To our selectors: Akram Inswinger

[amra_korbo_joy]

Akram Inswinger
Sri Lanka wrapped up the series expectedly although rain delayed their party. Bangladesh showed some improvement in the series but I think it was not satisfactory. Bangladesh won their first one-day match against Sri Lanka in this series but they are not in a stage to remain satisfied with one or two one-day victories after a long break.

They should prove their ability in the longer-version game to silence their critics. It would have been really fantastic if they could manage to draw at least one Test match rather than winning just the one-day game.

Ahead of a tough challenge against Australia in April at home, they should learn from their mistakes. Australia have been dominating the world cricket for last ten years that's why nobody will expect much more from Bangladesh in an uneven match. But Bangladesh can take the opportunity to make an impression against the world's number one team playing some good cricket. And to do that their batsman should understand the game, otherwise it would be a humiliating experience on home soil.

But before that Bangladesh have a challenge to show their superiority as a Test nation against Kenya in the four-match one-day series this month. It would be unwise if Bangladesh take Kenya lightly. They should be extra cautious against the ICC associate members because they have already proved their giant killing ability. If Bangladesh fail against Kenya, their reputation would undoubtedly go down.

Which makes me annoyed is the Bangladeshi players' making the same old mistakes in the longer-version game. They have to learn quickly. It is not good for a new team to make the same mistakes over and over again for last four years. I think consistency is not only a big problem in the players' performance but it was also evident in the team management's thinking. It was really surprised to see the think-tank pick up Mushfiqur Rahim when there were players like Alok Kapali and Aftab Ahmed.

It just puts pressure on the young but talented players. I don't know what was the selection policy of Bangladesh but I must say it's simply stupidity to field a player like Rahim to face world's one of the greatest bowlers Muttiah Muralidaran.

You can just destroy a player picking up him at a wrong time. The Bangladesh think-tank should be careful about the issue to nurse young talents properly.

Once again I want to mention one Bangladeshi player's name and it is Shahadat Hossain who really impressed me and I must say he has a very bright future in international cricket.

http://www.thedailystar.net/2006/03/12/d60312040228.htm

[sar2005]

A very bold and beautiful article! I think everyone in BC will agree with his every individual line, except if we have some selectors/players here by chance.

Thanks for posting it in BC.

[Tehsin]

I am glad that Wasim mentioned Rahim's inclusion. I think this kid has a very bright future and the best thing we can do is to nurture him and protect him. He is only 17, just because we played him in two test matches (for whatever reason) doesn't mean we need to continue doing that. I won't mind seeing him in ODIs by the end of this year (ie - not against Kenya or Australia) but we need to hold him back from Test matches until he gets his feet wet in first class matches.

We have enough players at this moment to field a full side. There is nothing wrong with Aftab, and Rajin. Take a moment and think what we put this talented players through when we simply drop them from the squad without any valid reason/excuse. This has been going on for the last 10+ years and I think it's about time our selectors show some consistency and back up the players. Look around world cricket and you'll notice that teams carry on with the same combination for several matches, they don't just make random changes and bring in new blood without giving them enough time to mature as cricketers.

[sonarbangla]

hmm i don know guys.. but i thought rahim will do better on this test.. atleast he sure had a great potential compare to alok or aftab..

[Sham]

Originally posted by amra_korbo_joy
Akram Inswinger


I was really surprised to see the think-tank pick up Mushfiqur Rahim when there were players like Alok Kapali and Aftab Ahmed.

It just puts pressure on the young but talented players. I don't know what was the selection policy of Bangladesh but I must say it's simply stupidity to field a player like Rahim to face world's one of the greatest bowlers Muttiah Muralidaran.

You can just destroy a player picking up him at a wrong time. The Bangladesh think-tank should be careful about the issue to nurse young talents properly.

http://www.thedailystar.net/2006/03/12/d60312040228.htm

Who is Wasim Akram? What does he know about cricket anyway?

I think we should keep picking Rahim. He has so much talent. So what if he is just 17? I think we have to look at the greater interest here. One or two talented youngsters careers can be destroyed to keep the people of Bogura and the members of Banglacricket.com happy!

[amra_korbo_joy]

Originally posted by Sham
Originally posted by amra_korbo_joy
Akram Inswinger


I was really surprised to see the think-tank pick up Mushfiqur Rahim when there were players like Alok Kapali and Aftab Ahmed.

It just puts pressure on the young but talented players. I don't know what was the selection policy of Bangladesh but I must say it's simply stupidity to field a player like Rahim to face world's one of the greatest bowlers Muttiah Muralidaran.

You can just destroy a player picking up him at a wrong time. The Bangladesh think-tank should be careful about the issue to nurse young talents properly.

http://www.thedailystar.net/2006/03/12/d60312040228.htm

Who is Wasim Akram? What does he know about cricket anyway?

I think we should keep picking Rahim. He has so much talent. So what if he is just 17? I think we have to look at the greater interest here. One or two talented youngsters careers can be destroyed to keep the people of Bogura and the members of Banglacricket.com happy!

I could not agree with you. We should not select Aftab and Rahim in test until they can play spin. But who can play spin , any way. I think Ashraful, Bashar and Rafique can paly spin. Other can only survive. Aftab and Rahim do not know how to survive against spin. But they are very young age. If we keep on selecting him in test, it will hamper their confidence and destroy their career. Consequently, we lose great 2 players.

