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  #1  
Old May 18, 2008, 11:22 PM
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Thumbs up US of PA Versus Siddons, the Latest.

US, apologist par excellence, is spot on this time.

READ

Maybe someone will be kind enough to translate ? ...
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  #2  
Old May 19, 2008, 01:55 AM
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hmm - maybe US has a point. But honestly we need our boys to be tough enough now to win without the soft psychology. Otherwise it will be that once in a blue moon win. The players who will survive this regime won't need some beer-goggle reality packaged in coach-speak to win. They will win because they bloody will WANT to win.

To this point: I'm looking at the likes of TI or S-a-H. You think those two need some Stuart-smileyesque daily affirmations to get their self-belief?
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  #3  
Old May 19, 2008, 02:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RazabQ
hmm - maybe US has a point. But honestly we need our boys to be tough enough now to win without the soft psychology. Otherwise it will be that once in a blue moon win. The players who will survive this regime won't need some beer-goggle reality packaged in coach-speak to win. They will win because they bloody will WANT to win.
US definitely has a point or two here, no matter how convoluted his ulterior motives may or may not be.

The flaccid, putuputu approach oozing with ceaseless New-Age slash SW-esque positive affirmations doesn't work in Bangladesh IMHO. Because instead of inspiring players to do better, it tends to make them complacent, dangerously delusional and moronic.

Weirdly enough, the negativist approach does the same with different expressions of moronic delusions as recently observed from the behavior of Ash and Aftab.

It is important to maintain and enhance one's self esteem, and offer the sort of corrective action that focuses on the what-what-why within clearly set lines, rather than the traditional belittlement in public -- but that has to be done within the context of International cricket WITHOUT taking away the few achievements we actually managed.

JS continues to almost casually flaunt his lack of interest, especially when compared to RM, in the details of our cricket and see everything from his almost arrogant, poorly informed and vacation-laden subjectivity. That is not helping either as the substantial difference between tough love and de facto fatalism in the name of "realistic expectations" is lost inside that smooth head somewhere.

He needs to learn a few things to and drop the know-it-all attitude...

Quote:
To this point: I'm looking at the likes of TI or S-a-H. You think those two need some Stuart-smileyesque daily affirmations to get their self-belief?
... Funny image.

Tamim probably does it with a punching bag with Munaf and Talha's face printed around his eye level.

Tamim and MaMi are young and have their own ways of bouncing back I'm sure. I just pray to GOD they sustain their comparatively more consistent performances. MaMi's in terms of "containment" bowling only because despite the couple of magnificent recent knocks, his batting has been more on the shaky side.
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Last edited by Sohel; May 19, 2008 at 02:48 AM..
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  #4  
Old May 19, 2008, 05:34 AM
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Perfect, absolutely spot on.

Even an established mature team might find it difficult to perform, under such negative attitude of the coach.
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  #5  
Old May 19, 2008, 05:51 AM
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it would be great if someone post the image of the news!! Cannot get the fonts of prothom-alo!!
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  #6  
Old May 19, 2008, 06:34 AM
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Its funny, how I am feeling the same way as did Utpal Shuvro. Excellen article, he just put out the words, what I had been dying to let out in the air for so long.

Absolutely, when you look back and see the performance of a team for the last 2.5 yers before JS took over and then compare that with JS's, you see a day night difference. The most important aspects are the players lack in self confidence, the can do attitude and satisfaction out of absolutely nothing. Thats why we hear Aftab is satisfied with a bare 9.0 batting avg! What a change in attitude! Bravo Jamie Siddons bravo. You have been successful letting a teams morale close to zero with your vacation ladden arrogance and know it all attitude.

"When you dont have victory written inside, you cant have victory outside". Its time for a reality check guys. Do you still want to carry on with a guy who spent more time on vacation than actual time on the field with our boys? Would you still like to step forward with a guy, who does not believe in our cricket, rather focus on the blame game all the time? I was shell shocked just even yeserday reading JS questioning the performance of our cricketers (during Biman-Abahoni) match, saying how can these players play at the nternational level, if they they cant even compete at the domestic level. FYI JS these same boys carried out fantastic victory after victory right before you joined. All the hell actually broke loose since you took over.

