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Beamer
July 19, 2010, 02:27 PM
Yea. Pretty much sums it up. Not a big fan of his style for shorter version. As I have said, improved test performances ( lasting five days, avoiding consistent innings defeat, building bigger partnerships, improving ind. stats ) with bat makes me hopeful. Its so important that we improve and continue to get better in tests. It hurts losing all these one dayers, but nobody drums up the warnoise of our expulsion from one dayers, however, losing test matches within two days will do that- kick out from tests! Bowling is going through some tough times. Mash was unfit, Rafiq retired, Rasel is done, Raj was off color- all these contributed to more ODI losses, though with all those players in their primes, it was still never good enough to win test matches. I think in Shafi and Rubel, we have potentially two good bowlers. They need proper nurture. Siddons is not able to do it. We need a good bowling coach. I personally beleive that when our bowlers are on par with the strength of bowling that was three-four years back, we will not only win a lot more ODI's, but with the new found belief in test batting, we will be knocking on the door of TEST victories. As a beginning, we had no choice but to build BATSMEN first and foremost..

Yes, I want him for two more years and I hope he is smartens up in one dayers ( T 20 ).

MatinSux
July 19, 2010, 03:58 PM
Both Beamer and I agree that under his term there have been notable improvements in Test Batting but his understanding and coaching of limited overs Suck. His term has also seen anything not batting related to decline.

Based on the above, I believe he should be replaced and Beamer believes he deserves to carry on.
That's about it.

Eshen
July 20, 2010, 01:03 PM
If this is not proof enough that Siddons needs to go, I don't know what will be!

Beamer
July 20, 2010, 01:05 PM
Gut wrenching loss. Its hard to defend him. Him and the team deserves all the attack from fans. Very sad.

Ananna
July 20, 2010, 01:07 PM
I have been following this thread for last couple weeks but havent said anything.
Now as a BD supported I demand that Siddons be sacked as the head coach of the team.
We have enough time to get prepared for WC under a new coach or an interim one.

reyme
July 20, 2010, 01:07 PM
I demand an instant raise for Siddons. He has worked very hard in last 3 years.

yaseer
July 20, 2010, 01:08 PM
If this is not proof enough that Siddons needs to go, I don't know what will be!

No, this is not the proof. Siddons need to go anyway because of our performance against G8.

It is a proof of the real quality of players we currently have in the team. If they need coach to beat teams like Netherlands, then they should only play against them.

WarWolf
July 20, 2010, 01:09 PM
Gut wrenching loss. Its hard to defend him. Him and the team deserves all the attack from fans. Very sad.
Hope these two defeats against the minnows would work as eye opener.

Baundule
July 20, 2010, 01:10 PM
Gut wrenching loss. Its hard to defend him. Him and the team deserves all the attack from fans. Very sad.
I can defend him very well, because this match is no exception of what Siddons want from the team. Four of the batsmen have scored well and we have played the full 30 overs.

Peace
July 20, 2010, 01:11 PM
the whole team should be given unpaid leave for six months. we will regroup after six months.I have changed my mind and siddons should go. strip off mashrafee's captaincy and tamim should take over. something is not right in the team.

AsifTheManRahman
July 20, 2010, 01:11 PM
Siddons must be fired immediately. Mashrafe is no captain either.

Then again, what do I care? I've been having a hard time trying to care much about Bangladesh cricket over the last couple of months. Never had much to be proud of being born in a poor, corrupted nation and now the last source of pride of being a Bangladeshi is gone. Screw this crap.

Baundule
July 20, 2010, 01:13 PM
the whole team should be given unpaid leave for six months. we will regroup after six months.I have changed my mind and siddons should go. strip off mashrafee's captaincy and tamim should take over. something is not right in the team.
Again you are clueless to identify the problem. It's our schedule that makes the coach, oops, the players soooo tired. :D

Zeeshan
July 20, 2010, 01:13 PM
Siddons must be fired immediately. Mashrafe is no captain either.

Then again, what do I care? I've been having a hard time trying to care much about Bangladesh cricket over the last couple of months. Never had much to be proud of being born in a poor, corrupted nation and now the last source of pride of being a Bangladeshi is gone. Screw this crap.

spoonerize it.

al Furqaan
July 20, 2010, 01:13 PM
this loss at the hands of the Dutch, has forced a realization in me:

its not siddons.

how can it be the coach when the players eff it up the whole time...

time and time and time again, our RR at the end of a limited overs innings, be it 50 overs or 30 overs is lower than it was at the 10 over mark, 15 over mark, 25 over mark, and 30 over mark.

our RR at 50 overs is almost always less than our RR at 40 overs, despite having 5 or more wickets in hand.

thats not the coach's fault. its the fault of riyad, mushy, rahim, and to smaller extent mashrafee for failing to accelerate. also partly at fault is sakib's poor form further pressurizing the tail.

Siddons is not asking the team to slow down at the end...the batsmen are doing that due to their inability and lack of confidence.

Beamer
July 20, 2010, 01:14 PM
Listen..I am as mad and sad as you all are. Don't make it an issue with me vs rest. Take it on Siddons if you like. I like what he has done with test performances, and very much dislike his ODI handling.

aniksh1
July 20, 2010, 01:14 PM
Dear citizens:

Never give up like our nonsense cricket team...

Beamer
July 20, 2010, 01:16 PM
Al
But, Siddons should realize that he has wrong players at no.6 and 7. Yes, Sakib's loss of form doesn't help matters, but whats with this infatuation with Riyad at no.7. Our Bowling is worse than many associates. That is a fact.

al Furqaan
July 20, 2010, 01:17 PM
Yea. Pretty much sums it up. Not a big fan of his style for shorter version. As I have said, improved test performances ( lasting five days, avoiding consistent innings defeat, building bigger partnerships, improving ind. stats ) with bat makes me hopeful. Its so important that we improve and continue to get better in tests. It hurts losing all these one dayers, but nobody drums up the warnoise of our expulsion from one dayers, however, losing test matches within two days will do that- kick out from tests! Bowling is going through some tough times. Mash was unfit, Rafiq retired, Rasel is done, Raj was off color- all these contributed to more ODI losses, though with all those players in their primes, it was still never good enough to win test matches. I think in Shafi and Rubel, we have potentially two good bowlers. They need proper nurture. Siddons is not able to do it. We need a good bowling coach. I personally beleive that when our bowlers are on par with the strength of bowling that was three-four years back, we will not only win a lot more ODI's, but with the new found belief in test batting, we will be knocking on the door of TEST victories. As a beginning, we had no choice but to build BATSMEN first and foremost..

Yes, I want him for two more years and I hope he is smartens up in one dayers ( T 20 ).

well said...siddons is the best we can have for now.

yaseer
July 20, 2010, 01:17 PM
We really need to put some real thought behind the team and players.

Imrul, Junaid, Riyad, Nayeem - these players are just not good enough to win us matches. These are street smart players and are just going to stuck around with the team. We are loosing players at the age of 25 and after some brief success in international level. Lots of problem but no solution. Future looks really bleak.

WarWolf
July 20, 2010, 01:19 PM
Siddons must be fired immediately. Mashrafe is no captain either.

Then again, what do I care? I've been having a hard time trying to care much about Bangladesh cricket over the last couple of months. Never had much to be proud of being born in a poor, corrupted nation and now the last source of pride of being a Bangladeshi is gone. Screw this crap.
Feeling sorry for you my dear brother. Feeling sorry for me as well.

MatinSux
July 20, 2010, 01:20 PM
It's settled now. Miraz wins. Congrats!
1) Siddions needs to take a hike immediately. I've had enough defending him.
2) Bangladesh must stop playing cricket and as a country seems to be a failure.

Baundule
July 20, 2010, 01:20 PM
....

thats not the coach's fault. its the fault of riyad, mushy, rahim, and to smaller extent mashrafee for failing to accelerate. also partly at fault is sakib's poor form further pressurizing the tail.

Siddons is not asking the team to slow down at the end...the batsmen are doing that due to their inability and lack of confidence.

then what personal improvement did the head coach do with these players?

bujhee kom
July 20, 2010, 01:22 PM
Jamie Siddons should resign now as BD coach.

view360
July 20, 2010, 01:22 PM
Siddon always tells the players not to worry about the asking run rates and to focus on 'personal improvements' instead . I know this because my ears and eyes are in the dressing room. What JS is doing is ok for a batting coach but I disapprove this for a head coach whose primary strategy should be to win and avoid defeats. I never publicly criticized JS but this is now beyond my endurance.

auntu
July 20, 2010, 01:23 PM
siddons must be fired immediately. Mashrafe is no captain either.

Then again, what do i care? I've been having a hard time trying to care much about bangladesh cricket over the last couple of months. Never had much to be proud of being born in a poor, corrupted nation and now the last source of pride of being a bangladeshi is gone. Screw this crap.
[বাংলা]মনটা খুব খারাপ হলো ভাই।
একদম ভালো লাগছে না। [/বাংলা]

mij
July 20, 2010, 01:23 PM
Part from TI and some others most of our players can't speak or fully understand English, I have seen past year or so misunderstanding between player and coach. For example when coach say come on put bit more gas, they play like no other day in a process of this kind play quickly loss wicket and never can recover from it.

We need a coach who can completely understand by players.

MatinSux
July 20, 2010, 01:24 PM
You can change the coach to whomever, but it wont change the state of BD cricket for sure.

Rifat
July 20, 2010, 01:26 PM
It's settled now. Miraz wins. Congrats!
1) Siddions needs to take a hike immediately. I've had enough defending him.
2) Bangladesh must stop playing cricket and as a country seems to be a failure.

Strongly disagree with this quote!

With Proper Guidance and nurture, Bangladesh can do wonders....

Rifat
July 20, 2010, 01:27 PM
yet another poor Summer for Bangladesh Cricket......

Baundule
July 20, 2010, 01:28 PM
You can change the coach to whomever, but it wont change the state of BD cricket for sure.
ha, this will be the view of Jamie Siddons' lovers. JS told the very first day that we are crap and he is trying his best to prove that. the same goes for JS lovers.

Murad
July 20, 2010, 01:30 PM
ha, this will be the view of Jamie Siddons' lovers. JS told the very first day that we are crap and he is trying his best to prove that. the same goes for JS lovers.

lolz.. ar lojja diyenna bhai... kainda dibe to :-p

Peace
July 20, 2010, 01:30 PM
Again you are clueless to identify the problem. It's our schedule that makes the coach, oops, the players soooo tired. :D

When have you become a certified judge in BC?

I still standby with my opinion that JS has made improvement over the last few years and the failures are to be blamed for player’s inability mainly. However, after today’s failure, I will not spare anyone in the team defending.

shakibrulz
July 20, 2010, 01:32 PM
Though I'm no blind Siddon's hater, this is embarrassing stuff, and now even BD's ODI status is gonna be under scrutiny.

So are they gonna sack Siddons? Obviously it is pathetic to lose two times to the associates, and there's absolutely no excuse for this. Siddon's coaching is an epic failure in ODI scenario especially.

Eshen
July 20, 2010, 01:32 PM
JS told the very first day that we are crap and he is trying his best to prove that. the same goes for JS lovers.
Yep, that's very much sums it up.

view360
July 20, 2010, 01:33 PM
We need a Bangladeshi coach who cares for the national shames and pride which can never be expected from a foreigner. A BD coach will not do worse than what we are witnessing these days.

shakibrulz
July 20, 2010, 01:33 PM
You can change the coach to whomever, but it wont change the state of BD cricket for sure.

Could do much much better than this with a decent coach. I mean 2 loses vs the Associates? WTH? :hairpull:

al-Sagar
July 20, 2010, 01:34 PM
we are crap comparing to G8, so we will lose to them, ok, i accept.

but are we crap comparing to associates ???? no.

so we should not lose to them. ar at least not lose to them regularly.

so in the end ......

3 games against England 1 upset win for us
3 games against associates, 1 upset win for us

yaseer
July 20, 2010, 01:35 PM
3 games against England 1 upset win for us
3 games against associates, 1 upset win for us

yes, only upset

reyme
July 20, 2010, 01:36 PM
Following the circus act that has been going on the field lately, it seems the players have lost their capability to act, think or simply bowl or bat with common sense. Bunch of kids going to the field bowling and batting at will. Some of them are clueless, hopeless, and scared regardless of the opposition.

<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comhttp://banglacricket.com/alochona/ /><o:p></o:p></FONT></FONT></P><P><FONT color=black><FONT face=This is what happens when there is no guidance/direction, management, planning/strategy, accountability. Siddons has successfully planted a seed among these players which make them think they are simply not good enough to compete, let alone win. I am willing to bet all my money this national team will lose against most premier clubs of Dhaka right at this moment. They all time low in terms of confidence and with team spirit.
<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Siddons has done enough damage to this young team. He has failed to deliver and he continues to come up with excuses to cover his lack of capability and his failures. Siddons himself needs a coach for himself and learn the fundamentals or basics of coaching first.
<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Siddons should not be any kind of coach, not even a batting consultant, for all his negative personality/attitude and simply lack of desire to work hard with or for this team. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
We have a world cup to prepare for. We have an ODI status to hold on to. We have a test status to survive for.

We need a new coach, today.<o:p></o:p>

Spitfire_x86
July 20, 2010, 01:37 PM
England lost to Holland in the previous W20. Now they are World T20 champion. So, what if we lost a T30 game to them?

(runs for cover)

Eshen
July 20, 2010, 01:37 PM
IMO, it's not only Siddons, we need a clean break from both current management and selection committee. Mahbub Anam, or whoever else responsible, should be also given the kick for organizing this cramped schedule.

BangladeshFan
July 20, 2010, 01:40 PM
who made siddons coach? who ? who?

SS
July 20, 2010, 01:40 PM
Following the circus act that has been going on the field lately, it seems the players have lost their capability to act, think or simply bowl or bat with common sense. Bunch of kids going to the field bowling and batting at will. Some of them are clueless, hopeless, and scared regardless of the opposition.

<o:p></o:p>
This is what happens when there is no guidance/direction, management, planning/strategy, accountability. Siddons has successfully planted a seed among these players which make them think they are simply not good enough to compete, let alone win. I am willing to bet all my money this national team will lose against most premier clubs of Dhaka right at this moment. They all time low in terms of confidence and with team spirit.
<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Siddons has done enough damage to this young team. He has failed to deliver and he continues to come up with excuses to cover his lack of capability and his failures. Siddons himself needs a coach for himself and learn the fundamentals or basics of coaching first.
<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>We have a world cup to prepare for. We have an ODI status to hold on to. We have a test status to survive for.

We need a new coach, today.<o:p></o:p>

Can't say anything more...Act today or die soon

Raynman
July 20, 2010, 01:40 PM
IMO, it's not only Siddons, we need a clean break from both current management and selection committee. Mahbub Anam, or whoever else responsible, should be also given the kick for organizing this cramped schedule.

Agree. Mass firings/replacements are in order after a 2-25 year which includes a losing record with associates.

SS
July 20, 2010, 01:41 PM
IMO, it's not only Siddons, we need a clean break from both current management and selection committee. Mahbub Anam, or whoever else responsible, should be also given the kick for organizing this cramped schedule.

Agree...not just the coach who are the selectors, management..all need to get a break..they are not doing anything but just getting money...in other places they would have been fired.

view360
July 20, 2010, 01:44 PM
The entire team management should be fired in a Pakistani style this time. It it was Pakistan , they would be hanged by now.

reyme
July 20, 2010, 01:48 PM
Agree about total facelift. But in a country like ours, that will take time. Hopefully sooner than later. You cant make/create players overnight, we have to stick with current players...but at least the management closest to the team needs to be adjusted, A management that can get the best out of our players.

bujhee kom
July 20, 2010, 01:48 PM
Remember bhais and apas, Siddons have a right to live as well. Please don't beat him.

view360
July 20, 2010, 01:49 PM
Remember bhais and apas, Siddons have a right to live as well. Please don't beat him.

