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Shish Ahmed
August 2, 2004, 06:59 AM
Minazul Abedin who played in 99 World Cup should be bought back to bat in the middle order and lend his experience in batting english conditions before.

He can't do anyworse!! It will give Kapali or someone else a bit of a rest.????

capslock
August 2, 2004, 11:55 AM
Why stop there? Put in Faruque Ahmed at number 3.

Bangla Mostan
August 2, 2004, 12:42 PM
We need Akram Khan...although he was an average player bearing in mind his outstanding size, he was nevetheless an excellent dictator on and off the field, which allowed the players to focus.

That is a true leaership role played out by Big Akram and it would be useful to bring him back....

+ point..it would be hard to get him out as well...since the ball would either get stuck in his stomach ...or he would either smash them away, as he is or was our only true big hitter, something we fans are dying to see more of...like Englands Flintoff....:flag:

Nasif
August 2, 2004, 12:50 PM
Bringing back those guys won't slove any problem.

Bangla Mostan
August 2, 2004, 02:06 PM
Originally posted by nasif
Bringing back those guys won't slove any problem.

But it may bring back the dictatorship a captain must have, which Bashar has not been showing both on and off the field.

He has admitted to not playing to his potential, but he must show more of a leadership than he currently is showing.

If this is the best he is can show then we should consider someone else, either Mashud again?

chinaman
August 2, 2004, 02:23 PM
Nice going guys.
I've yet to hear complains about Bashar's leadership or onfield captaincy unless you say he failed to motivate and bring out the best from his men. His test performance is still way above the rest and his odi performance was never good enough.

We want steady supply of more runs from these boys. They need more batting training, both specialised and routine. Leadership is not a problem at this point IMHO.

rafiq
August 2, 2004, 02:31 PM
How about opening the bowling with Golam Nawsher Prince and Hasibul Hossain Shanto, with Dipu Roy Chowdhury as a fiery (if just a tad fatter) change bowler? Now that is a lineup sure to send shivers down the opposition's spine!

Look forward, folks.

Habibul_bashar
August 2, 2004, 02:33 PM
Originally posted by chinaman
Nice going guys.
I've yet to hear complains about Bashar's leadership or onfield captaincy unless you say he failed to motivate and bring out the best from his men. His test performance is still way above the rest and his odi performance was never good enough.

We want steady supply of more runs from these boys. They need more batting training, both specialised and routine. Leadership is not a problem at this point IMHO.
You are r.......chinaman
Bashar is the man who have get 2074 runs in test.
He also best cap.... for bangladesh.

Piranha
August 2, 2004, 02:40 PM
I accept that Nannu, Aminul and co were given the boot too early. They should have hing around for a couple of more years. Having gone down the wrong road, it makes even less sense now to go back and make another mistake.

We are stuck with the current crop of players for better or for worse in the near term. Looking back will not do anyone any good.

mahbubH
August 2, 2004, 03:01 PM
Originally posted by rafiq
How about opening the bowling with Golam Nawsher Prince and Hasibul Hossain Shanto, with Dipu Roy Chowdhury as a fiery (if just a tad fatter) change bowler? Now that is a lineup sure to send shivers down the opposition's spine!

Look forward, folks.
what about the fastest bowler of Bangladesh : Ziaul Islam Masud........

Habibul_bashar
August 2, 2004, 03:12 PM
Originally posted by sports_fan_bd
Originally posted by rafiq
How about opening the bowling with Golam Nawsher Prince and Hasibul Hossain Shanto, with Dipu Roy Chowdhury as a fiery (if just a tad fatter) change bowler? Now that is a lineup sure to send shivers down the opposition's spine!

Look forward, folks.
what about the fastest bowler of Bangladesh : Ziaul Islam Masud........
What about the fast bowler of bd:Mashrafe Mortaza (Kowshik)

Bangla Mostan
August 2, 2004, 03:41 PM
Mashrafe is currently recovering from the injury so he would be very rusty and would need to gain back match fitnes as well as experience level.

We should keep current crop of fast bowlers, but as for sustaining the middle order we might need experienced players to be the backbone for the team.:flag:

TAIF
August 2, 2004, 03:49 PM
Who is Ziaul Islam Masud and how fast is he???

Zobair
August 2, 2004, 03:56 PM
I think he is a member of our site :D He just wants to keep his ID secret because he will get mobbed :D:D:D innit sports_fan_bd? ;) However, I may be wrong.


