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Tigers_eye
August 1, 2006, 10:47 AM
I don't know the whole process. Would like to know.

The three selectors select the first 15, I know that. What happens after that?

How much influence does the selectors have after that uptill the final selection? How would they communicate when the team is overseas? Do all three travel with the team? Does the coach has any power? How about the captain? By the way, I am talking about Bangladesh National cricket team selection process.

sadi
August 1, 2006, 10:49 AM
I guess the coach and the captain.

Tigers_eye
August 1, 2006, 11:05 AM
I guess the coach and the captain.
Then Fazal should take back his ultra defensive comment of our selectors :D and reignite the faith he has on them.

Rubu
August 1, 2006, 11:08 AM
If a selector is present there he and if he says something, of course coach and captian will take that into account.

but, in a regular process coach and captain selects the 11. of course they will get all the help from anyone they can.

Miraz
August 1, 2006, 11:21 AM
I think Team Manager, Coach and Captain (Team Management) selects the final XI and they consult with the selectors.

Sorry
August 1, 2006, 11:23 AM
i think its combined process- selectors, coach and captain but selectors have the final say.

Fazal
August 1, 2006, 11:27 AM
Guys we are all guesiing here....nobody knows exactly who are responsible.... thats how they can avoid the blame....but take the praise.... therefore is no clearcut accountability.... now see the bigger picture of the problem?

Sadi, "I guess...."
Miraz, "I think...."
Sorry, "I think...."
Sydney, "i think so too..."
Rubu: too many ifs in his statement
Mac: Too vague. Need Specific names or positions.

Rabz
August 1, 2006, 12:00 PM
yah..i think so too.. coach manager and captain selects..
but i think in our team, coach has the final say

mac
August 1, 2006, 01:00 PM
Selectors and the team management. Surely.:up:

Mahmood
August 1, 2006, 01:48 PM
At home, the selectors decide the playing 11. On away tours, the captain, coach and the manager decides.

Duck
August 1, 2006, 01:55 PM
At home, the selectors decide the playing 11. On away tours, the captain, coach and the manager decides.

....This is the truth...........
But i believe, our goat-sana (selectors) tries to pock noses even in away series.......

SS
August 1, 2006, 02:04 PM
I am 100% sure politicians ( including politican selectors, politician coach, Politician captain, politician people & us)...damn politicis is everywhere...if i knew that i would have been politicians. Why our parents, gradn parents, in-laws, fourteen generations want us to be doc,eng,programmers and business men when Politicians decide everything. WE WILL WIN ONLY by doing Politics!!!
DAMN abaro matha "Alauaei gese" , "chokke andhar dekhei"

kalpurush
August 1, 2006, 02:30 PM
DAMN abaro matha "Alauaei gese" , "chokke andhar dekhei"

Need any help?

Rubu
August 1, 2006, 02:36 PM
I take my answer back:

the guy with the invisible strings with his fingure decides the playing 11.

BangladeshFan
August 1, 2006, 02:40 PM
the selectors decide the team and captain, then it is the captain
who decides before the match, the coach can only make suggestion.

in bd's case, the soft guy bashar may actually have no say and its DW who make all the decisions. just a guess .

TheWatcher
August 1, 2006, 02:47 PM
The selection of the playing eleven was always heavly influenced by the selectors. It was very apparent during the England series, and also during the last series against Sri Lanka. But this time, no selector is traveling with the team, so it is not clear how much is their affect now on the team selection.

Anyway, one thing is clear- DW's spine is not that strong as most of us fan used to think it was.

Fazal
August 1, 2006, 02:58 PM
Kind of off topic.

This time selectors may not be traveling, but other officials are traveling not at the invitation of Zim, but at the cost of BCB's money to watch the remaining three games, traveling 1st class, stayin in 5 star hotel and milking the hefty daily allownace, and doing some shopping I guess:

the executives who are traveling, are:

1. Shah Nurul Kabir Shaheen, M.P.
2. Asaduzzam Khusru
3. Shaheen Aftabur Reza
4. Soilab Hiossain Tutul

Each will cost 4.5 lack Taka. (total cost for these four is 18 lacks taka)
-- Source Dail Inqelab

I wish instead of this people traveling to ZIM, they could have fly Tushar instead, even he will not be used in the game.

SS
August 1, 2006, 03:02 PM
Kind of off topic.