Well , there is a life after death .

Kabir
July 20, 2010, 01:50 PM
At the beginning we were thinking of ANY loss. Now that there's two - what does it say about our capabilities vs. what we fans think that the team is capable of?

SS
July 20, 2010, 01:52 PM
At the beginning we were thinking of ANY loss. Now that there's two - what does it say about our capabilities vs. what we fans think that the team is capable of?

We have to lower our expectations, Sir

reyme
July 20, 2010, 01:53 PM
who made siddons coach? who ? who?


Gazi Ashraf Lipu. I dont blame Lipu, it was good on paper. But due to lack of accountability Siddons got out of control promptly. He focused more on personal indulgance and vacation rather than focusing on his primary duty: coaching. He just simply took advantage of the situation. If he was in IPL, he would fired after half a season for lack of dedication or capability, just like his boss in KKR.

MatinSux
July 20, 2010, 01:54 PM
It's best if we focus on our individual lives than to follow this circus team. You will have a better heart and a fresher mind for the rest of your life.

SS
July 20, 2010, 01:55 PM
It's best if we focus on our individual lives than to follow this circus team. You will have a better heart and a fresher mind for the rest of your life.

True...what if our life also becomes like the team!

Baundule
July 20, 2010, 01:55 PM
When have you become a certified judge in BC?

I still standby with my opinion that JS has made improvement over the last few years and the failures are to be blamed for player’s inability mainly. However, after today’s failure, I will not spare anyone in the team defending.
If you are blaming the players, then tell me what improvement JS did with these players? We were hearing about personal improvement and bla bla bla....

Peace
July 20, 2010, 02:13 PM
If you are blaming the players, then tell me what improvement JS did with these players? We were hearing about personal improvement and bla bla bla....
you have not been following BC recently, have you?
thanks to ImtiazK.
These first ten years are not exactly something to be proud of. Only 3 wins and those were against depleted second or third string sides. Apart from a couple of others, we lost all the rest. So how do we measure our progress, if any.

I have gone back to Cricket's oldest statistic. The average. Except here, I have taken the team's average per wicket - batting and bowling - and come up with a result which I have named the Competition Index. The Competition Index is simply a Ratio. It is, in fact, the result of the batting average divided by the bowling average.

A 100% ratio would mean that we scored exactly the same number of runs per wicket as did our opponents. In other words, we were broadly speaking equal in strength. So, you would expect, given Bangladesh's record so far, for us to have a decidedly inferior ratio. But how does that ratio compare year after year. Has there been any improvement ?

Let me make some caveats. Firstly, in our inaugural year, 2000, we played only one test match. So, I believe it is not very representative. Similarly, in 2009, we played only 3 test matches including 2 against Floyd Reiffer's West Indies side - remember him ?

Here is the table:

<TABLE style="WIDTH: 305pt; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=406 border=0 x:str><COLGROUP><COL style="WIDTH: 48pt" span=5 width=64><COL style="WIDTH: 17pt; mso-width-source: userset; mso-width-alt: 804" width=22><COL style="WIDTH: 48pt" width=64><TBODY><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD class=xl27 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; WIDTH: 48pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=64 height=17>Year</TD><TD class=xl27 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; WIDTH: 48pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=64>Tests</TD><TD class=xl27 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; WIDTH: 48pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=64>Bat Ave.</TD><TD class=xl27 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; WIDTH: 48pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=64>Bowl Ave.</TD><TD class=xl27 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; WIDTH: 48pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=64>C.Index</TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; WIDTH: 17pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=22></TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; WIDTH: 48pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" width=64>Note</TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right height=17 x:num>2000</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>1</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>24.55</TD><TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>44.81</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num="0.54786877929033695" x:fmla="=C2/D2">54.79%</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right height=17 x:num>2001</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>8</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>19.79</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>59.82</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num="0.33082581076563022" x:fmla="=C3/D3">33.08%</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right height=17 x:num>2002</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>8</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>16.73</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>57.54</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num="0.29075425790754261" x:fmla="=C4/D4">29.08%</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right height=17 x:num>2003</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>9</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>20.43</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>45.75</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num="0.4465573770491803" x:fmla="=C5/D5">44.66%</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right height=17 x:num>2004</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>8</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>22.85</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>56.14</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num="0.40701816886355541" x:fmla="=C6/D6">40.70%</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">ZIM 2</TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right height=17 x:num>2005</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>6</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>22.25</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>44.56</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num="0.49932675044883301" x:fmla="=C7/D7">49.93%</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD><TD class=xl26 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">ZIM 2</TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right height=17 x:num>2006</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>4</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>25.13</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>48.69</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num="0.51612240706510581" x:fmla="=C8/D8">51.61%</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right height=17 x:num>2007</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>5</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>18.73</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>79.54</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num="0.23547900427457882" x:fmla="=C9/D9">23.55%</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right height=17 x:num>2008</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>9</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>20.11</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>40.62</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num="0.49507631708517974" x:fmla="=C10/D10">49.51%</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right height=17 x:num>2009</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>3</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>24.96</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>31.51</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num="0.79212948270390349" x:fmla="=C11/D11">79.21%</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD></TR><TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right height=17 x:num>2010</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>7</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>29.37</TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num>54.91</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" align=right x:num="0.53487525040976147" x:fmla="=C12/D12">53.49%</TD><TD class=xl25 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

From an initial glance, it is clear 2010 has been by a glorious cover drive the best year for batting. Almost respectable, I might say, at 29.37 runs per wicket. This includes 4 test matches against England and 3 test matches out of 7 abroad. It should not come as a surprise. Our average totals have been higher than late and centuries have flowed in greater numbers than hitherto. 2009 was the best year for bowling, but I have warned against reading too much into it. One, only 3 tests and, two, two of them against Reiffer's West Indies side.

The index - which takes into account both batting and bowling shows that apart from those two rather unrepresenatative years, 2010 was the best year for Bangladesh cricket in tests. 2006 comes up second best but all four test matches were played in Bangladesh - so the result will be slightly biased.

A rather odd result was 2009. Regardless of the aforementioned 2 test wins in the west Indies out of only 3 tests, we still did not manage even 100% in the ratio. Why ? Because in the only other test match against Sri Lanka , we were walloped to the tune of 465 runs at Chittagong.

Now compare the ratio in 2010 against 2007 which was our nadir it seems. In 2007 , we scored less than a quarter runs per wicket than we conceded. Now, we score just above 53%. Given that for all the test countries, these two averages must equal out, it shows that we have progressed but very slowly. I did not realise that 2007 was worse than 2002 and 2003.

2008 was the best year for our bowling. There are no caveats here. 4 Tests each against South Africa and New Zealand - split equally , home and away. The other one was against Sri Lanka. This was the year Shakib announced himself as a truly international class bowler.

If we could bat like we have in 2010 and bowl like we did in 2008, there could be more five day test matches including some draws.

Make what you will, but these are the facts and figures !

MatinSux
July 20, 2010, 02:21 PM
True...what if our life also becomes like the team!
Disaster, Allah'r naam nie train-e japai pora chara upai nai.

Baundule
July 20, 2010, 02:35 PM
you have not been following BC recently, have you?
thanks to ImtiazK.

Oh I see, lot of things are happening in BC. Sorry my fault, I joined BC only 2 months ago and then took a one and a half months paid vacation to Sydney. But my personal lack of BC knowledge does not count much. Let's stay on the topic.

From your stats, you want to say the players are made 'able' by Siddons and here in this thread you want to blame the loss against Netherlands to players' inabilities. This should not be done by a BC pro, right?

Peace
July 20, 2010, 02:53 PM
Oh I see, lot of things are happening in BC. Sorry my fault, I joined BC only 2 months ago and then took a one and a half months paid vacation to Sydney. But my personal lack of BC knowledge does not count much. Let's stay on the topic.

From your stats, you want to say the players are made 'able' by Siddons and here in this thread you want to blame the loss against Netherlands to players' inabilities. This should not be done by a BC pro, right?

I think you are making too much assumptions. I have not said any of those things you mentioned above.
I hate repeating myself. Please visit my last few posts (BANFAN'S thread) if you really want to know what I meant by players inability.

Raynman
July 20, 2010, 03:00 PM
Peace,

enough with the test batting stats.

Siddons is our HEAD coach. His responsibility is TEST, ODI & T20. His responsibility includes Batting, Partnerships, running between the wickets, fielding, keeping, bowling, team strategy, study of opposition and preparing, final say of playing XI.

Cricket has evolved and even Test Batsmen score at a better SR than Siddons would like for our boys to. As a host and having IRE, NED and WI in our group, the WC should have been our top top priority. We also have a T20 we're hosting in 2014. We can not focus on one thing and not the other. There is no reason why different specialists can't be played in different formats.

bujhee kom
July 20, 2010, 03:28 PM
As a head coach Jamie Siddons is a complete failure! Siddons should step down and resign!

Peace
July 20, 2010, 03:32 PM
Peace,

enough with the test batting stats.

Siddons is our HEAD coach. His responsibility is TEST, ODI & T20. His responsibility includes Batting, Partnerships, running between the wickets, fielding, keeping, bowling, team strategy, study of opposition and preparing, final say of playing XI.

Cricket has evolved and even Test Batsmen score at a better SR than Siddons would like for our boys to. As a host and having IRE, NED and WI in our group, the WC should have been our top top priority. We also have a T20 we're hosting in 2014. We can not focus on one thing and not the other. There is no reason why different specialists can't be played in different formats.

You are entitled for your opinion but I do not agree with you.
I refer to my earlier post.
I do not believe all these so called theories that a team can be destroyed by a head coach or under his leadership. How long will it take to realise that our players do not perform consistently and/ or lack intensity and ruthlessness in their performance. A coach can only teach you, instruct you, guide you, but he can not perform for you. A coach can not stop you by his order or guidance if you have the ability to win matches on your own initiative. We have had three high profile coaches to date. If we are still deprived of success despite having these high calibre coaches, that means we have problems in other areas...

bujhee kom
July 20, 2010, 03:34 PM
From today I shall call Jamie Siddons "Chiddon"!

Raynman
July 20, 2010, 03:37 PM
You are entitled for your opinion but I do not agree with you.
I refer to my earlier post.

If I had a tutor for my son and he taught him that its okay to fail in Science, math etc. as long as he focuses on the basics of language he would be out of my house with my size 11 shoe print on his a$$

bujhee kom
July 20, 2010, 03:41 PM
If I had a tutor for my son and he taught him that its okay to fail in Science, math etc. as long as he focuses on the basics of language he would be out of my house with my size 11 shoe print on his a$$

Hahhahhaha...E ki bolchen Raynman bhai....size 11? The tutor must have super big buttocks!!

Peace
July 20, 2010, 04:00 PM
If I had a tutor for my son and he taught him that its okay to fail in Science, math etc. as long as he focuses on the basics of language he would be out of my house with my size 11 shoe print on his a$$

I can not verify if Siddons said such or similar thing. I do not like excerbating stuffs and using my shoe on anyone's ar$$ under any circumstances. The human body should body respected and treated accordingly what they deserve. A brush to clean would have been nice language in the worse circumstances.:lol:
I refer to my other post.


...His approach to public and media is likely not be the same as his actual approach to the game. Many international coaches have policy to take off pressures from players by setting no ultimatum target in front of the media. But in the background, there will be always certain targets to achieve that are realistic, achievable and agreed by both the coach and BCB. There will be always an aim to win every match, and a contingency plan in place. He can not fulfil fans expectation of chasing 280 runs target after losing 3 wickets for 28 runs, for instance. Or he can not be blamed in a situation where we were 150/2 after 30 overs but batsmen, likes of Imrul, Ryad took no initiative to accelerate run rate, chasing 300+ runs. These are the things the players have to take practical initiative and responsibility. Most of the games that we lost recently because it was players inability to take imitative during the game such as accelerating run rate, taking power play earlier, and overly reliance on instructions from the dressing rooms. This shows lack of confidence of captain and team players. We should remeber that cricket is a game where captain plays more important role than coach or any other staffs in practical terms....

Baundule
July 20, 2010, 04:06 PM
I think you are making too much assumptions. I have not said any of those things you mentioned above.
I hate repeating myself. Please visit my last few posts (BANFAN'S thread) if you really want to know what I meant by players inability.
Sorry mate, I do not want to visit BANFAN's posts now to know what you mean by what. Have to make time for watering my cactus.

Peace
July 20, 2010, 04:10 PM
Sorry mate, I do not want to visit BANFAN's posts now to know what you mean by what. Have to make time for watering my cactus.
in that case, do not poke your nose in my post, if you can not come up with counter argument.

Baundule
July 20, 2010, 04:14 PM
in that case, do not poke your nose in my post, if you can not come up with counter argument.

right, right. The argument you gave like 'see BANFAN's post and find what I mean by what' and it's certainly my fault. :D

When have you become a certified judge in BC?

I still standby with my opinion that JS has made improvement over the last few years and the failures are to be blamed for player’s inability mainly. However, after today’s failure, I will not spare anyone in the team defending.
And, here by players you were probably meaning the aliens. Inability probably means the lack of following JS's orders completely to destroy Bangladesh cricket.

Anyway, no grudge, all peace! We speak for Bangladesh cricket at the end of the day.

Peace
July 20, 2010, 04:18 PM
right, right. The argument you gave like 'see BANFAN's post and find what I mean by what' and it's certainly my fault. :D

Certainly it is not your fault; but it looks like cactus your favourite toy.

Baundule
July 20, 2010, 04:21 PM
Certainly it is not your fault; but it looks like cactus your favourite toy.
Man, I love my cactus. Their water requirement is almost like JS's win requirement for Bangladesh cricket team. Anyway, we can discuss about it in the forget cricket section someday. Good bye and good night.

Peace
July 20, 2010, 04:36 PM
Man, I love my cactus. Their water requirement is almost like JS's win requirement for Bangladesh cricket team. Anyway, we can discuss about it in the forget cricket section someday. Good bye and good night.
Good night. enjoy the cactus.:love:

SS
July 20, 2010, 05:22 PM
BD te bhanga chura shuru hoise...we need some action to wake up the cricket board and govt

Antora
July 20, 2010, 05:32 PM
The time has come, the door is open... Siddons must now walk out!

I can't believe we'd lose to Netherlands.

chotpoti
July 20, 2010, 05:40 PM
Everything clear now ====takku need to go for good....enuf =enuf !!

BCBLFC
July 20, 2010, 05:56 PM
Do you think Khaled Mahmud could do the job? If a new coach comes in now he would want to find out about the players and pick his own players. That would set us back again especially as we have a good set of players already

Zobair
July 20, 2010, 06:01 PM
Lets not jump from the frying pan into the fire. Its time for cool heads.

Tiger-ess
July 20, 2010, 06:16 PM
Cant we have two coaches?? One for test and one for ODIs?? Siddons can stay for the test format while someone coaches the one day side...someone from the subcontinent?? prefrebally bangladeshi?? my vote goes with Sir Mohammed Rafique!!

Naimul_Hd
July 20, 2010, 07:16 PM
apart from Siddons contribution in this misery, I doubt Mashrafe's team selection and fielding settings !

One World
July 20, 2010, 09:28 PM
Siddons may be a good coach for longer version, but he does not really understand ODI.

Miraz
July 21, 2010, 04:22 AM
I met the whole team yesterday at London Heathrow as we (with one of my friend) were arranging their transit from Heathrow to Gatwick. I met Jamie as well, they didn't appear upset at all with the defeat.

lasith
July 21, 2010, 04:43 AM
It's ridiculous to blame only the coach, You guys should have serious thinking about your player's commitment. A test playing nation loosing to Ireland and Netherlands in quick succession is totally unacceptable. I think the whole authorited including the players responsiple for this misery.