Originally posted by TAIF
Who is Ziaul Islam Masud and how fast is he??? :P

Navarene
August 2, 2004, 04:53 PM
Originally posted by TAIF
Who is Ziaul Islam Masud and how fast is he???
Masud was a former right hand medium pace bowler of BD national team. The last time I saw him play for Dhaka Mohamedan in Dhaka league in late 80's(if my memory doesn't betray me). He was a bald headed decent medium fast with less focused among the then national players.

Masud's Stats:

ICC Trophy Career Batting and Fielding (1979)
M I NO Runs HS Ave 100 50 Ct
4 3 1 27 15* 13.50 0 0 1

ICC Trophy Career Bowling (1979)

Balls Mdns Runs Wkts BB Ave 4wI 5wI SRate Econ
222 7 102 5 2-17 20.40 0 0 44.40 2.75
Source (http://www.cricketarchive.co.uk/Archive/Players/49/49111/49111.html)

fwullah
August 3, 2004, 01:22 AM
We need those trio (Bulbul, Akram, Nannu) to return to the national team as batting advisers.

Bulbul is currently in Australia, Akram stays in Chittagong (probably) most of his times that when he's not playing cricket, and Nannu is busy with his cricket academy (probably).

What we need, is for them to just sit somewhere once a week when the national team is not on a tour, and just have a nice chat with the national players, - you know, just say hi, how things were before, and now how things are now, what kind of difficulties that they used to face, and the difficulties that the current players are facing, how to get rid of these difficulties, give their 'friendly' suggestions etc.

It is not only them, but also the other players who have played Test cricket - like Enamul Haque Moni, Naimur Rahman Durjoy to just come and have a chit-chat with the current players once a month, if not once a week.

But the main question is, who will arrange this? The board? They'd probably say - Khaya Daya kam nai, khamakha jhamela. So may be it could be a voluntary thing to do?

Flip Master Mick
August 3, 2004, 01:44 AM
I have to agree with most of you who are against bringing back the likes of Bulbul, Nannu, Akram, etc. I do agree that they were forced to retire a tad early, especially with the nascent state of our development as far as the game is concerned. I also must add that their performance was not much different from the showing of our present players, hence, I feel, it is fruitless to even talk about the foregone stars of our team. If we must bring some of the more seasoned players back in contention for the national squad, players like Mehrab Hussain, Al Shehriar, Mohammad Sharif, Hasib-ul-Hussain come to mind, of course they all need a full fledged rehabilitation program to even be considered for the ‘A’ team.

fwullah... I couldn't add more to your thoughts, but someone has to take the initiative, since the word "volunteer" is not so commonly used in our culture.

sasharif
August 3, 2004, 04:25 AM
It is true Akram has retired officiallyand in no mood to return and ouot of practice. Nannu has officially retired from ODI but expressed his desire to play test. Aminul did not retire at all. Both Aminul and Nannu are inform. Nannu was the highest scorer in the CCL and Aminul is playing in Australia. I am sure they will be more than happy to joint the national team if asked to. this is not a long term solution. But we need some pride back in the short term. please let us not fool ourselves with too many teen age sensations. I am sure they can not do worse than Faisal and Alok etc. Their foot work and shot selection were no worse. And I am sure they played with more responsibility and pride than Bashar. It is no shame to acknoledge mistakes and learn from Kenya.

Ahmed_B
August 3, 2004, 05:05 AM
Originally posted by fwullah
What we need, is for them to just sit somewhere once a week when the national team is not on a tour, and just have a nice chat with the national players...... may be it could be a voluntary thing to do?

Good idea.. that u said our team needs direct inputs/guidance from these experienced seniors. I also think it will be very valuable for the newcomers as these seniors know very well the technical/mental weaknesses of players from our country.

But it can't be done in a casual/voluntary fashion .. rather shud be an official part of the training program.

like ... mayb... the way Bob Woolmer decided to incorporate Miandad in the coaching of PAK team after he was appointed.

Shish Ahmed
August 3, 2004, 05:27 AM
Sasharif,

I totally agree with your remarks. I could not have expalined it better.

May i also add it is players like Nannu, Bulbul that played their guts out in the ICC Trophy to eventually get BD Test Status.