My question is are you JS is actually capable of winning a match at the international level, if it is not Australia? I dont think so. Mr. JS you need to go back and learn test level coaching first, learn to motivate players first and then come back. Until then keep you mouth shut and leave us alone.
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Last edited by reyme; May 19, 2008 at 06:40 AM..
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  #7  
Old May 19, 2008, 06:53 AM
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A coach's task is to solve the problems of players. Instead JS keeps complaining. Bd players average 20, BD players are at a level where you need to teach basics of cricket bla bla bla. Pathetic. Even Zimbo coach doean't speak like that.
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  #8  
Old May 19, 2008, 08:55 AM
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Siddons and his players need to hear any motivational speaker speak. Couple of weeks back I just heard Les Brown speak in my students graduation ceremony. Uplifting, inspiring, heartening and moving all put together. May be BCB can arrange something like that. BCB should have a team manager who can contradict with Siddons expectation.

I vote for US himself.
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  #9  
Old May 19, 2008, 09:11 AM
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Siddon keno... Siddon-er Baba combined with Dav-er Baba-o amader talented experienced player-der change kortey parbey na. Ashraful is no Bashar. Nor is he Rafiq, Gullu or Pilot. They may have limited skills, but they gave 100% and was eager to learn. They saved the team from total disaster. Now non of them are there anymore to save our as*.
Now Ashraful is the leader in the team. And we see his efffect in Aftab. Pretty soon he will influence Zuniad and other young players. Sooner we realize that and remove cancerous element from the team the better it is. Forgat about Siddon, No coach was able to change Ashraful. Whats makes you think Siddon will suddenly able to change him.
Ashraful and Aftab is happy with their performance. They are to a point that they think whatever they do, they are still good enough to be in the team. What you expect for Siddon? He should support and pamper them?

I am not saying I am happy with Siddon's performance so far, but I am not going to blame him for our experience's player's lack of improvement also. Among young and new players: Zunaid, Rahim is a disapointment. But Tamim, Sakib, Shahadat, Mahmudullah showed improvement.
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  #10  
Old May 19, 2008, 09:45 AM
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After 57, he said I played good. Gave bad luck as another excuse.
After getting dropped from Mahamadan he said, I am being rested.

Can reality be so far from a person? "FINE" the bugger. Penalize him. That is the only way if one can put some sense on him.
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  #11  
Old May 19, 2008, 10:27 AM
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Fazal, it's not only about Ashraful, but also about the self-esteem and the belief pattern of every player.

It's easy to blame Ashraful because of his stupidity, but definitely Siddons has much greater influence on the team compared to Ash.

Siddons is simply ruining what we have achieved during Dav era. Self-esteem and winning mentality are more precious than techniques to win matches.

We needed someone like Dav at the helm with couple of good coaches in the academy. Dav is a different material.
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  #12  
Old May 19, 2008, 11:02 AM
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Haire bangali!!
The person who was proud to utter the name "Siddons' first as a potential BD coach and now the same person is asking his head.
Without knowing properly how to play cricket, self belief or whatever you say can't make a good cricket team. To become a consistently performing team knowing how to play cricket is much more important than all the postive lectures or believe. If our cricketers knew the proper cricket, Siddon's negative comment could harm a little. Dave's inspirational coaching can win a few match here and there but that was not sufficient (nor our target) to become a consistently performing team. Not that I am happy with Siddon's performance but I believe a Siddon's style coaching will benefit us for the long run.
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  #13  
Old May 19, 2008, 11:06 AM
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Miraz,
I am not saying Siddon is doing a good job. And I agree that 'on theory' Siddon, as coach, should have more influence than the captain. But you cannot ignore the influence of Captain Ashraful in our young team with a foreign new coach. Siddon is doing lot of things that can be critisized. But not his inability to change players like Ashraful, Aftab and (in some extend) Mashrafee. By this time they are expreienced enough to self motivate themselves and guide the young players as well. In Indo-Pak-Bangladeshi culture its not abnomal to see captain incluence the whole the team when the team is young and the coach is foreign. For example: Pakistan and Inzy (and now Shoeb), India with Dada (and now with Dhony). You cannot ignore the role of Captain in our young team.

The mistake was made long before Siddon came here.... the mostake was made when we made Ashraful the captain.... the talented superstar who was always unable to adopt and unable to learn from his previous coaches. And we thought just making him the captain will suddenly make him more responsible and more productive. Thats the main root cause of pour problem. Aftab (with less national skill than Ash) is following Ashraful's path.... Zunida is on the way..... who knows about SN and Tamim.... may be one day they will aslo follow the leader.

