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Saurav
April 30, 2004, 07:11 AM
(This may be a bit touchy, but I am sure the members of this forum have enough maturity to handle this)

How many Hindu players have played for Bangladesh till date? (either Tests or ODIs)

I remember Bikash Ranjan Das being the first Hindu to play Test cricket for Bangladesh!

Are Alok Kapali and Tapash Baishya Hindus?

Does communal preferences play any part in the selection process? Has their been accusations of these kind or the like? What does the local media say ... or do people even talk about it?

I am curious!

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by Saurav : typo]

rassel
April 30, 2004, 07:30 AM
Are Alok Kapali and Tapash Baishya Hindus?

yes, that's all i know for now.

SS
April 30, 2004, 07:31 AM
nuthing to do with communial preference..if you are good you will be taken ...same for teachers, doctors,
and players...
kapali was considered several times..but he is total flop..only Tapash is the man
Dhiman Ghosh is really talented.
and others are coming..players are above all bangladeshi beyond their communial identity

Carte Blanche
April 30, 2004, 07:35 AM
Yes both Tapash and Alok are hindus. I have never heard of any communal preference playing parts in the selection process. Never. Nor have I heard of any such accusations. I believe you are the first person here to bring up a topic about this. I mean in this forum. Even in BD I've never heard of any racial/religious prejudice. We're very tolerant in that regard, imho. Same goes with the media. Many of the top reporters of the dhaka dailies are hindu. Take Utpal Shuvro for example. He has been covering most (if not all) of the BD tours. He is highly respected, and very popular among the media, and the cricket fans, enthusiasts. He works for Prothom-Alo, btw.

FaltuRidwanBhai
April 30, 2004, 08:30 AM
well bangladesh might have a big muslim population. but i dont think there has been any racism against hindus while choosing the team. the team is selected merely based on the players performances. yes carte blanche you have said it also. some leading news reporters are also hindus such as utpol shubhro but that does not mean anything to us. bangladesh is a peoples republic country. and everyone is looked upon the same way. not based on their religion. bangladesh is one of the most moderate democratic country.

fwullah
April 30, 2004, 08:40 AM
Ranajit Biswas is another hindu babu among the reporters.

Hannan Sarkar is a hindu.

oracle
April 30, 2004, 08:45 AM
Hannan Sarkar is a hindu


Really. Just wanted to clarify Sarker is a surname used by both muslims and Hindus in Bangladesh.

fwullah
April 30, 2004, 09:05 AM
Really. Just wanted to clarify Sarker is a surname used by both muslims and Hindus in Bangladesh.


Really? I've been living in Bangladesh all my life and even I didn't know that!

FaltuRidwanBhai
April 30, 2004, 09:08 AM
ji madam,
sarkar kintu amon akti nam jeti kintu muslim ebong hindi nirbisheshe bebohar kora hoye thake. dannabad.

FaltuRidwanBhai
April 30, 2004, 09:10 AM
tobe hanna sarkar hindi ai kothata kintu amar akhono amar bishhash hoi na,
karon tar pura nam kintu abdul hannan sarkar. ebong jotodur jani abdul namta shudhu musolmanderi hoye thake. kokhono kintu ami kono hindu manusher nam abdul hobe bole shuni ni. karon abdul manai hochhe allahar banda kingba follower of allah.

Navarene
April 30, 2004, 09:16 AM
Oracle is right. The name Sarkar is commonly practiced both in hindus and muslims. I remember this guy Sarkar Kabiruddin, who was a btv news reader long time ago. Also Jamiruddin Sarkar, the bnp politician?

Rubu
April 30, 2004, 09:21 AM
as long as i know, hannan is an arabic word. its very unlikely that a hindu will use it as a name. anyway, i've the same question for saurav as well about india.

see, the ratio of muslim and hindu population in bd is about 10:1. so, even if there is only one hindu player in the team, it would be proportional to the population. having two and half proves that it religion did not play a role there. saying two and half because i'm not sure about hannan. but india has a ratio of hindu and muslim much larger than bd. do u have any idea why there are so few muslims in the team? i don't wanna imply anything. just curious like u.