[Edited on 3-8-2004 by SHISH AHMED]

PoorFan
August 3, 2004, 07:31 AM
Originally posted by sasharif
It is true Akram has retired officiallyand in no mood to return and ouot of practice. Nannu has officially retired from ODI but expressed his desire to play test. Aminul did not retire at all. Both Aminul and Nannu are inform. Nannu was the highest scorer in the CCL and Aminul is playing in Australia. I am sure they will be more than happy to joint the national team if asked to. this is not a long term solution. But we need some pride back in the short term. please let us not fool ourselves with too many teen age sensations. I am sure they can not do worse than Faisal and Alok etc. Their foot work and shot selection were no worse. And I am sure they played with more responsibility and pride than Bashar. It is no shame to acknoledge mistakes and learn from Kenya.
Not a bad idea, for a short time solution.
what was Aminuls performance just before he dropped? was bad as I recall.
And what is his performance at the moment?
I dont know but, bring him back could be interesting. As long as we have to do something!

[Edited on 3-8-2004 by PoorFan]

Habibul_bashar
August 3, 2004, 07:34 AM
Now whare is Aminuls? what he do? :-/

sasharif
August 3, 2004, 07:39 AM
Aminul is in Australia now. I only know of his 2 recent scores in victorian league, 52 and not out 38. Not sure about the other scores.

sasharif
August 3, 2004, 07:50 AM
in his last ODI he scored 31 runs in 42 balls against Pakistan and BD manged to score 220 runs. Remember those days when Atahar, Aminul, minhazul, Akram palyed together and BD used to score between 190 - 230 regularly. And now our score is between 130-180.

PoorFan
August 3, 2004, 07:52 AM
Originally posted by sasharif
Aminul is in Australia now. I only know of his 2 recent scores in victorian league, 52 and not out 38. Not sure about the other scores.
Seems good, but need more information to convince.
Atleast better than most of our top order!
Thank you sasharif.

PoorFan
August 3, 2004, 08:04 AM
Originally posted by sasharif
in his last ODI he scored 31 runs in 42 balls against Pakistan and BD manged to score 220 runs. Remember those days when Atahar, Aminul, minhazul, Akram palyed together and BD used to score between 190 - 230 regularly. And now our score is between 130-180.
I could be wrong, but both Aminul and Akram was faild so often, just before
they going to be dropped.( as far I can remember)
I am not even sure, whether it was ODI or test.

rafiq
August 3, 2004, 09:44 AM
Originally posted by sasharif
in his last ODI he scored 31 runs in 42 balls against Pakistan and BD manged to score 220 runs. Remember those days when Atahar, Aminul, minhazul, Akram palyed together and BD used to score between 190 - 230 regularly. And now our score is between 130-180.

hello, I don't remember that at all. Please look at what mediocre opposition they used to play against once every 17 years to get the scores of 190-230.

Our score is not between 130-180 now as a general rule, they just had 3-4 bad games recently folks, please calm down.

Rubu
August 3, 2004, 01:41 PM
yeah, the heading of my post is the problem of all the old and new player conflict. i've seen several post about bringing back all the former stars of our national team, akram, nannu, bulbul and naimur. at least we are not asking for bowlers like gm nousheed prince! but the question is, is the old foxes any better than the ones we have now? Actually, NO. in fact, they are even worse.

the problem is, as i said expectation threshold. we did not have much expectation when they used to play. and, when they did play, all they cared for was playing 50 overs or getting a total of 200 and so on, regardless of the games nature or requirement. now, if u do'nt try to reach a goal, its really easy to have a better looking lose. but the new team at least try for the win, and may be ended up with worse result. which one u think is more positive, u decide.

moreover, the cricketing world went many many steps further since those oldies steped over. can they cope with the new techniques and all? i can't think so.

like everyone else, i'm also very very disappointed about the tiger's performance. but, i've no doubt that bringing back former starts is not a solution.

oracle
August 3, 2004, 02:23 PM
moreover, the cricketing world went many many steps further since those oldies steped over. can they cope with the new techniques and all?


Agree.

Younger sides will have an edge in terms of agility and as such they can be trained to be sharper fielders which is a "must" in international cricket. Just look at India and Sri Lanka.
Having said that, as highlighted in Shewar's piece, there shoulkd be a role for these seniors and maybe they are not contributing fully to the development process of BD cricket.

Ibrahim
August 3, 2004, 06:17 PM
Originally posted by capslock
Why stop there? Put in Faruque Ahmed at number 3.

