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View Full Version : tait's delivery stride compared with shahadat's


al Furqaan
January 14, 2008, 12:49 PM
i remember there was a thread about shahadat, losing a lot of bounce factor in his bowling because of is collapsed knee.

surprisinly shaun tait (IMO current world's fastest bowler) also has this problem. he's slightly taller than rajib, 6-4, and far more muscular...

does anyone know if tait extracts the kind of bounce that a prototypical fast bowler should get?

http://www.abc.net.au/reslib/200704/r137554_468125.jpg

Tigers_eye
January 14, 2008, 01:03 PM
Tait's upper body strength is many fold more than Shahadat. Bowlers generate pace through their thighs. Shahadat'r kathi'r moto shorir. Strength condition coach dorkar.

LateCut
January 14, 2008, 01:40 PM
I am a mechanical engineer. So I will answer this from this perspective. The velocity at which the ball leaves the wrist is a combination of two vectors. One generated by arm and another by the running speed. Now the fastest humans (sprinters) can generate only about 20mph running. By no means Shahadat can run that fast. I will give him 15mph (considering other aspects of releasing the ball). Remaining 65mph or more has come from the slingshot motion of the arm. The energy of this comes from the shoulder and arm muscles (and to a lesser degree from the wrist). I think there is al lot of bio-mechanics involved in transferring the kinetic energy of the arm to the ball. There is a research done on baseball pitchers (who do not run in yet routinely generate 90mph balls). It claims that there is an optimum (height and jerk(?)). The point is improving the technique of momentum transfer and upper body strength (shoulder, arm and cuff) should help

LateCut
January 14, 2008, 01:47 PM
The height is not bowelers height. It is the height of the ball at the point of release. Highs speed videos confirmed that the speed of the ball is same as the absolute speed of the wrist at the time of release. Lot of inefficiencies come from not releasing the ball at he highest speed and losses in the release. So, we will see with good technique one can bowl faster than a seemingly stronger person.

Russell2k7
January 14, 2008, 01:58 PM
The reason Baseball players generate 90 to 95mph on a daily basis is because they CHUCK. Tell them to swing their arm in 360-degree fasion and see how fast they can pitch.

Kuddus
January 14, 2008, 02:04 PM
I thought this might be interesting: Australian legendary fast bowler Jeff Thompson had the following to say...

When they timed me around the 161Ks, that was done at the batting end. These guys today are timed at the bowlers' end. Who's standing two metres in front of a bowler facing the ball? Nobody. They're trying to make them look as quick as us. We were timed further down the pitch, where it slows down. If they had timed me out of the hand, it would have been close to 180Ks.

Farhad
January 14, 2008, 02:08 PM
I thought this might be interesting: Australian legendary fast bowler Jeff Thompson had the following to say...

When they timed me around the 161Ks, that was done at the batting end. These guys today are timed at the bowlers' end. Who's standing two metres in front of a bowler facing the ball? Nobody. They're trying to make them look as quick as us. We were timed further down the pitch, where it slows down. If they had timed me out of the hand, it would have been close to 180Ks.

:notworthy: 180Ks?? Gee, that guys full of himself...

Kuddus
January 14, 2008, 02:09 PM
haha Farhad he is an Aussie after all!!!

Nafi
January 14, 2008, 04:34 PM
One generated by arm and another by the running speed. Now the fastest humans (sprinters) can generate only about 20mph running. By no means Shahadat can run that fast. I will give him 15mph (considering other aspects of releasing the ball). Remaining 65mph or more has come from the slingshot motion of the arm.p

Mate, running speed has no significant influence on bowling speed whatsoever.

This is because of hang time, the run up is meant to gather momentum, then everything slows as the momentum is gathered into a hang time, (for most bowlers this is the jump)

At this moment the body's speed is less than 5mph.

So really running speed has nothing to do with bowling fast, if you sprinted in your run up, you would probably bowl ten wides before you injure yourself.

Bowling speed is all-about, gathering momentum into an explosion of power.

Nafi
January 14, 2008, 04:38 PM
The reason Baseball players generate 90 to 95mph on a daily basis is because they CHUCK. Tell them to swing their arm in 360-degree fasion and see how fast they can pitch.

No offense but who the HELL BOWLS THE with the ARM EXTENDED FOR THE FULL 360 DEGREES

Orion
January 14, 2008, 04:53 PM
Shahahdat impressed me a lot lately...with his endurance and fighting attitude but I am concerned at his lack of pace. He usually bowls at around 125-135...with a few exceptions where he reaches 140-142. He should be bowling at around 140-145 in a few years if he wants to be a good paceman and trouble opposition because we need some out and out fast bowlers and it is not too much to ask since Farhad Reza has been bowling at the mid 130s.

al Furqaan
January 14, 2008, 04:55 PM
No offense but who the HELL BOWLS THE with the ARM EXTENDED FOR THE FULL 360 DEGREES

nonetheless, pitchers chuck...if they had proper bowling actions, with no run up, they would be slower than aftab.

