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jahidus200
December 28, 2007, 12:22 AM
tamim iqbal he is really good quality player, we dont have this kind of player in test . our natinonal cricket team must needed tamim in test . he is the player who play very easily any kind of ball . i really dont understand why our national cricket team selectors dont select tamim for test . i think with tamim we could have more storng batting line up in test . and i can say that without tamim we gonna lose test by innings and runs.

AsifTheManRahman
December 28, 2007, 12:41 AM
Well, no. We can't avoid an inning defeat through the inclusion of a single player. Let him want it bad. Let him work his butt off. Let him cry for it. Let's not let him in too easily.

Besides, I still don't think he's ready for it. He has improved his game, but all that he's done so far only suggests that if he keeps up the good work, half of our opening problems in ODI's will be solved. In tests, however, we need someone to bat out almost an entire day. Can he bat for three sessions yet? I don't think so.

jahidus200
December 28, 2007, 12:57 AM
Well, no. We can't avoid an inning defeat through the inclusion of a single player. Let him want it bad. Let him work his butt off. Let him cry for it. Let's not let him in too easily.

Besides, I still don't think he's ready for it. He has improved his game, but all that he's done so far only suggests that if he keeps up the good work, half of our opening problems in ODI's will be solved. In tests, however, we need someone to bat out almost an entire day. Can he bat for three sessions yet? I don't think so.

look dude we need good player , and tamim is one of them good player who can get some run for our team . and also he played lots of 4 day matches .and its really doesnt matter how he get his runs.

haba_guba_
December 28, 2007, 01:22 AM
Well, no. We can't avoid an inning defeat through the inclusion of a single player. Let him want it bad. Let him work his butt off. Let him cry for it. Let's not let him in too easily.

Besides, I still don't think he's ready for it. He has improved his game, but all that he's done so far only suggests that if he keeps up the good work, half of our opening problems in ODI's will be solved. In tests, however, we need someone to bat out almost an entire day. Can he bat for three sessions yet? I don't think so.
nai kopala bhaat,ar apni chan briyani?

which opening batsmen in ur mind is going 2 or hav da patient 2 stay in da crease for whole day? jo? ya rite., ya he ds but he dsnt hv the ability. and u cant jus say tamaim dsnt widout giving him da oppourtinity cz he myt change for better in the test. he myt nt charge dwn da wicket as der will be no shortage of ball.

btw tamim shud be in da test

tonoy
December 28, 2007, 01:27 AM
oh thats a good one. tamim in test. what next, haba retiring?

wiseshah
December 28, 2007, 01:40 AM
jahidUS, u r from NYC right?

lamisa
December 28, 2007, 01:46 AM
i dunno bout tamim.i agree wid asifthemanrahman.let him grow hungrier,let him beg 4 it thru his prformances,den v can giv him a try.i thnk v shud try shahriar mafees.

Gowza
December 28, 2007, 02:26 AM
i wouldn't say 15 FC matches was a lot, more like next to nothing. i'd prefer to see SN and NI open in tests but if tamim keeps up the one-day consistency he has this tour then he may very well be pushing for a test spot sooner rather than later.

Spitfire_x86
December 28, 2007, 03:02 AM
Besides, I still don't think he's ready for it. He has improved his game, but all that he's done so far only suggests that if he keeps up the good work, half of our opening problems in ODI's will be solved. In tests, however, we need someone to bat out almost an entire day. Can he bat for three sessions yet? I don't think so.
Who is ready then? JO?

If he can get triple digit score, then I don't care how many hour he lasts.

al-Sagar
December 28, 2007, 03:31 AM
he and junaed should open. because they have had the feel og the condition.

Ahmed_B
December 28, 2007, 05:45 AM
Just quoting myself about BD player's test-match temperaments:

2)Their mindset is still totally overcast with the One-Day format of the game and when they are unable to get boundaries, their scoring practically stops. It results in frustration and ultimately make them gift their wickets.

