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al Furqaan
July 21, 2010, 04:30 PM
recently i've noticed a gradual and worsening lack of impetus to posting here on BC. there are numerous reasons for this, least of which is probably our shambolic on-field performances. the majority of my posts used to come from game-time posts in the match thread. however, nowadays, since most games are broadcast, i tend to watch more, and post rarely until close of play. furthermore, last couple of years, i've been sending IMs to a friend of mine, who is almost always watching the game as well...and we tend to have discursive conversations about all things, both cricket related and not. simply put, i cant post in all places at once.

however, i have noticed, a disturbing lack of intellectual quality in the majority of BC discussions nowadays. when i first joined, i was a novice, and most of what i learned about the game came from BC and its posters.

I know of several prominent members who have started to avoid BC now, for various reasons, but the one would like to bring to attention is online etiquette.

a number of very senior level posters have told me that they're tired of the behavior of many of the "newbies" here and as a result have stopped posting, either altogether, or almost completely.

at any rate, guys like AsifTheManRahman, Sohel_NR, Ammark, Rubu, fwullah, mona/fab and many others are hardly seen anymore for various reasons. in recent times the likes of Beamer, Eshen, Ehsan, reverse_swing, and others have posted very rarely.

the bottom line is, there appears to be a changing of the guard, so to speak. a new generation of posters is taking over. this is a big responsibility, many of you are young, probably still in your teenage years.

take this opportunity as a challenge. build your online personality, develop your cricketing knowledge, respect others opinions no matter how wrong, and push your ideas strongly. keep an open mind, and don't rush to any judements, easy though it may seem.

before you, there were many highly knowledgable posters, there many thorough discussions. the "keys" to the kingdom are being handed over. you have great big shoes to fill, stay true to yourselves, and accept the challenge of making next generation's BC forum as great as the first.

Peace
July 21, 2010, 04:57 PM
"In war, your opponent must be demolished, humiliated, destroyed, torn to pieces and the shreds fed to dogs. And cricket forum* is greater than war."- (Gen. Asif The Man Rahman)




*subject to edit

Huda
July 21, 2010, 05:22 PM
Are you slowly going to leave Al furq? I've always been a lurker but it's always been a pleasure to read posts by yourself and the posters you mention above. The guard is being handed over to the youths much like our cricket team.....

MohammedC
July 21, 2010, 06:09 PM
But why are all this Intelligent members not returning back to Bangladesh Cricket section.

Is it because they had enough of Bangladesh Cricket teams perfomance.
They have spent so much time following this ram-chagol that have fallen behind in other more important aspects of life. e.g. family,work etc.

Zeeshan
July 21, 2010, 06:40 PM
Handing down the key? You gotta be kidding me. This is what happens when Lord of the Rings meet Cricket. It's an online forum for Christ sakes(!) which of course doesn't entail posting of utter garbage but at the same time doesn't mean we have to give a SPORT- yes, S-P-O-R-T an air of textbook pedagogy and and a makeover of geekfest.

I mean sure some of us feel that since Bangladesh cricket needs rescuing and we should do something about it and since playing for the league and moving up the ladder is a far cry, the next best thing we should do is get down and dirty with our e-wizard wands and engage in some lengthy monograph and pedantic iDebate with someone whom we have never even met face to face thinking somehow it should send a ripple of wave down the Cosmic Consciousness to change the astrocharts of Bangladesh cricket board and patting oneself on the back for "All in a day's work" for saving the civilization from the brink of destruction before a peaceful night of sleep, but let's just not delude ourselves.... The players, the board, the coach can give a flying frack to what we do,think or say living in our little universe eating cheetos on futon in front of the pc screen as if we have the whole universe figured out.

So at the end of the day it is what it is and enjoy it for what it is. A sport which we watch for entertainment's sakes and for fun and not some intellectual exercise that somehow needs to be 'solved' by a guild of ivory tower theoreticians who feels the need of a sense of belonging beguiled that somehow they have one-up of Shakib for being able to conjure up theory with data manipulation.

Tamim, Shakib, Ash-- these guys don't need us. We need them. And we solely need them so that we have something to do between the time of picking right nose and left nose. Some may HATE them feeling disillusioned that what do these 'morons' have achieved in life to deserve this celebrity status whilst all your life you worked towards your post-depression Keynesian economic theory but truth of the matter is such is life. So yeah y'all go ahead and feel as good as you want and giggle at Mushy or cuss the f out of Ash for his illiterate English but at the end if someone clubs Gillespie for the biggest six he is in the ultimate zone of life as an immortal while you will die a rotten corpse. THEM? : Middle finger to us. US?: Banging on keyboard at 193 wpm with our podgy thumb fixing our glasses thinking we own them.

And as for the fans. That's exactly what makes BC a BC. "I" come to BC because of the eclectic members ranging from little Antora to genius like Sohel bhai. If all the codgers came to this place to form some nerdy Internet Brotherhood to engage in paragraphs of armchair theories it would be the MOST BORING place ever. It's precisely the diversity of the FANS that makes this such an exciting place. To shoehorn the natural course and dictum of the forum into some cookie cutter mould of what it should or should not be shows utter disrespect for others. And way to go by culling out some handful of members and making others feel insignificant and no I don't give a rats arse that my name is not included. Even guys like Shakibrulz and Matinsux with whose views I disagree maintains the checks and balance of the forum. And as for the other members who don't feel that the standard went down and lost the drive to post- well sorry to burst your bubbles cuz no one gives a damn; it's not as if cybersky will collapse.

mafizraju
July 21, 2010, 06:54 PM
When I joined BC, there was no live online telecast. I still remember our first west indies tour.... ahh those were the days of good time at BC...

I think I agree with al-Furqaan regarding the quality of post. I am no expert in cricket, just another avid follower like everyone else of this board.

I think we share a different connection with the team. I grew up watching the struggle of earlier years of the cricket, when many didnot watch our boys. Watched everygame knowing we are going to loose. Watched the game just for a good shot or two. I still remember the two straight drive four by Faruque at the asia cup, who was immediately been compared with SRT by the commentator. he was out couple of balls later. Such was our joy. watched the game for the joy of watching.

My team was my connection to the unknown competing world. My team at world stage resembled my struggle in life.... two step forward one step backward...

