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  #51  
Old March 6, 2011, 06:47 PM
napoleonIV napoleonIV is offline
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Well, I would like to point to another thing. In spite of a string of successes (WC 07, victory against two test playing nations, then two victories against BD before the world cup, and one superb victory over England), the captain says they are not test-ready. We, the Bangladeshis, have lot to learn from this. Unlike us, the Irish look at the bigger picture. They do not want to take the "short-cut" and open themselves to ridicule and humiliation. They want to be patient, get ready, and only then ask for it. On the contrary, we won a single "dead" match (unlike Irish's win over Pakistan and England, our win over Pakistan had no significance) and suddenly we became test ready. We had no patience. We just wanted to take the short-cut. Look, what it has done to us. Not only had we expose ourselves to humiliation, we still don't have a single batsmen with test-attitude.
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  #52  
Old March 6, 2011, 08:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1212
Some of you people need to get back to reality and realize the team isn't as good as everyone seems to think it is. Other than Tamim and Shakib this team is full of garbagemen. This is why fans start getting emotional over performances like the WI game. Bangladesh has never proved worthy of test status and they need to re-earn it.
with only two garbage man we beat ireland not so long ago ....

where was the irish passion that day ..... all the passion finished when they got BD bowled out 205 ????

now IRISH had to chage 206 .... which any professional team with passion should do 90% time

BD had to defend 205 .... which most of the professional and passionate teams will fail to do 90% time ......

do u consider BD as a big boy ???? yes or no ??? if no then tell me how many big boys IRE has beaten so far ????
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  #53  
Old March 6, 2011, 08:10 PM
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Rifat Rifat is offline
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a few thoughts:

*) the main reason behind Irish success is because they take one game at a time. and they take it very seriously.

**) They seemed to have studied the fundamentals of cricket and know how to stick to the basics.

***) Their think tank/strategy(At least based on my observation) is world class. They do their Homework before every match.

Bangladesh, has the potential to replace many current squad members who can perform similarly or even better. does Ireland have that? maybe yes or maybe no. an irishmen is better suited to answer this question.

Last edited by Rifat; March 6, 2011 at 08:16 PM..
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  #54  
Old March 6, 2011, 08:17 PM
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mate 2012 you talking about bangladesh fielding, have you seen our the fielding against the Irish. They dived, they jumped, the slided to save every single runs. tamim's catch was one of the best in this tournament, Roks catch was decent too. No catch was dropped on that day, just look at the highlights of the game please and make such an comment.
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  #55  
Old March 6, 2011, 09:26 PM
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I think there is a case test status for Ireland if Bangladesh can have it. They have a domestic structure although Eng poach some of their quality talent. I don't think they are developing faster than Bangladesh since we have not seen enough of them. They should have played for ODIs after last WC when they defeated Bangladesh and Pakistan. I think perfomance in this WC further reinforces their case. They have a good chance of getting through this group
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  #56  
Old March 6, 2011, 09:27 PM
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The only difference I saw (after India having played both BD and IRE) is that the Irish played the game with the utmost sincerity that a religious man has towards god. They have given nothing away, did the basics right, in all 3 of the games they played they came close to winning or won.
BD needs to work out its batting, if Tamim is your best bat, he needs to stay till the end.

Talent is overrated, Hard-work rarely fails.
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  #57  
Old March 6, 2011, 09:40 PM
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^Also the conditions. They were the most typical Indians conditions. Pitch holding up and turning and Ireland players have not played much in these conditions. I think they have adapted much better than I expected.
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  #58  
Old March 6, 2011, 10:00 PM
amar11432 amar11432 is offline
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Doesn't have to be BD vs IRE. Cricket needs to expand. After watching today's game its obvious the Ireland team has fire in them. ICC needs to make a concrete plan to give test status to Ireland so they don't lose their players to England. If Eoin Morgan was still in the Irish squad, I would back them to make it to the quaterfinals and beyond. I wouldn't be surprise if the Irish team ranks above the BD in 5 years.
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  #59  
Old March 6, 2011, 10:54 PM
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Irish/Ned players get to play in county cricket/big bash etc. often. The quality of domestic cricket in BD quite poor in comparison.
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  #60  
Old March 6, 2011, 11:28 PM
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Yes it is true Ireland is moving up at much faster rate than us. We have NOT developed at the rate we should have. I think Bangladesh being a poor country our government, cricket board and even the fans have given as much as possible to the game of cricket in our country. However it is my opinion that our players have been pampered and spoiled to a certain extent. I mean let's face it when you have players that are in their early 20's and have so much fame and even riches at such an early age it does have an impact on you as a person and one can easily become big headed. Young players like Shakib, Tamim, Mushfiq etc making huge amount of money, real estate, cars, gifts, TV exposure.

