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View Full Version : Do we want Dave Whatmore to discontinue his mission in Bangladesh?


zakirc
April 29, 2006, 02:58 PM
Dav's mission in Bangladesh appears to have reached its peak. No doubt he has given a LOT to the boys, but it appears that for whatever reason he is being unable to make any further progress. One of the possible reasons will be his reluctance to recruit Speacialist Batting and Bowling coaches. I have immense respect for DW's coaching and his methods, but it is very clear that our team needs the service of Speacialist Batting and Bowling coaches. And it is also clear that as long as DW is our coach, this is not happening. So maybe it is time to let go and move on for the overall betterment of our Cricket.

sar2005
April 29, 2006, 03:58 PM
You have a good point but still I believe he should be with us till WC07. He can leave us after our semi-final birth in WC07 ;)

Bancan
April 29, 2006, 04:02 PM
i want to see him as our coach as long as possible. he is one of the best things that happened to our team.

Hatebreed
April 29, 2006, 04:58 PM
I want to see him continue at least until WC 2007 is over. It would be a better if BD gets seperate batting and bowling speciality coaches to work with Dav or whoever replaces him in future.

SMHasan
April 29, 2006, 08:27 PM
Dav should be with us at least the WC 2007. If we can then we should keep him more longer. He has done a lot , at least he has healed the damage done by Mohsin Kamal and others. Do you guys see the consequence of Greg Chappel in the indian team? Personal revenge might grasp our team very easily so don't think we will get a good coach straightaway if Dav leaves us.

cricket_pagol
April 29, 2006, 08:36 PM
If players temperment don't develop after playing so many ODI matches... I think the coach can do very little. I don't think a batting coach will make any drastic difference. If a world cup winning coach cannot make a difference, then i don't know who can?

PS: It was painful to lose the 3rd ODI, it kinda shows how inconsistent we are :(

cricket_pagla
April 29, 2006, 09:34 PM
he's da best... so far... no coach is comparable 2 em...
dis is he's team... n look at how dis team turn out 2 b.... we're gonna win.. WC.. if our som plyrs bcom a lil mor consistent......

Mon
April 29, 2006, 11:00 PM
Dav did a lot for us and still have much more to do. so, he should stay. Changing the coach will not any good. We need to change our mentality.

BD Tigers
April 29, 2006, 11:21 PM
bhai, ekta ODI kharap bhabe harlam ar omni coach ke ber kore deoyar chinta. kheye deye ki ar kaaj nai apnader. Like another member said, he's the best thing that ever happend to BD cricket. Batting coach can improve yr technique but cannot improve yr temparament which our top order lacks.

zakirc
April 29, 2006, 11:38 PM
bhai, ekta ODI kharap bhabe harlam ar omni coach ke ber kore deoyar chinta. kheye deye ki ar kaaj nai apnader.

What made you think that my thread was based on one match?? I had a look at last 2-3 years and based my comment on that entire period. I too agree that he is the best thing that ever happened to BD cricket. My point was, is he capable of contributing any further?


Batting coach can improve yr technique but cannot improve yr temparament which our top order lacks.


You said it here .... exactly how many of our batsmen are technically correct? When I look at their batting I see them playing in Backfoot on a slow pitch .... I see them shuffling in the crese when the new ball is in operation .... I see them playing cross bat shots as if they are playing street cricket. Same goes with the bowling, while our bowlers are doing great, they lack some finness that results in fewer wickets. It is easy for our oppositions to figure out our bowling attack because the bowlers have only one dimension.

Temperment alone without technique will keep us exactly in the place that we currently are in. We will have to pray for luck, a miracle or poor performance from the opposition to secure a win.

So, appointing specialist batting and bowling coach is a must for us. And DW has made it clear on several occassions that he will not allow that to happen probably because it does not fit within his methods. Hence, my conclusion is, its time to part with him and move on.

Kamini
April 30, 2006, 12:53 AM
Dave must be allowed to continue. He's done a great job

Bd's progress will not be very fast...hope they can peak around WC2007

Kamini
April 30, 2006, 12:54 AM
Dave must be allowed to continue.

There has been a gradual progress which has been really positive.