I get hurt by losses, like the one against NED. Because we watched the game from the very formative years of the team, our connection to the team is more close; our expectation more realistic. may be I do not possess the spirit of the youth, truth be told I have aged. I have been following Bangladesh cricket for 18 years day in day out. I have hardly ever missed a game (excluding the ones I had no way of watching or listening or reading the commentary).

To newbies they probably want the team to win more. they are more brave, more agressive than I ever was. Some of the probably do not have the understanding of the game as e.g. asifTheManRahman has. But certainly they can improve the language.

But some of the "inexpert one" will be an expert in may be five years down the road........hopefully they maintain the quality of criticism..

MohammedC
July 21, 2010, 06:55 PM
Very nice post Zeeshan. I am not brave enough to write something like that.

Banglacricket.com. Where tiger fans belong.
<br />Posted via BC Mobile Edition (iPhone)

Raynman
July 21, 2010, 07:03 PM
Quality posts exists but its just that the silly/stupid/insulting comments/threads gain more attention and responses and the other threads get buried quickly.

Its an open forum and everyone is entitled to their opinion. As much as I disagree with lets say the Siddons supporter in the latest hot topic, I wouldn't really post if they weren't here and there was no opposing view points.

Al F, I know you're trying to sound somewhat nostalgic but this post in itself is insulting to new comers who come here because of ALL of our common passion : Bangladesh Cricket.

rahat90
July 21, 2010, 08:32 PM
if anyone opens an intelectual thread, such as one regarding batting tactics and procedure, these now seem to get less response than other so called 'trivial' threads. why might that be?
im all for posting in trivial threads dont get me wrong, but i would like the more technical threads in bc to get more noticed that will be great

reyme
July 21, 2010, 09:10 PM
Well what can I say. I joined 90 days after Al, and its amazing how 6 years passed by just like that! I do see a lot of intelligent posts even now, but things were a lot different back then. Moderation was a lot strict, lots of bans used to take place at that time. Things started to losen up since chinaman left. Like now, lots of heated converasation used to take place back then as well. I doubt people left or leaving due to new generation members, I think it is due to the fact that older members got busy with life and work.

The BC maybe dominated by some junior posters now, but many of whom are very smart and I do believe they can fill the empty shoes quite nicely if needed.

al Furqaan
July 21, 2010, 09:13 PM
Handing down the key? You gotta be kidding me. This is what happens when Lord of the Rings meet Cricket. It's an online forum for Christ sakes(!) which of course doesn't entail posting of utter garbage but at the same time doesn't mean we have to give a SPORT- yes, S-P-O-R-T an air of textbook pedagogy and and a makeover of geekfest.

I mean sure some of us feel that since Bangladesh cricket needs rescuing and we should do something about it and since playing for the league and moving up the ladder is a far cry, the next best thing we should do is get down and dirty with our e-wizard wands and engage in some lengthy monograph and pedantic iDebate with someone whom we have never even met face to face thinking somehow it should send a ripple of wave down the Cosmic Consciousness to change the astrocharts of Bangladesh cricket board and patting oneself on the back for "All in a day's work" for saving the civilization from the brink of destruction before a peaceful night of sleep, but let's just not delude ourselves.... The players, the board, the coach can give a flying frack to what we do,think or say living in our little universe eating cheetos on futon in front of the pc screen as if we have the whole universe figured out.

So at the end of the day it is what it is and enjoy it for what it is. A sport which we watch for entertainment's sakes and for fun and not some intellectual exercise that somehow needs to be 'solved' by a guild of ivory tower theoreticians who feels the need of a sense of belonging beguiled that somehow they have one-up of Shakib for being able to conjure up theory with data manipulation.

Tamim, Shakib, Ash-- these guys don't need us. We need them. And we solely need them so that we have something to do between the time of picking right nose and left nose. Some may HATE them feeling disillusioned that what do these 'morons' have achieved in life to deserve this celebrity status whilst all your life you worked towards your post-depression Keynesian economic theory but truth of the matter is such is life. So yeah y'all go ahead and feel as good as you want and giggle at Mushy or cuss the f out of Ash for his illiterate English but at the end if someone clubs Gillespie for the biggest six he is in the ultimate zone of life as an immortal while you will die a rotten corpse. THEM? : Middle finger to us. US?: Banging on keyboard at 193 wpm with our podgy thumb fixing our glasses thinking we own them.

And as for the fans. That's exactly what makes BC a BC. "I" come to BC because of the eclectic members ranging from little Antora to genius like Sohel bhai. If all the codgers came to this place to form some nerdy Internet Brotherhood to engage in paragraphs of armchair theories it would be the MOST BORING place ever. It's precisely the diversity of the FANS that makes this such an exciting place. To shoehorn the natural course and dictum of the forum into some cookie cutter mould of what it should or should not be shows utter disrespect for others. And way to go by culling out some handful of members and making others feel insignificant and no I don't give a rats arse that my name is not included. Even guys like Shakibrulz and Matinsux with whose views I disagree maintains the checks and balance of the forum. And as for the other members who don't feel that the standard went down and lost the drive to post- well sorry to burst your bubbles cuz no one gives a damn; it's not as if cybersky will collapse.

and this is seems to be precisely the sort of post that a couple of senior members have lamented is becoming all too common from the newer generation.

put another way, you claim that cricket is too miniscule an endeavor as to warrant "intellectual excercises" yet my post, highlighting trends on a cricket message board, is important enough to warrant a multi-paragraph polemic?

I think you are the one who is kidding me, my dear Sir!

I absolutely agree, that the players don't need us, that we need them - although it is precisely our demand for their "talent" which puts money in their pockets, thus proving our grand interdependence!

however, you assertion that we should be blind followers of the sport (as i suspect many of the "newbs" are, and as i once was) is truly disappointing, for lack of harsher words. this is somewhat akin to a math teacher instructing pupils to just recite and don't bother about why i^2 = -1. it is mind boggling.

yes, our analyses, are ultimately of no use or benefit to the players, coaches, management. but that is not the reason why this website exists. it exists to disseminate knowledge of and about bangladesh cricket, in addition to being a base of fan support on the world wide web.

it will indeed be unfortunate, if and when, the majority of BC posters will clamor for a new bowling coach, but couldn't tell you something basic about reverse swing. thats just an example.

a forum full of empty comments, like :four: or :outbad: or full of smiles is something which we should shun. a forum where the game is dissected and understood is far more valuable than one where all we do is "woot" for a win or groan "we suck" for a loss.

