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  #126  
Old August 1, 2009, 07:28 PM
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Nafi Nafi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BD-Shardul
When we are sick, why do we go to doctors? When we want to build something why do we consult engineers and architcts? Why don't we just open a book and learn it ourselves?

In fact, in every field of study, there are experts and Islam is no different.
Most ridiculous thing Ive ever read, you cannot compare the knowledge of science to the knowledge of religion.
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Last edited by Nafi; August 1, 2009 at 07:39 PM..
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  #127  
Old August 1, 2009, 10:47 PM
Banglatiger84 Banglatiger84 is offline
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Didn;t know which thread to post it on, but just shows how pathetic moronic Muslims are spoling the image of Islam.

A westerner wore the Arab thobe (white flowing garment) in Dubai because he liked it and because it feels comfotable in the heat. He was stopped by a native Arab (who believe they are above the law), and was told he is insulting Islam by wearing the Thobe. When he defends his right to wear it, the native calls police to have the man arrested for "insulting Islam".

Apparently, a non-Arab or non-Muslim wearing Arabic dress is an "insult to Islam".

The westerner now believes its actually Islam that says it......
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  #128  
Old August 1, 2009, 10:51 PM
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al Furqaan al Furqaan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nafi
Most ridiculous thing Ive ever read, you cannot compare the knowledge of science to the knowledge of religion.
no its a perfectly good analogy. its just that just because a person is an "expert" doesn't mean his knowledge is perfect. only God's knowledge is perfect, and he's laid down all his info in the quran. that much is indisputable.

now as far as following madhabs and other ulema, its up to a person to see what is done and why its done and figure out if he/she wants to continue doing it.

even religion ultimately comes down to "why do i believe what i believe?"
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  #129  
Old August 1, 2009, 11:01 PM
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Rifat Rifat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
Didn;t know which thread to post it on, but just shows how pathetic moronic Muslims are spoling the image of Islam.

A westerner wore the Arab thobe (white flowing garment) in Dubai because he liked it and because it feels comfotable in the heat. He was stopped by a native Arab (who believe they are above the law), and was told he is insulting Islam by wearing the Thobe. When he defends his right to wear it, the native calls police to have the man arrested for "insulting Islam".

Apparently, a non-Arab or non-Muslim wearing Arabic dress is an "insult to Islam".

The westerner now believes its actually Islam that says it......

al furqaan bro, top post as usual.

well, i have been doing a lot of thinking: is it Muslim pride that is spoiling us?? is it that anything that falls under "Islam" suddenly becomes divinely blessed and hence the rest of the non-muslim world falls inferior to it? if i am not mistaken: Shaitan was the best of Allah's servant and because of Arrogance: he hit the lowest of the low...why are we following the same footstep?

Islamic Ideals exist in EVERY culture(well, parts of it) while many of those people engage in kufr and shirk: does that make an insult to Islam?...there is no such thing as Insult to Islam but rather Insult to yourself because by not following truth, you are only hurting yourself, noone else...
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  #130  
Old August 1, 2009, 11:04 PM
Zunaid Zunaid is offline
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Rifat - so how would you respond to Bangltigers post?
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  #131  
Old August 1, 2009, 11:17 PM
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Zeeshan Zeeshan is offline
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Lol I should take a screenshot of it before Rifat edits it....

Rifat bro deserves this special accolade
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  #132  
Old August 2, 2009, 12:16 AM
Banglatiger84 Banglatiger84 is offline
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It may sound politically incorrect, but such stuff exists more among Pakistanis and Arabs.

In some Arab countries, people become ruder during Ramadan, the excuse being "i am fasting so my temper is high". Also foreigners have been deported for eating in public and hence "insulting Islam. A family friend was scolded for feeding their 3 year old daughter in public and hence "insulting fasting peopelby spoiling their fast".
To the middle eastern psyche, Muslims have zero level of self control, so women must be covered freom head to toe lest they be raped, and no one should sip a drop of water lest fasting people break their own fast after being tempted....

