PDA

View Full Version : American beheaded in Iraq


Carte Blanche
May 12, 2004, 01:39 PM
Just watched the full uncensored video. Oh my god it's shocking. I don't have words to describe it. I can't believe this is what people do in the name of Islam. Anyone else seen it?

Zobair
May 12, 2004, 01:40 PM
The screams I heard in the censored video was enough for me. I almost puked right there.

reverse_swing
May 12, 2004, 02:05 PM
This is absolutely unbelievable.These people use Islam to conceal their vicious aims. The only difference between the Bush gang and AL QAEDA is that the killing session was relayed on the internet. We don't know what is US hiding or has hidden so far.

Carte Blanche
May 12, 2004, 02:07 PM
Right reverse swing. The worst part is, they kept saying Allahu Akbar till the head completely came off the body. I won't have felt that bad if they simply kept their mouth shut.

Arnab
May 12, 2004, 02:12 PM
Well, this will definitely be used as an excuse for a long time.

WI2debone
May 12, 2004, 03:32 PM
Someone sent me the video link ..... it was barbaric ..... simply no regard for human life!!!!!

rassel
May 12, 2004, 04:18 PM
Originally posted by WI2debone
Someone sent me the video link ..... it was barbaric ..... simply no regard for human life!!!!!

A little bit of advice! You don't want to see that:-/

[Edited on 12-5-2004 by rassel]

Carte Blanche
May 12, 2004, 04:24 PM
I've seen worse actually :wow:

rafiq
May 12, 2004, 05:36 PM
people are basically animals, they just pretend not to be most of the time. if you videotaped some of the atrocities that went on around the world only this morning, it would make for pretty grim footage. I don't even want to see that video. Today there are more sinister pictures of the prison abuse that have been released. I feel like we are in a time warp and what was a somewhat sane and normal world has been turned upside down for all of us.

Tehsin
May 12, 2004, 10:05 PM
A good number of human beings are simply barbaric. What they did to Berg was inhuman and the only justice would be an even worse death to those five killers. In fact, their punishment should be worse for bringing Islam down with them.

As far as the Iraqi prison abuse, the GIs will prolly be court marshalled.

When is the muslim world going to wake up and take care of the filth amongst us? We do not have any leadership at all. It's hard to say that Islam is the religion of peace when these killers chant Allahu Akbar while they kill (saw off rather) an unarmed man with his hand tied behind his back. more on Berg (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040513/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq_berg&cid=540&ncid=716)

Anyways, this is the election year in the US so there will be more dirt surfacing in the US media in the next few months.

fab
May 12, 2004, 10:13 PM
When is the muslim world going to wake up and take care of the filth amongst us? We do not have any leadership at all.
Won't happen dude. Not only are there too many apologists and too much of the finger pointing/assign the blame elsewhere type mentality amongst us, but what you suggest implies reform. Reform and Islam? You know these two words cannot be uttered in the same sentence!

Arnab
May 12, 2004, 10:19 PM
I don't think it's a problem of the muslim world as a whole.

And you cannot reform religions.

Also, Berg is not the first man to be killed like that. Just because its shown on TV doesn't mean this hasn't happened before.

fab
May 12, 2004, 10:25 PM
I don't think it's a problem of the muslim world as a whole.
The muslim world isn't devoid of its own problems either.. I just don't see much being done about it internally.
And you cannot reform religions. No, but you can reform its structure, practices etc. E.g. in Indonesia their head mullah has deemed suicide bombing has haram.
Also, Berg is not the first man to be killed like that. Just because its shown on TV doesn't mean this hasn't happened before. It just makes it easier to publicise... Look, 25 prisoners have died in US custody. I'm assuming they had a similar fate as the unfortunate Berg. But just because it's happened before, doesn't make it right.

Arnab
May 12, 2004, 10:29 PM
Well, it's definitely not right.

But you can think of it as "collateral damage." Or to use the capitalist term: a "negative externality".

The murderers have taken FULL RESPONSIBILITY for their crime, just like Rumsfeld. What more do you want?

fab
May 12, 2004, 10:40 PM
The murderers have taken FULL RESPONSIBILITY for their crime, just like Rumsfeld. What more do you want?
What? Is that supposed to be tongue in cheek?

Arnab
May 12, 2004, 10:52 PM
damn, forgot my sarcasm green.

Tehsin
May 12, 2004, 10:58 PM
amar bhoi holo - jodi cheleta amader desher koshai der haat e porto tahole beparta kemon hoto bhebe dekho. Amader 'bhaiya'ra OBL er trained army ke lojja dibey.

rafiq
May 12, 2004, 11:03 PM
OK time to clear the decks, looks like another farnab tussle brewing. one thing though - religion can be reformed and always has been through history. very slow but possible. it's not so much that religion needs to be reformed here, the religion may be fine as it is, it is more the illegal hijacking and misinterpretation of it by the ultra righteous few who think they are the many.

sage
May 13, 2004, 08:33 AM
This thread makes a point clear that we still have the sense of right and wrong. It is encouraging to see that muslims come out and critisize other muslims babaric actions. I feel numb to see that anybody can believe that this is a way to serve god.

sage
May 13, 2004, 08:43 AM
Originally posted by fab

The muslim world isn't devoid of its own problems either.. I just don't see much being done about it internally.


