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  #1  
Old September 19, 2003, 03:36 PM
chinaman chinaman is offline
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Default Peshawari Cheat

Latif, as a seasoned player, knew he dropped that catch, yet, was bold in claiming it inplay and afterwards. Why was he so confident? Had he gotten away with something else earlier?

Let's take a look at the peshawar test. In the first innings, BD came down to 320/8 at 126th over from 310/2 at 121st over. The chains of events that led to the premature demise of the BD innings may raise some eyebrows and even lead to some answers.

85 Over: New ball taken by Latif.
102 Over: Swing was seen on this ball for the last time before lunch.
108, 110 & 112 overs: Bowling by Shoaib Akhtar but no sign of swing at all.
104 & 106 overs: Bowling by Sabbir but no sign of swing at all.
116 & 118 overs: Bowling by Gul but no sign of swing at all.

Lunch was taken after 119 over.
The ball was just 35 overs old.
Bangladesh 302/2
Javed Omar 118* (351b 17x4) Mohammad Ashraful 70* (186b 7x4)

120 over: Dangerous swings were produced 4 times by Shoaib Akhtar
122, 124, 126 over: 4 batsmen were out from Shoaib's swings. (rajin by spin and Ash by pull)

120-126: Ball is not new enough to produce serious traditional swing and also not old enough to produce dangerous reverse swing. Reverse swing is known to occur after 40 overs of play (usually after 45 overs)

Now, the question is how come all on a sudden an apperently innocent ball became so violent? What happened to the ball at the lunch time?


The Daily Stars already questioned the possibility of reconditioning the Multan pitch on the final day.

All these are just mere coincidence? Or just another cause to inspire Latif to go for yet another big one and remain confident on a high note only to be caught unfortunately?

Raising eyebrows and questions are not merely a quest to find refuge for the tiger's loss. Indeed, for a nation, not naive in scaldals by it's national figures, if any of the doubts hold some thruth, the tigers must include yet another menu to their already overfilled net sessions if they even wish for a remote hope to win matches against such nations.


Qoutes from Wisden archive:


84.1 Shabbir Ahmed to Mohammad Ashraful, no run, angling away outside off, left alone
New ball has been taken by Rashid Latif
101.1 Shabbir Ahmed to Javed Omar, no run, good outswinger, with some bounce, tries to defend it, beaten outside off stump


End of over 119 (maiden) Bangladesh 302/2
Danish Kaneria 33-9-85-0 - College End
Javed Omar 118* (351b 17x4) Mohammad Ashraful 70* (186b 7x4)
Please join us again in 40 mins at 7:40GMT

Match State: Lunch - Day 2


Hello and welcome back to Arbab Niaz Stadium, Peshawar. The after lunch session about to start
Shoaib Akhtar to bowl to Javed Omar

119.1 Shoaib Akhtar to Javed Omar, no run, short ball, defended to leg
119.2 Shoaib Akhtar to Javed Omar, one run, pitches up, swings in, off
the edge to third man region
119.3 Shoaib Akhtar to Mohammad Ashraful, no run, bit of in swing in the
air, pitches on legs, tries to play on the on side, misses hit on
pads to short leg
119.4 Shoaib Akhtar to Mohammad Ashraful, one run, on target, swings in,
tries to play across the line, inner edge onto pads, hudge appeal
for lbw, declined by Tiffen
119.5 Shoaib Akhtar to Javed Omar, no run, good length ball outside off,
left alone
119.6 Shoaib Akhtar to Javed Omar, no run, again good ball, pitches just
outside off, came in sharply, hit on pads, just outside off, appel
for lbw, declined again by Tiffen


121.4 Shoaib Akhtar to Javed Omar, OUT: Gone! good fast swinging full toss, Javed Omar tries to drive it, beaten between bat and pad, ball hit the legstump, a great innings

comes to an end

Bangladesh 310/3, Partnership of 130
Javed Omar b Shoaib Akhtar 119 (357b 17x4 0x6)
Mohammad Ashraful 77* (196b 7x4) Shoaib Akhtar 18.4-2-40-1 (3nb)
Rajin Saleh is the new batsman