BangladeshFan
July 21, 2010, 04:46 AM
I met the whole team yesterday at London Heathrow as we (with one of my friend) were arranging their transit from Heathrow to Gatwick. I met Jamie as well, they didn't appear upset at all with the defeat.

stop their foreign tours, dismiss the foreign coach.

there is an old saying "jemon kukur temon mugur", trust me it works, especially with us bangladeshis.

M.H.Rubel
July 21, 2010, 04:53 AM
IMO, it's not only Siddons, we need a clean break from both current management and selection committee. Mahbub Anam, or whoever else responsible, should be also given the kick for organizing this cramped schedule.

Thats the point not only Siddons is responsible for this failue.All who are related to BCB have to take responsibility including Lotus for this failure.This must be an eye opener to the board.In an interview HB Sumon said that supply of quality players from the age level has diminished we need to rectify any flaws if we have.
<br />Posted via BC Mobile Edition

lasith
July 21, 2010, 05:19 AM
Players should be banned for their lack of commitment.

BANFAN
July 21, 2010, 06:21 AM
A post match statement from JS in Dec 2007:

"We had a plan in mind and we were going along according to that plan but we lost three wickets for five runs and the plan changed. The batsmen really did not get going after that and we probably lost our biggest strokemakers. So it didn't give us any chance to go after 335 which was virtually impossible from the start," said Jamie Siddons in reply to a question whether he thought the target was attainable.

"We don't pretend that we are going to compete against teams like New Zealand on a regular basis at this point of time. We are building. A lot of young players are getting good practice over here. We've lost two now and hopefully we'll play better in the last one and win," he added.

On the bowling effort, the Australian coach said: "If the ball is not swinging or spinning, which it really didn't today apart from the early overs where I think we bowled really well today, then it is a problem. The pace is also not there. The first two bowlers are bowling around 132-133kmph and not 140kmph,"

"It's really hard to contain when you can't bounce and there were not too many get out balls. They were giving us two bouncers last two balls every over and they were dot balls. So it makes it difficult for us to execute perfect yorkers and so we bowled a lot of slower balls which were disappearing as well and 100 off the last ten made it look really bad for us."

"We have two good openers who are doing the job for me everyday. Ashraful has moved up to number three which is a great positive for us if he can hold his spot up there," he said about the positives from the two matches.

Comments by Our Sohel NR Bhai;

Definitely a straight shooter. The truth may hurt a little, but that's exactly where real improvement starts. He sees the value of more pace and bounce, obviously, and sees that a good way to try and contain the opposition.

He also seems to like our best batsman FINALLY coming in at #3 and would like to see him make that slot his own. Ash sees the quicker ball early and is technically better that all other Bangladeshi batsmen. Add those facts to his talismanic performances of the past, and only 3 can be the magic number for him. He needs to bat as long as possible because when he does, we tend to do well and give ourselves the best chance to win. In ODIs, he's our best and safest bet to take advantage of powerplays, AND he can consolidate when necessary while rotating the strike. So let's have our best batsman give himself the opportunity to bat for as long as possible.

Bangladesh at this point: NO ASH = NO HOPE.

Irony of our fate is, we will still hear exactly the similar things from him today. How long Sohel Bhai? How long we have to be the target of these straight shooting, before we can expect him to deliver some result and tell us an improved truth? We all know the truth and he has been hired to change that truth. It's three years now ......... He hasn't made any player, he only ruined established performers. Starts with Ash.

http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/showthread.php?t=24876

BANFAN
July 21, 2010, 06:50 AM
We have to lower our expectations, Sir

All ready bare bottom. How much low sir? No sir, you can't do that to a national team, sir. A national team is too tall to go as low as enabling you to do that sir.

nahaz
July 21, 2010, 07:28 AM
To all pro-siddons supporters...

hhahahahahahahahahaahahahahhaha...you guys really crack me up.ROFL. So nice to see us lose against both Ireland and Netherlands..

Naimul_Hd
July 21, 2010, 08:24 AM
we need inspiration coach like him ( not Al pacino to be exact ) :saint:

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al-Sagar
July 21, 2010, 09:53 PM
I met the whole team yesterday at London Heathrow as we (with one of my friend) were arranging their transit from Heathrow to Gatwick. I met Jamie as well, they didn't appear upset at all with the defeat.

players are Hallucinated by the personal improvement theory, and the statement that win/loss does not matter.

Sohel
July 21, 2010, 10:59 PM
Comments by Our Sohel NR Bhai;



Irony of our fate is, we will still hear exactly the similar things from him today. How long Sohel Bhai? How long we have to be the target of these straight shooting, before we can expect him to deliver some result and tell us an improved truth? We all know the truth and he has been hired to change that truth. It's three years now ......... He hasn't made any player, he only ruined established performers. Starts with Ash.

http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/showthread.php?t=24876

The comment was made on December 29, 2007, 09:47 AM. I was wrong, horribly wrong! Premature verbage springing from unbridled optimism and hope. I've learned not to get carried away anymore. Any comment or observation made in a state of euphoria, depression or anger ought to be seasoned with a grain of salt :)

Rifat
July 21, 2010, 11:04 PM
I want to become Bangladesh Head Coach. By the will of Allah, I can do wonders with this team!

laugh at me! I know the weight of this testimony ;)

view360
July 21, 2010, 11:18 PM
In term of attitude , Jamie is very similar to the corporate managers who always come up with key performance indicators and all the statistics to back up their positions. We know how these corporate managers have led us to the current fiscal crisis. But they are still enjoying their bonuses with impunity. Flawed Corporate culture has taken over every institutions in our society and this will continue. The culture of taking positives out of nothing in fact started in BD cricket during the reign of Dav Whatmore and Jamie came as part of the evolution of the same process.

One World
July 21, 2010, 11:26 PM
The culture of taking positives out of nothing in fact started in BD cricket during the reign of Dav Whatmore and Jamie came as part of the evolution of the same process.

Extremely disagree. The culture was always there! We never took anything for granted. When we started winning and ran a whole year almost unbeaten, with Mash and SN both the best players for 2006 and then 2007 came, when only we started to enjoy the real glory of being a part of winning team.

We just had to remove Whatmore and create a crisis moment. Needed to sack Rafique out and dish out Pilot and Bashar completely. What were the motives, the real reason never dug out or mentioned, everybody went silent. Then we lost McInnes and the backbone was broken.

Drafting Siddons with personal achievements and strong batting power was well minimized with a Champaka direction to wayward bowling. Beating WI - 3 took us way over the moon, add Shakib becoming best all rounder and none really could picture the true damage done as the mental and psychological strength were totally flushed down the drain.

How Whatmore era could be the reason of the initiation of such culture?

view360
July 21, 2010, 11:41 PM
Extremely disagree. The culture was always there! We never took anything for granted. When we started winning and ran a whole year almost unbeaten, with Mash and SN both the best players for 2006 and then 2007 came, when only we started to enjoy the real glory of being a part of winning team.

We just had to remove Whatmore and create a crisis moment. Needed to sack Rafique out and dish out Pilot and Bashar completely. What were the motives, the real reason never dug out or mentioned, everybody went silent. Then we lost McInnes and the backbone was broken.

Drafting Siddons with personal achievements and strong batting power was well minimized with a Champaka direction to wayward bowling. Beating WI - 3 took us way over the moon, add Shakib becoming best all rounder and none really could picture the true damage done as the mental and psychological strength were totally flushed down the drain.

How Whatmore era could be the reason of the initiation of such culture?

I had been closely monitoring Whatmore's PR practice since 2002 and he was a PR man to the core to be honest. Rafiq , Bashar and Pilot could not back up their star values with performance and they had to go. That is why now Ryad and other are trying to back up their stats instead of focusing on the main objectives. Unfortunately, like any other sector in Bangladesh , we will have to live with disappointment in cricket as well. We Bangladeshis as a whole is an incompetent nation in every aspect of life regardless some flukes at the individual level. We have to face the truth.

One World
July 21, 2010, 11:49 PM
I had been closely monitoring Whatmore's PR practice since 2002 and he was a PR man to the core to be honest. Rafiq , Bashar and Pilot could not back up their star values with performance and they had to go. That is why now Ryad and other are trying to back up their stats instead of focusing on the main objectives. Unfortunately, like any other sector in Bangladesh , we will have to live with disappointment in cricket as well. We Bangladeshis as a whole is an incompetent nation in every aspect of life regardless some flukes at the individual level. We have to face the truth.

Thanks for the information. Note that I was not questioning the post-Whatmore situation really, but if that is performance then I could not understand why Pilot was not brought back after making so many runs in domestic. Anyway, my question was about your mentioning of "taking satisfaction out of nothing" started during Whatmore period. Well the fact does not really comply. If he was a PR practician then he must be the best possible at it. Because the common traits you are mentioning about incompetency were still there but that did not stop him to get the best out of the players collectively as a team.

view360
July 21, 2010, 11:56 PM
If he was a PR practician then he must be the best possible at it. Because the common traits you are mentioning about incompetency were still there but that did not stop him to get the best out of the players collectively as a team.

Whatmore's failures were overwhelming vis a vis his success with BD team. However , there were some occupational flukes at team level which are now replaced by individual flukes.

One World
July 22, 2010, 12:10 AM
Whatmore's failures were overwhelming vis a vis his success with BD team. However , there were some occupational flukes at team level which are now replaced by individual flukes.

Again if you want to call our ODI success which started beating the associates and Zim and ended up to that redundantly mentioned win against RSA - after which when we went through all these hustle and bustle, that is a quite a long period to be called fluke. Rather you could call the test at Fatulla or victory in Cardiff a fluke.

BANFAN
July 22, 2010, 01:29 AM
Whatmore's failures were overwhelming vis a vis his success with BD team. However , there were some occupational flukes at team level which are now replaced by individual flukes.

The standard of our cricket was much more messy at the point when DW tookover. There were severe problems of basic cricketing skills. When DW left and JS took over, we had more or less a sound 11/12 players with almost no basic problems. We were never expected to win matches before DW. DW made a difference in our expectations and abilities through sporadic wins and increasing resistance against good opponents.

JS was expected to take it to next level, that is to increase the percentage of wins and be more competitive with good teams. He promised the same to get the job, look at his first interview after the appointment. He failed miserably in last almost 3 years. Even if JS wasn't with the team, the team could have continued to sail as they are doing now with JS. JS failed to make any difference.

So comparing both the coaches flat out wins and defeats are unfair and irrational. You got to consider baselines.

Tiger-ess
July 22, 2010, 06:18 AM
Just saw the sport report on ATN. team has arrived in bangladesh.

While Masharfee has taken the blame completely on his shoulders, Siddons has other ideas. "Ireland always play good against anyone in thier home conditions", "we didnt play any practice matches in ireland/scotland", "players were tired from the tight schedule" were some of his excuses.

BANFAN
July 22, 2010, 07:17 AM
Just saw the sport report on ATN. team has arrived in bangladesh.

While Masharfee has taken the blame completely on his shoulders, Siddons has other ideas. "Ireland always play good against anyone in thier home conditions", "we didnt play any practice matches in ireland/scotland", "players were tired from the tight schedule" were some of his excuses.

ha ha ha :floor:

After playing 3 Odi, 2 Practice matches in Eng and two ODIs in Ire, still we needed practice match against Holland? Who would play in that practice match? The Holland player's GFs I guess ;)

And if you were tired, why would you want a funny practice match with 2nd string of Holand? This guy will do a lot better as a career comedian than a cricket coach.

dark mage
July 22, 2010, 08:12 AM
"Ireland always play good against anyone in thier home conditions", "we didnt play any practice matches in ireland/scotland", "players were tired from the tight schedule" were some of his excuses.


What a buncha bullshit. Now we need to play practice matches to play against a semi-professional team? And what were those matches agaisnt England count as, parar-match? If we need practice matches against Holland, we should go and play in the ICC trophy again

WarWolf
July 22, 2010, 08:39 AM
Hoi ami pagol naile BCB pagol. Naile ei shalader pichone ekhono shomoi nosto kori!!!

BangladeshFan
July 22, 2010, 09:21 AM
Say you appoint a house tutor for your child and the guy said your child is no good, dont expect anything from him, occasionally he may score 80 in math at best. then the point is, why should you pay the tutor, what exactly can he do?

ever since JS was there, he kept on saying Bd is no good. he never said what he can do. why should we pay a man if he kept on saying all the negatives, we may as well play without a coach and do better.

beshideshi
July 22, 2010, 09:41 AM
The loss against Ireland was at least bearable. They are a strong team, play well at home and very recently almost bagged an Aussie victory under their belt, also they always seem to play better against us. So I did not mind the Irish loss, but the loss to Holland just wasn't acceptable, I still can not believe we lost to Holland. We are a test nation and they are almost a second tier associate team, even if we play them at himalayas, with all our players suffering from plague, we should still be able to beat them. Can't swallow this.

Equinox
July 22, 2010, 10:55 AM
Miraz bhai please don't take any offence. I cracked up when I found this:
http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/showthread.php?t=24257
Just to share. :)

I was the first man to propose the name of Jamie Siddons as Bangladesh Coach on 20th April 2007.

Here is the link of that post (http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/showpost.php?p=433450&postcount=14)
:lol:

Miraz
July 22, 2010, 11:40 AM
Miraz bhai please don't take any offence. I cracked up when I found this:
http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/showthread.php?t=24257

:lol:

Yap, have to chew the bitter pill here. I have never in my imagination thought that he will be such a nightmare. We needed to move on after whatmore publicly wanted India job and Siddons seemed to be the best man around due to his CV.

This also shows I have nothing personal against Siddons. He has failed to deliver and must go.

:)

lamisa
July 23, 2010, 11:43 AM
Say you appoint a house tutor for your child and the guy said your child is no good, dont expect anything from him, occasionally he may score 80 in math at best. then the point is, why should you pay the tutor, what exactly can he do?

ever since JS was there, he kept on saying Bd is no good. he never said what he can do. why should we pay a man if he kept on saying all the negatives, we may as well play without a coach and do better.

well,it's all abut how u ake it.i had a math teacher who would remind me everyday how horrible and hopeless i was at math and that too infront of the juniors but i decided to reply to him with my results.the team should look at it as a motive to perform better

Beamer
October 11, 2010, 11:41 AM
Looks like when I watch a lot of games, we lose, and because of my heavy work load and travel associated with it, we win as I am more or less missing all of this series. I will stay away then...)

However, from far away, I would like to give a shout out to Jamie Siddons. He takes all the blame when we lose. I am not giving him all the credit when we win, though for consistencies sake, I won't be wrong if I did so.

"Losing attitude", "play to lose", "lack of killer instinct", "destroying our cricket" --all those sentences be damned !!

Miraz- Don't take the revival as a slight bro. I just thought he deserves some kudos..

Baundule
October 11, 2010, 11:57 AM
Looks like when I watch a lot of games, we lose, and because of my heavy work load and travel associated with it, we win as I am more or less missing all of this series. I will stay away then...)

However, from far away, I would like to give a shout out to Jamie Siddons. He takes all the blame when we lose. I am not giving him all the credit when we win, though for consistencies sake, I won't be wrong if I did so.

"Losing attitude", "play to lose", "lack of killer instinct", "destroying our cricket" --all those sentences be damned !!

Miraz- Don't take the revival as a slight bro. I just thought he deserves some kudos..
Beamer, I am with you on this. The coach certainly deserves his fare share of credit. A big hand to JS for the wins. In fact, my praise will double if these wins are the result of his changed attitude.

Our win also proves that JS used to talk BS about the team. For winning matches we do not need to score 240+ and of course we can win without Tamim and again, we do not need to play extra-defensive cricket. And not to mention, both these wins should be credited mainly to the bowlers (our weaker side according to JS). A new-born, previously hated, ICL-returnee SN showed the way to bat for wins.

shakibrulz
October 11, 2010, 12:12 PM
Needs to improve but definitely now theres MASSIVE improvement in player's batting. Especially their techniques have improved a lot.

