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  #1  
Old January 25, 2008, 07:00 PM
Pundit Pundit is offline
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Default Ashraful, Eid, and his Career

CriteriaMinimum Score
151001411313> 6
55011112323311393> 6
40
23511112323311119114> 1
30
1250025222632302111003211103> 1



Criteria: To get red box
Red Box: Innings in between "Minimum Score" exceeding "criteria" value.
Box Values: Innings in between "Minimum Score" indicated
Yello Box: Eid Occurences in Career
> x : Innings passed since last time "Minimum Score" was exceeded.

A "Eid" is when the number of innings between "Minimum Score" is very low.

Looks like the interval between his large scores remain the same - which is that they still do not occur often enough. His recent rise in average is only because he is scoring 25/35 like scores more often.

Nothing more to it.

Last edited by Pundit; January 25, 2008 at 07:07 PM..
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  #2  
Old January 25, 2008, 08:03 PM
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Small victories Pundit
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  #3  
Old January 25, 2008, 10:05 PM
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in ODIs, his rate of scoring 50s has increased, with only 2 coming against minnow nations (kenya and canada).

in tests, he is actually stuck in neutral. lets see how captaincy changes things. i think in 2 years time, he can finally push his average to around the 30 mark.
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  #4  
Old January 26, 2008, 08:10 AM
zainab zainab is offline
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Wow! Another thread on Ashraful.

I think Captaincy should improve his performance. Under Coach Siddons, He seems a bit more determined now, I hope that he matures from here on.
He was born under a powerful star, but as I have mentioned before, he is going through a bad period, this will change on his 24th birthday, and we will see the real Ashraful again.
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  #5  
Old January 26, 2008, 02:37 PM
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are you sure? You see the way he got out in the 3rd odi against new zealand? Keeps making the same mistake over and over again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zainab
Wow! Another thread on Ashraful.

I think Captaincy should improve his performance. Under Coach Siddons, He seems a bit more determined now, I hope that he matures from here on.
He was born under a powerful star, but as I have mentioned before, he is going through a bad period, this will change on his 24th birthday, and we will see the real Ashraful again.
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  #6  
Old January 26, 2008, 04:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uss01
are you sure? You see the way he got out in the 3rd odi against new zealand? Keeps making the same mistake over and over again.
it was probably an uncalled for shot, but at the same time, had he hit it over oram, or had it been just wide of oram, it would have been a "SIX, Maximum".

i am more upset with the fact that he got out before scoring a hundred at auckland and that he survived 2 chances at wellington before being wrongfully dismissed for 35. and the ross taylor bullshit too.
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  #7  
Old January 26, 2008, 04:16 PM
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anyone notice something strange?

Ashraful's top 4 Test scores:

158* vs India @ Chittagong
136 vs Sri Lanka @ Chittagong
129* vs Sri Lanka @ Colombo
114 vs Sri Lanka @ Colombo

each ton was against a subcontinent team in the subcontinent.

Ashraful top 4 ODI scores:

100 vs Australia @ Cardiff
94 vs England @ Nottingham
87 vs South Africa @ Guyana
70 vs New Zealand @ Auckland

top 4 ODI scores all outside the safe confines of subcontient against non-SC teams. is this just a coincidence?
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  #8  
Old January 26, 2008, 04:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zainab
Wow! Another thread on Ashraful.
he is going through a bad period, this will change on his 24th birthday, and we will see the real Ashraful again.
I think it's quite the opposite. The pressre of being the only hope for our otherwise pathetic batting ineup will get to him...as he starts fading away slowly. Then media and fan forgets what he did in the past..and puts him under the spotlight for every move he makes a captain or batsman. AND THEN by the age of 3o he is dropped from the team as another "Promising teenager" takes his spot! THE INFAMOUS "HaBa story" all over again.
I hope I'm wrong...and u r right...but I don't see much difference in the way his carrer is shaping up to be than it did for Bashar. Skill is there, improvement is not...and then u have 15o million unrealistic and impatient fans waiting to "Korbani" u!
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  #9  
Old January 26, 2008, 04:36 PM
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All we fans want is for him and the BD team to stop embarassing us, by not throwing their wickets away, in both tests and odi's. Thats it. The results are not that important. But when they stop throwing their wickets away I'm sure good results will follow (i.e. wins in odi's and draws in tests, then even wins in tests). We're very close, yet their stupidity brings us down.
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  #10  
Old January 26, 2008, 07:16 PM
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So Ash should play test against countries with names end with "A" @ places with names start with "C" .....