I mean my father worked his butt for 40 years holding various government positions in Bangladesh and his life saving after he retired is probably not 5 percent of what these young players have already made in few years. They have been treated like celebrities at such a young age and they may have gotten big headed and have forgotten that they sportsmen not celebrities and they are nothing but the servant of this nation, Again this just my thought, I might be completely wrong.
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  #61  
Old March 7, 2011, 12:12 AM
napoleonIV napoleonIV is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shakil_TX
Yes it is true Ireland is moving up at much faster rate than us. We have NOT developed at the rate we should have. I think Bangladesh being a poor country our government, cricket board and even the fans have given as much as possible to the game of cricket in our country. However it is my opinion that our players have been pampered and spoiled to a certain extent. I mean let's face it when you have players that are in their early 20's and have so much fame and even riches at such an early age it does have an impact on you as a person and one can easily become big headed. Young players like Shakib, Tamim, Mushfiq etc making huge amount of money, real estate, cars, gifts, TV exposure.

I mean my father worked his butt for 40 years holding various government positions in Bangladesh and his life saving after he retired is probably not 5 percent of what these young players have already made in few years. They have been treated like celebrities at such a young age and they may have gotten big headed and have forgotten that they sportsmen not celebrities and they are nothing but the servant of this nation, Again this just my thought, I might be completely wrong.
Shakil Bhai, it sounds a bit as if it is the fault of the current generation of players that they earn so much. But shouldn't we point the finger to ourselves? Did the players ask for a plot after the NZ series? No, it is our PM who gave it, and we, the spineless people. didn't have the guts to take a stand against it. I consider myself one of the biggest ash-bashers and even myself will admit to some extent that it is the idolization by the media and fans that must share some of the blame for his current state. Did Ash asl for such adulation? No. We, the "hujuge" fans and our sensational journalists like Utpol Shuvro made him a Tendulkar and now paying the price for it.

If it comes to money, then this current generation of players should instead be commended for not going to ICL, when our gentleman captain Habibul Bashar led a group of potential cricketers and severely weakened our team-strength. We should not put blame on someone for something that he cannot control. Shakib/Tamim never asked for the over-hype that has been created about them nor does it mean that such over-the-top adulation disqualifies them from reacting strongly when their own houses get attacked.

In fact, the whole problem dates back to much earlier. I strongly feel that it was a very bad decision on our part to go for test status so early. We were far off the mark at that point, much far off the the mark than Ireland is at present. Since we decided to take a short-cut instead of the more slow process of gradual improvement, we suddenly find ourselves stuck with 22-year olds with no one to guide them.
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  #62  
Old March 7, 2011, 12:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by napoleonIV
Shakil Bhai, it sounds a bit as if it is the fault of the current generation of players that they earn so much. But shouldn't we point the finger to ourselves? Did the players ask for a plot after the NZ series? No, it is our PM who gave it, and we, the spineless people. didn't have the guts to take a stand against it. I consider myself one of the biggest ash-bashers and even myself will admit to some extent that it is the idolization by the media and fans that must share some of the blame for his current state. Did Ash asl for such adulation? No. We, the "hujuge" fans and our sensational journalists like Utpol Shuvro made him a Tendulkar and now paying the price for it.

If it comes to money, then this current generation of players should instead be commended for not going to ICL, when our gentleman captain Habibul Bashar led a group of potential cricketers and severely weakened our team-strength. We should not put blame on someone for something that he cannot control. Shakib/Tamim never asked for the over-hype that has been created about them nor does it mean that such over-the-top adulation disqualifies them from reacting strongly when their own houses get attacked.

In fact, the whole problem dates back to much earlier. I strongly feel that it was a very bad decision on our part to go for test status so early. We were far off the mark at that point, much far off the the mark than Ireland is at present. Since we decided to take a short-cut instead of the more slow process of gradual improvement, we suddenly find ourselves stuck with 22-year olds with no one to guide them.
Dear brother NapoleoniV. There is nothing wrong with players making money and our cricketers are certainly not at fault for their fame and fortune. I probably did not explain or express myself clear enough. However my problem is not with the money and fame they received, my concern is how is this all affecting them as cricketers and as representatives of our country.

Our cricketers should consider all these money and fame as a privilege and should be humble and grateful and give back their best in return. My concern is whether all this fame and fortune they have received in such a short period of time have gotten into their heads and if they have been distracted from their main focus and which is devoting their 100% to cricket, whether they have gotten side tracked here.

However in my opinion this is only one of the many factors why we have not developed at a rate that we should have. People can say whatever they want but getting all out in 58 runs in a world cup match and in your own home ground is simply unacceptable and inexcusable, This just shows that we have major issues and flaws with our cricketers and cricketing system.

