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  #1  
Old January 14, 2008, 11:11 AM
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Default If we can stay together we’ll improve: Siddons

TigerCricket.com Report
14-January-2008

WELLINGTON: Bangladesh’s resistance lasted 25 overs on day three after they started their second innings on 51 for 5, 199 runs behind New Zealand’s first innings of 393. The Tigers were eventually bundled out for 113 giving the home side an innings and 137-run victory.

Tamim Iqbal had a fractured left thumb and decided not to come out after failing to grip the bat in the morning. He was later checked by a specialist in Wellington and was told to cover his injured thumb with a splinter.

“The splinter would come off in two to three weeks and an x-ray will be done after that. Based on the report we’ll have an idea about when he can start training,” said team physio Darryn Lifson.

In the third ball of the day’s first over Habibul Bashar squeezed a four between the slips but played down the wrong line to an in coming delivery from Chris Martin two balls later and was lbw. Shahadat Hossan then helped Shakib Al Hasan add 23 before Hossain was caught behind. Shakib looked solid out there in the middle and timed the ball superbly. He was not out on 41 when last man Mashrafe Bin Mortaza became the victim of a blinder taken by a diving Kyle Mills at point.

The Tigers will leave Wellington for Auckland on Thursday to catch their flight to Bangkok on way to Dhaka.

Quotes

Jamie Siddons (Bangladesh Coach)


His views on the series

It expresses the void between the two teams and between the top four five Test teams and Bangladesh at the moment. There’s a massive amount of work to do. Possibly it also expresses the difference in experience between the two sides in terms of number of games played. We’ve got a quite a few guys who are playing their first, second, third and up to their tenth Test match which is not great experience. And when you consider how well spread our Test matches are, I think we’ve played 10 in the last two to three years, the guys don’t have the experience behind them to come out and mix it with New Zealand on the Wellington wicket kind of which is something we never get to play on back home.

Whether there was anything positive to take out of this tour

Not in terms of score on the board but definitely in terms of hope and potential. The potential of our opening bowlers Mashrafe (Bin Mortaza) and Shahadat (Hossain) is enormous. The potential of our opening combination of Tamim (Iqbal) and Zunaed (Siddique) is pretty enormous as well. I see some really good things there and I think it is going to be seen in the next four-five months. I believe down the track in the next two years time those guys are going to be pretty hard to dismiss on a regular basis. I see potential in Mohammad Ashraful who is averaging 25 but should be averaging 45. Shakib (Al Hasan) as our spinner had a great game and ended up batting quite well at the end. So there are some good things there and we just need to fill a few holes at the moment in our catching and fielding.

The way forward for this team

I think they need to stay together. They need to travel with the coaching staff I have chosen which I think is supposedly the best coaching staff around in Bangladesh. I’d love this 15 to stay together as long as we can. There is no Ricky Ponting, Brett Lee or Stephen Fleming back home. We have not left any of them behind, trust me. The best players are here and the best eleven was put out there today and I have to work with them and our coaching staff is working hard to get them up to the right standard. If we can stay together we’ll improve and if we keep changing the side all the time, which has happened in the past, then these guys will never get the experience and won’t gradually improve.

How long it might take for Bangladesh to be competitive

We need some work to do with the cricket structure in Bangladesh. We’ll try to keep this group together and get them to travel around the world and improve that way. That is the best practice they’ll get and the best facilities also and probably the best opposition is the key thing. In domestic cricket back home we don’t get the bouncy wickets and we don’t get the fast bowlers. With the more they travel and the more experienced they get they’ll get better. So it’s going to take a while. I have to say two years as my contract is for that period but it may even take longer to reach the level where we can compete properly with New Zealand in New Zealand which is a tough ask for any international cricket team.