Reform has to come from the bottom level. Mullah's will not encourage reform ever. When people start to see the brutality,ignorence in their own shadow and take corrective measure collectively that appear as reform. I can see it happening slowly.

Carte Blanche
May 13, 2004, 09:46 AM
For those of you who have watched the full video, have you wondered how come there is no blood at all in the video? There was not a single drop of blood seen in the video. Even the guy who ran the knife, didn't have blood in his hands. I heard Berg's screams, so I doubt he was dead already. But how come he wasn't throwing his arms and legs around, and how come there was no blood gushing?

rafiq
May 13, 2004, 11:25 AM
Originally posted by sage
This thread makes a point clear that we still have the sense of right and wrong. It is encouraging to see that muslims come out and critisize other muslims babaric actions. I feel numb to see that anybody can believe that this is a way to serve god.


I disagree. The problem with the whole shebang is that the good, obedient Muslim never speaks up out of fear. This allows a climate of tolerance for atrocious behavior. The ones who consider themselves the most religiously grounded will never ever come to this thread and say, "damn, that was bad thing". They will stay silent, and their silence speaks volumes.

CB, I didn't see the video but that could be a good point, where are you going with that, speak freely.

Arnab
May 13, 2004, 11:25 AM
Originally posted by Carte Blanche
For those of you who have watched the full video, have you wondered how come there is no blood at all in the video? There was not a single drop of blood seen in the video. Even the guy who ran the knife, didn't have blood in his hands. I heard Berg's screams, so I doubt he was dead already. But how come he wasn't throwing his arms and legs around, and how come there was no blood gushing?


OOOH The plot thickens. Now I want to see the video. Carte man, you haven't read any holocaust revisionist books recently, have you?

fab
May 13, 2004, 06:04 PM
Cart so you think he was dead before the beheading? (he certainly was killed since his body was found)

Nascer
May 14, 2004, 12:09 AM
[Edited on 6-9-2004 by Nascer]

Rubu
May 14, 2004, 12:37 AM
Originally posted by Carte Blanche
For those of you who have watched the full video, have you wondered how come there is no blood at all in the video? There was not a single drop of blood seen in the video. Even the guy who ran the knife, didn't have blood in his hands. I heard Berg's screams, so I doubt he was dead already. But how come he wasn't throwing his arms and legs around, and how come there was no blood gushing?

this is exactly what i was looking for! when the prisoner abuse scandal came out, it was inavitable that something like this HAS TO be discovered. the question is, discovered or invented? my sincere apology if this thing actually happen. but i can't forget the vedio shown several times on tv after 9/11 attack where muslim girls are dancing on street. it was shown that that video was because they were happy about what had happened. BUT, if u still remember that video, it showed broad daylight. the reality is, since the attack and the broadcast of video, this arab region was from almost night to night. this is not my analogy, its actually been proven by an american university, don't know the source. as for that reason, i won't take this video too seriously. people who can kill thousand for the name of peace and use WMD for the excuse of having WMD, they can do anything.

al Furqaan
May 16, 2004, 11:16 PM
i have not seen the video nor do i wish to do so out of fear of being sick for the next several days (and i have a very strong stomach for violence).

this was indeed a cowardly act, but most of you people fail to realize what causes people to such blatantly heinous crimes. these people are angry. angry at the west, angry at the us, angry at israel, angry at jews and christians. anger clouds the mind...it is the most potent drug. this is a flaw which is inherent among humans and islam seeks to rectify it. the fact is that muslims have let negative feelings interfere with their interpretation of their faith.

fab
May 16, 2004, 11:31 PM
That's an amusing response. Some poor white trash rednecks from West Viriginia gave the same excuse about the prisoner abuses. 'But they made us be like that. This is for 9/11'! Furqaan, do you agree with that reasoning?

These AQ twits are thick as bricks. Rumsfeld should send them flowers. Seriously, stop apologising for them.

sage
May 18, 2004, 09:57 PM
fab you are so right. Bush was in real trouble because of this abuse picture. Dumb, Stupid AQ saved Bush by this. AQ is the reason Bush might get ellected again.

AQ is the stupidest *!&# ever.

Nasif
May 19, 2004, 01:26 AM
AQs have nothing do with anything. These are lunatic morons on the loose.

sage
May 19, 2004, 02:34 AM
God forgot to put the brain on these scums,so he put a tupi on to hide the emptyness.

Arnab
May 20, 2004, 04:08 AM
Suspicious Circumstances and Timeline
-------------------------------------------------

1) A Jewish man and U.S. citizen traveling alone in Iraq?

Why did a private Jewish American citizen choose to wander around Iraq by himself? He also had a passport stamp from Israel - very unsafe to travel with.

2) Berg wanted to return home

In his last email on April 6 to his family, Berg stated he wished to return home as soon as possible. The FBI claim he refused an offer of help to get home (perhaps because of danger to get to airport).