3)Building a long, patient, and big innings is something still quite absent in the mindsets of our batsmen. Once again, owing to the One-Day mindset, a quick fire 50 appears more appealing to most of the batsmen. Whereas, the scale at which the batsmen must judge himself in Test matches is quite different. Occasional 50’s might make a batsman quite handy in ODI games, but its not the case for Test matches until someone has the potential to convert those 50's into occasional 100’s. The patience and the willingness to play long and according to the situation are still very much lacking in almost all the Batsmen of the team.

4)Selfishness, as I have said before, is vital for the strength of a developing team like ours. In a Test match, every batsman has to put a price to his wicket. Even it may sound stupid, but every batsman has to be stubborn not to give away his wicket before he reaches at least the half-century mark, no matter how long it takes him! Except for one or two, such a stubborn face in the team is still a rare commodity....


.....Last few words:

Test matches are highly dominated by batsmen and it’s the amount of runs scored with patience which decides the final outcome. No matter how good we bowl, it will always be impossible to get ourselves in a position from where we can even draw a match with the style and mindset of batting that the team approaches the game right now, let alone winning a match! The overall thinking scale of the team in terms of batting is still set very low, and very much in the One-Day format. For this very reason, the Bangladesh team ends up scoring a One-Dayish 250-300 runs with a One-Dayish strike rate in almost every innings of Test matches.

Unless we improve our batting by a huge margin and with proper mindset, we will only keep getting glimpses of hopes while we play a relatively weaker Test team, or only in cases when the other side has an equally bad batting-day as ours. Instead of waiting for the other team to bat poorly, we need to start batting well enough ourselves soon, unless we still want to retain our identity as ‘the whipping boys’ in Test Arena.
Full here.. (http://banglacricket.com/html/article.php?item=466)

Nafi
December 28, 2007, 06:03 AM
way too early, give him 12 more months

mahbubH
December 28, 2007, 06:28 AM
Tamim is doing ok in ODIs recently. We don't want to lose him like other promising players we had who didn't perform because they were brought too early in test arena. Even though Tamim would do better than JO in tests, we should play JO - it will help Tamim eventually.

I think giving Tamim more time to prepare for test cricket will help himself and Bangladesh.

Protic
December 28, 2007, 07:00 AM
Yeah.. we do need tamim in tests..this time around..why? not because he's maturing or stuffs.. because he's one of the in-form batsman. Simple.

sadi
December 28, 2007, 09:52 AM
Sometimes we tend to overthink. Tamim has improved his technique and leg side game a lot and he is one of the top option to open for Bangladesh right now. I know the culture of Bangladesh cricket where we ruined many young cricketers career by giving them chance way too early but I guess that doesn't quite work here. Tamim has already played odis and 20/20s and are quite familiar with the pressure and package a national team callup brings.

I know a typical test opener should have the temparament to play a long innings preferrably playing out the whole day but when we have such a dearth of openers, we need to pick the best out of all other mediocre option we have. Tamim has more probability of scoring a fifty or even a ton then say Javed Omar in a test match in New Zealand. Tamim is in super nick, has already familiarized himself with the kiwi condition and this is the time, he opens with Shahriar Nafees. Bye bye Javed Omar.

BangladeshFan
December 28, 2007, 10:20 AM
between tamim and JO, its not even a contest. Tamim is scoring runs, he has a measure of the Nz bowlers and conditions. True he has problems rotating the strike in ODIs but in tests he doesnt have to worry about it. he may have some weakness against short bowling, but he is more likely to score big rather than JO.

I think its more between the other opener(SN?) and JO.

Protic
December 28, 2007, 10:29 AM
Between SN AND JO.. I'd definately..rather everyone will go for SN first up..yeah JO if SN doesnt performs.

