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Razi
July 22, 2010, 01:12 PM
Mashrafe concerned
The Daily Star, July 23, 2010 (http://www.thedailystar.net/newDesign/news-details.php?nid=147856)

http://www.thedailystar.net/photo/2010/07/23/2010-07-23__sp04.jpg
WE DID WIN ON TOUR, YOU KNOW: Bangladesh coach Jamie Siddons (L) explains to reporters as captain Mashrafe Bin Mortaza looks on after their arrival at the Hazrat Shahjalal International Airport yesterday. PHOTO: ANISUR RAHMAN

It was a case of the glass half-empty or half-full.

The Bangladesh cricket team think-tank had different views of the 7-match tour of the United Kingdom.

Upon their return from London yesterday, Bangladesh captain Mashrafe Bin Mortaza told reporters that he believed the players should take responsibility for the shocking defeats against associate nations Ireland and the Netherlands. But coach Jamie Siddons reminded everyone of the good things the Tigers did on the tour -- beating England for the first time.

"There were some issues like losing the toss in both the matches and the condition but still I believe the players should take the responsibility for the defeats. We didn't play well and that's why we lost the matches," confessed Mashrafe while talking to reporters during the on-arrival press conference at the Hazrat Shahjalal International Airport yesterday.

"I am very much aware of the fact that everybody shared the joy when we won the match but players are only responsible when we lose," the pace spearhead added with a furtive smile.

While the Bangladesh captain had mixed reactions, Siddons was a very happy man with the outcome of the trip.

The Australian coach wanted to highlight his team's great victory against England rather than focusing on the defeats against the two ICC associate member countries, although Mashrafe had concerns with the bowling effort.

"What are you talking about? How is that easy? You got to listen to the whole story. The ground was under covers for five days and was under water four days earlier. Had we won the toss we would have had a chance. The pitch was damp, we missed two catches and bowling was poor so we lost the game. Don't be dramatic over that loss; it was a 30-overs game not a 50-overs game. Why don't you remember the win against England? It was a fantastic win," Siddons responded.

"We remember the win against Australia ten years later but we forgot the win against England two days later. That's not really fair.

"These boys played fantastically on the tour, we lost the 30-overs game against the Netherlands where the pitch was underwater four days before the game," he added.

"You weren't there, you don't understand what the wicket was like, what the condition was like. How much rush we were to travel, we didn't get time to practice. There were real excuses; I think the team performed reasonably well and shouldn't have lost that game yesterday, but we did and we got to move on," he said while defending his team's poor showing.

Pointing to the bright sight of his team, Siddons said: "I am pretty positive about it. I think it went quite well. Batting was really consistent; I think five out of six or four out of five games we were around the 250 or 240-mark. We didn't bat very well in one game against England."

The Tigers' coach was very confident that his team can beat both Ireland and the Netherlands in the 2011 World Cup group matches.

Like his coach, Mashrafe also blamed the condition and luck for the disaster against Ireland and the Netherlands but the 'Narail Express' said that they have to correct few things quickly before the World Cup.

"It's true that conditions and toss were factors but we still must have won those two matches. We must have won the series against Ireland against whom we secured a 3-0 victory at home (in 2006). We will get some time before the World Cup and we must rectify the mistakes we made in the last series.

"I'm really concerned with our bowling. We should focus on this area ahead of the World Cup. I believe this team has got the quality to play much better cricket than the performance had against the two weak teams," said Mashrafe.

Shakib Al Hasan didn't accompany the team due to his county commitment while Mohammad Ashraful has also stayed back in England.

Razi
July 22, 2010, 01:16 PM
I just can't stand this anymore, such [..] like him don't deserve to be a head coach of a national team, period.

Murad
July 22, 2010, 01:18 PM
Holy Sh*t!!
i wonder why Reporters didn't spit on this taklu!!

Destroyer of Bangladesh cricket. Should be sacked immediately.

MohammedC
July 22, 2010, 01:47 PM
So Chindon did not blame his players. WTH I thought he used to tell they are rubbish.

BTW we won 3-0 in 2008 not 2006.

Only thing I can say. When we loose like we did what ever Chindon said would have sound disgusting to us. Best thing to do is wait till WC2011 and then get rid of him.

Rifat
July 22, 2010, 01:47 PM
The Real problem is:

Siddons has Lower Standards, and thus lower expectations. of course he will be happy with the result! :o

We have REAL expectations, REAL standards, of course no matter how you look at it, a loss is a loss!
we will always be dissapointed losing to associates no matter what!

250-240? you gota be kidding me? we should move on not be satisfied UNTIL 280-290+ is the new norm!

Roni_uk
July 22, 2010, 01:50 PM
I am really surprised that he didnt go back to Aus for couple of months before coming back before the Kiwi series.

I wonder what he says to his friends and family, when they ask.. 'so Jammie.. tough, aye?'....
He prob replies back... 'Ya bunch of no good monkies' :)

Dilscoop
July 22, 2010, 02:16 PM
The Australian coach wanted to highlight his team's great victory against England rather than focusing on the defeats against the two ICC associate member countries...
And all you anti-JS fools think JS is negative. This guy is positive as HELL.


On a series note: How can he even say those things. Things that are bold. Again we see many different excuses from him, and pointing fingers bowlers, this and that. And he leads the batsmen to a safe way out.

30 overs, wet field, toss, ary goru chur, we are a test playing nation, and playing against a unranked team, those shouldn't EVEN matter! And this kinds of excuses will send a bad message to our players! Omg this guy gotta go!

Tiger444
July 22, 2010, 02:18 PM
This just shows how high his satisfaction level is when we post decent totals..and he's blaming how bad the pitch was? Then why did Holland bat so well? And look at his attitude to..he's telling us we should be happy with the win against England and not care about the Holland loss..of course people are gonna get mad when we lose to 2 teams that we're supposed to beat..The coach should be ripping apart those performances..

MohammedC
July 22, 2010, 02:21 PM
And all you anti-JS fools think JS is negative. This guy is positive as HELL.

Dilscoop aren't you one of the anti-siddons

Dilscoop
July 22, 2010, 02:24 PM
Dilscoop aren't you one of the anti-siddons
sarcasm?

Dilscoop
July 22, 2010, 02:27 PM
If this does not open Pro siddons eyes, Idk what will. Now I don't even care about how much he improved our batting. All that time I said I wont mind if he stays as a batting coach. Eff that, he should leave right now! I dont care if it's only 8 months away from WC. Screw WC. We aren't gonna win that.

MohammedC
July 22, 2010, 02:30 PM
off topic: While we cant get a high profile fast Bowling coach. An ordinary FC side in Zimbabwe hires Jason Gillespie as a head coach.

Gillespie to coach MidWest Rhinos (http://www.cricinfo.com/zimbabwe/content/current/story/468459.html)

Nadim
July 22, 2010, 02:36 PM
JS er fasi chbai...:mad:
<br />Posted via BC Mobile Edition

Dilscoop
July 22, 2010, 02:46 PM
off topic: While we cant get a high profile fast Bowling coach. An ordinary FC side in Zimbabwe hires Jason Gillespie as a head coach.

Gillespie to coach MidWest Rhinos (http://www.cricinfo.com/zimbabwe/content/current/story/468459.html)

Well done Zims. Great. Now they will beat us up and down, left and right. And who did we hire again?? Exactly we can't even say his name.

Nadim
July 22, 2010, 02:48 PM
off topic: While we cant get a high profile fast Bowling coach. An ordinary FC side in Zimbabwe hires Jason Gillespie as a head coach.

Gillespie to coach MidWest Rhinos (http://www.cricinfo.com/zimbabwe/content/current/story/468459.html)

Well done Zims. Great. Now they will beat us up and down, left and right. And who did we hire again?? Exactly we can't even say his name.

lol i'm sure u misunderstood this...

Zimbabwe FC side hired him not Zimbabwe NAT team.

MohammedC
July 22, 2010, 02:52 PM
lol i'm sure u misunderstood this...

Zimbabwe FC side hired him not Zimbabwe NAT team.

Thats exactly my point. It will benefit the Zim bowlers. Good on them. Only reason I brought this up Zimbabwe Cricket are going in right direction. They had concerned about their FC sides and doing something about it. Where as we cant even get it right for our national side.

bujhee kom
July 22, 2010, 02:55 PM
Jamie Siddons is not the right coach for Bangladesh. I simply do not think the players (our players) understand what Siddons says or what he wants them to do or what he is saying period.! And by now I think he should realize that, know that and he should discuss these things, speak up. It's a personal opinion based on long observation and study. I could be wrong.

Dilscoop
July 22, 2010, 02:55 PM
lol i'm sure u misunderstood this...

Zimbabwe FC side hired him not Zimbabwe NAT team.

No I didn't. I know the FC side hired him. If anything that makes us look even bad. And the bowlers from that team will improve a LOT. And they get a chance to play from Zim NAT team, and then they will whoop those JS shona-chandu batsmen. I am sure you never thought of it that way? :D

Equinox
July 22, 2010, 03:01 PM
That's why I want Mash as captain. Doesn't echo the coach word for word.

Miraz
July 22, 2010, 03:14 PM
That's why I want Mash as captain. Doesn't echo the coach word for word.

And this is why Siddons doesn't want Mashrafe as captain and publicly undermined him on the first day of his captaincy.

alibangali
July 22, 2010, 03:55 PM
I stopped watching games because it was too painful and only followed progress here and in cricinfo. Now I am thinking of not following cricket until this fool is gone.

Equinox
July 22, 2010, 05:07 PM
And this is why Siddons doesn't want Mashrafe as captain and publicly undermined him on the first day of his captaincy.
Having two spineless captains has given Siddons complete control over the team. In cricket the captain should have a greater say on strategies and public relations. Siddons has become a football style manager for us due to the incompetence of the previous captains. Like I said in another thread, he is the one journalists want to speak to instead of the captain. No other International coach gets as much attention as him - they remain in the background running training sessions. Hopefully Mash will set that right and won't be afraid to challenge Siddons when it comes to setting ideas and strategies for the team to follow. He needs full backing from the BCB to do so however.

RazabQ
July 22, 2010, 05:31 PM
Well in PA, Razzak was saying they basically slogged away blindly and got lucky (Holland i.e.)

chotpoti
July 22, 2010, 05:36 PM
what a shame..bcb still continuing with him !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Zobair
July 22, 2010, 05:44 PM
"What are you talking about? How is that easy? You got to listen to the whole story. The ground was under covers for five days and was under water four days earlier. Had we won the toss we would have had a chance. The pitch was damp, we missed two catches and bowling was poor so we lost the game. Don't be dramatic over that loss; it was a 30-overs game not a 50-overs game. Why don't you remember the win against England? It was a fantastic win," Siddons responded.

I agree with Siddons.

bujhee kom
July 22, 2010, 05:53 PM
"What are you talking about? How is that easy? You got to listen to the whole story. The ground was under covers for five days and was under water four days earlier. Had we won the toss we would have had a chance. The pitch was damp, we missed two catches and bowling was poor so we lost the game. Don't be dramatic over that loss; it was a 30-overs game not a 50-overs game. Why don't you remember the win against England? It was a fantastic win," Siddons responded.

I agree with Siddons.

I have to agree with Zobair bhaiya here! I agree with Siddons here.

Baundule
July 22, 2010, 06:02 PM
Guys, look at the positive sides of things. Siddons is very confident that we can beat both Ireland and Netherlands in the WC11. So, we have a very good future. :D

simon
July 22, 2010, 06:04 PM
I liked Mash's statement.
Siddons was partially wrong,partially right.

Miraz
July 22, 2010, 06:05 PM
Well in PA, Razzak was saying they basically slogged away blindly and got lucky (Holland i.e.)

Razab bhai, that's a very poor attempt to cover-up wayward bowling. We used to hear similar excuses from para bowlers in local league.

You cannot chase 200 in 30 overs by blindly slogging. It's impossible. The text commentary in cricinfo and cricketeurope were complementary to the holland batting while they branded Mashrafe's heaves as "ugly".

Baundule
July 22, 2010, 06:08 PM
"What are you talking about? How is that easy? You got to listen to the whole story. The ground was under covers for five days and was under water four days earlier. Had we won the toss we would have had a chance. The pitch was damp, we missed two catches and bowling was poor so we lost the game. Don't be dramatic over that loss; it was a 30-overs game not a 50-overs game. Why don't you remember the win against England? It was a fantastic win," Siddons responded.

