Moonsighting or Moonfighting

[Dawah]

Every year, before the month of Ramadan, there are large battle goes on in Muslim world in the west on which is the 1st day of Ramadan or when is Eid.

Back in our home, we always started Ramadan and did Eid based on local Moonsighting. This is true for Muslims from other S. Asian countries like India, Pakistan, Srilanka, Maldeves etc. They all sight the moon locally and start/end Ramadan based on the sighting.

But, as soon as we come to the West, we become utterly confused to when to start/end ramadan.

One entire Pakistani Muslim community in U.K start/end Ramadan based on moon sighting in Pakistan, as if they are still in Pakistan . May be they want to keep their strong relation going. Similarly, Arab brothers in the West feel very strong ties with their homeland. As soon as moon is sighted in any Arab countries, mashaAllah, they will start/end Ramadan/Eid. Like the Pakistani community in UK, our Arab brothers probably want to keep strong ties with their homeland.

Our Bangaldeshi brothers are unique in that sense. Since most of our brothers do not really care about practicing Islam in the west (since we are in the west to get education or earn money, so I have been told many times[/ ), they say "I will follow whatever the President of our Islamic center decides. or I will follow whatever the Arab sheikh Dr. XYZ decides" Our Bangladeshi Muslims who usually do not have any positive feelings about any arabs, suddenly becomes great fan of the Arab sheikh Dr. XYZ.

One great thing happens in Ramadan, our Bangladeshi so called "modern" Muslim brothers starts showing up in Iftar parties That's how I usually meet them, and show our other tablighi brothers from other nations that there are also other Muslims in Bangladesh, not just me

But, it is a good thing that our desi brothers are at least coming to the masjid for something! So keep coming, Islam does not belong to Pakis or Arabs only. Islam is also ours



Edited on, September 30, 2005, 9:35 PM GMT, by Dawah.

[AsifTheManRahman]

Originally posted by Dawah
Back in our home, we always started Ramadan and did Eid based on local Moonsighting. This is true for Muslims from other S. Asian countries like India, Pakistan, Srilanka, Maldeves etc.

thats utter crap. Eid back in Bangladesh always depended on whether the PM was done with her shopping.

[Dawah]

Originally posted by AsifTheManRahman
[thats utter crap. Eid back in Bangladesh always depended on whether the PM was done with her shopping.

I see things have changed since I last went to Bangaldesh.

[AsifTheManRahman]

when did u last go there? i remember it always being like that, at least until i came over to Canada.

[Dawah]

Originally posted by AsifTheManRahman
when did u last go there? i remember it always being like that, at least until i came over to Canada.

Well, we used to go on top of our roof to sight moon every year! Ah those good old days......

In Bangladesh, they have a moonsighting committee of the scholars which sights/takes report of moon sighting from every part of Bangladesh.

Edited on, September 30, 2005, 9:42 PM GMT, by Dawah.

[AsifTheManRahman]

yeah. but the problem was that the decisions they used to make were always contradictory and causes of debate.

[Dawah]

Originally posted by AsifTheManRahman
yeah. but the problem was that the decisions they used to make were always contradictory and causes of debate.

Who did they contradict? The Biharies who followed moon sighting of Pakistan or the Arabs who were working in Saudi Embassy who followed Saudi? Or the Ahlel hadith whoes sheikh Abdul Wahhab was doing Eid on a different day?

Or did it contradict moonsighting of USA ?

Being a tablighi, we always did our own moonsighting (our family thing). Our sighting never contradicted the Govt. announcement till I came to US.


Edited on, September 30, 2005, 9:48 PM GMT, by Dawah.

[AsifTheManRahman]

i remember people in different regions would celebrate Eid on different days. Personally, I do not think Bangladesh has a large enough landmass for the moon to be seen on different days in different places. so in a way, even Bangladeshis living in Bangladesh celebrate Eid based on the predictions of a small group of people, which has a high chance of being wrong, since one sub-committee or the other has to screw up; or else we wouldn't have people celebrating on different days over an area of 144,000 sq km.

[AsifTheManRahman]

Originally posted by Dawah
Our sighting never contradicted the Govt. announcement till I came to US.
Edited on, September 30, 2005, 9:48 PM GMT, by Dawah.

oh boy. then you might just have been late on a couple of occassions

Originally posted by Dawah
Or did it contradict moonsighting of USA ?
Edited on, September 30, 2005, 9:48 PM GMT, by Dawah.

nah, nothing like that. it's bound to contradict that of the USA - the two are in different corners of the world. however, like i said in my post above, the general declaration did contradict those of various areas within the country, which leaves questions.

personally, i would like to be able to be fully certain that I'm celebrating on the right day.

