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  #1  
Old May 24, 2007, 08:37 AM
Reaz Reaz is offline
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BDFlag Two Team Concept

The two team concept for Test and ODI is not working for Bangladesh.

I failed to understand what Enamul did better that Razzak couldn't do or Pilot did that Mushfiq couldn't.

This concept, rather spoiling the young talents at the very onset of their career by tagging different brands with their name!

Let the young guns like Tamim, Aftab, Mushfiq and Razzak play Test cricket. They might initially falter but eventually would learn. How do you come to conclusion without even giving a single chance to play Test cricket to a player like Tamim!

I am indeed very sorry to say that the selectors from old generation cricketers are doing no good to the new generation cricket of Bangladesh. They are injecting the same old conservative and weak mentality to these fearless young bunch of Cricketers. Who no more believe in the concept of respectable loss or a tame draw! They, either know to win or to loose.

Please for heaven sake stop labeling them with ODI or Test player labels (Do it, when you can justify your decision by giving them enough chances!). Tamim, Aftab, Mushfiq, Razzaq and Shahadat are capable of playing both form of cricket. If you don't give them the chance they will never learn it. If they don't perform, train them. Don't start jumping in to conclusion with pre-conceived ideas or face of player or aggressive approach of player or even age of player!! If those would be the indicators of team selection then players like Jayasuriya, Gilchrist, Hayden would never get a chance to play Test cricket. Shachin wouldn’t play Test at the age of 16, Ashraful wouldn’t be youngest Test centurian in the history of Test cricket.

Team selection is never limited to adding and dumping a player from the team (These days, out of 150 million population of Bangladesh at least 75 million would be able to the great job that our present selectors are doing) . The selectors also need to find out the problem of the player they dumped and arrange necessary training and get the player back in the squad as quickly as possible. Continuously do the talent hunt and develop a system of endless inflow of new talents in Bangladesh cricket.

Bangladesh Team for both the Form of game should be:

Tamim Iqbal
Shahriar Nafees
Mohammad Ashraful (Captain)
Aftab Ahmed
Shakib AL Hasan
Mushfiqur Rahim (Wicket Keeper)
Mohammad Rafique
Abdur Razzak
Mashrafe Mortaza (Vice Captain)
Shahadat Hossain
Syed Rasel

St By:
Farhad Reza
Enamul Jnr
Mehrab Hossain Jnr
Tushar Imran

Groom these boys up and go for the Kill!
For unknown reason Bangladesh missed the trick in this current Indian Tour. Tamim, Aftab, Razzak and Mushfiq could make a huge impact.

However, let us look forward and do the right thing at the right time without looking back. Remember the thumb rule, ‘Either you live or you die’. No point living for years in a death bed. Cheers Bangladesh Team!

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  #2  
Old May 24, 2007, 09:36 AM
gatekeeper gatekeeper is offline
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You've raised some intersting points. I think we are still going thru some trial and error period. Hope BD management will soon get it together.
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  #3  
Old May 24, 2007, 09:48 AM
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Tigers_eye Tigers_eye is offline
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Sorry can't agree with you wholeheartedly. You give everyone a fair chance. Let them play the second test as well before taking the rugs out.

JO, Rajin should be in Test. They have done nothing wrong to be dropped. You may not like them that is a personal issue. But performance wise they warrent a place.

Your lineup has too many bowlers and not enough batsmen.

I do agree on few suggestions. Mushfiq. Someone else for Habibul Bashar. Time for Rafiq to be a part-time captain. But all changes must be in SL series.
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  #4  
Old May 24, 2007, 09:53 AM
BonBon BonBon is offline
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Bhai re..onek taka involved these days..onek politics..onek strategy..

Basically the team management hasnt been able to decide on the motto. If they took "Either you live or die", we would see really exciting cricket, revamped team and lots of wins (and losses).
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  #5  
Old May 24, 2007, 09:59 AM
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Aritro Aritro is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tigers_eye
Sorry can't agree with you wholeheartedly. You give everyone a fair chance. Let them play the second test as well before taking the rugs out.