Give some credit to the old man, good work Jamie

Baundule
October 11, 2010, 12:16 PM
A question, did JS get enough time to work with SN? Or, he is just drafted into the side? If I can remember, some of the ICLers were provided with the BCB facilities. Does that include the coach as well?

_Rafi_
October 11, 2010, 12:19 PM
Feeling lucky to be on Siddonse side!

Baundule
October 11, 2010, 12:25 PM
Feeling lucky to be on Siddonse side!
On the other hand, I am feeling lucky to be on the side of criticizing Siddons. :)
Our wins prove his words wrong.

Ajfar
October 11, 2010, 12:42 PM
A question, did JS get enough time to work with SN? Or, he is just drafted into the side? If I can remember, some of the ICLers were provided with the BCB facilities. Does that include the coach as well?

Well we cant really say. The squad for this series was announced over 3 weeks ago. Im sure he got some time but def not enough. Assuming SN sticks around the team for some time than we can make a conclusion on what kind of effect JS had on him. Also usually when players make a good come back after a long time usually someone will interview them and ask questions like who helped you the most and so on. So we might find out than from SN himself if JS influenced his batiing in anyway.
<br />Posted via BC Mobile Edition (iPhone)

Miraz
October 11, 2010, 12:42 PM
It's a win - win situation for me. These wins prove a good number Siddons word outright wrong as it shows we are capable of winning matches against G8 team. He should not think that those who "dream" to win matches against Pakistan or New Zealand or other G8 teams do not understand cricket.

At the same time, I am happy for Siddons and believe that these wins will help him to inspire his boys and instill winning mentality.

On a second thought, is the positive influence of Ian Pont and Julien Fountain counter-balancing the negative mindset of Siddons . ;)

Just kidding. :)

AsifTheManRahman
October 11, 2010, 01:43 PM
You can't just lose back to back games against Ireland and the Netherlands and forget about it. These wins are good but they coulda woulda shoulda come much earlier, maybe three/four years ago. Better late than never of course.

But none of this will matter if we can't win the series. This NZ team is pathetic, just like we are against associates.

These wins are no excuse for losing to minnows. Gimme the world cup and I might forget. Otherwise, meh. Learn to beat minnows first.

zman
October 11, 2010, 02:36 PM
not to condone our losses against the associates, but I tend to look at those results as aberration from our six month long steady progress where our players showed grit and patience for long periods at a time against two of the best teams in in the world, and the way we kept irritating them and pushing their backs against the wall frequently was pretty remarkable and unprecedented.

whether we admit or not, after a relatively long summer of cricket, by our standards, player burn out was an issue; however, i still can't see any of those associates beating us more than once or twice in a seven game series even in their own back yard.

in addition, NZ is still one of the better ODI teams in world cricket today having made the quarter finals/semi finals of almost every important tourney in the past few years. so if we can beat teams like NZ and WI and maybe even Pakistan (I can't imagine why we couldn't beat them) with little more regularity, it'll be hard to argue that we're fast approaching new heights of being in the same league as WI, NZ and Pakistan. you can blame the quality of cricket if you will but you can't discount the fact that we're a lot closer to these teams than we're a year ago although i'll concede that the gap between these teams plus us and the likes of Zim/Ire is closing much faster than we anticipated.

WC back ATMR...the team must be doing something right to be able to force you out of hiding ;)

Bond
October 11, 2010, 09:31 PM
All the Siddons haters got a big thapor on their face after consecutive victories over the Kiwis.

al Furqaan
October 11, 2010, 10:37 PM
You can't just lose back to back games against Ireland and the Netherlands and forget about it. These wins are good but they coulda woulda shoulda come much earlier, maybe three/four years ago. Better late than never of course.

But none of this will matter if we can't win the series. This NZ team is pathetic, just like we are against associates.

These wins are no excuse for losing to minnows. Gimme the world cup and I might forget. Otherwise, meh. Learn to beat minnows first.

the netherlands match was a 30-30 game, and we see how they've beaten england in 20-20 just 2 years back. not an excuse, but until we lose a 40 or 50 over match to them, i think we can give ourselves the benefit of the doubt based on NZ and ENG wins.

the ireland match, was a 50 over proper game. they seem to have our number, at least in venues that favor them. maybe we should accept the fact that ireland are a pretty decent side. i mean they produced Eoin Morgan, so they aren't totally worthless. plus we have Shakib with county experience, Ireland has several players who play in the county setup, plus their national team participates in the county league as well (and Scotland too). in these regards, Ireland may be associates, but they get way more exposure than say a team like Zimbabwe or even arguably us.

we just have to accept the fact that we aren't as good as Sri Lanka yet who will blast 200+ run wins against associates in their own backyards. heck, despite the 2-0 scoreline we're probably still not as good as this NZ side (ok maybe we are).

the bottom line is that there isn't a binary "we suck or we don't" quantized reality. there is a vast continuum from 2003 "we lost to canada" to 20?? "we're a G8 or T9 side ourselves".

right now, we're good enough to finally win ODI series (and maybe the odd test match) against the likes of NZ, WI, and PAK when we're at home and have these low slow pitches. but when we go to NZ, we'll get our tails handed to us against the same exact side we now lead 2-0. this also means that associates like Ireland and Afghanistan have no hope in Mirpur or Chittagong or Bogra, but would have all sorts of chances in Dublin or Barbados or Perth.

our development continues, and we're definitely on the right track, despite not being were we eventually want to be.

Baundule
October 12, 2010, 05:55 AM
All the Siddons haters got a big thapor on their face after consecutive victories over the Kiwis.
That explains the thought process of Sid-lovers. :D

lamisa
October 12, 2010, 10:14 AM
ATRM bhai,biye shaadi shob shere nisen?!

Raynman
October 12, 2010, 10:34 AM
As Miraz bhai said, these two wins only show what we have been screaming all along of where we should be with our cricket and not what has been paraded as a unrealistic dream.

For all the Siddons love, why is it fully ignored that at the end of the day its still his ugly step children (the bowlers) that have delivered.

There are still things about the Siddons mentality that bother me that needs to be addressed. Look at waiting for the batting PP till the 46th over in ODI one. NZ despite being 7 wickets down took the batting PP early on and it paid off for them (55-0).

My issue with Siddons has always been lack of belief and uber-defensive which is still an issue. His statements about us not being able to win without Tamim were pure garbage. For all its worth, note that this year (taking into account where ODI has come) we are yet to have a 6+ Run rate in a full 50 over match (setting or chasing).

Shakib was right to put the ownership on Nafees for not continuing on to get the century and complete a 10 wicket win. Thats the aggressiveness and attitude we need. This is what had been supressed most of this year by Grandmaster Jamie.

Fazal
October 12, 2010, 10:47 AM
Me no little English...

confused before ...Taklu Go or No Go?

me think before taklu go ... but now after this? I say, ogo....no go.

Me also think ATRM is now a real MAN after bagh shikar.

paagla
October 12, 2010, 01:08 PM
Couldn't stay quiet anymore. I have been always been a supporter of Jamie Siddons. He is realistic guy, makes realistic comments and looks into the bigger picture than occasional success. All his work has been so far to create a more consistent team.

riankhan
October 12, 2010, 01:15 PM
Me no little English...

confused before ...Taklu Go or No Go?

me think before taklu go ... but now after this? I say, ogo....no go.

Me also think ATRM is now a real MAN after bagh shikar.

So.....ATMR got married? Good news! Congrats to him.

Nice to see you around as well.

akabir77
October 12, 2010, 01:48 PM
As Miraz bhai said, these two wins only show what we have been screaming all along of where we should be with our cricket and not what has been paraded as a unrealistic dream.

so this two mean < the two loss with the *** team who made us play in the water. on top who know whether those matches were fixed or not!!!


For all the Siddons love, why is it fully ignored that at the end of the day its still his ugly step children (the bowlers) that have delivered.

When did he said that he doesn't like bowlers? our bowlers are still not that good compare to other teams and that shows when we travel. when was the last time we took 10 wkts?



There are still things about the Siddons mentality that bother me that needs to be addressed. Look at waiting for the batting PP till the 46th over in ODI one. NZ despite being 7 wickets down took the batting PP early on and it paid off for them (55-0).


We tried couple time to take the PP early and got bowled out before the 50 over. yes its strategy i also don't like but can't argue that there r no merit to it.

My issue with Siddons has always been lack of belief and uber-defensive which is still an issue. His statements about us not being able to win without Tamim were pure garbage. For all its worth, note that this year (taking into account where ODI has come) we are yet to have a 6+ Run rate in a full 50 over match (setting or chasing).


how do you know that he didn't say that intentionally to fire up rest of the gang. after all no bd cricket has yet to complain about him. were as tamim and other over and over again said they r what they r because of him, which for some reason you guys ignore and try to argue that is not the case...

Shakib was right to put the ownership on Nafees for not continuing on to get the century and complete a 10 wicket win. Thats the aggressiveness and attitude we need. This is what had been supressed most of this year by Grandmaster Jamie.
BTW siddon said the same to SN in the dressing room even before sakib said that to the press.

I think we are analyzing too much. just look at the big picture and i can guarantee that bd team is 50% better with him then any other theoretical coaches. Siddon is >>> whatmore. whatMore actually distoryed our cricket in my mind. now at least our players know what is TEST cricket and may be in next generation we can be top 3.

Siddon might not be the best but saying that he is good for nothing is a FALTU KOTHA.

roman
October 12, 2010, 02:05 PM
Me no little English...


me think before taklu go ... but now after this? I say, ogo....no go.



Classic!!!:floor:

_Rafi_
October 12, 2010, 02:15 PM
Whatmore was a tactical coach than a technical coach. He always tried and encouraged our team to play aggressive cricket. He always gave exposure to dashing batsmen who were inconsistent but on their day who could beat anyone. Thats why we used to lose matches pathetically and sneaked one win in between some matches. Imo he worked on fluke theory.
On the other hand Siddons is a technical coach. He is not aggressive and not also defensive but a steady coach. He works on shaping our players ability permanent. Thats why we were pushing hard and harder big teams before winning against England and Nz. We will be benefitted from his works even after his departure. There will be many key players in BD team who were shaped under Siddons in future. Now which player of Whatmore era able to keep his place in current BD team?
Btw Whatmore also lost to Ireland in 07 wc and was not in good condition against Bermuda.

Murad
October 12, 2010, 02:23 PM
Whatmore destroyed our cricket? how did he destroy our cricket?

ektu explain korben, kabir bhai?

Ajfar
October 12, 2010, 02:58 PM
Raynman bhai how are the bowlers his step children's? Ya he called out the bowlers from time to time or threw them under the bus, so what he can't be tough on his players? what if he did it to fire them up? Also I would like to point out to you few weeks before Ian Pont had joined JS mentioned in an interview he's is trying to spend more time with the bowlers due to the fact that we don't have a full time bowling coach. And the bowlers also mentioned that JS with working with them but they would prefer to have a full time bowling coach so they can work one on one because JS still has to give time to the batsman. I don't like how our management thinks batting is more important than bowling, and how we always pack the team with an extra batsman because we are afraid of a batting collapse but calling the bowlers "his step children" is a bit too much.

If you ask me we took the batting PP at the best possible time, you know why cause we had Shakib there? I didn't watch the end of BD batting so please correct me if i'm wrong. But looking at the scorecard, these are the batsman that came before and after shakib- Rakibul, Mushy, Riyad, Nayeem. From this list I think only Mushy could have hit a few boundaries during the PP overs, Riyad and Nayeem are both horribly out of form. I think the plan was to take the batting PP when Shakib was there, assuming he sticks around for a while. I would have loved to see us take the batting PP between the 30th and the 39th over because thats when Mushy and Shakib was batting. But look at the rest of the batting order, I don't think we could have survived till the 49th over had we taken the batting PP much earlier. us having a batting collapse in the PP over is given, yes we need to work on it. But given the match situation IMO JS/Shakib did the right thing by not taking the batting PP early on.

betaar
October 12, 2010, 03:22 PM
the bottom line is that there isn't a binary "we suck or we don't" quantized reality.

Isn't that what makes cricket the game it is?

akabir77
October 12, 2010, 03:47 PM
Whatmore destroyed our cricket? how did he destroy our cricket?

ektu explain korben, kabir bhai?

apner poster er upoer post poren taholai bujben. in his 5 year we got ash, kapali and aftab all fluke buz players who were not even good for T20. he didn't corrected players technics. which they couldn't learn from domestic as there were no coaches or anybody to teach them. I believe if siddons or some one like him (i preferred Mciness) was our coach during that time or we had Adi Barlow we could have become a much stronger team by now. after all we scored 400 in the first ever test innings. and then???? he dropped players like bulbul, akram nanu when boytoy like ash was drinking his mom's milk and put him in the front. now we have lost ash too(There r more players like rokon and etc was destroyed by him) because he couldn't finish drinking his mom's milk and now starving from nutrition.... lol. I am not saying it was dav's fault, we shouldn't have hired him at that stage. once we grow stronger and can fight with G8 then hiring him would have made more sense.

Raynman
October 12, 2010, 04:06 PM
Raynman bhai how are the bowlers his step children's? Ya he called out the bowlers from time to time or threw them under the bus, so what he can't be tough on his players? what if he did it to fire them up? Also I would like to point out to you few weeks before Ian Pont had joined JS mentioned in an interview he's is trying to spend more time with the bowlers due to the fact that we don't have a full time bowling coach. And the bowlers also mentioned that JS with working with them but they would prefer to have a full time bowling coach so they can work one on one because JS still has to give time to the batsman. I don't like how our management thinks batting is more important than bowling, and how we always pack the team with an extra batsman because we are afraid of a batting collapse but calling the bowlers "his step children" is a bit too much.

If you ask me we took the batting PP at the best possible time, you know why cause we had Shakib there? I didn't watch the end of BD batting so please correct me if i'm wrong. But looking at the scorecard, these are the batsman that came before and after shakib- Rakibul, Mushy, Riyad, Nayeem. From this list I think only Mushy could have hit a few boundaries during the PP overs, Riyad and Nayeem are both horribly out of form. I think the plan was to take the batting PP when Shakib was there, assuming he sticks around for a while. I would have loved to see us take the batting PP between the 30th and the 39th over because thats when Mushy and Shakib was batting. But look at the rest of the batting order, I don't think we could have survived till the 49th over had we taken the batting PP much earlier. us having a batting collapse in the PP over is given, yes we need to work on it. But given the match situation IMO JS/Shakib did the right thing by not taking the batting PP early on.

Jamie's focus has been solely on batting since he got here and not only that its been defensive minded Test style batting. He has his moments as a batting coach but my qualm as always been with him as a head coach. On numerous occasions he has blamed the bowling for losing the matches when the batsmen as a unit have not done anything of substance. He has build the team 8 man batting deep and there have been many reports/interviews/posts about bowlers feeling less important to the batsmen under his tenure.

About the PP, he has very little knowlege about aggressive batting and that is evident in our ODIs and T20s. Tamim's aggressive nature predates Siddons taking over.

He established crappy rules like the top 3 or 4 batsman had licence to hit out at any balls they wanted. He openly stated that the team has no chance of winning once Tamim is out. These are not signs of a good head coach with a solid plan.

Raynman
October 12, 2010, 04:10 PM
Siddon might not be the best but saying that he is good for nothing is a FALTU KOTHA.

..as is putting him on a pedastal when we win and shielding him when we lose.

He is basically a defensive batting coach trying to guise himself as a head coach.

kalpurush
October 12, 2010, 04:12 PM
These wins are no excuse for losing to minnows. Gimme the world cup and I might forget. Otherwise, meh. Learn to beat minnows first.
Love it!!!

kalpurush
October 12, 2010, 04:17 PM
Me no little English...

confused before ...Taklu Go or No Go?

me think before taklu go ... but now after this? I say, ogo....no go.