"Insulting Islam" has become a stick with which to practise one's superiority complex and glass-like ego.
In Pakistan, the blasphemy law enacted by Zia has become the best tool through which to settle property disputes. I have a property dispute, so suddenly me and 10 of my family members heard you uttering blasphemous stuff against Islam. Thats it, you are liable for the death penalty while I conveniently take over the property...

For that matter, it exists in Bangladesh also, but to a lesser extent.


Thousands of expats revert to Islam in Saudi Arabia; many do it to avoid being treated like an animal (which is how non-Muslim Asians are treated like). I am yet to see a convert who has reverted to Islam by being amazed at how humble or pious Saudis are.

Last edited by Banglatiger84; August 2, 2009 at 12:23 AM..
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  #133  
Old August 2, 2009, 12:24 AM
Banglatiger84 Banglatiger84 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by al Furqaan
my answer:

one should always seek to know "why?"...if an oncologist tells you you have cancer do you just accept it since he supposedly knows more about cancer than you? most people would, but thats usually because the doctor explains why he "believes" or "knows" you have cancer.

in a similar vein, if a scholar says such and such is haraam, you should ask why he feels that way. if you accept his decision and ruling fine. but if it doesn't make sense to you, also fine.

bottom line is people will always react according to their inner bias, belief. when that inner bias and belief is in line with the Quran (God's sole miracle on Earth) then you can be assured you're on hte right path.

JazakAllah; very well put indeed
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  #134  
Old August 2, 2009, 12:25 AM
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Zeeshan Zeeshan is offline
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Is it true our Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was made of "Nur" (Light) and onar chaya porto na?
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  #135  
Old August 2, 2009, 03:34 AM
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BANFAN BANFAN is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nafi
Most ridiculous thing Ive ever read, you cannot compare the knowledge of science to the knowledge of religion.
Right, that was ridiculous.

But when religion talks of science, that must be qualified by scientific knowledge.
But for verifying that knowledge we don't go to a Mullah or religious scholar. We need to check with a scientist/established scientific knowledge.
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  #136  
Old August 2, 2009, 07:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeeshanM
Is it true our Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was made of "Nur" (Light) and onar chaya porto na?
1st part, if I am not mistaken all souls came from Nur. 2nd part, of course he (PBUH) had shadow. He was a human being just like us. However, at times, it has been cited that often in the time of heat, a cloud would shelter him from the scorching sun. Cloud in deserts are hard find. Hard to prove scientifically. We don't have footage.
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  #137  
Old August 2, 2009, 07:29 AM
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Physiologically he (Prophet) was a human being like anyone of us. That's what Quran says. So chaya to porte e hobe, that is how we move towards shirk by showing too much devotion to a creation of Allah. instead of adhearing to the message we start worshipping the messenger. Jesus is the perfect example.
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  #138  
Old August 3, 2009, 09:05 AM
imtiaz82 imtiaz82 is offline
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Sahl bin Sa'd As Saidi (RA) reported: A man came to the Prophet [SAW] and said "O Messenger of Allah, guide me to such an action which, if I do Allah will love me and the people will also love me." He [SAW] said, " Have no desire for this world Allah will love you; and have no desire for what people possess, and the people will love you." [Ibn Majah]
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  #139  
Old August 5, 2009, 11:27 PM
imtiaz82 imtiaz82 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
It may sound politically incorrect, but such stuff exists more among Pakistanis and Arabs.

In some Arab countries, people become ruder during Ramadan, the excuse being "i am fasting so my temper is high". Also foreigners have been deported for eating in public and hence "insulting Islam. A family friend was scolded for feeding their 3 year old daughter in public and hence "insulting fasting peopelby spoiling their fast".
To the middle eastern psyche, Muslims have zero level of self control, so women must be covered freom head to toe lest they be raped, and no one should sip a drop of water lest fasting people break their own fast after being tempted....

"Insulting Islam" has become a stick with which to practise one's superiority complex and glass-like ego.
In Pakistan, the blasphemy law enacted by Zia has become the best tool through which to settle property disputes. I have a property dispute, so suddenly me and 10 of my family members heard you uttering blasphemous stuff against Islam. Thats it, you are liable for the death penalty while I conveniently take over the property...