JO, Rajin should be in Test. They have done nothing wrong to be dropped. You may not like them that is a personal issue. But performance wise they warrent a place.

Your lineup has too many bowlers and not enough batsmen.

I do agree on few suggestions. Mushfiq. Someone else for Habibul Bashar. Time for Rafiq to be a part-time captain. But all changes must be in SL series.
JO did plenty to be dropped 12 months ago. I've been wondering what he did to be re-instated this time around.

Especially with Rajin performing so well as an opener in our last couple of tests.
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  #6  
Old May 24, 2007, 10:08 AM
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Tigers_eye Tigers_eye is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aritro
I've been wondering what he did to be re-instated this time around.
Lets not make this a JO bashing thread as always.

Rajin is better suited down the order instead of the opening slot.

For Tamim, yes he strikes fear into opponent, yes he is techincally better than most of the openers and likes to charge down the fast bowlers but my personal view is to protect a talent like this he needs to be playing First class cricket a minimum of another year or two before making a debut in the test arena. If Tamim can grasp the concept of Rajin just think how devastating he would be.
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  #7  
Old May 24, 2007, 10:18 AM
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Aritro Aritro is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tigers_eye

For Tamim, yes he strikes fear into opponent, yes he is techincally better than most of the openers and likes to charge down the fast bowlers but my personal view is to protect a talent like this he needs to be playing First class cricket a minimum of another year or two before making a debut in the test arena. If Tamim can grasp the concept of Rajin just think how devastating he would be.
You won't need to convince me about that, I'm happy to see Omar used there at Tamim's expense until he's had another season under his belt.

I'm not too sure why you think Rajin's more suited to the middle order though. His technique is perfectly suited to the job, and Omar's limitations leave him vulnerable against the new ball no matter how many deliveries he leaves.
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  #8  
Old May 24, 2007, 10:25 AM
Mike Mike is offline
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BD has followed the two team concept from Australia. Now, it's time to think about our own model. Very interesting point.
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  #9  
Old May 24, 2007, 10:27 AM
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Tigers_eye Tigers_eye is offline
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lol, I don't think JO is better than Rajin. Rajin is a pure test player. he needs to stick around when our mardanga batsmen plays in the middle. he can not only protect his own side once set but also encourage his partner to hold on to his side as well creating partnerships. JO is ok for the opening slot for the time being. Till Nafis Iqbal is ready for the second stint. My distant memory serves me watching Nafis getting set and then giving his wicket away. Same with SN. We don't want both of our openers be that way. If anyone needs to replace JO it has to be Mehrab Jr.
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  #10  
Old May 24, 2007, 10:35 AM
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Aritro Aritro is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tigers_eye
lol, I don't think JO is better than Rajin. Rajin is a pure test player. he needs to stick around when our mardanga batsmen plays in the middle. he can not only protect his own side once set but also encourage his partner to hold on to his side as well creating partnerships. JO is ok for the opening slot for the time being. Till Nafis Iqbal is ready for the second stint. My distant memory serves me watching Nafis getting set and then giving his wicket away. Same with SN. We don't want both of our openers be that way. If anyone needs to replace JO it has to be Mehrab Jr.
Yeah, I realised that you weren't suggesting JO was actually better than him, so I ammended my post.

I take your point about needing Rajin to stick around in the middle order. But the trouble is, I think having JO as an opener immediately puts us at risk of losing an early wicket. A risk that can be reduced considerably by putting Rajin there instead.

IMO, we should be using Mushfiqur Rahim to do the job you've suggested for Rajin and I can't work out why he's not there either.