Zunaid
April 30, 2004, 09:28 AM
Sarkar is one of the many names in Bangladesh (and greater Bengal) that have been used by both Hindus and Muslims.

Another common one are the chowdhuri variants.

Hannan Sarkar is of Muslim origin. Anyone remember Abu Hossain Sarkar from the KSP (Krishak Sramik Party) who was the chief minister of erstewhile E. Pak twice. Younger members here might recognize the name Jamiruddin Sircar - Sircar is just variant of Sarkar. Then you have Younus Ali Sarkar (ex AL MP). BUET-ians here might recall Prof MA Rashi SARKAR from the ME dept.

I am not aware of any famous Hindu Sarkars in Bangladesh except for Partha Pratim Sarkar of bytesforall. Notre Dame College alumni might remember Sarkar Sir.

We do live an insular life, don't we?

say
April 30, 2004, 09:30 AM
FW> what Bangladesh do you live in? :o

Originally posted by fwullah

Really. Just wanted to clarify Sarker is a surname used by both muslims and Hindus in Bangladesh.


Really? I've been living in Bangladesh all my life and even I didn't know that!

say
April 30, 2004, 09:39 AM
Saurav, So far we have not seen any division like this in Bangladesh Cricket world. The communal preferences don't play any part in the selection process.

If there were anyhint of such practices in BD Cricket world, you would have known it by now through this forum - as in this forum, everything and every issue is discussed from many different angles.

Saurav
April 30, 2004, 09:45 AM
For Agentsmith:

Was expecting that :-) India consists of 80 per cent Hindus and 11 per cent Muslims (1991 Census data, the 2001 Census data on religions hasn't come out yet) actually.

We have Irfan and Zaheer in the team (when Zaheer is fit, that is) and otherwise Kaif is always there in the ODI team. So, the proportions are almost same, I would say.

Abdul Hannan Sarkar can't be a Hindu name!

So other than Bikash Ranjan Das, Kapali and Baishya, weren't there any other cricketer?

Zunaid
April 30, 2004, 09:49 AM
Originally posted by Saurav
So other than Bikash Ranjan Das, Kapali and Baishya, weren't there any other cricketer?

Why should it matter? As long as the system is based on merit (at least in our cricket selection system, it seems to be so) this is irrelevant. So it is fine if we had 11 Hindu players in the national team or none or even if we had 11 wiccas.

Saurav
April 30, 2004, 09:55 AM
Tch ... it hardly 'matters', in the real sense of the term.

It's just a matter of statistical interest.

Like, Yousuf Youhana is the first Christian captain of Pakistan

OR

Danish Kaneria is the second Hindu to play for Pakistan

and stuff like that!

(I got the answer to my second question from the members who posted)

Zunaid
April 30, 2004, 10:00 AM
Originally posted by Saurav
Tch ... it hardly 'matters', in the real sense of the term.

It's just a matter of statistical interest.

Like, Yousuf Youhana is the first Christian captain of Pakistan

OR

Danish Kaneria is the second Hindu to play for Pakistan

and stuff like that!


I am naive and idealistic - but I look forward to the day that such items are not of statistical interest.


(I got the answer to my second question from the members who posted)

And what might that be?

reinausagi
April 30, 2004, 10:08 AM
The confusion among our membership as to what religion Hannar Sarkar subscribes to PROVES that we really don't care what the religious make up of the BD team is. All we care about is that they are Bangladeshi gentleman cricketers.

Saurav
April 30, 2004, 10:10 AM
For Zunaid:

You may be idealistic and not interested in races, communities, tribes and their interaction.

I may be idealistic as well and may be interested in races, communities, tribes and their interaction!


I am interested in cultural anthropology, you are not!

But that shouldn't necessarily lead you to scoff at my interests!

