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View Full Version : Shakib: a true all-rounder


shuziburo
August 8, 2012, 04:48 AM
To me a true all-rounder is one who can make the team as a batsman and as a bowler. This is a rather stringent definition and many great all-rounders would not have made the cut. The nay list probably would include greats like Imran Khan (who became a truly dependable bat late in his career), Kapil Dev, and Hadlee. Sobers and Botham would qualify easily. (Sobers was special because he could bowl pace and spin.) Of the current crop, Jacques Kallis probably can make it to the SA team as either only in the ODI. (According to Bangladesh-haters, Kallis is the best all-rounder in the world, irrespective of what the ranking says.)

That leaves the #1 all-rounder Shakib, who can comfortably walk into the team either as a batsman or as a bowler in tests and ODI. I would like him to do better in T20, though.

Naimul_Hd
August 8, 2012, 04:56 AM
To me a true all-rounder is one who can make the team as a batsman and as a bowler. This is a rather stringent definition and many great all-rounders would not have made the cut. The nay list probably would include greats like Imran Khan (who became a truly dependable bat late in his career), Kapil Dev, and Hadlee. Sobers and Botham would qualify easily. (Sobers was special because he could bowl pace and spin.) Of the current crop, Jacques Kallis probably can make it to the SA team as either only in the ODI. (According to Bangladesh-haters, Kallis is the best all-rounder in the world, irrespective of what the ranking says.)

That leaves the #1 all-rounder Shakib, who can comfortably walk into the team either as a batsman or as a bowler in tests and ODI. I would like him to do better in T20, though.

If Shakib can walk into both ODI and Test team then Kallis will make it in ALL format without a shadow of a doubt.

playmaker
August 8, 2012, 05:02 AM
Ofcourse shakib is a true allrounder, his Asia Cup performance says enough

Naimul_Hd
August 8, 2012, 05:03 AM
If you ask me to rate Shakib in comparison to all other greats, then i am afraid Shakib is still long way behind. He needs to improve his batting average to over 40 and bowling average to around 20.

Maysun
August 8, 2012, 06:05 AM
I would definitely love to see Shakib improve his batting much more, say, average somewhere close to 40. But that being said, I'm kind of afraid as his bowling hasn't been that great off late.

Rubu
August 8, 2012, 07:23 AM
Yes, I don't think there is any doubt about that. Question is, is he one of the greatest? Because we need a role model like that for the youngsters to follow.

betaar
August 8, 2012, 08:52 AM
Yes, I don't think there is any doubt about that. Question is, is he one of the greatest? Because we need a role model like that for the youngsters to follow.

No he is not one of the greatest....he's got a long way to go before even considering a great. True he's ranked higher than Kallis and has done that consistently in the ODI format for a while but to be a great you need to do that in all format, with higher average. If I had to pick, I would pick Kallis over Shakib atm.

simon
August 8, 2012, 09:32 AM
I find Sakib the most "balanced" AR.
He is equally good with bat & ball.
Unlike some great ARs who take wickets occassionaly or score runs occassionaly .
Sakib is vital in both our bowling & batting,that's what makes him so special.

zinatf
August 8, 2012, 09:40 AM
Inshallah t20-teo bhalo hobe....o international career shuru korlo matro 6 bochor....aro agate din...Inshallah shamne aro bhalo hobe ;)

shuziburo
August 8, 2012, 11:23 AM
If Shakib can walk into both ODI and Test team then Kallis will make it in ALL format without a shadow of a doubt.

I made my observation based on their track record in each format. You might want to look at their averages and strike rates in each format.

oronnya
August 8, 2012, 12:11 PM
Ek e alochona r kotto !!! Shakib is good but still a long way to go before calling him a great. He still has a lot to prove to the world. He is young so we should just wait n see.

I am little worried with his performance too.. Hope it doesn't go down from here...

playmaker
August 8, 2012, 12:55 PM
I wont say "A LONG WAY". remember, he is just 25, he has atleast 12 more cricketing years in him. Like simon bhai said, he is a balanced allrounder.

Shane watson maybe called an allrounder but his batting outshines his bowling, which IMO is ordinary. Kallis is a better bowler but he is such a class act with the bat, thus more of a Top Batsman who can bowl well, but not exceptionally.

Imran khan was more of a genuine allrounder. Though he batted so low, which was because there where other top batsman in the team, he still was a good batsman and a good bowler.

So Shakib is one player who I think is equally good in both departmants.