Quote:
Originally Posted by al Furqaan
anyone notice something strange?

Ashraful's top 4 Test scores:

158* vs India @ Chittagong
136 vs Sri Lanka @ Chittagong
129* vs Sri Lanka @ Colombo
114 vs Sri Lanka @ Colombo

each ton was against a subcontinent team in the subcontinent.

Ashraful top 4 ODI scores:

100 vs Australia @ Cardiff
94 vs England @ Nottingham
87 vs South Africa @ Guyana
70 vs New Zealand @ Auckland

top 4 ODI scores all outside the safe confines of subcontient against non-SC teams. is this just a coincidence?
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  #11  
Old January 26, 2008, 10:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uss01
All we fans want is for him and the BD team to stop embarassing us, by not throwing their wickets away, in both tests and odi's. Thats it. The results are not that important. But when they stop throwing their wickets away I'm sure good results will follow (i.e. wins in odi's and draws in tests, then even wins in tests). We're very close, yet their stupidity brings us down.
Yes, that's exactly what the grid shows...to often his high scores are limited to the 25s.
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  #12  
Old January 26, 2008, 10:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by al Furqaan
in ODIs, his rate of scoring 50s has increased, with only 2 coming against minnow nations (kenya and canada).

in tests, he is actually stuck in neutral. lets see how captaincy changes things. i think in 2 years time, he can finally push his average to around the 30 mark.
The grid data just shows the Test scores, though you knew that.

I think he takes the bowling by storm in one-dayers, and that's why he is able to reach a 50 in ODIs. Moreover, bowling in ODIs are more run limiting than wicket limiting, so he tends to lose his wicket later, but his calibre helps him overcome the run limiting bowling approach...I'm just generalizing here very much, I suppose.
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  #13  
Old January 27, 2008, 08:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habfreak
I think it's quite the opposite. The pressre of being the only hope for our otherwise pathetic batting ineup will get to him...as he starts fading away slowly. Then media and fan forgets what he did in the past..and puts him under the spotlight for every move he makes a captain or batsman. AND THEN by the age of 3o he is dropped from the team as another "Promising teenager" takes his spot! THE INFAMOUS "HaBa story" all over again.
I hope I'm wrong...and u r right...but I don't see much difference in the way his carrer is shaping up to be than it did for Bashar. Skill is there, improvement is not...and then u have 15o million unrealistic and impatient fans waiting to "Korbani" u!
Wow! What pessimism! He cannot do worse than Bashar period.

The pressure of being the only hope has gotten to him in the past, but I think he is slowly coming to terms with the role he now has to play in the team.
Most cricketers dont come into ther own until they are 25 yrs old. Pushing Ash in the limelight so early in his teenage life has hampered his performance terribly. He should not have been pushed into the international arena too early. Should have played more domestic matches, then the added burden and responsibility of being the one hope for BD got to him and he began failing, so no reason to be so harsh to a young player who IMO has tried his best for BD. He is 23 yrs old, give him a break. IMO. he should not have accepted captaincy, but BCB had no other candidate.
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  #14  
Old January 27, 2008, 10:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zainab
Wow! What pessimism! He cannot do worse than Bashar period.

The pressure of being the only hope has gotten to him in the past, but I think he is slowly coming to terms with the role he now has to play in the team.
Most cricketers dont come into ther own until they are 25 yrs old. Pushing Ash in the limelight so early in his teenage life has hampered his performance terribly. He should not have been pushed into the international arena too early. Should have played more domestic matches, then the added burden and responsibility of being the one hope for BD got to him and he began failing, so no reason to be so harsh to a young player who IMO has tried his best for BD. He is 23 yrs old, give him a break. IMO. he should not have accepted captaincy, but BCB had no other candidate.
Agreed, but mid 20s??? Come on sis, I cannot think of any International cricketer in recent memory other than Graeme Smith and Michael Clarke who have "come into their own" in their mid 20s and started performing with any degree of consistency, and they have also had the benefit of their better cricket infrastructures and older, wiser cricket cultures. Try late 20s and hope they reach their peak during the early 30s ...

