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  #51  
Old April 23, 2007, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bharat
Kapil was not super express, but would it nicely with the present McGraths and Shaun Pollocks.His nagging line and length along with his lethal out swingers were his asset.

But most importantly he would lead the fast bowling along single handedly in a team donned by spinners ..see a similarity :-)

But one thing that amazes me is that Kapil (except for 1 test whihc he was rested) never missed a single Test due to injury.I think that was phenominal for a fast bowler
I thought he was dropped for that infamous shot in Calcutta and not rested ( don't understand that term at all. we use it as well ). Kapil would have got a lot more wkts had he played more on pitches that assisted him. And his batting, when on song, was as good as any batsmen of that era..
  #52  
Old April 23, 2007, 03:31 PM
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Didnt understand the reason for opening this thread..what are you trying to say?
  #53  
Old April 23, 2007, 09:39 PM
bd_fan_from_india bd_fan_from_india is offline
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i cant understand y is everyone getting after me. bangladesh is no doubt improving and they will win a world cup in the future, but to say they will win it in 2011 is getting way-too-over-excited. bangladesh do not have even 1 big-hitter in their team and to even think of winning the world cup, bangladesh will have to do a lot of work in the next 3.5 years. bangladesh, should try to win asia cups 1st and then move ahead by winning the world cup in all. at best in 2011, bangladesh will be 1 of the darkhorses.

also, cricket is an unpredictable game and anything can happen. who knows none of the existing "top-8" teams might fail to make it into the super-8 in a future world cup when we will be having 32 teams.
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  #54  
Old April 24, 2007, 12:02 AM
DJ Sahastra DJ Sahastra is offline
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BD Fan from India,

"bangladesh is no doubt improving and they will win a world cup in the future, but to say they will win it in 2011 is getting way-too-over-excited."

What is wrong in being over-excited? Didn't we say we'll win this world-cup when we even failed to get to the Super-8. In retrospection, wasn't that an over-excitrement. And if it was, what was wrong with that?

"bangladesh do not have even 1 big-hitter in their team and to even think of winning the world cup"

You don't need big-hitters to win a world-cup. You can make 183 and still win the world cup. Don't agree with me - Look at 83 world cup. You can win only 3-4 matches, and still win the world cup. Look at 1992 World cup.

"bangladesh will have to do a lot of work in the next 3.5 years"

So will every other team that aspires to win the next world cup.

"bangladesh, should try to win asia cups 1st and then move ahead by winning the world cup in all."

Winning the Asia cups won't guarantee that they can win the world cup, nor not being able to win Asia cups take away their chances.

"at best in 2011, bangladesh will be 1 of the darkhorses"

I am sure some might've bet their last dollar that "at best, BD will win againt Bermuda in 2007 WC".

"also, cricket is an unpredictable game and anything can happen. "

There, you got it .

"who knows none of the existing "top-8" teams might fail to make it into the super-8 in a future world cup when we will be having 32 teams."

And who knows - there might not be even one of the "existing" super-8 teams into the super-8 of the future world cup.

My simple point - it is pointless on your or anyone's part to try and put limit on what BD fans should dream and hope for. I don't see why they should hope for anything less than the World Cup. And i don't see why anyone should have anything against that.
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  #55  
Old April 24, 2007, 12:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ Sahastra
My simple point - it is pointless on your or anyone's part to try and put limit on what BD fans should dream and hope for. I don't see why they should hope for anything less than the World Cup. And i don't see why anyone should have anything against that.
Nicely put. It's like, going to WC for saying "hello my friend, I'm here to give you a win" instead of saying "hello my friend, I'm here to fight for the cup".