Me also think ATRM is now a real MAN after bagh shikar.
:lol::lol::lol:
Fazal bhai - onek din porey upnakey pelam BC tey. How you been?

auntu
October 12, 2010, 04:34 PM
[বাংলা]এই ধরনের সুতা কি লক করার সময় এসে গেলো নাকি?
[/বাংলা]

yaseer
October 12, 2010, 08:15 PM
apner poster er upoer post poren taholai bujben. in his 5 year we got ash, kapali and aftab all fluke buz players who were not even good for T20. he didn't corrected players technics. which they couldn't learn from domestic as there were no coaches or anybody to teach them. I believe if siddons or some one like him (i preferred Mciness) was our coach during that time or we had Adi Barlow we could have become a much stronger team by now. after all we scored 400 in the first ever test innings. and then???? he dropped players like bulbul, akram nanu when boytoy like ash was drinking his mom's milk and put him in the front. now we have lost ash too(There r more players like rokon and etc was destroyed by him) because he couldn't finish drinking his mom's milk and now starving from nutrition.... lol. I am not saying it was dav's fault, we shouldn't have hired him at that stage. once we grow stronger and can fight with G8 then hiring him would have made more sense.

All these happened before Whatmore started his era. You mixed up times brother.

Zeeshan
October 13, 2010, 01:43 AM
Congratulations Asif bhai. Please convey my best to bhabi.

BANFAN
October 13, 2010, 06:57 AM
..as is putting him on a pedastal when we win and shielding him when we lose.

He is basically a defensive batting coach trying to guise himself as a head coach.

Superb.

And crediting him for SN's batting is ridiculous. A player who doesn;t listen to him (Tamim, Shak) & comes new to the team (SN, Zahurul), plays well. Someone he seriously coaches, fails (Ash, Mullah, Nayeem, Goboy, Rok, .....) Let them stay a period out of team, they will play superb comeback innings, because they will forget some rubish they learnt. Team won the 2nd ODI for bowlers and first for Shak... where is JS's contribution to forget the losses against IRE/Ned?

Ajfar
October 13, 2010, 08:54 AM
Congratulations Asif bhai. Please convey my best to bhabi.

Asif bhai ki opurbor moto paliye giye biye korlen naki?

lamisa
October 13, 2010, 09:15 AM
this JS ddiscussion is like, which came first,the chicken or the egg...

Aahiyan
October 13, 2010, 09:26 AM
I think he will stay here for more 5 years. I think he is doing good job for us.

beshideshi
October 13, 2010, 09:52 AM
Jamie's focus has been solely on batting since he got here and not only that its been defensive minded Test style batting. He has his moments as a batting coach but my qualm as always been with him as a head coach. On numerous occasions he has blamed the bowling for losing the matches when the batsmen as a unit have not done anything of substance. He has build the team 8 man batting deep and there have been many reports/interviews/posts about bowlers feeling less important to the batsmen under his tenure.

About the PP, he has very little knowlege about aggressive batting and that is evident in our ODIs and T20s. Tamim's aggressive nature predates Siddons taking over.

He established crappy rules like the top 3 or 4 batsman had licence to hit out at any balls they wanted. He openly stated that the team has no chance of winning once Tamim is out. These are not signs of a good head coach with a solid plan.

I am sorry, but I must poke my nose here. If you have a look at our recent test matches, we have batter for 200~ overs in each game, and if you are to even draw[let aside win] you will have to bat for more than 200 overs in a game. As long as Bangladeshis have the mentality that "test" batting is "bad" strategy, we won't go forward, we will be running in circles and chasing the one off victory.
You might say slow batting doesn't go with ODIs, but even batting like Raqibul/Imrul a team can reach 230-240 and with a late boost by Shakib/Nayeem/Riyad it can easily reach 260-270. And if we can constantly score big runs, wins will come.
Also, has he done anything wrong by saying the bowlers cost us games? One game pops right up is the game where we scored 296 against India, no matter if you are playing cement pitch, with 296 on the board a bowling line up should be able to put some pressure on the opponent, but we were unable to put any pressure at all on India, which was just unacceptable in my opinion.
I agree that Siddons is not the best motivator, the way he said BD does not stand a chance of winning games without Tamim was quite disheartening, but the boys did prove him wrong. Who knows, it might have been a strategy to motivate the boys.
And the batting PP is still a mystery for us, when we take it early, we lose too many wickets and are all out within 50 and if left for the last 5, we are usually left without any proper batsmen, I think we will find the correct pocket for PP after some trial and error. I hope we find the right pocket before the WC arrives, for that we must try batting PP at different stages.

paagla
October 13, 2010, 02:44 PM
..as is putting him on a pedastal when we win and shielding him when we lose.

He is basically a defensive batting coach trying to guise himself as a head coach.

Everyone has thier own believes and other should respect that. And, i respect the fact that you are not a supporter and critic of Jamie. However, even a critic knows when to give credits for good work.

As i am a Siddons supporter, i gave him my critics when the team lost to IRE/NED.

But, now that the team doing better than ever, he deserves credit from everyone.

No reason, why you have to be stubborn as a mule

BanArafath
October 13, 2010, 08:09 PM
J Siddons started saying about spending more money on cricket to improve the facilities of Bangladesh cricket. Now BCB appointed Pont and Fountain for bowling and fielding coach. BCB took a step to refurbish the indoor practice facilities all around the country. Why the hell they didn't took those important steps before ??

If you want to blame some one about Bangladesh cricket thren blame BCB and do not blame Siddons.

thebest
October 14, 2010, 07:52 AM
Those who are arguing when JS said bowlers are stepson look at the deed; not the word. Rasel thrown out; Nazmul thrown out even Mash bundled out after 2/3 bad matches. Pathor, Chai played on and on irrespective of their contribution. Bowlers are always afraid one bad match and they are gone; while batsmen have the license to stay in the team. Then there are strategy of 8+3 combination. I still fail to understand what is the role of Riyad or Nayeem in the team. They could not contribute as batsman as when they come there is very little scope for them to settle and they are not front bowler. If we call them front line batsman why they are not coming before GoBoy and Sakib.
Tactically he is the worst coach ever though he is a good batting coach and BCB should appoint him as that

deshprem
October 14, 2010, 08:16 AM
J Siddons started saying about spending more money on cricket to improve the facilities of Bangladesh cricket. Now BCB appointed Pont and Fountain for bowling and fielding coach. BCB took a step to refurbish the indoor practice facilities all around the country. Why the hell they didn't took those important steps before ??

If you want to blame some one about Bangladesh cricket thren blame BCB and do not blame Siddons.

couldn't agree more. and people were reacting to siddons' requests by calling them complaints.

lamisa
October 14, 2010, 11:35 AM
i will say that this guy surely has bd's bst interest at heart thoug he might be dimwitted when h comes to plan out strategies.but now that we have 2 foreign coaches with experience from int'l level and county level,they can contribute in the planning and we will be all set to go!

akabir77
October 14, 2010, 01:01 PM
Those who are arguing when JS said bowlers are stepson look at the deed; not the word. Rasel thrown out; Nazmul thrown out even Mash bundled out after 2/3 bad matches. Pathor, Chai played on and on irrespective of their contribution. Bowlers are always afraid one bad match and they are gone; while batsmen have the license to stay in the team. Then there are strategy of 8+3 combination. I still fail to understand what is the role of Riyad or Nayeem in the team. They could not contribute as batsman as when they come there is very little scope for them to settle and they are not front bowler. If we call them front line batsman why they are not coming before GoBoy and Sakib.
Tactically he is the worst coach ever though he is a good batting coach and BCB should appoint him as that
So you are saying he should have made mash play with his medh bhuri?
Rassell should continue
I am not sure how you know nazmul was thrown out...

Do you who discovered sakib as a test bowler? guess?

paagla
October 14, 2010, 02:49 PM
Those who are arguing when JS said bowlers are stepson look at the deed; not the word. Rasel thrown out; Nazmul thrown out even Mash bundled out after 2/3 bad matches. Pathor, Chai played on and on irrespective of their contribution. Bowlers are always afraid one bad match and they are gone; while batsmen have the license to stay in the team. Then there are strategy of 8+3 combination. I still fail to understand what is the role of Riyad or Nayeem in the team. They could not contribute as batsman as when they come there is very little scope for them to settle and they are not front bowler. If we call them front line batsman why they are not coming before GoBoy and Sakib.
Tactically he is the worst coach ever though he is a good batting coach and BCB should appoint him as that

Here we have again. Someone making statements without knowing the fact. Dude, say what you feel, but don't make statements like they were known facts.

Rasel and Mash was injured for a while right after Siddons were in. And given the chance, Rasel was horrible at it.

Did you know Mash himself took out of the series after he came back from the long injury. becuase he was so out of shape, and he knew he wasn't ready for the international level.

Nazmul was injured for a while, and meantime Rubel and Shafiul came in with good pace and stats in domestic. So, Shahadat, Rubel, Shafiul continued until Mash is fit again.

Did you even know, Siddons cried out for a bowling coach in England tour. Why would he want a bowling coach for his bowlers if he doesn't care.

Fazal
October 14, 2010, 04:09 PM
Let it go.... let it go ...let it go ...
When team was not winning, right or wrong, coach should get some blame.
Now that the team is winning (atleast for this series), right or wrong, coach should get some credit.

What's wrong with you people?

Now this winning can be just for one series, thats fine. But as long as the team is winning the series, whats wrong to give some credit to the coach?

Bhai... tomra atoo pashan keno....ato kiptus keno? Ei jeetar deeney Taklu-ke ektu proshongsha korley ki amra bhikari hoyee jabo?

There is a time and place to criticise and the there is a time and place to priase.

Today, every one associated with BD cricket should get some credit.

al Furqaan
October 14, 2010, 08:27 PM
suppose we lose 0-3 to england, but 2 of the matches are close. close enough to where all and sundry of the UK media is surprised and praising BD.

then we happen to lose one match to the associates...should we fire him then?

this is a fairly likely scenario.

less likely, but quite improbable is a world cup 2007 like situation where we win against a major side but lose to minnows. so suppose we lose 1-2 to england, but then lose a match against Netherlands. should siddons go then too?

i think right now, the team is going through a "funk"...admittedly one of the worst funks we've been through relative to total team skill/talent, but a funk nonetheless. i think the BCB needs to do a better job of getting a support for Siddons' obvious weaknesses. essentially then need to make him a batting coach, and hire another bowling coach. lets see how this Italian fellow does.

wow, do i know our team and its inherent capabilities or what?

correctly predicted England series outcome, and correctly predicted that Netherlands might beat us. and correctly predicted that we're just in a funk, its not our true standard.

admiteddly our lower order batting funk is still there and just as bad as ever.

BanArafath
October 14, 2010, 09:03 PM
Here we have again. Someone making statements without knowing the fact. Dude, say what you feel, but don't make statements like they were known facts.

Rasel and Mash was injured for a while right after Siddons were in. And given the chance, Rasel was horrible at it.

Did you know Mash himself took out of the series after he came back from the long injury. becuase he was so out of shape, and he knew he wasn't ready for the international level.

Nazmul was injured for a while, and meantime Rubel and Shafiul came in with good pace and stats in domestic. So, Shahadat, Rubel, Shafiul continued until Mash is fit again.

Did you even know, Siddons cried out for a bowling coach in England tour. Why would he want a bowling coach for his bowlers if he doesn't care.

I totally agree with you paagla. Siddons do care about Bangladesh cricket and was asking for a bowling coach and also told BCB to increase the practice facilities in the domestic cricket for long time.

If we had these 3 coaching staffs 2 years ago we would see the improvement of Bangladesh team 2 years ago.BCB still need a good permanent coach for BD A team and give the A team same facilities as the national team having. so that we will always have back up players who will be fit to play for the national team.

makorsha
October 15, 2010, 12:15 AM
I totally agree with you paagla. Siddons do care about Bangladesh cricket and was asking for a bowling coach and also told BCB to increase the practice facilities in the domestic cricket for long time.

If we had these 3 coaching staffs 2 years ago we would see the improvement of Bangladesh team 2 years ago.BCB still need a good permanent coach for BD A team and give the A team same facilities as the national team having. so that we will always have back up players who will be fit to play for the national team.

Only the loosers who never played cricket in their entire lives dont like Taklo J S
we dont have any good coaches that can teach us how to play straight bat.....
it is easy to seat on the arm chair and criticize...
it is not the job ofa national team coach to teach these kids how to play ..
Js and Mccinnes did that...
so the so called pandits who expect miracles from a coach with bunch of talented blind hitters with good wristy shots and timing are bunch of fools..
WE NEED County or Ranji like infrustructre to produce world class cricketer....
look at Sakib ..he is sooooo different in tempertment and decision after just one county season...
Please forgive my spellings as I am just pissed off at some comments..
JS is the best thing that happens to BD cricket....

lamisa
October 15, 2010, 04:52 AM
ok,siddons sucks at making strategies,but surely he isn't the only strategy maker in the team.what does the caotain do?boshe boshe dim pare?

Zeeshan
October 15, 2010, 04:54 AM
Let it go.... let it go ...let it go ...
When team was not winning, right or wrong, coach should get some blame.
Now that the team is winning (atleast for this series), right or wrong, coach should get some credit.

What's wrong with you people?

Now this winning can be just for one series, thats fine. But as long as the team is winning the series, whats wrong to give some credit to the coach?

Bhai... tomra atoo pashan keno....ato kiptus keno? Ei jeetar deeney Taklu-ke ektu proshongsha korley ki amra bhikari hoyee jabo?

There is a time and place to criticise and the there is a time and place to priase.

Today, every one associated with BD cricket should get some credit.

agey apnar favoret pliyar motin koren tarpor kotha.... :-X

Beamer
October 15, 2010, 12:00 PM
Siddons on top of a cliff holding a rope looking below to see a few BC haters holding it tight for dear life. Let it go..let it go..screams Siddons? Fazal mamu can actually make a cartoon picture of it. He is good at that.

shakibrulz
October 15, 2010, 12:12 PM
People are more concerned about what he says in public. He's being realistic and taking the pressure off the team instead of burdening them with mammoth target. Bangladeshi first class cricket standards are poor. There is talent but you need good infrastructure and quality first class cricket to improve. Not everyone can be a Shakib or a Tamim. With whatever team Siddons got he's using them to full potential. He's concentrating more on improving technique, and gradually improving the consistency of the whole team. But I guess some people here prefer coaches with all gloss and no substance.

alibangali
October 15, 2010, 12:29 PM
Everyone involved with the team should naturally get the credit for winning however it is fairly obvious that both bowling and fielding had improved and credit should go to the coaches for making a swift impact. Also shakib's influence was so large in atleast two of the matches that if it was not for him things could have been different. I still fail to see how the head coach has made improvements since there was no noticeable change in his strategy. We are still continuing with the pp strategy which is failing and our batting is still inconsistent.
Improvements made by Fontaine and Pont seems to have saved JS for now.
<br />Posted via BC Mobile Edition (iPhone)

Ajfar
October 15, 2010, 01:20 PM
^ see there you go again, the team won but nah off course everyone else that's part of the team had something to do with it except JS.

Blah
October 15, 2010, 01:24 PM
http://i.imgur.com/DEBei.gif

paagla
October 15, 2010, 01:45 PM
Everyone involved with the team should naturally get the credit for winning however it is fairly obvious that both bowling and fielding had improved and credit should go to the coaches for making a swift impact. Also shakib's influence was so large in atleast two of the matches that if it was not for him things could have been different. I still fail to see how the head coach has made improvements since there was no noticeable change in his strategy. We are still continuing with the pp strategy which is failing and our batting is still inconsistent.
Improvements made by Fontaine and Pont seems to have saved JS for now.
<br />Posted via BC Mobile Edition (iPhone)

Do you even hear yourself talk . You sound like a Mule, who's too stubborn to admit things.

Siddons has been asking for a bowling coach for the longest time. Obviously, he had some strategy to ask for a bowling and fielding coach. As a head coach you need all the pieces to make the strategies work.