Daddy_Mac
April 30, 2006, 04:46 AM
I think he has done a great job after he came...!
He is the only think thats consistant abuot BD cricket team...
So I voted yessssssssssss:lol::lol::lol:

Shafin
April 30, 2006, 04:50 AM
no...........

sar2005
April 30, 2006, 05:26 AM
Can see shafin is one of those who said NO (though I would like to see his explanation). But I it's interesting to see 34% of the poll (8 votes to be precise) so far does not want DW continues. Would be interesting if they could explain of their NO votes.

ahms
April 30, 2006, 10:07 AM
Consider this, if he was any other team like India, Pakistan, or WI ; you will see the improvement within 2 years. I am sure those team will win the world cup. Bangladesh should be glad to be have him. I think BD should pick up 18 best possible oneday players and train them under DEV. And rotate them in different events.
I hope BD players watching WI vs ZIm game. They need to learn other team's strength/weakness. That might help. Just like Aus studied us after 1st test.

Thanks to DEV for his effort. Hopefully our players learn from the last series. There is no other better team to learn from, than Aus.

zakirc
April 30, 2006, 12:46 PM
Can see shafin is one of those who said NO (though I would like to see his explanation). But I it's interesting to see 34% of the poll (8 votes to be precise) so far does not want DW continues. Would be interesting if they could explain of their NO votes.

I opened the thread with a NO and with full explanation too. I hope a few others explain thier thaughts about the "NO" vote. I am sure more interesting thoughts will come out.

Locutus
April 30, 2006, 02:03 PM
NO. I think the Bangladesh is moving to the right direction. The management have to more effort in finding players, and creating a better First Class cricket league.

BD Tigers
April 30, 2006, 04:50 PM
What made you think that my thread was based on one match?? I had a look at last 2-3 years and based my comment on that entire period. I too agree that he is the best thing that ever happened to BD cricket. My point was, is he capable of contributing any further?

if ur comment is based on last 2/3 yrs then why didnt u open this thread after the srilanka or kenya series. U only opened this thread because we played bad in Aussie series. Ofcourse he can contribute more. Are we WC champion yet? He made a team like Srilanka champion not too long ago.

So, appointing specialist batting and bowling coach is a must for us. And DW has made it clear on several occassions that he will not allow that to happen probably because it does not fit within his methods. Hence, my conclusion is, its time to part with him and move on.

Didn DW brought a batting coach in his early days? I am pretty sure he did. So its not that he doesnt like the idea. May be he knows something abt our batsmen more than we do. But I do agree that we do need a bowling coach for our bowlers. But that doesnt mean he needs to go. He shud be here at least next WC.

TheWatcher
April 30, 2006, 05:14 PM
Can see shafin is one of those who said NO (though I would like to see his explanation). But I it's interesting to see 34% of the poll (8 votes to be precise) so far does not want DW continues. Would be interesting if they could explain of their NO votes.
Well, the thread title asks you whether you want DW to discontinue, but the question top at the poll is whether you want him to continue. So, I guess some people got confused, or did not read the poll question, and voted NO (other way to say- they don't want DW to discontinue).

I am not a DW fan either, but there is no other way it makes sense to me why should so many people would suddenly want to change our coach when we have less than a year to prepare for the next World Cup.

Stumped
April 30, 2006, 06:49 PM
He will be there for the world cup next year... And he did bring a batting coach in, more than once... A man who has worked with the Lankans and does alot of work in Uk and Australia.

Zunaid
April 30, 2006, 06:51 PM
http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/../pictures/newpic95.jpg
Expert batting coach Owen Mattau imparts some techniques to Habibul Bashar

5th January, 2004

Stumped
April 30, 2006, 07:43 PM
Owen! Thats the one!

Zaheed Mahmood
April 30, 2006, 08:50 PM
A lot of things come into play in a coach’s part, a good coaching ability is not confined only to teaching good batting/bowling technique, temper and time of application, a good communication with the players and the ability to know them also play a very big part as well. Dave Whatmore proved his skill as a coach when he was in charge of Sri-Lanka who are not very different from us in physique and mentality! It proves, Dave understands very well the people in this part of the world. So, we should have him as long as he is physically and mentally fit to take our charge!! Asking for a CHANGE and coming up with a suitable replacement are miles apart in reality, we saw twice what disgrace and humility our cricket suffered when we had the known Trevere Chappell and not-so-known Kamal recruited as our coach for some different short stint. One talked too much and the other didn’t talk at all! I remember Trevere commented (don’t remember the exact phrase) to press after a humiliation defeat in NZ that ...these guys (BD) are not like us (Aus-Eng), they don’t turn furious to avenge a defeat, rather they take it easy!! And the other one (Mohsin) would go back to his room after a defeat and put the ‘DO Not Disturb’ sign ON!!
Zaheed

Ahmed_B
May 1, 2006, 04:55 AM
by zakirc:
One of the possible reasons will be his reluctance to recruit Speacialist Batting and Bowling coaches. .....it is very clear that our team needs the service of Speacialist Batting and Bowling coaches. And it is also clear that as long as DW is our coach, this is not happening....
aaah... you should be given the position of a top-ranked BD politician, who has the ability to accuse people without any guilt or solid information!!