Also, I think if you look back Mehrab's career from U/19s and onwards, you'll find that nearly all his best scores were made in the middle order. In fact, he appears to be a genuine middle-order batsman whom we're trying to shoe-horn into the opening slot due to a lack of options.
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  #11  
Old May 24, 2007, 10:37 AM
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Tokai Tokai is offline
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Those who wants to open test with Tamim, I have to say, lacks concept about test cricket.

he is a hot headed 17 years old kid who can't keep his head cool for a 50 over game, how is he supposed to play the crutial patience game in test?
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  #12  
Old May 24, 2007, 10:49 AM
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Sohel Sohel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike
BD has followed the two team concept from Australia. Now, it's time to think about our own model. Very interesting point.
we ain't australia yet bro. let's try to get there first with a better cricket infrastructure. with passion and unrivaled popularity, that infratructure will take us to the next level before long. quality professional leagues for both forms of the game, participating teams with several age-based junior sides, and a national talent-scouting system will start to produce the kind numbers that will eventually necessitate the two team scenario... organic, natural growth's better and more cost effective over the long haul.
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Last edited by Sohel; May 24, 2007 at 12:29 PM..
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  #13  
Old May 24, 2007, 11:39 AM
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Rizvi Rizvi is offline
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Let's not even bring up Mehrab in this conversation! He's is the last person who should be considered in any position in the entire National Squad.

Agreed Tamim is simply not ready for this kind of patience. Give him some time. But there is no way Mushfiq should have sat out this test series. Some arguments go in the sense Pilot is in for defense, but Mushfiq should've atleast been inserted as a batsmen. In my opinion, this is the version of cricket Mushfiq will reach his highest potential and he should've been inserted maybe at the expense of Rajin in the middle order or even JO as an opener.

bottom line is Tamim, Aftab- as exciting as they are to us fans, they will simply not last in this version of the game.
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  #14  
Old May 24, 2007, 11:59 AM
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JO should stay in the test team no matter what, he rarely fails losing his wicket, I dont understand why so many dense people dont like him.
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  #15  
Old May 24, 2007, 12:05 PM
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Aritro Aritro is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Naf
JO should stay in the test team no matter what, he rarely fails losing his wicket, I dont understand why so many dense people dont like him.

30 - - - 1 L 1st Test v SL in SL 2005/06 at Colombo (RPS) [1764]
- DNB 0 0 2
9 - - - 3
- DNB 0 0 1 L 2nd Test v SL in SL 2005/06 at Colombo (PSS) [1766]
18 - - - 2
9 - - - 3
4 - - - 1 L 1st Test v SL in BD 2005/06 at Chittagong (CDS) [1784]
- DNB 1 0 2
31 - - - 3
- DNB 0 0 4
35 - - - 1 L 2nd Test v SL in BD 2005/06 at Bogra [1786]
- DNB 0 0 2
13 - - - 3
- DNB 0 0 4
27 - - - 1 L 1st Test v Aus in BD 2005/06 at Fatullah [1797]
- DNB 0 0 2
18 - - - 3
- DNB 0 0 4
2 - - - 1 L 2nd Test v Aus in BD 2005/06 at Chittagong (CDS) [1799]
- DNB 0 0 2
19 - - - 3
- DNB 1 0 1 D 1st Test v Ind in BD 2007 at Chittagong (CDS) [1832]
7 - - - 2
- DNB 0 0 3

In his last 14 innings he has 5 scores under 10 and 9 scores under 20.

Oh we're all just so dense.
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  #16  
Old May 24, 2007, 12:06 PM
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green_cat green_cat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaz
How do you come to conclusion without even giving a single chance to play Test cricket to a player like Tamim!

