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  #26  
Old September 4, 2011, 01:39 AM
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I can see a few grins on the faces of few BC members after Vitori's tough time on the park. Well, can't blame you guys he hurt you! Anyway, let's talk about the fact that he has ability and if properly nurtured he can turn into a class act. During Dale Steyn's early days, he showed a lot of promise with his pace and swing, but was the most expensive among the SA fast bowlers. Morne Morkel had a horror of a test series not so long ago against Australia and many people were saying he was not good enough to play Tests. Now take a look at these 2 fast bowling giants and what they have achieved of late. Many batsmen shiver when they hear these 2 names and they are on their way to becoming fast bowling greats! Vitori is still 21 and he's going to have some rough times ahead, but is it not obvious that with time he's going to improve and be ranked alongside Morkel and Steyn? He has pace, swing(both ways), aggression and accuracy all of which make a good fast bowler. Give him time, he's going to be successful.

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  #27  
Old September 4, 2011, 03:25 PM
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Dale Steyn or Morne Morkel has two legs, and Vitori also has two legs.

And the comparison end there as far as I am concern.

Let him show us show some more in near future before we start comparing him with Dale or Marne.
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  #28  
Old September 4, 2011, 06:50 PM
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Steyn and Morkel are a different class, at least Steyn is. Vitori will do well to be end up ranked anywhere near Zaheer Khan, to say nothing of Steyn. Vitori bowled very well against us, and I suspect he did not bowl as well against Pakistan as he strayed in his lines. That being said he had 2 wickets get dropped, and those would have helped his figures for sure. But yes, Vitori and Jarvis certainly are promising.
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  #29  
Old September 5, 2011, 02:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazal
Dale Steyn or Morne Morkel has two legs, and Vitori also has two legs.

And the comparison end there as far as I am concern.

Let him show us show some more in near future before we start comparing him with Dale or Marne.
I did not say Vitori is in the same class as Dale and Morné, yet. Vitori has the potential to get to those heights and at the age of 21 he can only get better. He has pace, swing(both ways), good control etc and he can only get better with time. Who knows he could reach those heights and even be better! What I think is disgusting is, because he's playing for Zimbabwe people have already written him off and have concluded that he can never reach great heights. Give him a chance...

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  #30  
Old September 5, 2011, 02:28 AM
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Abundance of right handed batsmen in the Pak team has not helped Vitori's cause for sure.

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  #31  
Old September 5, 2011, 02:48 AM
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Go Vitori!
Rock on baby!
Go Zimbabwe!
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  #32  
Old September 5, 2011, 02:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZimSlog
I did not say Vitori is in the same class as Dale and Morné, yet. Vitori has the potential to get to those heights and at the age of 21 he can only get better. He has pace, swing(both ways), good control etc and he can only get better with time. Who knows he could reach those heights and even be better! What I think is disgusting is, because he's playing for Zimbabwe people have already written him off and have concluded that he can never reach great heights. Give him a chance...

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He has to improve against the right handers. He is not impressive against the right handers at all. I am sure Streak is concerned about the issue. Let's see how he is gonna deal with that.
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  #33  
Old September 5, 2011, 02:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZimSlog
I did not say Vitori is in the same class as Dale and Morné, yet. Vitori has the potential to get to those heights and at the age of 21 he can only get better. He has pace, swing(both ways), good control etc and he can only get better with time. Who knows he could reach those heights and even be better! What I think is disgusting is, because he's playing for Zimbabwe people have already written him off and have concluded that he can never reach great heights. Give him a chance...

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Morkel yes, Vitori can reach Morkel's level...chances are slim, but crazier things happen in sports.

Steyn, hell freakin no! And it has nothing to do with him being Zimbabwean, and everything to do with you waking up from the delusions man. Have you seen Steyn's numbers? They're not even believable. He takes his wickets once every 40 deliveries, when you take into account how flat today's Test wickets are (read: how often he bowls to Indian batsman) that is the MOST remarkable strike rate in the history of the game. His statistical achievements are second only to Bradman's ridiculous batting average. Ashraful actually has a better chance of equalling Tendulkar, because average wise, SRT isn't the same kind of outlier that Steyn is. There is no way anyone will match up to Steyn anytime soon, Zimbabwean or Martian.
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  #34  
Old September 5, 2011, 03:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZimSlog
I did not say Vitori is in the same class as Dale and Morné, yet. Vitori has the potential to get to those heights and at the age of 21 he can only get better. He has pace, swing(both ways), good control etc and he can only get better with time.
There are plenty good players comes in international level with flares, they comes and then they vanish. What makes you so sure Vitori will get better with time? He just played 2 tests, in which he showed promise and then a very forgettable test where he took 10 steps backward.

