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Rubu
September 19, 2007, 09:36 AM
I know we had several religion related thread here before that ended in heated discussions. Still, I could not help opening this one.

I read in yesterday's prothom alo that Cartoonist Ariful Rahman was arrested for a cartoon in prothom alo's Al-Pin. Prothom alo pulled back the issue of al pin and apologized for it. Obviously, I was interested in knowing what the cartoon was.

well, here it is:

http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/86/prothomalocartoonyn3.jpg

I was surprised to say the least. Are we heading toward religious intolerance? I cannot believe someone will get arrested for something as simple as this.

Nasif
September 19, 2007, 09:44 AM
Very sad and unfortunate if CG has arrested the cartoonist. It is the correct portrayal of our society's naming disorder. I applaud the cartoonist for portraying the message so nicely. We have reached to insane amount of "Mohammad" idolization while naming children, and, it needs to stop.

:up: for the cartoonist. Pure genius.

akabir77
September 19, 2007, 10:03 AM
to me its not that simple. First of all What i know and i might be wrong that every muslim boys name should start with Mohammad even if its not in your certificate. thats like given (if you r a muslim). And making fun about this shows poor test cause in a way it makes fun of the way of the Muslim which is kinda fashion now a days.

:down: to the cartoon

cricket_dorshok
September 19, 2007, 10:05 AM
Thank you Rubu for sharing the cartoons. I was searching this.
I am very much disappointed to see cartoonist got arrested.
Where are we heading?

cricket_dorshok
September 19, 2007, 10:08 AM
to me its not that simple. First of all What i know and i might be wrong that every muslim boys name should start with Mohammad even if its not in your certificate. thats like given (if you r a muslim). And making fun about this shows poor test cause in a way it makes fun of the way of the Muslim which is kinda fashion now a days.

:down: to the cartoon
AKabir bhai, I don't know much about religion. Could you please tell me/give me some source where I can get that the name of Muslim should be started with 'Mohammad'.

Nasif
September 19, 2007, 10:13 AM
to me its not that simple. First of all What i know and i might be wrong that every muslim boys name should start with Mohammad even if its not in your certificate. thats like given (if you r a muslim). And making fun about this shows poor test cause in a way it makes fun of the way of the Muslim which is kinda fashion now a days.

:down: to the cartoon

Naming your son "Mohammad" has nothing to with being Muslim. As a matter of fact, naming itself has nothing to with Islam or Muslim. There is no such thing as "Islamic" name. No matter how much we force this dogma, it is still a made up rule. Someone can be as good a Muslim with a name such as Leo Tolstoy, Wokabi (African) or any other name.

Kabir
September 19, 2007, 10:21 AM
Most North Americans will know Imam Patel.

Any idea why his name is Patel? Apparently, that is not an Arabic name, and many people say that it's not a "Muslim" name either. So to add on to Nasif bhai's thoughts, this is another problematic and unrelated thing that many Muslims will die over.

If you don't know about Imam Patel, do a quick search about him. I had the pleasure of praying in an Eid Jamat with him...although that was quite a funny incident.

reverse_swing
September 19, 2007, 10:24 AM
Well said Nasif. But you need to keep in mind that people of Bangladesh don’t possess the same degree of sense of sensitivities. They still have a knee-jerk emotional response to such slights against their religion and seem to have no problem expressing such bigotry.

akabir77
September 19, 2007, 10:25 AM
Naming your son "Mohammad" has nothing to with being Muslim. As a matter of fact, naming itself has nothing to with Islam or Muslim. There is no such thing as "Islamic" name. No matter how much we force this dogma, it is still a made up rule. Someone can be as good a Muslim with a name such as Leo Tolstoy, Wokabi (African) or any other name.


Like i said i have very little knowledge about this but what i have heard specaly after my daughter was born from the arab frineds (african and middle east) that THIS iS not a made up rule. Its kinda sunna. Sons name has to have father and grandfather and so on names on their name ( that's why u will find most arab and african people got big names). And it has to have a meaning. putting two arab words doesn't make it meaning full. I wish i could give you the source but i don't have the links that i was given 2 years back... but i am sure if you research you will find a lot of them some genuine some not so...

akabir77
September 19, 2007, 10:27 AM
converting into islam and new born baby name has to be a different thing ...

Anyway i shouldn't talk about something that i have very little knowledge...

Fazal
September 19, 2007, 10:35 AM
How pathetic.... people have to go to jail because someone thought its a bad joke or Cartoon?

I knew its comming.... more to come .... I hope i am wrong though.

Miraz
September 19, 2007, 10:46 AM
It's not a cartoon of a very good taste especially in a country like Bangladesh. majority people don't bear the same level of sensitiveness like most of the BC members who are educated and conscious.

Everyone should understand the level of passion muslims bear in mind about Prophet (SW) and making fun where there can be slightest correlation with Prophet (SW)'s image will invoke serious repercussions. This type of cartoon should be avoided to maintain religious harmony.

Now I want to see it from two different perspectives .. (this is what I have seen in heated discussions in other forums, definitely there are more extreme views)

1. Cartoonist Guilty

The cartoonist could have conveyed the same message using different wordings where the possibility of hurting muslim sentiment could have easily been avoided.

Firstly there is no such custom or rule that a muslim name should be started with Muhammad and making it a subject of a cartoon isn't a well thought approach.

Secondly the cartoonist wanted to use the name "Muhammad" as from a rational point of view, there was no need to ask what's the boy is carrying? (when a cat should be clearly visible). if it was a covered box and the question was asked that would have been a different proposition.

2. Cartoonist not-guilty
He simply wanted to show some exchange of words that might be common in villages and wanted to make fun out of it.

He was not aware that " the use of name "Muhammad" might hurt muslims feelings.


Now if the second was is true, I have to say the cartoonist is quite a dumb person and should exercise more caution especially in Ramadan month. But definitely he should not be arrested or harassed, he should simply apologize for hurting the muslim feelings.

If the cartoonist had any inner ill-intention (only Allah knows), may Allah give gim hidayah.

BD-Shardul
September 19, 2007, 11:09 AM
Usual Knee-Jerk Reaction of BD-Shardul:

Actually there is no hadeeth or any source in Islam that says that a muslim name should start with 'Mohammad'. If there were, then of course the name of the companions of our holy prophet Mohammad Sallallahu Alaihi Wa Sallam would had started with 'Mohammad'.

Starting a name with Mohammad is pretty much an Indian subcontinental tradition, but I do not see any problem with that. Most of the people actually do it because of their love and respect towards the holy prophet.

Now coming to the issue, it seems to me that his work is simply making ridicle about starting a name with Mohammad. If I have wrongly interpreted the intention of the cartoonist, then can anyone of you tell me what could be the purpose of drawing such a cartoon? Refuting superstition? No way. It is true that there are many superstitions among the village people of Bangladesh about their religion, but never have I heard even a village mollah saying like "a name should start with Mohammad". My grand father's (dada) name was (late) Osman Gani, my nana's name was (late) Shamsul Islam. None of their names started with Mohammad.

Also the cartoon seemed to me a carbon copy of the following joke:

Teacher: What's your name?
Student: Omar
Teacher: How dare you are? You didn't address me with "sir". You should be polite when you talk with your teacher.

Student: OK. My name is SIR Omar.

To the people who who deamand arrest:

Guys whats the point of this arrest? Allah, the all knowing, knows best about the intention of the cartoontist, and will reward him accordingly in the hereafter. We now live in an era where holding onto imaan is like holding a piece of burning coal in hand.


To Nasif Bhai,

Yes, I agree that there is no such thing as 'Islamic' name. But still our prophet has encouraged the Muslims to choose Arabic names. Because, on the day of resurrection, we will be called upon to Allah SWT by our names. So, one can easily understand the importance of having a good name.

akabir77
September 19, 2007, 11:31 AM
BD-Shadrul Thanks for the info. I think one about the indian-sub thing is not totally right. Cause you will find most indian-sub people don't have Muhammad's name in their name like mine. but most arab people including african muslim follow this very strictly and when i was talking about naming my daughter they told me the stuff like at least your fathers name should be in the name ...

reverse_swing
September 19, 2007, 11:50 AM
We now live in an era where holding onto imaan is like holding a piece of burning coal in hand.


Not sure what you wanted to say but it depends on belief system. It is the xenophobic interpretation of the faith that some misguided Muslims choose to follow that is incompatible with modern society or really any form of civilization.These muslims make Islam as regional and middle aged religion. Islam does not oppose modernity at all. Islam is for all times.Islam is not opposed to any kinda scientific research,space travels,internet or any kinda electronic gadgets.It is unfortunate that this xenophobic sect seems to be more successful at communicating their message than the silent majority. It is the interpretation and implementation of a narrow set of individuals that serve the purpose of power that pervert the enlightenment of true Islam and portray this as medieval religion.

Rubu
September 19, 2007, 12:15 PM
Though, understandable, I'm disappointed with Prothom Alo's handling of the case. They did not stood by their staff at all, and declared that it was printed without the approval of the editor and the cartoon was a rejected one.

Sounded to me like they are will to say or do anything to save their *back*.

Sauron
September 19, 2007, 12:20 PM
I loved the cartoon. It pokes fun at the same kind of zealotry and ritualistic religiousness that is on offer here from some menbers in this thread.

The cartoonist is smart ... waaay too smart for most people, obviously.

If you are so thick that the humor and sarcasm of this cartoon doesn't get to you, then I have a question for you -
What do you think about all the thieves, criminals, rapists that share that same first name? Would you say that this cartoonist is more offending than them? So offending that while the criminals roam free and this cartoonist had to be arrested?

Grow up people. Or rather, grow brains people.

Sauron
September 19, 2007, 12:43 PM
It's not a cartoon of a very good taste especially in a country like Bangladesh. majority people don't bear the same level of sensitiveness like most of the BC members who are educated and conscious.


I'll modify your sentence like this - It's a cartoon of a very brave nature especially in a country like Bangladesh. where majority people do not have the coherence to not go after the proverbial "Cheel" that snatched away the "Kaan" and that includes some of the BC members who are educated and conscious.


This type of cartoon should be avoided to maintain religious harmony.


This coming from someone with university education?? Tsk Tsk.

The very reason why Muhammad's (PBUH) picture do not appear anywhere is that Islam strongly condemns any idolatry. Names, pictures, words or objects do not inherently carry any sacredness.

The cartoon in question very smartly portrays how young minds are molded in our very constrictive society. I am not talking about the few Gulshanites and Banani-ians. From a very tender age the kids are taught not to question anything and obey blindly what that bearded Mullah says. When in reality that bearded Mullah is probably the most ill-educated person around.

The cartoon just shows you the effect of following the Mullah blindly. And this will affect religious harmony?? Man! What a comment.


.

Nasif
September 19, 2007, 12:45 PM
To Nasif Bhai,

Yes, I agree that there is no such thing as 'Islamic' name. But still our prophet has encouraged the Muslims to choose Arabic names. Because, on the day of resurrection, we will be called upon to Allah SWT by our names. So, one can easily understand the importance of having a good name.

I have no problem with giving a good name. But I do have a problem if people tell me that only Arabic words can be considered as good names. Not all Arabic words are good and beautiful for name.

Good and beautiful can be very subjective at times. We can generally agree that some words don't work well for names; for example I don't think any parent would want to name their kid a Camel or Livestock (in Bangla or English). But surprisingly many parents do name their kids Camel and Livestock/Cattle in Arabic; Jamal and Anam respectively. I do not mean any disrespect to anyone who has those name. I am just trying to point out the obvious; the blind love for anything Arabic.

Arabic is just a language, and as such it consist of good and bad words. Blindly thinking anything Arabic or having Mohammad is good for my child's name is just that, "blind belief".

Unfortunately, us Muslims as a community, we encourage the blind belief; instead of knowledge and wisdom. We have forgotten the very first commandment of God, "Read."

Zobair
September 19, 2007, 12:55 PM
The cartoonist is sadly ahead of his time for a country like Bangladesh. Though I find it hard to believe our general populace would have reacted too harshly. He shouldn't be incarcerated for this...that would be a real shame.

sadi
September 19, 2007, 01:13 PM
Getting arrested for a cartoon? It's a joke. We should be better than that.