Reasons he thinks Bangladesh have not been able to improve rapidly in Tests

I think there was a short-term goal from the previous management, definitely. Trying to win games as we go and I think we’ve had a short-term vision there. I think my vision is more long term with young players brought in purely on skill and talent which have been identified. We’ve got a great group at the moment but I’m sure there are a couple of players who need to be looked at back home.
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  #2  
Old January 14, 2008, 11:19 AM
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Nice comments by Siddons!
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  #3  
Old January 14, 2008, 11:23 AM
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Good vision. Good plan. Implementation and co-operation from all sectors will move this team forward. Thank you JS once again.
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  #4  
Old January 14, 2008, 11:30 AM
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I like the way he thinks. With our weak domestic structure, we don't have a good option but let our players (quoting Sohel bhai) "learn on the job".

Although he said he wants to keep the current team together, I am glad to see he is also open to look at couple of players back home (hopefully to dump Bashar and bring someone else in his place). Selectors should definitely introduce him to Alok, Nazim, Raqib, Imrul, and Dhiman
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  #5  
Old January 14, 2008, 11:31 AM
abu2abu abu2abu is offline
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Hmm, a bit contradictory is our coach. First he says:

"We have not left any of them behind, trust me. The best players are here and the best eleven was put out there today...."

Then he says:

"We’ve got a great group at the moment but I’m sure there are a couple of players who need to be looked at back home."

But his general ethos is good. the point he makes about the limitations of playing cricket in BD is a valid point. Our boys are only going to get better by playing abroad, on different types of wickets and against quality bowlers (fast and slow, as we clearly had trouble playing vettorie as much as an1 else!...)
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  #6  
Old January 14, 2008, 11:34 AM
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Well said.

But what else he could do beside some good words?

We still need to perform on the field.

New team, new management, new coach, new captain,new vision.

But 2001 and 2007 NZ tour - same result.

We still suck at it.

Im dissapointed.
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  #7  
Old January 14, 2008, 11:37 AM
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Reading between the lines, no contradiction.
Quote:
Originally Posted by abu2abu
Hmm, a bit contradictory is our coach. First he says:

"We have not left any of them behind, trust me. The best players are here and the best eleven was put out there today...."
Short-term plan. This is the best team.
Quote:
Originally Posted by abu2abu
Then he says:

"We’ve got a great group at the moment but I’m sure there are a couple of players who need to be looked at back home."
Long-term. For the future, a bigger pool is needed.
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  #8  
Old January 14, 2008, 11:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabz
New team, new management, new coach, new captain,new vision.

But 2001 and 2007 NZ tour - same result.
Batting - yes, bowling - no. Last time we could not get them all out or make them bat twice.
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  #9  
Old January 14, 2008, 11:41 AM
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BTW, has anyone else noticed that tigercricket is extremely slow to load. And when it does, it only loads partially.
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  #10  
Old January 14, 2008, 11:43 AM
abu2abu abu2abu is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tigers_eye
Reading between the lines, no contradiction.

Short-term plan. This is the best team.

Long-term. For the future, a bigger pool is needed.
You're assuming he meant long term/short term. I don't think he did, especially as these comments were not made in response to questions about the future.

In fact, I thought that by referring to "other players" he was talking about the South Africa series, which is hardly "long term".

I suppose it comes down to what you read between the lines....
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  #11  
Old January 14, 2008, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eshen
Batting - yes, bowling - no. Last time we could not get them all out or make them bat twice.
I get your point.

But the end result is still the same.

Humiliated on the odi series ( 3rd odi)

Test matches: yes, we played 5 days . But too bad it was combined of two matches, not one.

Loosing by 9 wickets and innings and 137 runs doesnt ring any good bells to me.

yeah yeah yeah..bouncy pitches, not used to, alien climate, too windy, tailor made,bad umpiring........ heard them all before.

You and me would probably get it, not the whole world.
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  #12  
Old January 14, 2008, 12:38 PM
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Bowling-wise Mashrafe and Shahadat are world-class. Batting-wise, Ash is our lone Knight in the shinning armour. He just has to come good at some point and starts averaging 45 that he should. We just have to be patient with him for at least one more year. Alok, Aftab, Nafees, Shakib, Tamim and Zunaid have to get their acts together and we will have a good batting base. Then we have Rasel, Enamul and Razzak.