(If you are president of a country, would you ban the religion data that comes out of a census, hmmm?)

My second question was abt - communal preferences

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by Saurav : Salutation]

Huda
April 30, 2004, 10:15 AM
Originally posted by fwullah
Ranajit Biswas is another hindu babu among the reporters.

Hannan Sarkar is a hindu.
really? His full name is Abdul Hannan Sarker. I have never seen any hindu use Abdul as a name.
Any way bangladesh may have alarge muslim population but that does not mean it is a muslim country. Muslim countries are those that follow islamic law. So anyoen playign for BD should be taken if they are bangladeshis citizen or not like other teams not religion or race.

Beamer
April 30, 2004, 10:17 AM
saurav
besides the names already mentioned, there are quite a few players of hindu origin playing the domestic and league circuits. Kuntal, papan sharma, uttam sarkar, dhiman ghosh ( a real talent ) to name a few. I am sure there are many more. I personally never thought about this until you raised the question. I think many more names will surface now. people actually never looked at it from this angle...cheers

al Furqaan
April 30, 2004, 10:32 AM
so far the question of 'is this player such and such religion' has been a trivial matter. it would be important if their were good non-muslim players and they were being left out simply because they are [not Muslim -ED]. this would ultimately hurt the national team. India has a fair amount of muslims on their national teams (irfan, zaheer, kaif, and dont forget azar was capt. in the late 90s). yes, the proportion of muslims in india is greater than that of hindus in either pakistan or bangladesh. i think all subcontinent teams are doing well to incorporate minorities. BD has done their part. Pak has done theirs (i did not know that youhana was [not Muslim: ED], yousef is a common muslim name but youhana is not). even in war torn Sri Lanka (Vaas is christian and they capped a muslim Mohamed Maharoof in the ODI against Zim). and india has done theirs.

[Ed: Deleted: Not relevant or appropriate]

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by al Furqaan]

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by Zunaid]

Zephaniah
April 30, 2004, 10:44 AM
When we're going ga ga over player's religion, i just wondered do they really care bout religion or practice religion?

And prolly it's my strange disability to relate cricket with religion.

Saurav. Do we really need to do this?

May be you'd like to keep your statistical interest to yourself.


.

Navarene
April 30, 2004, 10:44 AM
Mr. al Furqaan, would pls stop mumbling with the word "kafir"??? This a very derogatory word to a apply to any human being!


i think all subcontinent teams are doing well to incorporate minorities.

Weird comment! Players are selected in terms of their merit and talent in BD cricket team. It is not BCB's job to incorporate minorities in the team.

Zunaid
April 30, 2004, 10:48 AM
Originally posted by Saurav
For Zunaid:
deleted for brevity

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by Saurav : Salutation]

I will make one comment and take this off line since it may not be relevant to the forum. I think you misread my intent - I wasn't scoffing at your interest . I apologize if I gave you that impression. I kind of extrapolated it into meta-issues and had no desire nor the intention to look for hidden motives. As for anthropology and such stuff - we should have a chat (offline of course - one of my passions is linguistic anthropology).

To forum members: I hope we all use our discretion and better judgement when following up on this thread. Threads like this often have the tendency to degenerate.

Moderator voice: I'll be unusually strict in following this thread.

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by Zunaid]

reinausagi
April 30, 2004, 10:59 AM
Moderator voice: I'll be unusually strict in following this thread.


Zunaid has laid down the law with 'Jessopian' speed. Sorry guys, I just had to use that term, after learning of it's existence on another thread.:)

SS
April 30, 2004, 11:27 AM
ok Mr.Saurav I guess you got the answer of who is Hindu, who is muslim, who are you, what's ur origin..does it matter..i..does it matter??? i guess we shoudl stop the topic

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by SS]

fwullah
April 30, 2004, 11:40 AM
FW> what Bangladesh do you live in?


Bangladesh Cricket World, I guess. :lol:

Zobair
April 30, 2004, 11:41 AM
Religion and sports should not be mixed at any level whatsoever. People who do it do so out of ignorance in my opinion.