I agree with Siddons.
Boss, there are still some people buying his cock and bull story and that's why Siddons is still getting his salary. The ground was under cover when we were bating and it suddenly became a batting paradise when the Dutch had their turn. And then that 30 over match and bla bla bla. We lost 7 wickets within that 30 overs, 50 over bat korle duniya ultay feltam! What a ridiculous reason from the loser to lose against Netherlands!

MohammedC
July 22, 2010, 06:18 PM
We lost end of story. BCB wont sack Siddons before WC2011 lets move on and see what happens in coming month.
To all people who have lost faith in Siddons, the upcoming world cup is blessing in disguise.

Get rid of him after WC. Regardless of win or loose.

RazabQ
July 22, 2010, 06:22 PM
We just don't have power/inventiveness in our lower order any more. Aftab/Ash/SN/Kapali - one or two of these guys are needed. You can't just lose that kind of explosiveness when you are a talent poor nation as BD. Also, Shahadat preferring smoking to being the bowler he can be, Sajidul and Robin not coming on as hoped for - these are losses that Tigers can ill-afford.

Again, the fault lies in our weak-minded, extrinsic factor motivated cricketers and more so on our lame-assed administrators. And of course having a defeatist coach is the proverbial last straw ...

Rifat
July 22, 2010, 06:25 PM
We lost end of story. BCB wont sack Siddons before WC2011 lets move on and see what happens in coming month.
To all people who have lost faith in Siddons, the upcoming world cup is blessing in disguise.

Get rid of him after WC. Regardless of win or loose.

another post i am marking! let's see what people thinks of Jamie Siddons after Bangladesh does its "thang" in the World Cup ;)

Zobair
July 22, 2010, 06:34 PM
Baundule did you miss this part?

"...The pitch was damp, we missed two catches and bowling was poor so we lost the game..."

Thats the honest truth.

Dilscoop
July 22, 2010, 06:50 PM
^^ That's still not good enough reason for a TEST side to lose to a UNRANKED team. 2 catches shouldn't be a problem. We should be getting them bowled. And stop with the bowlers blaming, and giving the batsmen a free pass saying the pitch was damp. How come they could chase it down with 2 overs to spare? Our batsmen should have got us 250, it's not like their bowling is world class.

And to JS, the reason we still remember Aus win after 10 years because it was a complete team win. We won that game. It wasn't a fluke win like the one against England. And after the Aus win, we did not go and lose to Zims, and other asso. teams that we played then right after. That's why we forget the Eng win, because we lost 2 games in a row against Asso teams. You stupid idiot!

Tiger444
July 22, 2010, 06:57 PM
This also shows that BCB are complete idiots..they barely put any pressure on the guy to make this team perform..thats why you see the attitude that "this team is doing better then ever before." When the team performs bad you have to let the coach know that if you don't have the team perform then your on the hot seat..Siddons knows his job is safe and BCB don't really care..also didn't Kamal have the guts to call out the players? Why can't he call out the coach then? He's a complete cheap shot artist..he knows how to talk smack to the young players but can't talk any smack to the coach? Ya some leaders we got up on the board..

Baundule
July 22, 2010, 07:13 PM
Baundule did you miss this part?

"...The pitch was damp, we missed two catches and bowling was poor so we lost the game..."

Thats the honest truth.
Zobair bhai, I did not miss it; but it is just a pathetic excuse to justify the loss. Missing two or three or even more catches is quite common for us, the pitch thing is a big lie as is evident from the fact that we scored 132/2 from the first 17 overs. The middle order could not capitalize on that great start (scored only 67 runs in the last 13 overs with a RR of about 5, was there some shower in between?). Scoring 200 runs in 30 overs on a batting paradise against an associate team is a sin and then putting the blame only on the bowling!! That is light years away from the truth.

FaHiMa
July 22, 2010, 07:31 PM
you know Siddons has a point ..but again NET and Ire are both associate teams! So Mash has it right!

Zeeshan
July 22, 2010, 08:07 PM
We just don't have power/inventiveness in our lower order any more. Aftab/Ash/SN/Kapali - one or two of these guys are needed. You can't just lose that kind of explosiveness when you are a talent poor nation as BD. Also, Shahadat preferring smoking to being the bowler he can be, Sajidul and Robin not coming on as hoped for - these are losses that Tigers can ill-afford.

Again, the fault lies in our weak-minded, extrinsic factor motivated cricketers and more so on our lame-assed administrators. And of course having a defeatist coach is the proverbial last straw ...

I would add Nazim:-Dddin to it. (Sadly Naeem and Riyad also lost their touch in recent times). With proper guidance Nazim:-Dddin can be trimmed and tailored to make clean shots like Tamim. Instrinsic of our nation is our spirit. Someone like Siddons who wasn't born in our country sadly doesn't know the **** about poverty and where we come from and what it feels like to transcend and rise above adversaries. A coach's job is much more than tinkering with batting techniques. If he could properly channel and fuel the above mentioned spirit factor he could make guys like the ones you mentioned total Sehwagian beasts. Emotion plays a HUGE role in it. Anyone who has drove past the countless images of amputees, bricklayers, beggars, people sleeping on garbage heap or heck better yet when they come from that background knows exactly what it feels like to thwack other bowlers around like rag dolls. TAMIM IQBAL certainly knows that. But he can channel and control his aggression to certain extent. While Ash, Aftab and the ones you mentioned has the fire in the belly but not the rigor of grafting a game. Whatmore was the crazy genius to spinoff of the EMOTIONAL FACTOR and light the spark.

So yeah if Siddons -instead of lamenting dearth of legends like Gambhir, Dhoni, Vettori, Watson in the team- saw the potential in the effulgent ember of team spirit- and helped to FUEL it through filtering our faults we could've easily have had cornucopia of wins. Instead, whatever fire we had left in people like Ash, SN, Aftab, was lost.

Bottomline: We got to get that winner mentality back. Siddons can get a citizenship of BD and sacrifice his life away for the team in battlefied, but he wouldn't have the shittiest idea what it feels like to come from a nation that faught for and won independece and being the player to rise above obstacles like financial matter, negative mindset and criticism, politics, trauma of family losses, dailys news of natural disasers finally get the natural high to dance down the track and despatch bowlers for sixes at will. Basically what it boils down to this:

Do you really care for the Bangladesh team, Siddons?

wiseshah
July 22, 2010, 09:33 PM
to judge siddons, lets wait for next tour against NZ.

its disappointing to lose against minnows but winning against england is great too

lets see if we can win series against NZ, that will compensate all the loss

mishu
July 22, 2010, 09:53 PM
To blame Siddons every time for player failure is not right... when all player perform according to their talent, and they lose only than you can you blame the coach...

Rifat
July 22, 2010, 09:58 PM
the miscalulations of Bangladesh Cricket Board, the misuse of Player's potential, the blunders in tactics....Players are not to blame!

they are given a role to fill and they should do their best to fulfill it!

al Furqaan
July 22, 2010, 10:05 PM
Well in PA, Razzak was saying they basically slogged away blindly and got lucky (Holland i.e.)

there may be some truth to that, the number of edges that went for 4 behind the keeper had to amount to 20-30 runs.

but what about the ireland game? perhaps the boys didnt get a chance to read the pitch and practice...and traveling was an issue...but at this stage we should have done better. i can understand a narrow win, but losing by 7 wickets is not acceptable. they just couldn't bat in the dying overs, plain and simple.

mishu
July 22, 2010, 10:15 PM
Tamim scoring 2 runs, shakib 15, mushfiq 0: against Netherlands what kind of player are they,,,

Tamim 5, imrul 5, jahrul 3, mushfiq 9 : against Ireland

these are our top players, you cant expect them to perform soo badly and than blame the coach

Mushfiq is out of form plus adha kana ekhon, why was he included after England ....

shabbir
July 22, 2010, 11:26 PM
Just Read persons report who watched match from the field

http://www.dailyinqilab.com/july22/index.htm

_Rafi_
July 22, 2010, 11:41 PM
This is ridiculous from Siddons. His statement about the failure is very elusive and cleverly he avoided the main points of controversy. I think our so called journalist didnt ask anything about Riyad's position in the team, their persistency with Raj and Ash, criminality of not giving Riyad any single over in final ODI etc. Our journo's dont have the ability of quizzing a coach properly, R. McInse once said it on this forum. They always stick to the same old questions and Siddons clearly giving same old answers/excuses which is ridiculing all of us and them. Our media reacts when we fail and starts criticizing the board and team which is hardly constructive. They need to be bit proactive there and have to maintain minimum standard as the media of a test playing and cricket crazy nation.

Ajfar
July 22, 2010, 11:58 PM
Just Read persons report who watched match from the field

http://www.dailyinqilab.com/july22/index.htm

If this stuff is all true than I have no idea what to say. Why in the world would they book their flight so close to the game time? We were away on this tour for over a month, would it have killed to stay one more night and leave the next day? I somehow don't really believe the whole Pak fan swearing at our players and them protesting by stopping the play. I'm sure we would have read something about it on the live commentary.

Excuses Excuses Excuses the whole team is full of excuses. unara naki home sick?? kochu. Ek ek jon er ki icha gf bou bacha ma baap choudho ghusti niya tour e jawar.

One World
July 23, 2010, 12:26 AM
Just Read persons report who watched match from the field

http://www.dailyinqilab.com/july22/index.htm

Interesting.

So if those things really happened then the integrity of JS can be questioned easily. Why Faisal instead of Nayeem? There is some issues very carefully need to be scrutinized from this report. The full power of selection if handed to the coach and the coach has his mind set to some other things rather than win, then this type of ending inevitable no matter how favourable the situation is.

What I feel he was so satisfied with the team batting, that it never troubled him to strategize the bowling/fielding areas. Probably he was thinking if I could made them score 20 more runs we could be winning by fluke.

Well done Siddons for ruining the team spirit from both ends.

wasi90lkv1
July 23, 2010, 12:30 AM
netherlands beat england in 2009, it was a 20 overs game. netherlands team is not as bad as some of the posters are stating them to be.

we need to move on, we can not just blame the coach over and over. it is time to focus on the next series against new zealand.

most likely siddons will not be sacked before the world cup.

lamisa
July 23, 2010, 12:32 AM
And all you anti-JS fools think JS is negative. This guy is positive as HELL.


On a series note: How can he even say those things. Things that are bold. Again we see many different excuses from him, and pointing fingers bowlers, this and that. And he leads the batsmen to a safe way out.

30 overs, wet field, toss, ary goru chur, we are a test playing nation, and playing against a unranked team, those shouldn't EVEN matter! And this kinds of excuses will send a bad message to our players! Omg this guy gotta go!

i agree with u here(can't believe i am saying this!).now we need the excuses of how horrible the pitch turned out to be in order to cover up for our shameful defeat against hollnad?

lamisa
July 23, 2010, 12:47 AM
We just don't have power/inventiveness in our lower order any more. Aftab/Ash/SN/Kapali - one or two of these guys are needed. You can't just lose that kind of explosiveness when you are a talent poor nation as BD. Also, Shahadat preferring smoking to being the bowler he can be, Sajidul and Robin not coming on as hoped for - these are losses that Tigers can ill-afford.

Again, the fault lies in our weak-minded, extrinsic factor motivated cricketers and more so on our lame-assed administrators. And of course having a defeatist coach is the proverbial last straw ...

are we allowed to use words like that in this forum?

WarWolf
July 23, 2010, 12:52 AM
"What are you talking about? How is that easy? You got to listen to the whole story. The ground was under covers for five days and was under water four days earlier. Had we won the toss we would have had a chance. The pitch was damp, we missed two catches and bowling was poor so we lost the game. Don't be dramatic over that loss; it was a 30-overs game not a 50-overs game. Why don't you remember the win against England? It was a fantastic win," Siddons responded.

I agree with Siddons.
I don't. What happened to the Ireland match which we lost?

Basically I don't like the attitude of this guy. He is always full of excuses.

One World
July 23, 2010, 01:01 AM
I don't.

Me neither.

PoorFan
July 23, 2010, 04:08 AM
What Siddon saying over and over again is ... "you guys got what you deserve" ... this time no exception, and that hurts lots of our fans and media.