People were complaining, oh 240 score isn't good enough to win against top teams. But, look we won three of four games scoring in that range.

So, his strategy of consistent batting works now for us, now that he has a bowling and fielding coach to complete his strategy.

Is it too difficult to understand. I mean, when is the last time, we won a 3-0 against a top team. The asnwer is "NEVER"

riankhan
October 15, 2010, 02:10 PM
No one is perfect, Taklu is not an exception either. As a specialized Batting coach:
Siddons is a fail case if we consider Ash. Whether it is Schachin's tips, Whatmore or other coaches......nothing worked.

Look at Tamim, Junaed, Shakib, Mahmudullah or now SN! If they are improved and contributing to our cricket.....then some credit indeed goes to Mr. Jamie Siddons.

If we compare pre-Taklu days (i.e. 2005/06) to 2009/10, we will find clear sign of steady improvement.

RazabQ
October 15, 2010, 02:17 PM
Moderator warning: I see some name-calling creeping into this thread. Please try and be civil.

Raynman
October 15, 2010, 03:40 PM
I'm okay to give Siddons kudos for the improvements to the team. I just feel that he is/was not a positive head coach. I still think he doesn't understand modern aggressive batting, doesn't have a game plan, doesn't respect our T20 engagements/obligations, doesn't select an XI that is equally fair to bowlers and batsmen, doesn't play to win but rather to minimize the volume of defeat. Even at the begining of 4th ODI he thought this was 240 pitch. The way Shakib and Riyadh were going at certain points the projection was between 270-310.

All along it was the those that criticised Siddons (or should I say stubborn mules) who believed that we were capable of winning. It was the Siddons apologists that insisted winning was not a possibility. If Siddons was shielded for the loss to NED and IRE I don't see what the hoopla is to bestow on him massive praise for the wins vs. NZ. When we lost he was the one who pointed out that the bowlers let us down and that batting was as good as it could be and all the Siddons supporters jumped on that wagon and pointed out that bowling was not his department even as a head coach. And now we get questioned for calling the bowlers his step child?

Fazal
October 15, 2010, 05:43 PM
agey apnar favoret pliyar motin koren tarpor kotha.... :-X

Dui galey dui chumma to Motin :bighug:for not playing and therefore helping us winning three games in a row.

AsifTheManRahman
October 15, 2010, 05:48 PM
Ashraful = MoS

akabir77
October 15, 2010, 06:40 PM
read this

http://www.thedailystar.net/newDesign/news-details.php?nid=158611

This is what I am talking about what the haters!!! fail to see. I seriously doubt how much cricket knowledge you guys have if you didn't see the improvement (even before these wins) he didn't tried to get short cut success just like most of you haters want. No wonder in football no good coach can be kept. probably people like you (haters) holds the power over there or else how do you say we let go a wc team coach saying he doesn't know ****...

akabir77
October 15, 2010, 07:22 PM
read this
http://www.prothom-alo.com/detail/date/2010-10-16/news/101713

so saying this team cannot win without tamim was to fire up every one else. he believes every one has to play better to win not just one or two so saying that jaust proves that he was trying to undermined every one to fire them up

Ajfar
October 15, 2010, 07:29 PM
When we lost he was the one who pointed out that the bowlers let us down and that batting was as good as it could be.

When was this?

Bond
October 15, 2010, 07:30 PM
My brother works out at the shonagaon gym, he told me he ran into Dan Vettori and took pictures with him, the kiwi players were very polite and true gentlemen. He then saw the Bangladeshi players and he decided not to take pictures with them, he's not much into cricket but he told me, "bhaiya ekta dabbu shada coach oder ke boltese weights koro, chest press koro, kintu modonta cycling kora start korse, coach er kotha keyo shuntesey na, english pare na onek jon" He also told me that they weren't taking the workouts seriously, did adda most of the time while the kiwi players were training pretty hard lol.

In conclusion, it was a tough task for Siddons and it still is, I respect the guy because no other coach has turned consistent players like Imrul (even though i hate his s.rate), tamim and co. Thank God I was never against him. :)

lamisa
October 16, 2010, 02:24 AM
^^^ei jonnoi toh eto joldi tired hoye jay ei meyegula!

BANFAN
October 16, 2010, 02:24 AM
ok,siddons sucks at making strategies,but surely he isn't the only strategy maker in the team.what does the caotain do?boshe boshe dim pare?

Captain of BD cannot yet over rule the decision of the coach, infact no captain can. If he does, that's a confrontation with the coach and captain doesnt survive in such confrontations. Example: Greg & Ganguly

Zeeshan
October 16, 2010, 02:44 AM
Hearsay much, bond and lamisa? :)

Equinox
October 16, 2010, 04:24 AM
A common argument used by the Siddons haters it that Siddons gets too much credit. They say that whenever we win everyone credits Siddons and when we lose it's the players' or BCB's fault. This series has shown that that is BS. While everyone has got their fair share of appreciation for the performance, even Lotus Kamal, no one is prepared to give any credit to Siddons. The only Siddons thread opened (the article by Md. Islam) hasn't got a single serious response. So this proves the opposite of what the Siddons haters have been arguing. Whenever we lose its Siddons fault and our wins have nothing to do with him. That's the attitude in BC.

BANFAN
October 16, 2010, 04:46 AM
A common argument used by the Siddons haters it that Siddons gets too much credit. They say that whenever we win everyone credits Siddons and when we lose it's the players' or BCB's fault. This series has shown that that is BS. While everyone has got their fair share of appreciation for the performance, even Lotus Kamal, no one is prepared to give any credit to Siddons. The only Siddons thread opened (the article by Md. Islam) hasn't got a single serious response. So this proves the opposite of what the Siddons haters have been arguing. Whenever we lose its Siddons fault and our wins have nothing to do with him. That's the attitude in BC.

Highlight his contribution, will go all out to appreciate. Yet we have a PP issue, while not discrediting him for that is kind of being nice with him.

shakibrulz
October 16, 2010, 06:14 AM
Highlight his contribution, will go all out to appreciate. Yet we have a PP issue, while not discrediting him for that is kind of being nice with him.
I can't believe this. Don't you see the improvement in batsmen's technique? Who gets credit for that? I agree they could've done better but still they're managing a defendable total on this slow track. Powerplay issue - is it his problem that wickets are falling during the powerplays? First target they got to achieve is bat out the full 50 overs.

BANFAN
October 16, 2010, 06:42 AM
I can't believe this. Don't you see the improvement in batsmen's technique? Who gets credit for that?

Ya I can see Rakibul improved in technique; he gets credit for that. Are yu talking about someone different? Can you name that batsman please?

I agree they could've done better but still they're managing a defendable total on this slow track.

Look closely Who are the batsman managed to get these totals, although defended, but I won;t call them outright defendable. Credit goes to some excellent bowling & fielding.

Powerplay issue - is it his problem that wickets are falling during the powerplays?

Is this some new phenomenon? Wickets are supposed to fall if you tell some unsettled tailender to come and start smoking 6s. That's why people suggest taking powerplay when you have two set batsmen in the crease and all the other teams are doing that. Even NZ did it and they were successful.

I don't believe, we are trying to credit him for Shakib & SNs batting, where JS had nothing to do. And make the players responsible for taking wrong PP decision.

First target they got to achieve is bat out the full 50 overs.

That pretty much describes your mind set & JS's. I don't agree to that at all. Our first target is to win. I don;t want to bat 50 overs for losing the match.

Yet, I'm happy with JS, that he has changed almost all his crappy principles and policies and that is allowing our team to flourish. I wish he realized it 2 years back and didnt push his nonsense ideas, we would be much ahead now. I thank him for abstaining from doing things he thought was the right way. Most importantly, we have been able to change his attitude he came with "If someone thinks that Bangladesh can beat the G8 teams, they are fools". Now He has made himself a fool. And if I compare, he has learnt much more from this two years as a coach than our players have from him. There is nothing to appreciate, infact he should be thankfull to us for such a scolarship of coaching training,

WarWolf
October 16, 2010, 07:04 AM
Top post BANFAN.

I don't want to take the credit away from JS when it's due. But some ppl have been trying to give him unreasonable credits. Please justify your logic.

shakibrulz
October 16, 2010, 07:09 AM
Ya I can see Rakibul improved in technique; he gets credit for that. Are yu talking about someone different? Can you name that batsman please?

Imrul, Tamim, Junaid, Jahurul


Look closely Who are the batsman managed to get these totals, although defended, but I won;t call them outright defendable. Credit goes to some excellent bowling & fielding.
See, not only this series, you can see this trend overall. Was the middle order strong before too? Except 2 or 3 times, the team managed to make the 250ish score.



Is this some new phenomenon? Wickets are supposed to fall if you tell some unsettled tailender to come and start smoking 6s. That's why people suggest taking powerplay when you have two set batsmen in the crease and all the other teams are doing that. Even NZ did it and they were successful.
Even NZ? They have Ross taylor to Mills and tuffey who can bat, who do BD have other than Iceman? Even Naeem looked like a dead duck in the powerplays. And taking the powerplay is upto batsmen in the middle too. If they feel confident, they can go for it. It's the way it works.


I don't believe, we are trying to credit him for Shakib & SNs batting, where JS had nothing to do. And make the players responsible for taking wrong PP decision.
:lol: So Siddons has nothing to do with Shakib's batting? Yeah, siddons is selling some Rasagollas and earning some pocket money maybe.



That pretty much describes your mind set & JS's. I don't agree to that at all. Our first target is to win. I don;t want to bat 50 overs for losing the match.
Jeez, not this crap again.

What I said is to batting the full 50 overs = making the most of the oppurtunity. Even if it is a 10 or 20 runs, it is valuable. You must make sure that you are in a position to bat out the 50 overs before going for the kill. This applies to all teams.

Yet, I'm happy with JS, that he has changed almost all his crappy principles and policies and that is allowing our team to flourish. I wish he realized it 2 years back and didnt push his nonsense ideas, we would be much ahead now. I thank him for abstaining from doing things he thought was the right way. Most importantly, we have been able to change his attitude he came with "If someone thinks that Bangladesh can beat the G8 teams, they are fools". Now He has made himself a fool. And if I compare, he has learnt much more from this two years as a coach than our players have from him. There is nothing to appreciate, infact he should be thankfull to us for such a scolarship of coaching training,

The same rhetoric trash. Maybe he didn't burden the players with more pressure, that lets him to play more freely. And I cant help but :lol: at the argument that he learned more from BD.

Almost average in 30'ish in first class cricket. And they enjoy similar if not better success in International level. Who gets the credit? Players or the coach? For you obviously players improved their technique out of thin air and became proper batsmen rather than a bunch of hit or miss sloggers.

Ajfar
October 16, 2010, 07:47 AM
JS had nothing to do with Shakibs batting? BANFAN bhai you couldnt sound any more ridiculous? See if you can get your rest of the we hate siddon crew to agree with you on this one.
<br />Posted via BC Mobile Edition (iPhone)

riankhan
October 16, 2010, 07:57 AM
I can't believe this. Don't you see the improvement in batsmen's technique? Who gets credit for that?

Chacha...;)
Even changing Shakib's Batting style (back-lift, pull etc) == Chacha? :lol:

I don't know about other areas, but batting certainly improved due to some of Taklu's effort.

alibangali
October 16, 2010, 08:04 AM
Do you even hear yourself talk . You sound like a Mule, who's too stubborn to admit things.


This is one of the reason's why I comment on BC rarely even though I visit it everyday.

If you read out my full post you would see that I was giving credit to JS but as WarWolf said he was getting unreasonable credit.


I don't want to take the credit away from JS when it's due. But some ppl have been trying to give him unreasonable credits. Please justify your logic.


It was made to look like as if JS brought us those wins when it was the success of the players and the two new coaches who contributed greatly to those wins. JS deserves credit for those wins since he is part of the team however I failed to notice any signs of his greatness in those wins. What I saw was the greatness of our players especially the huge improvements in bowling and fielding.

It seems that the positive energy from the two new coaches is balancing with the negative energy from JS quite nicely :-D.

BANFAN
October 16, 2010, 08:22 AM
JS had nothing to do with Shakibs batting? BANFAN bhai you couldnt sound any more ridiculous? See if you can get your rest of the we hate siddon crew to agree with you on this one.
<br />Posted via BC Mobile Edition (iPhone)

Shakib and Tamim are two guys that JS never intervened, even if they had flaws in technique, they were scoring with those. They never played to the team rules. They practiced and perfected their batting with the flaws they have and still doing good with that.

More over, They were good before JS came. JS had more important tasks to improve batting of Goboy, Rakib, Junaid, Imrul, Ash, Mullah, Nayeem ........ if he was ignoring these guys and spending time after Shakib & Tamim only .. he definitely hasn;t been able to identify his priority. These two guys needed least attention of the coach. Yet, if you want to give some credit to him, you must prove his ability through the development of some weaker guys. That substantiation is missing.

We won all the three matches through bowlers and batting of Shakib, SN and IK. SN is another guy, whp has got least scope of JS coaching, he just joined a few days before the series. So, if you have a neutral approach, you will see how microscopic his contribution is in these victories. Which can easily be netralized by his policy blunders.

You need to find out some example who has been directly mentored by him and has made improvement or find out some great team rules/policies which has contributed to improvement. On that, his major undertaking was Ash, he has perished. His major batting team rule has ruined many and finally abandone, his assessment of us as a team only delayed us to make this 3-0 type things happen much earlier. His defeatist attitude engulfed the morale of the team and when the team found their back against the wall, they changed their attitude and now you don't find JS saying that we can't beat G8, but still he is holding us back with some defeatist attitude, we were about to make the 3rd ODI look very competitive through the timid defensive batting of ROK & Junaid.

You can blame the players for that, but attidude of the average team members reflects the Coaches Instruction much better than the top and the bottom guys, who donot or cannot reflect the coach/teacher/trainer appropriately.

YES, I give him credit for not trying to change these two guys, as he tried with Ash and a few others, who all have nose dived.

shakibrulz
October 16, 2010, 08:57 AM
Shakib and Tamim are two guys that JS never intervened, even if they had flaws in technique, they were scoring with those. They never played to the team rules. They practiced and perfected their batting with the flaws they have and still doing good with that.
Care to explain? Any proofs to back this claims except your fantasies?

Zunaid
October 16, 2010, 09:05 AM
http://www.cricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/452976.html

Under the tutelage of Mohammad Salauddin, the national academy coach, Tamim spent hours and hours in the nets, working on his weaknesses and converting them into strengths, such as his flick through the leg side, which has now become one of his bread-and-butter boundary shots. And at the suggestion of the head coach, Jamie Siddons, Tamim widened his stance to improve his balance against quick bowling, a tip that has sent him soaring towards the top.

"Jamie didn't try to change me, he just suggested things that he believed would make me a better cricketer," said Tamim. "He said if I took a wide stance, like Graeme Smith for instance, I would be halfway to the ball already and I'd save myself time when getting on the front foot. If you see him at practice, he's a fantastic batting coach and a brilliant fielding coach as well, the best I've ever seen."

Although Siddons is not everyone's cup of tea within the Bangladesh Cricket Board, Tamim's endorsement is a testament to the success that his elite-focused methods have had since he took over as head coach at the end of 2007. In Tamim's opinion, most of the problems lie in the age-old issue of communication, but he believes it's a situation that cuts both ways.

It's not all black and white ....

Equinox
October 16, 2010, 09:05 AM
Lmao at "Shakib and Tamim are two guys that JS never intervened." I think you got that from Tamim's interview. What he meant was Siddons didn't try to change his approach or mentality. But JS most certainly worked on their techniques. You make it sound like as if Siddons left them alone and gave them the license to practice however they wanted and they improved themselves. In the same interview Tamim credited Siddons as the best coach he has ever worked with.

riankhan
October 16, 2010, 09:19 AM
http://www.cricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/452976.html

It's not all black and white ....