Rifat
December 28, 2007, 10:36 AM
i vote yes! :) but as Gowza and ATMR said it is not necessary, let Javed Omar and Nafees settle themselves and see how far they take us in terms of opening in tests but adding Tamim now could be a good idea on paper but i often wonder why we keep adding pressure to batsmen? let him focus on ODI's for some more time!

Protic
December 28, 2007, 10:45 AM
BTW is aftab one of the players returning after ODI?

Bengaliprince176
December 28, 2007, 11:01 AM
needs more time...as ATMR said, test match mentality different. he's still got a while to go, deffo for the future tho

DJ Sahastra
December 28, 2007, 11:07 AM
Tamim for the test - Absolutely. Look at it this way - even if a few of his streaky shots race to teh boundary, you have a good start.

Anher
December 28, 2007, 11:27 AM
So far in NZ Tamim have got 1 century and 1 50 and 1 40+ innings in bag. Probably the best batting performance in whole bd team. Provided that he suited well in tough NZ seaming condition.

Why on earth you will leave only in form batsman???

Eshen
December 28, 2007, 11:55 AM
Sometimes we tend to overthink. Tamim has improved his technique and leg side game a lot and he is one of the top option to open for Bangladesh right now. I know the culture of Bangladesh cricket where we ruined many young cricketers career by giving them chance way too early but I guess that doesn't quite work here. Tamim has already played odis and 20/20s and are quite familiar with the pressure and package a national team callup brings.

I know a typical test opener should have the temparament to play a long innings preferrably playing out the whole day but when we have such a dearth of openers, we need to pick the best out of all other mediocre option we have. Tamim has more probability of scoring a fifty or even a ton then say Javed Omar in a test match in New Zealand. Tamim is in super nick, has already familiarized himself with the kiwi condition and this is the time, he opens with Shahriar Nafees. Bye bye Javed Omar.
Ditto, bye bye Javed Omar.

Not only Tamim, I would also keep Zunaed to fill up the one-down position. My team would be-

SN
Tamim
Zunaed
Ash
Aftab
Tushar/Rajin/Mehrab
Mushfiq
Razzak
Mashrafe
Shahadat
Sajid (May be we can try Enamul in the 2nd test in Wellington)

sadi
December 28, 2007, 11:59 AM
Ditto, bye bye Javed Omar.

Not only Tamim, I would also keep Zunaed to fill up the one-down position. My team would be-

SN
Tamim
Zunaed
Ash
Aftab
Tushar/Rajin/Mehrab
Mushfiq
Razzak
Mashrafe
Shahadat
Sajid (May be we can try Enamul in the 2nd test in Wellington)

Your team looks quite good. I will only have one change where I will play Sakib at number 6. I will take Sakib over Mehrab or Tushar any given day.

One World
December 28, 2007, 12:04 PM
Ditto, bye bye Javed Omar.

Not only Tamim, I would also keep Zunaed to fill up the one-down position. My team would be-

SN
Tamim
Zunaed
Ash
Aftab
Tushar/Rajin/Mehrab
Mushfiq
Razzak
Mashrafe
Shahadat
Sajid (May be we can try Enamul in the 2nd test in Wellington)


Recent test performances indicate if there is rain, there is hope of a draw. Include JO and do not replace him with Tamim. You got one extra session. Include Bashar and Rajin, do not bring in Zunaed. You got another session. A three day match will now end right around lunch of 4th day.

As a fan I want gritty players, who will ensure they want to stick around, will never give their wicket for own mistakes, will not get run out (fear HB, trying to makeover one Inzi record) and make runs even if no boundaries. If we cannot play 2 sedate innings in both test against this bowling attack then critics asking for status will be humping allover.

Eshen
December 28, 2007, 12:10 PM
Siddons' post match comment on Tamim and Zunaed -
On Tamim Iqbal who made 43

I love the look of him, I love the look of Zunaed. Both openers have impressed me a lot. Big futures there I think. They are getting good starts. They are not intimidated and not worried by the moving ball. The first three batsmen are really firing at the moment.

http://tigercricket.com/viewNews.aspx?newsID=482
I highly suspect he is sending those two boys home.