3) Three FBI visits

The FBI made three visits to the Berg while he was in custody in Iraq. This suggest U.S. authorities were concerned about more than Berg's well-being. They may have had their own suspicions about what the young American was doing in Iraq.

4) FreeRepublic website listed the Berg business as an "Enemy of the State".
Nick Berg's father, Michael Berg, signed an anti-war petition online and included the business name. (Note that Nick Berg himself was pro-Bush and pro-war.) This occurred a week before his son's second departure to Iraq. As a result of this statement the Berg business was put on a right wing enemies list. The FreeRepublic website listed the Berg business as an "Enemy of the State." This may have been linked to the thre visits by the FBI during Nick Berg's containment by the Iraqi Police and then presumably by (or under supervision) of the US Military.

5) Family sues in U.S. and Berg released next day in Iraq

On 5 April, Berg's family filed a suit in federal court in Philadelphia - contending that their son was being held illegally by the US military in Iraq. The next day he was released and left to get himself home.

6) U.S. custody

Berg's last known whereabouts was in U.S. custody. On April 1, Beth A. Payne, the U.S. consular officer in Iraq, sent an e-mail to the family of Nick Berg. It stated that Ms. Payne had located Nick, and he was currently in custody of the US military. She wrote, "I have confirmed that your son, Nick, is being detained by the U.S. military in Mosul. He is safe. He was picked up approximately one week ago. We will try to obtain additional information regarding his detention and a contact person you can communicate with directly." (See: The Unanswered Questions of Nick Berg's Murder at antiwar.com.) This is distinct from the next point...

7) Denial of custody

The US military has stated that Berg was never in US custody and that he had been in custody of the Iraqi police. The Iraqi police adamantly deny he was ever in their custody. (See again: The Unanswered Questions of Nick Berg's Murder.) If this is so, we have to conclude that either the email from Ms. Payne was incorrect or that the US military has been lying.

8) Apprehension of Berg

Berg was mysteriously captured while still wearing jumpsuit. Either he escaped from U.S. captors or U.S. let him out -- with orange suit and all -- to be immediately apprehended by "terrorists" (before he had a chance to change). Or, the captors somehow came across a U.S. military prison jumpsuit. (More on this is below.) This scenario contradicts the following:

9) Was Berg at hotel several days to April 10?

Staff at Al-Fanar Hotel in Baghdad apparently told The Associated Press that Berg stayed there for several days until April 10. A U.S. consul contract worker checked at the hotel on 4/14 and staff there did not remember Berg.

10) Family blames detainment by U.S. military for Berg's death

The last time the family heard from Nick Berg was on 9 April. He had planned to return home at the end of March. His headless body was found near Mosul on 8 May. "That's really what cost my son his life, the fact that the United States government saw fit to keep him in custody for 13 days without any of his due process or civil rights," Michael Berg said.

Timing of Killing and Videotape Release

11) Berg is killed before torture photos
released but video tape refers to photos?
To quote "Fishy Circumstances and Flawed Timelines Surround American's Beheading)":
"me and a friend were discussing recent news events and trying to piece together the information presented to us, thought you might want to look into this further, they said in the news that Nicholas Berg was killed 2 weeks ago (i think), however in the video the culprits who killed him said they were "avenging iraqi prisoner abuse" but those photos weren't released until last week, so my question is how is that even a possible motive if he was killed prior to the abuse photos being released?? maybe i am misinformed but thought id ask the question to someone who would look into it."

12) Text with video mentions "shameful pictures"

The text posted to the website along with the video the translation of the Arabic statement, cites "shameful pictures." Here is a translation of the Arabic statement (at the Northeast Intelligence Network) made with the video: "And the shameful pictures and the news of the evil humiliation of the Islam people men and women in Ghareb 's father prison then where the jealousy and where the zeal and where the anger about the Allah's religion and where the jealousy for the Muslims sanctities and where the revenge for the honors of Muslims and Muslims is in the crosses prisons."

13) Wag the dog timing

There is extremely convenient 'wag the dog' timing at the height of furor regarding U.S. torture of Iraqis.

14) Torture photo timing

CNN poll question: 'Is the Berg killing a reason for withholding any remaining Iraq prisoner abuse pictures?' Bush has been reported to be struggling with question of whether the Pentagon should release additional torture photos. Given that the alleged decapitation of Berg was allegedly prompted by the first wave of torture photos, Bush could now cite 'national security' issues for withholding additional materials.

Videotape of Berg, His Decapitation, and Location

15) Orange jumpsuit

Berg shown in video wearing orange jumpsuit known to be of U.S. issue. The orange jump suit "appears" to be identical to the jumpsuits used at Guantanamo. (Compare with pictures at Guantanamo.) The orange jumpsuit was standard US military issue to men in custody. It is unlikely Berg would continue wearing a U.S. custodial uniform if he had been released by the military as they claim. The fact he was still wearing the suit is both anomalous and suggestive. One wonders: Was there an immediate transfer of Berg from the US military to unknown persons, preventing Berg from discarding his US prison garb?