Zeeshan
July 21, 2010, 09:53 PM
and this is seems to be precisely the sort of post that a couple of senior members have lamented is becoming all too common from the newer generation.


1. In that case please do convey to them in your next pow-wow and group therapy session that this sort of post is here to stay.


put another way, you claim that cricket is too miniscule an endeavor...

2. I never claimed that.


yet my post, highlighting trends on a cricket message board, is important enough to warrant a multi-paragraph polemic?.

3. Yes, because of the following:


and this is seems to be precisely the sort of post that a couple of senior members have lamented is becoming all too common from the newer generation.


1. In that case please do convey to them in your next pow-wow and group therapy session that this sort of post is here to stay.

One World
July 21, 2010, 10:21 PM
I mean sure some of us feel that since Bangladesh cricket needs rescuing and we should do something about it and since playing for the league and moving up the ladder is a far cry, the next best thing we should do is get down and dirty with our e-wizard wands and engage in some lengthy monograph and pedantic iDebate with someone whom we have never even met face to face thinking somehow it should send a ripple of wave down the Cosmic Consciousness to change the astrocharts of Bangladesh cricket board and patting oneself on the back for "All in a day's work" for saving the civilization from the brink of destruction before a peaceful night of sleep, but let's just not delude ourselves.... The players, the board, the coach can give a flying frack to what we do,think or say living in our little universe eating cheetos on futon in front of the pc screen as if we have the whole universe figured out.

:) and you just beat me in length.

WTG

Murad
July 21, 2010, 10:26 PM
Handing down the key? You gotta be kidding me. This is what happens when Lord of the Rings meet Cricket. It's an online forum for Christ sakes(!) which of course doesn't entail posting of utter garbage but at the same time doesn't mean we have to give a SPORT- yes, S-P-O-R-T an air of textbook pedagogy and and a makeover of geekfest.

I mean sure some of us feel that since Bangladesh cricket needs rescuing and we should do something about it and since playing for the league and moving up the ladder is a far cry, the next best thing we should do is get down and dirty with our e-wizard wands and engage in some lengthy monograph and pedantic iDebate with someone whom we have never even met face to face thinking somehow it should send a ripple of wave down the Cosmic Consciousness to change the astrocharts of Bangladesh cricket board and patting oneself on the back for "All in a day's work" for saving the civilization from the brink of destruction before a peaceful night of sleep, but let's just not delude ourselves.... The players, the board, the coach can give a flying frack to what we do,think or say living in our little universe eating cheetos on futon in front of the pc screen as if we have the whole universe figured out.

So at the end of the day it is what it is and enjoy it for what it is. A sport which we watch for entertainment's sakes and for fun and not some intellectual exercise that somehow needs to be 'solved' by a guild of ivory tower theoreticians who feels the need of a sense of belonging beguiled that somehow they have one-up of Shakib for being able to conjure up theory with data manipulation.

Tamim, Shakib, Ash-- these guys don't need us. We need them. And we solely need them so that we have something to do between the time of picking right nose and left nose. Some may HATE them feeling disillusioned that what do these 'morons' have achieved in life to deserve this celebrity status whilst all your life you worked towards your post-depression Keynesian economic theory but truth of the matter is such is life. So yeah y'all go ahead and feel as good as you want and giggle at Mushy or cuss the f out of Ash for his illiterate English but at the end if someone clubs Gillespie for the biggest six he is in the ultimate zone of life as an immortal while you will die a rotten corpse. THEM? : Middle finger to us. US?: Banging on keyboard at 193 wpm with our podgy thumb fixing our glasses thinking we own them.

And as for the fans. That's exactly what makes BC a BC. "I" come to BC because of the eclectic members ranging from little Antora to genius like Sohel bhai. If all the codgers came to this place to form some nerdy Internet Brotherhood to engage in paragraphs of armchair theories it would be the MOST BORING place ever. It's precisely the diversity of the FANS that makes this such an exciting place. To shoehorn the natural course and dictum of the forum into some cookie cutter mould of what it should or should not be shows utter disrespect for others. And way to go by culling out some handful of members and making others feel insignificant and no I don't give a rats arse that my name is not included. Even guys like Shakibrulz and Matinsux with whose views I disagree maintains the checks and balance of the forum. And as for the other members who don't feel that the standard went down and lost the drive to post- well sorry to burst your bubbles cuz no one gives a damn; it's not as if cybersky will collapse.

:big_hug::big_hug:
Well Said, Zeeshan. :notworthy:

cricket_king
July 21, 2010, 10:31 PM
I agree with both al Furqaan and Zeeshan to certain extents, and I'm glad this topic was brought up.

I think al Furqaan was really highlighting the growing lack of substantial posts within the forum, and I'd have to agree with him. He's completely right about the ridiculous numbers of pointless posts. BC wasn't this way when I joined either, and that was only 3 and a half years ago. Following our strong 2007 world cup performance, new members joined in masses. I do miss the old veterans of BC, and to be honest, even I've avoided BC as these pointless posters and posts grew in numbers.

However, I also agree with Zeeshan on one point. This forum was never quite as big until that 2007 world cup, and though a lot of the older members may not enjoy the silly posts and new members, it's bound to increase, and continue will rising as the older members avoid BC. In the end, we're all fans of a sports team who obviously don't give two cahoots about our opinions, and will continue progressing whether the veterans are here or the newbies take over completely.

I personally think that there should be an increase of substantial posts, and a decrease in pointless one-liners and emoticons. Neither al Furqaan, nor I suggest that we should be a forum of psycho-analysists, but I'm sure we'd all like to keep the respectable reputation of BC, which our veterans have shaped originally, intact. We all know we were different from those Indian and Pakistani forums. Let's keep it that way.