This time selectors may not be traveling, but other officials are traveling not at the invitation of Zim, but at the cost of BCB's money to watch the remaining three games, traveling 1st class, stayin in 5 star hotel and milking the hefty daily allownace, and doing some shopping I guess:

the executives who are traveling, are:

1. Shah Nurul Kabir Shaheen, M.P.
2. Asaduzzam Khusru
3. Shaheen Aftabur Reza
4. Soilab Hiossain Tutul

Each will cost 4.5 lack Taka.
-- Source Dail Inqelab

I wish instead of this people traveling to ZIM, they could have fly Tushar instead, even he will not used in the game.

FOUR ppl traveling to watch the game!
and can't send our players to different country for leagues or even to play !!!
I wish i can cut their....

Tigers_eye
August 1, 2006, 03:15 PM
....the executives who are traveling, are:

1. Shah Nurul Kabir Shaheen, M.P.
2. Asaduzzam Khusru
3. Shaheen Aftabur Reza
4. Soilab Hiossain Tutul

Each will cost 4.5 lack Taka. (total cost for these four is 18 lacks taka)
-- Source Dail Inqelab
...
So these guys are there to select the best 11 since the selectors are not there?

sadi
August 1, 2006, 03:23 PM
Sucks...

Fazal
August 1, 2006, 03:24 PM
So these guys are there to select the best 11 since the selectors are not there?

Good question. The reason for their trip is not well communicated in the media and therefore not well understood by the fan.

If they do (get involved in team selection), they can try to justify their spending. However that means, more bad news for the team. I hope they better concentrate on their shoping list given by their family and friends.

Sam
August 1, 2006, 03:45 PM
Off course, those BCB official do not have any say in selecting the final XI. If they do, it will be a practice of undue exercise. Even the Team Manager has nothing to do with the selection, as in most cases, this post belongs to somebody, who is not a cricket expert (e.g. Mr. Latif). For our team, it is mainly 80% of DW and 20 % of HB. If any selector is present in the tour, he has 40% share with DW 50% anf HB 10%. This is purely my analysis (rather speculation).

sadi
August 1, 2006, 03:51 PM
If they do (get involved in team selection), they can try to justify their spending. However that means, more bad news for the team. I hope they better concentrate on their shoping list given by their family and friends.

That explains why Javed is still on the team. Now please don't tell me they only go there for shopping. Who picks Javed then?? :-/

Fazal
August 1, 2006, 03:56 PM
Off course, those BCB official do not have any say in selecting the final XI. If they do, it will be a practice of undue exercise. Even the Team Manager has nothing to do with the selection, as in most cases, this post belongs to somebody, who is not a cricket expert (e.g. Mr. Latif). For our team, it is mainly 80% of DW and 20 % of HB. If any selector is present in the tour, he has 40% share with DW 50% anf HB 10%. This is purely my analysis (rather speculation).

See now you are confusing me again. After reading Mahmood's explaination, I thought I under stood the process. You are saying Manager has no say in team selection, where as Mahmood is saying in away series, Team Manager is also involved in team selection.

See thats the problem. No one knows for sure how a team is selected. Every body is guessing. No supporting info about their claim. Thats the problem w e have here. I bet if you ask the BCB execuitves the same question seperately, you will get five different version.

Thats the problem here. No concrete procedure and therefore no accountability.

BangladeshFan
August 1, 2006, 05:31 PM
Kind of off topic.

This time selectors may not be traveling, but other officials are traveling not at the invitation of Zim, but at the cost of BCB's money to watch the remaining three games, traveling 1st class, stayin in 5 star hotel and milking the hefty daily allownace, and doing some shopping I guess:

the executives who are traveling, are:

1. Shah Nurul Kabir Shaheen, M.P.
2. Asaduzzam Khusru
3. Shaheen Aftabur Reza
4. Soilab Hiossain Tutul

Each will cost 4.5 lack Taka. (total cost for these four is 18 lacks taka)
-- Source Dail Inqelab

I wish instead of this people traveling to ZIM, they could have fly Tushar instead, even he will not be used in the game.

wow. we got a member of parliament along with some 'soilab' etc traveling in public money and doing shopping (in public money too?). richest politicians of the poorest nation.:mad:

Stumped
August 1, 2006, 08:41 PM
The selection of the playing eleven was always heavly influenced by the selectors. It was very apparent during the England series, and also during the last series against Sri Lanka. But this time, no selector is traveling with the team, so it is not clear how much is their affect now on the team selection.