Let him play at-least 10 tests and let him show some constant performance with a trend of steady growth before we start mentioning Vitori and Dale and Morné in the same sentence.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ZimSlog

Who knows he could reach those heights and even be better!
Yes we don't know the future. But to have a better prediction, at least we need a better sample size, don;t you agree?


Quote:
Originally Posted by ZimSlog

What I think is disgusting is, because he's playing for Zimbabwe people have already written him off and have concluded that he can never reach great heights. Give him a chance...

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What I see is disgusting is the way you are using the Race card here. Where you get the idea that the people are written him off because he is playing for Zimbabwe? You accused us, now you have the responsibility to prove that with reference. Otherwise please stop this rubbish logic, its not good for healthy discussion.


Cheema got 8 wicket in this test where as Vitori got 0. Have you seen anyone comparing Cheema with the best in the world?
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  #35  
Old September 6, 2011, 06:13 AM
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I repeat, I didn't say Vitori is in the same league as Steyn and Morkel nor did did I say his career WILL career will be as successful as Steyn's. The reason why I mentioned Steyn is because when he started off a couple of years back he was the weakest link in a SA attack comprising Pollock, Ntini, Nél and him. He was often expensive and had some average performances. Who would've thought he'd be the most feared bowler a few years down the line? He had POTENTIAL and he turned it into something. Like Steyn(and any other bowler) Vitori has POTENTIAL and his career can take many routes from here, 1. He could do an Irfan Pathan and lose it all, 2. He could have average returns throughout his career like, maybe, Blignaut, or, 3. He CAN/MIGHT(if you like) develop into a complete fast bowler who is as successful as Steyn, Anderson etc. The route I mentioned above is clearly no.3 and like any one of the other routes it's very much a POSSIBILITY. Only time will tell if he's going to be a success, failure average...

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  #36  
Old September 6, 2011, 09:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZimSlog
I repeat, I didn't say Vitori is in the same league as Steyn and Morkel nor did did I say his career WILL career will be as successful as Steyn's.
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Ok fair enough. But can you please explain why you multiple times used the race card and said "What I think is disgusting is, because he's playing for Zimbabwe people have already written him off and have concluded that he can never reach great heights."?

I think the people you accused of racism (without any prove of evidence) deserve some explaination from you. And if you have no evidence to back up your accusation, a apology would be nice.
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  #37  
Old September 6, 2011, 10:53 AM
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^oh dear, you again Fazal!! Okay, first of all I will not apologise because I didn't accuse any specific person for this. I'll put it like this, if Vitori was playing for any one of the big teams ie Aus, Eng, SA etc PEOPLE wouldn't have objected to any comparisons or predictions that he's going to be great, but because he's playing for Zimbabwe he'll probably not get as much positive reactions. A good example would be a debate about who was a better bat Andy Flower or Gilchrist(tests).I bet the majority would jump to say Adam, but the stats clearly show Flower is better.Andy doesn't get as much credit as Gilly not bcoz he's a white Zim, but he played for a weak team ieZim.Now, the reason why people would write Vitori off is not because he's black or because he's Zimbo, but because he plays for a not so great team ie Zim. I don't see where I accuse anybody of RACISM. Please Fazal, read my posts word for word and interpret them properly before you start calling me names and accusing me of things I didn't say...

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  #38  
Old September 6, 2011, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZimSlog
I don't see where I accuse anybody of RACISM. Please Fazal, read my posts word for word and interpret them properly before you start calling me names and accusing me of things I didn't say...

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Here is your comment below . What else is there to interpret?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZimSlog
What I think is disgusting is, because he's playing for Zimbabwe people have already written him off and have concluded that he can never reach great heights. Give him a chance...)


Quote:
Originally Posted by ZimSlog
^oh dear, you again Fazal!! Okay, first of all I will not apologise because I didn't accuse any specific person for this.
Thats show your true character. You think playing race card is ok in general term. Thats fine, then don't preach us about civility in discussion here. You are the last person who should preach civility here.