16) No blood at decapitation

When Berg is decapitated, there was almost no blood. If Berg were still alive at this point, with the cut starting at front of throat, blood would have been spraying everywhere. Berg's severed head, the floor, Berg's clothes, and even the hand of the 'Arab' who decapitated Berg had no visible blood on it. When the executioner holds up Berg's head immediately following what is represented as an actual decapitation of a living person, there is no significant blood flow from the neck or blood splatters showing anywhere on the executioner.

17) Berg did not move

Berg seems limp just before the beheading. It is not clear if he was moving after the time skip in the tape. While on the ground, Berg's body didn't seem move except in response to the captors movements. Although held down, Berg would have tried to instinctively wiggle and writhe away from captor's grip and use of a knife. (That is unless he was long dead after the cut in the tape.) A surgeon would very likely testify that the beheading did not cause the death.

18) Berg may have been dead just before beheading

The lack of spurting blood and lack of movement suggests Berg was already dead at the time of the alleged decapitation. During the beheading, Berg's eyes are not seen. Camera angle made it impossible to see if Berg's eyes were open or glassy. Berg very probably was killed before the staged beheading. Did the captors have no stomach for the beheading of a living person?

19) Straight cut on the neck

The cut on Berg's neck seems to be too straight to have been done crudely and with such speed by a man wielding a large knife. Anybody who has carved a turkey knows there is something wrong with the supposed beheading. The suspended head looks more like Berg had been neatly beheaded by a guillotine.

20) Is the person in the video Berg?

Some viewers believe the person in the video only vaguely resembles Berg. (Note: presumably the family can and will identify Berg's voice and appearance.)

21) Chair

The chair that Berg was seated in during the filming was the exact same kind as seen in a color photo taken at the Abu Ghraib Prison. One blog mentioned this was "a standard issue military chair." However, these chairs might be abundant in Iraq. (See photo comparisons at link in next point.)

22) Walls and baseboard at the killing site same color as some in Abu Ghraid prison
However, many walls may be similar in Iraq. To quote Marc Perkel (It's The Same Chair!!!! OMFG!!):
"I have some more pics but the walls are the same yellow color and the baseboard is the same color as Abu Ghraib prison."

More Videotape Anomalies

23) The videotape was quite blurred.

24) A quickly disappearing video source?
A Reuters journalist in Dubai first named the Muntada al-Ansar al-Islami website as the source for the video - at www.al-ansar.biz. Although the site has now been shut down, Aljazeera.net had looked at the site within ninety minutes of the story breaking - and could find no such video footage. But Fox News, CNN and the BBC were all able to download the footage from the Arabic-only website and report the story within the hour.

25) Tape editing

The video tape is obviously spliced together and heavily edited: Going from a) Berg sitting in chair talking about family, to b) Berg sitting on floor with hooded "militants" behind, to c) blurry camera movement, to d) almost motionless Berg on floor as head cut off.

26) Long time jump in datestamp

There is a significant time jump on tape from a datestamp in the tape of about 2:44:40 to about 13:45:47. There could have been two cameras recording this event. However, there were changes in dress after the fact that would lead to the idea of an elapsed time.

27) Scream dubbed in: Screaming starts while Berg is not moving and before he is touched

Whatever the mismatch in the speaker and video (next point), videotape cognoscenti have said the scream was amateurishly dubbed into the tape. The writer of this K5 article reviewed this issue closely: The screaming starts (at 4:31 - on the copy I viewed, not the time stamp) about 5 to 6 seconds before Berg is touched (at 4:36) and he is moved to his side. He is just sitting there like a lump. While the screaming commences for (1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 seconds), his head doesn't move and his mouth doesn't appear to move (though the tape is blurry), nor does he seem to be physically screaming at any time. Yet the audio plays a loud vigorous screaming. The exact same dubbed screaming continues after the long time jump and a bit of a time gap with silence and after some cutting on the head, during which Berg is not moving. This screaming seems clearly dubbed and is highly incongruous with Berg's lack of activity.

28) Handling of papers on video

"Terrorist" reader flips through pages of 'statement' at one point. He keeps ending up on the same page for awhile. As noted below, this would very likely produce a gap in speech, which is out of sync with the smooth timing of the spoken statement.

29) Audio is dubbed: Tape of speaker and video are out of sync

Audio experts note the tape is clearly dubbed. The speaker recording is different from executioner video recording, due to lag between audio and video.
From "In the Absence of Truth from the White House, Conspiracy Theories Emerge About the Nick Berg Murder" at buzzflash.com:
"Analysis of Execution video -- I propose that the executioner's voice (according to my analysis of listening closely to the audio feed) is not that of the killer's. When listening to the executioner's voice on the tape one first notes that there is a 2-3 second lag in the "time" between audio and video, audio leading. This is consistent with the argument that the video camera and tape recorder are actually two different recording devices. What convinced me that the executioner could not be the "voice" behind the document, read prior to Nick Berg's execution, is the lack of consistency seen between the video and audio recordings, even if the 2-3 second delay is considered. A careful viewing of the video shows the executioner on "several occasions" fumbling with the 2 pages that he held, and at times reading the same page over again -- or so it appears. At least 4 times during the video the executioner is "turning over" pages, holding the pages "apart" as if confused, and all of this adds up to one conclusion. There should have been a "pause" or "2-3 second delay" in the reading of the documents during the physical handling of the documents -- but none is found that is long enough to account for it. Conclusion: The executioner is not "reading" the document. Someone else is. The executioner is trying his best to "lip sinc" the reading, but fails miserably on close inspection. The "smooth" reading of the document is entirely inconsistent (according my analysis of the video) and therefore cannot be the same person that is recording into the audio device."