This is the best joke in this forum

rajibpaulrana
August 3, 2004, 11:00 PM
guys dont be mad......
bringing the old players wont do any good. we all feel the same for our team. even after the westindies tour everyone was praising our team. bu one bad tournament and the whole team gets the blame...
my suggestion is get the under 19 boys in the world stage slowly...
mashrafee and shareef will be back shortly and then we will look a different team.
but one thing is for sure we shound make 2 different teams for short and long version of the game...
think for the future.....:fanflag:

sasharif
August 4, 2004, 12:48 AM
Dear all! please look at the fact. Are we telling that the current team is playing against superior oponents? Let us not forgert the players I am talking about played against likes of Wasim Akram, Walsh, Ambrose, Ranatunga, Wagh brothers, De Silva etc. I don't thins those teams were weaker than current SL, Austrlia, WI or Pak teams. How many times teh current team past 200+ in ODIs (except agianst Zim)? Talking about agility, how many catches we drop per match with thse bunch of agile fileders. All I am saying We ahve tried with teh talents, now let's put 2 people who does not have gerat talent but have better foot work and capable of scoring 30 odd runs at least. We need runs, we rather loose after scoring a respectable total, than loose by a hughe maging after pretending that we were just going for a win. Some of these players do not even know which ball to hit and which one to defend.

Navarene
August 4, 2004, 07:51 AM
Originally posted by sasharif
All I am saying We ahve tried with teh talents, now let's put 2 people who does not have gerat talent but have better foot work and capable of scoring 30 odd runs at least.
Considering the fact that both Bulbul, Akram and Nannu are in their mid 30's, I really don't see any valid reason to why these oldies should be brought back. Lets say they score 20/30 odd runs in every match. But how long do you expect them to continue playing in international arena? Another 1 year? Surely age will take its toll. What then? To kick them out and look for new bloods after an year?

BD team dont have the luxury for a temporary solution. It will bring our cricket to nowhere. We must nurture younsters for the betterment of our future cricket for a long run. The best we can do is to appoint these oldies as advisors to our young cricketers. We want their tips and experience, but not those odd 20/30 runs.

akabir77
August 4, 2004, 12:26 PM
Originally posted by sasharif
Dear all! please look at the fact. Are we telling that the current team is playing against superior oponents? Let us not forgert the players I am talking about played against likes of Wasim Akram, Walsh, Ambrose, Ranatunga, Wagh brothers, De Silva etc. I don't thins those teams were weaker than current SL, Austrlia, WI or Pak teams. How many times teh current team past 200+ in ODIs (except agianst Zim)? Talking about agility, how many ......

One thing you forgot to mention i don't know whether you have watched those games or not at that time after 25/30 overs other team use to bring their light guns to bowl like for paki wazed ali or some one who was a batsman got three wickets and most of the time the other team knew that they are wining so they were not hard on us and on that proccess our most talented batsman!!! (AL SHAhariar) got few 50's. But those matches were done after 20 over after that the big team just go with the motion which is not the case anymore sp after pak defeat no one is loose a little bit.

So please keep that in mind before saying those player were better than current...

MondayMorningQB
August 4, 2004, 12:48 PM
desperate situation requires desperate measures....

The question is: Is the situation so bad, that demands desperate measures?


In that case why not go to the extreme and bring back Rokibul and open him with Gullu in next few test series. Who knows they might create some kind of record. :fire:

In specialist spinner department, we can add our Energizer Bunny, Goala (Keeps on going) instead of Rafique and/or Razzak. :fire: :fire:

In opening bowler department, we can use “always reliable” Chacha and “once upon a time” speedster Badshah. :fire: :fire: :fire:

Hira can give rest to Pilot once in a while as a part-time wicketkeeper. Btw, how old is he now? :fire: :fire: :fire: :fire:

How about using “Kalicharan” Babu to stabilize the middle order. :fire: :fire: :fire: :fire: :fire:

Relax …. …things will be ok!!:P

paco
August 4, 2004, 01:00 PM
I like the idea about Rokibul - let's bring him back. How about Golam Nowsher prince also ...

Ahmed_B
August 4, 2004, 01:01 PM
Originally posted by Navarene
Considering the fact that both Bulbul, Akram and Nannu are in their mid 30's, I really don't see any valid reason to why these oldies should be brought back. Lets say they score 20/30 odd runs in every match. But how long do you expect them to continue playing in international arena? Another 1 year? Surely age will take its toll. What then? To kick them out and look for new bloods after an year?


I dont disagree with ur logic or explanation... but I do strongly protest ur language and way of phrasing when u mention the senior players like that in there... (marked in bold) ...

Every time has its own heroes.. and these Senior players are heroes of our cricket of that time!! Please dont make the mistake of degrading them by your words on the way to establish any of ur logic!!

paco
August 4, 2004, 01:12 PM
With all due respect to your opinions about Bulbul or Nannu, I think we should let the stats speak for themselves ...

