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View Full Version : WC’07 thoughts in relation to BD Away-Series Loss to Zim


Ahmed_B
December 8, 2006, 05:10 AM
Bangladesh just finished their 4th match of the home series against ZIM winning it convincingly by 8 wickets. And except for the 3rd ODI, the current Zimbabwe team looks to be clearly falling behind the BD team in terms of number of consistent performers as well as team-spirit. Right now... it looks as if this Bangladesh team can defeat Zimbabwe 9 out of 10 times... but ofcourse on Subcontinental conditions.

So why did BD lose it's away series to ZIM few months back? Was it due to Complacency? or does BD still have some major weaknesses while playing on non-subcontinental wickets which they should really work on?

At this moment, we might feel highly confident that it was simply a bad series and those days are over and it won’t come back again. But as I feel... this amazing turn-around of the BD team and dominating Zimbabwe for 5 games in a row (including Champ Trophy) results from two important factors combined :

1)Improvement of the Squad + 2)Success of the SLA’s in Sub-continental grounds

Firstly, the inclusion of Mehrab Jr & Saqib in the top order has produced the valuable stabilization which has become a key factor making the difference between the ZIM-Away series and the next 5 games. Its yet to be found out how effective and consistent these two will be against stronger opponents… but it has worked fine against ZIM.

Secondly, and surely… the SLA gang has done magic for the team in the later 5 matches. Inclusion of Saqib has re-inforced this strength of BD also. But again... if we look at the Zim-Away series which we lost, the the whole of BD bowling did not work very well because of being in a very different conditions.

This is where I would give a second thought before deciding which performance of BD will give a better picture while predicting BD’s output in the coming-soon WC2007. Conditions of the Lost ZIM-Away series are bit more closer to the WC environment for sure.

These are the factors that will be very important for sure:

1) Caribbean pacer-friendly sporting wickets-Reducing the effectiveness of our SLA attack.
2) Opponents that play spin bowling much better than Zim/Ken side
3) Effectiveness of Mehrab/Saqib/Mushfiq/Farhad (whoever is included) might not have as big an effect as it did against weaker teams.

I would rather suggest doing a clear post-mortem of our Away Series Loss to ZIM and find out why our bowlers failed to make a very big impact on the ZIM side and why our Batsmen failed to dominate this same ZIM attack. Complacency might have been a factor... but again, surely the looking-back will give us a lot of clues on what are the team’s weaknesses in a very different and non-spinner-friendly conditions.

PoorFan
December 8, 2006, 06:22 AM
As far I can remember, our top order horrible performance was the big failure in Africa. In my impression, top order batting consistency is making it looks a huge difference ( improvement? ) than Africa. In that sense, perhaps BD is as same as old BD in other department.

cricket_dorshok
December 8, 2006, 07:37 AM
As PoorFan said, I think BD is in the same place where they were in Africa Safari. In this series they look much better than opponents. Becuse, this ZIM is much worse than that we played against in away series. I don't know what happened to ZIM. Look today's match, how our batsmen school-boy's cricket played. Despite their repeated school boy cricket we won by 8 wkts. I think, if we played like this way against any club team, BD would have lost the match. I am not convinced that we have improved a lot in three months. Results look much better due to weak opponent not to our drastic improvement. Having all said, I belive we should beat ZIM in any day in any condition as we are much better than them.

israr
December 8, 2006, 02:02 PM
As PoorFan said, I think BD is in the same place where they were in Africa Safari. In this series they look much better than opponents. Becuse, this ZIM is much worse than that we played against in away series. I don't know what happened to ZIM. Look today's match, how our batsmen school-boy's cricket played. Despite their repeated school boy cricket we won by 8 wkts. I think, if we played like this way against any club team, BD would have lost the match. I am not convinced that we have improved a lot in three months. Results look much better due to weak opponent not to our drastic improvement. Having all said, I belive we should beat ZIM in any day in any condition as we are much better than them.

I disagree.
The Zimbabweans are still very much the same. But the difference in results are due to the fact that we've improved and above all, we're playing in home conditions.

SS
December 8, 2006, 03:03 PM
I agree 100% with Ahmed_B.
These are the factors that will be very important for sure:

1) Caribbean pacer-friendly sporting wickets-Reducing the effectiveness of our SLA attack.
2) Opponents that play spin bowling much better than Zim/Ken side
3) Effectiveness of Mehrab/Saqib/Mushfiq/Farhad (whoever is included) might not have as big an effect as it did against weaker teams.