Anyway, one thing is clear- DW's spine is not that strong as most of us fan used to think it was.

Watch what u say there buddy... how dare u say that about dav! He fights tooth and bone for things to get done in BD. He does alot more than some other coaches so don't assume from lookin on the outside u know whats what. I don't know how u came to that conclusion but i would take it back if i were u. He cares and listens to everyone in that team and his back bone is prob stronger than yours. Id like to see u put in his position and see how u do...

TheWatcher
August 1, 2006, 11:27 PM
Watch what u say there buddy......
Stumped, truth hurts, does not it?

Most of the leading cricket coaches (for example Bennett King or Bob Woolmer) has the final say in their playing eleven selection, the job of the selectors stop with selecting the 15/14 members squad. The coach is the one who makes the strategy for his team, so the team selection has to be according to his will. But, as you can see, most of the fans here (the true fanatics who follows our cricket team very closely) are not convinced that it is the case with your father. One very apparent example is that the chief selector had prevented Aftab Ahmed from playing during the Test series against Sri Lanka. Even though Aftab was selected in the Test squad, the selector decided to punish him this way for not playing up to his potential in the previous ODI series. I am not going to argue whether it was a wrong or right decision, but it should have been decided by DW, not by Faruque Ahmed.

There are good reason a poor country like ours pay your father $150 K some money every year. If he does not carry out his responsibilities properly, it hurts us all as a nation. So, I have my full rights to express my disappointment at him regardless of how hurtful it is for you.

Anyway, I have no problem taking my words back if you can, instead of throwing emotional giberish, provide us some hard facts that your father is the supreme authority in the playing eleven selection.

Orpheus
August 2, 2006, 12:10 AM
you can argue wihtout being an a** you know....what's up with "your father" instead of coach whatmore. I would take that personally .....

and stop talking about the man's salary, it's not much really. Also he has been by far the best coach bd had though sometimes i didn't like him either (for example when he wanted a get out clause to grab India's job)

By the way I also thought ms. stumped overreacted a bit... It's a fanatics' blog... you shouldn't be reading if you can't shrug it off.

TheWatcher
August 2, 2006, 12:29 AM
Orpheus, I don't think Stumped needs you to act as her protective boyfriend, she sounds smart enough to hold on her own in a debate. But if you want debate on her behalf, I have no problem.

The argument is not about how good a coach Whatmore is, it is about whether he is bold enough not to let others meddling with his team selection (the playing eleven).

Orpheus
August 2, 2006, 12:54 AM
You need to show a bit more respect to me.. I am not your buddy nor I am your father. Maybe then I will argue with you over nothing...

TheWatcher
August 2, 2006, 01:20 AM
Orpheus, I don't consider you for anything (buddy, foe, whatever), so there is no question of respecting or disrespecting. Also, argueing over nothing is not my style.

I guess that means you have nothing to say about the issue here.

karimjay.
August 2, 2006, 01:41 AM
<TABLE id=HB_Mail_Container height="100%" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0 UNSELECTABLE="on"><TBODY><TR height="100%" UNSELECTABLE="on" width="100%"><TD id=HB_Focus_Element vAlign=top width="100%" background="" height=250 UNSELECTABLE="off">You guys are arguing about nothing right now btw. Well in my opinion its Dav Whatmore who selects the XI. Bashar gets a say but it doesnt really mean much because hes too soft so its down to Dav in essence. Stumped..why dont you ask your father about this sometime..?</TD></TR><TR UNSELECTABLE="on" hb_tag="1"><TD style="FONT-SIZE: 1pt" height=1 UNSELECTABLE="on">
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Fazal
August 2, 2006, 06:18 AM
So all along the coach's daughter and her boyfriend was monitoring this thread .... I should be nuch more careful next time.... I better be watch out what I say.... bohud Bhoy Paiseee......

Tigers_eye
August 2, 2006, 10:58 AM
ki dhukkhey ei thread khulsilam??

Fazal
August 2, 2006, 11:26 AM
Now can the selectors (who were responsible for the 3rd ODI team) please stand up ?