The sole yardstick for judging cricketers should be their cricket ability, not their religion and other beliefs. Teams should not be selected on the basis of colour and creed. I am not in favour of affirmative action in Cricket either. For me, if the Bangladesh team is composed of 11 non-Muslims because they are the best in terms of abilities, then I will be as ardent a supporter of the team, as I would be with a team made of 11 Muslims.
Having said all that I have never heard any communal discourse of any nature regarding Bangladesh cricket. Bangladesh cricket may not be the ideal meritocracy (like the rest of the affairs of our country) but creed has never had to do anything with it. In fact, I find the dearth of any meaningful (or meaningless rather!) discussion about the nice communal blend (or the lack of it) in our discourse very refreshing. It shows that communalism doesnot figure high on our minds. I can honestly say that in my lifetime as a Bangladeshi cricket fan, I have never ever heard of any communal bias expressed by either our fellow fans, players, commentators or the administration. It is a nice achievement and hopefully we will keep it that way, and not go the way of some of the Indians and the Pakistanis . I have heard minority players on both Indian and Pakistani teams being explicitly accused of being traitors, and I hope I have never have to see that kind of a day dawn in our cricket. Because to be honest, a part of me (as a bangladeshi Cricket fan) will die that day. :(

fwullah
April 30, 2004, 11:43 AM
The confusion among our membership as to what religion Hannar Sarkar subscribes to PROVES that we really don't care what the religious make up of the BD team is. All we care about is that they are Bangladeshi gentleman cricketers.


There's a valid point there - I used to think all this time that Hannan Sarkar is a hindu, not really going through all the details of 'Abdul Hannan being an arabic name'.

Arnab
April 30, 2004, 11:43 AM
Religion and sports should not be mixed at any level whatsoever.

Yeah? What's your take on all the religious speeches Pakistani players give at the end of a match?

fwullah
April 30, 2004, 11:51 AM
i am a rajakar


I don't exactly know how the 'copyrights' law act on the Internet (of Bangladeshi origin), but saying the above words could be very harmful if spoken in an otherwise peaceful place in Bangladesh.

Zobair
April 30, 2004, 11:53 AM
I don't have any problems players have religious beliefs and expressing it (if they wish so) in non-confrontational ways. Perhaps I should have been more explicit. I am ok with "Thank you Tony, I owe it all to Allah/bhagwan/God". He did his bit on the cricket field, he can choose to dedicate it to whoever he chooses. I am not ok with "He is a better (or not better depending on the case) cricketer coz he is a Muslims/Hindu/God-fearing/atheist" line of arguements. In other words my beef is with religion being mixed into sports debates and discourse.

Beamer
April 30, 2004, 11:55 AM
or praying on the field together as a team? wrong thing to do. you relegate the likes of youhana or kaneria automatically by being exclusive. But that is Pakistan and religion was the sole region behind the birth of that nation along with Israel ( only two countires in the world). However, no one should have any problem if religious practices are done privately.

crazyisland
April 30, 2004, 12:35 PM
Shourav,
You sound to me a radical religious believer the kind who see everything from religious point of view. Don't worry , in Bangladesh minorities are far secured compared to our neighbors. I don't see any point discussing the issue you have brought up. Get over and above this religion thing.

Navarene
April 30, 2004, 01:00 PM
Originally posted by crazyisland
Shourav,
You sound to me a radical religious believer the kind who see everything from religious point of view.
crazyisland, let's not be judgemental to saurav as a person. I afraid we are reading way too much out of his original post. He simply asked a few innocent questions out of curiosity to enlighten him. Nothing much.

Ahmed_B
April 30, 2004, 01:04 PM
I should say that this is a very good thing in BD cricket (even all other sports) that communal choices have never emerged as the villain!...
BD fans r crazy about any team member who can show some gutts on the field.. matterless of his Religious or Ethenic or Educational ( ;) ) background!!

