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chinaman
December 28, 2003, 02:47 PM
Check out the following site. Somehow, they used bangla fonts exclusively without downloading fonts or the pdf thing.

http://www.banglalive.com/

Any idea as to how they accomplised this? May be in the future we'll have a bangla section of our own.

Arnab
December 28, 2003, 03:11 PM
I had a thread about it in the staff forum a few weeks ago and explained how it works (well, originally I did the same thing last october in the old messageborard, too). Why don't you read that thread again?

[Edited on 28-12-2003 by Arnab]

chinaman
December 28, 2003, 04:16 PM
If I remember it correctly, nobody explained what a webfont is or how it works or how to instruct the browser to download it or even if there are ways to walk arround....

Wheather we impliment bangla here or not, it's always nice to know how bangla web pages can be built efficiently.

I'm sure there might be experts out there among our members who might shed some lights.

Arnab
December 28, 2003, 04:38 PM
I am one of those experts, in fact, I am the only one here who actually tried to do something with it. Although it was a while ago, before you even joined this board. :)

Webfonts are embedded in the webpage. They are also called embedded fonts. These font files reside only on the remote server in the same directory as the webpage. When somebody loads a page that utilizes some embedded font, the embedded font is automatically downloaded and implemented by the browser from the remote server on the fly. The font is not going to be installed on your local machine. It always resides on the server. So no burden of downloading a font. It's all handled by the browser.

If you are the creator of the webpage, you need to create an embedded font for your own webpage. You have to use the micrsoft free software WEFT to do that. There was another program from another company, but it folded recently. Then you have to incorporate that embeedded font in your webpage using a css style code.

Search on Google for embedded fonts. There are a few hands-on, step-by-step tutorials on this very subject, I am sure.

Prothom Alo and Bhorer Kagoj have been using embedded fonts for their websites for months now.


[Edited on 28-12-2003 by Arnab]

Orpheus
December 28, 2003, 05:39 PM
Chinaman, I am curious.. I always wanted to know about you....

-your age
-what you do (student?)

actually thats all I wanted to know.... :) Wanna share....... oh yeah.....
are you married?

[Edited on 29-12-2003 by Orpheus : I wasted my 500th post on you! I better get an answer...]

chinaman
December 28, 2003, 07:21 PM
Thank you Arnab for the explanation.

Well, Orpheus, let's play the hide and seek game, OK? Answers to your questions are available in this site in "appropriate" places. I'm sure you'll find it, if not, u2u me. Have fun.

Orpheus
December 28, 2003, 07:38 PM
well it's hard to read every single thing on this messageboard... and I doubt if anyone does it....

anyways, got your age and location.... but what do you do though...

NOrmally I wouldn't care but the only reason why I am asking is cuz you have so much fxxxxxxxxxxxx time on your hand..... How does a man in your age get that - just wondering .... amazing!

chinaman
December 28, 2003, 07:43 PM
Lucky me, isn't it?

Orpheus
December 28, 2003, 08:01 PM
well not really unless you think you are...

anyways, lets stick to cricket!

Mahmood
December 29, 2003, 10:30 AM
We can use Bangla font to build a site that wont need downloading. However, the main question is, who will do it? write and maintain the Bangla articles?

It seems lot more work than simply writing an English article.

chinaman
December 29, 2003, 11:38 AM
One possible way to contribute bangla article is to copy-n-paste from Bhorer Kagoj and likes. At the begining we may opt to update it on an irregular basis (once in a week or even month). It has potential to increase traffic.

Arnab
December 29, 2003, 12:21 PM
Can't copy-paste. The embedded font only works when it resides on the same server as the webpage. When the font is created, the location of html files that can use the font is specified by the creator.

[Edited on 29-12-2003 by Arnab]

Arnab
December 29, 2003, 12:40 PM
Originally posted by Rajputro
However, the main question is, who will do it? write and maintain the Bangla articles?

It seems lot more work than simply writing an English article.

One way (and in my opinion the best) to quickly write bangla article is this:

1. Use a transliteration banla software to write bangla articles on the fly. Example: bangsee. It's supereasy to use. We do the same thing all the time here on this board.

Whenever we want to write something in Bangla, we just write something like this:

Ami bangla bhashai likhte pocchondo kori.

The transliteration software such as Bangsee converts the above "Bangla-written-in-english-letters" to actual Bangla font-based "Bangla-in-bangla"on the fly. There are some rules of course, but it's minimal and extremely intuitive.