Tigers_eye
December 28, 2007, 12:11 PM
The four coming back should be
Junaed: (make ODI lineup permanent first)
Aftab: (More punishment is needed)
Mehrab Jr.: (Not ODI material nor test material)
Forhad: (More work needed, not ready for the longer version as of yet)

That way the lineup can be (management thinking)
Tamim/JO
SN
Rajin
Ash
Bashar
Shakib
Mushi
Mash
A. Razzak
Shahadat
Enam Jr./Shajidul/nazmul

Eshen
December 28, 2007, 12:34 PM
Recent test performances indicate if there is rain, there is hope of a draw. Include JO and do not replace him with Tamim. You got one extra session. Include Bashar and Rajin, do not bring in Zunaed. You got another session. A three day match will now end right around lunch of 4th day.
Dude, the test matches will be played on traditional NZ seaming wickets, not the flat tracks that you have seen during ODIs. So, if you still want to indulge in the delusion that JO and Rajin (HB is a spent force as far I am concerned) can survive longer here than Tamim and Zunaed can, well, I don't know what to tell you.

As a fan I want gritty players, who will ensure they want to stick around, will never give their wicket for own mistakes, will not get run out (fear HB, trying to makeover one Inzi record) and make runs even if no boundaries. If we cannot play 2 sedate innings in both test against this bowling attack then critics asking for status will be humping allover.
Probably it's time we get out of the fear what if this or that happens. Bangladesh is in international cricket for ten years now, and she has shown all the indications that she is here to stay. I don't think ICC is unreasonable enough to take away our test status now based on what few silly guys may say.

Also, if you want to earn some respect from critics, couple of sessions of dodgy batting or a washout won't do the trick, rather you need a couple of sessions of sound batting display.

All those gritts or whatever you are talking about got us nothing but defeats after defeats (big ones), it's high time we take a different approach.

Russell2k7
December 28, 2007, 12:38 PM
T & Z is needed for the test match. Tamim is way better batsman than JO. Heck I'd include Aftab in there too. Atleast they have the qualification to be batsman.

sadi
December 28, 2007, 01:03 PM
I know it was a flat track. I know it was an odi. But the way both openers played against the kiwi seamers, it was a treat to watch. They were very comfortable and hardly missed anything. These two batsmen, Tamim and Zunaed are technically miles ahead of Javed Omar and should get a chance ahead of him. Maybe we can sit Zunaed if we want to go for Shahriar Nafees but Javed Omar has no business playing right now. I had no problem with him when we were out of option but it certainly not the case now.

Beamer
December 28, 2007, 01:23 PM
Eshen

I was thinking along the same line as well. I think Zunaid can play at no.3 in tests. He has a good technique, has patience ( not counting the two lofted this series ) and at the same time knows where his off stumps are and can attack, all virtues needed for a test no.3. SN is also a must for me. You can't tell me that there are six batsmen better than SN in Bangladesh. Tamim has vastly improved his on side technique though he still goes fishing outside off. Saying that, he is still better and viable option than JO, even in tests. Siddons also has taken a liking for those two ( Aussies like those type of players ), plus, he thinks he can work with them because of the raw nature of their young talent and both have a tremendous upswing. JO is more than bye bye. Nice excursion to NZ !

My test team looks like this : SN, TI, Z, Ash, Rajin/Mehrab, Aftab, Mushy, Raj, Mash, Rajib, Sajid ( gotta have three pacers in NZ, plus he is a lefty, added variety )

One World
December 28, 2007, 01:55 PM
Dude, the test matches will be played on traditional NZ seaming wickets, not the flat tracks that you have seen during ODIs. So, if you still want to indulge in the delusion that JO and Rajin (HB is a spent force as far I am concerned) can survive longer here than Tamim and Zunaed can, well, I don't know what to tell you.