Name Mat I NO Runs HS Ave SR 100 50
Alok Kapali 42 41 2 797 89* 20.43 65.81 - 4
Aminul Islam 39 39 5 794 70 23.35 56.59 - 3
Minhajul Abedin 27 26 2 453 68* 18.87 49.83 - 2
Rajin Saleh 19 19 0 450 71 23.68 52.44 - 3

I don't see how you guys can think Bulbul or Nannu would do any better than Rajin or Alok. Count in the fact that Bulbuls 5 not outs inflate his average by quite a bit, and both Bulbul and Nannu have been known for their slow strike rates.

chinaman
August 5, 2004, 12:15 AM
http://banglacricket.com/files/pics/posted/odicarrier.gif

Rubu
August 5, 2004, 12:33 AM
bd's average speaks for its team performance. just look at it. it is a sorry looking stat by any means.


do u guys remember how those 3 oldies used to play? wihout any target. wasting 50 overs wiht a target of spending it, 20 odd runs is not that hard. and even if the current team get out below that, they try to chase a total or to build it. and, i think thats the difference we should keep in mind before thinking of bringing any one back.

fwullah
August 5, 2004, 02:08 AM
I think one thing is not mentioned here at all.

THE FACTOR OF THE NEW BALL.

Bulbul, Akram, Nannu, Durjoy - they all played at number four, five, six and sometimes at seven. Only a few times (2/3 times) Akram and Durjoy were tried at number three or in the opening position and they failed miserably, considering their batting average and the number of times played at their respected batting positions.

Since we are having to face a similar kind of situation now just as before, the opening dilemma - THE NEW BALL FACTOR, (that is, wickets fall too regularly in the first few overs) so our aim could be to strengthen our middle order batting. And hence, stop losing the matches inside the first 10 overs of our batting.

In that case, Bashar, Rajin, Ashraful - the three main inform spearheads in our batting in present times can be batted at positions three, four and five. Given that Alok Kapali is not in such a good form, so lets just forget about him for the moment. The Bashar-Rajin-Ashraful batting line up helped us in the One Day series against Zimbabwe, so we could have stayed with the same batting order for the rest of the season.

However, as we are trying to get our acts together and trying to beat teams stronger than Zimbabwe, so the risk of entertaining the idea of Ashraful opening came into the mind of Whatmore, for our sake of winning against stronger teams like SL, IND, PAK, so Whatmore took a chance, a risk, and since there is no risk, no gain, so he was encouraged by the idea.

Anyway, am I making sense? There are the facts given by Atahar Ali Khan, the only opener (a makeshift opener, to be precise - just like Mohammad Ashraful) in our recent past who have succeeded in the International career and ofcourse there is Javed Omar, who have shown some success in International career.

I think my ideas are all messed up at the moment. If at least any one of you has come to understand as to what I meant, then my time on this long-messed-up post is worth it.

Ahmed_B
August 5, 2004, 05:36 AM
I wasn't much interested to post anything in this unrealistic discussion of "Bringing back players who already crossed their mid 30's" but the following data of batting averages caught my eyes n shocked me quite a lot!! :umm:

These r called our main guys!
Bashar 17.66 in 52 innings
Ashraful 16.66 in 35 innings
Hannan Sarkar 19.15 in 20 innings
Alok Kapali 20.43 in 42 innings

Notable: Currently considered 'out of form Alok & Hannan got higher averages.

Bit respectable r these:
Rajin Saleh 23.68 in 19 innings
Javed Omar 25.81 in 30 innings
Manjural Rana 30.42 in 10 innings
Khaled Masud* 25.12 in last 10 innings
(*though his alltime average is 18.13 in 80 innings I think he has got some momentum in is bat recenty)

[Edited on 5-8-2004 by crickethorizon]

Habibul_bashar
August 5, 2004, 05:44 AM
Originally posted by crickethorizon
I wasn't much interested to post anything in this unrealistic discussion of "Bringing back players who already crossed their mid 30's" but the following data of batting averages caught my eyes n shocked me quite a lot!! :umm:

Bashar 17.66 in 52 innings
Ashraful 16.66 in 35 innings
Hannan Sarkar 19.15 in 20 innings
Alok Kapali 20.43 in 42 innings

Bit respectable r these:

Rajin Saleh 23.68 in 19 innings
Javed Omar 25.81 in 30 innings
Manjural Rana 30.42 in 10 innings
Khaled Masud* 25.12 in last 10 innings
(*though his alltime average is 18.13 in 80 innings I think has got some momentum in is bat recenty)
Manjural Rana 30.42 is the best man. Hannan Sarkar (19.15 in 20 innings) is more then bashar and ash. Did Hannan will back in ICC2004 in UK on opner.