BD-Shardul
September 19, 2007, 01:13 PM
Originally posted by reverse_swing

Not sure what you wanted to say but it depends on belief system. It is the xenophobic interpretation of the faith that some misguided Muslims choose to follow that is incompatible with modern society or really any form of civilization.These muslims make Islam as regional and middle aged religion. Islam does not oppose modernity at all. Islam is for all times.Islam is not opposed to any kinda scientific research,space travels,internet or any kinda electronic gadgets.It is unfortunate that this xenophobic sect seems to be more successful at communicating their message than the silent majority. It is the interpretation and implementation of a narrow set of individuals that serve the purpose of power that pervert the enlightenment of true Islam and portray this as medieval religion.

Dear RS Bhai,

Let me clarify. I never believed that Islam is a back-dated religion. Rather, I always believed that Islam is the most modern way of life. The phrase 'Holding onto imaan is like holding on to a burning coal' came from one of the Haadiths of our Holy Prophet Muhammad (SM). He said, "There will be an era arrive, when holding onto imaan will be like holding a burning coal in hand". I do not have the linguistic skill to clarify the meaning of that phrase in English. So, I am quoting the follwing clarification(This clarification is written by an unknown muslim brother):

Source: http://www.imanway.com/en/showthread.php?t=324

Holding onto a Burning Coal

Day by day, year by year, as we hurtle closer to the Final Day - Yawmul-Qiyamah, the conditions in the world continue to deteriorate, as per the predictions of Sayyidina Rasulullah (sallallahu alayhi wasallam). Fitnahs are increasing at a frightening rate, evil is proliferating swiftly and dark, ominous clouds are enveloping the horizons. In such times, holding onto one's Imaan will become a tough ordeal - the equivalent of holding onto a burning coal - as it is described in the Hadith. The analogy of the burning coal appropriately captures the agony of the people of Imaan. The coal cannot be dropped for that would mean the forsaking of Imaan, yet holding onto it is no easy task, for it requires the maximum in patience, sacrifice and perseverance, just to hold on. May Allah make it easy for all Believers.

THICK VEIL OF SUSPICION

Besides the general fitnahs of immorality and vice that prevail, a thick veil of suspicion has been cast around Islam as an evil, extreme and destructive ideology. The sincere followers and servants of Islam, committed and faithful Muslims, are portrayed as the scourge of humanity. All kinds of disparaging epithets and labels are hurled at them. In many parts of the world, it goes far beyond labelling and calling names. They are considered fair game. Every means is considered legitimate against them. The all-pervading media is used as a dangerous tool against them. Every provocative headline, every damaging media report, serves to stoke up and fuel the raging inferno of Islamophobia. And the global Muslim community inevitably is the universal victim of this craze.

THE MAKKAN PERIOD

What is to be done in these trying times? The early history of Muslims at Makkah is a source of great consolation and inspiration for persecuted Muslims. The early Muslim community, living in the Makkan crucible, was relentlessly persecuted. But this only hardened their resolve to cling more firmly to their new found ideology - Islam - which was an unparalleled blessing after the miserable and dark days of Jahiliyyah. Nothing in the world was dearer to them than the blessing of this new faith, not even their own lives. The contemporary Muslim community has valuable lessons to learn from them in these difficult days. The guiding principle for the Makkan Muslims was Sabr at every step of the torment, for “Verily Allah is close to the patient ones.” These are the times that call for patience and steadfastness. Allah Ta'ala shall bring relief in due course, as He had done for the Believers of Makkah, and other persecuted folk.

As was the charter of the Makkan believers, Muslims must work towards developing their personalities and morals, thereby acting as true ambassadors of noble Islamic values. Beautiful Islamic conduct and character must be displayed towards all of mankind.

THE WAY AHEAD

In the difficult days that prevail, the way ahead lies in turning to Allah Ta'ala for help and succour, through obedience, submission and resignation to His will. Allah never disappoints those who have hope in Him, never refuses those who ask of Him, never ignores those who quest for Him, never underpays those who work for Him, never deprives those who thank Him, never fails those who strive for Him, never allows those whose comfort is in His remembrance to be estranged from Him, never surrenders to others those who surrender to Him, never abandons those who depend on Him, and never forsakes those who trust and commit themselves to Him.

This is a time for increasing in righteous A'amaal and returning to basic Islamic teachings, because A'amaal alone shall determine our present and future destiny. Conditions are created by Allah Ta'ala, based on A'amaal. Part of the process is to shun all evil deeds, and to kick aside a corrupt lifestyle. Some of the powerful A'amaal that have always brought excellent results are Salaah, Dua, Sadaqah (charity), abundant Istighfaar and Salawaat (Durood).

Now is the time for transforming the home into a spiritual powerhouse, through: Tarbiyyah, inculcation of piety and values; Ta'leem, learning and teaching; Zikrullah; Islamic Aadaab, etiquette and Sunnah practices; and Ibaadah, by all members in the household.

May Allah be our Helper and the Protector of our greatest wealth - our priceless Imaan!

cricket_dorshok
September 19, 2007, 01:18 PM
Getting arrested for a cartoon? It's a joke. We should be better than that.
look at the report

Cartoonist lands in jail, with no defence
Prothom Alo's freelance cartoonist Arifur Rahman was sent to jail Wednesday without any legal defence provided in court.The cartoonist is likely to face one-month's detention in jail initially, as there is a pending appeal by the prosecution. Arif was arrested on charges of offending religious sensibilities with a satirical cartoon strip.

Autocrats tried to muffle media, says Press Council chair
Press Council chairman Justice Abu Sayeed Ahmad Wednesday said every autocratic government had tried to silence the media. "The media enjoyed greater freedom in a democratic government," he said at a seminar organised to mark the third founding anniversary of Bangla-language daily Amar Desh at the National Press Club. But the chief of the media watchdog called for caution in handling sensitive issues and asked editors to "act responsibly". On a controversial cartoon published in a satire magazine of Prothom Alo, Sayeed said: "Prothom Alo didn't do the right thing by publishing it."

cricket_pagol
September 19, 2007, 02:20 PM
I think CG's reaction was very knee jerk, they just wanted to avoid any controversy or street protests regarding this incident. I feel sorry for the cartoonist.

BTW, this cartoon is not that original. I remember a similar joke was used in the movie Matir Moyna. Another blogger posted an example of a similar joke used in a kids magazine run by Shibir (Source (http://www.somewhereinblog.net/blog/sujonmcblog/28732243) - open with IE). The media needs to play it's role in highlighting these inconsistencies.

shaoun
September 19, 2007, 02:23 PM
i read about the courtoon. i thought it was pictures of our prophet (s.a). but now that i see it here i am really surprised that someone can get arrested for this. and i cant believe the newspaper didnt stand by their employee. because at first i was upset thinking he drew pic of our prophet (s.a). but now i dont see any reason why he should have been arrested.

Fazal
September 19, 2007, 02:28 PM
and i cant believe the newspaper didnt stand by their employee.

Nigey Bachley Baper Nam.... you wants to go to Jail?

Miraz
September 19, 2007, 02:46 PM
I'll modify your sentence like this - It's a cartoon of a very brave nature especially in a country like Bangladesh. where majority people do not have the coherence to not go after the proverbial "Cheel" that snatched away the "Kaan" and that includes some of the BC members who are educated and conscious.



This coming from someone with university education?? Tsk Tsk.

--

The cartoon just shows you the effect of following the Mullah blindly. And this will affect religious harmony?? Man! What a comment.


.

Sauron, I knew it coming from you. You are an expert in twisting comment and taking it out of context.

What I have said should be taken into the proper context. Quoting one sentence leaving others out doesn't make sense.

Everyone should understand the level of passion muslims bear in mind about Prophet (SW) and making fun where there can be slightest correlation with Prophet (SW)'s image will invoke serious repercussions. This type of cartoon should be avoided to maintain religious harmony.

Mass people are sensitive to religion and we should respect that.

Publishing this type of cartoon which can be interpreted in many ways does not help in maintaining the harmony. I have no problem with the cartoon, but the response in Bangladesh can be well predicted. I just don't want to supply fuel to anything that creates unnecessary anarchy, we cannot simply afford that in current Bangladesh.

Going by logic isn't always the supreme solution of everything. Understanding the mind of mass population is sometimes more required than logic.

Anyway, I don't want to go into any religious debate here, I was concerned about the current state of Bangladesh and situations like this does not help at all.

Beamer
September 19, 2007, 03:14 PM
I loved the cartoon. It pokes fun at the same kind of zealotry and ritualistic religiousness that is on offer here from some menbers in this thread.

The cartoonist is smart ... waaay too smart for most people, obviously.

If you are so thick that the humor and sarcasm of this cartoon doesn't get to you, then I have a question for you -
What do you think about all the thieves, criminals, rapists that share that same first name? Would you say that this cartoonist is more offending than them? So offending that while the criminals roam free and this cartoonist had to be arrested?

Grow up people. Or rather, grow brains people.

Indeed. People should be more offended by the likes of Hussein Muhammad Ershad. I think the cartoon is simple but brilliant in conveying its purported message. Its sad but ironic that the likes of Amini and khatib of Baitul Mukarram are leading the parade denouncing the messenger and the newspaper. How expected of them. These half educated religious merchants are cuddled in our society as in many muslim countries. Absolute knee jerk reaction by CG. There was zero public reaction. No vandalizing or that sort of stuff..

Hatebreed
September 19, 2007, 03:28 PM
As far as I know, there is no rule in Islam that you have to have Muhammad in your name, so the guy depicted in the cartoon is wrong in imposing that belief. It exposes the kind of the ill-educated religious zealots that represent Islam in an incorrect manner. At least I hope that’s what the cartoonist intended. The reaction by CTG is harsh and disappointing.

Omio
September 19, 2007, 03:31 PM
My question-
How come sahabi Abu Huruiya involve this issue according to amader desh.

http://amardeshbd.com/detail_news_index.php?NewsID=133561&NewsType=bistarito&SectionID=home

Miraz
September 19, 2007, 03:35 PM
My question-
How come sahabi Abu Huruiya involve this issue according to amader desh.

http://amardeshbd.com/detail_news_index.php?NewsID=133561&NewsType=bistarito&SectionID=home


This is exactly what I am afraid of.

I am sure some people will blow the situation out of proportion and that will ultimately harm the image of Bangladesh as a moderate muslim country.

Exercising some caution always helps in avoiding similar situations.

Rubu
September 19, 2007, 03:56 PM
My question-
How come sahabi Abu Huruiya involve this issue according to amader desh.

http://amardeshbd.com/detail_news_index.php?NewsID=133561&NewsType=bistarito&SectionID=home

I think Abu Huruiya had a title 'Father of Cat' because of his love for cat.

However, prothom alo has been a target of Rajakars (Read Jamaat Shibir) for years. I remember going to a Sirajganj Mosque once where in Friday prayer the imam called prothom alo 'prothom andhokar' and asked everyone to tear it apart anytime they see an issue. They just an issue to go behind this newspaper.

Many people did not like al pin for a long time because of his nature of poking fun of people (well deserved pokes, i must add).

those bastard rajakers need to be unrooted as soon as possible to maintain a secular Bangladesh.

Miraz
September 19, 2007, 04:23 PM
I think Abu Huruiya had a title 'Father of Cat' because of his love for cat.

However, prothom alo has been a target of Rajakars (Read Jamaat Shibir) for years. I remember going to a Sirajganj Mosque once where in Friday prayer the imam called prothom alo 'prothom andhokar' and asked everyone to tear it apart anytime they see an issue. They just an issue to go behind this newspaper.

Many people did not like al pin for a long time because of his nature of poking fun of people (well deserved pokes, i must add).

those bastard rajakers need to be unrooted as soon as possible to maintain a secular Bangladesh.

Abu Huraira in arabic means "Father of Cat".

However, I cannot separate Prothom Alo and those people who are trying blow the situation out of proportion. [বাংলা]দুই দলই সুবিধাবাদী [/বাংলা]

Prothom Alo should have clarified the cartoon and took stand behind the cartoonist. An apology should have followed the clarification for hurting religious sentiment. Now passing all the responsibility to the cartoonist is simply unacceptable.

Rubu
September 19, 2007, 04:26 PM
Abu Huraira in arabic means "Father of Cat".
Prothom Alo should have clarified the cartoon and took stand behind the cartoonist. An apology should have followed the clarification for hurting religious sentiment. Now passing all the responsibility to the cartoonist is simply unacceptable.Yeah, of course. As I said in a previous post, I'm very disappointed with prothom alo's handling of the situation.