In reality, I wouldn't mind if even Ireland, Scotland, and Bermuda dream of winning World Cup. Afterall, it's a dream cup
  #56  
Old April 24, 2007, 01:58 AM
bd_fan_from_india bd_fan_from_india is offline
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dj sahastra, the situation is different now than 1983 and u need big-hitters. u can win a u-19 world cup without a big-hitter as scores of 200 have proved to be match-winning scores at the u-19 level, but in odi level, big-hitters r a must. bangladesh, in their entire odi cricketing history have pulled off only 1 chase of 250 or more and only 3 others between 230-250. also, bd have made only 13 scores of 250 or more and just 1 score of 300+, 301/7 against kenya.

to even dream of winning a wc, a team needs to score 250+ scores regularly and pull off 230+ chases more frequently. bangladesh, should have won against ireland and west indies chasing 243 and 230.
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  #57  
Old April 24, 2007, 07:44 AM
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Yes, we all know we should have won against Ireland and Windies. But its a fallacy to say that to dream, we need to consistently score big. Big scores on utterly flat pitches dont help much, while small totals on a good pitch (with bounce and spin) can be lethal...I know you wont be able to see examples of this in the Bangladeshi game history, but just look at some of India's matches for examples...

Big-hitters often fall flat on their face when they least expect it. I honestly prefer normal consistent batsmen, for comparison purposes look at Dhoni and Dravid, and if anyone says they would choose Dhoni over Dravid, they should be put in a mental institute.

The situation is different now from 1983, and will be different in 2011 than it is now. Lets not talk about the far future and instead concentrate on the coming present? We'll have a more consistent team by then and hence we will continue to dream regardless of what you might have to say to discourage us...
  #58  
Old April 24, 2007, 08:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bd_fan_from_india
dj sahastra, the situation is different now than 1983 and u need big-hitters. u can win a u-19 world cup without a big-hitter as scores of 200 have proved to be match-winning scores at the u-19 level, but in odi level, big-hitters r a must. bangladesh, in their entire odi cricketing history have pulled off only 1 chase of 250 or more and only 3 others between 230-250. also, bd have made only 13 scores of 250 or more and just 1 score of 300+, 301/7 against kenya.

to even dream of winning a wc, a team needs to score 250+ scores regularly and pull off 230+ chases more frequently. bangladesh, should have won against ireland and west indies chasing 243 and 230.
Your stats actually make me more hopeful.

In early 90s, anything above 150 was a good score for BD and a score of 170/180 batting 50 overs used to be considered as a very good effort. In early 2ks, we asked for scoring 200 runs and now I am very much pleased to see that we have already scored 13 scores of 250+! To me, that's a very good achievement and if our batting is improving in this rate - our bowlers are doing consistently well - Bangladesh can overwhelm any team at any day!

About scoring quickly, we are having very good players from the age level. They are very positive and much skilled than the old guns. You can see this in the scoring rate of Aftab, Ashraful, Sakib, Tamim (his current stat does not tell his actualy ability though).....btw, hitters are not everything for winning matches. If so, Afridi would be the all-time great ODI player.

But well, your stats tell me so many postive stuffs for us that I can start dreaming and our team can start working for the world championship
  #59  
Old April 24, 2007, 08:34 AM
bd_fan_from_india bd_fan_from_india is offline
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let me make this clear - bangladesh winning the world cup in 2011 will be the best thing to ever happen to the game of cricket, even better than sri lanka winning in 1996. and much as everyone out here wants that to happen, but we should be a slightly more realistic. bangladesh, can make it into the semi-finals comfortably in 2011. bangladesh team in 2011 can be like the sri lankan team in 1995/96 which went on to win the world cup, but then bangladesh needs to find big-hitters. sri lanka had 2 of them at the top and started off scoring at 8-10 runs an over in all their matches. i havent seen bangladesh team pull off a 6+ run an over start in any match against a test-playing nation. the most explosive start i remember seeing of bangladesh was 5.5 runs an over against india this wc. even when bd beat aus, the start was only at around 4-4.5 runs an over.

on another thing, with bangladesh dreaming of winning the world cup, should teams like ireland and nepal also start dreaming to win it in 2015?????
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  #60  
Old April 24, 2007, 08:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bd_fan_from_india
on another thing, with bangladesh dreaming of winning the world cup, should teams like ireland and nepal also start dreaming to win it in 2015?????
This last paragraph ruined your whole post which apparently looked logical.

Ireland and Nepal do not have the cricket infrastructure or test status to regularly feature in the big league.

Do you mean Nepal/Ireland stands equal to Bangladesh in 2003?

In that case I have to doubt about your cricketing sense.
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  #61  
Old April 24, 2007, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miraz
In that case I have to doubt about your cricketing sense.
What he's trying to say is, we should be more realistic in dreaming. If nothing else, we should consult him before we have a dream.