Iram
August 5, 2004, 10:39 AM
I agree with you, sasharif.

rafiq
August 5, 2004, 11:04 AM
Akram and Bulbul - these guys should have crossed 1000 runs. Especially Akram who was so close. He came into the World Cup last year and plodded and nudged his way through a few overs - hardly picked up any runs. Against Kenya, one was expecting some accelaration from him but all he did was stand around. Those guys never got a good run chase going, they were just happy to face as many balls as possible. No wonder Bangladesh were always out of the game by the 20th over. Anyway, I don't mean to be too harsh on the legends, they did their duty for Bangladesh, but the cricket (from us) then was just not very good.

Fwullah - one thing you bring up in your post is that we got into the recent mess primarily because of the opener problem. Converting Ash to an opener has made the middle order paper thin. Do we have any real openers out there set to make a comeback? Wouldn't that solve some of our current problems?

oracle
August 5, 2004, 11:14 AM
Do we have any real openers out there set to make a comeback? Wouldn't that solve some of our current problems?


Come December and Sarkar + Bidyut will be back. Same cycle over again.:(

Navarene
August 5, 2004, 11:16 AM
Do we have any real openers out there set to make a comeback?

Apart from Javed Omar Belim, Shahriar Hossain Bidyut is reported to be fit according to BangladesherKhela report. But our U-19 opener Nafis Iqbal is probably the first choice over Bidyut in ICC Champions Trophy.

To Crickethorizon
I am sorry if I hurt your feelings about our ex crickers. I had no intention to be derogatory to those old chaps. Pls take the word "oldies" as a figure of speech and don't read much into it. Thank heaven I didn't call them as "senile";) kidding...

[Edited on 5-8-2004 by Navarene]

Ahmed_B
August 5, 2004, 02:12 PM
Originally posted by Navarene
To Crickethorizon
I am sorry if I hurt your feelings about our ex crickers. I had no intention to be derogatory to those old chaps. Pls take the word "oldies" as a figure of speech and don't read much into it. Thank heaven I didn't call them as "senile";) kidding...


:D... it's ok man.. u din't hurt my feelings!
It's just that they r the best we had at a certain time in our cricket..

n speaking frankly... at times their style of playing used to irritate me as well like many other fans here! ;)

mafizraju
August 5, 2004, 02:26 PM
Is Mehrab out of form now..... or still stuck due to that suspension in the domestic league........... he could be one of our options as oppener along with javed, bidyut and hannan.......(not considering nafees, let him have some more experience and learn not to through away wickets, after all we are expecting long service from this man)

rafiq
August 5, 2004, 03:36 PM
mafizraju,

you may be the only person on the planet not considering nafis iqbal at this point, all arguments against it notwithstanding.

fwullah
August 5, 2004, 11:58 PM
These r called our main guys!

(See the averages written above)

Among these 4 main players, Mohammad Ashraful and Hannan Sarkar's batting average is increasing, slowly with each tournament that they play, whereas Habibul Bashar and Alok Kapali's batting average (I'm talking about in ODIs in particular) is decreasing.

Doesn't it mean something?

Among the other players whom we do not consider to be our main batsman, most of the ODIs that Rana played, some of them include batting avg against Zimbabwe, a far weaker side in bowling (just look at our batting stats against them - all our above 250 totals are against them), Khaled Mashud is a far more experienced player.

And besides, the players with better average, those whom we don't consider to be our main players, have faced a slightly older ball - so again, we're facing the same problem - NEW BALL PHENOMENON.

Only Javed Omar has a better batting average even after he is facing the new ball. But then again, he is a specialist opening batsman, so he should have a better batting average considering his experience - in facing the new ball.

fwullah
August 6, 2004, 12:05 AM
Even Rajin Saleh's batting average is decreasing; I hope his avg stays where it is now.

I am making a new thread giving the proper info.

Flip Master Mick
August 6, 2004, 06:40 AM
by the way people, akram khan is in queens (nyc) playing club cricket for Club 46... his scores in the last two games - 22 and 26.

sunniath
August 7, 2004, 01:01 PM
I think we are all forgetting about Biddut.If he is fit than he should be brought back as Gullu's partner.

Bengal_Tiger
August 7, 2004, 02:34 PM
Originally posted by SHISH AHMED
Minazul Abedin who played in 99 World Cup should be bought back to bat in the middle order and lend his experience in batting english conditions before.