2. Write Bangla articles in using a transliteration wordprocessor. Save it as a webpage.

3. The webmaster of banglacricket will create an embedded font from the one used in the transliteration software.

4. Upload the webpage with the article on Banglacricket server in the directory where the font is. And voila! Read articles in Bangla.

-------------------------------

Writers don't need to worry about anything but writing articles on their transliteration software and saving them as webpages and then send/email the file to the administrator.

-------------------------------

Caveat:

Transliteration softwares like Bangsee are not free. There was another software called Bornosoft (Our Rafiq Bhai actually donated for that project) which is supposed to be free. I will check.

chinaman
December 29, 2003, 12:46 PM
So there's no way to copy quotes from other sites like we do in english everyday here?

Arnab
December 29, 2003, 12:55 PM
There's no need to quote, you can just give us the link to the webpage.

Of course quoting relevant parts would have been great, but that's not possible. We as a nation are backward gadhas, so we don't have a stable protocol for web-based bangla and bangla-reading capability is not included in any browser.

The only way to quote relevant sections is to take a screen shot of the thing (or crop out the relevant section if it is a pdf), save it as a gif/jpeg and then upload the gif/jpeg as attachment, like Raj bhai and some others have been doing. I personally think that's pretty lame, but that's the only choice we have now.

Or, as I said, you can link to the article. That makes more sense to me. We don't need to reproduce and read the whole news here. Linking is enough.

[Edited on 29-12-2003 by Arnab]

Arnab
December 29, 2003, 01:53 PM
I just created a bangla webpage using an embedded bangla font. I used Bornosoft as the transliteration software. Should look fine on Internet Explorer.

Here you go:

link removed

[Edited on 30-12-2003 by Arnab]

Orpheus
December 29, 2003, 01:55 PM
Bornosoft is the best.... very flexible too... by flexible I mean it allows different "spelling" for the same word. It's not free... I used the free one... it's crap, in order to write Bangladesh... you have to spell it differently...

anyways, ....I just wanted to say..

My friend cracked Bornosoft after he got pissed at the guy who wouldn't give him another key for his laptop.

He is no cracker... 1st year in computer Engineering. So arnab, you should be able to do it too...... :)

hint: they used VB to create that! Muahahhahaha

p.s. Please dont' ask me to provide you the software.. and a key.. I WoNT! I don't like to stick bamboo to my fellow Bangladeshi brother who is trying to make a living........... He is no microsoft! But I can however write you guys articles :)

[Edited on 29-12-2003 by Orpheus]

[Edited on 29-12-2003 by Orpheus : arnab already using bornosoft?? free?? it's the non-savable version right?]

Orpheus
December 29, 2003, 02:00 PM
It didn't come out ARnab.... i only see some nonsense..

Arnab
December 29, 2003, 02:04 PM
Hmm..interesting. You're right. I must have coded something wrong.

Lemme fix that.

chinaman
December 29, 2003, 02:30 PM
Originally posted by Orpheus

Please dont' ask me to provide you the software.. and a key.. I WoNT! I don't like to stick bamboo to my fellow Bangladeshi brother who is trying to make a living........... He is no microsoft! But I can however write you guys articles :)


That's huge, Orph. My salute to you. And your willingness to write is a much needed welcome news. Two thumbs up.

Orpheus
December 29, 2003, 02:44 PM
ACtually waht I meant was - you would write the article... like

"Amar shonar bangla.. keno baare bare haare"

I would just run that through the software. You sure don't want me to write articles and that too in bangla... that's a disaster waiting to happen!

bhobishshot
December 29, 2003, 03:00 PM
These webfont pages don't work with mozilla.

[Edited on 29-12-2003 by bhobishshot]

[Edited on 29-12-2003 by bhobishshot]

Arnab
December 29, 2003, 03:48 PM
1. The webfont should work now, albeit one or two letters are corrupted. I'll fix that.

2. Bhobishshot, as of now, they will only work on IE and Opera. Can you view prothom-alo articles on Mozilla?

Orpheus
December 29, 2003, 04:07 PM

Arnab
December 29, 2003, 04:13 PM
Hmm. It works on my housemate's PC on IE6. Try reloading the page. If still doesn't work, empty your cache and relaod again. Tell me what you saw.

chinaman
December 29, 2003, 04:18 PM
This is what all I see even after clearing cache:

bala Baxaet lKa Kub kifn ikCuna| Pa lFa bNsPF idey ileKiC|

Arnab
December 29, 2003, 04:38 PM
Should work. I was just able to open it on my library's PC using IE.