However this moron himself forgot that he has given 4 long years with best players we have got, yet his team can not play batting power play, can not pace innings before or after 40 overs! Least has been said on bowling and fielding [improvement] is better. A consistent target of 230-250 is good for first 1 year or so, no way can be a mission for 4 years!

Having 2011 WC mission in hand just around few months later, he still remain happy going to bed with that target. What exactly is his business with 2011 WC? Why on earth he went for his job extended? What was his target for the second term? Can he be honest enough to explain his targets and achievements for 2nd term of his job?

Question should be asked why we regularly fail to score beyond 250+, why we fail to play in batting power play, and what exactly is he doing to fix those, and most importantly how freaking long will it take! Small [or big] batting improvement in top order can not cover up those consistent failure. If he can not fix those batting problem by now then what is his business with coming world cup? A complete failure waiting ahead he should be aware of, otherwise I would call him just robbing salary from a poor country.

He should speak out true problem with the team and his strategy to fix, not those crap to cheer up the craps.

reyme
July 23, 2010, 04:46 AM
Siddons has given the sole authority to select the final 11. His reaction says it all, the team is losing to an unranked associate team, he was unmoved during and after the game.

The man simply does not care. Exactly, he is just robbing the huge salary from a poor country and in the process taking down our cricket to a point from which we may never be able to recover. Everybody can question our test status after losing to 2 associate teams in days, while giving ODI status to Netherlands in the process.

I wonder what will Siddons will say after we are officially lose our test status! We never deserved test staus but give another contrcat extension to Siddon with a Billion $ bonus! Shame on Siddons for his continous shameful comedy and BCB to continue to persue with this idiot.

zainab
July 23, 2010, 06:17 AM
It seems that he is the only coach who speaks to the media, Why does the BD media pay so much attention to him? and then he feels that the media and everyone else are idiots and accept his fruitless excuses and ramblings. shame on the BD media for even approaching him.
But aside from the coach, the players have to shoulder responsibility for losses to 2 Associates. They had to be the test team that Netherlands chalked up their first win, seems that BD is very generous to give other teams milestones.
Players are not committed, plays recklessly, especially Tamim and Sakib, dont understand their roles in the team. A friend of mine said that in his opinion, they should learn to play cricket, they do not know how to play it, and he is wondering how they are a Test team, when Ireland and Netherlands are better than them and I am sure if they play Afghanistan, they will be beaten.
These countries are hungry for wins and plays positively, and BD underestimates them, but the fact is that they have progressed rapidly whilst BD has regressed in the last year, thanks to Siddons.

Raynman
July 23, 2010, 09:33 AM
Questions to Siddons:

1. If we should be happy with the ENG win, why can't we be unhappy about the IRE loss and doubly unhappy about the NED loss?

2. When the bowling captain is upset at the level of effort what does it say when you are satisfied with scoring the 240 which by definition is 30-40 runs less than making the game competitive?

3. How about giving the bowlers credit for stopping this from being a 0-26 run?

4. Do you take some responsibility for turning this team into a team that can only expect results if we win the toss AND the pitch conditions are what we want AND have the best possible day AND the players are well rested AND the opponent has a horrible day?

5. Have you considered playing 11 batsmen and targetting to score 300+ and then forefeit the match since its pointless to your plan to bowl anyways?

6. Did you have a long talk with the team about the ENG win as it broke your rules by actually showing team effort? (I take this question back, because obviously he did and that demonstrated in the follow up 144 run loss).

7. How should we measure your succes in the world cup? Do you promise to do your best to help NED and/or IRE try to qualify for the quarterfinals?

8. Can you work your 'batting miracles' on more than one or two batsman per game?

9. Are you upset with Juhurul for not living up to the standards you expected from Ash?

10. Have you considered coaching ZIM or IRE after Bangladesh so you can also undo the progress there from the recent years?

cricket_king
July 23, 2010, 09:39 AM
Siddons' expectations are frighteningly limited. I just can't believe some of the things this guy is saying.

dark mage
July 23, 2010, 09:47 AM
This is ridiculous. Even a Zimbawe XI is thrashing Netherlands today and Siddons keeps coming up with excuses for losing to a 3rd rate team

Ananna
July 23, 2010, 09:55 AM
He must be FIRED.

BANFAN
July 23, 2010, 12:01 PM
"We remember the win against Australia ten years later but we forgot the win against England two days later. That's not really fair.

That Aus win was backed up by another super performance against Eng, although we didn't win. That was the standard of BD 10 (?) years back. And this Eng win was backed up by 2-1 loss against associate. Eng win has been clearly been marked as a fluke after miserable defeat in the third and performance with associates. So Jamie, we don't eat the recipe of your satisfaction, don't consider all of us too be fools. I admit there are still some, but nit many.

Beamer
July 23, 2010, 12:07 PM
^^ You think people who disagree with your views are fools? Me included?

bujhee kom
July 23, 2010, 12:35 PM
I am really truly sick and tired of Siddons speak nonsense and worthless words. He is a filure for Bangladesh team as a head coach. He needs to shut up, it's over.

simon
July 23, 2010, 01:03 PM
I don't think there is any chance of getting rid os Sidd before world cup.
But only way we can improve now is that the players will have to take more responsibilities & play as a team,most of them r experienced,they don't need to follow every word of Siddons.
I hope Mash will guide this team better.

Dilscoop
July 23, 2010, 01:24 PM
^^ You think people who disagree with your views are fools? Me included?
I am sorry to tell you this, but what Banfan wrote was not a VIEW/OPINION, rather FACTS. He copy pasted FACTS from the FACT book. Not a VIEW. Those are FACT. F-A-C-T. Fact. There is no right or wrong on that, there is no agreeing or disagreeing to that. It's a FACT.

Ban won a game v Eng, and lost to 2 asso. teams. How can they celebrate about Eng after that? Have a little shame. After the Aus win, they won against the Zims or who ever they played right after that tour. Those are facts. Not view.

The only reason they won the Eng game because of Bell's injury. I have high doubt about the man who avg. over 150 against Ban couldn't score those 5 more runs.

Beamer
July 23, 2010, 01:32 PM
I would rather have him answer it. But, no matter what the facts are, and that depends on who is saying it, my point was why must we call each other 'fools' or other names , if we don't agree with each others positions? If that is the new standard, then don't cry if somebody does exactly that to you.

RazabQ
July 23, 2010, 02:57 PM
To lamisa, as myself:

lame-*** mane lengra gadha. And yes that is certainly acceptable as far I can think of.

Zobair
July 23, 2010, 03:30 PM
Can you please elaborate on this "another super performance". I can't recall any. Is it the one where England racked up their highest ever ODI score...nearly 400?

That Aus win was backed up by another super performance against Eng, although we didn't win. That was the standard of BD 10 (?) years back. And this Eng win was backed up by 2-1 loss against associate. Eng win has been clearly been marked as a fluke after miserable defeat in the third and performance with associates. So Jamie, we don't eat the recipe of your satisfaction, don't consider all of us too be fools. I admit there are still some, but nit many.

Dilscoop
July 23, 2010, 04:01 PM
I'd rather take Eng scoring 400 over losing against unranked teams, back to back

Spitfire_x86
July 23, 2010, 04:03 PM
That Aus win was backed up by another super performance against Eng, although we didn't win.
Conceding 391 runs and then coming nowhere close to that total is "super performance", yeah right! I know back then our expectation to the team was lower than what it is now, but I don't remember anyone saying that was "super performance".

The only thing wrong in that statement is the year count.

Spitfire_x86
July 23, 2010, 04:06 PM
I'd rather take Eng scoring 400 over losing against unranked teams, back to back
Of course you would take that, wouldn't you? Something that didn't happen?

And as a matter of fact, we didn't lose "back to back".

Spitfire_x86
July 23, 2010, 04:10 PM
Or is it the super performance (http://www.cricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/212253.html) we are talking about?

Nowadays the team and Siddons gets crucified for regularly losing like this. Back then we were happy if we lost like that once in while.

cricman
July 23, 2010, 04:12 PM
Conceding 391 runs and then coming nowhere close to that total is "super performance", yeah right! I know back then our expectation to the team was lower than what it is now, but I don't remember anyone saying that was "super performance".

The only thing wrong in that statement is the year count.

We followed up w/ another spirited performance vs # 1 team in the world, where we reached 250 vs them, We ended that tour on a much better note than this one

cricman
July 23, 2010, 04:25 PM
Or is it the super performance (http://www.cricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/212253.html) we are talking about?

Nowadays the team and Siddons gets crucified for regularly losing like this. Back then we were happy if we lost like that once in while.

But we'd actually win once in a while too, we were on the ascend

Dec 04‚ IND: 1 win
Jan 05, Zim: 3-2, 1-0 (that Zim side was better than WI-C
May/Jun: That win siddu wants us to forget
Sept - Forgetable tour of SL
Feb 06 - 1 win vs SL
Apr 06: Siddons esqe losses vs Aus, which were deemed acceptable

One hiccup in Harare but we recovered and an acceptable WC

W/ this guy I dont wanna get to the Wc

We beat Scotland, Canada, Bermuda & Kenya pre WC, we Just lost to Holland!

Dilscoop
July 23, 2010, 04:27 PM
Of course you would take that, wouldn't you? Something that didn't happen?

And as a matter of fact, we didn't lose "back to back".
oh ya we won a game in between. That makes a lot of difference. /:)

After Aus win, Eng scored nearly 400. And then we did not go onto lose against the minnow teams that we played right after.

After this recent win against Eng, Eng nearly scored 400. AND we lost 2 matches against unranked teams!

And the coach asks why aren't we happy about the current situation as much as we were when we won against Aus.

Also he says to him this Eng is currently #1 ODI side, just to boost up one blue moon win he brought for us. The #1 team of 05 Aus is no where NEAR current so called #1 Eng team.

I am sorry, but it is not that hard to understand that, why are we even arguing about this. The Current situation is diffidently CRAP. And to compare that to one of the happiest moment of Bangladesh cricket is just making things even more ugly.

Dilscoop
July 23, 2010, 04:29 PM
Also during Aus win, none of the players were injured during the game.

Spitfire_x86
July 23, 2010, 04:52 PM
But we'd actually win once in a while too, we were on the ascend

Dec 04‚ IND: 1 win
Jan 05, Zim: 3-2, 1-0 (that Zim side was better than WI-C
May/Jun: That win siddu wants us to forget
Sept - Forgetable tour of SL
Feb 06 - 1 win vs SL
Apr 06: Siddons esqe losses vs Aus, which were deemed acceptable
The flukey win pattern hasn't worsened in Siddons era. It's just that the gap between 2 flukey wins was longer this time. Still we had at least 1 flukey win per year with Siddons. The only year we had 2 flukey wins was 2007, and with slightly better umpiring luck we could've matched that record this year.

MatinSux
July 23, 2010, 05:42 PM
Conceding 391 runs and then coming nowhere close to that total is "super performance", yeah right! I know back then our expectation to the team was lower than what it is now, but I don't remember anyone saying that was "super performance".

The only thing wrong in that statement is the year count.
Not to mention that amazing perf we pulled up against the Lankans after defeating India, oh and then our best ever perf against the Irish just after defeating the South Africans.

22Yards
July 23, 2010, 05:45 PM
Truth is, before we use to win a game once in a blue moon, and truth now is we still win a game once in a blue moon. Its still considered as an accident if we beat a test playing nation like we did with England few days back. Performance has definitely grew and we seem to perform better more frequently. But the collapses that we witness along the better performances is just heartbreaking to see because by that time you already have a hope that this team is better what it was before.