30) Berg identification - why?

Berg goes to great trouble to identify himself, providing information about his family. Why? To elicit greater sympathy? Or to provide a positive ID. FBI visited Berg family in an attempt to 'verify his identity'. The guy in video looks little like Berg photos provided by family.

31) Woman's scream, instead of Berg?

The alleged scream on heard on the tape has been interpreted as a woman's scream by viewers. (The scream did not seem to this K5 article's author necessarily to be in a woman's voice.)

32) Mistranslation of Al Qaeda connection

On the first day of Nick Berg's execution, it was reported on several major news networks that al Qaeda was connected to the killer's statement, which turned out to be false. The US Intelligence translation still retains this "reference" to al Qaeda, which does not exist. The U.S. government translation of one statement made on the film is: "Does al Qaeda need any further excuses?" This is a falsification. The actual statement urged fellow insurgents to get off their hind ends and do something. One assumes the translator used by the US military is a native speaker of Arabic, so this may not be an innocent flub. Did the US government intentionally link an alleged al Qaeda group into the murder of Nick Berg? Note: the word on tape was al qaed, with quite a different meaning from al Qaeda.

Identity of Killers of Berg and Their Possessions

33) Western body posture and mannerisms of "terrorists"

The "terrorists" have Western-style body posture and mannerisms. They seem to be at parade rest at times.

34) "Terrorists" were fat

Several of the men in the film were fat by Iraqi standards. If they were Feyadeen or Mujahadeen, they probably have been living underground since the first days of the occupation. Tens of thousands of Iraqis have been shown on news stories as they have marched and demonstrated. One would be hard pressed to point out a single fat man among these thousands.

35) White hands of "terrorists"

Some of the "Arab terrorists" have pasty-white hands and (other exposed) skin. One would be hard pressed to find Arab men with pasty-white hands. (See: Nick Berg Conspiracy Theories Abound.)

36) Wrong accent

Al-Zarqawi is/was Jordinian. Arab linguists have said the man posing as Al-Zarqawi did not speak with a Jordanian dialect. Others have suggested the man reading the written statement may not have been a native speaker of Arabic.

37) Change in masks by beheader

To quote a K5 comment:
"The guy who holds up the head at the end has a white mask and no vest. The guy who pulls out the knife and starts cutting is in a black mask. The only guy with a white mask is wearing a green vest"

38) Voice id

Al-Zarqawi's identification by the CIA was based on "probable" voice id of the videotape.

39) Al-Zarqawi's missing leg

Al-Zarqawi was missing one leg. Al-Zarqawi allegedly wears a prosthetic device, according to previous CIA reports. (See: IHT Protrait of Al-Zarqawi.) There is no evidence that the killer wore a prosthetic device. Further, Al-Zarqawi had been outfitted with an artificial leg that did not fit or function properly. He was unable to walk or stand normally. No man in the group showed evidence of such infirmity.

40) Missing tattoos?

Large green tattooed "dots" are known to be on the back of Abu Musab Zarqawi's left hand. These tattoos cannot be seen in the close up video of the execution, though the back of his hand is fairly visible. (See: IHT Protrait of Al-Zarqawi.)

41) Al-Zarqawi dead?

Numerous indigenous sources have said Al-Zarqawi was killed by a US helicopter attack months ago when he was unable to move quickly enough to escape the targeted house. While others managed to exit the house in time to survive, he died in the collapsed building.

42) Gold ring on killer's hand

The man in the videotape who is purported to be Zarqawi seems to be wearing a gold ring. Note: This is a questionable point. To quote Healing Iraq (healingiraq.blogspot.com) as quoted at this angryfinger.org post (Nick Berg Conspiracy Theories Abound): "Islam does not specifically forbid that men wear gold, in fact the Quran and the Hadith have encouraged men to 'adorn' and 'embellish' themselves (dying hair, perfume, etc.) .... the practice of wearing gold ornaments is discouraged by Muslim clerics, "Gold is the ornament of women". Socially it is not acceptable in the Arab world for men to wear gold, although this has changed lately and many young men do (engagement and wedding rings are mostly gold)."

43) Why anonymous?

Al-Zarqawi's face is very well-known. If Al-Zarqawi was the perpetrator, why did he bother to cover it the whole time? If Al-Zarqawi is trying to build a resistance movement, why did he not uncover his face at some point? (If it was another terrorist impersonating Al-Zarqawi, why is the CIA identifying the voice as Al-Zarqawi's?)

44) Iraqi denial of "terrorists"

Iraqis who have seen the videotape on Arabic news broadcasts are universally saying the men in the film are not Iraqis. Are they saying this partly because the speaker does not employ an Iraqi dialect? Where does their certainty come from?