What exactly makes you believe that DAV has the ultimate authority to hire or reject batting/bowling sub-coaches coaches for BD team? Or is it just a wild shot that you are pleased to go with?

Are you aware that it is a crime to come up with annoying rumors when you are talking in public? I really wonder!

zakirc
May 1, 2006, 12:53 PM
aaah... you should be given the position of a top-ranked BD politician, who has the ability to accuse people without any guilt or solid information!!

What exactly makes you believe that DAV has the ultimate authority to hire or reject batting/bowling sub-coaches coaches for BD team? Or is it just a wild shot that you are pleased to go with?

Are you aware that it is a crime to come up with annoying rumors when you are talking in public? I really wonder!

Well for one thing, DW said it himself several times answering to the press that he does not like the idea of recruiting specialist full-time Batting/Bowling coaches. There were talks of recruiting specialist full-time Batting/Bowling coaches and DW stood against that. As far as I know, his contract with BCB allows him the ultimate authority for such decisions.

DW definitely did a lot for BD Cricket team, nobody is denying that, but if he is not ready to recruit at least a full time specialist batting coach, while he is failing to make our batsmen's technique correct, I think we are better off with him. Someone was mentioning we need a bowling coach more than a batting coach ?? I wonder on what basis s/he amde this comment.

However, with WC '07 just round the corner, maybe we can wait till it is over.

zakirc
May 1, 2006, 12:57 PM
Well, the thread title asks you whether you want DW to discontinue, but the question top at the poll is whether you want him to continue. So, I guess some people got confused, or did not read the poll question, and voted NO (other way to say- they don't want DW to discontinue).

I noticed this msitake immidiately after making the post but could not rectify it as the forum rules does not allow editing the thread title / poll question.

Ahmed_B
May 1, 2006, 01:28 PM
Well for one thing, DW said it himself several times answering to the press that he does not like the idea of recruiting specialist full-time Batting/Bowling coaches. There were talks of recruiting specialist full-time Batting/Bowling coaches and DW stood against that. As far as I know, his contract with BCB allows him the ultimate authority for such decisions.
Please provide sources about the following:
1) In which press conference did Dav mention about not supporting the idea of specialist coaches?
2) In which newspaper/media was the news about it published and when?
3) What is the source of your knowledge about BCB's contract with Dav? Specially the part where it says he has ultimate authority on coaching selections?

Because this is a big allegation you are putting on Dav... it demands complete clarifications. So please take the pain to find the sources and mention them here. That would be very helpful.

Thanks

Bat-PadTogether
May 1, 2006, 03:19 PM
Let him continue as long as Dave wants.He is still the best coach Bd has ever had.The days are not far when Dave himself will quit! He is not happy with the performance of our batsmen!Its just same old story.

DJ Sahastra
May 1, 2006, 03:23 PM
Maybe, and i must add maybe, BD team needs a fresh look, a fresh perspective and someone with new idea to take it from here.

Nothing against Dav Whatmore but i am all for a coach change. Dav has done what he could and i don't see him implementing any new thoughts/ideas.

prasad
May 1, 2006, 03:35 PM
not with less than a yr to wc.when things r going smooth..no need.let him continue.

TheWatcher
May 1, 2006, 03:40 PM
Actually, in past, Whatmore has used specialist coaches quite often. He brought Owen Mattua quite a few time in 2004; he brought Mike Young and Trevor Chappel for fielding; he asked Sarwar Imran and Prince to help our bowlers before Stuart K joined the camp. Also, he whole heartedly supported the board when they were trying to hire Andy Roberts as our bowling coach.

I don't think techniques of our current crop of batsmen that is hurting our team, the lack of application seems to be the main problem here. Well, you can always argue that DW's soft touch is not working here, but that's a whole different issue.

PoorFan
May 1, 2006, 08:09 PM
<!--StartFragment -->Yes, but definitely not after WC 2007.

Bancan
May 1, 2006, 09:24 PM
those who are saying no. tell names whos gonna repalce him

zakirc
May 2, 2006, 12:41 AM
I don't think techniques of our current crop of batsmen that is hurting our team, the lack of application seems to be the main problem here. Well, you can always argue that DW's soft touch is not working here, but that's a whole different issue.

Exactly how many of our Batsmen have correct batting technique?? Could you mention some of thier names please?