Zeeshan
July 21, 2010, 10:32 PM
Ad hominem attacks aside, I think to help with AF's cause we should perhaps bring back the dreaded red arros? :)

view360
July 21, 2010, 11:09 PM
If a poster possesses more intellectuality than an average BD cricketer , he must be disappointed here. We know the intellectual level of BD cricket players and their management staffs and most of their fans . When you fail to comply that level , you are unlikely to enjoy the discussions. Many anonymous members are also afraid of being insulted by some naive teenagers who seem to have been dominating this forum lately.

al Furqaan
July 21, 2010, 11:32 PM
2. I never claimed that.


au contraire...you said, and i quote (nice work with the manipulation of the elipses marks while quoting what i said, btw):

A sport which we watch for entertainment's sakes and for fun and not some intellectual exercise that somehow needs to be 'solved' by a guild of ivory tower theoreticians who feels the need of a sense of belonging beguiled that somehow they have one-up of Shakib for being able to conjure up theory with data manipulation.


if there is an alternate interpretation to that, especially the part in bold, i'm game to hear it.

One World
July 21, 2010, 11:39 PM
[QUOTE=cricket_king;1192076]I agree with both al Furqaan and Zeeshan to certain extents, and I'm glad this topic was brought up [QUOTE]

That actually says, I could not agree to any of their views. :)

view360
July 21, 2010, 11:46 PM
[QUOTE=cricket_king;1192076]I agree with both al Furqaan and Zeeshan to certain extents, and I'm glad this topic was brought up [QUOTE]

That actually says, I could not agree to any of their views. :)

Exactly . This a perfect demonstration of typical PR practice. Like "If you give him a penny for his thoughts, you'd get change." or "Wheel is turning, but the hamster is dead."

Zeeshan
July 22, 2010, 02:07 AM
@AF: I was denying the usage of the word 'miniscule' which was thrust upon me.

Anyway, my point was simply this: Newbies are like newborn babies. [Note: the contraction]. Babies usually use words like googoo gaagaa doodoo daaadaaa. Through the passage of time they mature and learn to use polysyllabilic words,intelligent discourse, etc. When you write a post like that (OP) you end up as the kaatkhotta father who hears a 4 month baby go "dadadiidii" you respond by replying : "But would you fancy milk from your mother's mammaries, young man?" How psycho is that?

Just like the real world an environment like this forum caters to people of all demographics. To BRUTEFORCE others to churn out some pedagogical disseration from the newcomers saying they have some "shoe" to fill is analogous to telling your baby no-toys-no-cartoon-only-Aeneid. [Sure it worked out for Mill, but not everybody wants to live up to your or other man's expectation]. Live and let others be.

I get what you are saying but know that each and every members are different who have unique insights to contribute. If you want others to write more quality posts instead of complaining on the lack of thereof, concentrate producing more of those so that finally rest of us can get inspired and try to match them. It's like one approach is to eradicate all the unnecessary weeds, but another smarter approach would be to plant more flowers which outgrows the rest and enhances the aesthetics of the garden. Ghandhi's "be the change you want to see in the world" is what I am alluding to.

And what's up with all the seniorty issue? Barring the mods, each and every member here is same, and should be treated such. (And the custom user title was simply a work of jest by Big Boss just to let you so that I am not sounding hypocritical). As Eshen would say "humble pie test perhaps?" Humilty and respecting others opinion no matter how puerile or naive they may shows magnaminity of character instead of just giving a cold shoulder to others simply because one gets to flaunt a title higher up the order. At the age of 76 Morihei Ueshiba sensei, founder of Aikido and gangster as f---, said "I am still a baby in martial arts." Something to think about before writing out a sermon.

cricket_king
July 22, 2010, 04:31 AM
[QUOTE=cricket_king;1192076]I agree with both al Furqaan and Zeeshan to certain extents, and I'm glad this topic was brought up [QUOTE]

That actually says, I could not agree to any of their views. :)

Care to elaborate on that? That obviously wasn't my intention.

Tiger-ess
July 22, 2010, 07:31 AM
I agree with both al Furqaan and Zeeshan to certain extents, and I'm glad this topic was brought up.

I think al Furqaan was really highlighting the growing lack of substantial posts within the forum, and I'd have to agree with him. He's completely right about the ridiculous numbers of pointless posts. BC wasn't this way when I joined either, and that was only 3 and a half years ago. Following our strong 2007 world cup performance, new members joined in masses. I do miss the old veterans of BC, and to be honest, even I've avoided BC as these pointless posters and posts grew in numbers.

However, I also agree with Zeeshan on one point. This forum was never quite as big until that 2007 world cup, and though a lot of the older members may not enjoy the silly posts and new members, it's bound to increase, and continue will rising as the older members avoid BC. In the end, we're all fans of a sports team who obviously don't give two cahoots about our opinions, and will continue progressing whether the veterans are here or the newbies take over completely.

I personally think that there should be an increase of substantial posts, and a decrease in pointless one-liners and emoticons. Neither al Furqaan, nor I suggest that we should be a forum of psycho-analysists, but I'm sure we'd all like to keep the respectable reputation of BC, which our veterans have shaped originally, intact. We all know we were different from those Indian and Pakistani forums. Let's keep it that way.

Couldnt agree with you more!!:notworthy:

Can I just stress that, although I havent been an actual member for too long I have been following BC for a very long time and am fully aware of those quality posters Al furqann bhai has just mentioned. But a lot of the newer guys who werent around in that erm 'era' of BC, are obviously coming in and bringing a whole new dimension to BanglaCricket. And I compeletly agree with Zeeshan that as time goes on these guys will gain more and more awareness of the type of quality BC promotes. Personally if I fall into this 'new generation' category Al Furqaan bhai its only becuase I dont have as much Intellectual/In depth knowledge of cricket as some of the more established guys around here, therefore I woudnt have the confidence to dispute someone for example when the topic about the managent is in subject.
I would like it if some of those old members came back (BTW as far as i remember ATMR left because he had enough of the team's losing streak) But dont get yourself too worked up about this matter. Plus I think the BC staff are doing an excellent job in keeping this site clean and maintaining its high standards, If you notice there has been probably record number of bans than ever before(Omio, Shobha, Nadim..cant think of any atm) And I totally agree with cricket_king, we are different from your usual Indian and Pakistani or any other forums so lets take pride in that and just relax:-D

BANFAN
July 22, 2010, 09:53 AM
Handing down the key? You gotta be kidding me. This is what happens when Lord of the Rings meet Cricket. It's an online forum for Christ sakes(!) which of course doesn't entail posting of utter garbage but at the same time doesn't mean we have to give a SPORT- yes, S-P-O-R-T an air of textbook pedagogy and and a makeover of geekfest.