End of over 122 (6 runs) Bangladesh 315/3
Shoaib Akhtar 19-2-45-1 (5nb) - Pavilion End
Rajin Saleh 3* (1b) Mohammad Ashraful 77* (199b 7x4)

122.3 Danish Kaneria to Rajin Saleh, OUT: tosses up on middle stump, tries to defend it on the front foot, gets a faint outer edge in the hands of Rashid, huge appeal for

catch behind, Bucknor thinks and raises his finger up

Bangladesh 315/4, Partnership of 5
Rajin Saleh c Rashid Latif b Danish Kaneria 3 (4b 0x4 0x6)
Mohammad Ashraful 77* (199b 7x4) Danish Kaneria 34.3-9-90-1
Kapali comes in

End of over 123 (maiden) Bangladesh 315/4
Danish Kaneria 35-10-90-1 - College End
Mohammad Ashraful 77* (199b 7x4) Alok Kapali 0* (3b)

123.2 Shoaib Akhtar to Mohammad Ashraful, OUT: short ball again, tries to pull it from outside off stump, top edge and an easy catch in the hand of Rashid

Bangladesh 315/5, Partnership of 0
Mohammad Ashraful c Rashid Latif b Shoaib Akhtar 77 (201b 7x4 0x6)
Alok Kapali 0* (3b) Shoaib Akhtar 19.2-2-45-2 (5nb)
Khaled Mashud in

123.5 Shoaib Akhtar to Khaled Mashud, OUT: Gone! good inswinging delivery, Khaled missread that one, offers on stroke, rapped on pads in front of middle stump, huge

appeal for lbw, umpire raises his finger in a flash

Bangladesh 315/6, Partnership of 0
Khaled Mashud lbw b Shoaib Akhtar 0 (3b 0x4 0x6)
Alok Kapali 0* (3b) Shoaib Akhtar 19.5-2-45-3 (5nb)
Skipper comes into bat

End of over 124 (maiden) Bangladesh 315/6
Shoaib Akhtar 20-3-45-3 (5nb) - Pavilion End
Alok Kapali 0* (3b) Khaled Mahmud 0* (1b)


125.3 Shoaib Akhtar to Alok Kapali, OUT: good inswinger, Kapali tries to defend it, got the inner edge of the bat, Rashid dives towards his left and takes a very good catch

Bangladesh 320/7, Partnership of 5
Alok Kapali c Rashid Latif b Shoaib Akhtar 4 (10b 1x4 0x6)
Khaled Mahmud 0* (3b) Shoaib Akhtar 20.3-3-45-4 (5nb)
Match State: Drinks
Mohammad Rafique in

125.6 Shoaib Akhtar to Mohammad Rafique, OUT: swinging yorker, batsman tries to defend it, beaten by pace and swing, ball hit the off stump, Shoaib got his 5th wicket

Bangladesh 320/8, Partnership of 0
Mohammad Rafique b Shoaib Akhtar 0 (3b 0x4 0x6)
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  #2  
Old September 19, 2003, 03:46 PM
paco paco is offline
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Default Conspiracy theory indeed

Throw in the fact that Russell Tiffin got sick after lunch, Aleem Dar took over, and the ball started swinging prodigiously about the same time
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  #3  
Old September 19, 2003, 03:46 PM
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Mahmood Mahmood is offline
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Very good article. Front page matrial. May I post it there?

I do have some reservations about what happened to the pich on the 4th day? It totally changed from batting deadly to flat. There is a huge possibility, the pitch was altered, which is also a serious crime. But none seemed interested to take that path of investigation.

If you look realisticly, altering balls, match fixing, cheating catch, these all shows a pattern which surely can include altering pitch.
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  #4  
Old September 19, 2003, 03:56 PM
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pagol-chagol pagol-chagol is offline
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Default you are a genius Chinaman

This needs to be published. The change is too mind-boggling. I was talking to someone about whether Shoaib had taken steroid or something else during lunch. I remember that he was so tired in the heat that he was wearing ice-jacket earlier. I wondered what suddenly made him a superman.
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  #5  
Old September 19, 2003, 03:58 PM
chinaman chinaman is offline
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Tiffen went off and Asad Rauf comes in after 131 overs.

