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banglapower83
January 16, 2007, 07:44 AM
Gibbs slur on Pakistani supporters were behaving "like bloody animals" and "f**** Pakistanis

http://www.criki.com/videos/show/364

gatekeeper
January 16, 2007, 09:08 AM
This feels doctored but if it isin't there'll be hell to pay, I'm sure. Pakistanis are very good at palying this sort of things to their advantage. And in this case, they absolutely should.

Zunaid
January 16, 2007, 09:13 AM
This feels doctored but if it isin't there'll be hell to pay, I'm sure. Pakistanis are very good at palying this sort of things to their advantage. And in this case, they absolutely should.

From Cricinfo:

South Africa v Pakistan, 1st Test, Centurion
Gibbs to appeal against ban
Board postpones disciplinary hearing (http://www.cricinfo.com/southafrica/content/current/story/276610.html) | Two-Test ban for racial slur (http://www.cricinfo.com/rsavpak/content/current/story/276497.html)

ialbd
January 16, 2007, 10:02 AM
racism with the pakis !!!
gibbs paper-taper pore na mone hoy....

Kabir
January 16, 2007, 10:26 AM
Old news...but not surprised. SA aligning themselves up nicely with the Aussies looks like.

gatekeeper
January 16, 2007, 10:30 AM
From Cricinfo:

South Africa v Pakistan, 1st Test, Centurion
Gibbs to appeal against ban
Board postpones disciplinary hearing (http://www.cricinfo.com/southafrica/content/current/story/276610.html) | Two-Test ban for racial slur (http://www.cricinfo.com/rsavpak/content/current/story/276497.html)


Right, I just read that. Two test ban is way too soft.

Kabir
January 16, 2007, 12:53 PM
Our players get half their match fee fined coz of criticizing other team mates, without breaking any rules. And he just gets 0% fined...but banned for two tests. He should rather be made to play, play, and play...without one year's salary. :smug:

israr
January 16, 2007, 02:46 PM
You never know, Gibbs might have been provacated by those Pakistanis. Remember, this was the same team which demanded an apology from Jones about his comment on Hashim Amla. But in no way at all, I am defending Gibbs. We should first try to get to the root of the source.

Hatebreed
January 16, 2007, 03:09 PM
Nevertheless, resorting to racial slurs was very uncivil of him. Two match ban is too soft, he should have been fined also. If he was provoked, he should have informed the umpire so that the right officials could remove those people from the crowd.

gatekeeper
January 16, 2007, 04:15 PM
this was the same team which demanded an apology from Jones about his comment on Hashim Amla.

I was thinking the same thing. Also, isn't Gibbs black? But whatever his skin color is, this is very serious.

Alien
January 16, 2007, 07:56 PM
It's South Africa. What do you expect?

Kamini
January 16, 2007, 09:12 PM
http://www.cricketnext.com/news/gibbs-jibes-heats-up-racism-row/22773-13.html

Gavaskar wants action against Richards.

But Smith says Pakistani supporters provoked Gibbs by their racial comments and instigation. Gibbs punishment is justified. But Pakistani supporters need to be punished at the same time.

http://www.ndtv.com/sports/cricket/showstory.asp?id=32066


More racism: http://www.ndtv.com/topstories/showtopstory.asp?slug=British+Asians+campaign+for+ Shilpa+Shetty&id=21183&category=National

Kabir
January 16, 2007, 09:40 PM
Here's a clip where you can hear Gibbs' voice saying whatever he said.
http://www.criki.com/videos/show/364

My question is: He seemed to be close to the stumps when this happened. How is it possible that he's saying Pakistani fans used racial comments at him? Wouldn't that be like he was fielding near the boundary? Also, Gibbs hardly fields in the boundary lines. If the racial comments by Pakistani supporters were expressed beforehand, he was really out of his mind when he did this. Just shows his lack of control over his temper.

ialbd
January 16, 2007, 10:16 PM
Here's a clip where you can hear Gibbs' voice saying whatever he said.
http://www.criki.com/videos/show/364

My question is: He seemed to be close to the stumps when this happened. How is it possible that he's saying Pakistani fans used racial comments at him? Wouldn't that be like he was fielding near the boundary? Also, Gibbs hardly fields in the boundary lines. If the racial comments by Pakistani supporters were expressed beforehand, he was really out of his mind when he did this. Just shows his lack of control over his temper.

hmm good point Kabir bhai. I was thinking the same, how did his voice get recorded in the tvcast. I am assuming he said this to one of his team mate when they huddled up after the end of the over.