45) Firearms Israeli, not AK-47s

Firearms experts have stated the AK-47 carried by one man was a "Galil." This actually is an Israeli-made weapon that improves on the famous AK- 47. Feyadeen and other insurgents use AK-47s.

Berg's Activities and Return of the Body

46) Berg encountered Moussaoui, an al Qaeda operative, by chance in the U.S. in 1999

The FBI has reported (CNN, FOX) that Nick Berg's e-mail account was used by the "20th hijacker" of 9-11, Zacarious Moussaoui, whose computer held evidence of the 9-11 hijackers (and could not be searched by the FBI field office because of orders from Washington). The FBI interviewed Nick Berg about Moussaoui's use of his e-mail account to send "emails" but concluded that it was entirely "coincidental." Berg had apparently given the password to his e-mail account to an acquaintance of Moussaoui who he met on a bus in 1999 in Oklahoma. (See: Berg's encounter with 'terrorist' revealed.)

47) Berg's first visit to Iraq

Source: In the Absence of Truth from the White House, Conspiracy Theories Emerge About the Nick Berg Murder in http://www.buzzflash.com letters:
"In the Seattle Post-Intelligencer (Seattle P-I), May 13, 2004, A4, appeared an AP article by Robert H. Reid entitled: "Questions over beheading victim's travel in Iraq." That article, which is not online, says: "Berg first worked in Iraq in December and January and returned in March. He was inspecting communications facilities, some of which were destroyed in the war or by looters. During his time in Iraq, he worked on a tower in Abu Ghraib, site of the prison where U.S. soldiers abused Iraqi inmates."
And from The Guardian [Questions Surround Slain American in Iraq] here is a similar reference:
Perhaps Nick saw too much when he was at the prison repairing the tower. And/or maybe that work required close collaboration with the military intelligence onsite so that he learned too much.
Also, today's NY Times article entitled: "General Took Guantanamo Rules To Iraq for Handling of Prisoners" by Tim Golden and Eric Schmitt says:
"When Major General Geoffrey D. Miller arrived in Iraq last August with a team of military police and intelligence specialists, the group was confronted by chaos."
"In one prison yard, a detainee was being held in a scorching hot shipping container as punishment, one member of the team recalled. An important communications antenna stood broken and unrepaired."

48) Work vs. no work?

It has been reported all week in the media that Nick Berg was "looking for business" for his small telecommunications business. Some of his friends in Iraq who were interviewed reportedly said "business was booming." Yet others said Nick was leaving because he "couldn't find any work."

49) Berg traveled at night

It has been reported by people who knew Nick in Iraq (interviews, major networks) that strangely enough, Nick "traveled" at night. Indeed, when Nick was initially picked up by Iraqi Police (checkpoint) he was held because of "suspicious activity."

50) Berg's family was not allowed to view the body of Berg on its arrival to the U.S.

Carte Blanche
May 20, 2004, 12:14 PM
Many many thanks to Arnab for posting this. I read this article 4 days ago, but decided not to post this following some controversy over moderation here. Who knows, moderators might find it too graphic for the site.

Anyway, they have some very strong points here, specially the discrepancies of timestamp, wrong mask, accent etc. However, some of their points are very weak, specially 31, 34, 45, 39.

I have gone through the video many many times, and it sounds convincing enough to me. As a matter of fact in my earlier post I raised a question about lack of blood. I also found an article where a British surgeon proves this beheading "fake", i.e. beheading an already dead man. I will try to look for the link again. I found www.rense.com pretty interesting. Although it reeks of Anti-Bushism, you will find some interesting articles there.

By the way, isn't wearing Gold proscribed in Islam? They made it sound like it is very much permissible, but discouraged.

rafiq
May 20, 2004, 04:45 PM
Item 46 is entirely unbeliveable - you don't give your password to people you meet on buses.

So what's the thesis here - Berg was killed by the Americans? If so what have you heard from Al Quaeda and other interested terrorist groups in the area? I think they would have something to say about it.

fab
May 20, 2004, 11:45 PM
Very interesting theories, but a lot of it is all conjecture based on information from blog discussions (of all sources!) I'm no fan of the reliability of US media but come on, a decent level of credibility would be nice.

Tehsin
May 21, 2004, 11:58 PM
Wonder what the US conservative talk show hosts would think about these theories. Anyone willing to email this things to people like Michael Savage (tought but sometimes understanding), Glenn Back (pretty fair) or Laura Ingraham (Bush's self-appointed lapdog) from one of my favs - AM 570 (website (http://www.wtntam570.com/main.html) ?

Arnab
May 22, 2004, 12:04 AM
Originally posted by fab
Very interesting theories, but a lot of it is all conjecture based on information from blog discussions (of all sources!) I'm no fan of the reliability of US media but come on, a decent level of credibility would be nice.

Well, those are obvioulsy conjectures. But most of them make sense. The good thing about the list is that it doesn't launch into a conspiracy theory, but just points out the discrepancies.

It dosn't prove anything per se. It just shows that there are many glaring discrepancies NOT discussed in the media, yet we are supposed to believe their version of the story and jump to the conclusions provided by them, which they, in turn, probably got from the pentagon.

Nasif
May 22, 2004, 02:11 AM
Wow, what an article. Didn't get to read it before. Just finished it.