[Sham]

:lol:

[Sorry]

so i am not the only one who fail to detect sarcasm!
:head:

[Fazal]

No I think Akram meant we need to give Alok chance after chance until all the Alok fans get tired of him. Stupid Akram, underestimated the will power of Alok fans.

Ops... he didn't said that ... I made it up? Sorry.

[Tehsin]

Sham, you had me going there for a second. Good to see that you are still sane.

[Sham]

Am I sane? Was I ever sane? Will I ever be sane?

[esteban_loaiza]

It is time for Faruque to resign and give way to ppl like Akram Khan or somebody. He along with other selectors have completely and consistently failed to pick the best XI. They picked players who could not contribute. They made pitches not conducive for our players. They destroyed careers of some players. Do you see same thing happening for other teams? I never thought Faruque is good enough for this job as he was not that talented as a player. Somehow he made national team and also became captain. But there is a bunch of other former players lilke Akram/Bulbul who were talented, played under pressure and performed and had reasonable experience in ODI and test cricket. I believe Faruque is screewing other selecters heads too. Time for him to go.

[roaring_tiger]

I have one question...
is it possible to import selectors like we import coaches?...
that may improve the situation....

in any case most of us tend to think that foreign solution is the best solution...

:fanflag:

[Dhakablues]

Akram said the right thing.. There is no denial that Akram is a wellwisher of Bangladesh Cricket. I think what he said from his cricketing skills weighs more than what we passionate fans want to believe.

Rahim, from the begining, was weak against spins. We, the average fans, knew this. How BCB didnt know, its question that will haunt us... Not only was Rahim prematurely elevated to Test ( again), he was thrown in front of Spin Master Murli, where even established spin bashing batsmen struggle. we didnt use Rajin, Alok, Aftab as we shouldve.. Period. Akram, as a world class cricketer, only confirms what was being said for a long time.

[didit]

for pete's sakes, the kid's barely 17. why introduce him to the boogeyman and scar him for life?

[Duck]

BRAIN TRANSPLANT HOSPITAL

Eikhaney Bina Khorochey, bina bethai... Cricket team Selector-der Brain Transplant kora hoi! Faruk shab aisha poren.........

I hate Mr. Faruk's policy, hate his attitude and Godly Nature........he is doing a criminal act, ruining players by excluding the potentials like Aftab, Rajin and including unprepared youngsters like Rahim!

Not a single player is settled, no one is assured what/where to deliver, just filling in the musical chairs and doing the same mistakes again and again!

I wish Mr. Faruk be in the middle of a CROSS-FIRE!!
Amen....

:E:E:E:E:E:E:E:E:E:E:E:E:E:E:E:E:E:E:E:E

[TheWatcher]

Don't know why everybody wants have a go at the selectors, they gave DW all the options and the coach picked Mushfiq ahead of Aftab, Rajin, and Alok.

If the selectors are the ones who are choosing the playing eleven, why are we paying big bucks to Whatmore? Is not it his job to figure out the strength and weakness of his players and that of the opposition, and to make his gameplan (a part of which is selecting the playing eleven) according to it?

To me, it looked like he just threw Mushfiq out there, without much thinking, hoping for a miracle.

Edited on, March 12, 2006, 7:54 AM GMT, by TheWatcher.

[Musfique]

Good one Sham!!...u had me thinking for a while as well.

[Ahmed_B]

Originally posted by TheWatcher
Don't know why everybody wants have a go at the selectors, they gave DW all the options and the coach picked Mushfiq ahead of Aftab, Rajin, and Alok.

If the selectors are the ones who are choosing the playing eleven, why are we paying big bucks to Whatmore?....
How are you so sure that Whatmore has that much authority in selecting teams?

BTW.... my personal guess is that Our Prime Minister's son had something to do behind the scene with putting Local hero Rahim in the team on this occassion....perhaps out of the desire to cheer up the local people since it is high time for some campaigne work. ;)

Yes... Dav supported his inclusion by saying that he found his way into the team by his own merit. But that is what the coach will always have to say officially about the selected team no matter who is selected. He and the captain are the ones will have to come up with logics for the selection... no matter who plays the key-role behind the scene.

Interestingly enough... the selectors bounced back so far after this test... that they even excluded Rahim from the team against Kenya. IMO, it would have been a far better choice if they had decided to play Rahim against the Kenyans rather than the Sri Lankans.

[arafath79]

The people who were jumping to pick up Mushfiqur Rahim they are simply nothing but stupid !! :mad::head:

[Tehsin]

We need to stop doing this (calling people names). I think at some stage, we (the fans) just start looking for miracles. Some probably thought Rahim would be that miracle. He is very talented and BCB just needs to find the right time (and opponent) to reintroduce him to the international scene. Let's not fast track another talented kid to destruction.

Originally posted by arafath79
The people who were jumping to pick up Mushfiqur Rahim they are simply nothing but stupid !! :mad::head:



ON a completely separate note, did anyone (BCB, club officials, friends) ever did anything to help Mehrab Hossain Opee kick his ganja habits ? That would have been an worthy cause.

[Fazal]

Originally posted by arafath79
The people who were jumping to pick up Mushfiqur Rahim they are simply nothing but stupid !! :mad::head:

I think people who dis-agreed Mushfiqur Rahim's pick-up and doesn't have the guts to call the selectors stupid but has the shortsightedness to do the easy way out calling other fellow memebers supid, need to see their face in the mirror to find out who the real stupid is. Don't make fool out of yourself....