MatinSux
July 23, 2010, 05:46 PM
Also during Aus win, none of the players were injured during the game.
I understand but where are the superstars who are responsible for that win are right now?
Mr. Matin and his best pal oh dear me I forgot his name.

al-Sagar
July 23, 2010, 10:32 PM
okay the pitch was damp, and under water four days ??? but does it change in over a matter of 10-15 overs from batting hell to paradise. if there was an early morning shower, then ok the first few overs will seam and swing and then it dries up. but this was not early morning showers it was continous rain for 4-5 days. and in this case the dampness should have carried on for the whole days.

now again, we batted well in first 17 overs, and then lost the way in the last 13. that were we first lost the game. we have seen consistently in the ENG games we could not finish our innings well in last 15 overs. so this has been a problem part for us.

and then we did not bowl well and we could not defend. and the blame should go to bowlers and fielders.

now when we win again g8 sides, we have to play well and also hope we capitalaize on some mistakes of the g8 sides and take our chances.

now consider we as a g8 and netherlands as us. the winning formula for netherlands is clear. they have to play well and then have to take the chances when we make mistakes. we made mistakes in the last 13 overs of batting. they took chances. we made mistakes in our bowling, they took chances and they won the game.

the g8 teams can make big mistakes and still recover and win a game agaisnt us. but we can t make even smaller mistake agaisnt associates and then hope to recover. because all the associates are getting close to us.

u all know the proverb "dosher lathi, eker bojha"

the associates are developing team wise, making small small improvements in players, and combining them in big team improvements. and keeping the basics right.

but we are trying to make drastic improvements in players, and the same time forgetting basics, and when we play as a team we cannot combine them and the net resultant is zero.

OFF TOPIC: Netherlands have just beaten Zimbabwe last night. shows they have also making improvements .

Dilscoop
July 23, 2010, 11:05 PM
I just love how Spitfire_x86 ignored my reply...

cricket_king
July 23, 2010, 11:41 PM
OFF TOPIC: Netherlands have just beaten Zimbabwe last night. shows they have also making improvements .

It wasn't the Zimbabwe national team. It was the second XI. Nonetheless, it was a pretty commanding win.

Spitfire_x86
July 23, 2010, 11:45 PM
I just love how Spitfire_x86 ignored my reply...
Didn't feel like repeating myself over and over, but since you asked for it I'll go ahead.

Also he says to him this Eng is currently #1 ODI side, just to boost up one blue moon win he brought for us. The #1 team of 05 Aus is no where NEAR current so called #1 Eng team.
OK, maybe this Eng team is not as good as the Australia team of 2005, but we still beat a team ranked a lot above us. And they were an in-form team, after winning T20 WC and a 5 match ODI series against the currently ranked #1 ODI side.

It's not our fault that Bell got injured while fielding. It's part of the game.

I am sorry, but it is not that hard to understand that, why are we even arguing about this. The Current situation is diffidently CRAP. And to compare that to one of the happiest moment of Bangladesh cricket is just making things even more ugly.
So what if that moment is "one of the happiest moments" of Bangladeshi cricket? The fact is we won just 1 game, lost in an ok-ish manner in another game, and got thrashed in all of the remaining games. Just in the beginning of that year, we lost back-to-back home ODIs against a Zimbabwe side that was arguably no better than any good associate side.

2005 was very bad year for us (performance against top #8 sides), apart from that win. The other "good match" we are still so proud of, is now almost a routine thing, and I'm glad that we are not satisfied any more with just "near wins". We were absolutely crap in all of the tests we played in that year.

BANFAN
July 23, 2010, 11:47 PM
^^ You think people who disagree with your views are fools? Me included?

Beamer, isn't there quiet a bit difference between dis-agreeing with me and agreeing to Sid? Do you think all those who disagree with Sid, agrees with me?

But it would be interesting to know, if you would buy his logic of celebrating for Eng victory after losing to Ire & Holland.

al-Sagar
July 24, 2010, 02:58 AM
It wasn't the Zimbabwe national team. It was the second XI. Nonetheless, it was a pretty commanding win.

thanksx, i checked it later.

BANFAN
July 24, 2010, 03:28 AM
Can you please elaborate on this "another super performance". I can't recall any. Is it the one where England racked up their highest ever ODI score...nearly 400?

I consider it to be a super performance in the context of that time and also to our current approach / objectives after 5 years.

1. Although England put up a mamoth score of 391, we didn't give up
2. We chased pretty well until 25 overs (155/2) just before Ashraful got out. Infact they made it look as if it was possible to chase down at that stage. Unfortunately, today we give up on anything around 300 and start making 200-240.
3. We managed to make 223, but that magnificient innings of Ash, 94 of 52 balls and 59 frol JO, how can you forget that. If we had Shaki/Tamim/junaid along with that attitude, we could even dare to chase down 391 or give a closer fight. That attitude was something so special and so much essential for any team to develop & be victorious, I cannot call it anything but a super performance, Specially in today's context, why we can only dream of such attitude.
4. Although we lost, the English Crowd enjoyed a match played by BD against them and appreciated.
5. Although we lost, That was such a confidence building match, we proved that chasing down 250 against Australia wasn't a fluke.
6. We lost that match, but didn't lose our moral, these days in JS approach of making 240 as we did in Asia cup, we not only lose matches, we lose our characters, respect, confidence and much more. Only gainer of these matches is JS, because he can just add up his stats of 200+ scores. He is certainly doing things on purpose, to keep himself safe first.

That was indeed a super performance by all means.

salin
July 24, 2010, 04:09 AM
Ok sack siddon after world cup. but problem is after world cup we may lose both test and ODI status. so local coach will be enough for us.

zainab
July 24, 2010, 04:56 AM
This is ridiculous. Even a Zimbawe XI is thrashing Netherlands today and Siddons keeps coming up with excuses for losing to a 3rd rate team

Are you sure it is not the other way around.

shakibrulz
July 24, 2010, 06:04 AM
You cannot chase 200 in 30 overs by blindly slogging. It's impossible..

How do you think Afridi scores centuries, then? :-D

nobody
July 24, 2010, 06:09 AM
Baundule did you miss this part?

"...The pitch was damp, we missed two catches and bowling was poor so we lost the game..."

Thats the honest truth.
How many matches we won againest superior opposition due to poor pitch. Why bowling was poor? WTH the fielding coach doing?

dark mage
July 24, 2010, 07:17 AM
I consider it to be a super performance in the context of that time and also to our current approach / objectives after 5 years.

1. Although England put up a mamoth score of 391, we didn't give up
2. We chased pretty well until 25 overs (155/2) just before Ashraful got out. Infact they made it look as if it was possible to chase down at that stage. Unfortunately, today we give up on anything around 300 and start making 200-240.
3. We managed to make 223, but that magnificient innings of Ash, 94 of 52 balls and 59 frol JO, how can you forget that. If we had Shaki/Tamim/junaid along with that attitude, we could even dare to chase down 391 or give a closer fight. That attitude was something so special and so much essential for any team to develop & be victorious, I cannot call it anything but a super performance, Specially in today's context, why we can only dream of such attitude.
4. Although we lost, the English Crowd enjoyed a match played by BD against them and appreciated.
5. Although we lost, That was such a confidence building match, we proved that chasing down 250 against Australia wasn't a fluke.
6. We lost that match, but didn't lose our moral, these days in JS approach of making 240 as we did in Asia cup, we not only lose matches, we lose our characters, respect, confidence and much more. Only gainer of these matches is JS, because he can just add up his stats of 200+ scores. He is certainly doing things on purpose, to keep himself safe first.

That was indeed a super performance by all means.


Good Post and I agree on all points. Our current attitude is way too pessimistic. I mean, before we used to atleast try and go after the targets

Especially agre with you regarding # 4 and # 6, after that Asia Cup match against Pakistan we became a laughing stock, it was a black patch for ODI cricket itself, the crowd and every commentators around the world were disgusted with our negative batting approach.

@zainab, yeah that was my mistake, as I spoke too soon. When I wrote that post, the Zimbos really were in a commanding situation in that match, so I thought they would win comfortably.

Beamer
July 24, 2010, 08:33 AM
Beamer, isn't there quiet a bit difference between dis-agreeing with me and agreeing to Sid? Do you think all those who disagree with Sid, agrees with me?

But it would be interesting to know, if you would buy his logic of celebrating for Eng victory after losing to Ire & Holland.

I don't agree with his post-game comments upon arrival . It sounds like an excuse to me. As I have said a million times, among other things with his shortcomings in shorter version, he lacks PR skills as well. My point was that recently some of us have resorted to calling others 'fool's or other adjectives if they don't agree with others. I may disagree with you, I may not like your opinions or point of views, but I don't think I will call you a fool because of that. Thanks for answering though.

Beamer
July 24, 2010, 08:40 AM
Spitty

How about the test series in England that year? Quite a super performance! For reasons completely unknown to me, people seem to be fixated on ODI's, as if we never got the test status! Boycott will be proud.

Spitfire_x86
July 24, 2010, 09:15 AM
Vendetta does funny things to people. Now I have to believe JO's batting in that "super performance" was part of the masterplan to chase down 391. Even back in the days when we were fighting on the issue of JO's worth in team, his most ardent defenders wouldn't imply something like that.

Zobair
July 24, 2010, 09:23 AM
All the bravado in your response is based on the ONE innings of Ashraful. That innings, breathtaking as it was, would have been extinguished on nought 999999 out of 1000000! Tremlett was incredibly unlucky not to get his hattrick on debut. JO innings, though lightning fast by his standards, was pedestrian in the context of the game. The less said about our performance in the rest of that match the better!

In the last game of the latest ODI series we did try to chase down the large English total but got out quickly playing too many shots even with the likes of Tamim, Zunaid and Shakib in the team. I assume you were similarly enthused by that performance even though we lost by a large margin? Or do you choose to ignore performances that contradict the narrative you are looking to build against the coach?





I consider it to be a super performance in the context of that time and also to our current approach / objectives after 5 years.

1. Although England put up a mamoth score of 391, we didn't give up
2. We chased pretty well until 25 overs (155/2) just before Ashraful got out. Infact they made it look as if it was possible to chase down at that stage. Unfortunately, today we give up on anything around 300 and start making 200-240.
3. We managed to make 223, but that magnificient innings of Ash, 94 of 52 balls and 59 frol JO, how can you forget that. If we had Shaki/Tamim/junaid along with that attitude, we could even dare to chase down 391 or give a closer fight. That attitude was something so special and so much essential for any team to develop & be victorious, I cannot call it anything but a super performance, Specially in today's context, why we can only dream of such attitude.
4. Although we lost, the English Crowd enjoyed a match played by BD against them and appreciated.
5. Although we lost, That was such a confidence building match, we proved that chasing down 250 against Australia wasn't a fluke.
6. We lost that match, but didn't lose our moral, these days in JS approach of making 240 as we did in Asia cup, we not only lose matches, we lose our characters, respect, confidence and much more. Only gainer of these matches is JS, because he can just add up his stats of 200+ scores. He is certainly doing things on purpose, to keep himself safe first.

That was indeed a super performance by all means.

Beamer
July 24, 2010, 09:30 AM
I was going to put up the test score sheets from that English tour, but, felt ashamed just to stare at it. Feel free to look up yourself and if you want to, you should put it up so people can see how far in terms of batting we have actually improved.

Incidentally, I came across this ODI series in SL during '05, and again, if you want you can put it up. One game really stood out and we lost 0-3. We were chasing 297 or something, and we lost by some 60 runs, with Pilot NOT OUT on 30 something off 82 balls! I wonder where was the 'winning mentality' then?

Less is said about the test matches back then is better. Somethings are better left alone. Reaching fourth day of a test match back then was a miracle..

Beamer
July 24, 2010, 09:39 AM
And Of course, there is ImtazK bhai's wonderful thread with year to year break down from 00-'10. That should tell all if one is able to comprehend simple math. That should go up in the front page IMO.

Beamer
July 24, 2010, 09:42 AM
Vendetta does funny things to people. Now I have to believe JO's batting in that "super performance" was part of the masterplan to chase down 391. Even back in the days when we were fighting on the issue of JO's worth in team, his most ardent defenders wouldn't imply something like that.

I hear a pressure group is actively seeking to rename the sequel to V for Vendetta as JS for Vendetta II. :floor:

Zobair
July 24, 2010, 09:53 AM
Yes. How soon we forget.

I was going to put up the test score sheets from that English tour, but, felt ashamed just to stare at it. Feel free to look up yourself and if you want to, you should put it up so people can see how far in terms of batting we have actually improved.

Incidentally, I came across this ODI series in SL during '05, and again, if you want you can put it up. One game really stood out and we lost 0-3. We were chasing 297 or something, and we lost by some 60 runs, with Pilot NOT OUT on 30 something off 82 balls! I wonder where was the 'winning mentality' then?

Less is said about the test matches back then is better. Somethings are better left alone. Reaching fourth day of a test match back then was a miracle..