Thanks Arnab for posting this.

TigerFan
May 22, 2004, 05:35 PM
Thanks Arnab for the article. I have a question, were there any responses from the iraqi insurgents about this beheading?

[Edited on 22-5-2004 by TigerFan]

crickipagol
May 23, 2004, 06:22 AM
These are called conspiracy theories, and do not hold water in the BushWorld.

Arnab
May 23, 2004, 02:17 PM
Berg beheading: No way, say medical experts

By Ritt Goldstein

American businessman Nicholas Berg's body was found on May 8 near a Baghdad overpass; a video of his supposed decapitation death by knife appeared on an alleged al-Qaeda-linked website (www.al-ansar.biz) on May 11. But according to what both a leading surgical authority and a noted forensic death expert separately told Asia Times Online, the video depicting the decapitation appears to have been staged.

"I certainly would need to be convinced it [the decapitation video] was authentic," Dr John Simpson, executive director for surgical affairs at the Royal Australasian College of Surgeons, said from New Zealand. Echoing Dr Simpson's criticism, when this journalist asked forensic death expert Jon Nordby, PhD and fellow of the American Board of Medicolegal Death Investigators, whether he believed the Berg decapitation video had been "staged", Nordby replied: "Yes, I think that's the best explanation of it."

Questions of when the video's footage was taken, and the time elapsed between the shooting of the video's segments, were raised by both experts, reflecting a portion of the broader and ongoing video controversy. Nordby, speaking to Asia Times Online from Washington state, noted: "We don't know how much time wasn't filmed," adding that "there's no way of knowing whether ... footage is contemporaneous with the footage that follows".

While the circumstances surrounding both the video and Nick Berg's last days have been the source of substantive speculation, both Simpson and Nordby perceived it as highly probable that Berg had died some time prior to his decapitation. A factor in this was an apparent lack of the "massive" arterial bleeding such an act initiates.

"I would have thought that all the people in the vicinity would have been covered in blood, in a matter of seconds ... if it was genuine," said Simpson. Notably, the act's perpetrators appeared far from so. And separately Nordby observed: "I think that by the time they're ... on his head, he's already dead."

Providing another basis for their findings, in the course of such an assault, an individual's autonomic nervous system would react, typically doing so strongly, with the body shaking and jerking accordingly. And while Nordby noted that "they rotated and moved the head", shifting vertebrae that should have initiated such actions, Simpson said he "certainly didn't perceive any movements at all" in response to such efforts.

During the period when Berg's captors filmed the decapitation sequence, circumstances indicate that he had already been dead "a quite uncertain length of time, but more than ... however long the beheading took", Simpson stated. Both Simpson and Nordby also noted the difficulty in providing analysis based on the video, the inherent limitations presented by this. But both also felt that Berg had seemed drugged.

A particularly significant point in the video sequence occurred as Berg's captors attacked him, bringing the supposedly fatal knife to bear. "The way that they pulled him over, they could have used a dummy at that point," reflected Simpson regarding what the video portrayed. Separately, Nordby said Berg does not "appear to register any sort of surprise or any change in his facial expression when he's grabbed and twisted over, and they start to bring this weapon into use".

Subsequently, Nordby said it was likely that the filming sequence was manipulated at the point immediately preceding this, allowing Berg's corpse to be used for the decapitation sequence. Nordby also emphasized that the video "raises more questions than it answers", with the most fundamental questions of "who are you, and how did you die", being impossible to answer from it. But broad speculation exists regarding a number of factors surrounding both Berg's death and the video, and its timing in regard to revelations of US prison atrocities.

In a May 13 article, the Arabic newsgroup Aljazeera reported that a Dubai-based Reuters journalist first broke the story, "but while Fox News, CNN and the BBC" were able to secure the video from the "Arabic-only website" that hosted it, Aljazeera was unable to locate it. And also on May 13, the Associated Press (AP) reported that the US Central Intelligence Agency had determined that Abu Musab al-Zarqawi was the individual who beheaded Berg.

Since Secretary of State Colin Powell's United Nations presentation of February 5, 2003, al-Zarqawi has been portrayed as the single most dangerous element facing the Bush administration's "war on terror". Powell's UN presentation has since been widely accepted as empty; nevertheless, al-Zarqawi appears to have surpassed even Osama bin Laden as the administration's No 1 terror target. And on May 15, Brigadier-General Mark Kimmitt, the Coalition Provisional Authority's chief Iraq military spokesman, declared that al-Zarqawi will be eventually caught, though that may prove particularly difficult.

On March 4, Brigadier-General David Rodriguez of the Joint Chiefs of staff revealed that the Pentagon didn't have "direct evidence of whether he's [al-Zarqawi] alive or dead", providing commentary on the nature of prior "evidence" linking al-Zarqawi to attacks and bombings. But that same day, AP reported that an Iraqi resistance group claimed al-Zarqawi had been killed the April prior in the US bombing of northern Iraq.

Speaking off the record, intelligence community sources have previously said they believe it "very likely" that al-Zarqawi is indeed long dead. Such a fact makes al-Zarqawi's alleged killing of Berg difficult to reconcile, and there has been broad speculation that blaming al-Zarqawi is an administration ploy. Further anomalies surrounding Berg's death have fueled added speculation.