I think you got islands of thoughts which needs some synergistic approach to bring in conclusion. How much experience do you think Tamim and Z possess so they can produce miracles in a away test match under seaming condition. Mushfik has better advantage on paper.


Probably it's time we get out of the fear what if this or that happens. Bangladesh is in international cricket for ten years now, and she has shown all the indications that she is here to stay. I don't think ICC is unreasonable enough to take away our test status now based on what few silly guys may say.

Also, if you want to earn some respect from critics, couple of sessions of dodgy batting or a washout won't do the trick, rather you need a couple of sessions of sound batting display.

All those gritts or whatever you are talking about got us nothing but defeats after defeats (big ones), it's high time we take a different approach.

Are not we looking at the same point from different angle? Defeat, yes again awaits. Respectable test performance needs to be appear and your non-delusive look must not miss the fact that the NZ bowling is below parr.

This is a great opportunity to post some individual milestone. From Ahmed_B's quote above:

Test matches are highly dominated by batsmen and it’s the amount of runs scored with patience which decides the final outcome.

zainab
December 29, 2007, 07:52 AM
Look at the way Sri Lanka and India have played in tests lately against Australia. also England against Sri Lanka, now look what the windians are doing to SA.
Being bundled out for less than 200 against a strong team is not very shameful anymore, it has happened to the best teams. SA, No2 team bundled out for less than 200 runs against a No 8 team.
Sri Lanka and India could not take the game into the 5th day.No one is talking about taking away their test status. BD should try and score more than 300 runs in any innings here, avoid an innings defeat and take it into the 5th day.
BD may win a Test match within 2 years, but i cannot see it happening before. It took NZ 26 yrs to win a Test match.
I just feel that with JS as coach, performance will improve.

Sohel
December 29, 2007, 11:22 AM
Looks like he will be opening in tests after all, as strongly insinuated by PA after they talked to Coach Siddons. The Coach expects a big performance from the Big Z in the final ODI, and if he manages to deliver as expected, I think we'll see both Tamim and the Big Z opening ... :)

One World
December 29, 2007, 11:33 AM
Look at the way Sri Lanka and India have played in tests lately against Australia. also England against Sri Lanka, now look what the windians are doing to SA.
Being bundled out for less than 200 against a strong team is not very shameful anymore, it has happened to the best teams. SA, No2 team bundled out for less than 200 runs against a No 8 team.
Sri Lanka and India could not take the game into the 5th day.No one is talking about taking away their test status.

Patronizing complacency by comparing BD with other test nations has already created dents and damages in our prolonged test history. Its only 5th day and 5th day it is. BD players need to keep their heads down. Nobody wants an innings defeat. If Ash and Mash want to continue their fireworks like they did against India in Mirpur please choose an ODI or even T20 better. This bowling attack w/t Bond is a good anchoring point where BD test batting should take a one eighty degree turn.

Spitfire_x86
December 29, 2007, 11:54 AM
Patronizing complacency by comparing BD with other test nations has already created dents and damages in our prolonged test history. Its only 5th day and 5th day it is. BD players need to keep their heads down. Nobody wants an innings defeat. If Ash and Mash want to continue their fireworks like they did against India in Mirpur please choose an ODI or even T20 better. This bowling attack w/t Bond is a good anchoring point where BD test batting should take a one eighty degree turn.
This is what Ian Chappel has to say about Test batting
As a fielding captain, once runs are being scored, you have to take fielders out of catching positions and put them in run-saving positions. Once you do that, as the batting side, you are making your chances of surviving a lot better.

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/talk/content/multimedia/328064.html?view=transcript

One World
December 29, 2007, 12:30 PM
The problem is while playing Bangladesh in test no team except Zim has to worry about batsman's mistake. RSA executed similar plan in WC ODI match and HB took the full advantage of that. Credit to our spinners.

