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View Full Version : How good is Enamul Jr.......?


sheshprohor
October 13, 2003, 08:48 AM
Anyone have seen his bowling against ENG. How good is he actually?

Is this the time we should seriously considering to have 2 spinners?



Prohor

fwullah
October 13, 2003, 09:12 AM
Yes, this is the time to consider a 2nd spinner seriously. And that 2nd spinner should be Fahim Muntasir - the off spinner along with Rafique.

And Enamul Haque Junior can continue to learn - even after such a good performance against England and hopefully he will permanently replace Rafique when it is time for both - Rafique to retire from International cricket and Enamul Haque Junior to grow up - I mean really grow up and mature to bowl at top class batsman including somebody like Saurav Ganguly - who is best in playing spinners, not like the England batsman who are first of all, not playing seriously in this practice match, secondly are generally not good on slow wickets and thirdly are not comfortable against ACCURATE spin.

Although Enamul Junior had taken 3 wickets, but he also gave away a few runs - I would like to see him become a little more disciplined - than what he really is at the moment.

In that way, we will not face a similar situation that we are facing with Ashraful and also we will probably get a matured player like Rajin.

Upal
October 13, 2003, 10:04 AM
Although Enamul Junior had taken 3 wickets, but he also gave away a few runs - I would like to see him become a little more disciplined - than what he really is at the moment.


I have to disagree on that point Fahmida. Enamul Haque Jr. only gave up 59 runs from 27.1 overs, this is only a little over 2 runs per over. I think that's pretty tight bowling on his part. More importantly, he picked up 4 wickets. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he got the call upto the senior team in this series to become the 2nd spinner.

Clearly, Fahim Muntasir has no chance as he was not selected for either of the practise matches.

After our bowling performace from the mainly u-19 squad, I'm now a lot more confident of achieveing positive results against England in tests. :cool:

samircreep
October 13, 2003, 09:56 PM
Wow, I wonder how many of you guys have actually seen Shumit or Aminul.

Shumit and and Jr do have similarities. They both depend a lot on flight and both love attacking the off stump. But that's pretty much where the similarities end.

But I think the point raised was whether Shumit and Rafique should bowl together in a test match.In this case, I think Daily Star, with its next to worthless reporting on our cricket, had preveiously raised a huge hue and cry regarding Shumit's absence from either of the prep. matches and we seem to have been carried away with the rhetoric.

Bottom line is Aminul Islam Jr is a far better bowler than Shumit. I watched Shumit bowl around 15 overs on the first day from the pavilion end, and before that i saw him in the practise matches when BD just got back from the WC. And this guy is good. Even though both are chinamen, Aminul actually turns the ball enough to get edges. And this he does with the new ball.He would have had Trescothic out on 20 with an edge had Babu held on to a relatively simple slip catch.While I don't see Shumit ever taking 5 test match wickets, Aminul certainly has the ability to be a match winner.

Final verdict: Play him in the first test. he's not gonna mature any more than he has playing for the A or U-19 team.

rafiq
October 13, 2003, 10:00 PM
samir you have me confused - aminul jr or enamul jr?

playing both spinners on a slow and low track would make sense but there seems to be strong sentiment to include mushfiq babu on the team - I don't see how both mushfiq and the enamul can play. and we still need a batsman at 5.

Tehsin
October 13, 2003, 10:10 PM
It is enamul haque junior. :)

If the coach/selectors decide that we will go with two spinners and leave mushfiq behind, we can definitely see enamul jr in action. He is certainly a future prospect for the side.

How was Mushfiq's bowling ? 35 runs in 20 overs sound pretty good. But, what about the wickets ?

samircreep
October 13, 2003, 11:19 PM
Sorry bout the gaffer :o

Mushfique bowled well, but as i said in my test preview, that guy will never get top order batsmen out consistently. Tehsin, Mushfique looks set to play. he will bat at six. And should Enamul play, he'll bowl with Shujon, Mash Rafique and Mushfique. Tapash will sit out.

pagol-chagol
October 14, 2003, 01:13 AM
Thanks Sameercreep for the insights.

