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  #1  
Old April 18, 2003, 01:43 PM
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bd_cricket bd_cricket is offline
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Default questions behind dropping pilot

Just read prothom alo.
They are saying that the decision of dropping pilot was based on inquiry committee finding indisciplinary behaviour of him during the world cup. Basically they wanted to punish Pilot for that by dropping him even before the inquiry report is published. Isn't that ridiculous? Won't that make the report look like fabricated to validate their decision of punishing Pilot?

Sham, did you hear anything from your uncle about the accusation on Pilot during the WC? Prothom Alo also mentioned that Pilot was warned by the ICC security once for his action. What are these all about? Are those true? Any idea?


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  #2  
Old April 18, 2003, 03:53 PM
Sham Sham is offline
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Default Yes

I have heard a lot about Pilot. Actually, I was shocked. Remember I had written an article for the inquiry committee about my take on the state of BD cricket? I had basically heaped praise on Pilot, even suggesting that he be convinced to carry on as captain. However, once the inquiry started, the skeletons started coming out of the closet regarding Pilot and honestly guys, some of the allegations against him are very serious.

Actually, one allegation in particular is very serious and it will have to be looked into. Personally, I don't believe the allegation is true, but if it is, it will have serious consequences. I am really sorry that I can't tell you guys everything about what is going on. Truth is, I am not supposed to know myself I guess. But since the inquiry committee has been asking me for my opinions from time to time, I think I'll keep my mouth shut for the time being and retain their confidence.

Let me just tell you one thing guys, the inquiry committee has nothing against Pilot. They have no agenda against him at all. So they have no reason to want to punish Pilot other than for what they are finding out, and secondly, they have even less reason to fabricate their report to validate punishing Pilot. They know that dropping Pilot is an extremely unpopular thing, and they would not suggest such a thing (if they have, I am not sure that they have) and the selectors wouldn't do such a thing, unless there were serious reasons for doing so.
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  #3  
Old April 18, 2003, 04:16 PM
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Zobair Zobair is offline
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Default sigh...

I don't even know what to say! Hopefully it will all end well in the interest of our cricket team...i guess then it is not such a bad idea to give pilot a break coz if what you (sham) say is true, then we can hardly expect him to focus properly when he knows he is being investigated for a very serious allegation.
This is really sad...sigh!

[Edited on 18-4-2003 by pompous]
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  #4  
Old April 18, 2003, 05:36 PM
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Quote:
Actually, one allegation in particular is very serious and it will have to be looked into
Since you are not allowed to tell us ... I respect that. But let's play a game!! HOw close we can get? I am sure you have played that game before. Basically your answer would be either anywhere between "very close" and "Get the f*** outta here"

My Guess:

Since I don't know how serious is "very serious" when described by you Sham. So it is kind of hard to guess what happened. To me serious is a "rape case". But for Pilot I say

He probably slapped some one! Or had a physical fight with some other player. That's all!

I never felt this curious about anything lately. Last time that I remember I was this curious was at age 11 when I saw my first ****! Oh those sweet memories!

Give me a hint!!!! PLEASEEEEE!!!!!

You know what? Lemme make it easier for you...
GIve me 3 examples of "very serious" issues according to you!

[Edited on 18-4-2003 by Orpheus]
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  #5  
Old April 18, 2003, 05:59 PM
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Hint: Pilot became enamoured by his room-mate !
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  #6  
Old April 18, 2003, 06:46 PM
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Default Okay

Guys, remember firstly that allegations don't mean anything in Bangladesh. Secondly, although the allegation is serious, nothing has been found till date to substantiate it. As far as I am concerned, I would be EXTREMELY surprised if it turns out to be true. However, allegations of this nature have to be investigated.

About the allegations itself, send me u2u's guys and I'll play the game with some of you guys in private rather than on the message board. Right now, you guys are way off.

[Edited on 18-4-2003 by Sham]
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  #7  
Old April 18, 2003, 07:14 PM
Sham Sham is offline
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Default Just when I was being all judicious

with the information regarding Pilot, the Daily Star has come out and spilled it out. If you guys haven't read it yet, there have been allegations of match-fixing against Pilot. The allegation was leveled after the last match against Kenya where two easy catches did go down. Also, in the first match against Canada, remember the shot Pilot played to get out?