Omio
September 19, 2007, 04:31 PM
Yeah, of course. As I said in a previous post, I'm very disappointed with prothom alo's handling of the situation.
Me too,
They didnt take any responsibility, they blamed Arif.

reverse_swing
September 19, 2007, 04:47 PM
that will ultimately harm the image of Bangladesh as a moderate muslim country.
No comments.You know the real truth about this popular myth. Take this thread as an example.To be candid with you not a single newspaper in BD will dare to publish some of the comments posted by our members here.

[quote=Miraz;549786]

Prothom Alo should have clarified the cartoon and took stand behind the cartoonist./quote]

Agreed but I can't blame them either. This was the only option they had. These bigots are importuning that the government should shut down the newspaper by Friday and have menaced the government with dire consequences in case of failure.

Miraz
September 19, 2007, 04:51 PM
Well, I can't blame them. This is the only option they had. These bigots are importuning that the government should shut down the newspaper by Friday and have menaced the government with dire consequences in case of failure.

In that case they shouldn't have published the cartoon in the first place. If they can't take responsibility of their own action, they do not deserve any sympathy.

Making the cartoonist "scapegoat" is nothing less that bigotry.

Miraz
September 19, 2007, 04:59 PM
No comments.You know the real truth about this popular myth. Take this thread as an example.To be candid with you not a single newspaper in BD will dare to publish some of the comments posted by our members here.

I don't agree that it's a myth. Our society is moderate but have extremist elements who do not represent the main ideology of the society.

Situations like this only strengthen those extremists elements and portray a moderate society as radical.

It's much wiser not to supply fuel to those extremist element of the society which will make their job difficult to establish themselves.

Sauron
September 19, 2007, 05:17 PM
Trying to pacify extremists is equivalent to encouraging them.

In the past, all Govt.s tried to pacify these zealots because they did not have the moral courage. Also they did not want to be painted as "anti-islamic" for the fear of losing popular vote.

Our middle-class is no good - they want all the benefits but would not dare ruffle any feathers. Examples of that are evident. If we had a strong leader who could face this head-on, our country would benefit tremendously.

I kind of expected a braver stance from army-backed CTG. I am not suggesting that they create a confrontation. But they should have dealt with this with a little more back-bone, sort of like the DU incident where they identified and prosecuted the genuinely responsible people.

About prothom alo, I am not surprised. I echo what r/swing said.

reverse_swing
September 19, 2007, 05:24 PM
This is from BDNews24:

Prothom Alo's freelance cartoonist Arifur Rahman was sent to jail with a pending proposal for one-month detention, a day after he was arrested on charges of hurting religious sensibilities with a cartoon story.

Metropolitan magistrate Abdul Fattah issued the order sending him to Dhaka Central Jail, after sub inspector Ali Noor presented the case to court.

No lawyer was seen defending him in court.

Omio
September 19, 2007, 05:25 PM
vaggis bangla vai er a az nai, thakle ki hoto?

Sauron
September 19, 2007, 05:27 PM
Sauron, I knew it coming from you. You are an expert in twisting comment and taking it out of context.

What I have said should be taken into the proper context. Quoting one sentence leaving others out doesn't make sense.


Miraz, please stop making comments about the poster and stick to the post. You are alleging me of being "an expert in twisting comment and taking it out of context". That is not a nice thing to say about someone.

Again, here is what you said (note that I am putting the whole paragraph here, not just one sentence) -


Everyone should understand the level of passion muslims bear in mind about Prophet (SW) and making fun where there can be slightest correlation with Prophet (SW)'s image will invoke serious repercussions. This type of cartoon should be avoided to maintain religious harmony.


I do not see the slightest correlation with the Prophet's image in the cartoon. I don't know where you see it.

What you are suggesting is that everyone better conform (or pretend to conform), or else there will be serious repercussions. Reminds me of another infamous saying - "Either you are with us, or you are against us".

If educated people think this way, I don't know of what value is a good education.


.

tonoy
September 19, 2007, 05:27 PM
I know one thing for sure. Im not going to draw cartoons that will enrage more than 1 person.

Miraz
September 19, 2007, 05:38 PM
Miraz, please stop making comments about the poster and stick to the post.

And the comment is coming from Sauron?

Really made my day. :)

Take a mild taste of your own medicine. :)


I do not see the slightest correlation with the Prophet's image in the cartoon. I don't know where you see it.

What you are suggesting is that everyone better conform (or pretend to conform), or else there will be serious repercussions. Reminds me of another infamous saying - "Either you are with us, or you are against us".

If educated people think this way, I don't know of what value is a good education.
.

Well if you can't find correlation, I don't know whether I can make you understand. Anyway to help you, I haven't used the word image in the meaning of "picture" or "visual representation".

Conform to what? I am really sorry because I am not understanding the words you are putting in my mouth.

Care to explain?

tonoy
September 19, 2007, 05:55 PM
fight fight fight. Man I love being a Bangladeshi.

reverse_swing
September 19, 2007, 06:03 PM
No lawyer was seen defending him in court.

This just shows how moderate we are. Our middle class don't have enough moral intrepidity to determine the right from good. BC e bose jotoi lafalafi kori na keno I know you know the candor of braggadocio.

Rubu
September 19, 2007, 06:06 PM
It does not matter what or how the majority thinks, all it really matters is what the active interest group thinks. The keyword here is active. I think above 95% of Bangladeshi are moderate, but the rest 5% are active. And that is what we are seeing here.

RS Bhai, we can do at least something. We can email info@prothom-alo.com and tell them how we feel and what we think should have been done.

Better yet, just send a link to this thread.

Sauron
September 19, 2007, 06:08 PM
And the comment is coming from Sauron?

Really made my day. :)

Take a mild taste of your own medicine. :)

Glad to have made your day.

If I was you, I would have opened a separate thread complaining to all the members that this other seasoned member said something about me and I need to know if everyone agrees with him, because in that case I would resign from my post of BC editor. Unfortunately, I do not have a post to resign from, so I'll save it for later.




Well if you can't find correlation, I don't know whether I can make you understand. Anyway to help you, I haven't used the word image in the meaning of "picture" or "visual representation".

Conform to what? I am really sorry because I am not understanding the words you are putting in my mouth.

Care to explain?

Again, you are the one that mentioned a correlation between Mohammad's (PBUH) image and the cartoon. I understand that you did not really refer to a picture or likeness when you used the word image. But still you will need to explain the correlation.

You are asking me to prove a negative. How can I prove that the correlation does not exist if I do not find the correlation? You have stated plainly that you see a correlation. The burden of proof is on you.

If this logic is giving you a headache, then don't bother responding. If you do not understand my english and want to ask for more clarification or explanation, then don't bother responding. But if you actually understood why the burden of proving the correlation is on you, please elucidate.

Miraz
September 19, 2007, 06:19 PM
What you are suggesting is that everyone better conform (or pretend to conform), or else there will be serious repercussions. Reminds me of another infamous saying - "Either you are with us, or you are against us".

I requested a clarification of this comment. As you are claiming that I am suggesting these words.

Probably you haven't understood my poor English.

Conform to what? I am really sorry because I am not understanding the words you are putting in my mouth.

Again, you are the one that mentioned a correlation between Mohammad's (PBUH) image and the cartoon. I understand that you did not really refer to a picture or likeness when you used the word image. But still you will need to explain the correlation.

Anyway, Here's my clarification which was posted earlier in this thread.
Publishing this type of cartoon which can be interpreted in many ways does not help in maintaining the harmony. I have no problem with the cartoon, but the response in Bangladesh can be well predicted. I just don't want to supply fuel to anything that creates unnecessary anarchy, we cannot simply afford that in current Bangladesh.

If you read Bangladeshi newspapers you should know by now about the different interpretation of the cartoon by the extremists.

Sauron
September 19, 2007, 06:25 PM
For the sake of sticking to the topic, I give up. You win. Happy?

Miraz
September 19, 2007, 06:29 PM
If I was you, I would have opened a separate thread complaining to all the members that this other seasoned member said something about me and I need to know if everyone agrees with him, because in that case I would resign from my post of BC editor. Unfortunately, I do not have a post to resign from, so I'll save it for later.
Thanks for reminding the passion induced immaturity. I like you as you can really make my life difficult. :)

For the sake of sticking to the topic, I give up. You win. Happy?

C'mon man!! Nothing to win here.

Have a good day/night.

Will be looking forward for future debates. :D

Omio
September 19, 2007, 06:39 PM
For the sake of sticking to the topic, I give up. You win. Happy?
misti koi,:-p

Hatebreed
September 19, 2007, 07:03 PM
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/7997/0000000114hn4.jpg

Beamer
September 19, 2007, 08:41 PM
If anything, the cartoon was a dig at the mollahs and not against Islam or the Prophet. Is it stereotyping the mollahs in BD? Probably. But, the majority of mollahs act and thing like that. Just see how it perturbed the gang of Amini and co..

Sauron
September 19, 2007, 08:54 PM
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/7997/0000000114hn4.jpg
:lol::lol::lol::lol:

Thanks for making me the one on left ... loved Napoleon Dynamite ... cracks me up just seeing the pic.

Kabir
September 19, 2007, 10:38 PM
"Shuno nobin musolmano...bhalo koira ganja taano
hashorer din shob e paiba ganja paiba naaa
dui kaandhe dui fereshta...loiya boise ganjar bosta
tara shob nijei khaibo, tomgore dibo na..."

Ashen bhai...amra shobai ganja taani...naile eto au fau debate e moja nai...

ialbd
September 19, 2007, 11:30 PM
this is it !!! i expected sth more serious given that the guy got arrested and there are protests going on by various Islamic groups.

I think I have seen similar cartoons/jokes on paper before, so was really surprised to see sth this petty making such an impact. Maybe because its Ramadan and the editors/cartoonist should have been more careful.

Allah knows the best...

BD-Shardul
September 19, 2007, 11:47 PM
Abu Huraira in arabic means "Father of Cat".

Prothom Alo should have clarified the cartoon and took stand behind the cartoonist.

Clarifying? Its like a joke. They couldn't do that, because the cartoonist had an evil purpose.

The world is divided into two groups: Hizbullas (the group of Allah) and Hizbuttagut (the group of Sataan). People themselves decide which groups they want to join.

ammark
September 20, 2007, 12:16 AM
There can be no justifying the arrest. It just shows how stuck up the powers that be (and the ones defending them) always are and silence any form of parody or criticism. Any depictions of the folly of the newly invigorated muslims who want to be everything islamic in name and appearance (but who probably wont make the effort to stop an argument and gali-galaj between two people in roja-romjaner din) will get you in jail these days!

p.s: On the thread about secularism, and in the context of BD, I would love to know how we can continue to label ourselves as progressing to be a secular country anymore? The reaction to this cartoon shows how religious and close minded our countrymen and authorities are.

Its a significant development that I can watch any one of four Islam-oriented tv channels (one with Bangla translations and programming) in Bangladesh now.... the concept of Bible-belt like televangelising in Bangladesh was totally alien to me until I came back. But credit where credit due.... Islamic preachers arent exactly as hardcore as Pat Robertson.. it still makes pleasant enough viewing. The Qur'an qi'raat is still very awful, and radio foorti plays the the best form during sehri time

nobody
September 20, 2007, 01:55 AM
I even did not notice the cartoon in Alpin before Prthom Alo apologise.I found the cartoon as innocent joke. like one of my nephew who always pronounce ek chollish, dui cholis, tin chollish and so on.
What is wrong with us? Amini and gang are saying the cartoon lowered image of Muhammad (PBUH) but can the answer how killing innocent people highered up Rasullah.

GuruTM
September 20, 2007, 02:51 AM
I have very limited time. But still i will have my 2 cents.

Religion can sometimes be regarded as soft targets for quick fun. What bothers me here is the cartoonist did this during the month of Ramadan. Is it mere coincedence or lack of respect towards the religion of the majority? I would get offended absolutely at anything i love, do, like to do, believe, like to believe, think, like to think, any rituals, any religions that i practise, like to practise no matter how stupid it is; if someone makes fun of it. The person who is making fun of what i love, do, like to do, believe, like to believe, think, like to think, any rituals, any religions that i practise, like to practise; is making fun of me, not the things i love, do, like to do, believe, like to believe, think, like to think, any rituals, any religions that i practise, like to practise.

Fun, most of the times; very closely related to disrespect.

BD-Shardul
September 20, 2007, 03:12 AM
I have very limited time. But still i will have my 2 cents.