Source: Wisden

Sure, you may post. The article is not well written. Anyone like to be co-author?
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  #6  
Old September 19, 2003, 04:14 PM
Tehsin Tehsin is offline
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Quite interesting. Should send it to Dailystar. If nothing else, just have your friends read the article.
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  #7  
Old September 19, 2003, 04:18 PM
Arnab Arnab is offline
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The swing balls that got Shoaib the wickets after lunch were all swinging through the air, the pitch had little to do with it.

[Edited on 19-9-2003 by Arnab]
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  #8  
Old September 19, 2003, 04:28 PM
Tehsin Tehsin is offline
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Arnab is a spoiler.
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  #9  
Old September 19, 2003, 04:31 PM
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No, Chainaman indicated two cheats. One with the ball on Day 3 which gave the swings and the other with the pitch for the final day.

[Edited on 19-9-2003 by Rajputro]
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  #10  
Old September 19, 2003, 04:59 PM
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Piranha Piranha is offline
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Guys, I hate to pour cold water on such consipracy theories, but creating swinging condistions when none exists is a very complicated business. Swing bepends on moisture in air, wind, texture of ball in addition to the soil quiality.

If there is any doubts, its about ball tampering. Its not difficult to do something with the ball that will produce prodigious swing. Even then, I think its going a bit far to make conspiracy charges when we face something that we cannot handle.

I think it is highly unlikley that anyone could have done something to the pitch to produce such prodigious swing.

Dont forget that the biggest factor in swing bowling is the bowler himself. His action can make the difference between a tiny amount of swing and a huge amount.

Since he is a natural inswinger, it seems likley that he became very excited and that caused part of his success.
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  #11  
Old September 19, 2003, 05:00 PM
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Default Also...

Rashif Latif has already been proven a cheat and has been punished for it. I dont see the point in dragging on this discussion much further.
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  #12  
Old September 19, 2003, 05:19 PM
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You guys missed the point Chainaman made. The umpire acted suspitous, pakistani umpire came in, all off a sudden ball started to swing, the question he asked is, "what happened to the ball at lunch".

Pitch issue is the final day of the match. It totally changed on the fouth day going flat.
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  #13  
Old September 19, 2003, 05:42 PM
acbizz acbizz is offline
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These are old problems with pakistan cricket.

match fixing,cheating, ball tempering,umpiring drugs,girls,etc. I won't be surprise if something illegal happen in that test. Oh well nobody gets unpunished in the world.
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  #14  
Old September 19, 2003, 05:51 PM
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why dont you just take the defeat acbizz.

are you trying to say pakistan couldnt bowl BD out without cheating.
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  #15  
Old September 19, 2003, 05:56 PM
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I would say thats the direction where this discussion is headed...
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  #16  
Old September 19, 2003, 05:56 PM
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My few cents.

Re. Shoaib, I'll go with Piranha here. The Pakistani umpire was not standing at the time. The ball would have been in posession of the neutral umpires during the lunch break. So any ball tampering done during the lunch break can be ruled out. Though the theory sounds interesting, we need more evidence. Innocent until proven otherwise.

As for the pitch issue, is the Daily Star report a result of just some guess work or do they have anything to back it up with ? Going by some of the recent reports from DS posted here, its credibility does not seem all that high.
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  #17  
Old September 19, 2003, 06:25 PM
Tintin Tintin is offline
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Default Shoaib\'s spells

Just for the sake of curiousity, checked out last three of Shoaib's great bowling feats in tests - the 5/43 in Sharjah against WI, 6/11 in NZ, and the 5/21 in Colombo against Australia - to see whether there was anything common or suspicious.

5/43 in Sharjah : Ganga was bowled by a sharp incoming delivery in the first over a drinks break. 24th over of the innings, Shoaib's 7th. But Shoaib had been bowling well before the break too, and his first five overs were maidens. Got Gayle and Hinds in consecutive overs just after lunch, bowled Dillon and Cuffy in consecutive balls in the first over of a new spell.