He can't do anyworse!! It will give Kapali or someone else a bit of a rest.????

it is most like unrealistic to our selectors.

mafizraju
August 8, 2004, 05:10 AM
rafiq,

Nafees Iqbal got his debut last year against England. He played two matchs in his home soil and failed to impress with his 9 and 4. Well the argument could be raised that a player of his talent should not be judged by only those two innings after all he had a majestic century against the same opponent. I have seen him playing and I guess I should be the last person to have any doubt about the talent he possess. But still all I am proposing that let him be more mature and then bring him. He will be able to serve us long and without any hickup. the oppening problem is a long one. Everybody says that we dont have sufficient number of oppners. But I will disagree. After 1997 we had a very good influx of oppeners. Players like Bidyut, Oppee, Golla, Ashraful and even Nafees Iqbal and even U19 Nafees Ahmed is doing great in England. but what happened lot of these Oppeners for whatever reasons got out of the team and then struggled to come back and in the mean time we pushed a newer blood to take their space and when this new blood failed we couldnot go back to old one and looked for a newer one. By doing this we are just wasting all these players. Gordon always used to say I am agreed to play with some little undderclass players for couple years if that guarantees time needed to mature up those who are real talanted. And anyways Nafees have not done anything majestic yet after that century against england last year. I donot see anything but his raw talent that might make him qualify for the national team, if he is qualified. Look We have brought in players like Alok, Al shahriar, tushar, shipon for their talent even before they could actually earn the place. As soon as they failed we have thrown them out. Rokon can never come back. But was there any doubt about his talent? Alok... we are talking to drop him.... is there any doubt about his talent? No, there is none. But why we are dropping them.......because they failed to prove themselves.......... they could not score upto their talent or ability or the demand of the situation. I dont blame them. If anybody has to blame that gotta be us.......Why is that? cause when they came to the team they didnot come by proving them.....lets face it they didnot earn it............. you cant have raw steels and then say this steel can carry 500 ppl, lets put it on the deep sea.No matter how much quality the steel has its bound to sink that way. You have to make the ship out of it, test it for safety and only when it can withstand much harder test you know it will withstand all the ups and downs of the sea and will reach shore. I can wait till I make the ship and test it thoroughly untill I am satisfied it won't sink.........I dont see anything wrong with that approach at all.............

chinaman
August 8, 2004, 06:35 AM
That's a very nice argument you put up here. Well versed. But you know what even if Nafees continues to practice on way to become more mature, no one can gurantee that he will be free of ups and downs (or as you said, "without any hickup").

Yes, he was rushed into the team following his arrival to the airport from Pakistan. Yes, his performance was not worth mentioning. Yes, only two games do not tell anything. Yes, he might not be 100% ready. But he is ready nonetheless given his tight training with the U19 team for over a year now. He could be refined further in 'in-service' training with Whatmore.

Cricket structure in our country has a lot to do with his potential selection. You see, players of our current team never experienced the high profile training until very recently. They were blessed with their natural talent only refined by local and other low profile coaches with even lower support staffs and facilities. That's why they are struggling now. They have reached the peak of their abilities and it is next to impossible to make them any better. The result? Well, they will shine in a few games only to be flopped in the rest. They will remain inconsistant. It is not their fault entirely by any means.

With the newer generations of players like Ashraful, Kapali and the likes, there is hope. Since they were exposed to better training at a relatively younger age, it is quite possible for them to make noticeable progress than their older compatriots. If you force Bashar to make drastic changes in his style, he will forget batting. Whatmore is probably handling the oldies correctly in a sense that he is not making too much fuss about their styles other than some basics in order just to get the maximum return with minimum changes in player's styles and habits.

Going further down, the current U19 players are significantly better equipped both mentaly and physically to take charge for the future call. The call might come early for a few while it may take a long time for others. But good thing is when the call finally comes, they will be much easier to refine than the likes of Rokon, Tushar or even Kapali for that matter.

Those oldies have talent. But the talent is only a small part of the puzzle. You need to control your concentration, sharpen your reflexes, hold on to your patience, handle the pressure, exert the pressure upon the opponent, judge and manipulate the situation and above all your mind and body must be able, ready and willing to do such things all while your talent and practice well incorporated into the solid basics. And there lies one of the major differences between these two generations.

We already know our limits with the current players. We could go as far as to win a game or two every now and then. But for the thunder, we need the newer generation. Until the arrival of the fresh blood we possibly can not justify our dreams to push any team to their limits consistantly.