Pretty good timing :) :four:

Ajfar
October 16, 2010, 09:31 AM
Banfan bhai I guess you know more about Tamim and his game than Tamim himself.

shakibrulz
October 16, 2010, 09:44 AM
http://www.cricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/452976.html



It's not all black and white ....
Epic Pwnage.

Rifat
October 16, 2010, 09:57 AM
for me personally, I am neither a Siddons hater nor a Siddons lover.
However, despite the recent results, Siddons has made too many controvertial decisions in the past to get my vote of confidence. Batting powerplay, ignoring weak aspects of our bowling is one of them.


I am with the opinion that he is a very good batting coach but definitely not a good head coach.
as soon as he came in, he said that Bangladesh players need to learn batting techniques that Aussie players learn at school level. so he immediately heavily focused on batting.

I just didn't appreciate the fact that he told players "we are not good enough to win"...which can be argued both ways, but some famous cricketer said, "90% of the game is played in the mind".

the results paid off in the test arena: although we didn't win a test match except West Indies, it is a huge achivement in and of itself stretching the test until 5 days against the likes of Sri Lanka, India, England and New Zealand, more consistently than before, and this happened largely due to improved performance in our batting where before Jamie Siddons, it was innings defeat most of the time.

I keep saying this, I could be wrong. but the recent success has more to do with Boys working harder than never before with Ian Pont and Julian Fountain rather than with Jamie Siddons.

akabir77
October 16, 2010, 12:13 PM
this is very funny saying two new coaches who came less then a month ago has more to do... so you didn't saw those close matches? you didn't saw how we used to play (go and watch 2003 WC and WC2007) and then watch some games now. how we are so confident how we can still fight after 4/5 wickets down. can u tell me one time we scored over 200 after loosing 4/5 wickets and among those wickets were also the big wickets like ash? no. if you couldn't see those changes then again i don't think u follow real cricket. yest if you bring stats we had bad stats but i am saying watching cricket with your own eyes and see the difference. I can guaranty that anyone watched bd games all the time from 97 to now and tell me they don't see a BIG difference then they just follow cricinfo and watch a game here and there. I can say this because over the year i have taken vacations/sick leaves to watch most games. and now then ever (even without these wins) we have a big difference in attitude(every where). yeah there r place to improve but you can't make a number 11 team(yeah kenya and IR was better than us) number 6/7 and have every thing top notch in over night. if you think that any coach in the world can do it then i have nothing to say. but he is the best option for us. now that we have good baters now he moved to bowling and then other aspects. we were losing a match even before it started as we used to lose 4/5 wickets in 10 overs. we still will do that some times but most time we wont lose a match because we lost too many wickets and hence thats the biggest change we needed. now that we have that we can move to other aspects... but saying he shouldn't have said that bd can't win was bad is .... look he said that and bd won the series and he put pressure on other players. so let him do his thing don't just judge and say he should say this or that when that is what our players needs

WarWolf
October 16, 2010, 01:06 PM
Kabir bhai thanks for the good arguments.

I am again saying that I wanna give him the credit due to him. He is definitely a good batting coach. But he lacks head coach material. Simple. Isn't it?

if you couldn't see those changes then again i don't think u follow real cricket. yest if you bring stats we had bad stats but i am saying watching cricket with your own eyes and see the difference. I can guaranty that anyone watched bd games all the time from 97 to now and tell me they don't see a BIG difference then they just follow cricinfo and watch a game here and there. I can say this because over the year i have taken vacations/sick leaves to watch most games. Brother your logic is simply inappropriate here. Please don't compare with the team from 97 here. How many of the players even in 2004 came into national side having first class average above 40? This team has at least 3 players of that category. So your logic doesn't apply here. The quality of cricketers coming to the side is much higher now. I am sure JS doesn't get credit for the pipeline improvement. Right?


Now that we have good baters now he moved to bowling and then other aspects.Simply funny. Je radhe sha chul o badhe. Working with batting doesn't mean you cannot work with bowling and fielding!!!

He lacks vision. This is the reason he couldn't get the head coach position in the Australia team after Buchanan lost it. He had to come to Bangladesh.

auntu
October 16, 2010, 01:30 PM
JS is doing good. He was the best choice we had so far.

---end of story---

WarWolf
October 17, 2010, 03:19 AM
I went to stadium today. Had to come back once they got all out below 174. A pathetic display of ugly batting. Only Shakib did a few runs along with Vimrul. The rest of them are simply bunch of losers.

Guys you need to understand one thing. We won the series because of bowling and fielding.Not Batting. Please omit Shakib's runs from the board, you will see how painful the scoreboards look.

TIme to wake up.

WarWolf
October 17, 2010, 03:21 AM
The loser doesn't understand the meaning of PP at all. When we are 6 wickets down only after 31 overs, we must have taken PP. But we didn't. Following his own strategy we have added only around 35 runs after that, though we played 14 overs more. Bravo!!!

We have scored 820 runs in total in the series. Among those Shakib alone scored 213 runs which makes it 26% of the total runs scored by Bangladesh. What the other players did then? Here we are talking about so called batting improvements.

reyme
October 17, 2010, 03:51 AM
The thing that piss me off is the coach is just a spectator. Totally unmoved and watches the game as if came to watch the game after buying a ticket. No proactive activity at all. If it was not for Shakib, we will all be asking for his head.

Nasif
October 17, 2010, 04:22 AM
The thing that piss me off is the coach is just a spectator. Totally unmoved and watches the game as if came to watch the game after buying a ticket. No proactive activity at all. If it was not for Shakib, we will all be asking for his head.

Not true, Siddons just few overs ago signaled Shakib to bring on shafi/rubel instead of spinners.

Equinox
October 17, 2010, 04:24 AM
I don't know where some of you get this stuff from. Siddons is more pro-active than any other coach in International cricket.

WarWolf
October 17, 2010, 04:27 AM
Some people says that he improved the techniques of the players. May this is partially true. This is job.

The above assumption is not true for at least some of the players. Mushfiq is always vulnerable against quick incoming deliveries and gets himself out by getting bowled or LBWed. Today the same thing happened. I don't see any improvement here. Also his form and scores doesn't seem to improve at all.

reyme
October 17, 2010, 04:29 AM
Not true, Siddons just few overs ago signaled Shakib to bring on shafi/rubel instead of spinners.

Yes, after all the commies were talking about it for a while...I saw him coming out, but its probabaly a message came from some BCB officials...

Equinox
October 17, 2010, 04:30 AM
Yes, after all the commies were talking about it for a while...I saw him coming out, but its probabaly a message came from some BCB officials...
lol...you funny

reyme
October 17, 2010, 04:32 AM
Siddons talks about personal improvement, I think he himself needs some improvement to stay as a head coach.

reyme
October 17, 2010, 04:34 AM
Its not funny, its sad really, He is a test team head coach....he needs to get his basics straight...

Baundule
October 17, 2010, 06:03 AM
I don't know where some of you get this stuff from. Siddons is more pro-active than any other coach in International cricket.
Buchanan is much more pro-active than Siddons. Appointed as an consultant of the ECB, his first go is against KP, the batsman the Aussies fear the most.

Zeeshan
October 17, 2010, 06:05 AM
okay lets not debate on this joyous occasion :)

Miraz
October 17, 2010, 06:07 AM
Siddons should get due credit.

However, we must not forget batting remains messy as a whole with no startegy and clue to use powerplay.

It's the bowlers who are winning matches. Ian Pont should be also applauded for the transformation of pace bowlers.

Congrats to all the coaching staff!!

reyme
October 17, 2010, 06:30 AM
Congrats to all coaching staff. They worked very hard during the last 2 months and it paid off.

Imtiazk
October 17, 2010, 06:31 AM
I just posted this on the match thread; it was meant to be here. Sorry !

This will be my only post here. Just back from Dhaka last night having seen us go up 3 - 0 on Thursday.

Many people here have unfairly made ill-informed comments on Siddons. If losing two ODI's to associates is a dismissable offence then winning 4 - 0 against a top 8 side [ no.2 at the beginning of the year ] must at least erase that.

The feeling and hostility shown to him was unfair but typical of many here who gets on a high horse [ more like a donkey ] but cannot get off it gracefully.

Siddons may not be a great coach. But certainly the best we have ever had. In every conceivable way we have the best stats today than ever before ; team or individual.

Certainly under no one else did we reach the #8 rank before in ODI. The overall performance in England in tests were miles better than here in 2005 !

He has shown humility and kept quite under criticism. His detractors should have equal humility and, for once, just may concede that they were ever so slightly wrong. Perhaps that is too much to ask !

Thank you, JS ! [ from someone who has followed cricket closely for almost 50 years ! ]

Nasif
October 17, 2010, 07:28 AM
I just posted this on the match thread; it was meant to be here. Sorry !

This will be my only post here. Just back from Dhaka last night having seen us go up 3 - 0 on Thursday.

Many people here have unfairly made ill-informed comments on Siddons. If losing two ODI's to associates is a dismissable offence then winning 4 - 0 against a top 8 side [ no.2 at the beginning of the year ] must at least erase that.

The feeling and hostility shown to him was unfair but typical of many here who gets on a high horse [ more like a donkey ] but cannot get off it gracefully.

Siddons may not be a great coach. But certainly the best we have ever had. In every conceivable way we have the best stats today than ever before ; team or individual.

Certainly under no one else did we reach the #8 rank before in ODI. The overall performance in England in tests were miles better than here in 2005 !

He has shown humility and kept quite under criticism. His detractors should have equal humility and, for once, just may concede that they were ever so slightly wrong. Perhaps that is too much to ask !

Thank you, JS ! [ from someone who has followed cricket closely for almost 50 years ! ]

Agreed 100%
He is the best we have had; no doubt.

zman
October 17, 2010, 07:35 AM
We didn't play our best cricket in this match no denying that. It's natural to be a little complacent when you're in the unfamiliar position of being up 3-0 in a series. How they fought back after making their fair share of mistakes and scraped out a win is what stood out for me in game 5. Isn't this the very quality that we'd been missing for so long! And isn't this the quality that made Australia great in the last couple decades!

riankhan
October 17, 2010, 07:54 AM
Siddons lives another day till the next defeat! Saved by an inch!

Claps for JS for his contributions. But bigger claps should go to Salahuddin (Spin coach).
JS may have coaching flaws....but over all, IMO...he's one of the best we had (along side R. Mackins and Eddie Barlow).

BANFAN
October 17, 2010, 08:12 AM
Batting improvement and Siddons contribution is one of the biggest myth of Banglacricket. The damages caused by him are more evident and we were taken 2.5 years behind. This position was expected after the 2007 world cup.

All our matches have been won by bowlers and batting of SN & Shakib, JS had nothing to do with them. Hats off to the bowling and fielding coaches, they have both created immediate impact. We are just 1.5 man batting side, by the grace of JS contribution.

Although, this guy will benefit from this series win even if we don't want and he is very quick to cash in. Clever guy, and it's essential for his survival as coach. You don;t survive with both incompetence and dumbness.

A good batting and head coach at this point could lift the team a lot. If we again start stuggling against inform teams, it is surely our batting, that will let us down. You can't expect 1/2 guys to perform all the time with bat. So, I'm happy at this victory and at the same time don;t like to go overboard, because our batting is really the weakest link, apart from 1/2 guys.

So WC success will largely depend on our batting. I hope they will give up JS mantra's and be self motivated to perfect on their own style of batting and make improvements as Shakib & TI has done. Self help is the best way for our batsmen .... let Shakib and TI be your example and inspiration.

_Rafi_
October 17, 2010, 08:14 AM
Alternate use of this thread: Vettori must go if Nz lose against Bangladesh.

Miraz
October 17, 2010, 08:22 AM
I am again saying Siddons should get due credit, but have you noticed the impact of Pont and Fontain?

They made immediate impact after joining the coaching staff. Fielding has been great except couple of blushes today. Bowling department looked completely different. The pace bowlers suddenly looked threatening.

Despite having a a batting coach in Siddons for the last 3 years, we could not see such impact in our batting department. Not to mention the overall strategy to the game. We could only muster 240 once in the series, yet we managed to win 4-0. Nobody except Shakib and to some extent Imrul was consistent with batting. This speaks volume about the impact of Pont and Fontain, and the contribution of bowling and fielding towards winning the series.

Similar scores with the typical shoddy fielding and radarless bowling would have seen the score line 4-0 in favour of New Zealand.

Siddons should now believe in the abilities of his boys and stop saying words like "We can only win if Tamim can score 150 or give a great start". he must change his strategy towards the game.

174 or 220 will not always win us games. Bowlers are doing their bit, which they were struggling before. Fielders are coming to the party. Now it's the BIG responsibility of Siddons to make the batting unit consistent. AND that includes proper use of the powerplay overs.


I rest my case.

_Rafi_
October 17, 2010, 08:32 AM
^new way of saying no!:-)

makorsha
October 17, 2010, 08:38 AM
Quote:
<TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=5 width="100%"><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-BOTTOM: #ffffff 1px solid; BORDER-LEFT: #ffffff 1px solid; BORDER-TOP: #ffffff 1px solid; BORDER-RIGHT: #ffffff 1px solid" class=alt2>Originally Posted by Imtiazk
This will be my only post here. Just back from Dhaka last night having seen us go up 3 - 0 on Thursday.

Many people here have unfairly made ill-informed comments on Siddons. If losing two ODI's to associates is a dismissable offence then winning 4 - 0 against a top 8 side [ no.2 at the beginning of the year ] must at least erase that.

The feeling and hostility shown to him was unfair but typical of many here who gets on a high horse [ more like a donkey ] but cannot get off it gracefully.

Siddons may not be a great coach. But certainly the best we have ever had. In every conceivable way we have the best stats today than ever before ; team or individual.

Certainly under no one else did we reach the #8 rank before in ODI. The overall performance in England in tests were miles better than here in 2005 !

He has shown humility and kept quite under criticism. His detractors should have equal humility and, for once, just may concede that they were ever so slightly wrong. Perhaps that is too much to ask !

Thank you, JS ! [ from someone who has followed cricket closely for almost 50 years ! ]

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

makorsha
October 17, 2010, 08:41 AM
some people are in denial and cant eat a humble pie for just the ego .....

makorsha
October 17, 2010, 08:46 AM
"Jamie didn't try to change me, he just suggested things that he believed would make me a better cricketer," said Tamim. "He said if I took a wide stance, like Graeme Smith for instance, I would be halfway to the ball already and I'd save myself time when getting on the front foot. If you see him at practice, he's a fantastic batting coach and a brilliant fielding coach as well, the best I've ever seen."

Although Siddons is not everyone's cup of tea within the Bangladesh Cricket Board, Tamim's endorsement is a testament to the success that his elite-focused methods have had since he took over as head coach at the end of 2007. In Tamim's opinion, most of the problems lie in the age-old issue of communication, but he believes it's a situation that cuts both ways.

"Bangladeshi guys are a little bit shy," he says. "But we need to understand that if you want to learn something, you have to go to the teacher, and ask them. You can't just sit on the back bench and do nothing, because if you want to improve, play well and do good for your country, you have to put in the effort yourself.

"Jamie, like many Australians, speaks a little bit fast, and when he first came in, some guys had a problem with that. But now he speaks to us very slowly, and though there are some guys who understand English very well, there are also some who don't, so I might translate, or Shakib, or Mushy. We have all been working well with him, and the results of what he's done are clear within the team."



source:
http://www.cricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/452976.html

Bugz
October 17, 2010, 08:49 AM
I am again saying Siddons should get due credit, but have you noticed the impact of Pont and Fontain?

They made immediate impact after joining the coaching staff. Fielding has been great except couple of blushes today. Bowling department looked completely different. The pace bowlers suddenly looked threatening.