BD_fan_from_India, can I dream of a chicken crossing the street tonight?
  #62  
Old April 24, 2007, 10:59 AM
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Everyone is applying logic to something that does not/should not have logic. People will dream, and work towards there dream, regardless of the realist possibility. Hope and dream is the fundamental ingredient to winning. Its that simple.
  #63  
Old April 24, 2007, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miraz
This last paragraph ruined your whole post which apparently looked logical.

Ireland and Nepal do not have the cricket infrastructure or test status to regularly feature in the big league.

Do you mean Nepal/Ireland stands equal to Bangladesh in 2003?

In that case I have to doubt about your cricketing sense.
"TOYING with sensitive words"... is the other name of Amit aka BD_fan_frm_india. As mentioned by Mahmood bhai already... he bas been banned before by going too far with his "sensitive words". This time around... he is just stepping a bit slower towards his kidding_ploy.

Trying to shape up his posts with logic has never been of much use anyway...
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  #64  
Old April 24, 2007, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bd_fan_from_india
let me make this clear - bangladesh winning the world cup in 2011 will be the best thing to ever happen to the game of cricket, even better than sri lanka winning in 1996. and much as everyone out here wants that to happen, but we should be a slightly more realistic. bangladesh, can make it into the semi-finals comfortably in 2011. bangladesh team in 2011 can be like the sri lankan team in 1995/96 which went on to win the world cup, but then bangladesh needs to find big-hitters. sri lanka had 2 of them at the top and started off scoring at 8-10 runs an over in all their matches. i havent seen bangladesh team pull off a 6+ run an over start in any match against a test-playing nation. the most explosive start i remember seeing of bangladesh was 5.5 runs an over against india this wc. even when bd beat aus, the start was only at around 4-4.5 runs an over.

on another thing, with bangladesh dreaming of winning the world cup, should teams like ireland and nepal also start dreaming to win it in 2015?????
It is really getting too much. Did you watch the ad in your TV stating "Agla world cup hum layenge"? After watching the ad, did a single BD fan go to any indian cricket forum and give a statement about it? We can dream anything positive about our country. We can dream to be the richest country in the world. Why does that bother to you my friend? Do you have any object about our dreams?

You might have missed a point already. We know how to dream. But we don't get hopeless if our dream doesn't convert into reality. Please don't try to teach us what should we dream. Thanks.
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  #65  
Old April 24, 2007, 10:53 PM
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BF Fan From India,

My final 2 cents.

1. To win the world cup, you don't need to be having pinch-hitters, big hitters, fat hitters nor you need to be consistently scoring 250 or chasing 450 etc. All you need is a team that can play good 8-10 games over a period of 10-20 days.

2. To dream of winning the world cup, and yes, even for Ireland or Nepal, is the right thing to do. To ask them to not dream because of so-and-so reasons is a ridiculous thing to do.

Remember, Kenya reached the last cup's semi-finals. Two more good games, and they would've won the cup!
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  #66  
Old April 25, 2007, 01:35 AM
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Guys, I dont find anything offensive in the post of bd_fan_from_India. there is nothing wrong to dream. But I personally prefer to dream which atleast can be reachable. So for the time being, my dream is to win a test against india in the upcoming series. If in next 2 years we can win couple of test and draw few more, then i will start dreaming for winning 2011 world cup. if we are consistent in test, then eventually our ODI performance will be much much better.
and having 1 ot 2 big hitters is a necessity these days for ODI. may be not that extent like Jaysuria, but atleast someone who can control the game at anytime and change the course in short time. but i think we already have this kind in Tamim, Ash and Aftab though they arent consistant at all yet. May be some good performance in test will make them confident and they will find it easier in ODI then.
  #67  
Old April 25, 2007, 02:03 AM
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hmmmmmmmm.........
Junior
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  #68  
Old April 25, 2007, 04:00 AM
bd_fan_from_india bd_fan_from_india is offline
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my apologies to all who found my posts offensive and thanks to all guys who supported me. we all have a right to dream, even we indians r ourselves dreaming of winning the 2011 wc, so we cant prevent others from dreaming. i was only saying that bd can continue to dream of winning the 2011 wc, its just a diff thing that it has almost 0 chance of happening as bd dont have even 1 big-hitter. over 90% of bd fans think that they r the 2011 champs. i saw huge banners saying "bangladesh - 2011 wc champ" in the wc matches of bangladesh and even out here, many ppl think the same.