Bengali_bradman
May 2, 2006, 01:12 AM
Exactly how many of our Batsmen have correct batting technique?? Could you mention some of thier names please?
Well Zakirc, Dav's contribution is at peak already ...Each series show us gradual improvement ... if you look at our team's recent performance, it's easy to understand that the team's improvement graph is going uphill at this moment ... Mush of the appreciation go to Dav in that context, and I guess his discontunuation may create a kind a inconfidence among the players.

Bengali_bradman
May 2, 2006, 01:13 AM
But more vital question is the opposite of Zakirc ... I am rather worried about how long Dav Whatmore will continue tolerating these irresponsibilities of our batsmen ... May be he is taking a poll inside himself whether to continue with BD team or not.

TheWatcher
May 2, 2006, 02:23 AM
Exactly how many of our Batsmen have correct batting technique?? Could you mention some of thier names please?
Well, I know very little about the stuff you are talking about, so why don't you enlighten me which of our batsmen (other than JO) lost his wicket during Australia series because of his glaring technical faults?

What I have seen with my layman's understanding, our batsmen got out because of-

1) being fooled by a world class bowler. Such cases were rare, and in most cases the full credit goes to the bowler, nothing much to hold against the batsman.

2) lapse of concentration.

3) poor shot selection.

4) plain stupidity.

For the last three cases, a coach can do very little more than give the batsman a good butt kicking. As I said in my previous post, I too am wondering why DW is not doing that.

Miraz
May 2, 2006, 04:24 AM
Well, the thread title asks you whether you want DW to discontinue, but the question top at the poll is whether you want him to continue. So, I guess some people got confused, or did not read the poll question, and voted NO (other way to say- they don't want DW to discontinue).



I am caught with the same mistake.

I think we are too emotional, after one or two bad series we want the the head of coach, selectors, players who have earned win for Bangladesh.... and so on.

Don't be so impassionate. International cricket is not like ' a pice of cake' waiting to be taken. Its hard, damn hard. We will have good days and definitely some bad days. We had a wonderful Kenya series, we headed the series with a record of 1-6 and we managed to win all the matches and that showed clear improvement of Bangladesh. We have done pretty well in the test series (Gillespie 200* is the only dark spot) and we ended with a very bad ODI series. So what??? Teams like Pakistan, South Africa or India also struggle very often at International level.

India played like a club team in New Zealand and I recall many Newspapers in New Zealand said that Bangladesh is better than India while playing in Newzealand. Pakistan wes bundled out for 54 and 56 in two successive innings against Australia, WI managed only two win (pior to ZIM series) out of 23 ODI's. I don't think cricket fans are desperate there to see their coach, selectors or players are axed.

These bunch of players, current selectors, and definitely Dav brought the ultimate glory of Bangladesh cricket. It's only cricket which shows Bangladesh in a positive frame in most part of the world. Apart from Cricket we really have nothing to be proud of. I am definitely sure the inner bleeding of Dav, our selectors and definitely our players are more intense than anybody else in this forum. So, please have faith on this team and officials, definitely they will bring nack the glory which we lost in the ODI series.

ghalib.imtiyaz
May 2, 2006, 07:33 AM
We need to have a specialist batting coach. Our bowlers are doing a good job. We have managed to restrict Australia but we havent been able to bat well enough to win.

Bancan
May 2, 2006, 04:04 PM
But more vital question is the opposite of Zakirc ... I am rather worried about how long Dav Whatmore will continue tolerating these irresponsibilities of our batsmen ... May be he is taking a poll inside himself whether to continue with BD team or not.
wel said man

mhferdaus
May 2, 2006, 06:22 PM
man i am confused with the poll, cuz one place said continue and anothe place he said discontinued, so what is it? I wonder whether I voted yes or no, I wanted Mr. Whatmore to continue till 2007 WC.

annie
May 3, 2006, 12:36 PM
Whatmore should be more strict with players and Faruk. This guy some how knows how to be more friendly with sub continent crooks. He couldn't cricket the crickets mentality after staying here so long. People say bd advanced but how long they are playing test cricket? Man statistics doesn't talk about anything in favor of him.

Stumped
May 3, 2006, 06:32 PM
Annie... He is strick, but there is only so much you can do when dealing with adults. If they want to do something they are going to do it with or without permission of the coach. Dav is all about the look and he has a way about him that you don't want to dissapoint him. The silence treatment is the worst... the not saying anything cos your that upset and angry... and i feel for the cricketers more at that time than i do when they get yelled at. But believe me when those boys need their heads pulled in it is done.When talking about stats... you talking against aussie or against themselves? They have improved and have one series, maybe against a weaker side, but its a win and they are progressing... Rome was not built in a day and either is a World Cup winning team.