Young geniuses like the two mentioned above and Lara, Tendulkar and Ponting before them are exceptions to the rule. Talented guys like Sangakkara and Jayawardena have had to wait until hitting their current form in the late 20s, and the best consistency is yet to come from guys like Yuvraj, Sarwan, Gayle, M Hussey and Samuels, all past their 25th birthdays if I'm not mistaken. International cricket is hardly the sport for people that young despite some great success here and there.

Having said that, Ash will learn to apply his talent better and deliver more consistently Inshallah from the age of 27, like other talented batsmen in the side. Unless BCB manages to screw up the process completely, we have no reason NOT to expect great things from Zunaed, Tamim, Imrul, Aftab, Mushy, Dhiman, Shakib, Rokibul, Nazmus and who knows, even Alok during that "peak range". We also have players like the Nafeeses who still have their best cricket ahead of them. Then you've got hard workering players like Merhrab Jr, Farhad Reza and Abul Bashar who continue to improve. I wish I had my finger on the cosmic "fast forward" button.

The Captaincy issue is a no brainer when we look at HaBa's exploits.
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Last edited by Sohel; February 1, 2008 at 10:19 AM..
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  #15  
Old January 27, 2008, 10:42 AM
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another 2-3 years and wait and see wat becomes of Ash!btw,wat iz his actual age?
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  #16  
Old January 27, 2008, 11:32 AM
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Sohel Bhai, I am so glad that you mentioned Jayawardena and Sangakkara's names. If I remember rightly, Jayawardena was dropped from the National team after his poor showing in the 2003 World Cup. Poor fellow, his beloved brother died from cancer and it affected his batting. He reinvented himself from 2004 and now, look at his record. Also Sangakkara has scored most of his runs after 2004, both these batsmen are now 30 yrs old, so there is big hope for Ash to score many runs by the time he is 30 yrs old.
Also now, there are other young dependable players in the team and under Siddons tutelage, this team will slowly get better and perform better, so let's hope that 2008, that we see marked improvement in Ash and the rest.
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  #17  
Old January 27, 2008, 04:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zainab
Wow! What pessimism! He cannot do worse than Bashar period.

The pressure of being the only hope has gotten to him in the past, but I think he is slowly coming to terms with the role he now has to play in the team.
Most cricketers dont come into ther own until they are 25 yrs old. Pushing Ash in the limelight so early in his teenage life has hampered his performance terribly. He should not have been pushed into the international arena too early. Should have played more domestic matches, then the added burden and responsibility of being the one hope for BD got to him and he began failing, so no reason to be so harsh to a young player who IMO has tried his best for BD. He is 23 yrs old, give him a break. IMO. he should not have accepted captaincy, but BCB had no other candidate.
I agree with both you and Sohel bhai that batsmen reach their peak in their mid 20s...but that is when u let them develop properly! and part of develpoing properly is paying your dues at the domestic level...have we done that with any of the players Sohel bhai mentioned?
I hope as badly as any other fan that i'm wrong, but I'm afraid all this hype about being world beaters in 3/4 years is a hype. I think we have messed up this generation of players pretty badly by throwing them into the international arena too quickly. They haven't learnt to value their positions; it shows in the lack of development (Ash, Aftab, Nafees).
These players will never do for Bangladesh what the generation of Ranatunga/De Silva did for SL performance wise. I terms of leadership..we'll have to wait until they are in their 30s to see if they had learnt anything form their mistakes...and if they can use that learning in moulding new talent. but..again...we are talkin about 5/6 years down the road...right now we would just have to be satisfied with occasional flash of graeatness..and embarassment the rest of the way!
And Ash will never be as bad as Bashar? If I was Ashraful, I'd gladly settle for a 32.00 average right now if offered
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  #18  
Old January 27, 2008, 07:34 PM
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Innings by innings list
17-----v Sri LankaColombo (SSC)25 Jun 2007Test # 1837
2-13.052000v Sri LankaColombo (SSC)25 Jun 2007Test # 1837
337-----v Sri LankaColombo (SSC)25 Jun 2007Test # 1837
10-----v Sri LankaColombo (PSS)3 Jul 2007Test # 1838
2-7.031000v Sri LankaColombo (PSS)3 Jul 2007Test # 1838
3129*-----v Sri LankaColombo (PSS)3 Jul 2007Test # 1838
126-----v Sri LankaKandy11 Jul 2007Test # 1839
2-12.074010v Sri LankaKandy11 Jul 2007Test # 1839
319-----v Sri LankaKandy11 Jul 2007Test # 1839
10-----v New ZealandDunedin4 Jan 2008Test # 1859
2-9.046200v New ZealandDunedin4 Jan 2008Test # 1859
323-----v New ZealandDunedin4 Jan 2008Test # 1859
4-0.16000v New ZealandDunedin4 Jan 2008Test # 1859
135-----v New ZealandWellington12 Jan 2008Test # 1861
2-2.016000v New ZealandWellington12 Jan 2008Test # 1861
31-----v New ZealandWellington12 Jan 2008Test # 1861