Gowza
August 8, 2012, 07:21 PM
ok looking at stats shakib is one of the greatest, all he has to do to be a great at the end of his career is improve or stay as consistent as he is. kallis is one of the greatest and shakib is always battling him for the #1 allrounder spot.

now as already said most great allrounders are batting allrounders (sobers, kallis) or bowling allrounders (hadlee) especially in test cricket, you also have the kapil devs and ian bothams. shakib is kind of inbetween if you look at his stats because his batting average even in tests is around 35, bowling average is 31 in tests and 28 in ODIs. so his batting seems a bit better than the bothams and devs but bowling seems on par or possibly even slightly better.

however, there is a difference with shakib, most great allrounders a pacers. shakib is one of the few genuine spin allrounders, sure there are a lot of spinners who can hold a bat but not many reach allrounder status.

no doubt shakib is a great ODI allrounder, he's on his way in tests clearly being that he averages close to 35, bats in the top 6 and has is a frontline strike bowler with great wicket-taking ability (proven by the 4fers and 5fers he's got in the tests he's played).

ahnaf
August 9, 2012, 12:40 AM
Seems like we are running out of idea for opening new thread :-p
<br />Posted via BC Mobile Edition (Opera Mobile)

NoName
August 10, 2012, 02:53 PM
Shakib has a long way to go to even in Kallis's caliber, mainly with the bat, but he's on the right trek. Though I'd say Shakib's bowling average is quite well, considering the time he is playing cricket in where batsmen have a lot more advantages.

Kohli_Sox
August 10, 2012, 03:39 PM
Personally I think we shouldn't compare pace allrounders with spinning allrounders (Test match should only apply while comparing greats)

Check out these records of some greatest spinning all rounders and Shakib is right up there

Aubrey Faulkner (http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/45039.html)
Vinoo Mankad (http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/30939.html)
Wilfred Rhodes (http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/19376.html)
Frank Woolley (http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/22518.html)

Gowza
August 10, 2012, 06:11 PM
Personally I think we shouldn't compare pace allrounders with spinning allrounders (Test match should only apply while comparing greats)

Check out these records of some greatest spinning all rounders and Shakib is right up there

Aubrey Faulkner (http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/45039.html)
Vinoo Mankad (http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/30939.html)
Wilfred Rhodes (http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/19376.html)
Frank Woolley (http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/22518.html)

yep true, shakib is one of the best spin allrounders, at least if he keeps this up he will be in tests, he's already there in ODIs imo.

deshimon
August 10, 2012, 06:16 PM
How can we say him great so early, he is a very good all rounder but this is not the time to call him great. Though he is number #1 with his nice performance, he has to go long way more. He is probably a alrounder a little better than Flintof.

Gowza
August 10, 2012, 06:48 PM
How can we say him great so early, he is a very good all rounder but this is not the time to call him great. Though he is number #1 with his nice performance, he has to go long way more. He is probably a alrounder a little better than Flintof.

can't call him great in tests yet, maybe in one-dayers, 120 odd matches is a lot though i know they play so many more these days.

oronnya
August 10, 2012, 07:43 PM
How can we say him great so early, he is a very good all rounder but this is not the time to call him great. Though he is number #1 with his nice performance, he has to go long way more. He is probably a alrounder a little better than Flintof.

Yeah Shakib is still not 1 of those greats but he is a much much better AR than Flintof.. He is a much balanced AR..

The point is we should stop discussing whether Shakib is 1 of the greats as he is only half way through his career.. Let him flourish.. He has already achieved a lot which many AR would just dream for.. Let's appreciate that and encourage him to do even better..

Gowza
August 10, 2012, 07:46 PM
yeah flintoff was a good bowler at times, but i'd never say he was a top 6 batsman, certainly not for a strong side, shakib on the other hand i'd rate much more highly as a batsman than flintoff, he can bat top 6 and make it just as a batsman, quality bowler to.

oronnya
August 10, 2012, 08:24 PM
yeah flintoff was a good bowler at times, but i'd never say he was a top 6 batsman, certainly not for a strong side, shakib on the other hand i'd rate much more highly as a batsman than flintoff, he can bat top 6 and make it just as a batsman, quality bowler to.

exactomo :up:

zinatf
August 10, 2012, 09:43 PM
He's the current World No.1 All-rounder. Of course he's the best. Enough said!

NoName
August 11, 2012, 02:54 PM
Lol, I think only the English think of Flintoff as an all-round legend.

shuziburo
August 12, 2012, 11:32 PM
can't call him great in tests yet, maybe in one-dayers, 120 odd matches is a lot though i know they play so many more these days.

Shakib is an excellent all-rounder, but the time to call him great is not here yet. If he remains healthy and retains his hunger, he would be an all-time great in all formats, despite the relatively small number of tests. Just my humble 2 cents.

Gowza
August 12, 2012, 11:50 PM
Shakib is an excellent all-rounder, but the time to call him great is not here yet. If he remains healthy and retains his hunger, he would be an all-time great in all formats, despite the relatively small number of tests. Just my humble 2 cents.