..& bye the way... Hannan sarkar is confirmed Muslim :D

Zunaid
April 30, 2004, 01:06 PM
Moderator voice:

Thanks Navarene... I hope this keeps the lid on.

crazyisland, this is too much a flame and I would encourage you to edit/modify your post.

Sourav, please let this one pass :) I think most people do get the reason for your query.

[Addition: saw the second post by crickethorizon: thanks]

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by Zunaid]

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by Zunaid]

Zobair
April 30, 2004, 02:03 PM
or praying on the field together as a team? wrong thing to do. you relegate the likes of youhana or kaneria automatically by being exclusive. But that is Pakistan and religion was the sole region behind the birth of that nation along with Israel ( only two countires in the world). However, no one should have any problem if religious practices are done privately.


Very interesting point. This is where it enters into the "grey area" for me. I am a practising Muslim and so I am well aware of the significance on praying in Jamaat (congregation) for Muslims.One of the reasons this is done is to build a sense of community and brotherhood. But as far as I know this is a preferred practice of the Prophet PBUH though it is not compulsory at all times (exceptions include Friday, Funeral and Eid prayers). The non-Muslims may feel excluded by this practise and there is no denying that. Yet, I would definitely consider it wrong if the team deliberately prevents players from praying together since that is impinging on a fundamental right of the players to practise their faith (reminds me of the whole 'hijab ban' in france episode). What I would do is instead ensure that the practise of faith by a particular group shouldnot be made the priority of the team management i.e. it shouldnot take centre-stage. Players can worship together in a corner, get over with it and move on, and not bring the world to a standstill while they are at it. This should minimize alienation to a minimum since players are not "losing out on privileges or limelight" because of their faith if you know what I mean. I am by no means suggesting that this is what the Pakistani team is doing. I won't pass judgement on that since I don't exactly know how they are going about it.

akabir77
April 30, 2004, 02:18 PM
Originally posted by pompous

or praying on the field together as a team? wrong thing to do. you relegate the likes of youhana or kaneria automatically by being exclusive. But that is Pakistan and religion was the sole region behind the birth of that nation along with Israel ( only two countires in the world). However, no one should have any problem if religious practices are done privately.


Very interesting point. This is where it enters into the "grey area" for me. I am a practising Muslim and so I am well aware of the significance on praying in Jamaat (congregation) for Muslims.One of the reasons this is done is to build a sense of community and brotherhood. But as far as I know this is a preferred practice of the Prophet PBUH though it is not compulsory at all times (exceptions include Friday, Funeral and Eid prayers). The non-Muslims may feel excluded by this practise and there is no denying that. Yet, I would definitely consider it wrong if the team deliberately prevents players from praying together since that is impinging on a fundamental right of the players to practise their faith (reminds me of the whole 'hijab ban' in france episode). What I would do is instead ensure that the practise of faith by a particular group shouldnot be made the priority of the team management i.e. it shouldnot take centre-stage. Players can worship together in a corner, get over with it and move on, and not bring the world to a standstill while they are at it. This should minimize alienation to a minimum since players are not "losing out on privileges or limelight" because of their faith if you know what I mean. I am by no means suggesting that this is what the Pakistani team is doing. I won't pass judgement on that since I don't exactly know how they are going about it.

On this matter I want to point out one thing many player in many sports shows their religious belief. example Rolando crosses his hart (christen believe) after he scores also a player from Spain (forgot his name), in baseball most of the player when they come out from their dugout they cross their hart and when hits home runs looks above and say their small prayers... so what’s the problem if Muslims shows some religion?

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by akabir77]

Beamer
April 30, 2004, 02:23 PM
Well said, pompous. I am not judging the pakistanis here but such public showing of fraternity, however innocent it may be, may alienate the minorities in a team setting. Judging from their history of religious and ethnic intolerance that has caused so many strifes, its hard to give them the benefit of doubt though. I agree with everythign you said. To prevent people from praying will also be an infringement on their right to express religious freedom. Point well taken. Its just better, in my mind, to keep religious activities for private consumptions, and enhanced visibilty more often than none can lead to unpleasant situations.