I still don't think there is any truth to it. But match-fixing has become such a major issue in world cricket that allegations of this nature have to be investigated and given importance. Who would ever have thought that Cronje would have been involved in match-fixing? So there it is guys, very very sad. I was so depressed when I first heard it, since I am such a big fan of Pilot myself. This is why I was saying after Pilot got dropped from the last ODI that things have come to a stage where his off-field activities can no longer be ignored!




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  #8  
Old April 18, 2003, 07:35 PM
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James90 James90 is offline
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Well after the Kenyan game i wondered if the all were match-fixing

Hansie would have been the captain when he match-fixed wouldn't he???
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  #9  
Old April 18, 2003, 07:42 PM
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Default HEHE

Where does the arrogance come here I don't know? Yes I am shocked too but Now my question is where is all these allegations coming from? If it's from your neutral uncle after finding something - then I will shut up. But if it's from some one else - all I gotta say is - Bullshit.

This is just publicity! If we can somehow convince the world that the loses against Canada and Kenya were fixed! Our test status will be intact. Then again our reputation will go down the toilet.

First of all - labeling canada match as matchfixing is just ridiculous! Kenya - I can understand! They have a cause! Then I am also suspecting that the win agains SL might also be fixed. Does kenya has that much money?
If it is match fixing - Mashud can't be the only one to be involved. It wasn't only Mashud who played bad against the minnows.

If it turns out to be true... Mashud is dead!

[Edited on 19-4-2003 by Orpheus]
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  #10  
Old April 18, 2003, 07:47 PM
Sham Sham is offline
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Well, the allegations are obviously not from my uncle. The allegations are from others within the team and the management who have made these allegations TO the inquiry committee. Like I said, personally, I don't think there is any truth to it. I don't even think that this is being done to keep our Test status intact. I just think that some people saw a couple of easy catches go down and figured, something is up, he must have taken money.

Anyway, I'll be really happy if this thing gets cleared up.
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  #11  
Old April 18, 2003, 08:45 PM
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Sham, what is this about your uncle? I must have missed something somewhere.

My first reaction after reading today's Daily Star is that Pilot does not even have the NERVES to win a match in International cricket. So, all this match fixing allegations are just publicity to hide something - my belief is that it is a stint to hide the fact that Pilot doesn't have nerves.

Before the Canada match, the last match that we had to win under Pilot's captancy was against Holland - in a practice match before the ICC Knockout. In that match, Pilot scored only 1 and then got out when it was only required to stay at the wicket for a while and get a few number of runs. Then it was Kapali and Sujon who remained unbeaten to bring us home.

Now it all might sound OK if we had not won against Namibia - 4 times out of 5 and also one warm up match against a Provincial side just 1 week before the game against Canada.

Lets see, also if the allegations come out to be true (which I think never will - come out in the open) then the following players including Pilot are should be invovled in match fixing:

1) Alok Kapali - yes, he is young, but he is one player who could have tried to get us home against Canada - but didn't - and he is a very popular guy - right now (so I am under a lot of pounding even namig Kapali in this rank)

2) Sumon - him, too, since he scored 20 odd runs in the last warm up match but could not score a single run against Canada

3) Rokon - I think he is one of the players who was in terrific form after that 170 odd runs against Namibia and a couple of big innings in both warm up games, but just did not deliver in the actual world cup

4) Seejan - He is the other player for whom Bangladesh won the 2nd warm up match and yet he could not do it against Canada.

Well there could be a lot of other players who can join this list.

I personally don't believe that these 4 players and also Pilot can't be involved in match fixing allegations because - especially because there is no motive. Pilot will be getting a lot of money even for playing in the world cup from the BCB under the new contract. And also a win could make them even richer by getting different kinds of gifts just for winning - which would exceed whatever money a player would have received after fixing a match.

So, to me, the main thing is "NERVES" - nobody in the team was in any position to handle the pressure, and to me, this incapability of the players is a bigger thing than allegations of match fixing which can never be proved.

The only guy who has the capability of handling this pressure is Sujon - as he showed when he was bowling against Kenya. But then again - he could not handle the pressure with the bat while chasing.
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  #12  
Old April 18, 2003, 08:56 PM
Sham Sham is offline
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See allegations werent brought against any of the other people, just against Pilot. Thats the big problem here. I mean everyone plays badly, nothing happens, but Pilot drops two catches and all of a sudden he is a match-fixer. This might be more complicated that it seems, actually, obvious it is more complicated that it seems. Right now, I don't know what to think of it. I really wish that Pilot gets cleared, but there are a lot of different issues that will have to be dealt with. Actually, the match-fixing issue will have to be dealt with by the BCB, not the inquiry committee.
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  #13  
Old April 18, 2003, 09:11 PM
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Default In addition to what I said

Sujon may have the nerves, may be he was just not caring anymore after 4 catches were dropped off his bowling.