Edited on, March 12, 2006, 11:38 PM GMT, by Fazal.

[Bat-PadTogether]

Great mistake to play Rahim just because it was his parents desire and dream that their son will play in Bogra and BCB has to make the Bogra people happy! Shame!If Rahim clicked nobody has to wrote so many things!

[TheWatcher]

The saddest part of all this talks about Rahim is that our dear BanglaCricket advisers and experts had nothing to say before the match regarding Rahim's inclusion in the playing eleven. It was us, silly Rahim fans, who expressed their doubts that Rahim could be a wrong choice for that match.

Link (http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/viewthread.php?tid=16470&page=3)

[Fazal]

Originally posted by TheWatcher
The saddest part of all this talks about Rahim is that our dear BanglaCricket advisers and experts had nothing to say before the match regarding Rahim's inclusion in the playing eleven. It was us, silly Rahim fans, who expressed their doubts that Rahim could be a wrong choice for that match.

Link (http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/viewthread.php?tid=16470&page=3)

:lol: Thanks TheWatcher for pointing that out. Thats why I asked those people to see their own face in the mirror before calling other people stupid.


When I asked before the game :

Originally posted by Fazal
The only concern is local newspaper claims that he is pretty weak against Spinners. Anyone can validate or invalidate the claim?

None of the so-called intellegent self claimed experts had any clue or bothered to experess their opinionabout his technical weakness against spin or fb. Now after the fact that he failed... they want Rahim fan's head and calling names... now if we need to call anyone stupid guess what who is the real stupid... its not real hard to identify.


Edited on, March 12, 2006, 11:32 PM GMT, by Fazal.

[LateCut]

I agree with Akram Khan in that Rahim should not have been put in an impossible situation. Talents should be nurtured not squandered by bad decisions and misuse. One thing that I don't understand is that why DW supports his inclusion in the team. May be he is the one pulling the strings!

Also, the fact that Shahadat is improving did not escape anybodies attention. I am also glad that he did not mention Tapash as he does not seem to figure in BD cricket anymore. He is already in the books as the ODI's most expensive bowling average (12+) for anybody bowling over 5 over. So, bye, bye Mr. Baishya.

[Sham]

Originally posted by TheWatcher
The saddest part of all this talks about Rahim is that our dear BanglaCricket advisers and experts had nothing to say before the match regarding Rahim's inclusion in the playing eleven. It was us, silly Rahim fans, who expressed their doubts that Rahim could be a wrong choice for that match.

Link (http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/viewthread.php?tid=16470&page=3)

This is getting even sillier than i though possible!

The saddest part about this whole episode isnt the fact that we played one of our most talented players in a Test match before giving him time to settle into longer-version cricket, the saddest thing isn't that we are risking destroying the careers of our most talented young players by pushing them into the Test team after a handful of first class games, the saddest thing isn't that we are bandying around with our batting order without a damn thought or strategy, NO, what is the saddest thing?

the adviser of banglacricket, that being I, failed to post in a particular thread about the possible downsides to Rahim's inclusion!

My lord! Are you guys even serious?

How many threads do I have to post in to say that I always was, am and always will be against the idea of pushing talented youngsters into the Test team too early? I have said it countless times even during this series.

After the guy gets picked in the playing XI, what the hell is the point in saying it anymore? Better get behind the guy and hope he does well.

The people who supported Rahim's inclusion all along were then expressing their doubts about his selection AFTER he gets selected! Firstly, make up your minds. And secondly, I think you guys were just covering your backsides in case the kid didn't do well! How typical!

Edited on, March 13, 2006, 12:30 AM GMT, by Sham.

[RazabQ]

Originally posted by Fazal
Originally posted by TheWatcher
The saddest part of all this talks about Rahim is that our dear BanglaCricket advisers and experts had nothing to say before the match regarding Rahim's inclusion in the playing eleven. It was us, silly Rahim fans, who expressed their doubts that Rahim could be a wrong choice for that match.

Link (http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/viewthread.php?tid=16470&page=3)

:lol: Thanks TheWatcher for pointing that out. Thats why I asked those people to see their own face in the mirror before calling other people stupid.
When I asked before the game :Originally posted by Fazal
The only concern is local newspaper claims that he is pretty weak against Spinners. Anyone can validate or invalidate the claim?None of the so-called intellegent self claimed experts had any clue or bothered to experess their opinionabout his technical weakness against spin or fb. Now after the fact that he failed... they want Rahim fan's head and calling names... now if we need to call anyone stupid guess what who is the real stupid... its not real hard to identify.

Many of us who were against Rahim's inclusion kept repeating: "he's young - he's not yet had enough exposure to FC cricket or List A. Give him time to round off his game". While we may not have known that he is weak against spin bowling - doesn't that kinda prove the point? If he is given a few more years of exposre, weakness against spin or any other forms of bowling will be found out and rectified.

Going ga ga goo over a 19 year old boy who had 2 good innings against depleted county attacks, and whose biggest strength so far has been willingness to soak in the pressure (be it for u-19 or the Lords match), that to me is the sign of stupidity.

I really wonder how many of the Rahim pushers here played cricket or do so regularly now. Note I am not calling you guys Rahim "lovers" rather "pushers"; heck I am a big fan of the kid too - I just happen care enough for this kid to want him to get the proper build up to Test cricket that he deserves.

[Tehsin]

Sham - from now on, can you please make sure that you post in every single thread that are opened in the forum, even if it means repeating yourself. I do not want to hear any excuses.