For that matter, it exists in Bangladesh also, but to a lesser extent.
What you have said above is most likely true. But I feel that we should work together as human beings and fellow muslims to fix the wrong things among us and strive towards equity and fairness.

The gulf arab states are being tested by Allah(swt) through extreme wealth that came within span of few decades, before that they had to fight with harsh geography and weather. As you stated, many/most are failing in this test, Saudi rulers have established monarchy (not permissable in islam) and have also developed superiority complex. But how do we help? We should have responsibility towards them aswell.. Probably education is way towards social emancipation?

Similarly, Bangladeshis are tested by Allah(swt) with poverty and natural disasters. So it's the duty of others to help us in our need aswell.

Also, if you look at the behavior of some of the ultra rich Bangladeshis, they are not too different from Arabs. I knew people at my class, who would drink, party all night and even had special apartments on their own where they coul do whatever they want without parent's supervision. Also, they behaved the exact same way as arrogant arabs towards their domestic helps(kajer chele). Some used to openly abuse them by kicking, slapping for the smallest of mistake.So when given the situation and test by Allah(swt), we also fail in lot of occassions.

Infact the educated middle class families that most of us belong to, have the least test in order to maintain our faith/iman. We don't have ultra luxury to make as arrogant to that extent at the same time the Islamic and scientific teachings also make us more broad minded.

Finally, we should ofcourse condemn such wrong acts, take legal actions where possible (like the treatment of BD workers). But at the same time work towards long term solution.
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  #140  
Old August 6, 2009, 12:10 AM
Banglatiger84 Banglatiger84 is offline
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Here's the thing:

1) You can only help them if they are willing to be helped.

Many Bangladeshis are the first to criticise wrongdoings by their own.
However I am yet to meet a Gulf Arab who will acknowledge half the issues they have. Mr. Saudi Arabian (you know who I mean) is a prime example. He is not racist but he justifies racism against Bangladeshi workers in Saudi Arabia by claiming most of them are ex convicts (which is a completely false allegation). You have racist Americans but you have many Americans on the other pole in terms of opinion. However, within Gulf people, their opinions are a lot more homogeneous...

2) There is a world of difference between a rich Bangladeshi who doesnt understand more than 10 verses of the Quran and acts like a knobhead, and an Arab who reads all about how racism is bad and how we should treat servants as human beings, and then proceeds to rape his maid. Both acts are bad, however, the Arab (or for that matter, the practising Muslim) is more to blame when he prays and commits major sins within a couple of hours of each other. It is not unknown for people here to drink all night, and then pray Fajr (castigating those who dont pray it...)
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  #141  
Old August 6, 2009, 08:38 AM
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BanglaTiger: I followed the previous post of yours until it got ot the last paragraph.

I also opined the same thing to one of my colleagues, who is very religious. He says - a sinner is a sinner, but if he's praying 5 times a day, he's at least doing the ibadot right...but that doesn't mean his sins will be forgiven.

So the comparision you made about bangladeshi sinners vs arab sinners...it's kinda kiddish IMO.
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  #142  
Old August 6, 2009, 09:04 AM
imtiaz82 imtiaz82 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
Here's the thing:

1) You can only help them if they are willing to be helped.

Many Bangladeshis are the first to criticise wrongdoings by their own.
However I am yet to meet a Gulf Arab who will acknowledge half the issues they have. Mr. Saudi Arabian (you know who I mean) is a prime example. He is not racist but he justifies racism against Bangladeshi workers in Saudi Arabia by claiming most of them are ex convicts (which is a completely false allegation). You have racist Americans but you have many Americans on the other pole in terms of opinion. However, within Gulf people, their opinions are a lot more homogeneous...

2) There is a world of difference between a rich Bangladeshi who doesnt understand more than 10 verses of the Quran and acts like a knobhead, and an Arab who reads all about how racism is bad and how we should treat servants as human beings, and then proceeds to rape his maid. Both acts are bad, however, the Arab (or for that matter, the practising Muslim) is more to blame when he prays and commits major sins within a couple of hours of each other. It is not unknown for people here to drink all night, and then pray Fajr (castigating those who dont pray it...)
Bro I get your point. But I believe that no race/ethnicity(be it Arabs, Europeans or Bangladeshis) is inherently bad in nature. My example was ofcourse not a complete match, it was just to show how given the circumstance even Bangladeshis would have done the same.

