A Conspiracy

[Rabz]

Thanks for that massive post Shaad bhai.
Once a believer, then a skeptic and now confused.

Havent read your whole post yet, but i'd definitely would.
Looks like its gonna solve a lot of my confusion.

[BD-Shardul]

deleted

[Tokai]

Those pictures are all PHOTOSHOPED!!!!

Dont ask me when Photoshop first came out though :P

[damalChele]

Originally Posted by shaad
No it won't, if you have an open and a critical mind. I have already addressed many of the so-called "points" it raises in my initial response to BD-Shardul's post. If you want a point by point refutation, do look at Phil Plait's elegant critique on his Bad Astronomy web site.

And keep in mind, that this was made by Fox, a company which is more interested in sensationalism (and thus ratings) than truth, the very same company that also made the "documentary" Alien Autopsy, which Fox later admitted was fake, which runs news reports which it calls "balanced and fair," but are patently not (if you are going to watch a documentary on Google, I recommend OUTFOXED: Rupert Murdoch's War on Journalism instead).

Seriously, as I posted in my previous "jhari", be critical, and think for youself. Don't necessarily accept everything you see on TV or read as the gospel truth. Learn what Occam's razor is, if you don't already, and apply it to the two competing hypotheses: (i) that we landed men on the moon, or (ii) a massive conspiracy involving thousands of people in the know was carried out successfully to fake the landings.

Shaad bahi you haven't watched either of the clips, I assume. I am sure you are open minded. If you do you might reconsider your position. I won't argue with your point on over sensationalising a documentary for rating. But the questions they posed in that documentary demands some answers.

Back in the 69 there were a lot going on. Cold war with russia, space battle and so on. They had every reason to hoax this event.

In all fairness I haven't read anything that debunks this mythical trip. I will try to read your post..in the mean time I hope you watch them clips

[damalChele]

Originally Posted by Tokai
Those pictures are all PHOTOSHOPED!!!!

Dont ask me when Photoshop first came out though :P

So they had the money and technology to send someone on the moon but not enough brain to develop a software internally to manipulate those pictures?? NASA's technology is atleast 10-15 years ahead of it's time, in my opinion.

[shaad]

Originally Posted by damalChele
Shaad bahi you haven't watched either of the clips, I assume. I am sure you are open minded. If you do you might reconsider your position. I won't argue with your point on over sensationalising a documentary for rating. But the questions they posed in that documentary demands some answers.

damalChele, I have watched both the "documentaries" the clips are taken from, before they were posted on the Net. The questions posed in the first clip, Conspiracy Theory: Did We Land on the Moon? are answered both by me earlier in this thread, and more elegantly by Phil Plait at his Bad Astronomy website here, and by Jim Scotti at the University of Arizona, here. They will also be addressed in the video clips attached towards the end of this message.

Let's move on now to Bart Sibrel's "documentary", A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon. I am going to post some video responses. Please watch them. I think the complete video, Lunar Legacy (particularly Parts 3 and 4) will make it abundantly clear that Sibrel's "documentary" is nothing other than an assemblage of lies made up by a charlatan.

Part 1: MoonDust


Part 2: The American Flag


Part 3: Peddling Propaganda



Part 4: Portholes & Transparencies - I was unable to embed this successfully (it was removed from Youtube because one of the hoax supporters didn't care to be shown up as the ignorant idiot that he was and complained about footage of him being presented), so follow this link to the video instead.

Part 5: Validation


Now some comments. Most of us who are scientists or researchers or even explorers, be it biologists, physicists, or those involved in space exploration, are generally not in it for the money. Believe me, we could certainly make more in other fields of work. We do what we do because it interests us, because we feel that the search for truth and the advancement of human knowledge (yes, I know it sounds bombastic, but bear with me) is a goal worth pursuing. Landing on the moon was a glorious human achievement, one in which numerous researchers, scientists, mathematicians, technicians, and professionals in diverse fields played a part, one for which astronauts paid the price with their lives (Apollo 1), an achievement that we as a race should be proud of.

And yet, what do we see here? Claims that the moon landing was a hoax, fanned by a few charlatans (I'm not talking about the posters on this thread, they were just ignorant; I mean people like David Milne, Bart Sibrel, and the producers of the Fox documentary), not because they have a any particular loyalty to or interest in the truth, but simply because they want to make money selling their books or DVDs to a gullible public -- the very same books and DVDs which these videos show to be nothing other than an assemblage of lies. If I sound disgusted, it's because some of you fell for their line of bullshit.

[tonoy]

Thank you shaad for such a wonderful documentry. I have personally watched all the conspiracy videos and frankly none of the evidence they presented seemed any credible. And Finally seeing your documentry should leave no question unanswered what so ever. I just wish that this documentry is distributed more, so that the mass can have no questions to these false accusations.