Religion can sometimes be regarded as soft targets for quick fun. What bothers me here is the cartoonist did this during the month of Ramadan. Is it mere coincedence or lack of respect towards the religion of the majority? I would get offended absolutely at anything i love, do, like to do, believe, like to believe, think, like to think, any rituals, any religions that i practise, like to practise no matter how stupid it is; if someone makes fun of it. The person who is making fun of what i love, do, like to do, believe, like to believe, think, like to think, any rituals, any religions that i practise, like to practise; is making fun of me, not the things i love, do, like to do, believe, like to believe, think, like to think, any rituals, any religions that i practise, like to practise.

Fun, most of the times; very closely related to disrespect.

Wisely put

nsd3
September 20, 2007, 05:19 AM
This could be a soft start to do even more dangerous attacks to religious culture. If this can't be managed at the beginning things might get worse in the name of Cultural Evolultion. The respect may become a forgotten phenomenon if not guarded effectively in course of time.

Naming the cat with our Prophet's (PBUH) name was the issue related to the cartoon. Although this was apparently done for the sake of making humour, however, if we can't lay down the limitation or guard against what to make fun of or not, we will lose respect for ourselves - coming generation will do something more serious and still general people will debate saying it's freedom of speech...what's wrong with it....bla bla bla.

Some people said it was a coordinated conspiracy. I dont know if it's true but be it true or not true, it's better to guard ourselves from making fun of something/somoeone respectful. Therefore, the cartoon should have been censored thinking deep into the reasons stated above. This is just an opinion.

Banglatiger84
September 20, 2007, 05:24 AM
Like i said i have very little knowledge about this but what i have heard specaly after my daughter was born from the arab frineds (african and middle east) that THIS iS not a made up rule. Its kinda sunna. Sons name has to have father and grandfather and so on names on their name ( that's why u will find most arab and african people got big names). And it has to have a meaning. putting two arab words doesn't make it meaning full. I wish i could give you the source but i don't have the links that i was given 2 years back... but i am sure if you research you will find a lot of them some genuine some not so...


Dude, its not Sunnah, ask any Alim (Scholar) about this. It is not necessary that every child has to have Mohammed in his name.

Banglatiger84
September 20, 2007, 05:27 AM
But still our prophet has encouraged the Muslims to choose Arabic names. Because, on the day of resurrection, we will be called upon to Allah SWT by our names. So, one can easily understand the importance of having a good name.

1) Dont quote the Prophet on something he did not say.

2) There is a difference between Arabic and good name. Arabic names are kept by Arabs (including Jewish and Christian Arabs) .

Prophet (saws) has encouraged us to keep good names, not Arabic names

Sohel
September 20, 2007, 05:32 AM
... Guys whats the point of this arrest? Allah, the all knowing, knows best about the intention of the cartoontist, and will reward him accordingly in the hereafter. We now live in an era where holding onto imaan is like holding a piece of burning coal in hand.

Spot on.

That's why I oppose all forms of censorship unless it disturbs the public peace, and violates a community's moral standards without violating an individual's right to free speech. If you don't like what he has to say, shun the product, express yourself and articulate your concerns, and even try to organize a non-violent boycott of the product with likeminded people.

This incident is a clear case of over-zealous, semi-literate Deshi Kat'hmollahs who use Islam for political ends in a traditionally filthy political culture of Bangladesh, and can't get even 20 seats in the Parliament.

Sohel
September 20, 2007, 05:35 AM
If anything, the cartoon was a dig at the mollahs and not against Islam or the Prophet. Is it stereotyping the mollahs in BD? Probably. But, the majority of mollahs act and thing like that. Just see how it perturbed the gang of Amini and co..

Spot on.

Sohel
September 20, 2007, 05:37 AM
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/7997/0000000114hn4.jpg

:lol::lol::lol: ... HB, you continue to make my day, very appropriate casting BTW, especially within the context of what happened in this thread ... thanks bro.

ND Rules ...

http://img1.jurko.net/18989.gif

Sumon77
September 20, 2007, 06:12 AM
Some way, I find the cartoon like this also... it says, if something noble or valuable is given to immatured hand, it can be misused. Like here, use of the name of Prophet (PBUH) was given to a child who doesnt have the knowledge to handle it and thereby used inappropriately, its quite common in our society, the simple example can be democracy given to us in 91 and we somehow ruined it by misusing. Anyway, it is better to avoid anything in the first place which can be used even intentionally by certain groups.

PoorFan
September 20, 2007, 06:28 AM
Only a Half Educated, Mullahs, Zealots ( read HEMZ all together from now on ) knee jerk reaction?

May be should take a close look around us, so called highly educated people, in my observation more in numbers than ever, these people are becoming radical religious recently ( last few years ), which is nothing wrong at all until I see some with less common tolerance and understanding. This type of highly educated people make me more concern than those HEMZ, since those HEMZ is / were always in our society but new generation of high educated HEMZs are seems even more radical with their intellectual, source, logic and skilled argument.

Before going into few example, I have to make it clear that ... its simply my observation and experience, which could be seen in different perspective and belief, so no point on arguing right or wrong, rather the point ( my observation ) is radical religious people are growing fast in numbers also in highly educated people.

Case one : My sister in law, a graduate from BUET few years ago used to live in Dhaka, was such an average girl usually we can imagine. Couple of years ago she got married and moved to Canada with her husband, an engineer graduated from some Texas university. Later a year or so, I heard she started to follow religion more 'proper' / 'correct' way. Now she refuse taking picture unless for official use, and says recording home video is out of question, she even stopped watching TV.

I felt totally broken, when she was arguing to remove a picture of my sixty plus aged mother in law from our photo album. In that picture she was embracing my son, both looked nice, lovely, smiling, and I thought a great picture with moment, so I put this only one picture in front page of the album to start. She find it offended because my mother in law has performed hajj ( that picture taken before hajj ) and she was not covering her head. Her point is, since this album could be seen by other people, keeping that picture we are damaging the purity of her ( mother in law ) hajj performance.

Case two : A married couple used live near, a graduate come teacher of BUET, came to Tokyo for MS from Waseda University. Once we went together to visit Kyoto, the ancient capital city of Japan for few days. The wife a honors graduate from Iden collage, normally wear shari, salowar cameez, pant shirt as usual and average. One day she nicely dressed up with 'chakma' dress and accessory ( Nupur, necklace, forehead accessory etc. ) saying "this is also a Bangladeshi traditional dress, so I wanted to introduce our tradition to those tourist who wearing Japanese traditional dress". I felt proud and honor to her free, rational thought and courage.

This same lady a year later moved to Chicago and when she send some picture I was surprised to see her totally dressed up in muslim tradition ( not traditional burka, but head to toe long, loose dress, rounded up head and shoulder with scarf, even wearing sunglass and hand gloves ). When I asked her on phone of this sudden change ( which I shouldnt ), she started to send verious internet links on 'after life' in Islam etc. to my wife. When I asked her to stop, her obvious answer was its every muslims duty to inform and correct others if they indetify anything wrong going, and she stoped altimately.

Case three : The other day recently, I came to know from my wife that some people are arguing not to use 'mohamanno rastropiti' or 'mohamanonio bicharpoti' saying these words only should be used to Muhammod ( PBUH ). The logic is no other living person could be 'mohamanno' or 'mohamanonio' other than Muhammod ( PBUH ) only. When I said this is absurd ... to my big surprise my wife think its right and logical. Though I tried to explain that when we use 'mohamanno' or 'mohamanonio' to a person like president or judge, it is totally a different context than our profet, no way demean our profet, and almighty Allah knows well our intention, but all in vain. Seemed to me a debate again like 'Allah hafez' or 'khoda hafez', 'Allah' or 'God' ( while we write in english ).

Once again, my intention of this post is not to debate on right or wrong, rather my focus is ... we tend to believe half educated people are becoming redical religious, but my feeling is high educated people are also becoming more redical than ever, and its perhaps growing fast in my observation. May be my observation is isolated, or just a coincident, and I will be happy if that the case is.

PoorFan
September 20, 2007, 06:46 AM
The arrest of that cartoonist by any chance ... helping the cause of life security of that poor guy? I mean, can you imagine how danger his life and his family could be if he left alone in the society without having 'any sort of punishment', given that the Mullah's outrageous reaction this time?

May be it was a good move for instant, but for long time? ... may be this is not the time to think for 'long time'.

Miraz
September 20, 2007, 06:50 AM
The arrest of that cartoonist by any chance ... helping the cause of life security of that poor guy? I mean, can you imagine how danger his life and his family could be if he left alone in the society without having 'any sort of punishment', given that the Mullah's outrageous reaction this time?

May be it was a good move for instant, but for long time? ... may be this is not the time to think for 'long time'.

IMHO, isolating the cartoonist and making him responsible for everything is the worst scenario here.

Extremists will take advantage of the situation but the dumping by the so called "progressive" society is even more painful.

Can you imagine, the poor guy has lost his job from Prothom-Alo and got no defense from any lawyear??

The extremists will think it as a minor win and will press for major ones.

PoorFan
September 20, 2007, 08:42 AM
IMHO, isolating the cartoonist and making him responsible for everything is the worst scenario here.

Agree.

Extremists will take advantage of the situation but the dumping by the so called "progressive" society is even more painful.

Agree.

Can you imagine, the poor guy has lost his job from Prothom-Alo and got no defense from any lawyear??

Agree.

The extremists will think it as a minor win and will press for major ones.

Agree more than 100%


My comment was rather question.:)

akabir77
September 20, 2007, 09:14 AM
never mind

Spitfire_x86
September 20, 2007, 01:21 PM
The world is divided into two groups: Hizbullas (the group of Allah) and Hizbuttagut (the group of Sataan). People themselves decide which groups they want to join.
That sound's awfully like "Either you're with us, or against us", doesn't it?

Fazal
September 20, 2007, 01:35 PM
Prothom Alo's satire magazine suspended
The Dhaka district magistrate has suspended the Prothom Alo's satire magazine Aalpin, three days after it ran a controversial cartoon strip "hurting religious sensibilities". In an order, the magistrate informed its publisher that the publication of the cartoon story violated the Printing Press and Publications (Declaration and Registration) Act 1973, the Press Information Department said in a statement Thursday. "The publisher has been asked to explain in two weeks from notification why the Prothom Alo's Aalpin magazine will not be banned," said the order, quoted by PID. source: http://www.bdnews24.com/home.php

cricket_dorshok
September 20, 2007, 01:55 PM
OMG! are we heading towrads Afganshitan. Now Sapthahik2000 Eid issue banned:

Eid issue of Shaptahik 2000 banned

The government has banned the Eid issue of Bangla-language weekly magazine Shaptahik 2000, a top official said Thursday. Home secretary Abdul Karim told bdnews24.com that the Eid edition of the magazine had carried an article "offensive to religious sensibilities". The autobiographical article written by Daud Haider, self-exiled in Germany, is at the heart of the controversy. The acting editor of the magazine, Golam Mortoza, told bdnews24.com: "I heard about it. But we didn't get any official order." He said the magazine authorities had decided to take the Eid issue off the newsstands, taking into
http://www.bdnews24.com/home.php

Rubu
September 20, 2007, 02:45 PM
This is the problem with CTG. They could bang the students, who in most case driven by hot head rather than any political or even goal. But, they could not beat up the bastard mullahs who, we all know, looking for a political goal making an issue out of nothing.

how hard would have been to beat them up good and shut them up?

Kabir
September 20, 2007, 02:51 PM
how hard would have been to beat them up good and shut them up?

Not hard enough. But the aftermath would've been uncontrollable. And for that matter, they would lose all the support that they currently have...which is running low anyway.

skeptic
September 20, 2007, 02:59 PM
me hiding at the darkest corner of the milkyway and crying

Kabir
September 20, 2007, 03:03 PM
Keno bhai, mone eto dukho keno? Amader ke bolen jodi paren :)

Nasif
September 20, 2007, 03:19 PM
Keno bhai, mone eto dukho keno? Amader ke bolen jodi paren :)

Its not the sadness, [বাংলা]কার্টুনের ঐ হুজুরের ভয়ে পলাইছে...[/বাংলা]

BD-Shardul
September 20, 2007, 04:15 PM
Originally Posted by Rubu

This is the problem with CTG. They could bang the students, who in most case driven by hot head rather than any political or even goal. But, they could not beat up the bastard mullahs who, we all know, looking for a political goal making an issue out of nothing.

how hard would have been to beat them up good and shut them up?