These are our building blocks for future success. As JS said, we need to retain them for a long time. Success is bound to come our way...simply just so much talent there! ...No more chopping and changing!

We should keep an special eye on Raqibul, Imrul, Nazim, M Rubel, Dhiman, Sajidul, Dolar and Talha. Send them on A tour in England along with Tamim, Zunaid, Aftab, Nafees, Shakib, Mushfiq, Rasel and Shahadat.
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  #13  
Old January 14, 2008, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
We’ll try to keep this group together and get them to travel around the world and improve that way. That is the best practice they’ll get and the best facilities also and probably the best opposition is the key thing. In domestic cricket back home we don’t get the bouncy wickets and we don’t get the fast bowlers.
Very ver crucial thing to say!
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  #14  
Old January 14, 2008, 01:07 PM
FHossain FHossain is offline
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Default two test matches produced mirror bad performances

Surely this proves how these players are not learning and reacting to their mistakes in the right ways. Using mathematical probability it was hugely unlikely that both tests would be so paralel, however, exact same mistakes were made. Only exception tamim and junaeed's partnership, but even that will never happen again, that got proved in the second test. Disgraceful performance, cut their wages, shuffle the team, CHANGE THE SELECTORS, drop useless test players such as aftab, bashar, rahim etc. I feel sorry for siddons, the players are useless and the country needs to understand that when they get back home they will still get applauded due to that one-off 161 partnership. Set standards higher! No English county club or Indian, SA OR any other country's clubs and districts would have lost two tests in 5 days. Stop making excuses! The whole system is corupt, what can siddons do????????
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  #15  
Old January 14, 2008, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eshen
TigerCricket.com Report

Quotes

Jamie Siddons (Bangladesh Coach)

His views on the series

It expresses the void between the two teams and between the top four five Test teams and Bangladesh at the moment. There’s a massive amount of work to do. Possibly it also expresses the difference in experience between the two sides in terms of number of games played. We’ve got a quite a few guys who are playing their first, second, third and up to their tenth Test match which is not great experience. And when you consider how well spread our Test matches are, I think we’ve played 10 in the last two to three years, the guys don’t have the experience behind them to come out and mix it with New Zealand on the Wellington wicket kind of which is something we never get to play on back home.

Whether there was anything positive to take out of this tour

Not in terms of score on the board but definitely in terms of hope and potential. The potential of our opening bowlers Mashrafe (Bin Mortaza) and Shahadat (Hossain) is enormous. The potential of our opening combination of Tamim (Iqbal) and Zunaed (Siddique) is pretty enormous as well. I see some really good things there and I think it is going to be seen in the next four-five months. I believe down the track in the next two years time those guys are going to be pretty hard to dismiss on a regular basis. I see potential in Mohammad Ashraful who is averaging 25 but should be averaging 45. Shakib (Al Hasan) as our spinner had a great game and ended up batting quite well at the end. So there are some good things there and we just need to fill a few holes at the moment in our catching and fielding.

The way forward for this team

I think they need to stay together. They need to travel with the coaching staff I have chosen which I think is supposedly the best coaching staff around in Bangladesh. I’d love this 15 to stay together as long as we can. There is no Ricky Ponting, Brett Lee or Stephen Fleming back home. We have not left any of them behind, trust me. The best players are here and the best eleven was put out there today and I have to work with them and our coaching staff is working hard to get them up to the right standard. If we can stay together we’ll improve and if we keep changing the side all the time, which has happened in the past, then these guys will never get the experience and won’t gradually improve.

How long it might take for Bangladesh to be competitive

We need some work to do with the cricket structure in Bangladesh. We’ll try to keep this group together and get them to travel around the world and improve that way. That is the best practice they’ll get and the best facilities also and probably the best opposition is the key thing. In domestic cricket back home we don’t get the bouncy wickets and we don’t get the fast bowlers. With the more they travel and the more experienced they get they’ll get better. So it’s going to take a while. I have to say two years as my contract is for that period but it may even take longer to reach the level where we can compete properly with New Zealand in New Zealand which is a tough ask for any international cricket team.