Do our players lack of talent? I don't think so. What I think they have been missing is "GAME TEMPERAMENT". And I have a feeling all this money and fame could be affecting their game temperament.
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Last edited by Shakil_TX; March 7, 2011 at 01:02 AM..
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  #63  
Old March 7, 2011, 01:03 AM
SUS SUS is offline
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So many pointless posts here that I felt like losing the plot even before I reached the halfway stage of this post.What I have seen here so far is mostly typical Bangladeshi emotion without the facts & figures.
First some words on Ireland.I don't know when they started playing cricket & it is irrelevant here.What is important is that they have played a very small number of one day internationals & yet developed much more than expected.Withing 2 50 over world cups,they have beaten Pakistan & England,tied with Zimbabwe,competed well against India too.In its very first world cup it got Pakistan allout for just 132,for us just for 170 odd.In its second world cup it chased down a mammoth 327 against a bowling lineup comprising the likes of Anderson,Broad,Swann.Bresnan.Yes the pitch was a belter but was it the first excellent batting pitch in all world cups combined ? definitely not.& yet this is the highest successful chase in all world cups combined.How tremendous is that ? Ireland beat us neck & crop in 2007,neck & crop in 2009 T20 World Cup,& again in 2010.That's 3 wins in 4 years against a test nation ! Since the 2007 World Cup,they have achieved 5 wins over test nations in ODIs-& let us not forget the fact that don't play against test nations at all.How many years did it take us to win 5 matches against test nations ? Pakistan in 1999,Zimbabwe & India in 2004,Australia in 2005 & Sri Lanka in 2006-that's a whopping 7 years-& don't forget that we've always played regular cricket against the test nations,something Ireland has never had the fortune of!In between,there were consecutive 47 winless ODIs for us-the most by a country mile.
Somebody was talking about Kenya-it is a similar case there.By 2003,they were galaxies ahead of us in terms of performance.After the 2003 world cup,how many matches did they play against test nations ? A quadrangular tournament just after the 2003 world cup & a Bangladesh tour in 2006-that's all they managed before the 2007 world cup.After the 2007 world cup,they did not play against any test nation at all before their next assignment-world cup 2011.Can you imagine that ? From one World Cup to another-no matches against test nations in between ! How can you expect them to even compete ?
The Irish play county cricket-why ? Because they are good enough.After their tour of Bangladesh in early 2008,this world cup is Ireland's 1st tour to the subcontinent,but could you guess that by the way they have batted so far in this tournament ?
When Ireland toured Bangladesh in 2008,they did not get blown away in any of the matches-they scored really good totals for an associate nation playing its first international match in the subcontinent.Even in 2010,they beat us.In this world cup,Ireland would have beaten us again had their inexperience & our crowd not come into play-& that's a tremendous tribute to them.We had to take the advantage of our own conditions to beat them even after playing 10 years of test cricket !
Somebody was saying that Ireland lost to the likes of Afghanistan & such before the world cup.Well,first of all,the Irish are still an associate nation & not an ESTABLISHED test team.The criticism of this post by some people is of an ESTABLISHED test team-& that's another tribute to the Irish that their performances sometimes don't make you realise that they aren't a test nation yet.They may lose the odd game to the likes of Afghanistan because those are the teams Ireland play against all the time,& it is only the "odd" game.& let us not forget that apart from Scotland & UAE(against whom we've played only once),we have lost to all other nations we have come against.Kenya,Ireland,Canada,Netherlands-you name them.Even in 2010,the defeats to Ireland & Netherlands were comprehensive.Forget test cricket,we've beaten a full strength test nation in an ODI series only ONCE after 10 years of hard test cricket.
Continued.....
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  #64  
Old March 7, 2011, 01:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mahir
It's such a piss-off at times, seriously.

Can we PLEASE put on a post-count or "member since" sort of qualification before someone can post in the forum, Tehsin bhai ? I'm begging you
Mahir vai post na korte parle post count kivabe hobe!

anyway we shouldn't impose this rules..everybody has the right to speak..if they are saying bogus then there are people to show them that with logic
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  #65  
Old March 7, 2011, 01:31 AM
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Well we know we BD peeps are inefficient that's all

time to get efficient...
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  #66  
Old March 7, 2011, 01:45 AM
Shartaz Shartaz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SUS
S Since the 2007 World Cup,they have achieved 5 wins over test nations in ODIs-& let us not forget the fact that don't play against test nations at all.
Would you like to tell me who their 5 wins were over, I know they beat us once since the 2007 world cup, what about the other 4?
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  #67  
Old March 7, 2011, 02:02 AM
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Good for the Irish.
We'd give them a big medal from Stadium market.
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  #68  
Old March 7, 2011, 02:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shartaz
Would you like to tell me who their 5 wins were over, I know they beat us once since the 2007 world cup, what about the other 4?
1.vs pak
1.vs zim
1.vs eng
2.vs us