And to be specific, Rokon was the first fielder who dropped a catch off Sujon, then Pilot dropped a couple of catches, and then it was Kapali who dropped a high catch too.

And later Sujon also dropped Collins Obuya in a boundary.
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  #14  
Old April 19, 2003, 01:06 AM
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Default WOW!

I just can't believe what I am hearing...I so don't believe this...match-fixing?!? against Canada and Kenya?! so he dropped the catches against Kenya...but please don't tell me the odds were in our favour...I don't remember any one giving us a chance of winning agains the Africans besides us, do you?!?!? so what was he trying to match-fix....besides against Canada...he comes so low down the order...not even a top-order batsmen...who even thought it would even get to Pilot to get us home?!?! who would pay the BD captain?! Just doesn't make sense...sigh! I so hope this is all bull... Poor guy! my heart goes out to him...This can't be good for our cricket! Just when I thought our worst days are behind....
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  #15  
Old April 19, 2003, 03:22 AM
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His keeping was dubious but can any1 tell me which Bangladeshi scored the most runs in the WC??

That's right it was Pilot with 99 although he scored 1 against Canada and 14 against Kenya

Batting Flops v Canada
Pilot (1)
Sumon(0)
Taposh(0)
Masri (0)
Rokon (9)

Batting Flops v Kenya
Sujon (3)
Rafique(5)
Ashraful(1)
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  #16  
Old April 19, 2003, 05:40 AM
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We certainly did not deserve a loss against Canada - not after 4-1 win against Namibia and specially 1 win out of 2 warm up matches against a provincial side.
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  #17  
Old April 19, 2003, 08:55 AM
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You beat me Fehmida. I was just about to say it. When I saw our performance agains the Namibians and a Provincial team of SA I was quiet impressed and was thinking abt at least one upset and two wins.

The provincial team which got beaten by us beat India in a warm up match. Wt would I say I was so hopefull that our team would do something in this WC but everything was ruined suddenly, don't how and why??

[Edited on 19-4-2003 by ehsan]
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  #18  
Old April 19, 2003, 09:05 AM
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Well at least 1 win against Canada would have been the right option - since the team that had beaten India is not exactly the same team i.e., did not consist of the same players that we have beaten.

Still, half the side of the provincial team is strong enough.

For example - look at the Indian team of this TVS cup - I mean the Indian team with Sehwag, Yuvraj and Kaif is not the same team when the Indian team also have Tendulkar, Dravid and Ganguly, and still the Indian team with only Sehwag, Yuvraj and Kaif is strong enough.
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  #19  
Old April 19, 2003, 10:25 AM
Banglatiger84 Banglatiger84 is offline
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None of use know what all pilot had in his mind and whether he intentionally played bad,

But i can say for sure that the last thing we need is the sort of infighting pakistan has with every one accusing some one else of fixing matches.

Many players played surprisingly bad , inzamam, jayawardene, donald.

There is no way to tell who really was in a bad form and who was bribed
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  #20  
Old April 19, 2003, 11:34 AM
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Default All BS

This is all BS to beleive.

If you follow the consequences what happened before and during the WC with Mashud with BCB - you will clearly see the the reason behind this accusation.
I remember once Mashud commented against the selectors that they whatever the selectors are saying should say within the limit (forgot the occasion). And also for some reason he was pissed off with BCB/selectors and announced his resignation even before the WC - which definitely didn't liked by BCB. He might have been arrogant with the team-mates and sometimes showed misconduct (Galagali) with them - I can beleive that. But match-fixing - oh no. If there is match-fixing allegation against Canada - it should be against not only Mashud but all the batsmen except Kapali and Mashrafe (who scored 32 and 28). And odds were in Kenya's favor in the match against them - and with the form and morale of Bangladeshi players at that time - nobody could waste any money for the defeat of Bangladesh against the charged up Kenya. I know there is two easy catch miss by Pilot and bad captaincy in that match - but still that is not match-fixing - that is nerve, as mentioned by Fahmida.

What I understand that BCB was not happy with Pilot at all for many reasons and there might be some team-mates who didn't like Pilot's attitude during WC might have saying this.