Reasons he thinks Bangladesh have not been able to improve rapidly in Tests

I think there was a short-term goal from the previous management, definitely. Trying to win games as we go and I think we’ve had a short-term vision there. I think my vision is more long term with young players brought in purely on skill and talent which have been identified. We’ve got a great group at the moment but I’m sure there are a couple of players who need to be looked at back home.
Outstanding, just what I wanted!!!
Keep it up, Siddons!
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  #16  
Old January 14, 2008, 03:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FHossain
Surely this proves how these players are not learning and reacting to their mistakes in the right ways. Using mathematical probability it was hugely unlikely that both tests would be so paralel, however, exact same mistakes were made. Only exception tamim and junaeed's partnership, but even that will never happen again, that got proved in the second test. Disgraceful performance, cut their wages, shuffle the team, CHANGE THE SELECTORS, drop useless test players such as aftab, bashar, rahim etc. I feel sorry for siddons, the players are useless and the country needs to understand that when they get back home they will still get applauded due to that one-off 161 partnership. Set standards higher! No English county club or Indian, SA OR any other country's clubs and districts would have lost two tests in 5 days. Stop making excuses! The whole system is corupt, what can siddons do????????
Wow...calm down, bro! The useless players you're talking about ARE the best we got. So steady on! There are no kwik fix...you just have to bear with them. NZ conditions are very tough even for the bests. Yes, they have made repeated school-boy-like errors but they are of school boy age ,coming to think of it.

If this could make you any happier; they WILL put up a much better fight against the Saffers in Dhaka and Chittagong, insha-allah.

Please stop blaming the selectors, its somewhat silly.
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  #17  
Old January 14, 2008, 03:39 PM
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i feel like if bangladesh did bad in home series aginst south africa jamie siddons might leave from our country . but i really dont him to lose ,because he knows exectly where is our players problem . he is really great coach for our team i think . i really dont want him to lose. i really like his coaching when he brings 18 gog batting picth from 22 gog. because he knows that our batsman can not play fast bowler well. and he knows exectly who is somekind of good player.

Last edited by sipon; January 14, 2008 at 03:49 PM..
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  #18  
Old January 14, 2008, 03:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabz
Well said.

But what else he could do beside some good words?
We still need to perform on the field.
New team, new management, new coach, new captain,new vision.
But 2001 and 2007 NZ tour - same result.
We still suck at it.
Im dissapointed.
Rabz, I don't think it's quite fair to hold Siddons resposible at ths point, given the miniscule amount of time he has been with the team. Let's take a look after about a year or so before judging the coach.
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Old January 14, 2008, 04:01 PM
FagunerAgun FagunerAgun is offline
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We heard something like that when BD lost to Canada in 2003.
Where we are now after 5 years?
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  #20  
Old January 14, 2008, 04:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abu2abu
Hmm, a bit contradictory is our coach. First he says:

"We have not left any of them behind, trust me. The best players are here and the best eleven was put out there today...."

Then he says:

"We’ve got a great group at the moment but I’m sure there are a couple of players who need to be looked at back home."

But his general ethos is good. the point he makes about the limitations of playing cricket in BD is a valid point. Our boys are only going to get better by playing abroad, on different types of wickets and against quality bowlers (fast and slow, as we clearly had trouble playing vettorie as much as an1 else!...)
I don't see any contradiction. He thinks we did not leave out any superstars (i.e. Ponting, Bret Lee, etc.) but he also thinks that there are some good players who can join the squad to make it 15 or by replacing couple from the current squad.

So far Jamie has been saying the right stuff. We have a to wait and see how BCB and other support organizations work with him. I biggest fear is the media who swings its mood witht he wind and get people all up in the air for nothing.
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Old January 14, 2008, 04:43 PM
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It is over 4 years since the 2003 world cup when BD was beaten by every team, even Canada whose players do not play cricket throughout the year. Most of their players have full time jobs and get time off by their nice bosses. They do not even play many games. Bangladesh cricketers are paid to play full time. I still feel that this is a better team that played in 2003. I have seen a few of those matches and it was simply pathetic, those days are fully gone and with Jamie at the helm, Inshallah, those days will never return.