BangladeshFan
August 2, 2006, 02:32 PM
i dont know where do u guys find that the coach has the final say. It is the captain and captain only who makes decision about the final 11. the coach can atbest suggest. So it is not the question whether DW spine is strong or not it is Bashar whose spine should be strong enough. Anyway after seeing JO selected in this match, I am sure it is DW who is choosing him. its amazing that he was the same coach of 96 Srilankans with dare devil openers kalu and jaya. but in that case i guess it was capain ranatunga's decision(which it should be).

Fazal
August 2, 2006, 02:44 PM
i dont know where do u guys find that the coach has the final say. It is the captain and captain only who makes decision about the final 11.


Anyway after seeing JO selected in this match, I am sure it is DW who is choosing him. its amazing that he was the same coach of 96 Srilankans with dare devil openers kalu and jaya.

Please .... please ..... don't confuse me any more !!!!!

BangladeshFan
August 2, 2006, 03:01 PM
well, all i wanted to say is captain always take precedence over coach. Bd may be the only exception in this case.

Stumped
August 2, 2006, 07:42 PM
well, all i wanted to say is captain always take precedence over coach. Bd may be the only exception in this case.

OK im sorry if everyone feels i have over reacted. Dad does not have the final say neva has in any team, he only puts in his word. He is not a selector. He was briefly in sri lanka for a very short time. He did not like it as he felt it got in the way of his relationship with the players. What i was over reacting about was the back bone my father aparently does not have. Seriously I "over react" and defend my dad cos i know how much sleep dad does not get sometimes thinkin of different ways to help the guys. I know how many hours he spends getting footage together before every series, how much time he spends in the office as well as training with the guys and one on one. Really u guys can believe what u want at the end of the day but i only see my dad a month of a year and phone calls are all i have. If he did not care he would be with his family a hell of a lot more than what he does. I came to BD for a week to spend with dad last dec and still he had to work. and that was after not seeing him for many months. So if u think u can find a better coach that will work just as hard go ahead and make ur suggestions.. and no way should u bring how much he gets paid into all this... it is no lie that he gets paid alot less than other coaches.. and y?!?!?! Because he wants to help a team become the best team. A team that has been struggling for years...

Sorry
August 2, 2006, 08:08 PM
OK im sorry if everyone feels i have over reacted. Dad does not have the final say neva has in any team, he only puts in his word. He is not a selector. He was briefly in sri lanka for a very short time. He did not like it as he felt it got in the way of his relationship with the players. What i was over reacting about was the back bone my father aparently does not have. Seriously I "over react" and defend my dad cos i know how much sleep dad does not get sometimes thinkin of different ways to help the guys. I know how many hours he spends getting footage together before every series, how much time he spends in the office as well as training with the guys and one on one. Really u guys can believe what u want at the end of the day but i only see my dad a month of a year and phone calls are all i have. If he did not care he would be with his family a hell of a lot more than what he does. I came to BD for a week to spend with dad last dec and still he had to work. and that was after not seeing him for many months. So if u think u can find a better coach that will work just as hard go ahead and make ur suggestions.. and no way should u bring how much he gets paid into all this... it is no lie that he gets paid alot less than other coaches.. and y?!?!?! Because he wants to help a team become the best team. A team that has been struggling for years...
i always thought dav is the best coach we had so far....
but may i sense that you really don't like our team but defending your dad?
and, btw, a professional is not supposed to spend his time out of his work while his daughter is on holiday; besides, undisputedly, you should be proud of your dad for his dedication for the work.

Stumped
August 2, 2006, 08:22 PM
I will admit... sri lanka is always my number one team but i grew up with many of them and sri lanka is my home, but i do like the BD team. I have gotten to know a couple of them over the years and they are decent well mannerd guys. I am proud of my dad. I was not complaining that he went to work while i was there just stating it so that peop know how hard he works(it was just before x-mas). He really is an amazing man, not just cos he is my dad, but he gives a thousand percent no matter how small or large a task may be.

Fazal
August 2, 2006, 08:56 PM
[বাংলা] খাইশে.... মনে হয় এতো আসলেই কোচের মাইয়া [/বাংলা]

akabir77
August 2, 2006, 09:22 PM
listen stumped. Its very bad time to stick around in BC. I am sure when we do well you will see the same guys r full of pride with dav and the management. I am sure you know that by now.
On another note I can't understand why he didn't send any 12 man to come down the bowler and tell/suggest him where to bowl.
Yes you might say the bowler is experience etc but Dav have been in this situation then the whole bd team so he know exactly what to do. And that where i am disappointed that he didn't do most pro coaches would have done in the same position.

