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View Full Version : Too much dependence on Shakib


Cricket46
December 6, 2010, 09:58 AM
I don't know what others think, but I still think the team depends too much on Shakib. That is not good. We will be in trouble when he fails, and surely, he can't keep on performing every single time. Even in this ODI, Mushfiq was extremely lucky that Taibu missed an easy stumping off Cremer. He was miles away and was batting dangerously on 14. Shakib on the other hand never looked like getting out. All the bastmen perform in one match and the next one they are dismissed for a low score. However, the bowling was much better this time - even from Mashrafee.

Mahmood
December 6, 2010, 10:04 AM
Look at it this way, every great team needs 2 superstars to reach the top. Finally we got one. Now we wait for the 2nd, once we have both, the team will depend on both and eliminate the single point of failure. Unless both flops, we will do good every match.

Tiger444
December 6, 2010, 11:19 AM
The problem with all our players barring Shakib is their consistency. The 2nd ODI was the 1st time in a while that we did not have to depend on Shakib with the bat to win the game. When I was watching the game yesterday I also realized how poor they were compared to Shakib. Tamim is the only other batsman thats got the skills to take on any bowling attack but thats it. Zunaed is still playing too many shots that are going in the air. It's been his problem in ODIs ever since he came in. It's gotten better but he still does it which is just not good for a #3 batsman. He needs to keep his shots down more. Then you have Imrul/Roqibul who struggle to rotate the strike consistently. After all these ODIs its sad to see that they still continue to struggle with this basic. It shouldn't be too much to expect players nowadays to just find the gap in the field consistently. Mushy stepped it up yesterday but was still chancy during his innings. He's better at rotating the strike though then Imrul/Roqibul and can strike some nice looking boundaries. He needs to be a lot more consistent with the bat though. Naeem wasn't very good in the beginning but then did a decent job. It was still upsetting to see that he missed out on some deliveries though that needed to be punished. Mash seems like our only true power hitter down the order which is why we should have him in our team. He's got the highest SR I believe in BD so it will be handy to have him in. There are still too many question marks in our batting lineup.

Night_wolf
December 6, 2010, 11:33 AM
Look at it this way, every great team needs 2 superstars to reach the top. Finally we got one. Now we wait for the 2nd, once we have both, the team will depend on both and eliminate the single point of failure. Unless both flops, we will do good every match.

great post...tamim is getting there..i think in the near future he will be that 2nd player..he is 70% the second player now

Fazal
December 6, 2010, 01:00 PM
Yes we are too much dependent on Shakib. Its for several reasons:

1) Out of necessitity. Example last game where he need to rebuild the BD innings.

2) Not adressing the core of the batting order for too long. When we replace a player to address batting problem, we either drop the wrong player or bring back another off form players whereas player who have shown they are in form or some recent sign of success are ignored(SN, Jahirul, etc).

3) Sometimes Shakib take additional load by himself unnecessarily. For example when game was under control he didn't need to 10 overs, he could used Naem for 5-6 overs. That will give Naem more prectice/experience and the selectors some opportunity about further evaluation Naem's performance.

Rabz
December 6, 2010, 01:22 PM
IceMan should start to think of long term effect.
Global warming is on the rise and the inconvenient truth is, we need him for another good 15 years or so.
Hot performance like this day in day out, he is going to get sunburnt and might start to melt away at an increasing pace.

Dilscoop
December 6, 2010, 02:15 PM
great post...tamim is getting there..i think in the near future he will be that 2nd player..he is 70% the second player now

He was around 85%, but the surgery made him hit the buffer zone. Just need a 80% fast bowler in version of Rubel and Shafiul or Mashrafe from 06-07.

Can't wait for a test match where Tamim hits 150+, and then a 100 from Shak in the same match.

or Shak 5fw and someone else at the other end with a 5fw

Rifat
December 6, 2010, 10:03 PM
IceMan should start to think of long term effect.
Global warming is on the rise and the inconvenient truth is, we need him for another good 15 years or so.
Hot performance like this day in day out, he is going to get sunburnt and might start to melt away at an increasing pace.

very intelligent post :clap: and yeah totally agree with the content.

Solution: Others need to Step UP Every Game, Imrul is trying but coming up short. Tamim is also trying hard but there is always that "odd match" where he scores less than 10 runs.

shakibrulz
December 6, 2010, 11:55 PM
IceMan should start to think of long term effect.
Global warming is on the rise and the inconvenient truth is, we need him for another good 15 years or so.
Hot performance like this day in day out, he is going to get sunburnt and might start to melt away at an increasing pace.

I feel Iceman is gradually becoming the Iron man. Have faith in the legend.