Despite having a a batting coach in Siddons for the last 3 years, we could not see such impact in our batting department. Not to mention the overall strategy to the game. We could only muster 240 once in the series, yet we managed to win 4-0. Nobody except Shakib and to some extent Imrul was consistent with batting. This speaks volume about the impact of Pont and Fontain, and the contribution of bowling and fielding towards winning the series.

Similar scores with the typical shoddy fielding and radarless bowling would have seen the score line 4-0 in favour of New Zealand.

Siddons should now believe in the abilities of his boys and stop saying words like "We can only win if Tamim can score 150 or give a great start". he must change his strategy towards the game.

174 or 220 will not always win us games. Bowlers are doing their bit, which they were struggling before. Fielders are coming to the party. Now it's the BIG responsibility of Siddons to make the batting unit consistent. AND that includes proper use of the powerplay overs.


I rest my case.

You have egg on your face and are spinning at 200 miles an hour. Do you really think a week or two of bowling and fielding coached has made a huge impact?

Just admit it dude. You're wrong.

makorsha
October 17, 2010, 08:51 AM
admit it!

Ajfar
October 17, 2010, 10:47 AM
BANFAN bhai keep denying. apnar post poira khub hashi ashtase. Shakib and Tamim improved their batting all on their own? This gets better and better.

I want to ask you one question, who knows more about Tamim and his game, you or Tamim?

Bancan
October 17, 2010, 11:55 AM
There is absolutely no way the two new coaches had an impact this fast. Absolutely no way.

WarWolf
October 17, 2010, 12:00 PM
There is absolutely no way the two new coaches had an impact this fast. Absolutely no way.
So Siddons has been training Rubel and Shafiul pace bowling for last couple of years and all on a sudden the impact is visible after new bowling coach came!!!!

Dhruvo
October 17, 2010, 12:10 PM
Siddons is batting coach material, not head coach material. How can anyone say that our fielding and bowling was siddons work ? I mean why the sudden change in bowling and fielding AFTER we get our fielding and bowling coaches ? He gets some of the credit, but not all of it thats just exaggerating.

So Siddons has been training Rubel and Shafiul pace bowling for last couple of years and all on a sudden the impact is visible after new bowling coach came!!!!
+1

Nadim
October 17, 2010, 12:13 PM
BANFAN bhai keep denying. apnar post poira khub hashi ashtase. Shakib and Tamim improved their batting all on their own? This gets better and better.

I want to ask you one question, who knows more about Tamim and his game, you or Tamim?

Even TIK said Salauddin is the main reason for his improvement....even i saw with my own eye salauddin was doing all the work with our batsmans(when they tourd eng) while Siddons were busy sitting on the balcony.

_Rafi_
October 17, 2010, 12:27 PM
So Siddons has been training Rubel and Shafiul pace bowling for last couple of years and all on a sudden the impact is visible after new bowling coach came!!!!

atleast he backed Rubel and Shafi and picked them in main 11 despite their inconsistency. He provided encouragement and motivation to RBX and Shafi.
And before Pont coming he had to work with bowlers. That might have some impact.

Bancan
October 17, 2010, 01:05 PM
So Siddons has been training Rubel and Shafiul pace bowling for last couple of years and all on a sudden the impact is visible after new bowling coach came!!!!

It has nothing to do with Siddons either. I am sure the other coaches will have an impact in due time.

I am under the impression that in this series everything just came together. I dont think the new coaches had enough time to change anything. Any technical advice from these coaches wasnt the reason for their winning. The new coaches probably inspired them to play like but as far as the changes in bowling in a technical sense, I dont think they had much impact.

Ajfar
October 17, 2010, 02:25 PM
Even TIK said Salauddin is the main reason for his improvement....even i saw with my own eye salauddin was doing all the work with our batsmans(when they tourd eng) while Siddons were busy sitting on the balcony.

nadim you didnt answer the question? So answer it who knows more about his game tamim me or you or Banfan bhai?
<br />Posted via BC Mobile Edition (iPhone)

alibangali
October 17, 2010, 02:40 PM
It has nothing to do with Siddons either. I am sure the other coaches will have an impact in due time.

I am under the impression that in this series everything just came together. I dont think the new coaches had enough time to change anything. Any technical advice from these coaches wasnt the reason for their winning. The new coaches probably inspired them to play like but as far as the changes in bowling in a technical sense, I dont think they had much impact.

The bowlers did not need their technique completely rewritten at this level. What the bowlers needed to improve from schoolboy type of bowling (which they were doing before the arrival of Pont) was good advice on bowling the correct line and length given the pitches condition. If you also look closely to the fast bowling in the matches you will also see the bowlers using change of pace wisely. Rubel used to be all over the place and Shafi used to give atleast 1 boundary delivery an over.

I look for more improvements in the future when the coaches can start tweaking and developing the bowling more.

Also the fielding has improved as well and this also did not just happen out of coincidence.

WarWolf
October 17, 2010, 09:24 PM
atleast he backed Rubel and Shafi and picked them in main 11 despite their inconsistency. He provided encouragement and motivation to RBX and Shafi.
And before Pont coming he had to work with bowlers. That might have some impact.
Frankly speaking he had no other choice other than picking them.

Everybody involved with BD cricket encourages the players. It's nothing much to be credited.

deshprem
October 17, 2010, 09:48 PM
lolz there are so many know it alls and self proclaimed pundits here. why is it so hard to believe our coaches are dping the right thing? why do you awayseed to stand out and have a critique up ur sleeve? just live wit th fact that our coaches are guns and more dedicated to our cricket than any of the administrators ever will be?

BANFAN
October 18, 2010, 04:24 AM
BANFAN bhai keep denying. apnar post poira khub hashi ashtase. Shakib and Tamim improved their batting all on their own? This gets better and better.

I want to ask you one question, who knows more about Tamim and his game, you or Tamim?

When did you last hear an inform player of playing 11 saying that the coach was rubish? Even with Greg chappels departure did you hear people of playing 11 talking against him?

If that's your standard, answer me; who knows more about what we need to do for the improvement of our cricket? You, me or BCB? Why do you criticize them?

Who know better how to run the country? You, me or the prime minister? Why do you call them incapable?

Answer to your question although hidden in my question, but as you want; Because you can analyze the performance of a person, by his policies and performance indicators. He himself had to abandon most of his policies that he introduced after coming to BD & we lost a few players whom he focussed maximum (Ash). And Tamim may be generous to acknowledge his advice, in reality he has never followed his coaching policies and that made him successful, same goes with Shakib.

If his merely advice could be good enough to make a TIK, imagine the guys who got his full attention would turn into SRT. But unfortunately the guys who had and needed his attention are going down the drains; Ash, Rok, Junaid, Mullah, Mushy, Nayeem .... need more names?

Baundule
October 18, 2010, 05:20 AM
If his merely advice could be good enough to make a TIK, imagine the guys who got his full attention would turn into SRT.

I have an observation regarding Buchanan and our beloved JS. Actually they are very good teachers, you just need to do the opposite of what they say, because they always mean the opposite. Examples?

1) JS: Our bowlers are crap. Reality: bowlers win matches.
2) JS: We should focus on personal improvement rather on the team. We can not win anyway. Reality: Personal improvements do not add up every match. Team effort win matches.
3) JS: score 240. Reality: We score 290 and lose the match. We score 174 and still can win the match.
4) JS: Power play - when to take? Do not let it destroy your focus. Reality: It is supposed to be an advantage for the batting side.
5) Buchanan: (appointed as ECB consultant) KP is crap. Reality: KP is the player that the Aussies fear the most.

lamisa
October 18, 2010, 05:45 AM
well,did u guys notice one thing?when we were playing in the 40th over or maybe even before that,the field setting was like that of a PP.but we still lost wickets,didn't we?i guess this is exactly why we take PP so late...

yaseer
October 18, 2010, 05:57 AM
Tamim may be generous to acknowledge his advice, in reality he has never followed his coaching policies and that made him successful, same goes with Shakib.


Come on mate, from where you are making up these craps?

We should give credit where it is due. Bowling/fielding improvement is credited to the coaches as direct impact! and batting improvement is solely to the player!

When previously batsmen were doing good but we were not winning matches, then it was Siddons who can't motivate! Now we won the series, now it is Siddons who can't coach batsmen.

All of a sudden Everyone's favorite batting coach and worst head coach has become the worst batting coach now!!!!

_Rafi_
October 18, 2010, 06:01 AM
1) JS: Our bowlers are crap. Reality: bowlers win matches.
2) JS: We should focus on personal improvement rather on the team. We can not win anyway. Reality: Personal improvements do not add up every match. Team effort win matches.
3) JS: score 240. Reality: We score 290 and lose the match. We score 174 and still can win the match.
4) JS: Power play - when to take? Do not let it destroy your focus. Reality: It is supposed to be an advantage for the batting side.
5) Buchanan: (appointed as ECB consultant) KP is crap. Reality: KP is the player that the Aussies fear the most.

1. Are you sure he said our bowlers are crap or our bowling was crap (at that moment). Reality our bowling was crap which is getting better. Not just only bowlers win the matches but also batters and fielders have fair share on that.
2. Team efforts resulted by some personal efforts.
3. Last time when he said score 240 we scored 241 and win the match against Nz(3rd win)
4. PP is advantage of batting team but it is well established fact that it causes batsmen to lose focus. I have seen Shakib to get out very first ball or 2nd ball of PP many occasions. But yes he can take PP bit earliar e.g. 40-44 overs depending on match situation.

BANFAN
October 18, 2010, 06:25 AM
We should give credit where it is due. Bowling/fielding improvement is credited to the coaches as direct impact! and batting improvement is solely to the player!

You tell me where it is due? We will talk about Shakib and Tamim later. Bring in other examples from the team to give him credit.

When previously batsmen were doing good but we were not winning matches, then it was Siddons who can't motivate! Now we won the series, now it is Siddons who can't coach batsmen.

When was that, batsmen were good and we couldnt win?

Baundule
October 18, 2010, 07:35 AM
1. Are you sure he said our bowlers are crap or our bowling was crap (at that moment). Reality our bowling was crap which is getting better. Not just only bowlers win the matches but also batters and fielders have fair share on that.
2. Team efforts resulted by some personal efforts.
3. Last time when he said score 240 we scored 241 and win the match against Nz(3rd win)
4. PP is advantage of batting team but it is well established fact that it causes batsmen to lose focus. I have seen Shakib to get out very first ball or 2nd ball of PP many occasions. But yes he can take PP bit earliar e.g. 40-44 overs depending on match situation.
Rafi bhai, Almost all our wins came with bowlers doing well. I do not get how they were crap and suddenly got better without Siddons noticing it. These days 240 is a sub-par score for ODIs. No team can win scoring 240 on normal ODI pitches if the bowlers do not do extra-ordinary job. If being afraid of losing wicket gets the first priority in taking power play, then I have nothing to say. Saying without Tamim we can not win (pathetic match against the Pakis) does not really make one believe in the team concept. Anyway, it is a Siddons issue and I better not get engaged in a heated discussion with people relation with whom I do care. :)

MohammedC
October 18, 2010, 09:55 AM
Siddons thumi jaiba koi.

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4106/5093083143_fb9f42a757.jpg

Pic from Bangladeshnews24

Ajfar
October 18, 2010, 10:20 AM
When did you last hear an inform player of playing 11 saying that the coach was rubish?

First of all let me remind you we are talking about Tamim here. And after the little incident that occurred a few days ago its pretty clear if Tamim has something on his mind he'll put it out there when he gets an opportunity. Tamim is not the kind of guy who will say stuff just to be in the team nor will he say stuff to make people happy. He does whatever he likes, and he likes JS.

If that's your standard, answer me; who knows more about what we need to do for the improvement of our cricket? You, me or BCB? Why do you criticize them?

see you didn't understand my logic. so let me break it down for you. My logic is JS works with Tamim, so obviously Tamim has a better understanding of who JS is and what he has done for him. So when someone asks him a question about JS he will reflect upon his experience. yes or no?
Now let me answer your question, BCB works for all of our cricket- that includes all players, coaches and what not and fans as well. So as a fan when you and I see BCB doing something that doesn't seem right we criticize them. 3

I'm not saying you and I can't criticize JS, but what I am saying is Tamim's claim has more value to it.

Who know better how to run the country? You, me or the prime minister? Why do you call them incapable?

Again same logic, Prime Minister works for the country, and you and I are citizens of the country, so when we see something wrong we criticize them.

And Tamim may be generous to acknowledge his advice, in reality he has never followed his coaching policies and that made him successful, same goes with Shakib.

wow wow wow wow wow. where the heck are you getting this from? what are you best friend with tamim and Shakib? or are you some kind of mind reader? man you are trying way to hard right now to make JS look bad that are you are not even making any sense. At least I have tamim's word to back my claim by? Show me some reference, show me where got this BS news from?

If his merely advice could be good enough to make a TIK, imagine the guys who got his full attention would turn into SRT. But unfortunately the guys who had and needed his attention are going down the drains; Ash, Rok, Junaid, Mullah, Mushy, Nayeem .... need more names?

First of all you don't become SRT by listening to coach. so don't bring that in here.

you can't have it both ways. You can't say oh JS worked with these guys and they went down the drain, but he also worked with Tamim and Shakib but they didn't listen to them so became better batsman. See that right there is pure BS. either they all took advice from JS or none of them took advice from JS. see if we go by your logic than you can't really blame JS can you, I mean if Tamim and Shakib didn't take JS advice than so didn't the rest of the guys and they made themselves go down the drain.

Ajfar
October 18, 2010, 10:26 AM
When was that, batsmen were good and we couldnt win?

http://www.cricinfo.com/tri-bdesh2010/engine/match/434260.html

there 296 is that a good enough score for you?

how about this one

http://www.cricinfo.com/bangladesh/engine/match/343761.html

When previously batsmen were doing good but we were not winning matches, then it was Siddons who can't motivate! Now we won the series, now it is Siddons who can't coach batsmen.

Thank you. Right on the Money.

Blah
October 18, 2010, 11:25 AM
Siddons thumi jaiba koi.

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4106/5093083143_fb9f42a757.jpg

Pic from Bangladeshnews24

This needs some serious context. Whats going on here? Link to article perhaps?

ialbd
October 18, 2010, 11:34 AM
^^^ the picture has everything in it to start another Lotus Kamal controversy (like the Lota-Shakib one)..

Look at the cold Lotus Kamal stare, its like saying 'looks like you cant ever make it to this side of the table'

MohammedC
October 18, 2010, 12:04 PM
^^^ the picture has everything in it to start another Lotus Kamal controversy (like the Lota-Shakib one)..

Look at the cold Lotus Kamal stare, its like saying 'looks like you cant ever make it to this side of the table'

Battle of The Ashes with 2 English men on his both wings
Lotus predicts The Ashes outcome. 2-1 to England. Siddons not happy.

MohammedC
October 18, 2010, 12:08 PM
This needs some serious context. Whats going on here? Link to article perhaps?

picture from todays BCB arranged party in BCB headquarter.

article

http://www.banglanews24.com.bd/detailsnews.php?nssl=bc786a7e5492c8c5c3e3d9d1b9ba3 ec0&nttl=2010101812801&toppos=1

more pic

http://www.banglanews24.com.bd/photogallery.php?photoserial=3318&page=2

Blah
October 18, 2010, 12:18 PM
picture from todays BCB arranged party in BCB headquarter.

article

http://www.banglanews24.com.bd/detailsnews.php?nssl=bc786a7e5492c8c5c3e3d9d1b9ba3 ec0&nttl=2010101812801&toppos=1

more pic

http://www.banglanews24.com.bd/photogallery.php?photoserial=3318&page=2


Thanks. Images without context can be very deceiving.

ialbd
October 18, 2010, 12:57 PM
couldnt resist posting this pic (from the banglanews24 link MohammedC posted)

I wonder what Siddons is saying:

http://www.banglanews24.com.bd/images/PhotoGallery/BCB101018-06.jpg