------
Thanks for the laughs people. I love this childish posts, keeps me going for hours).

[Sham]

Sure thing boss!

[RazabQ]

তেহসিন ভাই আসলে ঠিকি বলেছেন৷ আছিলাম বোকা হইলাম বুদ্ধিমান :)

[Tehsin]

Eto budhdhi diya etodiney matro 4 ta test team ke haraite parla. Kenya'r bhoye pura board akhon taalmatal, budhdhi khataya ekta fullproof plan suggest koro - Dav chacha'r (since the original chacha retired, Dav has proved himself to be capable and eager to own the nick) kache email pathamu.

[Fazal]

RazabQ, I know your position on Rahim. My comments are not towards people who opposed Rahim's inclusion at this time and express their opinion before or after his failure in the last test, but rather for people who doesn't go the length to explain why they think that way but use one liner like people x or y are stupid supporting Rahim’s inclusion. To me it doesn't bring anything into the table and shut down any civil conversation between two opinions.

Fans are supposed to go ga ga goo over a player (either its 19 year old boy or 32 years old man) based on their liking. What is has to do with stupidity? You have all the right to think the way you want, that shouldn’t give you (or me) the ethical right to start calling people right or left stupid. As a Moderator, do you think that the norm you want to set here? Then just tell us... we can also start calling people stupid left and right... or you think only few people have that privilege only. Then just mention it who are the privileged one.

btw ... whether we play cricket or not, which level of criket we played has nothing to do with expressing our opinion here; at least that what I thought until now. And unlike what you are thinking , our logic (inclusion of Rahim) was more in sync with the Selectors and Coach Dav who have 1000 times more experience than any of us. Of course the gamble failed for now. Atleast we are not that much off base as some of you think. Don't you think we should be more careful before using calling names to other fellow members like 'stupid' , etc ? What value does it bring to the table?

You guys: the MODs, the senior members make up your mind, what kind of standard do you want to setup here? Jee Hojur kind of group who always agrees with the so called elite know all members, otherwise they will be tagged as stupid... that’s the best you guys can offer here?

As for me I am re-evaluating my stay here... because if I stay here , I will always bring the new point of view here... whether its unpopular, unsophisticated or not atel enough by the elite group. Looks like either I am not smart enough for you guys, or you guys are not ready for people like me.

Just tell me, I will leave without any hassle here. But one thing for sure, as long as I stay here, I will protest whenever people call names , …. Because to me that’s not only show the bad choice of words or taste, but very destructive for constructive debate between two groups of people with different views.

However I have to say I am kind of disappointed the way things are going here now…

Edited on, March 13, 2006, 1:29 AM GMT, by Fazal.

[mafizraju]

Originally posted by Fazal
RazabQ, I know your position on Rahim. My comments are not towards people who opposed Rahim's inclusion at this time and express their opinion before or after his failure in the last test, but rather for people who doesn't go the length to explain why they think that way but use one liner like people x or y are stupid supporting Rahim’s inclusion. To me it doesn't bring anything into the table and shut down any civil conversation between two opinions.

Fans are supposed to go ga ga goo over a player (either its 19 year old boy or 32 years old man) based on their liking. What is has to do with stupidity? You have all the right to think the way you want, that shouldn’t give you (or me) the ethical right to start calling people right or left stupid. As a Moderator, do you think that the norm you want to set here? Then just tell us... we can also start calling people stupid left and right... or you think only few people have that privilege only. Then just mention it who are the privileged one.

btw ... whether we play cricket or not, which level of criket we played has nothing to do with expressing our opinion here; at least that what I thought until now. And unlike what you are thinking , our logic (inclusion of Rahim) was more in sync with the Selectors and Coach Dav who have 1000 times more experience than any of us. Of course the gamble failed for now. Atleast we are not that much off base as some of you think. Don't you think we should be more careful before using calling names to other fellow members like 'stupid' , etc ? What value does it bring to the table?

You guys: the MODs, the senior members make up your mind, what kind of standard do you want to setup here? Jee Hojur kind of group who always agrees with the so called elite know all members, otherwise they will be tagged as stupid... that’s the best you guys can offer here?

As for me I am re-evaluating my stay here... because if I stay here , I will always bring the new point of view here... whether its unpopular, unsophisticated or not atel enough by the elite group. Looks like either I am not smart enough for you guys, or you guys are not ready for people like me.

Just tell me, I will leave without any hassle here. But one thing for sure, as long as I stay here, I will protest whenever people call names , …. Because to me that’s not only show the bad choice of words or taste, but very destructive for constructive debate between two groups of people with different views.

However I have to say I am kind of disappointed the way things are going here now…

Edited on, March 13, 2006, 1:29 AM GMT, by Fazal.


I support you completely. But still I dont want to see rahim getting picked again or in the retrospective any youngster withour proper exposure....................

:)

One note Fazal Bhai : Just because I and Einstein have one case similarity doesnot prove I know as much as Einstein or in that matter as much as schordinger. :lol: ( JUST like I am no Wasim Akram although on rohim case me and him we both agree)

Hope you will stay here and will pump me up with more and more ragefull (is that even a word?) comment and points of vies. FOr sure he didnot want to offend you

[mafizraju]

I beleive we all should stop name calling even during the outmost frustration

[Sham]

Fazal, I am going to largely ignore that post because I honestly don't know whether you are too stupid for us or we are too stupid for you.