Groom these boys up and go for the Kill!
first give them chance to play national cricket league 4 day version...let them prove that they are handy even to make a draw in local league...after that the point comes to give them a chance...you are right to groom this boys up...but how..did you think? the only way is to prove them 4 day version. if they can succeed then u can say that they can stay in 5 day version. now a days we even cant draw a test match playing 5 days...how can you expect players cant prove in 4 day version will be able to coap up with 5 day versions?
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  #17  
Old May 24, 2007, 12:16 PM
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Aritro Aritro is offline
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Here is the currently maligned Shariar Nafees, who's only played 14 innings in his career


3 - - - 1 L 1st Test v SL in SL 2005/06 at Colombo (RPS) [1764]
- DNB 0 0 2
13 - - - 3
- DNB 1 0 1 L 2nd Test v SL in SL 2005/06 at Colombo (PSS) [1766]
5 - - - 2
51 - - - 3
27 - - - 1 L 1st Test v SL in BD 2005/06 at Chittagong (CDS) [1784]
- DNB 2 0 2
38 - - - 3
- DNB 1 0 4
9 - - - 1 L 2nd Test v SL in BD 2005/06 at Bogra [1786]
- DNB 1 0 2
6 - - - 3
- DNB 0 0 4
138 - - - 1 L 1st Test v Aus in BD 2005/06 at Fatullah [1797]
- DNB 0 0 2
33 - - - 3
- DNB 0 0 4
0 - - - 1 L 2nd Test v Aus in BD 2005/06 at Chittagong (CDS) [1799]
- DNB 1 0 2
79 - - - 3
- DNB 0 0 1 D 1st Test v Ind in BD 2007 at Chittagong (CDS) [1832]
32 - - - 2
- DNB 2 0 3
1 - - - 4


6 dismissals with less than 10 runs, but only 7 under 20 and he's got two 50s and a 100 to show for it.

Javed Omar hasn't looked capable of a test century for a long, long time.

Here's Rajin Saleh


0 - - - 1 L 1st Test v Ind in BD 2004/05 at Dhaka [1725]
- DNB 0 0 2
0 - - - 3
89 - - - 1 W 1st Test v Zim in BD 2004/05 at Chittagong (MAA) [1733]
- 0/25 0 0 2
26 - - - 3
- DNB 1 0 4
- DNB 0 0 1 D 2nd Test v Zim in BD 2004/05 at Dhaka [1735]
24 - - - 2
- DNB 1 0 3
56* - - - 4
2 - - - 1 L 2nd Test v Eng in Eng 2005 at Chester-le-Street [1753]
- DNB 0 0 2
7 - - - 3
67 - - - 1 L 1st Test v Aus in BD 2005/06 at Fatullah [1797]
- 0/5 0 0 2
33 - - - 3
- DNB 0 0 4
71 - - - 1 L 2nd Test v Aus in BD 2005/06 at Chittagong (CDS) [1799]
- 0/32 0 0 2
5 - - - 3
- 0/12 0 0 1 D 1st Test v Ind in BD 2007 at Chittagong (CDS) [1832]
41 - - - 2
- DNB 1 0 3
7* - - - 4

5 dismissals under 10. But he's got four 50s, a 40 and no scores between 10 and 20. Excellent record.



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  #18  
Old May 24, 2007, 12:40 PM
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Sohel Sohel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rizvi
Let's not even bring up Mehrab in this conversation! He's is the last person who should be considered in any position in the entire National Squad.

Agreed Tamim is simply not ready for this kind of patience. Give him some time. But there is no way Mushfiq should have sat out this test series. Some arguments go in the sense Pilot is in for defense, but Mushfiq should've atleast been inserted as a batsmen. In my opinion, this is the version of cricket Mushfiq will reach his highest potential and he should've been inserted maybe at the expense of Rajin in the middle order or even JO as an opener.

bottom line is Tamim, Aftab- as exciting as they are to us fans, they will simply not last in this version of the game.
i agree wholeheartedly. he's a golla clone with slightly better technique. has issues with rotating the strike just like golla, and these days also rajin. can't put way half volley and full tosses before blocking away everything for about 50 balls. i'd bring back nafis iqbal.