I have some BD friends who would fast then drink alcohol for Iftar! Apparently they fast for weight control, culture etc. Again, they come from a class in society where the wealth and power has influenced their behavior. For the oil rich gulf nations, you have to magnify this issue 1000 times since their wealth is much more widespread.

On the other hand, I had few good Saudi friends at college who would be extremely critical of what's happening in their country (Jalal and Tariq, 2 Saudi PHd students in CS and Maths infact used to wear "punjabi" during Eid instead of thobe, since they liked desi culture so much). The education and atmoshphere in US must have opened up their mind. But you are right, majority of the gulf arabs I have met are not like them and don't realize the injustice done in their country in the name of religion [I would blame their highly closed and monitored political system for that, where free thinking is not encouraged, the arabs are not just born with vengeance and racism].

If you look at Europeans (who define standard of world human rights nowadays), it took them few hundred years to change. They were the ones to enslave Africans,native americans. Even in 1960s, an African american could not get into restaurants with European americans. Technological development in 15-16th century gave the same superiority complex as arabs have it today. How about South Africa, the apartheid era only ended in 1990s..!

The best way to stop racism by gulf arab countries is to take united stance against their biased policies. Use world organizations to monitor human rights abuse and take actions. Bangladesh government should also lodge official complaints.. infact we should even make a united effort to change the regime in Saudi Arabia, Kuwait etc by spreading Islam's message in this topic to the general people(since Islam does not allow monarchy and authoratarian rule)..but disliking individual arabs due to racial stereotype is not the way to go. We need to fix the cause of the "disease" and not react on the outward symptom..

Last edited by imtiaz82; August 6, 2009 at 03:17 PM..
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  #143  
Old August 6, 2009, 03:21 PM
imtiaz82 imtiaz82 is offline
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Anyways, going back to topic of Prophet Muhammad(pbuh), I love the following Nasheed by Sami Yusuf and ofcourse the hadith:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aMfV...om=PL&index=55

"Beware of speculations, words that are based on speculations are the biggest lies"

"Only by narrating everything you hear to others you'll do many sins"

"Allah loves small deeds that are done constantly"

"Those that have a sparkle of arrogance will never enter paradise"

"Nothing more than a believer's good manner will weigh on the scale on Judgement Day"
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  #144  
Old August 6, 2009, 08:46 PM
imtiaz82 imtiaz82 is offline
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Narrated Jabir bin 'Abdullah (Radi-Allahu 'anhum):
A funeral procession passed in front of us and the Prophet (Sallallahu
'Alaihi Wa Sallam) stood up and we too stood up. We said, 'O Allah's
Apostle! This is the funeral procession of a Jew." He said, "Whenever you
see a funeral procession, you should stand up."
Bukhari Vol. 2 : No. 398

There is so much to learn from our beloved prophet(pbuh), he showed respect and courtsey to everyone. Whereas nowadays many of us are much more narrow minded and do not show the same attitude towards others..
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  #145  
Old August 6, 2009, 09:19 PM
One World One World is offline
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Instead of talking about the Prophet itself this thread turned into a defining center of Bidoyaat and Sunnah.

Well if a BD guy with his so called upped class signature does not know anything about Quran that should not allow him to let go, procrastination is a bigger crime than drinking all night and then pray Fajr.
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  #146  
Old August 6, 2009, 11:14 PM
imtiaz82 imtiaz82 is offline
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^^^ Bro you know how online forums are... topics often end up going on a tangent.
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  #147  
Old August 7, 2009, 04:27 PM
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Will verify source and then repost.
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  #148  
Old July 4, 2010, 12:18 AM
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Rifat Rifat is offline
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Prophet Mohammad(SallAllahu A'laihe wasallam) said:

Whomever has not thanked the people has not thanked Allah!
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