WC will be totally different, and we have no plans for it yet!!! May be we planned, but so far didn't give any solid confidence that we won't make the same mistakes we do whenever we play in 'different' games with 'different' opponents.

No doubt if Mash, and rectified Rajib serve us well in upcoming matches in WC, we will show good fight. But we won't be able to show any resistance, our SLA attack may be help us few mid overs, but what if opponent go for a kill in few overs. Not sure, if our players developed that nerve yet to deal with that sort of situations.

I know I am happy with all of you for recent performances of the team in this series, but I am not totally convinced the way the team is getting prepared for the big events.

akabir77
December 8, 2006, 03:35 PM
I think in WI there r couple of pitches that matches with ours and remember we had a good tour over there. they once had pace bowlers but not pace wickets like SA, NZ or AUS

SS
December 8, 2006, 04:20 PM
We should then immediately make our pitches like that ...clone them!
but can we clone Ind and SL pacers and spinners so that we can practice ..I remember we brought somebody who coult bowl like SA spinner Adams before our games against them.
Our batsmen playing also lot in backfoot in recent series, scenario will be different when Zhaeer,Munaf,Irfan, Vaas, Malinga will bowl. What about our weakness against OB and legspin. I believe our players should play leagues few matches, then play few games with Ind/SL A sides. But to get used to with the pitch, we have to go there to play and get used to WI type pitches. I guess we can not do all those things with the amount of time we have in hand. But it's better to start early one at a time rather than procastinating and complaining, or even waiting for the last moment.

Beamer
December 8, 2006, 04:28 PM
SS - You make some very good points. In between jan and March, BCB should actively look for sending the team overseas to play against quality domestic opponents. Would it be too hard to arrange some one day games against SL or Pak "A" teams? or Academy XI's? I think not. They should try really hard. If they can arrange something with PCB, that will be ideal as they have a plethora of quality pacers and even spinners in their domestic sides.

TheWatcher
December 8, 2006, 04:39 PM
1) Caribbean pacer-friendly sporting wickets-Reducing the effectiveness of our SLA attack.
Really ? I was under the impression that West Indian wickets are not that pacer friendly nowadays, not more than how Mirpur wicket was yesterday.

Our spinners don't produce much turns from wickets anyway (as we have seen in the last four ODIs), they depend more on drift, variation of line, length, and speed. As long the wicket in Trinidad is not grassy, they should be ok.

However, I do think that we should not depend on Sakib (obviously, not on Mehrab either) as a full time bowler against better oppositions.

Thunder
December 8, 2006, 04:53 PM
The last time we went to play West indies was a very good one when we managed to draw a test by performing well and as a follow through Lara declared that he will retire if he doesn't win the 2nd test. We also did well in the odi series too. I still remember that day when we had 3 centurians in a test.. So, i am hopeful that BD will show a good performance again and will be through to the 2nd round at least. :flag:

reyme
December 8, 2006, 05:54 PM
SS - Would it be too hard to arrange some one day games against SL or Pak "A" teams? or Academy XI's? I think not. They should try really hard. If they can arrange something with PCB, that will be ideal as they have a plethora of quality pacers and even spinners in their domestic sides.

Why go through all this trouble and spend so much? Spend that money in the local leagues and make it more attractive by handsome awards! Just open the premier league for foreign players with no quota, make the pitches like WI. Surely local clubs will import quality bowlers, and challenge the BD batsmen to the extremes!

Ahmed_B
December 9, 2006, 02:52 AM
It is great to see that the 2nd pitch of Mirpur stadium (today's match) is a sporting batting wicket. That should help BD to try out pace options and batting against it as well.

And ofcourse... just a small clue in today's match (ODI-5) of what even Zimbabwe can do to the 'aparently solid but ultimately frazile' BD batting if the wicket is a sporting batting/bowling track!

SS
December 9, 2006, 11:47 AM
That should help BD to try out pace options and batting against it as well.

And ofcourse... just a small clue in today's match (ODI-5) of what even Zimbabwe can do to the 'aparently solid but ultimately frazile' BD batting if the wicket is a sporting batting/bowling track!

if Zimb can peg us down like this, imagine how well we need to prepare against Ind and SL in this sort of pitch.