i think he wanted to say since 2007 wc(including it)
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Last edited by Night_wolf; March 7, 2011 at 02:28 AM..
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  #69  
Old March 7, 2011, 02:23 AM
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Good for Ireland...maybe we should play together more often and help each other out....BCB and Irish cricket I mean....I am sure Ireland will further benifit from it...playing in our pitch, our slow spin bowlers more and more, our humidity and we as well, playing in Ire and against their fast bowlers, their weather. The Irish crciket team in general has a lot to offer to our team and boys, determination, focus, technique, grammer (cricket), I mean tons of things...it's all for the good and mental and physical prosperity, right bros??...I mean what is a forum for, whatever for, but we make ourselves look real ugly, through forums I mean....we forget it all could be used for the good.
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Last edited by bujhee kom; March 7, 2011 at 03:00 AM..
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  #70  
Old March 7, 2011, 02:47 AM
SUS SUS is offline
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@Shartaz :-
2007 World Cup-Ireland defeated us
2007 World Cup-Ireland defeated Pakistan
2009 World T20-Ireland defeated us
2010-Ireland defeated us-I guess in Belfast
2011 World Cup-Ireland defeated England
easy stats buddy !
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  #71  
Old March 7, 2011, 02:54 AM
SUS SUS is offline
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@Shartaz :- I made one mistake though;I meant limited overs cricket,not only ODIs but also T20Is.I should have said "Since the 2007 World Cup,they have achieved 5 wins over test nations in ODIs T20Is-& let us not forget the fact that don't play against test nations at all." Sorry for my mistake.
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  #72  
Old March 7, 2011, 03:26 AM
yashsaxena yashsaxena is offline
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I hope IRE will be in quarter final team in next world cup . . .
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  #73  
Old March 7, 2011, 05:03 AM
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Lots of us Bangladeshis love to say that this nation took this many years to win their first test match,test series,etc.But this means absolutely nothing.What matters is HOW MANY TESTS you play to win your first test match & series,the opposition,& how you fare in all tests regularly.India & New Zealand took more years to win their first test match but they did not fare as miserably in their previous tests as we did before our first test win.They drew lots of tests by their own ability,not by rain.The two teams (Sri Lanka & Zimbabwe) who got test status before us already had world class cricketers by the time they got their test status.In our case,we have produced our only world class cricketer in Sakib Al Hasan after 10 years of test cricket (I did not mention Tamim Iqbal because had he been world class,he would have been picked up in both IPL & county cricket).The fact that external world is not against us & is willing to reward our good performances is proved by the fact that Sakib Al Hasan has been picked up for both the IPL & county cricket.Had they been against us,Sakib would never have been picked.
How have we fared in test cricket ? 68 tests,3 wins-one against a depleted Zimbabwe side & 2 against a West Indies "C" team (even then we managed to get into considerable trouble against them),6 draws-4 due to rain,1 against a depleted Zimbabwe side & only 1 draw earned by playing 5 days against a full-strength West Indies team,& 59 losses-most of which by an innings & plenty,& one or two fights here & there.No other test team has been even close to being as abysmal & woeful in their first 68 tests as we have been,& hell,the statistics don't seem like changing soon.& yet we shout that we deserve our test status ?
Even after we were "gifted" our test status,we continued being shocking not only in tests but also in ODIs-as I pointed out in my previous posts.Ireland have been so much more impressive than us in the first stages of the two teams' respective ODI careers,but they know that does not mean they can be a good test side just now.That is why Trent Johnston has said that they are not ready for test cricket yet.That's maturity for you.They don't want to embarrass themselves by prematurely receiving their test status.What they want is more ODIs & first class matches against top teams regularly so that they can prepare themselves for test cricket in such a manner that they can become a competitive test force within a few years of their test career-something we are not even close to being after spending 10 years in the test arena.& what did we do ? After one upset against Pakistan in 1999,we kept on shouting that we are ready for tests,the ICC gifted us the test status accordingly,& the results are there for all of us to see.
To be continued....
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  #74  
Old March 7, 2011, 05:13 AM
Zunaid Zunaid is offline
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SUS - we have been there done that. There have been umpteen million posts and even articles published on BC on this very topic. Go revisit. An important fact you might not have thought about (yes, our members have done that too and an article and several detailed posts exists on this) is that much of the Tests of old were not 5 day - they were 3-day or 4-day Tests. No wonder, even an outclassed team would come out with a draw.

Granted we may have been awarded our Test status before we were ready but you know what - we have it now and we intend to keep it. Rest is noise.

So remember - water under the bridge. Let it go - look forward.
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  #75  
Old March 7, 2011, 05:17 AM
SUS SUS is offline
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@Zunaid :- All right,show me the tests which were 3 day or 4 day.Come on,give me the link which will prove your claim.
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