We have to keep the faith in these boys, the way Jamie is keeping the faith, and he feels that there will be a good turnaround by the middle of the year. He will not tolerate any crap from players, probably make them work so hard until they collapse from exhaustion, then revive them with a splash of cold water and make them work harder. He has the Aussie mentality and he has to rub this off on the players. If anyone is to toughen them up, it is Jamie.
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  #22  
Old January 14, 2008, 05:07 PM
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i wouldn't say that mash and rajib world class, unless "world class" is defined by being at par with fast bowlers from most Test nations.

Bangladesh's fast bowling stock with Mashrafee, Shahadat, and Rasel is the trio that we have to build around. whether sajid, dollar, zia, et al can do it is still to be decided.

but mash and shahadat are a class apart in BD and would walk into the NZ, WI, SL, and England test XIs. and they would push the indian-pakistani quicks for a 3rd pacer spot (RP, zaheer, asif, fit shoaib excluded).
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  #23  
Old January 14, 2008, 05:25 PM
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kind of contradictory to say he doesn't want to change the team but then at the end sneak in "but i'm sure there are a couple of players that need to be looked at back home".

anyway, i agree with keeping the team together and i agree with looking at players back home. basically the goal should be to look at all of the FC and ODD players pick out the talents (this icludes consistent performers which in itself is a talent), then pick the best 15 that would work together and keep them together for a couple of years.

this doesn't mean keep the squads that went to NZ together, alot of those players should be in the long term squad but before they nail down the long term squad they probably need to trial a few more players in the next couple of series then after that pick the long term 15.

siddons has the right idea as long as he doesn't get too carried away with keeping the team together and never considering/looking at possible better options for the squad.

Last edited by Gowza; January 14, 2008 at 05:50 PM..
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  #24  
Old January 14, 2008, 05:36 PM
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old wine in new bottle
i am hearing this crap for 7 years.
coaches comes and go the moto remains the same
no end result
bcb would hire someone els in two years and he would dish out the same crap
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Old January 14, 2008, 06:12 PM
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Great to FINALLY have a coach who's emphasizing the importance of staying together within the development process. The process involves:-

1. Addressing footwork and other technical deficiencies with regards to batting.

2. Developing temperament meaning learning to play "each ball according to its merit" on a variety of sporting wickets. Choosing the higher percentage when it comes leaving the ball, rotating the strike with ease, and giving loose deliveries the treatment seem simple enough on paper, but cannot be done without adequate time and match practice on better pitches. Luckily, most of our boys are still years away from their peak-range from the ages of 27-32. With Coach Siddons persisting with younger players with better talent, the ability to learn quickly, and the discipline to apply what they've learned, we certainly have a better future with the bat. GONE are the days of stop-gap measures and rank sentimentality from buiraz whose cavalier disregard of technique never really pushed us past the club or parhar cricket level.

3. Learning to bowl 6 good deliveries in a row before moving on to good back-to-back spells. There's no shortage of heart in guys like Mash, Rajib, Rasel, Razzak and Enam amongst others, but they have GOT to bowl IN THE RIGHT AREAS to the field set for them delivery after delivery, over after over and spell after spell.

4. NOT dropping catches, bungling easy direct hits, and fumbling ground balls for extra runs. Bad fielding is not simply not acceptable at this level. Fielding is one area where ANY team can compete with any other team and we must not be inconsistent in this area.

Cliché-ridden pessimism, just like drunken and puerile optimism serves the same, COUNTERPRODUCTIVE purpose which does not win games and move anything forward. Patience and sobriety on the other hand, will get us and our cricket to a much better place Inshallah, and Coach Siddons maybe the man to lead us there.

This is coming from a die-hard Red Wings fan before Scotty Bowman brought us to where we are today. Then the "Dead Wings" were lead by a young and talented Captain of their own, and would have had the hardest time believing what has been happening for the past 17 years because of a single man focused on the "fundamentals" ...

KEEP THE FAITH.
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Last edited by Sohel; January 15, 2008 at 08:38 AM..
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