Beamer
April 30, 2004, 02:29 PM
akabir77
Thats individualism in that case and Brazil or Spain are pretty homogeneous ( all catholics )in terms of religion. Nothing wrong with muslims showing their faith but its also your duty not to alienate a minority in your team. thats all

Zobair
April 30, 2004, 02:30 PM
Thanks Beamer. I was actually disturbed by the photograph of the players praying together- emphasis on photograph! This is an instance of what minority players may call "privelege" or "being in the limelight" (photographed in a group), and being the only ones to miss out on the opportunity because of their faith may cause them to feel excluded!

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by pompous]

Beamer
April 30, 2004, 02:41 PM
Absolutely correct you are. I didn't like the picture as well. I thought it was pretty political, you know, playing India after all to show the public. pretty cheap. I hope we never resort to these type of stunts.
Saeed Anwar and Saqlain Mushtaq on the otehr hand, keeping beard to show faith is totally different case and purely individual, and I hope people dont connect the two.

crazyisland
April 30, 2004, 03:00 PM
Originally posted by Navarene
crazyisland, let's not be judgemental to saurav as a person. I afraid we are reading way too much out of his original post. He simply asked a few innocent questions out of curiosity to enlighten him. Nothing much.

I am not sure if his intention behind that question is that innocent. I have met few people who like put up a face of a moderate on the outside - where inside they have hatred for other religion or country. And sometimes they show their real face through such "innocent" questions. I wouldn't be surprise if he goes out to other Forum and say things like "Bangldesh's playing test is a Joke".

I just think talking about or thinking of terms of "who is Hindu, who is Muslim , why Muslim or why not Hindu - etc" is a disgrace itself. I have been following this forum for a while and I think question/topic like this just does not belong here. <b> It's really a shame that we are discussing our player's religion on this board. </b> Who cares who is what..Let's talk about cricket.

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by crazyisland]

akabir77
April 30, 2004, 03:07 PM
Originally posted by Beamer
Absolutely correct you are. I didn't like the picture as well. I thought it was pretty political, you know, playing India after all to show the public. pretty cheap. I hope we never resort to these type of stunts.
Saeed Anwar and Saqlain Mushtaq on the otehr hand, keeping beard to show faith is totally different case and purely individual, and I hope people dont connect the two.

I agree with you two. Thanks for clearing that out. I am also opposing to showing fake faith like pakistanis do… To my knowledge and have seen first hand what they do after game when they return to the hotel room.. Exception one or two…. Individually every one should be allowed to do their prayers not to show that I am a good Muslim. What I want to say is when we go to a funeral or christen people comes to Muslim occasions every one prays together but in their own belief. And in cricket we can do that to if the player thinks it’s needed.

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by Zunaid]

al Furqaan
April 30, 2004, 03:09 PM
Originally posted by Navarene
Mr. al Furqaan, would pls stop mumbling with the word "kafir"??? This a very derogatory word to a apply to any human being!


i think all subcontinent teams are doing well to incorporate minorities.

Weird comment! Players are selected in terms of their merit and talent in BD cricket team. It is not BCB's job to incorporate minorities in the team.

firstly, the word 'kafir' can mean many things as far as i am concerned. all of them mean 'disbeliever' and their are varying levels with which it can be applied. one is 'non-muslim'. this is not offensive and this is the way in which i meant it. it can also mean 'disbeliever' and this is moderately offensive. then there is 'infidel' the final and undoubtably derogatory term. this term i would only use after being viciously attacked by a 'non-muslim' first. i used the word kafir both because it is easier to type than 'non muslim' and also because i wanted to see what the response would be from banglacricket's mostly muslim readers.

secondly, i did not advocate that teams should put in minorities just to fill some affirmative action quotas. what i meant was that the fact that all 4 sub-continental teams had minority caps in their squads shows that they were obviously not keeping talented players out because of relgion.