That's two different machines than my home PC.

Try the new link:

link removed



[Edited on 30-12-2003 by Arnab]

chinaman
December 29, 2003, 05:03 PM
Worked.

Arnab
December 29, 2003, 05:13 PM
Awesome. Now let me write a full blown article and use some formatting. Will upload that shortly.

Mahmood
December 29, 2003, 06:19 PM
It doesnt work for me. I see weird characters.

Arnab
December 29, 2003, 07:51 PM
Yeah that webpage won't work anymore. I deleted the embedded font file for that one. I have made a webpage with more bangla this time:

http://banglacricket.com/Tours/bangladesha1.htm


What do you guys think?

[Edited on 30-12-2003 by Arnab]

chinaman
December 29, 2003, 08:51 PM
Great piece of work! Extra space between letters in a single word here and there proly reflects typos rather than gliches I think. Bangla fonts look better on print than on screen.

Arnab
December 29, 2003, 08:56 PM
Extra space between letters in a single word here and there proly reflects typos rather than gliches I think.

Program glitches, not typos.

Can be solved later.

Nasif
December 30, 2003, 02:23 AM
Its amazing that being a FULL COUNTRY we can't get true ISO Bangla UNICODE character set. The current UNICODE Bangla character set is done by kolkata public! Just shows the sad state of our government. They want to do all sorts of things for advancement of Bangla language, they made 21st February into International Mother Language. What did that achieve? Nothing but some propagada for the government.

The Arabic UNICODE set, even though it reads from right to left, is perfectly there. And my browser, both Mozilla and IE, shows Arabic perfectly. My Moziall and IE shows all chinese, just cosider that chinese language have move than 1000 characters in them!

We are worlds 7th most spoken most language! And yet we will be the last to completely implement into computer.

Take a look at Microsoft's offcial CRAPPY unicode Bangla keyboard layout http://www.microsoft.com/globaldev/keyboards/kbdinben.htm
Based on Indian INSCRIPT layout!

More on Unicode and Bangla:
http://www.banglakoi.tk
http://www.ekushey.org/unicode.html

On technical level Bangla is in Middle Ages! :(

Edit:
http://www.unicode.org/charts/PDF/U0980.pdf
Did a little more digging. Here is the proposed crappy Unicode chart. Look at the chart of characters. WHO_THE_F uses "9kar" and double "9Kar" (also known as "lee-kar")? Its on position 0x09E1-0x09E3. The guy who proposed this $hit (pardon my language) was on phensidyl. There are 128 positions (0x0980-0x09FF) availalbe for Bangla. Where the hell is all the jukto font? People who designed this don't know bangla or they don't care. Looks to me like they took "Shonamoni-der Ao, Aa, Ka, Kha" book and copied the fonts mindlessly into unicode standard. :mad:

Bangla bhashar dharok ebong bahok holo Bangladesh. Taholey Kolkata, India thekey keno Bangla unicode jabey? :mad:

[Edited on 30-12-2003 by nasif]

Arnab
December 30, 2003, 12:23 PM
Yeah, when I started doing this, Unicode was my first instinct. I even downloaded a couple of Bangla Unicode word processors.

But, they lack the Juktakkhors. It's a huge drawback. Realistically, Bangla doesn't just have 50 letters. Counting the juktakkhors, it requires around 215 characters/glyphs for proper printing.

The current Bangla fonts that claim themselves to be Unicode compatible match the vowels and consonants in the actual unicode and then add the juktakkhors by replacing some other language's characters.

I actually made my own unicode Bangla font a year back using a font maker software. But, as long as there are no unicode standards including juktakkhors, I figured there's no use of that.

Arnab
December 30, 2003, 12:31 PM
Bangla bhashar dharok ebong bahok holo Bangladesh. Taholey Kolkata, India thekey keno Bangla unicode jabey?

That is just lame. Why do we need to bash them? West Bengal does have a sizable Bengali population, and clearly some people there have thought about this before us. For India, Bangla is just another Indic Script, no different from Hindi, Asamese and others and they all look quite the same.

Admit it, WE are backward gadhas to not have stood up for our own language.

Actually, hindi, the world's fifth largetst language is also in the same place as bangla. They can't use their unicode to print anything. They have to use transliteration software and use web embedded fonts just like us. The reason why Hindi didn't develop is the widespread use of English in India.