I mean sure some of us feel that since Bangladesh cricket needs rescuing and we should do something about it and since playing for the league and moving up the ladder is a far cry, the next best thing we should do is get down and dirty with our e-wizard wands and engage in some lengthy monograph and pedantic iDebate with someone whom we have never even met face to face thinking somehow it should send a ripple of wave down the Cosmic Consciousness to change the astrocharts of Bangladesh cricket board and patting oneself on the back for "All in a day's work" for saving the civilization from the brink of destruction before a peaceful night of sleep, but let's just not delude ourselves.... The players, the board, the coach can give a flying frack to what we do,think or say living in our little universe eating cheetos on futon in front of the pc screen as if we have the whole universe figured out.

So at the end of the day it is what it is and enjoy it for what it is. A sport which we watch for entertainment's sakes and for fun and not some intellectual exercise that somehow needs to be 'solved' by a guild of ivory tower theoreticians who feels the need of a sense of belonging beguiled that somehow they have one-up of Shakib for being able to conjure up theory with data manipulation.

Tamim, Shakib, Ash-- these guys don't need us. We need them. And we solely need them so that we have something to do between the time of picking right nose and left nose. Some may HATE them feeling disillusioned that what do these 'morons' have achieved in life to deserve this celebrity status whilst all your life you worked towards your post-depression Keynesian economic theory but truth of the matter is such is life. So yeah y'all go ahead and feel as good as you want and giggle at Mushy or cuss the f out of Ash for his illiterate English but at the end if someone clubs Gillespie for the biggest six he is in the ultimate zone of life as an immortal while you will die a rotten corpse. THEM? : Middle finger to us. US?: Banging on keyboard at 193 wpm with our podgy thumb fixing our glasses thinking we own them.

And as for the fans. That's exactly what makes BC a BC. "I" come to BC because of the eclectic members ranging from little Antora to genius like Sohel bhai. If all the codgers came to this place to form some nerdy Internet Brotherhood to engage in paragraphs of armchair theories it would be the MOST BORING place ever. It's precisely the diversity of the FANS that makes this such an exciting place. To shoehorn the natural course and dictum of the forum into some cookie cutter mould of what it should or should not be shows utter disrespect for others. And way to go by culling out some handful of members and making others feel insignificant and no I don't give a rats arse that my name is not included. Even guys like Shakibrulz and Matinsux with whose views I disagree maintains the checks and balance of the forum. And as for the other members who don't feel that the standard went down and lost the drive to post- well sorry to burst your bubbles cuz no one gives a damn; it's not as if cybersky will collapse.

I really understood this time. And I agree 100%. ZM/GB :)

It's the diversity of the people that brings me here. What would we talk about if there was no pro JS group (However illogical They are ;) )

instead of stressing on intellectuality, I would preffer discussing how we can make this forum more constructive for our cricket & informative for the members, which inturn will raise the quality of discussions. What do you expect to discuss after such a bad run of BD team, while fans are not informed of the other side what they are/were thinking/planning? As fans we all are speculating and arguing on speculations to vent our frustrations on whomever we think to be the culprit for depriving us of deserved pride & pleasure.

We should have had some good interviews of the responsible people and players, digging for the truth in every possible way would have helped us to have much more substantial, constructive and meaningful discussions rathar than wild debates. Those news paper articles are not feeding us (BC Members) with the required information for sure. But all are volunteers here, and I'm greatful to all the guys who are providing this voluntary service. I know what it takes for me to come here and to keep my professional side healthy. I can't demand more from them.

CK/AL, You know when I joined BC in March 2007, I was amazed to see that many of the members knew each others personally, at times I would feel that I'm an intruder in someone elses premises. Please I mean no offense to any one, that was an honest confession of what I felt and it has no negative strings attached. And I took it as a very natural one and none could have controlled that one, I cannot tell someone to undo his acquintance. And when you know someone personally you will always understand him/her better than someone whose face/name is even unknown, forget about true personality. So there were reasons to feel at home for you with the old gurards, You know it's like my mother is the best cook.

With the addition of a lot of new members this forum has become wider and that feelings of my mothers touch has eroded a little bit. That makes some uncomfortable and brings opposite feelings to some. I won't tell that the new members are intellectually any less, But yes, I would expect the old and experienced members to come back more often and they can definitely enrich the forum & help the newbies indulge into meaningful discussions. Or it will be boring for the older members to see threads you exaustively discussed 5 years back, coming again. May be we need a volunteer (new mod) to bring up the old thread and link it to similar new thread, so that the discussions can only go forward and avoid a lots of boring repeatation posts. Only an old guard has the capacity to take such a role. We need to do something new to retain our uniqueness and quality, unfortunately questioning IQ/Intellectuality isn't the right way. We must not forget new people brings in new ideas and new generation is always ahead of the old in innovation, while old is precious & knows the way to utilize those in the right way. lets use the experience to make BC a better place and not compare old with new, it's truely uncompareable.

(Sorry can't read back to quality contol my post; will try to do it later, excuse me for any mistakes please.)

Rifat
July 22, 2010, 11:12 AM
I want to give my input:

* people prefer emotions more than constructive criticism. it is the things that are appealing to the public which gets more attention than lets say an intellectual debate. or let's say a thread talking about Ashraful for the 500th time will get 50 more replies than let's say talking about a fast bowling coach(we desperately need one!) because Ashraful is still by far an ICON for Bangladesh cricket..it will still take a lot of time for people to forget about him because of his enigma!

* competition for post counts ;)

* more experienced posters tend to avoid certain threads because they have discussed it in the past. for example: no offense to BanglaCricket or myself, but we have been talking about Quran/Islam threads in Forget cricket since the dawn of BanglaCricket. now you have new members replacing the old ones...the arguments are essentially the same the topics are essentially the same, it is just the implementation(different people talking about it a bit more differently) is what is different! more experienced posters don't need to bother with many threads in BanglaCricket because some things just come over and over and over again.

* the overall progress and success and failures of the team has to do with it. i mean it doesn't matter how you measure progress. generally speaking, at the end of the day, people look at Losses and Wins...it doesn't matter if you scored 500 runs in an innings, it doesn't matter you bowl your opponent out for 88. if you lose, then you lose! if you win, then you win! simple as that! and that is how people measure success even though the true criteria for measuring progress/success may be on a different level. but at the end of the day, the wins/losses count! and the experienced members shouldn't be blamed for giving up/losing interest in the forum!