P.S: isnt this the original clip the thread started with Kabir bhai? :-D

Carte Blanche
January 16, 2007, 10:37 PM
The way I see it, Gibby's position is untenable. He got caught on the mics and didn't deny it happening. The extenuating circumstances are weak at best. They crowd pay big bucks to come to the ground to be entertained. If the ground authority deems their behaviour unruly, they deserve to be ejected. Gibbs, on the other hand, is paid not just to be a Cricketer, but also an entertainer. I do not condone the abuse by the crowd at all, but how can he ever justify what he said? If it bothers him that much, he always has the luxury of using the proper channels to propagate his grief. And now by deciding to appeal ICC's ruling, he is flipflopping just like Kerry. The truth of the matter is, these things happen in professional sports all the time. You don't have to be a whiny baby about it. I'm not the over-sensitive kind, and am reluctant to flash the race-card like many do; however, I'd like to see him being made an example out of because of his sheer stupidity.

ps: Gavaskar's allegation is ridiculous. Barry's comments are open to interpretation, and I'm willing to bet it wasn't intended with racial malice. If we can compare BD's gutsy performance to Aussie professionalism, BD's batting collapse to Paki batters' unpredictable nature, why spare the Indians?

AsifTheManRahman
January 17, 2007, 01:21 AM
gavaskar may have been one of the best batsmen of his era, but honestly, the guy's a clown.

what's wrong with these short little indian batting geniuses? first tendulkar goes in public to say "You should always respect your elders..." (re: the aussies pushing powar off the cameras)...what the heck? brown guy giving a white guy a lesson on how to treat older people? does he know how funny that sounded? "You should always respect your elders..." - what a clown to the western ear! then there's gavaskar, sniffing racism in a harmless comment (taking advantage of the situation, perhaps?) - what a clown!

gatekeeper
January 17, 2007, 01:42 AM
gavaskar may have been one of the best batsmen of his era, but honestly, the guy's a clown.

what's wrong with these short little indian batting geniuses? first tendulkar goes in public to say "You should always respect your elders..." (re: the aussies pushing powar off the cameras)...what the heck? brown guy giving a white guy a lesson on how to treat older people? does he know how funny that sounded? "You should always respect your elders..." - what a clown to the western ear! then there's gavaskar, sniffing racism in a harmless comment (taking advantage of the situation, perhaps?) - what a clown!

What are you talking about? How do you figure respecting elders is a foreign notion to white people?

Gavaskar took offense in Richards' statement and reacted to it. What is so clownish about that? I agree with Carte Blanche that it is open to interpritation and SG interpreted it to be offensive, he has every right to do that.

BTW, I did not find it offensive but I'm not ready to call someone a clown if he does.

AsifTheManRahman
January 17, 2007, 01:55 AM
What are you talking about? How do you figure respecting elders is a foreign notion to white people?


i found the concept of someone from india teaching an australian how to behave stupid, because the two cultures are very different, and "respecting elders" has a totally different meaning across cultures. he needn't have mentioned the word "elders", since the fact that powar is older had nothing to do with it; rather he could've worded his statement like "they should have shown more respect and maturity in their behaviour", although anything that he'd have said would've been much ado about nothing imo, because i didn't think there was anything wrong in the powar incident.


Gavaskar took offense in Richards' statement and reacted to it. What is so clownish about that? I agree with Carte Blanche that it is open to interpritation and SG interpreted it to be offensive, he has every right to do that.


well, richards was definitely referring to performance related issues, and i don't see how that could be tied to racism. i agree that it could be open to interpretation, but why stir the pot by choosing to interpret it the least accurate way? i thought it was more like trying to dig up traces of racism just for the heck of it, and hence the assigned adjective.

I'm not ready to call someone a clown if he does.

sure. you go your way, and i go mine :-D

gatekeeper
January 17, 2007, 02:29 AM
i found the concept of someone from india teaching an australian how to behave stupid, because the two cultures are very different, and "respecting elders" has a totally different meaning across cultures. he needn't have mentioned the word "elders", since the fact that powar is older had nothing to do with it; rather he could've worded his statement like "they should have shown more respect and maturity in their behaviour", although anything that he'd have said would've been much ado about nothing imo, because i didn't think there was anything wrong in the powar incident.