According to e-mails sent from a US consular officer in Baghdad, Beth Payne, to the Berg family, Nick Berg was being held in Iraq "by the US military in Mosul". A May 13 AP report notes that a US State Department spokesperson subsequently said this was untrue, an error, and that Berg was being held by Iraqi authorities. But another May 13 AP report quoted "police chief Major-General Mohammed Khair al-Barhawi" as claiming that reports of Iraqi police having held Berg were "baseless".

And Berg is seen on the beheading videotape in what appears to be US military prison-issue clothing, sitting in what appears to be a US military-type white chair, virtually identical to those photographed as used at Abu Ghraib prison. However, the taking of hostages has occurred in the region, and beheadings are not unheard of.

According to a February 2003 report by Human Rights Watch (HRW), on September 23, 2001, radical Islamists captured a group of 25 Kurdish fighters in the Iraqi village of Kheli Hama. "Some prisoners' throats had been slit, while others had been beheaded," HRW reported, noting that the television station KurdSat had broadcast pictures of the dead that September 26. The report also noted that a videotape "apparently filmed" by those committing the atrocities had been found.

The strict Islamist community in Iraq denied that the acts were committed by their people, stating that the incident was fabricated.

Additional reports of beheadings also exist, with the victims usually noted as killed with a bullet before the beheading occurs. But HRW's report also raised an issue that the Berg video's makers, and Berg's father, both raised: prisoner exchange.

HRW noted that Iraq's radical Islamists did pursue exchanges of captives, and the Berg video specifically noted that his captors claimed they were killing him as their attempts to exchange Berg had been rebuffed by US authorities. Berg's father, Michael, has pressed the administration of US President George W Bush as regards what the facts of this allegation are, with the administration denying any knowledge that such a trade was offered. And added questions still exist.

Because Iraq's radical Islamists speak in a particular manner, and live by a closely proscribed code, apparent contradictions between these ways and the way Berg's captors appeared has generated speculation. Some observers have speculated on the possibility that the individuals weren't native Arabic speakers. Conversely, it is reported that in Saudi Arabia, where Sharia law allows for beheadings in cases of severe crimes, the condemned is heavily drugged with tranquilizers prior to the execution, reportedly leaving them in a state similar to that which Berg appeared in during parts of the video.

Again, Nordby emphasized that the video "raises more questions than it answers".

------------

Ritt Goldstein is an American investigative political journalist based in Stockholm. His work has appeared in broadsheets such as Australia's Sydney Morning Herald, Spain's El Mundo and Denmark's Politiken, as well as with the Inter Press Service (IPS), a global news agency.

reverse_swing
June 7, 2004, 07:09 AM
WASHINGTON, June 6: The father of an American citizen beheaded in Iraq last month has said that he held the Bush administration responsible for the death of his son, Nick Berg.

Michael Berg spoke out against the administration's policies at a protest outside the White House this weekend, accusing President Bush and Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld of war crimes.

As thousands listened during a passion-filled and rain-soaked rally, Mr Berg said in a voice choking with emotions: "The men who killed my son should be arrested and subject to trial in a court of law, and if found guilty, never again be allowed to practice the brutality that cost my son his life."

He added: "But I ultimately hold the Bush administration responsible for my son's death." Mr Berg, who finds himself in a sudden media spotlight because of the brutal execution of his son, has used his higher profile to speak for peace and against the war in Iraq.

"I would do anything in the world to take back what happened to Nick," he said and added that since what had been done could not be undone, he would continue to strive for peace so that "other innocent people could be saved."

About 3,000 people had gathered outside the White House, ignoring incessant rain, to listen to Mr Beg and other speakers. The crowd cheered and chanted as Mr Berg urged President Bush to "bring the troops home now."

He spoke of the necessity for "nonviolent, direct action to stop the war," and told the audience that he had received hundreds of messages from soldiers of this war and ones before, backing the peace movement.

Referring to a historic speech by the American civil rights leader Martin Luther King, junior, Mr Berg said: "The people of America and the world have a dream and a vision now, too, and that dream is a dream of peace, a vision of all nations living together in harmony and love.

"Do not let what happened to my son and my family happen again. Stand up for peace now! ... Let's act now to stop war and end racism, and let's keep acting until we can raise a banner of peace that says, 'mission accomplished.'"

Mr Berg, a long-time peace activist, said his views differed from his son's when it came to politics and the Iraq war. "We long ago agreed to disagree, we respected each other for acting on our beliefs."

Mr Berg came to the rally wearing a brown polo shirt that belonged to his son. A way of keeping him close, he said. "I would like to ask (Mr Bush) if it is true that Al Qaeda offered to trade my son's life for the life of another person," said Mr Berg referring to a statement one of the executioners read while slaying his son.

In the statement the executioner said they were killing Nick Berg because the Bush administration refused to accept their demand. "If that is true, well, I need that information, and I think the people of the US need to know what the fate of their sons and daughters might be in the hands of the Bush administration," he said.
-Dawn