[shaad]

tonoy, I am sure you know this, but just to prevent any misunderstanding or undue credit, I feel obliged to say I had nothing to do with the documentary other than posting their links here. They were made by Svector, and based on a mass of information from NASA archives, the spacecraft.com movie site, clavius.org, Phil Plait's Bad Astonomy blog, and others.

[Dhurr]

Anyone who believes in conspiracy theories is an idiot. Thanks, Shaad, for putting all the conspiracy theories regarding this to rest.

[auntu]

Shaad bhai eita to Thesis hoye gelo. map chai. tobe jotil explanation

[shaad]

Originally Posted by auntu
Shaad bhai eita to Thesis hoye gelo. map chai. tobe jotil explanation

auntu, ki aar korbo, that's the problem with us scientists. A conspiracy theorist or a politician can easily offer a sound bite or two (regardless of whether it is true or not) to try to sway people's minds. We instead are obliged to provide the entire truth, not just selectively chosen and modified little bits of information designed to mislead people. Unfortunately, that's often tedious, boring, and thesis-er moto lomba.

[thebest]

This is for those who believe everything in net.
Shaad vai, wonderful. I wonder how I miss it previously.

[Zeeshan]

This is for everyone who don't question the reality.

[Orpheus]

You know I read a lot of posts on how informed and educated the members of this forum is. I think we are kidding ourselves. I think random sample of youtube posters and a random sample of BC posters will not show any significant difference in education and/or intelligence level.

I mean this is not really a religious thread. This is not evolution that it is in conflict with one's belief system. It is a historical event.

I shudder to think what the result would be with a poll: Did Holocaust happen? Really guys you should all be ashamed of yourselves and we should all be ashamed to be part of this "diverse" forum.

[One World]

I do no like uneven parallel bars.
What really stopped us to go to the moon again?

[CholCholBD]

O comeon, dont compare the holocaust to apollo 11..that is so Faux news of u.... so was that weak youtube/bc analogy.....

[Zeeshan]

Bharism. Article 2 Section 9.1: All acts and theatrical stagings of life's drama are like the Buddhist Maya and hoax created by God to test our Faith much like the one in a Grand Shakespearean stage or Hollywood set.

Article 2 Section 9.1.1 Don't take previous axiom too seriously, but just keep in the back of your mind.

Damn, you guys don't get high that much, do you? Or don't like to ponder what if we are straightjacketed in this world like the men in Plato's cave and watching a Truman show?

[Rifat]

Originally Posted by Beamer
There are many moon rocks on display in museums, brought back to Earth, and has been researched by many scientists. Are you prepared to say that all of them were part of a conspiracy, or worse yet, liars?

Actually, that is not the problem you have. You will be the first one to open a thread, if say hypothetically, an "Islamic" nation, that conforms with your definition of an Islamic state, manages to land a mission on the moon. It will be great then. Wouldn't it? The way I see it, people like you ( not being personal here ) who continue to see things with religious tint in every matter is the crux of the problem facing Islamic nations today. What we need is a revival of the glorious age that Islam had eight hundred years ago, when it lead the world in science, innovation, philosophy etc.This long period of intellectual dormancy is serving none of us any good. You make yourself look silly and irrelevant when you claim falsehoods to be true based on your prejudice. Just as the West profited from early Islamic innovation, we should be open to learn a few things or two from them ( they have a lot to offer if you want to learn). Unless you think science is unimportant, then, the whole point is mute. How long will we live in denial? Wake up.

Beamer, i understand your input in defending the moon landing case, but i fail to see how all this relate to "Islam" or your criticism of it...

just out of curiousity..how does the moon landing being false promote ISlam? i do not think Da'wah or Shardul bhai were promoting "Islam" here through their posts?

but you do raise a valid point(through sheer cold sarcasm)...we should always question anything and everything we see because human perception and intellect is indeed always biased.

Muslims take pride in their faith because they see it and want to share this vision with others but the reality is if Allah doesn't guide someone then who are we to shed light on other people's understanding of life?

and no, believeing in Islam does not render science irrevelant! it actually confirms it

no personal attacks just plain curiosity...

[Beamer]

That post , oddly an year ago, had nothing to do with Islam, but was an observation on my part about the thinking process of a few members. Now, if you believe that it was an attack on Islam, then by all means, go ahead and think so. Obviously you have chosen to ignore the fact that I mentioned about the glorious past of Islamic age.

I stand on what I said, and Yes, BD-Shardul and I actually get along fine here. Now, move on please! I am sure you have things to do..

[Rifat]

thank you, Beamer for clarifying my misunderstanding