I understand people needs balls to recognize their mistake, not everybody can do that. I have achieved my point.

We bangladeshis are usually very supporting to ZIM cricket (when they are not playing Bangladesh). And I am one of them. But Comments like you makes me think twice. Please remeber you are one of the few representing ZIM in this Bangla Cricket fan club.
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  #39  
Old September 6, 2011, 11:13 AM
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Its quite amusing that some of BC members are gloating the fact that Vitori had a poor outing against the Paks. Let me tell you this lad is a genuine prospect. If nurtured properly he could easily turn out to be one of the best of his generation. Quality left-armers a rarity. He is still very young and has plenty to learn about his art. That includes how to bowl well against the quality right-handers.

Yes, I'm still backing him.
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  #40  
Old September 6, 2011, 11:26 AM
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Pak or no pak, that is not the issue here. And nobody is not asking him to not back him.

Vitori is a young talent, but its too early to make him another Dale and Morné makeing. We have seen wenough of those, don't we? We had one Tendulkar in making for example.

jarvis looked more mature than Vitori in this test. Vitori was kind of clueless and lost in this TEST. Now we need to see how he does next few TESTs ... move forward or backward...that is someting I will personally see before I buy into this Vitori banwaggan
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  #41  
Old September 6, 2011, 12:00 PM
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I'm not sure which race card you're talking about Fazal. I thought I told you people writting Vitori off is not because of race, but because he plays for a not so great team. If I had said something like,"People are writting Vitori off because is black..."(which I didn't), then you had the right to demand an apology. I'm sure Igave you the Flower-Gilchrist example and here is another, Shakib-Dan Vettori. It's obvious Shakib is not given as much credit as Dan Vettori despite the fact that there isn't that big a gap between them. It's not because Shakib is Asian or anything along racial lines, but because he's playing for a not so great team ie BD. The same applies to Vitori, he'll have to do something extraordinary to gain some serious credit not because he's black or Zimbabwean, but because he's playing for a not so strong team ie Zim...by the way what were you trying to say when you said something like, remember you're the only Zimbo on BC?(may have misquoted you there, but it's something along those lines).

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  #42  
Old September 6, 2011, 12:09 PM
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...and Fazal, it good to know you support Zim. I hope you'll continue supporting us. If you however decide to stop supporting Zim let it not be because of our misunderstanding. I hope we'll resolve this and be chinas again, hey?

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  #43  
Old September 6, 2011, 12:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZimSlog
...and Fazal, it good to know you support Zim. I hope you'll continue supporting us. If you however decide to stop supporting Zim let it not be because of our misunderstanding. I hope we'll resolve this and be chinas again, hey?

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I have always soft-corners for teams like ZIM.

Yes lets move on and talk cricket from now on.
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  #44  
Old September 8, 2011, 01:16 PM
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Butcher "Different conditions in Harare may make us think of a different attack. Vitori's omission today was tactical but I'm sure he will play a role in Harare. We hope he plays a similar role to the one he played against Bangladesh, taking wickets up front. Pakistan have a more solid batting line-up, so it is hard to expect him to have the same impact. Against better opposition he may have to work harder."


Right now Vitori stand behind MoFu and Jarvis in the team.

Jarvis is the fasted bowler in the team. Maturity wise he is also ahead of Jarvis.
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  #45  
Old September 12, 2011, 02:23 PM
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The "destroyer of BD batsman" so far failed to manage a single wicket?
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  #46  
Old September 13, 2011, 08:01 AM
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^^we created complacency in Vitori
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  #47  
Old September 13, 2011, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simon
^^we created complacency in Vitori
totally!
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  #48  
Old September 13, 2011, 11:03 AM
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Is he another Ashraful in making?

If he continue to fail against NZ series, is that right time to name him "Christmas Boy"?

or should we wait for 10 years before we call him "Bhua" ?
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  #49  
Old September 13, 2011, 01:59 PM
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^i would be surprised to see another ash in world cricket..how dare u compare someone with the Mighty one!!
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  #50  
Old September 14, 2011, 12:09 PM
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Vitory got his 1st wicket in the series (9 overs, 66 runs, 1 wicket, Econ 6.88), and still there is not trafic in this Bhuturi Thread?
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