The mollahs are bad people. They are bastard. They are idiot. They are non-sense. They are extremist. They are backdated. They are .................the list continues

But still they are good people than the so called intellectuals like Daud Haider, Ariful Rahman. Because despite all the criticisms from the intellectuals like Ahmed Sharif, Humayun Azad, it were the mullah's who said their Janaja prayer. The day I will die, it will be the mollahs who will say janaja for me. They will be the people who will at least recite Innahlillah or some other prayer,and put me in the grave according to Islamic manner. , Those intellectual, educated, progressive people will not. They will at best write a poem, or publish an essay, which will be of no use for me. :(:(:(:(

Miraz
September 20, 2007, 04:19 PM
Prothom-Alo has sacked Sumonto Aslam, editor of Alpin, for publishing material that does not conform with the principles of Prothom-Alo.

Another selfish decision from Matiur Rahman.

ialbd
September 20, 2007, 04:37 PM
Prothom-Alo has sacked Sumonto Aslam, editor of Alpin, for publishing material that does not conform with the principles of Prothom-Alo.

Another selfish decision from Matiur Rahman.

Dont know how selfish this is Miraz bhai, but Matiur Rahman needs to do these to save his rear and Prothom-alo. If he stood by Aslam, his effigy would have been burning in Paltan by now....

Hopefully Sumonto Aslam was laid off with a big fat check, cuz his editorial career is badly tainted if not over. Use to enjoy his 'Baundule' articles at the last page of Alpin, 2-3 years back....

Kana-Baba
September 20, 2007, 04:41 PM
Prothom-Alo has sacked Sumonto Aslam, editor of Alpin, for publishing material that does not conform with the principles of Prothom-Alo.

Another selfish decision from Matiur Rahman.

Spot on!

<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comhttp://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/ /><o:p></o:p></FONT></P><P><FONT color=black>Matiur Rahman did not stand behind the cartoonist, did not say a word against the arrest; moreover today he sacked Sumonto Aslam, a fine, young and promising journalist. Seems like he is interested to save his a$$ rather than standing against those religious bigots.<o:p></o:p></FONT></P><P><FONT size=3><FONT face=<o:p></o:p>

Miraz
September 20, 2007, 04:51 PM
Dont know how selfish this is Miraz bhai, but Matiur Rahman needs to do these to save his rear and Prothom-alo. If he stood by Aslam, his effigy would have been burning in Paltan by now....

Hopefully Sumonto Aslam was laid off with a big fat check, cuz his editorial career is badly tainted if not over. Use to enjoy his 'Baundule' articles at the last page of Alpin, 2-3 years back....

IMO, this is over reaction from Matiur Rahman to save his rear. If Sumonto Aslam is responsible, Matiur is also responsible to the same extent.

Why he is visiting Iftaar Parties and apologising?

He should also step down or stop making these selfish decisions.

Special 1
September 20, 2007, 04:52 PM
The mollahs are bad people. They are bastard. They are idiot. They are non-sense. They are extremist. They are backdated. They are .................the list continues

But still they are good people than the so called intellectuals like Daud Haider, Ariful Rahman. Because despite all the criticisms from the intellectuals like Ahmed Sharif, Humayun Azad, it were the mullah's who said their Janaja prayer. The day I will die, it will be the mollahs who will say janaja for me. They will be the people who will at least recite Innahlillah or some other prayer,and put me in the grave according to Islamic manner. , Those intellectual, educated, progressive people will not. They will at best write a poem, or publish an essay, which will be of no use for me. :(:(:(:(

what is the point of your post?
It is a clerks job to do all the above things. And just because they do it they are better people?

Special 1
September 20, 2007, 04:55 PM
The problem started when bangladesh constitution was stripped of its religious neutrality clause.
The problem got worse when AL came to power in 1996 and started every one who was wearing punjabi and yupi rajakars.
The final nail was plugged in when Jamaat came to power in 2001 after the 9/11 attacks(altho the 2 evnts were not related, but 9/11 had that much of an impact)

BD-Shardul
September 20, 2007, 05:13 PM
One more thing:

We do not know about the intention of people. But this is very important in, beacuse based on our intention, Allah will reward us of our deeds. If Amini-Nezami of the Jamayat Party, a party that always uses religion as a means of political success, organising all these protests to achieve their own nefarious mundane purposes, then they are the biggest loser, even bigger then the cartoonist.

Special 1
September 20, 2007, 05:22 PM
One more thing:

We do not know about the intention of people. But this is very important in, beacuse based on our intention, Allah will reward us of our deeds. If Amini-Nezami of the Jamayat Party, a party that always uses religion as a means of political success, organising all these protests to achieve their own nefarious mundane purposes, then they are the biggest loser, even bigger then the cartoonist.

You know u are commiting a big sin here.
You havent talked to the cartoonist and have not talked about his intentions and in public making assumptions about his intentions that tooo in the the month of ramadan.

babubangla
September 20, 2007, 06:14 PM
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2007/08/17/world/17peru2.l.jpg

[বাংলা]এই বেদায়াত কার্টুনখানা ফোরামে প্রকাশ করিয়া রুবু আমার ধর্মীয় অনুভুতিতে প্রবল আঘাত হানিয়াছে।
আঘাতে আমার মাথা ঝিম ঝিম এবং পা টলটল করিতেছে।
অবিলম্বে রুবুকে ফোরাম হইতে এক সপ্তাহের জন্য বহিষ্কার করা হোক।

না, শাস্তি কম হইয়া যাইতেছে—এত কম শাস্তিতে আমার গুরুতর আহত অনুভূতি নিরাময় হইবে না।
রুবুর পোস্ট সংখ্যা হইতে ২০০০ পোস্ট জরিমানা হিসাবে কাটিয়া নেয়া হোক।

উঁহু, তাও আমার আঘাতপ্রাপ্ত অনুভুতি শান্তি পাইতেছে না। শাস্তি আরো বাড়ানো দরকার।
রুবুকে ফোরাম স্টাফ পদ হইতে ডিমোশন দিয়া ফোরাম জেনিটর বানাইয়া দেয়া হোক।

ধুর শালা, তাও আমার ধর্মীয় অনুভুতি কুট-কুট করিতেছে, কিছুতেই আরাম হইতেছে না।
আসলে এইসব ভার্চুয়াল শাস্তিতে আমার ছিন্ন-বিছিন্ন অনুভুতি কানা-কড়িও জোড়া লাগিবে না।

আমি কিছুক্ষন আগে মাওলানা ডাকাইয়া আমার ধর্মীয় অনুভুতি আবার ভালো করিয়া পরীক্ষা করাইলাম।
অবস্থা বেশ বেগতিক। আস্তাগফিরুল্লা-মার্কা কার্টুনসম্বলিত রুবুর এই বেত্তমিজ থ্রেড আমার ধর্মীয় অনুভুতিতে এমন জায়গা মতো ঢুশ মারিয়াছে যে- আমার মুল্যবান অনুভুতি মোবারক এখন সকল প্রকার মেরামতের উর্ধ্বে।
জোড়া লাগাইবার কোন পথ নাই-- আমার ধর্মীয় অনুভুতি এখন পুরোপুরি ভাঙ্গিয়া ফেলিয়া আবার নতুন করিয়া বানাইতে হইবে।

দেখিয়াছ রুবু, তুমি আমার কতো বড় সর্বনাশ ঘটাইয়াছ?
যাই হোক, প্রথম কিস্তির ক্ষতিপুরন হিসাবে কিছু ব্লু –ফিল্ম ডিভিডি খরিদের খরচ বাবদ পঞ্চাশ ডলার তাড়াতাড়ি আমার নামে পে-পল করিয়া দাও। ব্লু-ফিল্ম দেখিয়া দেখিয়া আমি আমার মেরামত-অযোগ্য পুরানো ধর্মীয় অনুভুতি ভাঙ্গিয়া ফেলার কাজ শুরু করি।

তবে আশার কথা এই যে, মনে হইতেছে পুরানো অনুভুতি ভাঙ্গিয়া ফেলার কাজ আমি খুব শীঘ্রই শেষ করিতে পারিব। কারন তুমি কেবল মাত্র একখানি কার্টুন মারিয়া আমার ধর্মীয় অনুভুতির যে দশা করিয়াছ—তা দেখিয়া আমার ধর্মীয় অনুভুতির ফাউন্ডেশন খুব একটা শক্ত বলিয়া মনে হইতেছে না। ছোটবেলায় আমার অভিভাবকেরা কোন ঠিকাদারের হাতে যে আমার ধর্মীয় অনুভুতি বানাইবার টেন্ডার দিয়াছিল!! আমাকে ভেজাল-মিশ্রিত ধর্মীয় অনুভুতি গছাইয়া দিয়া ওই ঠিকাদার হারামজাদা নিশ্চয়ই টাকা মারিয়াছে।

তবে শুনিয়া রাখো, আমার নতুন ধর্মীয় অনুভুতি বানাইবার সময় আমি এমন শক্ত ফাউন্ডেশন দিয়া বানাইবো যাহাতে তোমার মতো দুস্ট লোকের ঠুনকো কার্টুনে আমার মুল্যবান ধর্মীয় অনুভুতি ভবিষ্যতে এমন তাসের ঘরের মতো ভাঙ্গিয়া না পড়ে।
[/বাংলা]

Hatebreed
September 20, 2007, 06:24 PM
Classic Babubangla bhai :lol:
[বাংলা]
উঁহু, তাও আমার আঘাতপ্রাপ্ত অনুভুতি শান্তি পাইতেছে না। শাস্তি আরো বাড়ানো দরকার।
রুবুকে ফোরাম স্টাফ পদ হইতে ডিমোশন দিয়া ফোরাম জেনিটর বানাইয়া দেয়া হোক।[/বাংলা]

Rubu
September 20, 2007, 06:26 PM
[বাংলা]সত্যিইতো। কি যে করিলাম। তা ইহার ক্ষতিপুরন স্বরুপ উক্ত বর্নিত ডিভিডি সহ ডিভিডির অভিনেত্রী কেও পাঠিয়ে দেব নাকি? বিসমিল্লাহ বলিয়া ওজু করিয়া বিবাহ করিয়া লইবেন। পরবর্তিতে তিন তালাক দিয়া বিদায় করিয়া দিবেন তাহলে আর কোন গুনাহ হইবে না।[/বাংলা]

BTW, good to see you back bro.

nsd3
September 20, 2007, 06:26 PM
This is the problem with CTG. They could bang the students, who in most case driven by hot head rather than any political or even goal. But, they could not beat up the bastard mullahs who, we all know, looking for a political goal making an issue out of nothing.

how hard would have been to beat them up good and shut them up?

I guess students got banged cuz they did "bhangchur" across the country. Mollahs didn't get banged as they did everything through speeches and meetings with CTG. No bhangchur was done - was it?

Omio
September 20, 2007, 08:04 PM
Classic stuff Babu vai,:lol:

PoorFan
September 20, 2007, 08:54 PM
The problem started when bangladesh constitution was stripped of its religious neutrality clause.
The problem got worse when AL came to power in 1996 and started every one who was wearing punjabi and yupi rajakars.
The final nail was plugged in when Jamaat came to power in 2001 after the 9/11 attacks(altho the 2 evnts were not related, but 9/11 had that much of an impact)
Well said.

PoorFan
September 20, 2007, 08:56 PM
[বাংলা]সত্যিইতো। কি যে করিলাম। তা ইহার ক্ষতিপুরন স্বরুপ উক্ত বর্নিত ডিভিডি সহ ডিভিডির অভিনেত্রী কেও পাঠিয়ে দেব নাকি? বিসমিল্লাহ বলিয়া ওজু করিয়া বিবাহ করিয়া লইবেন। পরবর্তিতে তিন তালাক দিয়া বিদায় করিয়া দিবেন তাহলে আর কোন গুনাহ হইবে না।[/বাংলা]

<!--StartFragment -->
Dear Babubangla & Rubu,
What if BC get suspended and had to shutdown for weeks, after being ordered a show cause notice from authority!?
Please don't let them do that.;)

Alien
September 20, 2007, 08:56 PM
Very sad and unfortunate if CG has arrested the cartoonist. It is the correct portrayal of our society's naming disorder. I applaud the cartoonist for portraying the message so nicely. We have reached to insane amount of "Mohammad" idolization while naming children, and, it needs to stop.

:up: for the cartoonist. Pure genius.

Its better to have him arrested then have twenty mullah running after him with all degrees of fatwas. In that way he is better protected.

On a different note, people who think that having Mohammad before your name (there is a female equivalent can't remember) are one of those misguided souls mostly found in villages. There is no mention in the Quran that you need to have it before the name.