Miraz
December 9, 2006, 12:49 PM
Don't take too much from todays performance. It was a dead rubber and players played five matches (including 20-20) before where they have won easily. Bangladesh is not yet a professional side and we cannot expect professional performance from them in every game.

Bangladesh has progressed significantly that's true. Our defeat in Zim away series is not a true indication of our performance. A number of non cricket related factors and Bashar's absence played some important role in our series defeat. Moreover, we have lost two matches from winning position due to lack of leadership.

From my knowledge, WI wickets have got pretty similarity with Pakistani wicket (sporting subcontinent wicket). Bangladesh performed well in the past in similar conditions (both in WI and Pakistan away series). There is considerable difference (improvement) between current Bangladesh and previous Bangladesh which toured WI and Pakistan.

The only thing that worries me is lack of quality match practice ahead of World Cup. We need to play at least two competitive game before WC against teams other than Zim/Kenya/Scot/Bermuda/Namibia et al.

Kabir
December 9, 2006, 01:22 PM
Don't take too much from todays performance. It was a dead rubber and players played five matches (including 20-20) before where they have won easily. Bangladesh is not yet a professional side and we cannot expect professional performance from them in every game.
...

The only thing that worries me is lack of quality match practice ahead of World Cup. We need to play at least two competitive game before WC against teams other than Zim/Kenya/Scot/Bermuda/Namibia et al.

Good observation Miraz bhai. Absolutely, there needs to be practice matches before the WC with STRONG teams. If that's not possible at all, then I would go with Reyme and Beamer's ideas. What I strongly believe is, we need practice with two things: strong pacers, and good fielders.

Strong pacers: Given that we cannot play with strong teams like PAK or SL, we could import a couple of players from there. Play the matches in Mirpur as Ahmed bhai said, and see how well our players do. At the same time, I would encourage the management to hire a bowling coach, like Wasim Akram (not sure about his availability right now), for even as short a time as two weeks. I know particularly Wasim Akram's coaching is superb, and that might help our pacers. But the reason we want to import pacers if not play against strong teams is for our batting practice. We can get a 2-in-one deal this way.

Good fielders: To improve our fielding, we need to practice with the big boys and play well against them. Take tips from them, watch them play, bring some coaches, anything will do. With players like Sakib, Rajin, and Ashraful who are doing good in fielding, we should improve them, and make others like Bashar, SN, and Mashrafe get some training.

After watching the series, I must admit that even though we whitewashed Zimbabwe, we only deserved to win the first 4 ODIs. We shouldn't have won the last one, given our performance in the last one. Yes, may be some of the wickets we lost were because of good bowling by Bent, we gotta keep it in mind that when we're playing against big boys, this is the type of bowling we have to face ALL the time. So, in other words: most of our batsmen aren't ready for bowlers of such calibre.

SS
December 11, 2006, 09:48 AM
We are having so many thoughts and suggestions, but not sure if BCB cares about it. As Mr. Miraz mentioned that WI wicket is like Pak wicket. Why can't our BCB officials arrange few games with PAK A team. Not sure if they took any initiatives?
Playing any subcontinent team's A team in WI like pitches will help us to prepare to face other two subcontinent teams as they play almost and addition to that we will be playing in wickets similar to WI.

Sam
December 11, 2006, 10:54 AM
...Bangladesh has progressed significantly that's true. Our defeat in Zim away series is not a true indication of our performance. A number of non cricket related factors and Bashar's absence played some important role in our series defeat. Moreover, we have lost two matches from winning position due to lack of leadership...
I agree. It was a mixture of complacency and other factors, which was the reason for our failure in that away series.
I remember, we have lost from winning position twice. Once it was the forgetable horrible delivery in the last over from Mash, which changed the fate of the match against us - just from Hero to Zero.

Imteaz
December 12, 2006, 01:27 AM
I Don't Think We Can Even Compare This Series with WC. Beating, Inexperienced and Weak Zimbabwe in Home Soil will Never Show The Prepareness of WC. Our Cricketers Should be Prepared for 100 times Tougher Situation to Handle With. If Our Tigers Can Beat Zimbabwe on a Same way in Zimbabwe, Then I will Say You are 50% Ready.

But Dont be Upset. We are Playing Test Cricket only for 6 Years. I Think We should Wait for Some More Times. My Best Expectation from Our Tigers is Bangladesh will be a Favourite in 2011 World Cup. Not More Than That. But It is Also Almost Impossible. They Have to Work Too Hard.

Have a Nice Time.