Now back to Siddon. How much influence he had with the young players? I would say its a mixed signal.... some improvement with Sakib, mahmudullah, Sahadat, Tamim etc but haven/t seen much with Zunaid, Rahim, Mehrab, etc for different reasons. Among moderate experienced players Rasel (after injury), Razzak and SN are kind of struggling. I cannot completely blame Siddon for that.

Now where I blame Siddon?
1. Fielding is going downward

2. Sticking with Ash and Aftab too long.

3. Taking too many vacations. But we don't know whats in his contract. May be we need to blame BCB for that more than Siddon.

4. Sometimes saying stuff (even I may agree) that may create hearburn to fans and reporters.

5. Not knowing players beyond his 14/16 selected players. No interest to know beyond that.

6. Not talking control of the team and prevent further damage being done buy the two bolods.

7. etc....

btw if you want someone like Dav as coach thats fine..... but make no mistake McInnis is Noooo Dav. He wouldn't tolerate those two bolods (plus more may be) and their stupidness.... he would make sure that these two connot even enter to the stadium or make any contact with the rest of the young players.

Last edited by Fazal; May 19, 2008 at 11:19 AM..
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  #14  
Old May 19, 2008, 11:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cricket_dorshok
Haire bangali!!
The person who was proud to utter the name "Siddons' first as a potential BD coach and now the same person is asking his head.
Without knowing properly how to play cricket, self belief or whatever you say can't make a good cricket team. To become a consistently performing team knowing how to play cricket is much more important than all the postive lectures or believe. If our cricketers knew the proper cricket, Siddon's negative comment could harm a little. Dave's inspirational coaching can win a few match here and there but that was not sufficient (nor our target) to become a consistently performing team. Not that I am happy with Siddon's performance but I believe a Siddon's style coaching will benefit us for the long run.
Thanks for saying it so clearly.... you hit few key points.
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  #15  
Old May 19, 2008, 11:26 AM
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Tough approach doesn't mean, breaking the morale and self belief

What a logic man, "If our cricketers knew the proper cricket, Siddon's negative comment could harm a little" Salute

I wonder if harming Is the way of teaching !! Good approach, TUI PROPER CRICKET JOANOCH NA KEN, SHA LA TOR CRICKET KHELAR SHOKH E SHESH KOiRA DIMU.

bravo for the coach and his support. great people think alike, & ..... too.
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  #16  
Old May 19, 2008, 11:37 AM
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So far we did pampering. So what Pampering gave us so far?
We had one Ashraful to deal before, now we have two fools. You do more pampering? Pretty soon you will have a team with 11 fools.

Next what? Buy a dozen of diapers and pacifyers incase they start wetting their pants and start crying when opponent fielders start sledging them saying they are noo good?
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  #17  
Old May 19, 2008, 11:41 AM
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While I don't go along with Fazal's singling out of Ashraful as the root cause (he's more emblematic than anything), we are both on the same page that at this point we need the tough love. Let us take our lumps while we find the players who have strong mind. Don't forget, before winning the Reliance World Cup, Border's Aussies (with Waugh, Boon, Marsh, McDermott, et al) were hardly world beaters. But they stuck with the tough minded guys, took the hard knocks and turned it around. Siddons is trying to get our players fundamental straight and giving them no molly coddling. Our over-emotional folks need to get around this line of thinking.
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  #18  
Old May 19, 2008, 11:55 AM
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I don't agree that Siddon's approach is tough approach, it's a demoralizing approach. Haven't heard about any hard stance by Siddons on any issues except putting excuses for losing.

To be honest, I haven't seen any sort of technical improvements of any player under his coaching.

"You are a bunch of losers, how dare you dream to win!!", that's the message Siddon's is giving out. This is not tough love or anything similar.
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  #19  
Old May 19, 2008, 11:56 AM
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Just face it..... nobody wants to be our coach.

Dav ran away the first chance he got....even taking a job to coach Inidan u-19 team.

Our management and players are not ready to handle McInnes 'no-nonsense' type of coaching.... he doesn't believe in baby seating... and diaper changing.... he will change the 'polau birirani' diet, will not except picnic and fooling-around atmosphere. He is a no nonsence kind of guy... wouldn't give 3rd, 4th or 5th chance to players ....You don't like Siddon's approach? Then you wouldn't like McInnes thats for sure.