Edited on, September 30, 2005, 9:59 PM GMT, by AsifTheManRahman.

[Dawah]

Originally posted by AsifTheManRahman
personally, i would like to be able to be fully certain that I'm celebrating on the right day.

That is why we always did our moonsighting ourselves to be sure. And I am kind of suprised that you found contradiction, and I never had one. Even after I left BD, I have been in good touch, and there has been no contradiction on naked eye moon sighting. We only needed to sight the moon on the 1st day, ie. new moon. So how can this go wrong when millions of people are watching out for the last two days of the previous month as in the custom of BD.

Could you direct me to any link/info on this contradiction in BD moonsighting.

Are you saying there were conflicting report on when moon was sighted on naked eye or based on some calculation? Or the method of sighting?

All of Bangladesh follows naked eye sighting, not calculation as far as I know other than the Ahlel hadith/salafie groups.

Edited on, September 30, 2005, 10:01 PM GMT, by Dawah.

[AsifTheManRahman]

no, not on naked_eye-sighting (unless that's what the authorities do ) . it was based on the declaration of committees in various parts of the country.

my beliefs were somewhat confirmed when i myself discovered a couple of times that the moon looked too big for a new one on the official Eid eve.

as for links - i really don't have any, but it would be nice to go through prothom alo around Ramadan time. you might be able to find interesting stuff, if it happens this year too.

[Dawah]

Originally posted by AsifTheManRahman
no, not on naked_eye-sighting (unless that's what the authorities do ) . it was based on the declaration of committees in various parts of the country.

That is what they do, sight the moon with naked-eye.

my beliefs were somewhat confirmed when i myself discovered a couple of times that the moon looked too big for a new one on the official Eid eve.

Hadith of Nabi(saw) says to the nearest meaning, Start fasting when you see the moon..... It does not say see the new moon. So in an area if the people even after making maximum effort to sight the new moon with naked-eye fails to see it, then could wait a day to try see it again. Maximum delay being 1 day, since Islamic months cannot be smaller than 29 days or longer than 30 days. So in BD, if they did fail to see new moon on the 1st day of its appearance, but did manage to see it next day, than 1st day of Fasting will start from following day and the night being 1st night on Ramadan, hence taraweeh.

People confuse moonsighting with new moon. It is incorrect. It does not have to be New moon. What can we do if we fail to see the new moon for whatever reason. So Allah made it ehsan for us, by not requiring the 1st day of New moon.

Again Islamic months, cannot be 28 days. It is 29 days or max 30 days. So in this Month, now Arabic month Shaban, we need to start sighting the moon on 29th night of Shaban. That is the 1st possible sight of New Moon. If we do not see it on 29th night, then we know next day is 30th of Shaban, and following day Must be 1st of Ramadan, even if we fail to see moon on 30th night of Shaban.

Hope I am clear on my explanation, waAllahu Alam.


Edited on, September 30, 2005, 10:16 PM GMT, by Dawah.

[Dawah]

So, when you saw the moon the following day, and you though it did look much bigger, it is not an issue at all.
Key to moonsighting are these:

1. Do not have to be new moon, but must be sighted,
2. Islamic month cannot be shorter than 29 days and maximum 30 days.

Month:

Shaban: 1,2,3,4,5, .... 28,29,30 Ramadan 1,2..29,30

So now do the math. The most important night is the 29th of the month, not 30th. If you fail to sight the moon on 29th night, then by default new month starts after 30th of this month.



Edited on, September 30, 2005, 10:23 PM GMT, by Dawah.

[thebest]

i fondly remember we run to the roof on the 29th ramadan after taking drink to have a sight of Eid moon. But I now forgot when I last enjoyed that. Once 4 /5 yrs ago my brother told me that the learn to know about eid on 10 o clock news. Though he stayed on roof for the whole evening to watch the moon. It was more a political decision my friends and family claim. I remember once I broke fast around 12 pm when i learned from my Nigerian friend that it was eid day all over europe.

[tiger_man]

me too.....

i remember taking my binocular and going to the roof with my mum and sis and stare at sunny west.....
my eyes wud hurt when i came down......

guys remember the eid when hasina announced eid like 9.30 or 10 o clock....???? half the country already went to bed then.....this happened like 5 or 6 years earlier...or sth like...cant remember the exact year...

i bet she finished her last bit shopping b4 announcing out....

[DJ Sahastra]

Moonsighting is a fantastic thing.

Reminds me of a very good song on Moonsighting:

"Mera Chaand Mujhe ... Aaya Hai Nazar... Aye Raat Zara .. Thham Thaam Ke Guzar ... Chhaya Hai Nasha ... Meri Aankhon Par .... Aye Raat Zara ... Thham Thaam Ke Guzar ... "