But there is one point I am going to pick up on and reply to.

You said that those who have been against Rahim's inclusion haven't provided any basis for that position. I cannot agree with you at all. We have done that and continue to do it. But just for your convenience, I am going to rehash it all again.

First misconception you guys have about our position is that we are questioning Rahim's ability. Now I said from the outset that two innings in which he didnt even get going says nothing about Rahim's ability. You guys are now bringing up the issue about his supposed weakness against spin. But I'm not interested in his weakness against spin. He could be the best player of spin bowling in the world for all I care, my opposition to his inclusion is based on matters that are not related to how much talent or ability or skill he has.

In any country, a cricketer learns his trade in domestic cricket and then in A tours. Once he showcases his ability there over a period of time, he is rewarded with a national cap. It is the culmination of years of hard work. In our country, you need to just play two innings against second rate opposition before you are taking on the best at the highest and most testing form of the game. Its just not right!

Now, you may ask, what does Rahim need to do? How many runs does he need to score? Its not really about that. Even when he isnt scoring runs in domestic cricket, playing gives you experience that you can't substitute. Some days, he will go out to bat with his team at 220 for 2, other days he will go into bat with his team 18 for 3! He needs to experience all these different situations. He may go in at 220 for 2 one day with his team still 140 behind, or he may go in at 18 for 3 with his team 120 ahead. How do you play in these different scenarios? He might have a season when everything he hits races to the boundary, and another when he cant get bat to ball. If its the former, he needs to learn how to cash in when the going is good, and if its the latter, he needs to learn how to turn the corner.

These are all situations a batsman must face and experience BEFORE they come into the Test arena so taht when he faces a similar situation in Tests, he will have experience to draw from. Three or four years of grounding in domestic cricket is hugely beneficial. That should be the training ground where you learn your game. Also, if you have performed consistently for 3 or 4 seasons, of course you may still have a bad season here and there, you come in with a lot of confidence that you dont have after one or two big scores.

So, for a whole host of reasons, grounding is important. Its even more important when a player has a lot of talent, because he must learn how to use his talent. Ashraful is one guy who wasnt allowed to learn. He got thrown in, and he has had to learn at the highest level, which is why its taking him so damn long! Players like Tendulkar and Hanif Mohammed are rare. The Kambli's of the world are much more common. So my question remains, why the hurry? Why take that risk? Will Bangladesh cricket lose out big time if we give this kid a few years to learn his trade outside of Test cricket?

[Fazal]

Originally posted by Sham

But there is one point I am going to pick up on and reply to.

You said that those who have been against Rahim's inclusion haven't provided any basis for that position. I cannot agree with you at all. We have done that and continue to do it. But just for your convenience, I am going to rehash it all again.


You missed my point. As far as I know I never said those who have been against Rahim's inclusion haven't provided any basis for that position. What I said was some of them didn't spend the time and went for quick low blow calling other 'stupid'. And the other did that any way (after explaining their view point).

My other point was calling names to others created bad atmosphere in this discussion board.

btw I know your position anyway, you (and some other) spend time to elaborate the point of view. But that doesn't mean I have to agree with all of those.

Edited on, March 13, 2006, 2:06 AM GMT, by Fazal.

[Sham]

Fair enough, you dont have to agree. But since I've spent the time putting my argument out there, maybe you can elaborate on which bits you don't agree with! Just saying that you dont agree doesnt make you all that much better than those you are faulting for not elaborating their point!

[Tehsin]

Fazal,

I can say with 100% confidence that not all the mods agree on non mod related (ie cricket issues) issues. There are mods/staff who support Rahim's inclusion while others completely disagree. I see that you have used some strong words. I am a little baffled. How did you even come up with the conclusion that every single mod/staff (and there are a lot) are unison about every single cricket related issue that pops up here. What's the point of having a message board then ? The mods could just open a separate forum and pat each other in the back all day long, why bother getting other members involved ?

BC is all about Bangladesh cricket, it is all about the fans. We care about our cricket and when I say we, I mean every single BD cricket fan who take the time to come to the site and share their thoughts. The thoughts have to be different to have any significance at all and that's why we love coming back to the site - for the different viewpoints posted by the hundreds/thousands of members who visit the site every day, everyone is unique and everyone bring in their own views and thats what makes this place so amazing.

---------------------------------
I agree with you on one point - the use of the word 'stupid' is indeed unfortunate. I'd suggest whoever used the word would utilize the 'edit' feature which is conveniently located on the top right corner of each post.

[Tehsin]

By the way, I didn't think this needed to be explained but apparantly it does. When Sham or I post here, we posts as MEMBERS. The mod hat is OFF.

I just read Sham's last post. When he said "First misconception you guys have about our position is that we are questioning Rahim's ability", by 'you guys' he meant members who were for Rahim's inclusion and by 'we', he meant MEMBERS who were against Rahim's inclusion. Clearly, this is a debate between opposing member viewpoints.

I do not see how the MODs were dragged into it.

[Fazal]

Originally posted by Sham
Fair enough, you dont have to agree. But since I've spent the time putting my argument out there, maybe you can elaborate on which bits you don't agree with! Just saying that you dont agree doesnt make you all that much better than those you are faulting for not elaborating their point!

Whats the point of beating the dead horse? Good locgic was given
by both parties for and against Rahim's inclusion. Obviously it was apparant that he was not technically ready for the TEST yet. I don't believe in age restriction.