6/11 v NZ : Pakistan had just been allout for 629. Akhtar yorked Horne, Richardson Fleming in his second over and 5th overs - and bowled Harris in his 6th. The one that got Fleming was travelling at 157 kmph.

5/21 v Aus : His greatest spell : It was nowhere near a drinks or other break, but again it was the beginning of a spell. In the first over of the spell, he bowled Ponting, M Waugh, and got S Waugh lbw in four balls. In the next, he yorked Gilchrist with an unplayable yorker and bowled Warne in his next.

The only common thing between the three is that they all came at the beginning of a spell. Not all came immediately after a break, the ball was very new in one case, around 20 overs in most cases, and very old in one.

I don't mind the least being contradicted, but the evidence of the past is in favour of Shoaib being innocent (unless he was cheating every time !)
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  #18  
Old September 19, 2003, 06:28 PM
oracle oracle is offline
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During the heat of the test match i would have easily been enamoured by the ball tampering and other theories and gone along with this point. However, guys, look at it this way- what's really the point of all this? To prove that we should have won; That the Pakistanis are cheats.
The sentiment of the whole world that "day after" was that BD should have won that match.
As far as I am concerned we won morally and that is far superior to me than clamoring about this and that incident. In 20 years time when we have won our fair share of victories this game would,nt matter.
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  #19  
Old September 19, 2003, 06:30 PM
Arnab Arnab is offline
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All I can say is I love Tintin and Thundercats. My two favorites.
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  #20  
Old September 19, 2003, 06:40 PM
Tintin Tintin is offline
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Who are Thundercats ?
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  #21  
Old September 19, 2003, 06:46 PM
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You mean that cartoon (Thundercats)?
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  #22  
Old September 19, 2003, 07:18 PM
Arnab Arnab is offline
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Yes the thudercats logo in radicalsalami's avatar.
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  #23  
Old September 19, 2003, 08:01 PM
chinaman chinaman is offline
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I think I need to clear few points as some of our members apparently missed some points.

I did not question the ability of Shoab Akthar as a bowler. He is one of the best bowlers of our time. I merely presented few facts to seek some answers which might alert or benefit our team in the future.

There was no swing from 103 to 119 th overs. Lunch was taken after the 119th over. Suddenly from the 120th over the ball started swinging seriously. 120th over was the 35th over of the new ball and as I mentioned earlier it is not suppose to make serious swing at that time. Of course the humidity, dryness etc etc play some part in producing swing but
there was no notable change in these conditions that might offer some explation to the cause at that time. So how could you explain the sudden appearance of swing when the ball is 35 overs old?

Someone put examples of Shoaib's spells. Did he produced drastic swings with a ball 35 overs old in any of the examples and the ball didn't swing at all in the previous 17 overs?

My point revolves arround the fact that a 35 overs old ball is not that suitable for normal or reverse swing. If you need more info on swing, please read "Reverse Swing" in the front page or elswhere on the net.

The pitch I mentioned is not from Peshawar but from Multan. Remember Inji?
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  #24  
Old September 19, 2003, 08:12 PM
Ockey Ockey is offline
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Going by Chinaman has said, in almost every game the opposition cheats in some way or another...because there is always a batting debacle just when BD seems to be settling down. If what you say did happen I would expect the BD team, who had first account of what the wicket and the ball looked like during the game, to raise the issue and make more noise. They did take on Rashid Latif, who happens to be the captain of the opposing team, which leads me to believe they certainly would brought it up with match officials.

May I request that, for the sake of maintaining professtionalism, we not have any conspiricy theories or speculation articles on the home page.
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  #25  
Old September 19, 2003, 09:10 PM
Pundit Pundit is offline
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A bunch of cry babies, some of you are !

Whether its because you support the WI or you are still running the ekatturer andolon, some of you guys are just too caustic.

Having said that though, if I were to mark the most likely to cheat in Int Cricket, then it would be like this-

1. Pakistan (not because the English think so)
2. Australia
3. Sri Lanka
4. England
5. No one else so far
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