Wasn't Jr.'s performance (getting three world class batsman out in 10 balls without giving up any run) the greatest performance by a Bangladeshi bowler ever? Alok's trifecta on 3 tailenders pales in comparison. Whats up with this sylheti invasion in our cricket (now jr.).
Shabash Sylhet!

Sham
October 14, 2003, 01:14 AM
There is one thing getting wickets in ODIs when batsmen are going for it and another to prize out Test batsmen of Vaughan, Trescothick and Thorpe's calibre. I just don't think that there is a place in the side for Mushfiq is Sujon is there as well. At six, we need a batsman who is going to score runs. And if we are confident enough with our batting order upto number 5, then perhaps the captain should promote himself to 6, take the greater responsibility, and create a place for a genuine bowler who will take wickets.

I hope Mushfiq proves me wrong if he plays, but I just don't see the thinking behind it.

tnb
October 14, 2003, 01:26 AM
Sylhet has good, established tradition of cricket. She always contributed in the national team. Unfortunately, Sylhet is always overlooked when it comes to improve facilities or stage international matches.

Is there any chance of playing both Rafique and Jr.? Both of them are lefty, even though style is different. Why are we not getting a good off spinner?

Tehsin
October 14, 2003, 01:30 AM
Eng declared for 69/1. Enamul bowled 9 ball to get 1 for 3. I think he may be worth it. Let's see how he does (they should play him) in the next pratice match.

rafiq
October 14, 2003, 01:33 AM
well there is logic.... and then there is reality. why stop at dropping tapash? why not rest mashrafee (maybe he needs rest so he can play against zimbabwe next year) as well, so shanto can play?

first they refuse to get rid of sujon. now they have brought back mushfiq babu from the dead. having one liability is enough, and whatmore in the past could have been excused as his selection powers can be debated and he had not seen too many of our players. now that he has seen more (like enamul jr or even a good batsman or two), surely he won't play mushfiq in the tests? sham is right - one day wicket taking is different.

if the wicket allows plenty of spin, alok, mashud, sujon should play 5,6,7, followed by rafique, tapash, masri, enamul. It is a weak batting tail for sure but until sujon goes we have to rob peter to pay paul.

why is mushfiq "all set". because some paper said so? even counting reasonable form coming out of the one day series in pakistan, he simply does not fit into bangladesh's test equation. I just can't believe some people (ie selectors) think he does, when there are so many other good players looking for a chance.

[Edited on 14-10-2003 by rafiq]

Tehsin
October 14, 2003, 01:41 AM
Rafiq bhai .... I have given up worrying about Shujon and Mushfiq playing TEST cricket. The less you think about it, is better. I could even live with one of them but both of them in the team is just a mockery. Again, forget it, no need to get all excited and lose sleep over these moronic (excuse my english) decisions.

Sham
October 14, 2003, 02:01 AM
Samir said Mushfiq looks set to play, not that he is all set. And I think he is quite justified in thinking that Mushfiq looks the most likely to bat at 6, especially after this match.

But like I said, I am dead against Mushfiq playing and so is Samir, so don't take his comment on Mushfiq's probably inclusion to mean that he is advocating Mushfiq's inclusion.

rafiq
October 14, 2003, 08:31 AM
btw I wasn't saying samir was advocating mushfiq, I know he was passing on news/perception in dhaka. I am just wondering where that news/perception comes from and why given there is NO performance to back it up. everytime someone scores more than 10 runs we have him in the team. what about aftab - he scored 45 didn't he?

Mahmood
October 14, 2003, 10:33 AM
Last time, in the practice match, Aftab scored a fifty+ against SA. He is a star in the making.