I think Australians would understand what he meant by "Elders". No reason to go into a sementic argument here. I don't think he was trying to "teach" anything but merely pointing out certain aspects. It's like me saying "our politicians should try to behave". As far as cultural differnces go, these people travel to each other's countries so often that it would really be moronic if one didn't know some key aspects of the other's culture. I remember a few years ago when Steve Waugh's Autralia visited India, I was in Delhi. They were just as aggresive and attacking on the field as the present bunch but off the field they showed tremendous respect to the locals. But the present lot I feel is not that adapt. I don't diagree with you that it was blown out of proportions but Tendulkar's comments weren't anything to get miffed.

gatekeeper
January 17, 2007, 02:32 AM
well, richards was definitely referring to performance related issues, and i don't see how that could be tied to racism. i agree that it could be open to interpretation, but why stir the pot by choosing to interpret it the least accurate way? i thought it was more like trying to dig up traces of racism just for the heck of it, and hence the assigned adjective.



Valid argument. But think about it, if you had 24 more hours to react, would you still call him a clown?

AsifTheManRahman
January 17, 2007, 02:43 AM
As far as cultural differnces go, these people travel to each other's countries so often that it would really be moronic if one didn't know some key aspects of the other's culture.


exactly my point. one would think he'd know, given that he's travelled a lot.

Tendulkar's comments weren't anything to get miffed.

i wasn't saying anyone should get miffed. all i said was those words sounded pretty funny, because they were not very well put, and out of context.

AsifTheManRahman
January 17, 2007, 02:46 AM
Valid argument. But think about it, if you had 24 more hours to react, would you still call him a clown?

i see you're having problems with the word clown. like i implied in the line "you go your way, and i go mine", you can replace it with whatever adjective best suits your liking. :)

and just for the record, yeah, i'd still have used the word clown given 24 hours to reconsider :)

gatekeeper
January 17, 2007, 03:04 AM
i see you're having problems with the word clown. like i implied in the line "you go your way, and i go mine", you can replace it with whatever adjective best suits your liking. :)



You're right, I do have a problem with the word 'clown'. In some tents it is considered a serious slander. Gavaskar's comments at most times I find repitative and not insightful but he's one of the giants of out time in cricketing terms. He would really have to run naked thru the field for me to call him that.

AsifTheManRahman
January 17, 2007, 03:07 AM
He would really have to run naked thru the field for me to call him that.

suit yourself

AsifTheManRahman
January 17, 2007, 03:34 AM
haven't really gone through all the links posted, but the report in this <a href="http://thatscricket.oneindia.in/news/2007/01/15/1501gibbs-yet-again-courts-contraversy.html">link</a> says that seven spectators were removed from the ground for making racist remarks at the players.

Carte Blanche
January 17, 2007, 03:52 AM
I actually agree with the word "clown". I wanted to say something along that line, but opted for something more diplomatic in the end. I remember listening to Gavaskar's commentary on ESPN back in the days with Harsha Bhogle. He has a unique way of injecting racism and bias in his arguments, and ends up victimizing India (and other Subcontinentals). I don't know if it is his lack of articulacy or a mere inferiority complex. Nonetheless, he used to whine on and on about how unfair Aussie umpires are. I specifically recall this Tendulkar LBW: basically, despite the procession of batsmen around him, Sachin held the Innings together. In comes a McGrath short delivery that didn't bounce as high as Sachin anticipated. He ends up ducking and the ball hits his helmet. Dubiously, he was adjudged LBW. I was irate at the decision myself, but I wouldn't go as far as to call the umpire racist because of that like Gavaskar did.

Great players don't always translate to think-before-you-accuse-commentators.

akabir77
January 17, 2007, 11:20 AM
interesting article in cricinfo on this today:
As for the other issue, if the offending fans were white would you still have said what you said? ...
I'm asking this question because when the South African team suffered racist abuse from spectators - most of them white - in Australia last season, there was no shouting about or at the fans from the field. At least, none seems to have been recorded.
I'm not calling you racist, I'm trying to explain why some people might do so.
And what about the Pakistani batsmen who were out there on the field with you? Didn't you think that what you said broke the admittedly unwritten rules of sledging? Also, how does it change anything if you were talking to your teammates? The comments you made are still out there, regardless.
I have to tell you that when I heard for myself what you said, I was disgusted. It's not the swearing. Bloody hell, I'm a reporter - we were born effing and blinding, and I'll continue to do so until I b****r off this mortal coil at the age of 112. So swearing doesn't scare me. Instead, it was your harsh tone that struck me most.

Read the full article (http://content-usa.cricinfo.com/rsavpak/content/current/story/276685.html)

HereWeGo
January 21, 2007, 03:41 PM
Well i think that if he was provoked than he shud not have been suspended for 2 tests. I am sure that if most of you were provoked u wont keep urself quiet. Plus Gibbs hmself is not white. Does neone know wat sentense inzamam recieved when he fought with a spectator in toronto. they called him "Aloo". I think wat Pak spectators said was more offensive than Aloo. And honestly Wasim Waqar used to sledge all the time. And This is a fact that all the players use the "f" word in the field all the time. Sometimes even against their team mates when they drop a catch or something (this is fact). May be that cricket is not a gentlemans game nemore but I think Gibbs is just made a scapegoat for being at the wrong place(infront of stump mic) at the wrong time.