about salaat in jammaat: it is vastly better to offer prayer in jamaat rather than everyone pray by themselves. no one denies this fact. if the bangladeshi or pakistani players want to perform prayers in jamaat, then they should do so by any means. there is no hostile attempt to exclude non-muslim players because if that were the true intent then how would these players be on the team to begin with. by the same argument one should say that all jamaat prayers in Bdesh should be banned as there are some 20 million non-muslims in the country that will feel left out. please. i am a muslim born and raised in the USA. i know everything about being a religious minority which most of you in Bdesh do not. when my friends talk about jesus or going to church, it only stregnthens my faith. i don't feel left out and wish that i could convert to xtianity. bottom line is that if they wish, the Bangladeshi players should pray in jamaat and let everyone know that they are muslims. there shouldn't be a stigma for people to practice the relgion that they believe in, whatever that relgion might be.

Zunaid
April 30, 2004, 03:15 PM
Moderator role off:

The discussion has changed for the better and is very interesting, though it is losing relevance to this forum. In my moderator role, I was considering sports/religion portion to Forget Cricket but there is no way to move part of the thread and lose context (the first part is obviously relevant here). Could I urge all of you to retire to Forget Cricket and I (in my moderator role) will see if I can migrate the articles over?

Thanks

[Edited on 30-4-2004 by Zunaid]

reverse_swing
April 30, 2004, 03:16 PM
Originally posted by crazyisland
<b> It's really a shame that we are discussing our player's religion in the board. </b> Who cares who is what..Let's talk about cricket.

well said

FaltuRidwanBhai
April 30, 2004, 04:04 PM
well amar mone hoi prithibir shob playerder modhhe bishesh kore musolman playerder modhhe shob cheye dharmik hochhe sayeed anwar. i really admire him for his religousness. usually playerder religion gollai jai bishesh kore musolmander aro beshi. tobe saeed jokhon rojar shomoy dhakay eshechilen tokhon amar sposhto mone ache tini kotha bolte channi shangbadikder shathe karon tini kintu roja rekhechilen. echara sayeed kintu dario rekhechilen. jodio tar dari rakhata onekta tar konnar mrittur shoker karone. akhon ager shai kothai fire jete chai je bangladesh dol a kintu confirm dujon hindu player ache tara hole taposh boishho ebong alok kapali. shutorang it is 15:2. so there is no point of saying that players in our team is chosen based on their religion. dannabad.

Banglar Bagh
April 30, 2004, 06:04 PM
Are u mad.????!!!!!!!!!:-/
Hannan Is one of my best friend. From my school. We both play together in Jack team in Khilgaon Govt. High school. He is muslim. No dought about that.:mad::mad:

say
April 30, 2004, 06:41 PM
Originally posted by al Furqaan
i used the word kafir both because it is easier to type than 'non muslim' and also because i wanted to see what the response would be from banglacricket's mostly muslim readers.

=====del=====

there shouldn't be a stigma for people to practice the relgion that they believe in, whatever that relgion might be.

Al, I believe you got you answer and can see that is an offensive term. Please don't use it anymore. If you look around, the 'non-muslim' world is as diverse as it can get and looking at everyone in an 'us and them' view would do injustice. Let me give you an example. If someone divided the world into two groups - 'Christians and Heathens' - how would you feel being lumped sum with all the other 'lesser' religions? What you are saying (Only two groups of people, Muslim and Kuffar) is nothing short of being an Islamic Supremacist. And it can lead the society into very ominous states by leading the Muslims think that their religion is better than that of others. Please try to understand that there are many good things in other religions too and we must appreciate others to live in harmonious world . This is a plague in today's Muslim youth and someone must start talking about it.