Also this is a lame attempt at humour. Ok, maybe the open minded individuals may find it amusing, but given how half our country works, you'll be crucified in no time. There is a limit for all jokes. And when it comes to jokes there is always a limit especially with regards to religion. So play with fire and you'll get burned sooner or later. Thats what happened here. He should have had the common sense before doing something like this.

So :down: to the cartoonist and :down: to the public.

Fazal
September 20, 2007, 09:11 PM
Just found out in http://www.drishtipat.org/blog/ that there was similar joke published in Islamic Chatra Shibir Magazine (Nov 1998, Edition Page 87) under Children's Voice ( courtesyhttp://www.somewhereinblog.net/blog/sujonmcblog/28732243)



http://img463.imageshack.us/img463/6441/jamatphpwo6.gif
http://images.somewhereinblog.net/phpThumb/phpThumb.php?src=../bba/images/sujonmcblog_1190217050_2-kk2.gif&w=0

People who find Prothom Alo cartoon Offensive, do you guys find this offensive also? But where is the protest then? Do you remember anyone went to jail then? Any one saked? Any publisher scolded? How about now? Shouldn't justice be served now?

Where is Fatwa against Jamati Islam and its magazine? Where are the protector of Mohammed hiding in this case...can you please all stand up and show your real face please?

Guys Keu (jail) pabe ar keu (jail) Pabena... ta to hobe na ta to hobe na !!!!!

Rubu
September 20, 2007, 09:15 PM
Also this is a lame attempt at humour.
So :down: to the cartoonist and :down: to the public.
I don't think it was an attempted joke. Rather, it was a satire, poking at mullahs. What the cartoon showing is, a mullah giving a child an advise that is not proper Islamic (like most of their advises). And what the outcome is for those made up fatwahs.

Basically, what the cartoon is saying is: if you listen to those illiterate mullahs (99% of Bangladeshi mullahs are illiterate), you are going to end up in trouble.

Dream theater
September 20, 2007, 09:33 PM
Fazal, since when Shibir and Jamat is a standard of what is right and wrong. Shibir publishing the same cartoon a decade ago does not take away anything from what it is. A tasteless joke. Not exactly the right place and time for this. Also it is sheer stupidity to call for actions against Shibir for a tasteless cartoon they published in 1998. Arent you 9 years too late.

Anyway, there is something really wrong with both Fundamentalists who thinks they are given the right to protect Prophets (PBUH) name by making a big fuss out of nothing. And there is something really wrong with secuars who thinks anything and everything goes. And always blame the Mullahs, Jamatis and Rajakars for everything.

al Furqaan
September 20, 2007, 09:35 PM
i cannot read bangla...but nonetheless i have figured out the gist of the cartoon and i will say this:

there was no need for the cartoonist to be punished as (from my understanding) he did not insult the prophet, but rather a peculiar tradition of bangladesh (and i'm sure many other muslim countries).

at the same time, this article was at least moderately irresponsible, witty though it might have been. why so?

there was absolutely no reason for lamenting this "tradition." i can name 100 other flaws of the way islam is practiced that it is worth getting fired/jailed or even killed over. how about cartoons making fun of:

- the fact that muslim women usually aren't allowed to set foot inside the mosque
- the fact that islam is being used as cover to harass ahmadiyas
- the fact that islam is being used to fight illegitimate battles
- the fact that some muslims feel its their right to trample on the rights of others
- the fact that most muslims don't even have basic understanding of islam
- the fact that the words "muslim world" are the biggest oxymoron on earth
- the fact that many so called muslims oppose grameen banks aid to women

and the list goes on and on. when you have people speak its either wrong (danish cartoons terrorist spiel) or utterly pointless (prothom alo's 'why is your name mohammad?')

how utterly unsurprising?

Maddog
September 20, 2007, 09:36 PM
maybe its high time we call on all the razakar mullahs to publicly apologize for their anti-state role during 1971 or face eviction!
lets see where our alem olama khatibs stand on that demand!

al Furqaan
September 20, 2007, 09:37 PM
btw, naming someone "muhammad" is not at all essential, as the prophet himself said that the best name for a muslim is "abdullah" (slave of allah)

Fazal
September 20, 2007, 09:44 PM
Fazal, since when Shibir and Jamat is a standard of what is right and wrong. Shibir publishing the same cartoon a decade ago does not take away anything from what it is. A tasteless joke. Not exactly the right place and time for this. Also it is sheer stupidity to call for actions against Shibir for a tasteless cartoon they published in 1998. Arent you 9 years too late.


Dream theater its not me who thinks people should go to jail for tasteless joke. Nor did I mentioned anywhere that Shibir and Jamat is a standard of what is right and wrong. So you are asking to the wrong person.


Also it is sheer stupidity to call for actions against Shibir for a tasteless cartoon they published in 1998. Arent you 9 years too late.

Ahhaa its stupidity to ask for action if its against Shibir published in 1998 and I guess its a matter of great intellectual superiority to send a cartoonist to jail for a tasteless joke... ok I got it... thanks but not thanks I would rather be a stupid than an intellectual then.

Arent you 9 years too late
Now about is 9 years too late? Why is that? We can send Hasina and co. jail for crimes close to 9 years old, why not for this case? Why not the same people who sent the cartoonist to jail can do the same for the joke published in Shibir Magazine? As far as I know, there shouldn't be any legal barrier doing that. They should try their best. At least no body will be able to say there is a double standard there.

al Furqaan
September 20, 2007, 09:48 PM
I have very limited time. But still i will have my 2 cents.

Religion can sometimes be regarded as soft targets for quick fun. What bothers me here is the cartoonist did this during the month of Ramadan. Is it mere coincedence or lack of respect towards the religion of the majority? I would get offended absolutely at anything i love, do, like to do, believe, like to believe, think, like to think, any rituals, any religions that i practise, like to practise no matter how stupid it is; if someone makes fun of it. The person who is making fun of what i love, do, like to do, believe, like to believe, think, like to think, any rituals, any religions that i practise, like to practise; is making fun of me, not the things i love, do, like to do, believe, like to believe, think, like to think, any rituals, any religions that i practise, like to practise.

Fun, most of the times; very closely related to disrespect.

also agree with this guru :D

such a cartoon, as benign as it is, insults all those people who have named their sons mohammad (my grandfather included). it includes ashraful's father. these people didnt deserve to be insulted. naming your child mohammad makes you no less illiterate than naming him stalin, george, OJ, kareem, paris, tony, or santino.

as such the cartoon was pointless to the max. he could have satirized, attacked, or brought to light the million and one other things wrong with muslims and the way islam is practiced and interpreted today. who can argue with this?

if naming your kid mohammad was the only thing wrong with muslims, we'd be in a very good position.

al Furqaan
September 20, 2007, 09:59 PM
The mollahs are bad people. They are bastard. They are idiot. They are non-sense. They are extremist. They are backdated. They are .................the list continues

But still they are good people than the so called intellectuals like Daud Haider, Ariful Rahman. Because despite all the criticisms from the intellectuals like Ahmed Sharif, Humayun Azad, it were the mullah's who said their Janaja prayer. The day I will die, it will be the mollahs who will say janaja for me. They will be the people who will at least recite Innahlillah or some other prayer,and put me in the grave according to Islamic manner. , Those intellectual, educated, progressive people will not. They will at best write a poem, or publish an essay, which will be of no use for me. :(:(:(:(

BD shardul bhai, i understand what you are saying, but this does not give the right to mullahs to do what they do.

i may be pious, i might pray, i might do dhikr...but this doesn't automatically give me license to sin and be half educated.

we need people who understand islam, implement it, and also embrace the modern aspects of life. modern as in going to school, women can drive, girls go to school. having enough female doctors so women don't have to to go to men doctors, having schools that teach math, science, english, computers, history, in addition to islamiyat and not in place of it.

Maddog
September 20, 2007, 10:00 PM
Fazal, since when Shibir and Jamat is a standard of what is right and wrong. Shibir publishing the same cartoon a decade ago does not take away anything from what it is. A tasteless joke. Not exactly the right place and time for this. Also it is sheer stupidity to call for actions against Shibir for a tasteless cartoon they published in 1998. Arent you 9 years too late.

Anyway, there is something really wrong with both Fundamentalists who thinks they are given the right to protect Prophets (PBUH) name by making a big fuss out of nothing. And there is something really wrong with secuars who thinks anything and everything goes. And always blame the Mullahs, Jamatis and Rajakars for everything.

Nobody is calling for action! as u can well understand, those who want to point this out don;t see any need for action! fact is "WHERE WAS THE OUTRAGE THEN? WERE WE LESS MUSLIM THEM? " and shibir being the so called "dharok" "bahok" and "rokhkhakorta" of islam, HOW, tell me HOW could they even contemplate publishing in their own magazine something which is 'supposedly' so controversial! So controversial that an editor virtually has to go down on his knees and beg for forgiveness! So controversial the cartoonist is languishing in the jail for 2 days with no justice in sight whatsoever! the whole magazine is to be banned from publication! ALL THIS OVER A CARTOON which an islamic party magazine themselves dimmed fit to be published on their own magazine some years back! Do u see the massive discrepancy here?? the fact it was printed 9 years back is a non-issue, the fact is that they (meaning shibir) DIDNT see anything wrong with publishing the same cartoon!
something tells me that there is much more at play than this cartoon!

PoorFan
September 20, 2007, 10:29 PM
Where the hell those 'democracy lover' politicians now? While Mullahs are jumping up and down on this issue, why they remain dead silent? What kind of political gain they are going to have being silent? No need to go for 'street protest' or 'bhangchur', but shouldn't they express their thoughts and support in the line of democracy?

Fazal
September 20, 2007, 11:00 PM
http://rumiahmed.files.wordpress.com/2007/09/paapology.jpg

Fande Poria Boga Kandey Reee...

Alien
September 20, 2007, 11:55 PM
For those who can't read Bengali or has trouble with it.

Mullah: Hey kid, what's your name?
Kid: My name is Babu.

Mullah: Before you say your name, you should say "Mohammad". (i.e put Mohammad before your name)

Mullah: What is your father's name?
Kid: Mohammad Abu.

Mullah: So, what's that in your arm?
Kid: Mohammad Biral (cat).

Alien
September 21, 2007, 12:10 AM
we need people who understand islam, implement it, and also embrace the modern aspects of life.

Problem is that such people don't exist and if they do they don't stand out much.

We live in an age of ignorance. We are all most happy to point the finger of blame towards the mullahs but seldom look the mirrors. End of the day, they do the very things that we do not (including the intellectuals not to mention some end up like Rushdie and Taslima Nasrin).

Fair enough they are misguided, lost, badly interpret the Quran, but end of the day they made the effort to do so which we intellectuals don't due to or work commitments, career or fun lives. And that includes people like myself who has a translation of Quran in english sitting in the bookshelves and never went through the whole book once.

shaoun
September 21, 2007, 12:13 AM
they are using this for their own political benefit now. i have no problem with molla's. i respect them because they are the one who preaches our religion. but i do have problem with molla's who uses islam for their own personal and political benefit. there isnt anything wrong with that cartoon. when i first read at in the newspaper the newspaper made it sound alot different then what it really is. i feel bad for the guy who drew it.

Spitfire_x86
September 21, 2007, 02:28 AM
there was no need for the cartoonist to be punished as (from my understanding) he did not insult the prophet, but rather a peculiar tradition of bangladesh (and i'm sure many other muslim countries).

at the same time, this article was at least moderately irresponsible, witty though it might have been. why so?
....
....
....
and the list goes on and on. when you have people speak its either wrong (danish cartoons terrorist spiel) or utterly pointless (prothom alo's 'why is your name mohammad?')
I think it was just a light hearted joke about the mullahs, as many jokes exists about all kinds of professionals. It's hard to believe that the cartoonist tried to imply anything at all about Islam or Islamic culture.

Now the poor guy is being either labeled as villain (by Mullah and supporter group) or hero (for trying to make a "bold statement")

Nocturnal
September 21, 2007, 03:41 AM
good post babubangla bhai.
amader "dormio onubhuti" r foundation boroi dhurbol, na hoile ki ar ekta shamanno cartoon niya eto matha batha, Lal Shalu'r Majeed (a famous novel by Syed Waliullah (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syed_Waliullah) published in 1948!!) re deikha ei 2007 eo amra bhoy pai.
Shibir bahini eki type er jokes chapaile oita tik ase, prothom-alo te ashlei amader dommo gelo ga, hayre Matiur Rahman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matiur_Rahman_%28journalist%29)- ei rup o dekte hoilo eksomoy er "Ekota" shompadok er.

