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Originally Posted by Gowza
It depends in which botham you are talking about and also the standard you are expecting. Pretty sure for a certain period of time beefy was one of the top 5 bats in the world but if you're talking about an all time national xi then I agree, he couldn't make it on just batting and he couldn't make it on just bowling either (at least not if you take his entire career into consideration - at the beginning he certainly could've made a team as a pure bowler).
As far as sobers having more talent than beefy and Miller, well yes certainly more than beefy but I think Miller V Sobers is closer, both exceptionally talented batsmen but sobers showed it more at the highest level and probably had a slightly higher ceiling than Miller as a bat but as bowlers sobers strength was his versatility, I've no doubt Miller had more pace bowling talent than sobers had. Not saying sobers didn't have a lot of talent as a pacer but I just think Miller had more, Miller did also bowl some offices but didn't bowl spin anywhere near as often as sobers.
Mahela V Sanga, from what I saw sanga had more talent and their records show that as well.
Forgot Gilly, an underrated player imo, very much a top tier keeper imo and combine it with his batting then he was a talent rarely seen.
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The standard am expecting is not all time, am expecting international standard, and you can't take just 2/3 years of prime, it has to be at least a good chunk of their careers
Botham simply wouldn't get into many teams averaging in his low 30's, even in his prime and taking away everything after mid 80's he averaged 34/35, that's not good enough for most test teams as a batsman today
As a bowler he could make it in that period as a bowler in most teams in my opinion
Miller from footage I've seen, was not the same level as sobers as a batsman
Sangakara record shows his superior hard work and dedication, he kept improving, Mahela half the time turned up asleep to games when he didn't need to perform, he was a great big game player, a players record certainly doesn't show who had more talent, it shows who was the better player, talent is just a small part to it
Gilchrist is also super talented as a batsman, not so much as a keeper, he practiced batting very little, it was his keeping he gave most of his attention on training, even then as a keeper, he wasn't top tier, he was excellent but not top tier, as a batsman keeper, there is no better.