Stumped
August 2, 2006, 09:39 PM
I did not watch the match. Most probably when drinks were taken out messages were relayed then or if someone needed something or if someone is on the boundary and someone goes to talk to them. And not everything is on camera. I have no idea if dad did send msg or not but sometimes it does not help... they have to be willing to listen too! Im sure the team and bowlers knew what they were doing wrong. They are all feeling crap after yesterday and maybe so they should from what everyone is saying who watched the game. At the end of the day they have to be able to think for themselves. They have alot of prep for a tour let alone a game. They have team meetings to discuss the days game stratagy have analized all players more so on key players. They have been provided with alot of info... Yes peop are all full of praise for dad when they do well but i dun really pay much attention to all the hype its been up and down in each country for years with the fans... all i am tryin to do is show both sides of the field. If dad did something wrong id admit it, but learning from dad get all the facts first before judging or attacking...

Spitfire_x86
August 2, 2006, 11:26 PM
On another note I can't understand why he didn't send any 12 man to come down the bowler and tell/suggest him where to bowl.
Yes you might say the bowler is experience etc but Dav have been in this situation then the whole bd team so he know exactly what to do. And that where i am disappointed that he didn't do most pro coaches would have done in the same position.
No advice in the world will help us if we keep giving 4 full tosses in the last over.

akabir77
August 3, 2006, 08:37 AM
I guess we would never know what happen before that ball until dav writes about it in TC. but looking from the video footage it didn't seem that any instruction came. whether it would have worked or not that's different.
But one thing I want mention I am not judging or attacking anyone. I am just saying that might have given some hope to masri... as could say well every one told me to do this and it didn't work. instead he is hiding in his sweater now...

Tigers_eye
August 8, 2006, 09:33 AM
I had asked Saber Bhai about this process. I am quoting him.

"With regard to who selects the final XI on the day of the match, this is
usually for the Coach and Captain to decide but the Manager may also
be consulted. The Selectors choose / select the squad only."

Now we know which side H Bashar, Hira and the Coach is on in regards on JO and Kapali. Unless things have changed after he left. The new selectors seem to have more influence on the final eleven.

(Miraz, Mahmood, Sydney, Dak_Pion was right all along)

Sovik
August 8, 2006, 09:37 AM
so we are still blaming dave for mash bowling 4 full tosses.

Bad luck for JO cause his friend will not be in kenya to give him another chance

Tigers_eye
August 8, 2006, 09:44 AM
so we are still blaming dave for mash bowling 4 full tosses.
I don't think so. The only one to be blamed is Mash himself. No one in sane mind would ask a bowler to bowl one fulltoss in the dying moments let alone four.

Fazal
August 8, 2006, 10:12 AM
I had asked Saber Bhai about this process. I am quoting him.

"With regard to who selects the final XI on the day of the match, this is
usually for the Coach and Captain to decide but the Manager may also
be consulted. The Selectors choose / select the squad only."

Now we know which side H Bashar, Hira and the Coach is on in regards on JO and Kapali. Unless things have changed after he left. The new selectors seem to have more influence on the final eleven.

(Miraz, Mahmood, Sydney, Dak_Pion was right all along)

Hmmm... based on different rumors in newspapers (past and present) I suspect things may have changed a lit bit. For exmaple I have hard time to believe that the manager has more to say (selecting the final 11) than selectors? Before Hira (who was just recently being appointed), we used to have a non-cricket back ground Manager. Also my guess is for-good-or-for-bad the current set of selectors are more involved in team selection than before.

These are all speculation in my part. And its happening becuase, BCB never came out in public and addressed this in a official manner and continue to allow this issue a breeding ground for rumors.

Stumped
August 8, 2006, 07:00 PM
...

Fazal
August 9, 2006, 12:39 PM
...

What that supposed to mean? Does that mean you know somthing but don't want to share with us for one reason or another? Or you shared with us.... but it was edited by someone for one reason or another?

Stumped
August 10, 2006, 06:15 PM
What that supposed to mean? Does that mean you know somthing but don't want to share with us for one reason or another? Or you shared with us.... but it was edited by someone for one reason or another?

Hmm but there are things that cant be discussed on here i guess... But no i forgot i had replyed to something earlier... and i did not know how to delete it.. sorry!