al Furqaan
April 30, 2004, 07:21 PM
to be honest, it shouldnt matter to a non muslim to be called kafir. xtians do not, but if they did call me a heathen, i really wouldnt care. some xtians have told me that, if i dont believe in christ as lord, i will go to hell. do you think that scared me? no because i dont believe in the same things that they do. its just like calling muslims non-christians, or gentile (hebrew: goyim), or non-hindu, or non-buddhist or whatever. if they dont believe in Islam they shouldnt worry being considered disbelievers.

the real problem is when non-muslims feel marginalized in society. they fear for their well being is compromised because of their beliefs. this attitude is not unfounded. in fact, it shows that muslims should interact peacefully and justly with those who treat us with peace and justice. the word 'kafir' will then not be an issue. the fact is that the word is termed offensive whenever it refers to a minority. the fact of the matter is that in the quran there are no other words to describe non-muslim. the majority of meccans were kuffar. so the word in and of itself is not offensive, rather it is the manner in which it is used. i meant it in no biggoted manner.

[Edited on 1-5-2004 by al Furqaan]

Zobair
April 30, 2004, 07:49 PM
Lets drop this kafir issue. Every one's concern and Al furqan's explanation have been duly noted. No more discussion on this please. This word has been put on Banglacricket "no no list" from now on. Lets move on. :cool:

[Edited on 1-5-2004 by pompous]

AsifTheManRahman
April 30, 2004, 10:08 PM
I think we had a Hindu wicket keeper in the national team a couple of years ago...don't remember his name though...
we have hindus in our soccer team as well...in fact we had a hindu captain just recently...so it's like - you're picked if you're good enough, and the selection process is independent of the players' religion...

and...Hannan Sarkar is Muslim of course...the name speaks for itself...Hannan can't be Hindu...

Besides my great great grandfathers were a bunch of Sarkars, yet they used to pray on a "Jaay Namaaz"...:)

wasif
April 30, 2004, 10:30 PM
ATLEAST CRICKET BOARD IS FARE .WE ALL TOGETHER ARE BANGLADESHI .............
I WANT TO HOIST MY FLAG UP ........RELIGION DOES'T MATTER.........I HAVE FAITH ON BCCB:fanflag::fanflag::fanflag:

Orpheus
May 1, 2004, 01:28 AM
we have hindu players in our team??? who did this? Kill that [ED]

We need some female in our team as well to show equal rights!

it's funny how this thread got so many replies .....to such an innocent query...

ALLAH HAFIZ!

[Edited on 1-5-2004 by Orpheus]

Saurav
May 2, 2004, 05:27 AM
Thanks for posting, everyone!

I admire and appreciate all those who answered honestly, without trying to smell a nonexistent rat.

Thanks to those as well who pointed out the systems that are prevalent in Bangladesh1

[edit]

Anyway, I have never stopped myself from asking a 'politically incorrect' question! Will never do so in the future as well!

Thanks!

[Edited on 5-2-2004 by chinaman : Moderation. See my post below]]

zakir
May 2, 2004, 08:21 AM
I think Yousuf Yohana is not the first
Christian player played for Pakistan.
Wallis Mattews (sp?) also played for
Pakistan earlier.

chinaman
May 2, 2004, 10:17 AM
Dear Sourav

Please do not make offensive and / or flaming comments. Please be sensible when asking sensitive questions.

Arnab
May 2, 2004, 10:30 AM
What did he write?

Carte Blanche
May 2, 2004, 11:51 AM
I don't think he is going to tell us. I wish I read it before chinaman came here :P

Saurav
May 2, 2004, 11:58 PM
Youhana is the 4th Christian actually.
Though he is the first Christian to captain Pakistan.

To Chinaman:

That was a flame? Hmmm? I am learning. I thought that was normal straight-talk
:lol:

Errm, some of the responses were far far far more provocative. And of course, I was tottally sensible while asking whatever I asked. Though I guess you edited more than what you 'should have'.

But still, it's your prerogative!

To Arnab and Carte Blanche:

What did I say? Okay, I will u2u it to you guys some time. Right now I am way too busy with a friend's wedding and the accompanying fun ;-)