Currently I am not in a mood to have debate here in this issue at this moment....right now I am more interested in figuring out more fundamental issue.... the standard/norm of discussion here...

[Tehsin]

Board Rules (http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/faq.php?page=forumrules)




Originally posted by Fazal
Whats the point of beating the dead horse? Good locgic was given
by both parties for and against Rahim's inclusion. Obviously it was apparant that he was not technically ready for the TEST yet. I don't believe in age restriction.

Currently I am not in a mood to have debate here in this issue at this moment....right now I am more interested in figuring out more fundamental issue.... the standard/norm of discussion here...

[Fazal]

Originally posted by Tehsin
By the way, I didn't think this needed to be explained but apparantly it does. When Sham or I post here, we posts as MEMBERS. The mod hat is OFF.


I understand that, but hypothetically speaking, don't you agree that even with hat is OFF, there is a intimidation factor working for them (knowlingly or unknowingly)?

Therefore shouldn't they be more careful about their choice of word even as a member? Whether MODs like it or not, general members look at MOD (even their hats off) as model citizen and thry to emulate them how to communicate with others respecfully. May be I am expecting too much from the MOD but thats how I used to see them.

[RazabQ]

Fazal to add to Tehsin bhai's point, yeah not all Mods think alike. At any rate, I obviously did not preface my post with "As mod", so hopefully it's evident that the opinions were just as myself. Having said that, in second read, I shouldn't have used perhaps the strong language. I saw your posts and lost my head at usage of the term "stupid" a number of times. Was not expected from a senior member like you :) And yes, you are considered a BC murubba these days :)

As for my comment about having played or not, obviously someone who hasn't played a bit of cricket or just started watching yesterday can hold an opinion. Everyone has the right to. Rather, I was asking that question because, it would help _explain_ some of the of the positions being expounded here :)

As for different viewpoints, you should always bring them on board. Just like my opinions are not sacred, neither are yours. Both are open to criticism and ridicule as well as praise.

Sham, good explanation on why nothing beats experience.

[Fazal]

Originally posted by RazabQ
Having said that, in second read, I shouldn't have used perhaps the strong language. I saw your posts and lost my head at usage of the term "stupid" a number of times. Was not expected from a senior member like you :) And yes, you are considered a BC murubba these days :)


Thanks for clarification. However I failed to understand why you lost your head calling back people 'stupid' (of course indirectly) who called us stupid first directly?

Just wondering, why you didn't lost your head to the first offenders ( and direct name calling, no indirect name calling). Was it beacuse he/they were in your side of the argument and therefore somehow that make it ok?


Edited on, March 13, 2006, 2:38 AM GMT, by Fazal.

[Tehsin]

Understood.

However, this is not a dictatorship. MODs can lose their privilage if they abuse their 'power'. In the 6/7 years that I have been linked with BC, I have rarely seen any MOD misusing their privilage. I have a lot of respect for all of them, even with all the various viewpoints they have.

The mods volunteer their valuable time to BC because of their love and dedication to our cricket and their sole goal is to maintain a clean message board, one that you can bring your parents too.

We also have to realize that they are first and foremost, members of the board. They enjoy discussing BD cricket like you and I. As I said, they have opposing viewpoints and they would like nothing less then a good discussion.

This intimidation factor that you mentioned, I have seen it practiced at other forums and you may have experienced a few of your own. You and I both know that it does not exist in BC. You have made 4286 posts so far. Obviously we have done a great job so far for you to hang around for so long and participating actively.


Originally posted by Fazal
I understand that, but hypothetically speaking, don't you agree that even with hat is OFF, there is a intimidation factor working for them (knowlingly or unknowingly)?

Therefore shouldn't they be more careful about their choice of word even as a member? Whether MODs like it or not, general members look at MOD (even their hats off) as model citizen and thry to emulate them how to communicate with others respecfully. May be I am expecting too much from the MOD but thats how I used to see them.

[TheWatcher]

Fazal, sorry mate, I opened up a can of worm and left you to fight all by yourself. Great arguments there:up:

[Tehsin]

TheWatcher, shame on you mate, leaving your buddy all alone to defend himself. Expected more out of you. :)

[Pundit]

I think Sham is the coolest person around. But man, your defense against Rahim's inclusion is getting just a tad too much.

Let it go man. We all know his play didn't turn out to be as expected, and many of us were justified in our speaking out against it.

But lets move on, cool dude. Please write more words about BD cricket in general, and not about one rather insignificant (hopefully) happening. Banglacricket will be far richer in that way.

Just my opinion, shared out of respect.

[Duck]

Well..............as a novice BC member, I enjoyed the gentlemen-debate.........really liked you all how you guys pulled you legs fisrt, muscled around the neck and finally embraced each other! cool! Hope our Biggo Rajnitibid-ra BC page gula ghurey shikhbey (anyway, this is the word which is absent in their dictionary!! ). LONG LIVE BC!

[Sham]

Originally posted by Pundit
I think Sham is the coolest person around. But man, your defense against Rahim's inclusion is getting just a tad too much.


No kidding. I thought I had over-sold the point as well till I read the Watcher's post (and Fazal's full-hearted agreement) about how its sad that Banglacricket's adviser(s?) and experts were tight-lipped about his inclusion and didn't care to point out the possible downsides!

[abherath]

Good writeup from Wasim Akram, a great cricketer. He sure means well for Bangla cricket.