One World
July 24, 2010, 09:59 AM
I have to admit poor defense from Banfan :).

WarWolf
July 24, 2010, 10:51 AM
Yes. How soon we forget.
Zobair bhai and Beamer bhai
You are missing the key point here I believe. Nobody denied that our batting has improved quite much. But what is the use of improvement if the mindset is not right?

You can be a quite capable person, but without proper vision you would go nowhere in your life.
Beamer bhai admitted a several times that JS lacks vision. I believe he lacks commitment too.

Beamer bhai several times hoped that his approach would be fixed. We all have been hoping this for quite some time. Has anything changed in him so far? I don't think so.

I don't believe he will change in future regarding fixing vision and targets. I also want to keep him for batting training. But that has to be as batting coach only. If he can accept that then keep him. Otherwise I don't see any other way except saying THANKS and GOODBYE to him.

A good guide and trainer should be him who can dream big. Otherwise he is simply not good enough for the job.

MatinSux
July 24, 2010, 11:39 AM
I do agree that he doesn't seem to be quite updated with recent tweaks in ODI such batting powerplay but let us have a look at some of the positive that came out of this guy after all. BD test avg:

from 2008-2010: from 2001-2006
ENG(4)--291.7-----------------(4)181.6
NZ(3)----274.6-----------------(4)165.8
IND(2)---272.0-----------------(3)222.2
SL(2)----239.2-----------------(7)193.4
SA(2)----173.2-----------------(4)183.2
Overall->~260----------~193

I expect the test numbers to rise around above 300 and thats when things will get more interesting. I believe fans are way too critical of him after a T30 match against Holland and not too long ago Holland actually beat current champ ENG in T20. I am not saying criticism of JS is not justified in fact it is, but lets give him a chance till WC and see what tricks he can pull out of his hat.

WarWolf
July 24, 2010, 11:48 AM
I do agree that he doesn't seem to be quite updated with recent tweaks in ODI such batting powerplay but let us have a look at some of the positive that came out of this guy after all. BD test avg:

from 2008-2010: from 2001-2006
ENG(4)--291.7-----------------(4)181.6
NZ(3)----274.6-----------------(4)165.8
IND(2)---272.0-----------------(3)222.2
SL(2)----239.2-----------------(7)193.4
SA(2)----173.2-----------------(4)183.2
Overall->~260----------~193

I expect the test numbers to rise around above 300 and thats when things will get more interesting. I believe fans are way too critical of him after a T30 match against Holland and not too long ago Holland actually beat current champ ENG in T20. I am not saying criticism of JS is not justified in fact it is, but lets give him a chance till WC and see what tricks he can pull out of his hat.


Vai average dhua pani khabo? Riyad er average dekhsen to? Average dia ki hoi? I am sick of hearing the same word again and again.

How many of the players had first class averages above 30 till 2006 when coming to the national side? And how many had 30+ averages who joined after 2006 ? Look and you will see the answer. Now we have Tamim, now we have Shakib, now we have Riyad, now we have Jahurul, now we have Raqibul....I hope nothing more will be needed to show you the difference between the players' class. I don't see any magician in JS.

Murad
July 24, 2010, 11:49 AM
Vai average dhua pani khabo? Riyad er average dekhsen to? Average dia ki hoi? I am sick of hearing the same word again and again.

Test status chole jaowar pore amra average deikha mon valo korum ar ki ;)

MatinSux
July 24, 2010, 12:10 PM
Vai average dhua pani khabo? Riyad er average dekhsen to? Average dia ki hoi? I am sick of hearing the same word again and again.

How many of the players had first class averages above 30 till 2006 when coming to the national side? And how many had 30+ averages who joined after 2006 ? Look and you will see the answer. Now we have Tamim, now we have Shakib, now we have Riyad, now we have Jahurul, now we have Raqibul....I hope nothing more will be needed to show you the difference between the players' class.
banglider ei ek problem, ura joto toku na eir theke beshi dorte chai. No wonder why Bangladesh is still pretty much backward.

Going from 182 to 292 against ENG just doesnt happen because you have better set of players. That's just lame excuse. ENG bowling now is much more potent than it ever was.

Murad
July 24, 2010, 12:12 PM
banglider ei ek problem, ura joto toku na eir theke beshi dorte chai. No wonder why Bangladesh is still pretty much backward.

Going from 182 to 292 against ENG just doesnt happen because you have better set of players. That's just lame excuse. ENG bowling now is much more potent than it ever was.

England batting and bowling was much stronger than it is now. Did you check who were the bowlers back then?

cricman
July 24, 2010, 12:15 PM
banglider ei ek problem, ura joto toku na eir theke beshi dorte chai. No wonder why Bangladesh is still pretty much backward.

Going from 182 to 292 against ENG just doesnt happen because you have better set of players. That's just lame excuse. ENG bowling now is much more potent than it ever was.

Stupidity [edit] is why Bangladesh is backwards

Swann & Bums < Flintoff, Jones, Harmisson

beshideshi
July 24, 2010, 12:15 PM
I consider it to be a super performance in the context of that time and also to our current approach / objectives after 5 years.

1. Although England put up a mamoth score of 391, we didn't give up
2. We chased pretty well until 25 overs (155/2) just before Ashraful got out. Infact they made it look as if it was possible to chase down at that stage. Unfortunately, today we give up on anything around 300 and start making 200-240.
3. We managed to make 223, but that magnificient innings of Ash, 94 of 52 balls and 59 frol JO, how can you forget that. If we had Shaki/Tamim/junaid along with that attitude, we could even dare to chase down 391 or give a closer fight. That attitude was something so special and so much essential for any team to develop & be victorious, I cannot call it anything but a super performance, Specially in today's context, why we can only dream of such attitude.
4. Although we lost, the English Crowd enjoyed a match played by BD against them and appreciated.
5. Although we lost, That was such a confidence building match, we proved that chasing down 250 against Australia wasn't a fluke.
6. We lost that match, but didn't lose our moral, these days in JS approach of making 240 as we did in Asia cup, we not only lose matches, we lose our characters, respect, confidence and much more. Only gainer of these matches is JS, because he can just add up his stats of 200+ scores. He is certainly doing things on purpose, to keep himself safe first.

That was indeed a super performance by all means.

By no means was that match a "super performance". And we barely chased the game as well, only when Ashraful was in the crease we saw some fireworks and some unbelievable hitting. Other than that marvelous knock from Ash, that game had nothing for us. And if you want to praise a 109 ball 59 chasing 391, I really see no point arguing.

I will still put up some points of the game that should demonstrate how easily we gave up.
We started with 30 runs off 10 overs losing 2 wickets, which left us needing 360 off 40 overs. You think that was a plan?
Then came the super-human innings by Ashraful, you just pray Ashraful plays like that on a given day and he did at Trent Bridge. And after Ash got out, we scored another 26 runs in the next 7 overs when the RRR was 9.83 and the rest of the innings was nothing but struggle.
I didn't really see when we were chasing the target and showed winning mentality.


I am not saying we are suddenly a world champion team, but I am tired of hearing "DW was better than JS" argument. Yes DW was a great coach, did great things for us, and turned a sub associate level team into a sub-test level team. But under DW the team was far more inconsistent and had some of the most embarrassing moments imaginable. Things are not exactly perfect now, but we have to stop comparing the two eras and try to prove that we were a much better team before. We have always sucked in international cricket, just because we had some fluke wins against some big teams doesn't mean we were a great unit back then.

Murad
July 24, 2010, 12:18 PM
Swann & Bums < Flintoff, Jones, Harmisson

Add Hoggard, who was at his peak form.

Beamer
July 24, 2010, 12:35 PM
Zobair bhai and Beamer bhai
You are missing the key point here I believe. Nobody denied that our batting has improved quite much. But what is the use of improvement if the mindset is not right?

You can be a quite capable person, but without proper vision you would go nowhere in your life.
Beamer bhai admitted a several times that JS lacks vision. I believe he lacks commitment too.

Beamer bhai several times hoped that his approach would be fixed. We all have been hoping this for quite some time. Has anything changed in him so far? I don't think so.

I don't believe he will change in future regarding fixing vision and targets. I also want to keep him for batting training. But that has to be as batting coach only. If he can accept that then keep him. Otherwise I don't see any other way except saying THANKS and GOODBYE to him.

A good guide and trainer should be him who can dream big. Otherwise he is simply not good enough for the job.

WarWolf

I have consistently said that Siddons lacks some acumen regarding ODI games. For example, the PP strategy, which I think is due to the fear of losing too many wkts if we take it earlier. Hence, we wait until the 45th as a safety net. A confident team should take when it thinks it is advantageous to them. He has prioritized playing 50 overs first and foremost and he probably has good reasons to justify it. It is debatable and I would like us to become more curious and positive in that regard.

I do not like Mushy and Riyad at no.6 and 7 and Siddons is completely at fault for it. He probably thinks that those two would give us a better chance to finish 50 overs. We should be a lot more flexible in our batting card. No.1-5 are pretty set, and based on their return of runs which has been quite consistent, I would definitely like to see a more dynamic play ( players ) at no.6 and 7..

I question his one day strategies sometimes. But, I don't think I ever said that he lacks vision. He has a vision. Its just that a lot of us completely disagrees with his vision without knowing what it is. To me, his vision from the getgo was dead set on working with the new generation of batsmen that he inherited to make them intl standard players. He has said it openly .I do see his vision and understand it. It maybe inadequate, but if you ask me, he clearly set his goals when he took over and so far, he has done well with his set vision.

I am not sure if he lacks commitment as you allege. That is something you just can't substantiate. I would rather not comment on hearsays.

Beamer
July 24, 2010, 12:37 PM
Test status chole jaowar pore amra average deikha mon valo korum ar ki ;)

test status choley gele agei choley jeto, jokhon amra tin din er beshi kheltey partam na. ODI r result diye test status judge kora thik na.

Dilscoop
July 24, 2010, 12:50 PM
Didn't feel like repeating myself over and over, but since you asked for it I'll go ahead.


OK, maybe this Eng team is not as good as the Australia team of 2005, but we still beat a team ranked a lot above us. And they were an in-form team, after winning T20 WC and a 5 match ODI series against the currently ranked #1 ODI side.

It's not our fault that Bell got injured while fielding. It's part of the game.


So what if that moment is "one of the happiest moments" of Bangladeshi cricket? The fact is we won just 1 game, lost in an ok-ish manner in another game, and got thrashed in all of the remaining games. Just in the beginning of that year, we lost back-to-back home ODIs against a Zimbabwe side that was arguably no better than any good associate side.

2005 was very bad year for us (performance against top #8 sides), apart from that win. The other "good match" we are still so proud of, is now almost a routine thing, and I'm glad that we are not satisfied any more with just "near wins". We were absolutely crap in all of the tests we played in that year.

Ok this is what you are saying, 2005 was a bad year, even with a that big win, that year wasn't just good enough. Back then we had a crappy team. I guess we can agree on that? But still the expectation was high, and high enough that even a win against Aus wasn't good enough. (your words). This is 2010. Better team. Agree on that? Better players? So expectation is lot higher as well? Then tell me how the eff can we be happy and satisfied with one fluke win and 2 bad, embarrassing, shocking, lose against one of the low ranked and a unranked team?? That to me makes no sense whats so ever.

If you can't possibly say 2005 win wasn't good enough, but this current situation is better. There is no way in hell Eng win means more to Bangladesh cricket, then the win against Aus.

MatinSux
July 24, 2010, 12:52 PM
Stupidity like yours is why Bangladesh is backwards

Swann & Bums < Flintoff, Jones, Harmisson

lol Swann and Bums. You do not get my point. Eng did not require likes of Matthew Hoggard to take wickets for them against BD. Richard Johnson who in total played only 3 matches took 9 wickets for ENG in just one match against BD, such was the standard of BD at the time. If Jones was that great and ENG couldnt resist keeping him why did he play only for 18 matches?

In fact, even with bowling lineup composed of Hoggard, Johnson, Giles, Saggers, Clarke Eng was able to blow away BAN for 152 and d 138 respectively. Daymn such scary looking bowling lineup. It's such a shame that I only know couple of them there.