What BanglaCricket needs is a diversity of members, which will contain the balance of this forum so that everyone can benefit from each other. this is the current situation with still a good number of knowledgeable members contributing as well as the inexperienced ones learning :)

al Furqaan
July 22, 2010, 11:40 AM
@AF: I was denying the usage of the word 'miniscule' which was thrust upon me.

sure, you didn't actually use the word, but thats basically what you hinted at. regardless its far more accurate than the quote job of one of my quotes where the "..." was inserted just before a key part of my statement, pretty much changing the entire meaning of that statement. my usage of the word "miniscule" perhaps changed ur statement from 19 to 20, as they say in Bengali.


Just like the real world an environment like this forum caters to people of all demographics. To BRUTEFORCE others to churn out some pedagogical disseration from the newcomers saying they have some "shoe" to fill is analogous to telling your baby no-toys-no-cartoon-only-Aeneid. [Sure it worked out for Mill, but not everybody wants to live up to your or other man's expectation]. Live and let others be.

live and let others live does exclude one from encouraging or suggesting improvement. unless you tell your baby "its ok to play with toys and become a bum when u grow up" i don't there's much to argue about. thats all i'm saying.



And what's up with all the seniorty issue? Barring the mods, each and every member here is same, and should be treated such. (And the custom user title was simply a work of jest by Big Boss just to let you so that I am not sounding hypocritical). As Eshen would say "humble pie test perhaps?" Humilty and respecting others opinion no matter how puerile or naive they may shows magnaminity of character instead of just giving a cold shoulder to others simply because one gets to flaunt a title higher up the order. At the age of 76 Morihei Ueshiba sensei, founder of Aikido and gangster as f---, said "I am still a baby in martial arts." Something to think about before writing out a sermon.

i dont disagree...i'm just pointing out an observation and some things which have been brought to my attention out of curiosity. i even mentioned in the OP its important to respect divergent points of view, but to always aggressively push own's own ideas.

RazabQ
July 22, 2010, 04:06 PM
there there Al ... the sky is not falling ...

I think someone nailed it on the head that many of us old codgers don't get to post as much because life has taken over ... I still visit on a daily basis. Just don't have the time to provide the detailed responses of yore. Plus there's the Facebook/Twitter effect as well.

I'm an optimist. As Antora herself mentioned on yet another thread, when she joined she was all about the one-liners and l88t spk ... now she's practically a murubbi here :) New members will get edjumacated and start providing more weighty posts.

Y'all think it's changed? I still lament the days when Shams, Ammark, Z-bhai, FaltuRidwanBhai, Arnab would get at it. 'Tis the circle of life baby ...

al Furqaan
July 22, 2010, 05:23 PM
there there Al ... the sky is not falling ...

I think someone nailed it on the head that many of us old codgers don't get to post as much because life has taken over ... I still visit on a daily basis. Just don't have the time to provide the detailed responses of yore. Plus there's the Facebook/Twitter effect as well.

I'm an optimist. As Antora herself mentioned on yet another thread, when she joined she was all about the one-liners and l88t spk ... now she's practically a murubbi here :) New members will get edjumacated and start providing more weighty posts.

Y'all think it's changed? I still lament the days when Shams, Ammark, Z-bhai, FaltuRidwanBhai, Arnab would get at it. 'Tis the circle of life baby ...

yeah sorry for being a tad bit elitist, but thats just how i feel about it. and that bit about antora is what i'm talking about...i'm trying to challenge the babies to go from using the one-liner, text-speak to becoming "murubbis". i joined the forum at a "tweener" age of 20-21...not quite a teeny-bopper, but certainly not the grey-beard i am now. i went from being a passionate - which no doubt the younguns are (and that is a GREAT thing) - guy who didn't even know that a cricket ball could swing (forget about reverse swing), to what i would like to think is a person who could hold his own in almost any contemporary cricket conversation.

i know its the circle of life...thats why i stated this is the changing of the guards...we can't be here forever...real life takes over. jobs, families, and the associated pressures renders BC as the thing that gets cut...although the passion usually never wanes.

btw, i made sure to illustrate my own issues in the OP...ur definitely right. my match-time posting has drastically gone down due primarily to the skype-factor...i now skype in game comments to a buddy of mine who's usually watching and commenting on his own...plus we can talk about other topics without needing to be relevant as well as use the "colorful" language that just isn't proper for a family forum such as this one. whereas i'm sure i've topped 100-200 posts in a match thread in a single day, i'm now down to like 4-5 max. i just can't be posting on skype, facebook, and BC all at the same time!

Neel Here
July 22, 2010, 11:26 PM
what I understand from this thread, BD needs to win more against G8 teams and stop losing against associates, period. till that happens we will keep having fights over sweet nothings on BC. :)

One World
July 23, 2010, 01:06 AM
I wrote a huge post and accidentally deleted, the gist of that post was, it is the more experienced who need to hand over the baton to the newbies and lead them through with proper guidance. So if they are not doing what is expected, those who think should be responsible need to help them out, but definitely with humility and respect, so the warmth and the community bondage is well in tact. The experienced bunch also need to be very careful while doing that as the younger they are more passionate and emotional they are. Use your own past experiences, current family responsibilities as examples and gain ideas from there that how you can handle the situation if it is below expectation, and also keep in mind this is just an online forum, not a monastery or academy.

Naimul_Hd
July 23, 2010, 02:25 AM
After reading all these comments, i find this thread to be true resemble of our national team ! Some of them are too egoistic and some of them lack proper guidance. NO OFFENCE TO ANYONE !!

May Allah bless us all and peace be upon us ! Ameen !

lamisa
July 23, 2010, 04:23 AM
al faruqaan bhai,the thing is that we have a lot of new members here in bc and it is never easy to settle in a place at first.people are scared that they might say the wrong thing or make a fool of themselves somehow so they don't risk going into all that intellectual stuff and just start with small talk,meaning one lined posts.even i used to opt more for timid,one line posts since i was not confident enough and just didn't know much about cricket apart from the basic rules.but now i can say that atleast i am not completely ignorant when it comes to cricket and can very confidently stick up for my opinions that i express here in bc:)

revolver
July 23, 2010, 05:29 AM
"In war, your opponent must be demolished, humiliated, destroyed, torn to pieces and the shreds fed to dogs. And cricket forum* is greater than war."- (Gen. Asif The Man Rahman)




*subject to edit

:notworthy::notworthy::notworthy::notworthy:

Baundule
July 23, 2010, 05:52 AM
Most often, it is not the shirt that is changing its size; but we are growing older. Cricket is a passion; but other things also get priority as life goes on. So, many people may leave the forum for personal reasons as well.