I wonder if there is any possibility of Cricket Bangladesh engaging his services in some capacity; at least to train the pacies on a short term assignment.

I cannot challenge the views of a great plalyer of the calibre of Akram. But I do think Mushfiqur Rahim will do well very soon, at the highest level. Pretty much like Marvan Atapattu, who started with innigs of 0, 0, 1, 0 in test cricket but was persisted with.

As long as Mushfiqur fails, people will cry out for the blood of the selectors but when he starts performing the selectors will be praised !

[Sham]

Originally posted by abherath
Good writeup from Wasim Akram, a great cricketer. He sure means well for Bangla cricket.

I wonder if there is any possibility of Cricket Bangladesh engaging his services in some capacity; at least to train the pacies on a short term assignment.

I cannot challenge the views of a great plalyer of the calibre of Akram. But I do think Mushfiqur Rahim will do well very soon, at the highest level. Pretty much like Marvan Atapattu, who started with innigs of 0, 0, 1, 0 in test cricket but was persisted with.

As long as Mushfiqur fails, people will cry out for the blood of the selectors but when he starts performing the selectors will be praised !

Abherath,

I didn't think I would need to point out to a SL cricket guru like yourself that Atapattu's career actually supports the point of view of those of us who have taken a position against rushing youngsters into Test cricket.

Marvan played his first Test match back in the 1990/91 season as a 20 year old, and two more in the next six years! He only bacame a regular in the side in the 1996/97 season and has never looked back!

So, he wasn't really 'persisted' with. He actually got dropped for three years between 93/94 and 96/97 and he came back a much better player!

[Flipper]

Few quick comments as I am in a hurry.

There is irony in the signature that Sham carries. He is one of the best in the forum, no doubt about it. I think over the years he has heard / argued with a lot of people and guess what...
Some of his ideas are really weired! :)

Why age is the sole factor? Yes, it's one of the factors but not the only one when considering one's maturity. There are tons of examples I can bring, not only in the game of cricket, but in every single aspects of life- you name it, you got it. I can understand when some parents are saying, oh he is a 17 year old, but when I hear it from young people, I have to wonder...

Mushifiqur was indeed the choice ahead of many top guns in the team- wheather recent form, technique, potential, temperment every thing is with him. On the other hand, When you talk about Kapali, he has only age in his side for the last couple of years wheather Domestic, international, or A-matches. Why we go all out to say I want Kapali in the team, and I don't want Mushfique is beyond me ( perhaps age is the only criteria in some people's book). I hate to bring in what I already said long ago, but we always like to talk about Ashraful, and Kamblis all the time, but lets not forget the Mashrafes.

We talk about nurturing young prodigy like Mushfiqur, and I agree and wish we were the Aussies. We are getting there for sure when I see what we are doing with lot of our young prospects. We can't jump from step one to a lot higher step. Mushfiqur was introduced last year in test, had lot of international games, and now he comes back again. We can't wait any longer to keep a prospect of his calliber out of a team like Bangladesh, which has been so unfortunate that sometimes even it's biggest fan call for its head, and say "Bangladesh doesn't deserve to play test cricket"!

[abherath]

Originally posted by Sham
Originally posted by abherath
Good writeup from Wasim Akram, a great cricketer. He sure means well for Bangla cricket.

I wonder if there is any possibility of Cricket Bangladesh engaging his services in some capacity; at least to train the pacies on a short term assignment.

I cannot challenge the views of a great plalyer of the calibre of Akram. But I do think Mushfiqur Rahim will do well very soon, at the highest level. Pretty much like Marvan Atapattu, who started with innigs of 0, 0, 1, 0 in test cricket but was persisted with.

As long as Mushfiqur fails, people will cry out for the blood of the selectors but when he starts performing the selectors will be praised !

Abherath,

I didn't think I would need to point out to a SL cricket guru like yourself that Atapattu's career actually supports the point of view of those of us who have taken a position against rushing youngsters into Test cricket.

Marvan played his first Test match back in the 1990/91 season as a 20 year old, and two more in the next six years! He only bacame a regular in the side in the 1996/97 season and has never looked back!

So, he wasn't really 'persisted' with. He actually got dropped for three years between 93/94 and 96/97 and he came back a much better player!

I think Sri Lanka did not play too many tests back then. Most countries would hardly give us matches. So even those who did not get dropped did not play too many tests in those years.

Sri Lanka had Arjuna, Aravinda, Mahanama and Gurusinghe coming straight out of school into the national team. In fact Arjuna was still schooling when he played in Sri Lanka's first test. The four of them were pillars on which Sri Lanka's World Cup success was built.

By the way, I am just a cricket enthusiast with some mercantile cricket in the lowest divisions to my credit. So I am not a Guru in any sense. :) I would be glad to learn and even correct myself, reading what you write. Thanks for your comments, anyway.

I am waiting to see Mushfiqur shining in international cricket and I am sure that it will happen soon.

[abherath]

One more comment I would like to add here. Look at Graeme Smith of South Africa ! He came in to the team with no previous test or ODI cricket and with just a bit of first class cricket, as the Captain !

[Tigers_eye]

The batting lineup we have,

can't score 200+ against a quality attack,

loves to play aggressive and loves the walk from the crease to the dressing room,

and showed time and again can't learn from previous mistakes;

what other options the selectors/coach/ captain have?

With below par outputs I know everyone wants an excape goat and that is the coach and the selectors.