Spitfire_x86
July 24, 2010, 01:18 PM
Witch hunting was never solution to any problem. I think we all agree that our current team is better than the one we had few years ago. But how better the current team is in terms of individual ability of players? Can you honestly say individual ability wise our XI is capable of winning 40-50% of their games? If it was, regardless of regardless of whoever we had as coach, we would easily win 1 out 3-4 matches.

Ok this is what you are saying, 2005 was a bad year, even with a that big win, that year wasn't just good enough. Back then we had a crappy team. I guess we can agree on that? But still the expectation was high, and high enough that even a win against Aus wasn't good enough. (your words).
BTW, the expectation was not "high", it wasn't "low", we barely had any expectation. The team's performance throughout the year was indicator of their true ability. If anyone expected things that were beyond the ability of those players, they were kidding themselves.

Tigers_eye
July 24, 2010, 01:39 PM
Infra structure betterment will lead to better processes. Continuously we will have better equipped cricketers who would perform consistantly. If batsmen has to learn how to bat and how to bowl in the national team then something is definitely wrong in the process. At least these crops are better than the Ash and co.

Beamer
July 24, 2010, 01:43 PM
Is it even remotely possible for a Jamie Siddons antagonist to argue with fellow human beings who has different opinions without calling them 'fools" , 'stupid' etc? You guys keep that up, the more and more you will become irrelevant. Some of you are becoming plain old reactionaries. After all, most adults avoid conversing with adults who are trapped in a juveniles brain.

Dilscoop
July 24, 2010, 02:22 PM
BTW, the expectation was not "high", it wasn't "low", we barely had any expectation. The team's performance throughout the year was indicator of their true ability. If anyone expected things that were beyond the ability of those players, they were kidding themselves.
So today expecting them to win against Ireland and Holland is expecting beyond our players ability? Then why do we have Test status and they don't if we can't even expect them to win against them? What ability are we talking about here? Then we should rather have those hopeless, with no expectation players over this high ability players and coaches?

seriously I dont even know what you are trying to prove here.

Spitfire_x86
July 24, 2010, 02:46 PM
So today expecting them to win against Ireland and Holland is expecting beyond our players ability? Then why do we have Test status and they don't if we can't even expect them to win against them? What ability are we talking about here? Then we should rather have those hopeless, with no expectation players over this high ability players and coaches?
Yes, we should've won those two matches, and not doing so is unacceptable. Say, we won all the matches against associates but didn't win against England. For how long would you remember those victories against associates. We didn't lose because of some extra ordinary bad performance, it was just couple of bad days which exposed some long-standing issues which needed rectifying anyway (bowling and slog overs batting).

reyme
July 24, 2010, 03:39 PM
We had some very good players back then, sure, but how many were great back then?

Shakib: A match winner like we never saw. The man sigle handedly won matches agaich West Indies. Number 1 all rounder, our best bowler, sometime even the best batsman. Name one player who was as good as him 5 years ago?

Greats: Bashar/Rafiq: It is JS who discarded these legends. He called Bashar "too old". About Rafiq, JS did not even know who the guy is. Why these greats were not kept, but discarded, Who's fault is it?

Pilot: JS had all the options to keep him in or around the team. He never even considered him, he was around, I remember he was even in top 15, but got discarded by the coach.

Bowlers: Isn't it the coach who should be responsible for developing a bowling lineups? Why other coaches had better bowlers than now? Did the previous coaches got lucky and bowlers just showed up in the past? I remeber Whatmore did not even had a bowling coach.

Bottom line, experience counts and counts big. Whatmore left us with Tamim, Ash, Riyad, Mushy, Shakib, Alok, Nafees, Aftab and most ICL players. With experience and time these players were bound to get better. We have better training facilities, more trainers, more information and with time, more experience. Why all these batsmen are failing under a "high profile" batting coach?

You want to keep a coach who lacks the basics of cricket gameplans? Commentators laughed at us for taking unthinkable toss decision, field setups, batting orders, bowling strategy, lack of vision, planning, gameplan? As if the coach cant even think!

Now all you keep saying, oh he is a good batting coach. The team cant even score against the associates now. What next? No, he is a good man, he speaks the truth, he is starighforward, he knows our cricket has no future. Lets just keep him around.

Test batting avg: Please compare the rest of the test team as well. All the teams are scoring at a higher rate now, thanks to the effect of 20/20. Again almost all the batsmen are coming from Whatmore era, they are getting better through trainings, experience and time. I may be wrong , but I think, other coaches for example Nannu could do the same.

Give him an extension regardless being 1-26 record? Please Name one professional sport where the coach will still keep his job after this kind of dreadful performance.

The man simply dont care, sooner BCB realizes this, is better for our cricket.

Beamer
July 24, 2010, 03:46 PM
Ar ki bring on korbo reyme bhaya ? how are you btw?

Sauron
July 24, 2010, 03:53 PM
The Real problem is:

Siddons has Lower Standards, and thus lower expectations. of course he will be happy with the result! :o

We have REAL expectations, REAL standards, of course no matter how you look at it, a loss is a loss!
we will always be dissapointed losing to associates no matter what!

250-240? you gota be kidding me? we should move on not be satisfied UNTIL 280-290+ is the new norm!

You are almost correct. I will modify a little -
Siddons has realistic expectations, we don't have expectations, we have wishes.

btw, I am as disgusted as the next guy with these results.

reyme
July 24, 2010, 03:58 PM
......

Raynman
July 24, 2010, 10:00 PM
I know I'm a bit late to the party but comparing the ENG win with the AUS win in 2005 is simply ridiculous.

Here is why:

The AUS win in 2005 was something completely unexpected and something that shook the cricket world. It is debatably one of the biggest shock wins in sports history. It was a win vs. a full strength Australian team that other teams FEARED to share the field with. They were a two time defending champion with all sorts of victory records under their belt.

What was beautiful about that win was that it was a complete team effort from the 2nd ball dismissal of Gilchrist to the Aftab 6 in the first ball of the 50th over. In between the bowling and fielding with heart, a great century from Ash, a brilliant supportive 50 from Bashar and a quick burst by Aftab. That match can be a poster for self belief, team belief and a desire to win no matter how impossible the outcome may seem.

This win was the precursor to a 2006 where we would seperate ourselves from ZIM to become the true #9 ranked team in the world and put us in a seperate class from the other associates. It was the harbinger of 2007 wins vs. IND and SA in the Worldcup none the less where the match was just as important to our opponents. With the exception of the Irish loss in that WC, very few things seemed off course for us. Even after the the WC, a strong showing in a draw in the 1st test vs India and a win over WI in the T20 world cup promised great things to come from us.

......

I just don't see how someone can hold that win in the same context as the recent ENG win. This win was a face saver after an embarassing run which unfortunately became even more embarassing in the games to follow. This year has been a disappointment not only by standards where Whatmore had left us but by standards where Siddons had us by the end of last year. And disappoint is when you perform below reason, below expectation.

For those that love Siddons, I don't agree with you but I fully respect your right to hang his poster on your ceiling above your bed :D (in the words of Seinfeld, not that there is anything wrong with that). But PLEASE put things in context and admit that 2010 so far is a failure even by his own 2009 accomplishments.

You guys remind me of some guys who work out a couple of days and flex their biceps in pride (the test batting) when they have a huge unsightly gut still sticking out. And truth be told, the bicep isn't that impressive to begin with.

MatinSux
July 24, 2010, 10:09 PM
I don't think anyone is putting the win vs AUS in the same context the one vs ENG. What the man was saying is that how can we forget the ENG win in just two days where we remember our other wins for years.

Raynman
July 24, 2010, 10:17 PM
^^^ Because the ENG win is not in the same context as the AUS win. It was the IRE and NED loss that overshadowed it as it rightfully should.

Dilscoop
July 24, 2010, 11:21 PM
Yes, we should've won those two matches, and not doing so is unacceptable. Say, we won all the matches against associates but didn't win against England. For how long would you remember those victories against associates. We didn't lose because of some extra ordinary bad performance, it was just couple of bad days which exposed some long-standing issues which needed rectifying anyway (bowling and slog overs batting).

Couple of bad days? So besides those 2 matches, we had good days for rest of the year? Again, I clearly don't know what you are tryin to prove.

mishu
July 25, 2010, 12:49 AM
guys we need to stop blaming the coach... the players has to perform... we need new players in the team who are simply better.. ex. shovagoto hom. replacement for razzak. rasel, nazmul and so on has to go. we have no choice we have to try new players before world cup, and hope they click, because we dont have enough time for these current players to get back to form... and dont say it does not work, look at Jahrul Islam, he is doing just fine...

BANFAN
July 25, 2010, 01:26 AM
Diagnose and Treat the desease, get healthy and body will naturally perform well. When you fall sick, that's what the doc/medical board does. We just diagnosed the disease (JS), now we need discussion for the treatment (When a7 how to remove him) and then the aggangements for getting healthy (New Coach) and watch the body perform.

Isn't it a natural process?

Eshen
July 25, 2010, 12:57 PM
If I accept that defeats against Ireland and Holland were just two bad days, in same note, should not I accept that our ODI win against England was just a bad day for England?! I mean England did give a bad thrashing in the following ODI!

But yeah, there is no point for Siddons to worry about that kind of logic, he will continue to collect his hefty salary from BCB till WC'11, regardless how poor or well the team does.

godzilla
July 25, 2010, 02:28 PM
Loosing against Eng and giving a comment like that is understandable but when you loose against the associates and give a comment like that, well time to throw those sandles at this bald head.

shabbir
July 31, 2010, 09:57 PM
ক্রিকেটারদের শ্রদ্ধা হারাচ্ছেন সিডন্স
সাইদুজ্জামান