Special 1
September 21, 2007, 04:24 AM
and the fightings hae started.
Reports of clash between police and people left around 50 people injured near bait al mukarrak.

Nocturnal
September 21, 2007, 04:27 AM
and the fightings hae started.
Reports of clash between police and people left around 50 people injured near bait al mukarrak.

Prothom Alo faces demonstrations in Baitul Mukarram :(

Fri, Sep 21st, 2007 3:15 pm BdST
Dhaka, Sep 21 (bdnews24.com) – Many Islamist organisations including Hizbut Tahrir have started demonstrations against the daily Prothom Alo in Baitul Mukarram after Friday prayers.

Hundreds of demonstrators gathered at the north gate of the national mosque at around 1:25pm just after the prayers ended amid the state of emergency.

Earlier Hizbut Tahrir burnt an effigy of the Prothom Alo editor Matiur Rahman in the mosque complex.

Islami Oikya Andolon, Islamic Constitution Movement, Khelafat Andolan and Islami Chhatra Majlish also carried banners in the processions.

The processions demanded closure of the publication of the Prothom Alo, which they termed "Friend of the Jews and Christians" for carrying a rogue cartoon strip in its satire magazine Aalpin.

The agitators also chanted slogans for besieging the paper's office in Karwan Bazar.

A huge number of riot police deployed in the area played the silent spectators during the demonstrations.

The protestors took out processions from Baitul Mukarram north gate to the High Court area.

Source (http://www.bdnews24.com/details.php?cid=2&id=21926)

Rubu
September 21, 2007, 07:27 AM
As I said, the joke has nothing to do with Islam or Islamic tradition, but it has all to do with illiterate mullahs who give wrong sermons. He showed what the result of those wrong sermons. Rajakars do have things to worry here, as they use those wrong sermons as their source of bread and butter. I'm surprised that not CTG not any other group pointed that out and asked them to shut the F up.

Now, to make my point I'll give another joke here, I'll try to make it G rated, but might end up G+. Basically, they both have the same message:

[বাংলা]একজন লোকের বাবা মারা গেছেন। সে তখন তাদের বাড়ীর কাছের মোল্লাকে যেয়ে জিজ্ঞাস করল, কেউ যদি মৃত্যুর আগে কিছু খেতে চায়, কিন্তু খাওয়ার আগেই মারা যায়, তাহলে কি করা উচিৎ? মোল্লা বলল, তাহলে ভাল কোন মোল্লা ডেকে তাকে খাওয়ায়ে দেবেন। (বলা বাহুল্য ধর্মে এধরনের কোন নিয়ম নেই। মোল্লা একটা দাওয়াতের আশায় এটা বলেছে) । তো মোল্লা যা আশা করেছিলো, লোকটা বলল, তাহলে আপনিই কাল আসেন আমাদের বাড়ীতে। পরদিন, মোল্লা বসেছে খেতে, কিন্তু সে ঠিক চিনতে পারলো না কি খাচ্ছে। তো সে, বলল, রান্না তো খুবই ভাল হয়েছে, খেতেও ভাল, তা জিনিসটা কি? তখন লোকটা বলল, শেষের দিকে বাবাতো কিছুই খেতে চাইতো না, মেজাজও খুব খারাপ থাকতো। তো আমি যখন যানতে চাই কি খাবেন, তিনি বলেন আমার _____ খাবো। তাই কেটে রেখে আপনাকে রান্না করে দিয়েছি।[/বাংলা]

Fazal
September 21, 2007, 08:55 AM
Where is Rubu's Joke Gone?

Is he also sacked from BC Staff.... or he is sent to jail?
Is BC editors are going to aplologize to the public for posting it in the first place?

Sohel
September 21, 2007, 09:12 AM
Classic mollatantrik demonstration in Dhaka today. Tilke tal baniye rajnoitik phayda lotar fyashibadi cheshta ... CTG's steps to avoid this crap fails.

Alien
September 21, 2007, 09:40 AM
I don't get why some of us are calling the cartoonist a 'genius'. What's so genius about writing 3 page cartoon that causes nothing but controversy?

Also, CTG should ban this demonstration and use similar police presence as in DU to break it up. We had enough of this kind of rubbish where people take law into their own hands. Let's be fair here and treat the mullah in same line as politicians.

Sauron
September 21, 2007, 09:47 AM
I don't get why some of us are calling the cartoonist a 'genius'. What's so genius about writing 3 page cartoon that causes nothing but controversy?

I wouldn't quite call him a genious but he is a good cartoonist no doubt. He did not cause the controversy, and it should be apparent to anyone that there isn't anything controversial in the cartoon. The controversy has been caused by the same religious mafia that starts riots and cuts tendons of the "infidels".


Also, CTG should ban this demonstration and use similar police presence as in DU to break it up. We had enough of this kind of rubbish where people take law into their own hands. Let's be fair here and treat the mullah in same line as politicians.
This I completely agree with. CTG should deal with this in the same strong fashion. Part of the challenge for CTG would be to do a great PR job so that the moronic masses don't digest any crap that says CTG is anti-islamic.

ialbd
September 21, 2007, 10:15 AM
.... If he stood by Aslam, his effigy would have been burning in Paltan by now....


Prothom Alo faces demonstrations in Baitul Mukarram
....
Earlier Hizbut Tahrir burnt an effigy of the Prothom Alo editor Matiur Rahman in the mosque complex.


Source (http://www.bdnews24.com/details.php?cid=2&id=21926)

eto kisu koreo shesh rokkha hoilona....

reverse_swing
September 21, 2007, 10:32 AM
eto kisu koreo shesh rokkha hoilona....

http://www.sachalayatan.com/next/files/images/IndexRallyProthomAlo070921_0.jpg

:)

zahid
September 21, 2007, 10:53 AM
Kuthakar pani kothay giya gorailo!

These Extremists are using it to their advantage!

Dream theater
September 21, 2007, 10:54 AM
Dream theater its not me who thinks people should go to jail for tasteless joke. Nor did I mentioned anywhere that Shibir and Jamat is a standard of what is right and wrong. So you are asking to the wrong person.


Fazal, I dont think the cartoonist should go to jail for this joke, neither do I believe jokes like that should be made ( by anyone at any time ) in a country like Bangladesh specially during the month of Ramadan. It can easily trigger a volatile situation. That explains why Prothom-alo was quick to retract the cartoon and took quick action.

Another thing I always note reagrding people like you is , you dont miss a chance to bring up the topic of Jamat Shibir whether it fits the discussion or not. The problem with doing that is you redirect the discussion to a different path. The path this topic did not intent to take.

I am all for Shibir cartoonist sharing the same fate as Prothom-Alo cartoonist. Which is a rebuke from the editor and so on. For the sake of this discussion I will refrain from commenting on Hasina being accused of a crime and what not.

May be you can open a new thread and start venting against Jamat- Shibir and their cohorts. But this topic is dedicated to Prothom-Alo cartoon incident and related matters.

al Furqaan
September 21, 2007, 11:08 AM
I think it was just a light hearted joke about the mullahs, as many jokes exists about all kinds of professionals. It's hard to believe that the cartoonist tried to imply anything at all about Islam or Islamic culture.

Now the poor guy is being either labeled as villain (by Mullah and supporter group) or hero (for trying to make a "bold statement")

i wouldn't say he's a villain although calling a cat mohammad is coming close.

if you don't think so just imagine if he was holding a hog and the kid said "muhammad shuor"

and he wasn't making a bold statement. if he was going to piss off the mullahs and get himself jailed, he should have picked something more worthwhile. what about all those acid throwing incidents? bangla bhai? etc, etc.

the artist was an idiot.

even me with my trigger happy mouth knows better than to risk my job over something which makes absolutely zero societal impact.

Alien
September 21, 2007, 11:25 AM
i wouldn't say he's a villain although calling a cat mohammad is coming close.

if you don't think so just imagine if he was holding a hog and the kid said "muhammad shuor"

and he wasn't making a bold statement. if he was going to piss off the mullahs and get himself jailed, he should have picked something more worthwhile. what about all those acid throwing incidents? bangla bhai? etc, etc.

the artist was an idiot.

even me with my trigger happy mouth knows better than to risk my job over something which makes absolutely zero societal impact.


Well put.

Its hard to imagine he didn't know all this was coming.

Rubu
September 21, 2007, 11:36 AM
But still they are good people than the so called intellectuals like Daud Haider, Ariful Rahman. Because despite all the criticisms from the intellectuals like Ahmed Sharif, Humayun Azad, it were the mullah's who said their Janaja prayer. The day I will die, it will be the mollahs who will say janaja for me. They will be the people who will at least recite Innahlillah or some other prayer,and put me in the grave according to Islamic manner. , Those intellectual, educated, progressive people will not. They will at best write a poem, or publish an essay, which will be of no use for me. :(:(:(:(

I do not know intentionally or not, you are messing up religious people with those mullahs we were talking about.

Let me define them first, in case it was not intentional. A religious person is one who follows the true path of Islam the way Muhammad (SW) did. Without any doubt they are the most honorable people.

Then there are 'those' mullahs of Bangladesh previously known as Rajakar and Al Bodors. Currently known as Shibir and Jamaat and JMB and many many more. What do they do? They use a DISTORTED version of Islam to gain political and monitory advantage. They killed and raped million in '71 and now taking a different path to do what they failed to do in '71. What they follow or do has nothing to do with Islam. In fact, they do the opposite. They use the religion to create instability in the country so that they can take advantage of it.

You can be more than sure that none of the first group took part in the current protest. Its the second group who did all those.

Now, as some people were talking about, should the cartoonist has done it, or did he deserved the jail.

Notice here that, it is not a Islamic rule that names has to start with Muhammad. Since this cartoon talks about this rule, the cartoon is not about Islamic rule. What I'm saying is, if this cartoon was making fun of a real Islamic rule, it would be again Islam. Since it did not, Islam has nothing to do with it.

Then, what does it has to do with? A distorted version of Islam (I already told you who uses that). In that version, all name has to start with Muhammad. And the cartoonist poke fun against them (the people who are protesting it). Should the cartoonist has done it? Why not? If people can make fun of thieves or robbers why not them? Thieves and robbers are not, at least, hypocrites, which these people are.

the only thing wrong about this whole thing is how Prothom Alo and CTG handled the situation. any protest and such activities should have been stopped with roller stream from the root and Prothom Alo should have stood behind their staff.

Oh yeah, if such thing creates instability in the country, there is something wrong with the country and that need to be fixed. Stopping such cartoon is not the solution.

Fazal
September 21, 2007, 11:41 AM
Another thing I always note reagrding people like you is , you dont miss a chance to bring up the topic of Jamat Shibir whether it fits the discussion or not. The problem with doing that is you redirect the discussion to a different path. The path this topic did not intent to take.
....well I don't agree... actually I think the Shibir cartoon is very much to the point of this discussion... but the problem with People like you, is, you are too sensitive about that and fail to see the connection or see the connection but don't want to talk beacuse it doesn't help your cause.


May be you can open a new thread and start venting against Jamat- Shibir and their cohorts. But this topic is dedicated to Prothom-Alo cartoon incident and related matters.

Why should I? To accomodate you? Rubu the creator of this thread also see the connection. Only you don't see the connection. The Shibir Cartoon IS RELATED matters of this thread. If it hurts your feeling, may be you should avoid this thread instead.

ialbd
September 21, 2007, 12:03 PM
Police clubs the protesters (source bdnews24).... it starts once again....

BD-Shardul
September 21, 2007, 03:20 PM
Please read it:

http://prothom-alo.com/index.news.details.php?nid=MTA1OTA=

Spitfire_x86
September 21, 2007, 04:00 PM
i wouldn't say he's a villain although calling a cat mohammad is coming close.

if you don't think so just imagine if he was holding a hog and the kid said "muhammad shuor"
Now that we're talking about imagination, it's hard to imagine that a Bangladeshi kid would go around carrying a pig in his hand. You can say that jokes are usually unrealistic, but the joke teller/cartoonist will usually try to make the imagined world resemble real world as close as possible.

and he wasn't making a bold statement. if he was going to piss off the mullahs and get himself jailed, he should have picked something more worthwhile. what about all those acid throwing incidents? bangla bhai? etc, etc.
Why should everything must carry a great meaning or serve deep purpose? People read light jokes, chuckle if they like it and forget it within a day regardless of whether they liked it or not when they read it first.

the artist was an idiot.

even me with my trigger happy mouth knows better than to risk my job over something which makes absolutely zero societal impact.
Who could know that some people will make mountain out of molehill over a ordinary joke? After this incident the editors will surely be more careful to ensure "political correctness" of anything they print. But is it a good thing to let political correctness dominate over common sense and general conscience?