So to save their rear these cricket gurus tries out young blood. Only natural, when seaching for "the one" who will take us to the promise land. What would you do? I can garantee, you would do the same after a year or two when your own neck is on the line. The coach and the selectors are fedup with Ash, Aftab, NI, S Nafees, Bashar's repeated faliures. And they have every right to feel that way. Tharanga a 20 year old in span of 7 months should our batsmen how to bat in ODI and test. Two different form of game two different approach. with 5+ years of experience Ash still could not master that. We all are desparately waiting for someone who is matured enough for test cricket. The think tank thought they had found one in Mushfiq. I thought we had found one. May be we did, just by judging one test is not the best thing to do. He is more advanced than any one for his age. Only time will tell. I still want mushfiq in the test team (may not be in the final 11).

Edited on, March 13, 2006, 3:30 PM GMT, by Cats_eye.

[PoorFan]

Originally posted by Cats_eye
The batting lineup we have,

can't score 200+ against a quality attack,

loves to play aggressive and loves the walk from the crease to the dressing room,

and showed time and again can't learn from previous mistakes;

what other options the selectors/coach/ captain have?

With below par outputs I know everyone wants an excape goat and that is the coach and the selectors.

So to save their rear these cricket gurus tries out young blood. Only natural, when seaching for "the one" who will take us to the promise land. What would you do? I can garantee, you would do the same after a year or two when your own neck is on the line. The coach and the selectors are fedup with Ash, Aftab, NI, S Nafees, Bashar's repeated faliures. And they have every right to feel that way. Tharanga a 20 year old in span of 7 months should our batsmen how to bat in ODI and test. Two different form of game two different approach. with 5+ years of experience Ash still could not master that. We all are desparately waiting for someone who is matured enough for test cricket. The think tank thought they had found one in Mushfiq. I thought we had found one. May be we did, just by judging one test is not the best thing to do. He is more advanced than any one for his age. Only time will tell. I still want mushfiq in the test team (may not be in the final 11).

Edited on, March 13, 2006, 3:30 PM GMT, by Cats_eye.
Cats_eye, you just beat me on this! Thank's to you.

I was following the threads last couple of days on this "Mushfique issue" but didn't reply because of time. I got the impression that ... by any chance, IF any of our GURU on BC forum was the selectors, he might have thought or tried even his son or anyone ( if not his mom & dad ) to produce CONSISTENCE or positive result from BD team. You did put it very nicely by saying "when your own neck is on the line", one will try any option in his hand.

As far I can remember, I saw same kind of reaction on this forum, when Shahadat got thrashed by ENG last year. Same crying was going on by saying "destroying his future" by playing him so early in top level. Now we see different picture of Shahadat, though he still has long way to go. What is the different between Shahadat and Mushfique? one is a bowler and other is a batsman, one was 19+ at that time and other is 17+ now, one had couple of A match experience against UAE and ZIM ( don't know more than that ) and other has plenty of international match experience tough in U 19. So I don't see much difference between this two except 2 years of AGE. Given all this difference still I don't understand how we JUDGE and be SURE that our selectors are "destroying his future" by including him in the team, and ofcourse judging on just ONE bad test performance!

If this AGE was the case, I wonder why our ex U 19 coach allowed him to go to England in the first place.

[KaaL-PurusH]

Originally posted by Sham
Originally posted by amra_korbo_joy
Akram Inswinger


I was really surprised to see the think-tank pick up Mushfiqur Rahim when there were players like Alok Kapali and Aftab Ahmed.

It just puts pressure on the young but talented players. I don't know what was the selection policy of Bangladesh but I must say it's simply stupidity to field a player like Rahim to face world's one of the greatest bowlers Muttiah Muralidaran.

You can just destroy a player picking up him at a wrong time. The Bangladesh think-tank should be careful about the issue to nurse young talents properly.

http://www.thedailystar.net/2006/03/12/d60312040228.htm

Who is Wasim Akram? What does he know about cricket anyway?

I think we should keep picking Rahim. He has so much talent. So what if he is just 17? I think we have to look at the greater interest here. One or two talented youngsters careers can be destroyed to keep the people of Bogura and the members of Banglacricket.com happy!

okk...listen vai...just remember..when AKRAM, BULBUL, ATAHAR, DURJOY, NANNU were in da team....our batting side was strong...atleast we don had to think abt our batting....n our bowling side was our headache then...but now...dat circumstance has been totally changed....now our batting side is poor like past bowling side...

so we hav 2 consider dat XPerience is also 1 of da X-FACTOR in cricket...we should balance between XPerience n talent...as Xample...Captain Shumon is XPerienced player in our team...n also da 1&only seccessful batsmen in our team...Javem Omar is also same....but Ashraful, Aftab, Shahriar Nafees r not successful...but their talent, ability is better than Shumo n Javed...so..why they cant be successful???....

n we should learn from Ashraful's history...he might b able to b more consistent if he had started his career after 20....N REMEMBER 1 THING...EVERYBODY IS NOT LIKE MASHRAFEE...coz his temperament is simply Xtra-ordinary...

Edited on, March 14, 2006, 1:30 PM GMT, by KaaL-PurusH.

Edited on, March 14, 2006, 2:31 PM GMT, by KaaL-PurusH.

[KaaL-PurusH]

Originally posted by Sham


Who is Wasim Akram? What does he know about cricket anyway?

hey man...dont u know Wasim Akram?...he is very famous HA-DU-DU player...lolllllzzz:great:...don mind...m joking