IMO, the two actions - baseball pitching and cricket bowling - are 2 completely and inherently uncomparable things.


but i did enjoy latecut's vector analysis. but let us look at newtons 2nd law perhaps. that mass = force X accelration.

if we can find the acceleration of the ball, with initial acceleration being that at release point and final acceleration at time of highest velocity. we can easily calculate the force needed to attain that acceleration.

which muscles generate that force is a different matter.

Nafi
January 14, 2008, 05:09 PM
Well the muscles involved are many, in my action, the muscles of the non bowling arm (which is the rudder of the bowl) are involved, the shoulder neck muscle is tightened and very short, the triceps and biceps are involved somewhat, legs muscle are very important, the front leg is very important in helping the transfer of power.


but the main muscle is the back muscle the trapezius muscle

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2d/Trapezius_Gray409.PNG/250px-Trapezius_Gray409.PNG

With shahadat's lanky frame, he is not gonna get much out of having a collapsed knee, as pace isnt really he's strong suit.

Sovik
January 14, 2008, 05:15 PM
if i am not mistaken, i read somewhere, may it was shane warne who said its not only the shoulder or thigh that generate more speed. to ball faster you need to have a big A**. just look at Lee, Akhter, Flitoff and their A**es.

P.S- I am not a G*Y

Nafi
January 14, 2008, 05:17 PM
if i am not mistaken, i read somewhere, may it was shane warne who said its not only the shoulder or thigh that generate more speed. to ball faster you need to have a big A**. just look at Lee, Akhter, Flitoff and their A**es.

P.S- I am not a G*Y

LMAO!!!!!!!! Seriously where did you read that

Sovik
January 14, 2008, 05:22 PM
LMAO!!!!!!!! Seriously where did you read that

can't remember but i think i read that or watched or i just don't remember anything

Nafi
January 14, 2008, 05:24 PM
Well I have to admit the rear half of the buttocks is very tense in the action :lol:

Sovik
January 14, 2008, 05:30 PM
Well I have to admit the rear half of the buttocks is very tense in the action :lol:


i really wanted to say something from a movie but couldn't. its a PG rated forum

Sohel
January 14, 2008, 05:41 PM
I’m no expert in bio mechanics, but from years of doing Kendo and playing ice/inline hockey, I’d guess that his high slingshot action has a lot to do with it. Any type of slingshot action locks the elbow and necessitates additional torque and therefore brings the lower back into play more prominently in addition to the traps and shoulders. The most powerful blows and shots also feature the lower back in both Kendo and ice/inline hockey.

Interesting that Jeff Thomson was also a slinger.

kp348
January 14, 2008, 06:10 PM
can't remember but i think i read that or watched or i just don't remember anything

or may be u were dreaming about those............:D

Ishtylish cricketer
January 14, 2008, 06:25 PM
if i am not mistaken, i read somewhere, may it was shane warne who said its not only the shoulder or thigh that generate more speed. to ball faster you need to have a big A**. just look at Lee, Akhter, Flitoff and their A**es.

P.S- I am not a G*Y

That's preposturous! Akhter and Freddie have huge bodies and thus their "A**es" are big as well. Just like if you are tall your limbs will be taller or bigger. To bowl fast you need a strong upper body and flexible arms. A big butt may play a role in stabilizing the landing (though I seriously doubt that) but it can also be a disadvantage because big weight puts lot of pressure on the ankle and knees making the big butted players injury prone.

Russell2k7
January 14, 2008, 06:46 PM
IMO Tait also chucks a little http://http://youtube.com/watch?v=LrBYjfLo0zY (http://youtube.com/watch?v=LrBYjfLo0zY). Well it does make sense that being a bit more muscular should help you to bowl faster but Shadat already has good speed being lanky. Indian Ishant Sharma is even more lankier but he too have good speed of around 138K-140K.

abu2abu
January 15, 2008, 10:47 AM
IMO Tait also chucks a little http://http://youtube.com/watch?v=LrBYjfLo0zY (http://youtube.com/watch?v=LrBYjfLo0zY). Well it does make sense that being a bit more muscular should help you to bowl faster but Shadat already has good speed being lanky. Indian Ishant Sharma is even more lankier but he too have good speed of around 138K-140K.

i think all bowlers chuck a little...Tait's great though isn't he?...