but before dreaming of winning the 2011 wc, bd should start dreaming of winning the asia cups.

also, stop bringing india into this just bcoz the person who started the thread happened to be an indian. what if a bangladeshi had started this thread???

i remember in the 2002 champions trophy bangladesh had said - "we can beat australia"
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  #69  
Old April 25, 2007, 07:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bd_fan_from_india
over 90% of bd fans think that they r the 2011 champs.
OK... enough of this useless talks and counter-talks. The above quote proves how much in the dark about BD fan's thoughts and emotions. You are really making a mountain out of nothing here.

And BTW... no BD fan would create this sort of a thread because they would know that the basic assumption of 90% fans believing BD to be the 2007WC champs is a very wrong statement. Many members here have tried to clarify that to you. But you either dont get the basic flaws of your thread-concept or maybe you are just pretending not to get it.

Whatever the reason is... its probably time to stop repeting over and over again that you dont get this and you dont get that.
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  #70  
Old April 25, 2007, 08:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bd_fan_from_india
my apologies to all who found my posts offensive and thanks to all guys who supported me. we all have a right to dream, even we indians r ourselves dreaming of winning the 2011 wc, so we cant prevent others from dreaming.
Now the Q is how dare Indians even dream about winning the next WC?? After the debacle of this WC most of the super-stars would have reitred to various professions, such as, chef, fruit-seller, fish-monger, street performer etc. What a waste of talents- I would say!!:p

It seems like you're obssessed with big-hitters. Well, a 17 yr old charging a fast bowler in the WC and dispatching him on the second-tier of the stand goes down as a big hitter in my book. If you are not convinced then wait until the BD v Ind series. There are plenty more where that came from! You might not be surprised but your fellow compatriot Sanjay Manjrekar is amazed by Aftab and his "Six hitting prowess". Dont forget about Mashrafi, until recently, his SR was above 100. His batting career hasn't even began yet! Finally, I'm sure you have seen Ashraful and he is only 22!

Can we dream now, bd-fan-from-ind??
  #71  
Old April 25, 2007, 09:43 AM
bd_fan_from_india bd_fan_from_india is offline
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bangladesh team does have some players with the potential of becoming big-hitters like tamim iqbal, aftab ahmad, ashraful, but then none of these players have played regular innings with big-hitting. tamim iqbal has played only 1 such innings, the one against india. also aftab and ash have played only 2-3 such innings over the last 2-3 years. its too early to call tamim, aftab or ash as big-hitters now. maybe if they play 1-2 big-hitting innings then they will be called big-hitters as all 3 have the potential.
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  #72  
Old April 25, 2007, 10:27 AM
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Amit's like your average Bangladeshi batsman - he learns with time, but you still feel he leaves a lot to be desired. Aggression, too much defence and half-hearted shots all combined together.
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  #73  
Old April 25, 2007, 04:33 PM
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This thread got lot more interesting. <-- Ignore.

Openess allows people to speak regardless of their intelligence. It is up to us to make sure, we are smarter to let it hurt us.
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  #74  
Old April 26, 2007, 03:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bd_fan_from_india
even we indians r ourselves dreaming of winning the 2011 wc, so we cant prevent others from dreaming.
lmao!! you cant even make it to the 2nd round of a WC and you are dreaming to win the next WC???

i would say BD has a better chance of winning the next WC than the [..edit..] indian side has.

Last edited by Ahmed_B; April 26, 2007 at 06:31 AM.. Reason: Mod.edit: Please dont lower your own level to fight some other low-comments.
  #75  
Old April 26, 2007, 03:10 AM
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So please, mr bd-fan-from-india, do tell us all what is the exact criteria needed for..

1. being classified as a big-hitter...

2. being allowed to dream and aim a notch higher than what we're likely to be fully capable of by then...

you know, sometimes, u actually make sense. Then u just decide to stop making sense and insult us and worsen our opinion of u....
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