Also when the team returned from the WC BCB (from Loby-Aliul to Anam) everybody totally blamed the commitment of our players - but I remember Pilot also blamed BCB upto some extent (20%) with the commitment of the players (80%) - I am sure this was not liked by BCB either.

Sham, did your uncle say to you anything that he got some proof of this - like Pilot meeting some unknown party (bookmakers) and somebody reported that or any other proof or it is totally based on speculation that he might have taken money for match fixing without any proof.

Moreover Pilot is the highest run scorer for BD in WC. And the reason Aliul & Co pointed out for dropping him from the test side - about his recent form is ridiculous too. He was the only one who scored some runs in the couple of practice matches before this TVS cup. And he was always good in bat (better than renowned batsmen in our team) both in One-days and tests.

I don't beleive this and now it is clear to me that BCB and selectors are showing some lesson to Pilot for his deeds by telling to the inquiry committee that Pilot might have done match-fixing - but no proof - just speculation.

Sham, could you pls tell us if the inquiry committee is doing inquiry on this allegation against Pilot? Are they putting this on paper in their report that Pilot might have fixed the match without any proof by just getting interviews of some people who doesn't like Pilot.
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  #21  
Old April 19, 2003, 12:15 PM
Sham Sham is offline
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Default Of course not

They aren't going to accuse someone of match-fixing without proof guys. And no, there is no proof. How many times am I going to say this, this allegation is totally unsubstantiated. There is no proof of it, not yet atleast. However, match-fixing has become such a big problem in cricket these days that you have to take these allegations seriously.

And the match does not necessarilly have to be fixed by bookmakers. Kenya could have paid us off to lose the match so they could go to the super sixes. No only did they go to the super sixes, they had enough points to carry them through to the semi-finals. And if they did want to buy us off, who would they approach? The captain right? Well, like I said, I don't believe it. I hope that Pilot's name gets cleared. But we can't just dismiss an allegation like this and say that Pilot is definitely innocent and everybody else is to blame.

[Edited on 19-4-2003 by Sham]
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  #22  
Old April 19, 2003, 12:46 PM
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The bowling rotation did not make any sense. And yes, a captain can force a team to lose with the bowling rotation.

When I think about the Kenya match, not using the bowler full overs who was doing good, I can see where these alligations are coming from.

It didnt make sense. If the match fixing alligations are true, it does make sense.
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  #23  
Old April 19, 2003, 12:57 PM
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Default thats an interesting angle Sham!

Didn't think of Kenya being a possible party in this whole episode. Anyways, I am gonna just desist from any further comments on this until some thing concrete comes out. Though I must say I am almost 99.99% sure that Pilot ain't no match-mixer. He is an honest Pilot as far as I know!

[Edited on 19-4-2003 by pompous]
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  #24  
Old April 19, 2003, 01:40 PM
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I dont understand why everybody is so vehemently defending Pilot's innocence. You have to remember that sitting at home in either USA or Dhaka, you are very very far away from the action in SA. I am not saying that Pilot is guilty or that he should be dropped because of these allegations. I am just saying that we are in no position to make any kind of judgement.

I am very shocked at hearing there allegations. But I am not so surprised though. Surely this was bound to come up someday. Everybody was blaming everybody. People were all really pipped off at each other. Someone must have thrown out such an allegation and other people started believing it!

I dont think the investigation wil really find anything. Thats most what happens with such allegations. But I hope that they get it over quickly. I would love to see Pilot back in the team and playing with confidence.

[Edited on 19-4-2003 by Piranha]
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  #25  
Old April 19, 2003, 08:22 PM
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Default All speculation!

Today's Daily Star has said that it was all a speculation and that the paper stands by their report. That's it.

They have also denied that they have said anything about the BCB getting info on match fixing from the ICC.

Well speculation or not - from now on, in my mind, whenever I will see Pilot's picture on anywhere, the first thing that will come into my mind is that he is a match fixer, as I believe that match fixing can never be proved and so Pilot's name can never be cleared. It will all come down to 'just' belief.

If you have read in today's prothom alo and the daily star, you would also come to a conclusion that there are different kind of allegations are being made against Pilot - whichever suits which language/paper/culture. For example - English language paper Daily Star has mentioned about match fixing - which is pretty serious in the English language, that is, for foreigners/people who are not Bangladeshi etc. And then in Prothom Alo, a Bengali daily has nothing about any match fixing news - the only thing that is in Prothom Alo is about "narighotitho" which is a serious crime in Bengali language - in Bangladeshi culture.





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