You want nicer and kinder coach? Like GG? You are complaining about Siddon's vacation... they agreed even more vacation and still GG didnlt want the job. You don't like Siddon saying that we are no good? Guess what? w What GG said in out 1st WC?

Then who do we get? I say go to Mother Teresa's graveyard and pray if she can come back and coah our natioanl team.
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Old May 19, 2008, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazal
Just face it..... nobody wants to be our coach.

Dav ran away the first chance he got....even taking a job to coach Inidan u-19 team.
That's not true. Dav had some initial proposal of pay rise and we declined his offer.

After the initial proposal got rejected, Dav decided to move on. India job prospect was certainly a reason and that simply ruined Dav's reputation.

Ironically, we are paying Siddons more than Dav's demand.
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  #21  
Old May 19, 2008, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cricket_dorshok
Haire bangali!!
The person who was proud to utter the name "Siddons' first as a potential BD coach and now the same person is asking his head.
Without knowing properly how to play cricket, self belief or whatever you say can't make a good cricket team. To become a consistently performing team knowing how to play cricket is much more important than all the postive lectures or believe. If our cricketers knew the proper cricket, Siddon's negative comment could harm a little. Dave's inspirational coaching can win a few match here and there but that was not sufficient (nor our target) to become a consistently performing team. Not that I am happy with Siddon's performance but I believe a Siddon's style coaching will benefit us for the long run.
C_D, I proposed Siddon's name as the prospective coach of Bangladesh and that was simply due to his coaching pedigree with different Australian team.

Now, I am not convinced with his approach/tactics and is ready to ask questions.

From what I have seen so far, he is neither a hard taskmaster nor an inspiring coach.
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  #22  
Old May 19, 2008, 12:06 PM
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Siddons is like Minhazul abedin Nannu, who just know how to put the blames on others ppl or things.

And they both are failing in their job.

We should make Bulbul our head coach. He's a great coach. He does the opposite of the twos. Instead of playing the blame games, he just concentrate on working hard with his players and find a way to beat the opposition team with few talented players.

We don't need any foreign coach who are just like whiney babies.
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  #23  
Old May 19, 2008, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miraz
I don't agree that Siddon's approach is tough approach, it's a demoralizing approach. Haven't heard about any hard stance by Siddons on any issues except putting excuses for losing.

To be honest, I haven't seen any sort of technical improvements of any player under his coaching.
Ok Miraz fair enough. To be true I also don't like it because i was hoping he would be more tough.

But now comes the real hard question. What we do? Who we bring in? No body wants the job.

.. except for McInnes....and for some reason we (BCB) are too afraid of McInees and his coaching aproach. And I am not sure now McInnes will want it either. He is a proud man. When BCB delayed his renewal (to the last moment), he made his move first. I doublt he will acpect it now. There is too much chaos here and too much unrealistic expectation here... need complete rebuiling mode ... getting rid of all the spoiled players.


Are we ready for this? I don't think so.
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  #24  
Old May 19, 2008, 12:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miraz
That's not true. Dav had some initial proposal of pay rise and we declined his offer.

After the initial proposal got rejected, Dav decided to move on. India job prospect was certainly a reason and that simply ruined Dav's reputation.

Ironically, we are paying Siddons more than Dav's demand.
I don't know where you are getting this information. As far as I know, Dav was looking this job as a launching pad for his next move. Unfortunately he misjudged it.

Plus Dav Stopped talking with Ash. Why? He realized that its a no win situation here in this job, he cannot make permanent change... drop players who are not learning...... he just went with the flow and bought some time and did his job hunting while staying with us ... atleast the last few years.
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  #25  
Old May 19, 2008, 12:18 PM
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There is no problem for the coach being tough with the players. Infact the coach should be tough. There should be no mercy in training and penalizing for nonsense game. He is even at liberty to insult the senior players infront of the team and board if needed. Drop anyone if they are not showing any improvement repeatedly...anything else that can be defined as being tough, to improve the team.

But killing the self belief is not at all the way of improvement. Every player must believe that they can improve and come to the expected standard. If that's gone, nothing can improve the game.

Show me an area where sidon has made a positive impact. He is simply unfit for the national side. He can be with with under 13/14 team, where they have long time in hand to improve, lets see if he is even capable of doing that over a long period, as some people expect.
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