Nasif
December 30, 2003, 04:13 PM
Arnab man, I don't know if you read the post or not. In the whole post I was trying to say that it was our fault, mainly our government's fault. Being the fools that we are, we let our neighbors decide our language. Bangla doesn't deserve the same status as Karnatak, Asamese, Gujrati, Punjabi etc. Because it is a national language of a country, and we should have been the one who decided how it is in unicode. Unfortunately we are bunch of fools who like to sing "Ekushey" and do nothing. The last sentence was just saying that. I have nothing against the people of Kolkata, but the truth is Bangladesh is the home of Bangla not Kolkata. Sadly our leaders don't have that realization.

Orpheus
December 30, 2003, 04:39 PM
What are you guys whining about?

you make one! YOu are Bangladeshis right? Both of you are Computer Engineers.. you guys come up with something instead of gali-ing everyone.

Arnab
December 30, 2003, 05:44 PM
Orpheus, people have come up with what they can do. That's why you can read Prothom-alo in Bangla.

The thing is a proper Bangla Unicode is not in Nasif or my hands. It has to go through Bangladesh government.

And I don't care who does it first, the bangla speaking people in west bengal or us or even together, as long as it is properly done. So far, both sides have been incompetent.

[Edited on 30-12-2003 by Arnab]

Orpheus
December 30, 2003, 05:45 PM
f****** government

Orpheus
December 31, 2003, 06:56 PM
I feel like an idiot...

I didn't know they were offering free version (not trial one like before) of bornosoft at their website....

ha! not bad! and here I was talking about cracking...

[Edited on 31-12-2003 by Orpheus]

Arnab
January 1, 2004, 03:41 PM
The free version still has less features than the professional version. But the problems can be worked around.

What is bothering me is the unwanted spaces that show up in the html.

Bangsee doesn't have that problem, as apparent from the Prothom-alo website they use bangsee). But bangsee full version is not free.

And I don't know what software the Bhoere Kagoj guys use (definitely not bornosoft), but they also don't seem to have that problem.

Orpheus
January 2, 2004, 03:27 AM
if you copy that too ms word... the spacing might get solved... but I don't know if you will see it when you make it a webpage....

the pro doesn't have that problem :) and they also got a spell checker ...

[Edited on 2-1-2004 by Orpheus]

chinaman
January 2, 2004, 04:30 AM
Well, take a good look at their website. Not free from spaces. These are tell tell signs of the quality of their products. Just hope they fix it fast.

alpona
April 13, 2004, 12:55 AM
Hi Guys,

Most of the Bangla sites throughout the world developed using Alpona. The famous news paper sites like www.prothom-alo.com, www.bhorerkagoj.net etc. developed using Alpona. Even the Bangsee software you are talking using Alpona's font engine.

Alpona Standard edition is free for all; you can develope your site using this edition.

Information can be found at:

Web: http://www.akshor.com
Forum: http://forum.akshor.com

Thanx,

Alpona Support Team

chinaman
April 13, 2004, 01:05 AM
Dear alpona

Welcome to Banglacricket.

Yupe, Alpona is great. In my limited usage, I found it very useful. The only thing I didn't like is the extra spaces that appear from nowhere. I heard the professional edition doesn't have this problem. Would be great if that is the implemented in the standard edition too.

Anyway, great effort from the Alpona team. Hat's off to you guys.

Arnab
April 13, 2004, 12:02 PM
Alpona guy,

Do you have any plans of developing a phonetic transliteration software like Bangsee?

I don't have the energy to learn a new bangla keyboard layout like bijoy, etc.

I want to type things in English and see it in Bangla. Like in Bornosoft or Bangsee.

alpona
April 19, 2004, 05:27 AM
so brother, why don't you use Bangsee ... :-/

chinaman
April 19, 2004, 05:42 AM
Dear alpona

Of course he or anyone for that matter can use any program they are comfortable with. He asked a very simple question since you were publicising your program. You can even answer with a small yes or no. But your answer doesn't seem to be a bright one at all. Well, our expectations are always high from creative guys like yourself. Thanks anyway.

alpona
April 20, 2004, 01:45 AM
Sorry for misunderstanding.

Bangsee using Alpona's font engine that I told you already. So, using Alpona or Bangsee doesn't make any difference in such case...am I right?

Gaan
December 30, 2009, 03:59 AM
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