So far, I am quite happy with the way the BC is going. The equation of intelligence is somewhat relative. For example, I am quite surprised by the fact that some of the BC fans still supports Siddons view; but I have respect for them, may be, they see something that I do not see. As long as we are working towards the same/similar goal, it's not a big conflict.

The newer members in the forum are actually the heart of it. They may think a bit differently than us, because they have grown up in cricket, while football was the more popular sport while older people like me were growing up. About the sanity of the forum and mutual respect, I do not have any big objection, it has been quite smooth, with bad incidents occurring only occassionally.

A big salute to the members and the mods from my side, BC is the most sane forum I have ever been a part of.

Beamer
July 23, 2010, 09:54 AM
Tsk tsk Al..You should have known better. Why oh why do you commit the cardinal sin of not mentioning Zeeshan in your list of names? You got him all hot and bothered.

Zeeshan
July 23, 2010, 03:39 PM
I am always hot and bothered. This is me smiling. ---------------> :mad:

One World
July 24, 2010, 10:47 AM
The cat is out of the bag I guess.

FagunerAgun
July 24, 2010, 10:51 AM
In this human race, intellectualism has been best used to resolve problems in a positive way, not to create problems.

One World
July 24, 2010, 10:53 AM
In this human race, intellectualism has been best used to resolve problems in a positive way, not to create problems.

So you claim that Alfred Nobel was a problem!!

Peace
July 24, 2010, 11:00 AM
So you claim that Alfred Nobel was a problem!!

I think he is saying that the politicians or the advisors of politicians are not intellectuals and they are not responsible for any wars.:confused:

One World
July 24, 2010, 11:33 AM
I think he is saying that the politicians or the advisors of politicians are not intellectuals and they are not responsible for any wars.:confused:

I think either his comment is too generalized or your reply is just an assumption.

FagunerAgun
July 24, 2010, 11:55 AM
So you claim that Alfred Nobel was a problem!!
Not my claim, actually his claim, he had been regreting for the rest of his life for inventing dynamites, and then he created Noble Peace Committee.

He invented dynamites for mining use, in a positive way, for the best use, but unfortunately it fell in the wrong hands.

You missed two key phrases in my previous post: 'best used' and 'in a positive way'.

Peace
July 24, 2010, 12:08 PM
Not my claim, actually his claim, he had been regreting for the rest of his life for inventing dynamites, and then he created Noble Peace Committee.

He invented dynamites for mining use, in a positive way, for the best use, but unfortunately it fell in the wrong hands.

You missed two key phrases in my previous post: 'best used' and 'in a positive way'.

Does not make sense.
Perhaps it could have been better phrased-
"In this human race, some intellectualism has been intended to resolve problems in a positive way, not to create problems."
would you agree?

Tigers_eye
July 24, 2010, 12:14 PM
The older posters have lived through Football days (supporting other countries like WI, Ind or Pak Not even SL or Zim), then ICC Trophy days (missing two world cups just by a thread), then making it to the worldcup, making it big time (by shear luck). We all went through the pain. Much harder than the Holland loss.

The newer posters have seen test status performance and their demand is higher. Therefore, their approach is different.

Oldies will always be replaced. My advice to the young ones here would be, do not personally attack someone. Don't say something that you would not want someone else to say it to you. Reread your post before you press the submit button.
+++

One World
July 24, 2010, 12:15 PM
Not my claim, actually his claim, he had been regreting for the rest of his life for inventing dynamites, and then he created Noble Peace Committee.

He invented dynamites for mining use, in a positive way, for the best use, but unfortunately it fell in the wrong hands.

You missed two key phrases in my previous post: 'best used' and 'in a positive way'.

Brother no offense, you should not get judgmental about things right a way. How would you know whether I missed parts of your post that you commented, a bit over-diligence on your part.

Best used - was the knowledge and intellect to create dynamite used while it was created or after, as I specifically mentioned Nobel, none who used it after creation.

Positive way - According to your post the attempt and invention was positive.

I think next time it will help you understand about who is missing what!

FagunerAgun
July 24, 2010, 12:21 PM
Does not make sense.
Perhaps it could have been better phrased-
"In this human race, some intellectualism has been intended to resolve problems in a positive way, not to create problems."
would you agree?
Nope, because, IMO, your embarrassing post contains a feeble and indiosyncratic logic,
So many things had been intended for in this world that did not take place.
We need to base our conclusions on what has happened, because history cares for what happened, it cares less for what was intended for.

Peace
July 24, 2010, 12:41 PM
Nope, because, IMO, your embarrassing post contains a feeble and indiosyncratic logic,
So many things had been intended for in this world that did not take place.
We need to base our conclusions on what has happened, because history cares for what happened, it cares less for what was intended for.

Not sure who is embarrassed.
According to you “He invented dynamites for mining use, in a positive way, for the best use, but unfortunately it fell in the wrong hands.”

My understanding about your above claim is that his invention (intellect) was intended for positive (peaceful) use of dynamite, but unfortunately it fell in the wrong hands. Therefore, it has not been “best used” (happened). Remember, best used>better used>good used.

FagunerAgun
July 24, 2010, 12:56 PM
Not sure who is embarrassed.
According to you “He invented dynamites for mining use, in a positive way, for the best use, but unfortunately it fell in the wrong hands.”

My understanding about your above claim is that his invention (intellect) was intended for positive (peaceful) use of dynamite, but unfortunately it fell in the wrong hands. Therefore, it has not been “best used” (happened). Remember, best used>better used>good used.
Get on the topic. No need to debate in a circle for nothing.
My first post was for those 'old intellectuals' who do not like to come to BC. What I meant by my generalized first post without pointing to any one or any groups, that you both guys missed, those intellectuals could have overcome the barriers, resolved problems with their shere power of intellectualism in this forum. They could have, at least, initiated the process (in their posts) to narrow the gap between the old and the new, in a positive way, with the best use of their intellectualism. Because they are 'intellectuals' as per the thread.