Chappell and Sunny are talking about AUS and INDIA and Chappel is actually asking IND playing at this level how logical it is. Now that's funny.

We all want to see runs happening, top batsmen are performing well, keeping their wickets, placing a mammoth total and lowering the margin of gap while chasing to a minimum if not topping. If you look at this score
http://content-usa.cricinfo.com/bangladesh/engine/match/282692.html

and ask any cricket expert they would say, "What in the seventh heaven middle order was thinking?" Ash and Rajin should have stayed and made it to lunch next day. Then add that lower order performance, you have a big competing score on the board although the match was finished.

Opponent 3 wicket vs Host 20 wickets and still 239 runs short. This kind of execution should be stopped sooner the better.

AsifTheManRahman
December 29, 2007, 12:46 PM
Who is ready then? JO?

Of course, he's always ready. :)

jahidus200
December 29, 2007, 01:26 PM
The problem is while playing Bangladesh in test no team except Zim has to worry about batsman's mistake. RSA executed similar plan in WC ODI match and HB took the full advantage of that. Credit to our spinners.

Chappell and Sunny are talking about AUS and INDIA and Chappel is actually asking IND playing at this level how logical it is. Now that's funny.

We all want to see runs happening, top batsmen are performing well, keeping their wickets, placing a mammoth total and lowering the margin of gap while chasing to a minimum if not topping. If you look at this score
http://content-usa.cricinfo.com/bangladesh/engine/match/282692.html

and ask any cricket expert they would say, "What in the seventh heaven middle order was thinking?" Ash and Rajin should have stayed and made it to lunch next day. Then add that lower order performance, you have a big competing score on the board although the match was finished.

Opponent 3 wicket vs Host 20 wickets and still 239 runs short. This kind of execution should be stopped sooner the better.

good one bro .

jahidus200
December 29, 2007, 01:35 PM
jahidUS, u r from NYC right?

yes bro i am from nyc , usa

Spitfire_x86
December 29, 2007, 01:42 PM
[QUOTE]Chappell and Sunny are talking about AUS and INDIA and Chappel is actually asking IND playing at this level how logical it is. Now that's funny.
The statement I quoted was not specific to that particular game, it's more like a maxim. And last time I checked, India, Australia and BD were playing in the same level, which is TEST level. If you are going to play test cricket in this age, you can't do it in 50's style. If a team plays with the mentality to survive right from the start, in almost all cases that team will lose and lose badly.

and ask any cricket expert they would say, "What in the seventh heaven middle order was thinking?" Ash and Rajin should have stayed and made it to lunch next day. Then add that lower order performance, you have a big competing score on the board although the match was finished.
I watched that match, and I saw how both of them were dismissed. You could say Rajin gave his wicket away, because he played that shot even though there was a fielder placed at long-on. Ash's dismissal was purely unfortunate case of wrong shot placement, which can happen even when a batsman is not scoring that fast. All of the shots he played in that innings were clean cricket shots, and his SR was very high because of aggressive Indian field placement, which resulted in many of those shots being converted into boundaries.

Opponent 3 wicket vs Host 20 wickets and still 239 runs short. This kind of execution should be stopped sooner the better.
They couldn't score so many runs for only 3 wickets if we had better and in-form bowlers. Plus its always harder to bat when you are trailing by so many runs in the first innings, for it allows the opposition to bowl and field very aggressively and the mental pressure it creates on the batting side.

One World
December 29, 2007, 03:12 PM
I watched the match too and I believe Ash even Mash played two superb innings. But the mix of defense with offense was lacking which made it an ODI-like performance.

I read the article and I found it funny when Chapel mentioned about India's playing level.

They couldn't score so many runs for only 3 wickets if we had better and in-form bowlers. Plus its always harder to bat when you are trailing by so many runs in the first innings, for it allows the opposition to bowl and field very aggressively and the mental pressure it creates on the batting side.


You definitely want a change to that. I do.