LBW103
December 7, 2010, 12:42 AM
Shakib is a world class batter. Tamim CAN be. The rest of the batters might be as good as they are ever going to be. We are Bangladesh and not India and do not have 10 great potential players to bring in each match.

Of course we are going to rely on our only world class player.

22Yards
December 7, 2010, 01:12 AM
I feel so bad. Why tamim isnt being considered of the same league as shakib. I mean that guy was the wisden cricketer of the year for crissakes, hit a glorious 100 at lords, and back to back 100 at old trafford. He's one of the leading test scorers this year, one of the most consistent batsman out there according to world standards and you still say he is not a 'world class batter". Makes me dissapointed.

I hope he hits a 100 to remind ourselves what he has been for us because fans tend to have very short term memory.

godzilla
December 7, 2010, 01:16 AM
I feel Iceman is gradually becoming the Iron man. Have faith in the legend.

I disagree. Iceman is gradually and eventualy going to become a BALDMAN if things continues like this. He is going to loose his cool if no one is going to step up ... He is just in his early 20's and already carries the whole country on his shoulder. If Mash get's back 80% of wtv he had before his injury then it will be a blessing for him and the team.

LBW103
December 7, 2010, 01:28 AM
I feel so bad. Why tamim isnt being considered of the same league as shakib. I mean that guy was the wisden cricketer of the year for crissakes, hit a glorious 100 at lords, and back to back 100 at old trafford. He's one of the leading test scorers this year, one of the most consistent batsman out there according to world standards and you still say he is not a 'world class batter". Makes me dissapointed.

I hope he hits a 100 to remind ourselves what he has been for us because fans tend to have very short term memory.

22 yards.. your definition of world class is a little off the mark I am afraid.

Tamim has an ODI average of a very poor 29.31 and this in 76 ODIs. This is what we are talking about. You seem to be confusing BIG HITTING and high strike rates for world class batting.

No one doubts of his credentials for batting (his test average is only just over 40 by the way) but to be called World Class I suggest the results need to be like other world class players.

Shahriar Nafees averages 33.49 from 64 matches in ODI by comparison, and he has been left out.

al Furqaan
December 7, 2010, 01:35 AM
22 yards.. your definition of world class is a little off the mark I am afraid.

Tamim has an ODI average of a very poor 29.31 and this in 76 ODIs. This is what we are talking about. You seem to be confusing BIG HITTING and high strike rates for world class batting.

No one doubts of his credentials for batting (his test average is only just over 40 by the way) but to be called World Class I suggest the results need to be like other world class players.

Shahriar Nafees averages 33.49 from 64 matches in ODI by comparison, and he has been left out.

SN is a poorer player than his average suggests. Tamim is better. switch their averages around and u get a better picture.

I too think that Tamim and Shakib are our two superstars and we depend on them. remember when tamim got out against pak in asia cup, siddons was like "if tamim scored 150 we would have been in the game".

we need others to step up. mortaza hopefully can come back to his best, and have either of rubel or shafi to take wickets and keep pressure.

LBW103
December 7, 2010, 01:43 AM
SN is a poorer player than his average suggests. Tamim is better. switch their averages around and u get a better picture.

I too think that Tamim and Shakib are our two superstars and we depend on them. remember when tamim got out against pak in asia cup, siddons was like "if tamim scored 150 we would have been in the game".

we need others to step up. mortaza hopefully can come back to his best, and have either of rubel or shafi to take wickets and keep pressure.

I think SN is a FAR BETTER player than his average suggests and is mighty unlucky to be excluded from the team when the middle order is inconsistent. Tamim is explosive and exciting, all the things we love about him. SN could bat through an innings and hold it all together if given that role - or bat 3.

Tamim is always likely to be inconsistent with massive hitting and loads of low scores mixed in. But averages do not lie. However us fans will always pick our favourites even if the statistics do not back up our arguments.

Zunaid
December 7, 2010, 01:57 AM
I too am a huge fan of SN - he just has not been treated fairly - why is he sitting out and not part of the tour team?

Our own favorite coach McInness had this to say about SN (don't mind his name mangling, it was very endearing how Richard spelt some of our names)

Shaharie Nafees Ahmed is by far the best potential captain of the Bangladesh team, no questtion at all.

He has the game sense and the knowledge of how to play positive aggressive cricket. He should be the next skipper, there is no one else in the picture.

http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/showthread.php?p=164526#post164526

Zunaid
December 7, 2010, 01:57 AM
I too am a huge fan of SN - he just has not been treated fairly - why is he sitting out and not part of the tour team?

Our own favorite coach McInness had this to say about SN (don't mind his name mangling, it was very endearing how Richard spelt some of our names)

Shaharie Nafees Ahmed is by far the best potential captain of the Bangladesh team, no questtion at all.