Post WC ASH stat shows he scored in the 30's right before a 100. So according to this trend he might score a second innings century against SA in the first test although we wont be able to avoid a defeat of 10+ wickets .
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  #19  
Old January 28, 2008, 08:04 AM
zainab zainab is offline
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The trouble with Ash, is that when he begins to score well, he forgets how many runs he has scored, the adrenalin pours through his veins, throws caution to the wind and voila! there goes a poor shot selection. I think that Siddons will make him practice more to hit the ball closer to the ground. He has not mastered that yet, if he can do this, then he can score more runs.
When I watched this teenager in 2001 scoring a century, I was watching a little genius. In the ensuing years, he has lost his way somewhat. He still holds the record for being the youngest centurion, i dont think any other country will choose a 17yr old to play in a test match, all commentators throughout the world always mentions this, they comment on his talent, BUT!!!! POOR SHOT SELECTION AND INCONSISTENCY, NOT DEPENDABLE.
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  #20  
Old January 28, 2008, 12:44 PM
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Pundit bhai,

I did not understand the first post of the thread. However, I think i understand what you are trying to say.

We could also analyze a "Consistency Index" (CI) of sorts as well. Take a players mean score squared and divide it by his standard deviation: mean ^ 2/SD

even for low mean, but consistency one should get a lower CI value.

for a standard, lets use K Sangakarra over the last 2 years (his form has been sick, and so his CI should be extraordinarily high).

K Sangakkara Test CI = 74.07 (mean score 76.21, SD = 78.40)

Now looking Ashraful:

Ash Test CI = 16.88 (mean score = 23.85, SD = 33.70)
Ash ODI CI = 17.91 (mean score = 20.16, SD = 22.69)

*********

so ashraful is actually more consistent in his scoring throughout his career than KS has been the last 2 years. but ash is consistently scoring low scores.

another interesting note:

ashraful seems to really struggle against minnows, or at least dominating them.

against top 8 ODI teams (which includes zimbabwe pre-BS) his stats:

1478 runs @ 21.74 73.90 strike rate 20.53 mean score

overall career stats:

2016 runs @ 22.15 73.02 strike rate 20.16 mean score

his mean score (runs per innings) and strike rate are higher against top sides, albeit marginally. only his average is lower due to batting down at number 7 against zimbabwe in 2006 and remaining unbeaten a number of times.

had ashraful bashed minnows like aftab and SN, then his averages would be significantly higher.

(all stats courtesy of my personal database)
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  #21  
Old January 28, 2008, 02:44 PM
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Yes indeed, AF - however way we disseminate Ash's performance, a lot is left to be desired. Maybe our expectations are misplaced -but still, he should have been atleast pushing towards the mid 30s in both forms of game, and not merely trying to consolidate his current middish 20 average. Sigh.

I remember long back...actually long long back, I think in the first 18 months of Tests, Bashar's test average was a 44 something. Wow.

Last edited by Pundit; January 28, 2008 at 05:41 PM..
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  #22  
Old January 28, 2008, 07:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pundit
Yes indeed, AF - however way we disseminate Ash's performance, a lot is left to be desired. Maybe our expectations are misplaced -but still, he should have been atleast pushing towards the mid 30s in both forms of game, and not merely trying to consolidate his current middish 20 average. Sigh.

I remember long back...actually long long back, I think in the first 18 months of Tests, Bashar's test average was a 44 something. Wow.
bashar had a mad solid average his first 7-8 matches or so, which is more than can be said of the current lot. but that doesn't mean that his batting is now any better than enamul jr's.

also, i expect ash's average to start going up...with tamim, junaid, mushy, and hopefully one or two more, there should be a cessation of wickets tumbling soon. lets see what JS can manage for Saffie tour.
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