As for Mushfiq and Sujon, none should be in the team. They can either realize it now, or learn the hard way.

bhobishshot
October 14, 2003, 01:23 PM
I think Dav is looking ahead and looking for Sujan's replacement. He is looking for a pace all rounder. If sujan does not do very well he will be dropped out of the BD team for the Zim tour.

Sham
October 14, 2003, 02:26 PM
The reason Mushfiq looks set to play is because if he can bat at six and be one of the two new ball bowlers, then Bangladesh can have two spinners, whether they are Rafiq and Fahim or Rafiq and Jnr.

Personally, I'd have Aftab before Mushfiq anyday.

Zobair
October 14, 2003, 04:52 PM
anyways we still gotta see how our new legspinner Mosaddek (who went to India) performs against the poms...lets not forget him...its quite exciting to think that there are quite a few players amongst our junior ranks who can perform at the top level. That should keep our national cricketers honest and on their toes.

Zobair
October 14, 2003, 05:10 PM
We still need a few more class batsmen to fill our ranks... is it me or we seem to be lacking classy. technically-sound solid bats?!?!

pagol-chagol
October 15, 2003, 02:39 PM
If we can't get England out in the test, the selectors will be scrutinized to death for leaving Enamul Jr. out of the team.

On the other hand they have nothing to lose for putting him in. (Unless someone upstages him from BD A team).;)

[Edited on 16-10-2003 by pagol-chagol]

Mahmood
October 15, 2003, 03:22 PM
We should be very carefull about these future stars. Unless they are fully mature and ready, I do not suggest rushing them in to national squad. We do not want the Ash situation repeated again.

We should rather go the Rajin way. Mature them over age groups and A tours, then only they may move to National Team.

So, even though we know Enamul and Aftab is good, let us take it slow and stedy.

rafiq
October 15, 2003, 03:29 PM
good point on the slow and steady but we want to do well now - there's always that pressure.

good analysis by fahmida on the front page about the options.

I support playing a pure batsman or a pure spinner in that open slot rather than a player like mushfiq who will not leave his mark with bat or ball. It may be tempting to go the half-route and take an allrounder, but as we don't really have any let's at least take a good bowler or a good batsman. I don't think it matters how old they are.

Zobair
October 15, 2003, 07:32 PM
Judging by what I know of human nature and by what Australia seems to have successfully done, it is better if we hold on to our young talents until the time is just right which may be now or later. They need to be mature but more importantly build that hunger that we see in the Australian 20 something players once they get into the national team...that appreciation of what it means to play for the national team... with all its perks and positives. The case of Michael Clarke of Australia is a good example. He is definitely good enough to replace a some one on the national squad, yet the Aussies are waiting on him. Once he gets in of course, I just can't see him failing. Exception can be made for an exception...but it has to stay that...an exception!

pagol-chagol
October 15, 2003, 09:12 PM
An Australian talent gets top level nurturing whether he is in the national team or not. A Bangladeshi talent in the national team gets much better coaching and nurturing than our 2nd level player. Don't you think Enamul will learn more on the top level? Players with big heads like Ashraful don't do well with pampering. If Jr. has the intelligence and work ethic he could be ready. Its not numerical age - you know. Its whats up there.

[Edited on 16-10-2003 by pagol-chagol]

BangladeshCricket
October 15, 2003, 09:51 PM
so far we all gave options ...whether playing musfiq or sujon or both or may be aftab and others we should i guess have all of them ...then play them depending on the conditions of the match ....

1) suppose if the pitch has no advandance for the seamers it's no need to play two or three seamers.

2) If the pitch is spin friendly and turning then two specialist spinners should play.

3) If batting paradise then till number 6 there should be all specialist batsman. One spinner, one w/k, two pacers, may be a third seamer or spinner.

4) We also should produce all rounders who will can ball in need effectively and also bat when there is necessary to bat after even 6th position.

Let me know guyz what you think...thanks