'শাট-আপ!'
'ইউ বেটার শাট-আপ! তুমি জানো কার সঙ্গে কথা বলছ?'
জুলাই মাসে ইংল্যান্ডে ওয়ানডে সিরিজ চলাকালে বার্মিংহামে গুরু-শিষ্যের এ বাদানুবাদ গড়িয়েছিল অনেক দূর। ফল হিসেবে পুরো বাংলাদেশ দলের সামনে তামিম ইকবালের কাছে ক্ষমা চেয়েছিলেন জেমি সিডন্স। কোচকে তামিম ক্ষমা করে দিয়েছেন, এমন নিশ্চয়তা বাংলাদেশ দলের অনেকেই দিতে পারছেন না। বরং সাম্প্রতিক সময়ে 'খেলোয়াড়দের কোচ' বলে পরিচিত সিডন্স ক্রমেই ক্রিকেটারদের চক্ষুশূল হয়ে উঠছেন। ২০১১ বিশ্বকাপের আগে বাংলাদেশ দলে এ ছন্দপতনকে অশনি সংকেত বলে মনে করছেন দল-সংশ্লিষ্টদের অনেকে। বিষয়টি জানেন জাতীয় দলের তত্ত্বাবধানকারী ক্রিকেট অপারেশনস কমিটির চেয়ারম্যান এনায়েত হোসেন সিরাজও।
ইংল্যান্ডে ওয়ানডে সফরে দলের সঙ্গেই ছিলেন বিসিবি পরিচালক এনায়েত হোসেন সিরাজ। ব্যাগ বহন করা নিয়ে তামিম ও কোচের উত্তপ্ত বাক্য বিনিময়ের বিষয়টিও জানেন তিনি। তবে অন্য সব ব্যাপারের মতো এ বিষয়টিও নমনীয় দৃষ্টিতে দেখছেন এনায়েত হোসেন, 'ঘটনাটা আমিও শুনেছি। তবে খুব বড় কিছু নয়।' এ ঘটনার প্রসঙ্গ ধরে ম্যানেজার হিসেবে নিজের অভিজ্ঞতার স্মৃতিচারণায় ডুব দেন তিনি, 'বুস্টা কাপে ওয়েস্ট ইন্ডিজে ৫৮ দিনের ট্যুর করেছিলাম। এত লম্বা ট্যুরেও কোনো সমস্যা হয়নি।' কিন্তু এখন প্রায় প্রতি ট্যুরেই গোলমাল হচ্ছে। বিস্ময়করভাবে সেই দ্বন্দ্বের কেন্দ্রে থাকছেন জেমি সিডন্স। যিনি প্রবল প্রতিকূলতার মাঝেও ক্রিকেটারদের পক্ষ নিয়ে থাকেন।
জুনে শ্রীলঙ্কায় অনুষ্ঠিত এশিয়া কাপে মুশফিকুর রহিম ও মোহাম্মদ আশরাফুলের সঙ্গে কথা কাটাকাটি হয় জেমি সিডন্সের। তারও আগে, মে মাসে ডার্বিশায়ারে তিন দিনের প্রস্তুতি ম্যাচের আগে কোচের সঙ্গে তর্ক হয়েছিল তখনকার অধিনায়ক সাকিব আল হাসানের। জলবসন্তে কাবু সাকিবকে ওই ম্যাচে খেলানোর জন্য প্র্যাকটিসে নামার নির্দেশ দিয়েছিলেন সিডন্স। কিন্তু নিজের শারীরিক অবস্থার কারণে সেই নির্দেশ অমান্য করেছিলেন সাকিব। তবে বার্মিংহামে তামিম ও সিডন্সের এ বিবাদের ঘটনা বাংলাদেশ ক্রিকেটে বিরল। স্থানীয় ব্যাগেজ মাস্টার বেশির ভাগ 'কফিন' বহন করেছিলেন। কিন্তু যে কয়টা বাদ পড়েছিল, তার একটি তামিমের। নিজের ব্যাগ টেনে নিতে তামিম অপারগতা প্রকাশ করতেই রেগে যান জেমি সিডন্স। ছেড়ে কথা বলেননি তামিমও। ব্যাগেজ মাস্টারকে ডেকে কোচকে নাকি তিনি বলেন, 'আশা করি, তুমি ইংরেজি বোঝ। ওর (ব্যাগেজ মাস্টার) কাছেই শোন ওর কাজ কী কী!' ব্যাগেজ মাস্টারের অনেক কাজের মধ্যে একটি হলো ক্রিকেটারদের কফিন টানা। অগত্যা পুরো দলের সামনে তামিম ইকবালের কাছে ক্ষমা চান জেমি সিডন্স।
যে ঘটনায় বিস্মিত নাম প্রকাশে অনিচ্ছুক বাংলাদেশ দল-সংশ্লিষ্ট একজন, 'এটা অনাকাঙ্ক্ষিত। সত্যি বলতে কি, অবস্থাদৃষ্টে মনে হচ্ছে, বাংলাদেশ দলের ড্রেসিং রুম থেকে পারস্পরিক শ্রদ্ধার ব্যাপারটিই হারিয়ে যাচ্ছে। কোচকে শ্রদ্ধা করাটা জরুরি। অন্তত ভয় তো পেতে হবে। কিন্তু এক-দুজন বাদে এটা আর কারো কাছ থেকে পাচ্ছেন না জেমি।'
তবে কি তারুণ্যের ছটফটানিতে কোচের কর্তৃত্ব অস্বীকার করছেন তামিম-সাকিবরা? এটাও মানতে নারাজ বাংলাদেশ দলের ওই সদস্য, 'এটা ঠিক যে যুগ বদলেছে। এখনকার ক্রিকেটাররা আরো উঁচু পর্যায়ে খেলছে। ভালো খেলছে। এ বয়সে এত খ্যাতি মনে প্রভাব ফেলতে পারে। তবে শ্রদ্ধা কিংবা ভালোবাসা আদায় করে নেওয়ার দায়িত্ব কিন্তু আপনার নিজেরই। কোচ সম্ভবত সেটি পারছেন না।' আরো বিস্ময়কর ব্যাপার হলো, ইদানীং জেমির অনুশীলন পদ্ধতি নিয়েও প্রশ্ন তুলছেন ক্রিকেটাররা। যা শুনে মুচকি হাসেন এনায়েত হোসেন, 'জেমির অধীনে বাংলাদেশ দল ব্যাটিংয়ে উন্নতি করেছে, এটা সবাইকে মানতে হবে। ইংল্যান্ডে টেস্ট সিরিজে তামিম যে ব্যাক টু ব্যাক সেঞ্চুরি করল, সেটি কি সহজ কথা!' জেমি সিডন্সের সমালোচকদের একজনের পাল্টা প্রশ্ন, 'এত ভালো ব্যাটিং কোচ যদি হবেন তিনি, তাহলে আশরাফুলের সমস্যা কাটছে না কেন? রিয়াদই-বা (মাহমুদুল্লাহ) রান পেতে ভুলে যাচ্ছে কেন? এর-ওর স্টান্স পাল্টে ব্যাক লিফট ঠিক করতে গিয়ে উল্টো ছেলেদের সমস্যার আবর্তে ঠেলে দিচ্ছেন কোচ। বিশ্বের সব ব্যাটসম্যানের স্টান্সই এক নাকি?'
আয়ারল্যান্ড-নেদারল্যান্ডসের কাছে হারের চেয়েও এ কোচ-ক্রিকেটার দ্বন্দ্ব ২০১১ বিশ্বকাপের আগে আরো বড় দুশ্চিন্তার কারণ হয়ে সামনে এসে দাঁড়িয়েছে। এনায়েত হোসেন সিরাজ কিংবা বিসিবির শীর্ষ কর্তাদের অজানা থাকতে পারে। তাই তাঁদের জ্ঞাতার্থে কোচ সম্পর্কে জাতীয় দলের ক্রিকেটারদের সার্বিক মূল্যায়ন জানানো জরুরি হয়ে পড়েছে। সামগ্রিক মতামতটা এ রকম, সিডন্স খুব ভালো ব্যাটিং কোচ। কিন্তু হেড কোচ হিসেবে যাচ্ছেতাই। ভালো মানুষ, তবে নির্বোধ

One World
July 31, 2010, 10:30 PM
You can disect the article from the get go. It starts with a quote which subsequently falls through a descriptive introduction without any mention of who really said that to whom.

Cricket has become the well educated upper classes' FDC.

Murad
July 31, 2010, 10:30 PM
Shabbir bhai, please use the bangla taghttp://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/images/editor/vbBangla.gif when you post something in Bangla. Otherwise, its very hard to read. Thanks.:)

BANFAN
July 31, 2010, 11:19 PM
[বাংলা]কোচ সম্ভবত সেটি পারছেন না।' আরো বিস্ময়কর ব্যাপার হলো, ইদানীং জেমির অনুশীলন পদ্ধতি নিয়েও প্রশ্ন তুলছেন ক্রিকেটাররা। যা শুনে মুচকি হাসেন এনায়েত হোসেন, 'জেমির অধীনে বাংলাদেশ দল ব্যাটিংয়ে উন্নতি করেছে, এটা সবাইকে মানতে হবে। ইংল্যান্ডে টেস্ট সিরিজে তামিম যে ব্যাক টু ব্যাক সেঞ্চুরি করল, সেটি কি সহজ কথা!' জেমি সিডন্সের সমালোচকদের একজনের পাল্টা প্রশ্ন, 'এত ভালো ব্যাটিং কোচ যদি হবেন তিনি, তাহলে আশরাফুলের সমস্যা কাটছে না কেন? রিয়াদই-বা (মাহমুদুল্লাহ) রান পেতে ভুলে যাচ্ছে কেন? এর-ওর স্টান্স পাল্টে ব্যাক লিফট ঠিক করতে গিয়ে উল্টো ছেলেদের সমস্যার আবর্তে ঠেলে দিচ্ছেন কোচ। বিশ্বের সব ব্যাটসম্যানের স্টান্সই এক নাকি?'[/বাংলা]

That's what I said before, He only knows one way of batting (That He used to Do) now he thinks everyone has to do that only. Tamim was one of those guys whom he didn't try/couldn't convince to change style. That's how he survived. How the conclusion under this situation can be "Jamie is a good batting coach?" Ridiculous.

A coach loses respect, when he is incompetent. These are natural reactions to incompetency. Forcing people to respect him isn't the solution, realizing his incompetence and removing him is the only solution. A competent leader/team member, however harsh/rude he is, is always respected by the professional team members. That's a natural reaction.

max410
July 31, 2010, 11:21 PM
whats past is past we can't turn back time to make things right , now that we got a break we should practice our bowling attack as well as batting techniques needs to be improved ,and we also need to study and make game tactics before the world cup 2011 , we SHOULD FOCUS ON IT RIGHT NOW.
THAT IS MORE IMPORTANT, SIDDONS was just trying to back up his players and mashrafee said it clearly we played bad, that's what they did they played badly that's why they lost , which is as simple as that .
we need to focus on the upcoming series now.

M.H.Rubel
August 1, 2010, 04:20 AM
ক্রিকেটারদের শ্রদ্ধা হারাচ্ছেন সিডন্স
সাইদুজ্জামান