RazabQ
September 21, 2007, 06:40 PM
What a find Fazal!!! good one.

shaad
September 21, 2007, 08:14 PM
There appears to be several issues that we are discussing in this thread.

There's the cartoon itself: I did not find it objectionable in the least. Nor did I find it, in any manner, insulting towards the prophet. At most, it insults or ridicules those particular unenlightened or ignorant mullahs who come up with ridiculous notions like the one suggesting that every Muslim male must preface his name with Muhammad. I have no issues with actual scholars; but the mullahs who come up with this type of tripe are just one step away from rank superstition and deserve all the ridicule we can heap upon them.

Then, there's the issue of the cartoonist being tried for allegedly offending the "religious sentiment" of the people. I find this a terrible precedent (not that we haven't had plenty of such precedents earlier with certain books and issues of magazines being banned). This is just another slippery step down the road to religion-based censorship. Today, it's the cartoonist being tried -- what will it be tomorrow? Arresting me if I teach a molecular biology or a genetics course at a local university during my sabbaticals (because I will be talking about evolution, and clearly, many religious people find that hard to digest)? Or arresting artists, or sculptors, or even anyone with a camera for making facsimiles of living beings? We have seen this before, after all, in Afghanistan -- the destruction by the Taliban of the 1500-year old Bamyan Buddha statues -- and it all stems from a narrow-minded, blind and zealous interpretation of the faith. Some of you are suggesting that the cartoonist should have known better, what with this being Ramadan and all. That's essentially a tacit approval of the fate that befalls him, and as far as I'm concerned, that makes you equally culpable if Bangladesh goes down the fundamentalist drain to Taliban-istan.

There's the editorial board for Prothom Alo, which avows no responsibility in the matter, putting all the culpability on the cartoonist's shoulders. One has to ask: what then was the editor doing, given that he is ultimately responsible for what comes out in his paper? Either he was fine with the cartoon before all this hoop-la, in which case he is a hypocrite, or he never bothered to see what was going out to print, in which case he is incompetent.

Then there are all the people who seem to be offended at the cartoon -- seriously, is their faith so weak, so vulnerable, so susceptible to even a simple cartoon (that, in my view, was never attacking it in the first place), that there is such a need for vehemence?

And finally, what is it with Hizbul Tahrir? They get so aggravated by a simple cartoon that they burn an effigy of Prothom Alo editor Matiur Rahman in Baitul Mukarram, conveniently ignoring the proscription on making effigies of living beings in Islam.

Rubu
September 21, 2007, 08:20 PM
As always, To the point post from Shaad. :up: if you read through the thread, those are the points I was trying to make all the way. Except for the last one, which is, of course shows the kind of hypocrites those mullahs are.

nobody
September 22, 2007, 01:44 AM
I wish I could show this ad (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7007816.stm)to the mullahs. Should not these mullahs now gherao Belgian embassy for the blasphmous act Jesus is also our prophet. Bunch of hypocrate

Alien
September 22, 2007, 07:11 AM
Police disperse protest march towards Prothom Alo
Staff Correspondent


Protesters remove police barricade at Shahbagh intersection in the capital yesterday in their bid to reach the office of daily Prothom Alo at Karwan Bazar. Photo: STAR
Police yesterday dispersed a march towards the office of the daily Prothom Alo in the capital, which was protesting the publication of a cartoon strip in the newspaper's weekly satirical magazine Aalpin.

The march was organised by Hizbut Tahrir, Bangladesh Khelafat Andolon, Islami Oikya Andolon, Bangladesh Chhatra Mukti Andolon, and Islami Shasantantra Andolon, despite repeated apologies from the editor of the daily for the inadvertent publication of the cartoon strip.

The protesters demanded arrests of Prothom Alo Editor Matiur Rahman and its publisher Mahfuz Anam, and imposition of a ban on the publication of the newspaper.

Police dispersed the marchers by charging batons when they reached close to Shahbagh intersection trying to approach the newspaper's office by removing barricades put up there by the law enforcers. The police action left 20 Hizbut Tahrir activists injured, five of whom were treated in Dhaka Medical College Hospital.

As the dispersed marchers tried to regroup, police charged batons again dispersing them completely in only 15 minutes.

During the melee vehicular traffic on several nearby roads remained suspended causing sufferings for commuters.

Activists of the five organisations had started to gather at the north gate of Baitul Mukarram Mosque after the Juma prayer yesterday carrying banners and leaflets and chanting slogans.

The demonstrators also burnt several copies of the Prothom Alo, and effigies of its editor and the publisher.

After holding a brief rally at the entrance of the mosque, activists of the Islamist organisations marched through the roads of Purana Paltan and Baitul Mukarram Mosque area for some time, after which the activists of four organisations, except Hizbut Tahrir, dispersed.

Hizbut Tahrir activists however started to march towards the newspaper's office calling pedestrians over the bullhorns to join them.

The march was trailed by a long traffic jam stretching from Paltan via the Press Club to Shahbagh intersection.

Since early morning security measures had been heightened surrounding the offices of the Prothom Alo and The Daily Star. Police were deployed at several strategic points circling the offices, and barbed wire police barricades were set up at several points. Additional police were also deployed at the entrances of the offices.

Rapid Action Battalion members were seen patrolling the roads surrounding the two offices on motorbikes.

A tense situation had prevailed in the area until the Juma prayer ended and the fasting Muslims returned home in peace.

Vehicles going towards Bangla Motor from Farmgate used alternative roads as police had blocked the stretch of Kazi Nazrul Islam Avenue between Karwan Bazar intersection and Bangla Motor intersection during the skirmishes at Shahbagh.

"We have gathered here to lay a siege to the office of the Prothom Alo as the cartoon hurt the religious sentiments of the Muslims," said Saleh Uddin, who was injured in the police baton charge.

International Khatme Nabuwat Movement brought out a march in the Tejgaon industrial area while Islami Oikya Jote Chairman Mufti Fazlul Haque Amini delivered a long speech during his sermon before the Juma prayer in Boro Katra Mosque of Chakbazar. A protest march was also brought out in the area.

Bangladesh Khelafat Majlish Chairman Shaikhul Hadith Allama Azizul Haque in a statement said the Saptahik 2000 magazine fuelled the fire already burning in the minds of the Muslims by publishing another 'objectionable piece' in the Eid issue.

Earlier, Baitul Mukarram National Mosque Khatib Maulana Obaidul Haq on Thursday urged people not to incite tension and not to give rise to any movement in the country centring the cartoon strip.

The Prothom Alo Editor Matiur Rahman on the same day apologised once again for the inadvertent publication of the cartoon, and urged the Muslims and their clerics to 'forgive the mistake'.

Meanwhile, UNB reported that in Chittagong yesterday about 2,000 Muslims led by Kazi Fazlul Karim, convenor of General Musalli Parishad, tried to bring out a protest march in the port city after holding a condemnation rally on the Andarkilla Mosque premises following the Juma prayer there. But they abandoned the plan at the request of police.

Security was beefed up around mosques and newsstands in Sylhet. Police arrested three -- Syed Mohidul Islam, Abdullah Al Mahmud, and Mushfiqur Rahman -- students of Shahjalal University of Engineering and Technology, while they were distributing leaflets in front of the shrine of Shajalal (Rh).

Our correspondent from Barisal reported that Imam Maulana Abdul Kadir of the local Baitul Mukarram Mosque, Maulana Sharfuddin of Saw Road Mosque demanded arrest of the editor of Aalpin and the Prothom Alo.

However, due to the vigilance of law enforcers in uniform and in plain clothes, no demonstration could take place after the prayer.

The cartoon was published on Monday, prompting the government to confiscate all copies of Aalpin's 431st issue available on the market containing the cartoon strip titled 'Naam' [name] on page six, while the authorities of the newspaper apologised for the publication of the satire, and dismissed a sub-editor in connection with it.

Law enforcement agencies arrested Arifur Rahman, the cartoonist, on September 20.

Anher
September 22, 2007, 07:17 AM
This is the problem with CTG. They could bang the students, who in most case driven by hot head rather than any political or even goal. But, they could not beat up the bastard mullahs who, we all know, looking for a political goal making an issue out of nothing.

how hard would have been to beat them up good and shut them up?

You could punish them but never can beat them. Have a look in Afganistan!!

sunnyctg
September 22, 2007, 07:53 AM
A sad incident really. Sad to see how low the tolerance of the extreemists in bd. The cartoon itself wasnt really that funny to me(as a joke/comic) but to arrest the cartoonist and putting him behind bar just for a cartoon is just way too much, its like poeple in bd going back in time instead of forwards. Much education is needed to get their mind off from the little box ..... i say.

Dream theater
September 22, 2007, 09:05 AM
....well I don't agree... actually I think the Shibir cartoon is very much to the point of this discussion... but the problem with People like you, is, you are too sensitive about that and fail to see the connection or see the connection but don't want to talk beacuse it doesn't help your cause.



Why should I? To accomodate you? Rubu the creator of this thread also see the connection. Only you don't see the connection. The Shibir Cartoon IS RELATED matters of this thread. If it hurts your feeling, may be you should avoid this thread instead.

Yes . I have to agree with you. I am very sensitive about this cartoon. I am even more sensitive about Jamat Shibir. No love lost between us.

BTW Shaad vai, You made some very good points. I strongly believe if anyone bears the responsibility for anything it should be Prothom-Alo. The poor cartoonist should not suffer the fate he is right now.

al Furqaan
September 22, 2007, 12:02 PM
Now that we're talking about imagination, it's hard to imagine that a Bangladeshi kid would go around carrying a pig in his hand. You can say that jokes are usually unrealistic, but the joke teller/cartoonist will usually try to make the imagined world resemble real world as close as possible.

true.

Why should everything must carry a great meaning or serve deep purpose? People read light jokes, chuckle if they like it and forget it within a day regardless of whether they liked it or not when they read it first.

because the point of this cartoon, at least from my (and all other BC members') viewpoint, is that we can achieve societal progress by getting people to realize the folly of their ways. is that not correct?

we all agree that the 99.99999% majority of mullahs have a strangle hold on religion and force all the ill perceptions about Islam and muslims onto the media for us.

so one would be wisest to tackle a real problem, many of which i have mentioned in my post. that would be a worthwhile cartoon. instead he chose to parody bangali naming conventions. perhaps he thought that he wouldn't get in trouble that way and still get the job done? if so, then i could agree with him even though his plan. backfired.

Who could know that some people will make mountain out of molehill over a ordinary joke?

well no one on BC is surprised about the result.

After this incident the editors will surely be more careful to ensure "political correctness" of anything they print. But is it a good thing to let political correctness dominate over common sense and general conscience?

this is a very good question, which i think needs to be debated. political correctness is the finest of tightropes...

PC is the source of most of the ire of most racist conservatives out here in the west. the argument is that PC is preventing the media and government from informing the public of the dangers and truth of "abortion, homosexuals, people of color, and muslims."

of course it is the duty of every decent, worthwhile human being to call out a spade as a spade. but one has to be careful of not to come out with blatant lies in an attempt to dehumanize others.

there are 2 extremely poignant examples of why PC actually does serve its purpose (while having obvious drawbacks): the 1930s Nazi assertions that Jews, Slavs, and gypsies were "sub-humans" and the current assertions by many that Muslim parents all over the world "hate us more than they love their children."

how many BC members hate "them" more than they love their children? any volunteers?

dehumanization at its most virulent potency.

*** i realize i went way off topic with this post despite my efforts

Eshen
September 22, 2007, 02:31 PM
As far I know, the tradition of naming your children Mohammad started in subcontinent when some subcontinental mullahs gave the fatwa that Muslims should start their names with Mohammad as opposed to Hindus starting their names with Sri so that British rulers could easily differentiate between Hindus and Muslims. I myself find it quite amusing that such obsolete tradition is still being followed, even when such naming procedure is no more required in a Muslim dominant country.

Naming your children Mohammad has nothing to do with tradition of Sahabis or later generations, very few of their children were named so. They more commonly named their children Abdullah (slave of Allah), Abdur Rahman (slave of the Rahman - another name of Allah), or other names with similar meaning , names that are somehow not that popular in our country.