He has the game sense and the knowledge of how to play positive aggressive cricket. He should be the next skipper, there is no one else in the picture.

http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/showthread.php?p=164526#post164526

Jadukor
December 7, 2010, 02:02 AM
Nafees is a good player compared with other bangladeshi batter but he is no where in the league of Tamim... Tamim has a low average because when he started out he had a lot of limitations as a batsman...he couldnt play on the leg side...used to step out of the crease too frequently..couldnt rotate the strike either. But that tamim and the tamim of today is completely different. Tamim now has a lot more shots and skilled enough to take on any fast bowler and has proved himself against best bowling attacks overseas.

Nafees even at his prime never looked secure against swing bowling. He did score a memorable hundred in BD against the aussies but don't really recall anything significant overseas. Nafees still has a tendancy to go for loose wafts outside the off stump... he seems more like a flat track bully to me....

shakibrulz
December 7, 2010, 02:41 AM
I disagree. Iceman is gradually and eventualy going to become a BALDMAN if things continues like this. He is going to loose his cool if no one is going to step up ... He is just in his early 20's and already carries the whole country on his shoulder. If Mash get's back 80% of wtv he had before his injury then it will be a blessing for him and the team.
That's what seperates men from boys. Check out Iceman's average with the bat and ball as a captain, shows how good a player he is under pressure. If he was a pretender like you-know-who, he would'nt have been where he is now.

Night_wolf
December 7, 2010, 02:51 AM
Nafees is a good player compared with other bangladeshi batter but he is no where in the league of Tamim... Tamim has a low average because when he started out he had a lot of limitations as a batsman...he couldnt play on the leg side...used to step out of the crease too frequently..couldnt rotate the strike either. But that tamim and the tamim of today is completely different. Tamim now has a lot more shots and skilled enough to take on any fast bowler and has proved himself against best bowling attacks overseas.

Nafees even at his prime never looked secure against swing bowling. He did score a memorable hundred in BD against the aussies but don't really recall anything significant overseas. Nafees still has a tendancy to go for loose wafts outside the off stump... he seems more like a flat track bully to me....
i agree...SN when the ball moves around a little looks like a fish out of water

Brit-boy
December 7, 2010, 10:21 AM
Shakib is a world class batter. Tamim CAN be. The rest of the batters might be as good as they are ever going to be. We are Bangladesh and not India and do not have 10 great potential players to bring in each match.

Of course we are going to rely on our only world class player.

Shame. A country of huge population couldnt produce more than 2-3 worldclass players in a decade... AUS, SL, SA, ENG, NZ, WI produced many, and they arnt any way near the BD population!
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Tiger444
December 7, 2010, 11:10 AM
SN is a good batsman but he should not be compared with Tamim by any means. You compare the stats when they play test playing nations and it's obvious who the better player is. Tamim's got a big hundred against England and a lot of fifties while SN has only 3 and a very poor average. He does play really well against Zimbabwe and other associates. I believe he's on the same level as the rest of the batsmen. He's still very iffy against good quality pace but that's the case with all our batsmen except Tamim and Shakib.

Tiger444
December 7, 2010, 11:13 AM
Shame. A country of huge population couldnt produce more than 2-3 worldclass players in a decade... AUS, SL, SA, ENG, NZ, WI produced many, and they arnt any way near the BD population!
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Population really doesn't matter when producing players. If that was the case then India would be ruling the cricket world for decades. It's all about the infrastructure in producing players and all those countries have better infrastructure then us. With the poor domestic structure still in place it will be hard to produce world class players.

lamisa
December 7, 2010, 11:22 AM
i agree.remember what happened to us when shakib was out of form with the bat?(before he went to play county)

ammark
December 7, 2010, 03:43 PM
If anything, Tamim needs to play in first class county cricket, and realistically it should be SN and not just Ash playing in the Lancashire leagues/ minor counties. SN would do well to play a bit in the swinging English conditions. Heck I remember in UK tour 2005, he played a fine MOM innings (http://www.banglacricket.com/alochona/showthread.php?t=11696) against Aus in an ODI.

I think both SN and Tamim, along with Sakib have an excellent work ethic that will go well for them to the extent that BD will have our own version of Jayasuriya, Ranatunga, and Aravinda De Silva. (Sakib ≈ De Silva, Tamim ≈ Jayasuriya)

Zunaed, Imrul, Mushi all have too many limitations as batsmen to be considered in this upper tier I know Mushi has solid technique, but he does usually have very chancy/iffy gameplay to set himself up. I wont judge Rokib because I just havent seen him in different wickets and innings enough to form an opinion.

When you have more capable players shouldering responsibility across the batting order, dependence on Sakib alone will no longer be an issue.