by the way, let's not judge tamim and aftab as test players before giving them a go, just because they're aggressive ODI players. tamim's FC average is 40 and aftab's ain't too shabby either. it's all about the runs by the end of the day... again, i'll take a 30 ball 30 over a 100 ball 30 any day if it doesn't adversely effect the outcome of the game. temperament doesn't mean playing like a kochch'hop. if turtles could bat, they'd not come out of that shell either. you gotta rotate the strike and put the juicy ones away. look at ponting, dravid and yusuf, the best anchors in the game...
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  #19  
Old May 24, 2007, 12:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aritro


Oh we're all just so dense.
I never said no one was dense, I said dense people dont like him, not that all those who dont like him are dense, catch my drift.

he clearly (now, forget the past) is looking to be the most ideal test batsman we have, though he doesnt capitalise on making the good strokes when a chance is there, I would always prefer 35 runs from 10 overs, than 25 runs in 5 overs and out, in a test match
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  #20  
Old May 24, 2007, 01:39 PM
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Still wont give up - eh, Dr_E-naf

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Naf
I never said no one was dense, I said dense people dont like him, not that all those who dont like him are dense, catch my drift.

he clearly (now, forget the past) is looking to be the most ideal test batsman we have, though he doesnt capitalise on making the good strokes when a chance is there, I would always prefer 35 runs from 10 overs, than 25 runs in 5 overs and out, in a test match
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  #21  
Old May 24, 2007, 01:40 PM
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It's only the tall Javed Omar who should be opening in Tests.

The short one is rubbish.
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  #22  
Old May 24, 2007, 01:41 PM
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Oh, Man, .. you hit the sweet spot!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sohel NR
...he's a golla clone ...
... temperament doesn't mean playing like a kochch'hop...
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  #23  
Old May 24, 2007, 02:20 PM
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Sohel Sohel is offline
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some of our young players seem to lose their form (hope nothing else) after getting married... so why not the two wives concept? ektar kachh theika jhari khaile onnoday tare jate peyar-mohobbot korbar pare... ...
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  #24  
Old May 24, 2007, 02:24 PM
BD-Shardul BD-Shardul is offline
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Its really unfortunate that BC forum members still judge our players based on their own liking. If you disagree, then can you explain why some people still advocate to drop Rajin and Javed Omar despite their good performances? More pathetic is the fact that not a single member appreciated Rajin's knock of 41. Didn't he steadied our innings when we were tottering at 30-3 or something like that? Wake up guys, Saleh is playing international cricket almost after 10 months.

Some members are arguing that it is the runs that matters at the end of the day. Not agree, because the statement is not applicable for test matches. Test matches is not about Do or Die. Here you have another option and that is 'draw'.

As for the strike rotation, Tamim, Aftab may be better rotator than Hablu, Golla, and Saleh, but if you get yourself out ealry, then your strike-rotating ability makes no sense at all.

Another unfortunate fact is that people forgive players of their own liking very easily and don't hesitate a bit in overlooking their mistakes.I have seen this happening again and again. We all know how strong was the support behind SN even after his poor form in the World Cup. Despite got out for playing an irresponsible shot, ASHFOOL supporters are forgiving him saying that ASH was unfortunate victim of a superb athletic catch. Guys, those type of athletic catch is not unfamiliar in cricket.

Before I conclude, I would like to remind that I am not against these young tigers. Who can deny their potential? But I want to things

- Justice should be fair for all.
- Young talented tigers like Tamim should play in the domestic leage extensively and should not be exposed to test level until they are 23-25.

Thanks to BCB selectors for doing a fine job. Disgrace to the mentality, which prefers pinch hitting in the test match ignoring temperament.
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  #25  
Old May 24, 2007, 02:27 PM
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Sohel NR : =| Actually.. we should finance Masri's wifey to open up an institute " HOW TO BE THE PERFECT WIFE FOR A CRICKETER? " and then train aftab,nafees,rajins wife.
How well Masri shaped up after getting married.
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