I do agree somewhat but what he has achieved in the one-day game thus far is a rare feat. Just recently I was discussing the same about steyn but from your POV so I totally understand what you're saying.

fiasnahk
August 15, 2012, 10:04 PM
I think it's embarrassing and a little rude to say that Shakib is better than Kallis as an allrounder. Kallis is truly a great and even if we are from Bangladesh we should respect the game of cricket and not be naive to compare Shakib to him. If you want go and have a look at their stats. Kallis has a which can't be matched by anyone. He averages 32 with the ball and 57 with the bat in Tests: Shakib averages 31 and 34 respectively. Kallis has maintained his averages over 150 matches while Shakib has only played 26. Averaging 30 with the ball is nothing outstanding, neither is averaging 34 with the bat. Put together, Shakib is a very good cricketer but take them alone and he is average. When you say he could play in the team as either a batsman or bowler, remember that its the BD team! He wouldn't get into the SA team (maybe as a spinner he might) with his record!

Gowza
August 15, 2012, 10:24 PM
I think it's embarrassing and a little rude to say that Shakib is better than Kallis as an allrounder. Kallis is truly a great and even if we are from Bangladesh we should respect the game of cricket and not be naive to compare Shakib to him. If you want go and have a look at their stats. Kallis has a which can't be matched by anyone. He averages 32 with the ball and 57 with the bat in Tests: Shakib averages 31 and 34 respectively. Kallis has maintained his averages over 150 matches while Shakib has only played 26. Averaging 30 with the ball is nothing outstanding, neither is averaging 34 with the bat. Put together, Shakib is a very good cricketer but take them alone and he is average. When you say he could play in the team as either a batsman or bowler, remember that its the BD team! He wouldn't get into the SA team (maybe as a spinner he might) with his record!

who is saying shakib is a better allrounder than kallis? what can't be denied though is that shakib is one of the best allrounders at current, he consistently holds the #1 allrounder spot in various formats. of course this doesn't mean he is better than kallis, the truth is kallis is more of a batting allrounder, shakib is more equal with bat and ball than being amazing at one. as far as shakib being able to make it as both batsman or bowler i think there are a number of current teams he would make it other than BD. sri lanka for one, he would definitely make it as a batsman and most likely as a bowler to, india he could make it as a bowler NZ of course he would make it for both, WI he'd def make it as a batsman and maybe a bowler (depends on how narine develops for now), zimbabwe obviously he'd make it as both, england he'd be a strong chance as bowler, and this might be a shock but at current he'd make the aussie team for both batting and bowling.

keep in mind i don't think anyone is clear cut saying right now at this second shakib is a great, but if he continues as he has been he will be considered a great allrounder, compare his stats to dev and botham who are 2 of the best ever and clearly if he keeps his stats as is he will be ahead of them. however, shakib seems to be geting better so there is a chance he'll end up with better stats than he currently has.

is he better than kallis? of course not, kallis is already a great who is nearing the end of his career. what is clear though is that shakib is on track to be a great, he's still really young but is already performing pretty well and as said comparable to some other great allrounders plus he's consistently vying for the #1 allrounder spot in various formats so that proves that he's one of the best of the current generation/era.

also this isn't just about test matches, shakib has performed really well in the one-day format for more than 100 matches, pretty much tells us he is consistently a quality ODI allrounder, his ODI stats show that. we will see how far he goes in tests, he's on track and he looks to be getting better.

on a side note it can be a bit unfair to compare batting/bowling allrounders to allrounders who are more balanced and are relied upon more on both skill sets. think about it, kallis is a batsman RSA rely on, but he's not a frontline bowler in anyway, maybe early in his career he was but he hasn't been for years, shakib is a frontline bowler every single match, so just saying kallis has a 32 bowling average which isn't to far off shakib's 31, that doesn't tell the whole story because shakib bowls a lot more thus has to hold up his consistency for a longer period than kallis does. same goes for bowling allrounders, compare their batting to shakib's and shakib is much better (hadlee for example). different types of allrounders are harder to compare, can't just purely go one basic stats, you have to delve a little deeper and look at the situations more closely.

anyway no doubt kallis is one of the greatest allrounders of all time, stats wise he's the best, most you ask will still say sobers is #1, but kallis certainly makes top 5 if not top 3 imo (it's between him and imran for the #2 spot).

PoorFan
August 15, 2012, 10:28 PM
Damn! Here come lady ninjas on BC.

Night_wolf
August 15, 2012, 10:35 PM
Damn! Here come lady ninjas on BC.

hahaha:floor::floor:

Gowza
August 15, 2012, 10:56 PM
:ninja: *kapow*