'শাট-আপ!'
'ইউ বেটার শাট-আপ! তুমি জানো কার সঙ্গে কথা বলছ?'
জুলাই মাসে ইংল্যান্ডে ওয়ানডে সিরিজ চলাকালে বার্মিংহামে গুরু-শিষ্যের এ বাদানুবাদ গড়িয়েছিল অনেক দূর। ফল হিসেবে পুরো বাংলাদেশ দলের সামনে তামিম ইকবালের কাছে ক্ষমা চেয়েছিলেন জেমি সিডন্স। কোচকে তামিম ক্ষমা করে দিয়েছেন, এমন নিশ্চয়তা বাংলাদেশ দলের অনেকেই দিতে পারছেন না। বরং সাম্প্রতিক সময়ে 'খেলোয়াড়দের কোচ' বলে পরিচিত সিডন্স ক্রমেই ক্রিকেটারদের চক্ষুশূল হয়ে উঠছেন। ২০১১ বিশ্বকাপের আগে বাংলাদেশ দলে এ ছন্দপতনকে অশনি সংকেত বলে মনে করছেন দল-সংশ্লিষ্টদের অনেকে। বিষয়টি জানেন জাতীয় দলের তত্ত্বাবধানকারী ক্রিকেট অপারেশনস কমিটির চেয়ারম্যান এনায়েত হোসেন সিরাজও।
ইংল্যান্ডে ওয়ানডে সফরে দলের সঙ্গেই ছিলেন বিসিবি পরিচালক এনায়েত হোসেন সিরাজ। ব্যাগ বহন করা নিয়ে তামিম ও কোচের উত্তপ্ত বাক্য বিনিময়ের বিষয়টিও জানেন তিনি। তবে অন্য সব ব্যাপারের মতো এ বিষয়টিও নমনীয় দৃষ্টিতে দেখছেন এনায়েত হোসেন, 'ঘটনাটা আমিও শুনেছি। তবে খুব বড় কিছু নয়।' এ ঘটনার প্রসঙ্গ ধরে ম্যানেজার হিসেবে নিজের অভিজ্ঞতার স্মৃতিচারণায় ডুব দেন তিনি, 'বুস্টা কাপে ওয়েস্ট ইন্ডিজে ৫৮ দিনের ট্যুর করেছিলাম। এত লম্বা ট্যুরেও কোনো সমস্যা হয়নি।' কিন্তু এখন প্রায় প্রতি ট্যুরেই গোলমাল হচ্ছে। বিস্ময়করভাবে সেই দ্বন্দ্বের কেন্দ্রে থাকছেন জেমি সিডন্স। যিনি প্রবল প্রতিকূলতার মাঝেও ক্রিকেটারদের পক্ষ নিয়ে থাকেন।
জুনে শ্রীলঙ্কায় অনুষ্ঠিত এশিয়া কাপে মুশফিকুর রহিম ও মোহাম্মদ আশরাফুলের সঙ্গে কথা কাটাকাটি হয় জেমি সিডন্সের। তারও আগে, মে মাসে ডার্বিশায়ারে তিন দিনের প্রস্তুতি ম্যাচের আগে কোচের সঙ্গে তর্ক হয়েছিল তখনকার অধিনায়ক সাকিব আল হাসানের। জলবসন্তে কাবু সাকিবকে ওই ম্যাচে খেলানোর জন্য প্র্যাকটিসে নামার নির্দেশ দিয়েছিলেন সিডন্স। কিন্তু নিজের শারীরিক অবস্থার কারণে সেই নির্দেশ অমান্য করেছিলেন সাকিব। তবে বার্মিংহামে তামিম ও সিডন্সের এ বিবাদের ঘটনা বাংলাদেশ ক্রিকেটে বিরল। স্থানীয় ব্যাগেজ মাস্টার বেশির ভাগ 'কফিন' বহন করেছিলেন। কিন্তু যে কয়টা বাদ পড়েছিল, তার একটি তামিমের। নিজের ব্যাগ টেনে নিতে তামিম অপারগতা প্রকাশ করতেই রেগে যান জেমি সিডন্স। ছেড়ে কথা বলেননি তামিমও। ব্যাগেজ মাস্টারকে ডেকে কোচকে নাকি তিনি বলেন, 'আশা করি, তুমি ইংরেজি বোঝ। ওর (ব্যাগেজ মাস্টার) কাছেই শোন ওর কাজ কী কী!' ব্যাগেজ মাস্টারের অনেক কাজের মধ্যে একটি হলো ক্রিকেটারদের কফিন টানা। অগত্যা পুরো দলের সামনে তামিম ইকবালের কাছে ক্ষমা চান জেমি সিডন্স।
যে ঘটনায় বিস্মিত নাম প্রকাশে অনিচ্ছুক বাংলাদেশ দল-সংশ্লিষ্ট একজন, 'এটা অনাকাঙ্ক্ষিত। সত্যি বলতে কি, অবস্থাদৃষ্টে মনে হচ্ছে, বাংলাদেশ দলের ড্রেসিং রুম থেকে পারস্পরিক শ্রদ্ধার ব্যাপারটিই হারিয়ে যাচ্ছে। কোচকে শ্রদ্ধা করাটা জরুরি। অন্তত ভয় তো পেতে হবে। কিন্তু এক-দুজন বাদে এটা আর কারো কাছ থেকে পাচ্ছেন না জেমি।'
তবে কি তারুণ্যের ছটফটানিতে কোচের কর্তৃত্ব অস্বীকার করছেন তামিম-সাকিবরা? এটাও মানতে নারাজ বাংলাদেশ দলের ওই সদস্য, 'এটা ঠিক যে যুগ বদলেছে। এখনকার ক্রিকেটাররা আরো উঁচু পর্যায়ে খেলছে। ভালো খেলছে। এ বয়সে এত খ্যাতি মনে প্রভাব ফেলতে পারে। তবে শ্রদ্ধা কিংবা ভালোবাসা আদায় করে নেওয়ার দায়িত্ব কিন্তু আপনার নিজেরই। কোচ সম্ভবত সেটি পারছেন না।' আরো বিস্ময়কর ব্যাপার হলো, ইদানীং জেমির অনুশীলন পদ্ধতি নিয়েও প্রশ্ন তুলছেন ক্রিকেটাররা। যা শুনে মুচকি হাসেন এনায়েত হোসেন, 'জেমির অধীনে বাংলাদেশ দল ব্যাটিংয়ে উন্নতি করেছে, এটা সবাইকে মানতে হবে। ইংল্যান্ডে টেস্ট সিরিজে তামিম যে ব্যাক টু ব্যাক সেঞ্চুরি করল, সেটি কি সহজ কথা!' জেমি সিডন্সের সমালোচকদের একজনের পাল্টা প্রশ্ন, 'এত ভালো ব্যাটিং কোচ যদি হবেন তিনি, তাহলে আশরাফুলের সমস্যা কাটছে না কেন? রিয়াদই-বা (মাহমুদুল্লাহ) রান পেতে ভুলে যাচ্ছে কেন? এর-ওর স্টান্স পাল্টে ব্যাক লিফট ঠিক করতে গিয়ে উল্টো ছেলেদের সমস্যার আবর্তে ঠেলে দিচ্ছেন কোচ। বিশ্বের সব ব্যাটসম্যানের স্টান্সই এক নাকি?'
আয়ারল্যান্ড-নেদারল্যান্ডসের কাছে হারের চেয়েও এ কোচ-ক্রিকেটার দ্বন্দ্ব ২০১১ বিশ্বকাপের আগে আরো বড় দুশ্চিন্তার কারণ হয়ে সামনে এসে দাঁড়িয়েছে। এনায়েত হোসেন সিরাজ কিংবা বিসিবির শীর্ষ কর্তাদের অজানা থাকতে পারে। তাই তাঁদের জ্ঞাতার্থে কোচ সম্পর্কে জাতীয় দলের ক্রিকেটারদের সার্বিক মূল্যায়ন জানানো জরুরি হয়ে পড়েছে। সামগ্রিক মতামতটা এ রকম, সিডন্স খুব ভালো ব্যাটিং কোচ। কিন্তু হেড কোচ হিসেবে যাচ্ছেতাই। ভালো মানুষ, তবে নির্বোধ

It seems very interesting.Any one some translation please?
<br />Posted via BC Mobile Edition

lamisa
August 1, 2010, 05:19 AM
^^^yes,i can't read it properly either.translation please?

Nadim
August 1, 2010, 05:21 AM
^^^Why??

BANFAN
August 1, 2010, 08:02 AM
Witch hunting was never solution to any problem. I think we all agree that our current team is better than the one we had few years ago. But how better the current team is in terms of individual ability of players? Can you honestly say individual ability wise our XI is capable of winning 40-50% of their games? If it was, regardless of regardless of whoever we had as coach, we would easily win 1 out 3-4 matches.


BTW, the expectation was not "high", it wasn't "low", we barely had any expectation. The team's performance throughout the year was indicator of their true ability. If anyone expected things that were beyond the ability of those players, they were kidding themselves.

Spitty, if you are putting up excuses or pointing fingures at others for your mistakes; that's perfect witch hunting JS had been doing for last about 3 years. I don't see any contribuion from the coach neither any planned effort which could have brought positive changes.

If the current team has better skill level than the 2005 team, that's because of the coaches & mentors at school cricket, Para cricket, club cricket, age group, academy or any other entity making anonymous contributions before a player comes to the National team. Show an example that JS has improved after coming to national side, by puting some of his plan/actions.

I completely disagree with you on "I think we all agree that our current team is better than the one we had few years ago." Current players of the national team are better, not the team. As a team, that team even dreamt of winning against No one ranking team with whatever they had. Team played for winning and if you say that we didnt expect the team to win matches, that's not true. But the current team is way way inferior than that team. As a team, they even don't look to be winning against associates at the moment. They lost that spirit of being a team. they are just a gathering of some high performing individuals. The motivation is as such and the formula of being in the team is such.

A team with better players must make a better team and that's logical. But if they are not, you must go all out to find out and eliminate the cause of obstructing logical outcome. That's not witch hunting. That's what is the job of every entity related to the development of cricket, including Fans.

BANFAN
August 1, 2010, 08:27 AM
All the bravado in your response is based on the ONE innings of Ashraful. That innings, breathtaking as it was, would have been extinguished on nought 999999 out of 1000000! Tremlett was incredibly unlucky not to get his hattrick on debut. JO innings, though lightning fast by his standards, was pedestrian in the context of the game. The less said about our performance in the rest of that match the better!

In the last game of the latest ODI series we did try to chase down the large English total but got out quickly playing too many shots even with the likes of Tamim, Zunaid and Shakib in the team. I assume you were similarly enthused by that performance even though we lost by a large margin? Or do you choose to ignore performances that contradict the narrative you are looking to build against the coach?

I don't want to repeat all the points I mentioned.

Even irrespective of who played what, if you look from the team perspective, they were on target until 25 overs.

I don't understand what you mean by what you said about chasing in our last ODi. I mean they lost wicket was the plus point or having bigger names? Can you over rule an achievement by calling it a one man show and rate a failure higher by citing potential big names?

How can you ignore all the other points I mentioned? Crowd appreciated that performance, JO played a role that you dream to see Imrul do every match ... Well a couple of the points might be weak but if I compare those two matches one on one, what ever has a positive must come in.

My friend, I'm not making any case against JS. I heard it in 2008 when I was saying against JS, and you may bring out some of those posts to see, that many of those are proven. I'm no fortune teller, but certain things of human behaviour can be predicted academically. And at this moment, I don't need to make any case against JS, he is a case by his own merit. You may like to go over recent media reports to get an update on his case. I'm too small to build up a case against JS

MatinSux
August 1, 2010, 12:11 PM
Crowd appreciated that performance,
Who cares about the crowd. They booed us in 2nd match and we won that match. They appreciated us in 2005 but we still got hammered from ENG near 400 runs.

MohammedC
August 1, 2010, 12:57 PM
Rumours,Rumours,Rumours. He (the sports reporter) just likes making story based on rumours. Before the first test he said in TV programme that he has heard "Siddons does not like Ashraful" but another well known sports reporter sitting next to him confirmed that is just rumours and he wont believe such things.

Without searching for this news on the net I can tell you this was published in "Daily Kaler Konto". The same paper that published the picture of Shakib on his knee to BCB president.

WarWolf
August 1, 2010, 01:49 PM
Interestingly no source of the news is posted. Bro Shabbir please post the source.

Razi
August 1, 2010, 02:20 PM
Interestingly no source of the news is posted. Bro Shabbir please post the source.

Here is the source (http://www.dailykalerkantho.com/?view=details&type=gold&data=Income&pub_no=241&cat_id=1&menu_id=18&news_type_id=1&index=0), WarWolf bhai.

crikfreak
August 1, 2010, 03:44 PM
i really dunno wat to say abt sid... 4get wat he's already done... i'm worried abt wat he's gonna do in the future............ how much more damage is this guy gonna do 2 us till the WC???? man... i really really wanna c the end of this guy.... i think we\ve all had enough........

MohammedC
August 1, 2010, 04:52 PM
Here is the source (http://www.dailykalerkantho.com/?view=details&type=gold&data=Income&pub_no=241&cat_id=1&menu_id=18&news_type_id=1&index=0), WarWolf bhai.

Daily Kaler Konto just as I predicted.

MohammedC
August 1, 2010, 04:53 PM
i really dunno wat to say abt sid... 4get wat he's already done... i'm worried abt wat he's gonna do in the future............ how much more damage is this guy gonna do 2 us till the WC???? man... i really really wanna c the end of this guy.... i think we\ve all had enough........

JS will go after WC dont worry. As for that news I wont worry about it.

deshprem
August 2, 2010, 12:48 AM
Spitty, if you are putting up excuses or pointing fingures at others for your mistakes; that's perfect witch hunting JS had been doing for last about 3 years. I don't see any contribuion from the coach neither any planned effort which could have brought positive changes.

If the current team has better skill level than the 2005 team, that's because of the coaches & mentors at school cricket, Para cricket, club cricket, age group, academy or any other entity making anonymous contributions before a player comes to the National team. Show an example that JS has improved after coming to national side, by puting some of his plan/actions.

I completely disagree with you on "I think we all agree that our current team is better than the one we had few years ago." Current players of the national team are better, not the team. As a team, that team even dreamt of winning against No one ranking team with whatever they had. Team played for winning and if you say that we didnt expect the team to win matches, that's not true. But the current team is way way inferior than that team. As a team, they even don't look to be winning against associates at the moment. They lost that spirit of being a team. they are just a gathering of some high performing individuals. The motivation is as such and the formula of being in the team is such.

A team with better players must make a better team and that's logical. But if they are not, you must go all out to find out and eliminate the cause of obstructing logical outcome. That's not witch hunting. That's what is the job of every entity related to the development of cricket, including Fans.



if ur going to ask for examples of siddons' work, then u shud povide examples of wat these para coaches atc have done.

lamisa
August 2, 2010, 03:49 AM
kaler kontho i think said after tamim's first 100 in the test series against england that nottingham has asked him to join the team!

BANFAN
August 2, 2010, 03:58 AM
if ur going to ask for examples of siddons' work, then u shud povide examples of wat these para coaches atc have done.

All the players coming into national team are their product.

Baundule
August 2, 2010, 09:28 AM
if ur going to ask for examples of siddons' work, then u shud povide examples of wat these para coaches atc have done.
This is a valid question. Those para coaches are bringing the players to the national side (not an easy task, I would say, whether the jacking system is strong or not) and Siddons is finding that those are not good for international matches (very often because they have a different backlift than that Siddons dreamt of and could not do by himself) and therefore he is re-inventing the wheel. In the process the engine of Bangladesh cricket is failing, ICC is refusing to refuel, the fans are getting crazy etc. etc. and by the time Siddons is finished (or most likely his contract is finished) with his re-invention, we will see the car called Bangladesh cricket team has become an antique that fits more in the national museum than in a cricket ground.