Carte Blanche
January 21, 2007, 06:06 PM
The "F" word is not on trial here.

If I call you a blanking moron, that's a personal insult. If I call you a blanking fish monger, or a blanking Bangli, that's racism --> and that is exactly the problem here. The crowd are not the ICC's ambassadors, the national cricketers are. The severest punishment ICC can slap a spectator with is ejection from the ground, or a lawsuit at the severest.

I remember this Malcolm Knox article around the time Darren Lehmann was punished for racist remarks against Sri Lanka:

Lehmann's misfortune is that he is the man who got caught revealing the unwitting racism that infuses not only Australian cricketing culture but mainstream Australia.
Lehmann's supporters cannot understand the difference between calling someone a "c---" and a "black c---". Nor, presumably, can they understand that it is offensive for our media commentators to speak of the Sri Lankans as "babbling" in the field, as "leaping about with great big smiles" or as "little guys". Monkeys babble. Little black sambos have great big smiles.

If Gibbs was caught on mic calling the crowd merely "animals", my guess is this would have been a non-issue. But since he was caught saying "blanking animals" and "blanking Pakistanis" AND "they belong to the zoo", it clearly constitutes racism and therefore should not be tolerated. Surely there were mitigating circumstances, but two wrongs don't make a right. Plus, given that ICC practically signs his paycheques, he is bound by its code of conducts; the crowd aren't.

Who here remembers the famous Ian Healy encounter with Ranatunga? Basically, Ranatunga wanted a runner and Healy said "You don't get a runner for being an unfit fat c***." That's not racism, neither are the taunting chants of "aloo". Gibbs not being white is irrelevant here. It doesn't give him a license to racially vilify others. Where I work, we have a "zero tolerance on racism" policy. If I get caught calling my colleague a negro blabbermouth, I'm fired. It doesn't matter if I announce it on a megaphone or crack it as a private joke. It's simple as that.

akabir77
January 21, 2007, 07:26 PM
The "F" word is not on trial here.

If I call you a blanking moron, that's a personal insult. If I call you a blanking fish monger, or a blanking Bangli, that's racism --> and that is exactly the problem here. The crowd are not the ICC's ambassadors, the national cricketers are. The severest punishment ICC can slap a spectator with is ejection from the ground, or a lawsuit at the severest.

I remember this Malcolm Knox article around the time Darren Lehmann was punished for racist remarks against Sri Lanka:

Lehmann's misfortune is that he is the man who got caught revealing the unwitting racism that infuses not only Australian cricketing culture but mainstream Australia.
Lehmann's supporters cannot understand the difference between calling someone a "c---" and a "black c---". Nor, presumably, can they understand that it is offensive for our media commentators to speak of the Sri Lankans as "babbling" in the field, as "leaping about with great big smiles" or as "little guys". Monkeys babble. Little black sambos have great big smiles.

If Gibbs was caught on mic calling the crowd merely "animals", my guess is this would have been a non-issue. But since he was caught saying "blanking animals" and "blanking Pakistanis" AND "they belong to the zoo", it clearly constitutes racism and therefore should not be tolerated. Surely there were mitigating circumstances, but two wrongs don't make a right. Plus, given that ICC practically signs his paycheques, he is bound by its code of conducts; the crowd aren't.

Who here remembers the famous Ian Healy encounter with Ranatunga? Basically, Ranatunga wanted a runner and Healy said "You don't get a runner for being an unfit fat c***." That's not racism, neither are the taunting chants of "aloo". Gibbs not being white is irrelevant here. It doesn't give him a license to racially vilify others. Where I work, we have a "zero tolerance on racism" policy. If I get caught calling my colleague a negro blabbermouth, I'm fired. It doesn't matter if I announce it on a megaphone or crack it as a private joke. It's simple as that.



Good one. Exactly my point too. Like the cricinfo article said he never complained or any other SA when Australian supporters where doing the same thing but look at him now... And it doesn't matter what color he is. HereWeGO bhai do u think blacks have some kind of a license to be raciest?

Kabir
January 21, 2007, 07:48 PM
HereWeGO bhai do u think blacks have some kind of a license to be raciest?

It's important to define the term "racism". It's not that the racist could only be a white, and the victim has to be a non-white. It could be the other way round too. And here's a little note for HereWeGo: there's racism in Bangladesh too.