Again, Intellectualism finds its way to resolve problems, in this situation, in a positive way (without putting any newbees down), with their creativity in their posts.

Peace
July 24, 2010, 01:30 PM
Lets get on the topic then.
There was never short of intellectuals in BC. In fact, in my view, the present crops of intellectuals, likes of shaad bhai, ZeeshanM, One world, ImtiazK, Miraz, Dhrubo, BD_Nafees et all are better equipped with knowledge and intellectuality than the predecessors.

Furthermore, the names mentioned in the opening threads, likes of ATMR, Beamer, RazabQ, regularly posts in the forum.

I also do not agree that there is any loss of quality in BC postings, may be such quality posts are over shadowed by increased number of overall posts than in the past.

New members often get branded as KDDP for opening a thread, expressing his/her views. The quality of those threads may be low but we can simply avoid them. Those members are unlikely to show respect to the oldies.

In my view, the oldies are over rated, and the newbies are underrated. A change in perception is needed if we are to bridge the gap.

deshprem
July 24, 2010, 11:12 PM
man theres too many people here that just continue to drill a point. and also the subtle passive aggresiveness is very offensive, and shuts the person down. many people get off doing this cos they think it makes them more intellecual when they provide an indirect nudge.

BANFAN
July 25, 2010, 01:07 AM
The older posters have lived through Football days (supporting other countries like WI, Ind or Pak Not even SL or Zim), then ICC Trophy days (missing two world cups just by a thread), then making it to the worldcup, making it big time (by shear luck). We all went through the pain. Much harder than the Holland loss.
......................+++

TE, many of the new posters have gone through the same learning curve as well, may not be in BC. There are many passionate cricket fans, never made it to BC yet. So it could be misleading, if there is a pre conception that the new members aren't as much educated on our cricket/cricket in general like the old BC members.

Yes, younger members (by Age) might be having a different perspective of cricket than older (By Age) members. But then, not all new BC members are teenagers. Hope we consider that as well.

FagunerAgun
July 25, 2010, 08:01 AM
man theres too many people here that just continue to drill a point. and also the subtle passive aggresiveness is very offensive, and shuts the person down. many people get off doing this cos they think it makes them more intellecual when they provide an indirect nudge.
Hats-off.

Some of those intellectuals have self-identity and self-esteem crisis (my experience from reading their posts). So they are extreme and agressive to be recognized as intellectuals.:floor:

wiseshah
July 25, 2010, 08:10 AM
Isnt this thread supposed to be in the forget cricket section?

FagunerAgun
July 25, 2010, 08:16 AM
TE, many of the new posters have gone through the same learning curve as well, may not be in BC. There are many passionate cricket fans, never made it to BC yet. So it could be misleading, if there is a pre conception that the new members aren't as much educated on our cricket/cricket in general like the old BC members.

Yes, younger members (by Age) might be having a different perspective of cricket than older (By Age) members. But then, not all new BC members are teenagers. Hope we consider that as well.
Well stated.

However, there are some aged cricket fans here who do not have that much cricket knowledge (may be cricket is their third/fourth pass-time, or they do not have enough time to follow cricket and attain cricket knowledge but they like their country of origin and BD cricket, does not matter what) but they like to come to BC and post with their compatriots.

Sometimes those aged fans get hammered and humiliated in this forum when their posts do not contain that much cricket knowledge.

It is discouraging for those cricket fans to come to BC because of the passive agressiveness of those knowledgeable 'raw intellectuals'.

Peace
July 25, 2010, 08:40 AM
Sometimes what you perceive less important to drill, could be significantly important to others to debate (drill?). For example, the post of Faguneer Agun has more substantial element of fruitful debate than this thread itself, in my opinion.

The generalisation of intellectualism by FA could lead many young members here to believe that intellectualism has always been best used to resolve problems in positive way. This needed clarification or debate. Because such claim is untrue or misleading at the least (as appeared).

You do not need to look too far to invalidate such statement. The invention of nuclear warheads, mass destructive war weapons- (chemical and biological weapon), wars between countries, unequal distribution of wealth and unequal prosperity among countries provide sufficient evidence that some intellectualism have not been best used or intended for positive use; instead, some intellectualism have been used in evil way, very selfishly, to safeguard interest of group of people of own kind, rather than human race in wider extent. This philosophy (intellectualism) of safeguarding own kind people applies in many situation, and one can argue that it applies to this thread in less substantive extent. The topic of use of intellectualism deserves a separate thread.

Finally, passive nudging is not unhealthy in public forum, where one is in denial of facts and obvious truth, but direct gross judgemental on “many here” can not be excused.

FagunerAgun
July 25, 2010, 08:56 AM
One of the problems of the 'raw intellectuals' is to digress and deflect using indirect nudge, which creates debates in circle.

Keep it simple and discuss the post in perspective of the thread - how the post is relevant to the thread, if you can.

You can debate the way you like to as long as you are within the board rules of mighty BC and you are not banned, but how relevant is your post to the thread is sometimes questionable.

Young readers: intellectualism can be used in a positive way and the negative way, depends on the good/evil design of the individual/group.

In this forum, I prefer intellectualism being used in a positive way. The reason: (I had already stated the reason in post #48 'that even some egoistic intellectuals with tautology and half-wits here need multiple head-bangs to grasp') the young newbees/aged newbees will be not looked down upon/frowned upon very badly for their opinions/opportunities, by the 'intellectuals'.

ammark
July 25, 2010, 12:33 PM
I'm enjoying this debate. And I perhaps also fall into one of the categories FagunerAgun has given in post #54. However, I feel that the use of the word "intellectualism" in Bangladesh Cricket sub forum is misplaced. It would be more appropriate if in Bangladesh Cricket we saw, for example, more "analytical", "educational" and "insightful" posts and debates on Bangladesh Cricket structures, coaching, management, players, player's abilities, gameplay, strategies, and so forth :). I think this is what the opening post is all about.

- Just my 2 cents

gods of wisdom in BC that I miss certainly are gatekeeper & TheWatcher. They along with many old and new members personify "analytical", "insightful" and "educational" for me at BC.