Zephaniah
August 8, 2004, 07:56 AM
I agree with both mafizraju & Chinaman.

mafizraju:
Like you I would like to see our well trained U19 players play more real matches against senior teams on foreign soil to hone their skills and get accustomed with pressure-cooker match situation. But trouble is we don't play A team matches so under the circumstances, when we need to replace some of our obvious hapless national players, we have no other choices but to inject some U19 players forcefully and only hope that they couldn't do worse than their predecessor's dismal performance.

Chinaman:
You can train your most talented players only so much, but to assess various aspects of their game and get them prepared in real terms for international cricket I don't see any other route than to send them playing A team matches on foreign soil. It's difficult to say an U19 player is ready for international cricket based on his performance in the U19 level.

[Edited on 8-8-2004 by Zephaniah]

Habibul_bashar
August 12, 2004, 04:16 AM
Name Mat I NO Runs HS
Minhajul Abedin 4 4 2 140 68*
He is the man who has make two 50 in world cup from bangladesh

rafiq
August 12, 2004, 07:03 AM
Mraju:

I agree openers are dropped and chopped too often. Even Javed was about to be until a couple of better scores in the Asian Cup. Inability to play pace well obviously has a lot to do with it. Hopefully they all get longer chances to settle and learn in the future.

On Nafees Iqbal, he just had double ton in the practise match and then a woeful 2nd test. That's been his net performance so far - not much in real games. Yet he is in the team, so no amount of debating now can change that fact. That;s all I was trying to point out. The other Nafees seems to be in better form!

mafizraju
August 5, 2005, 07:24 PM
Originally posted by mafizraju
Is Mehrab out of form now..... or still stuck due to that suspension in the domestic league........... he could be one of our options as oppener along with javed, bidyut and hannan.......(not considering nafees, let him have some more experience and learn not to through away wickets, after all we are expecting long service from this man)

kalpurush
August 6, 2005, 12:05 AM
Can I bring back my mom too?!

kalpurush
August 6, 2005, 12:09 AM
Sorry...for the above remark. It was ment to pinch Mr. Boycott!! I don't think bringing back Nannu will solve our prob.

guy_zin
August 6, 2005, 04:41 AM
just wondering what made the delay of replying a post posted nearly one year ago..( & by now which become a dead subject too):-/:-/

Mahmood
August 6, 2005, 12:33 PM
No doubt, all of them were great cricketers and we would love to have their service when they were at their pick.

But you have to understand, they have aged, their reflex has slowed down and now, they are not national level anymore.

We need to accept the fact, "their time has come and gone" and move on.

Edited on, August 6, 2005, 9:58 PM GMT, by Mahmood.

arafath79
August 6, 2005, 02:30 PM
Originally posted by SHISH AHMED
Minazul Abedin who played in 99 World Cup should be bought back to bat in the middle order and lend his experience in batting english conditions before.

He can't do anyworse!! It will give Kapali or someone else a bit of a rest.????

[Edited]


Edited on, August 6, 2005, 9:45 PM GMT, by reverse_swing.
Reason: mod.content: Please be courteous and respectul to the opposing opinion and never attack a poster.

Shish Ahmed
August 6, 2005, 04:15 PM
[Removed]



Edited on, August 6, 2005, 9:21 PM GMT, by reverse_swing.
Reason: mod.content: Mind your language.

sleeping_giant
August 7, 2005, 04:01 AM
Originally posted by SHISH AHMED
Minazul Abedin who played in 99 World Cup should be bought back to bat in the middle order and lend his experience in batting english conditions before.

He can't do anyworse!! It will give Kapali or someone else a bit of a rest.????

Minhaj is the Grandfather of our new sension wicket keeper, a 16 years old!
Make space for these people, and do not wish to see 'dada aar nati ek shathey', and 'dada - nati perfectly ideal for Television Bangla Magazine Show 'ITTADI'........

:fanflag:

Shish Ahmed
August 7, 2005, 04:14 AM
This topic was posted over a year a go. At the time more experience would have helped the younger players.

Remind me how Bangladesh did in the champions trophy ??

Spitfire_x86
August 7, 2005, 08:13 AM
I'm not sure how Nannu could've helped BD in the Champions trophy.

Shish Ahmed
August 7, 2005, 10:12 AM
Originally posted by Spitfire_x86
I'm not sure how Nannu could've helped BD in the Champions trophy.


He could not have done any worse, it was worth a try at the time as some of the youngsters were struggling!!!

Ejaj
August 9, 2005, 02:12 AM
I dont think its a positive idea to bring back old players. Without taking stats into consideration, I believe these new players are infact much more better in technique and mentality than them. So, I would very much like to stick to the new generation and let the Nannu/AKram/bulubul etc get involved in more constructive work like coaching local younger players.