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Old June 24, 2009, 12:42 AM
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Fazal Fazal is offline
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Default Bangladeshi Match Winner Player(s) - myth or reality?

The way we use Match Winner and "Playing his Natural Game" is kind of over using these terms I guess. Beamer addressed "Natural Game" aspect and here in this thread I would try to discuss about Match Winner issues. Do we really have any? if so, who are they?

We often argue that this guy is match winner and that guy is not and to prove our case we stage and filter our data and use our fuzzy logic to say this 50 was better than that 50 or a 100 somehow is astronomically better than a 95 for example. But for me its pure straight and simple who I consider a match winner (if any) and who is not.

I don't want to distinguish the quality of the score, the opponent, nor do I want to distinguish between a 100 and a 98 beyond that 2 run difference. To me, every runs counts, every wicket counts and every opponent counts equal. When BD plays against any opponent ODI or TEST, that records counts.

To me, to be considered to be a match winning performance, he needs to win MOM award. There may be multiple players who contribute significantly, but the one who wins the MOM is officially considered the best performer in that particular game, and therefore the Match Winner. Others are contributors and may be potential match winner, but definitely not the match winner in that game.

In the next two posts I would show the stat for TEST MOM and ODI MOM for all the games that we played. That would give us if really we have any significant match winner or not. Also I am going take into consideration how many times they played and calculate their potential MOM rate. I think it’s unfair for a player who may played 10 games with 1 MOM to compare with another player with 5 MOM with 100 games with pure total number of MOM they each got. That’s why I am calculating potential MOM rate.

I hope it will shed some light to some
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Last edited by Fazal; June 24, 2009 at 01:17 AM..
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Old June 24, 2009, 12:43 AM
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YEAR
OpponentWinnerMOM
2000IndiaIndiaSB Joshi (India)
2001ZimbabweZimbabweJaved Omar (Bangladesh)
2001ZimbabweZimbabweGJ Whittall (Zimbabwe)
2001PakistanPakistanDanish Kaneria (Pakistan)
2001Sri LankaSri LankaMohammad Ashraful (Bangladesh)
M Muralitharan (Sri Lanka)
2001ZimbabweDrawTJ Friend (Zimbabwe)
2001ZimbabweZimbabweGW Flower (Zimbabwe)
2001New ZealandNew ZealandMH Richardson (New Zealand)
2001New ZealandNew ZealandCD McMillan (New Zealand)
2002PakistanPakistanAbdul Razzaq (Pakistan)
2002PakistanPakistanYousuf Youhana (Pakistan)
2002Sri LankaSri LankaM Muralitharan (Sri Lanka)
2002Sri LankaSri LankaMG Vandort (Sri Lanka)
2002South AfricaSouth AfricaGC Smith (South Africa)
2002South AfricaSouth AfricaJH Kallis (South Africa)
2002West IndiesWest IndiesJJC Lawson (West Indies)
2002West IndiesWest IndiesAlok Kapali (Bangladesh)
2003South AfricaSouth AfricaJA Rudolph (South Africa)
2003South AfricaSouth AfricaMohammad Rafique (Bangladesh)
2003AustraliaAustraliaSR Waugh (Australia)
2003AustraliaAustraliaSCG MacGill (Australia)
2003PakistanPakistanYasir Hameed (Pakistan)
2003PakistanPakistanShoaib Akhtar (Pakistan)
2003PakistanPakistanInzamam-ul-Haq (Pakistan)
2003EnglandEnglandSJ Harmison (England)
2003EnglandEnglandRL Johnson (England)
2004ZimbabweZimbabweSM Ervine (Zimbabwe)
2004ZimbabweDrawNot Recorded
2004West IndiesDrawCH Gayle (West Indies)
2004West IndiesWest IndiesRR Sarwan (West Indies)
2004New ZealandNew ZealandBB McCullum (New Zealand)
2004New ZealandNew ZealandSP Fleming (New Zealand)
2004IndiaIndiaIK Pathan (India)
2004IndiaIndiaMohammad Ashraful (Bangladesh)
2005ZimbabweBangladeshEnamul Haque jnr (Bangladesh)
2005ZimbabweDrawT Taibu (Zimbabwe)
2005EnglandEnglandME Trescothick (England)
2005EnglandEnglandMJ Hoggard (England)
2005Sri LankaSri LankaM Muralitharan (Sri Lanka)
2005Sri LankaSri LankaTT Samaraweera (Sri Lanka)
2006Sri LankaSri LankaMohammad Ashraful (Bangladesh)
2006Sri LankaSri LankaWU Tharanga (Sri Lanka)
2006AustraliaAustraliaAC Gilchrist (Australia)
2006AustraliaAustraliaJN Gillespie (Australia)
2007IndiaDrawMashrafe Mortaza (Bangladesh)
2007IndiaIndiaZ Khan (India)
2007Sri LankaSri LankaM Muralitharan (Sri Lanka)
2007Sri LankaSri LankaKC Sangakkara (Sri Lanka)
2007Sri LankaSri LankaM Muralitharan (Sri Lanka)
2008New ZealandNew ZealandJDP Oram (New Zealand)
2008New ZealandNew ZealandDL Vettori (New Zealand)
2008South AfricaSouth AfricaJH Kallis (South Africa)
2008South AfricaSouth AfricaGC Smith (South Africa)
2008New ZealandNew ZealandDL Vettori (New Zealand)
2008New ZealandDrawDL Vettori (New Zealand)
2008South AfricaSouth AfricaGC Smith (South Africa)
2008South AfricaSouth AfricaAG Prince (South Africa)
2008Sri LankaSri LankaShakib Al Hasan (Bangladesh)


The above table is the summary of all the 58 TEST that we played. There was 1 Win, 6 Draw and 51 Loss.
Only 9 times a BD player was rewarded as MOM i.e Match winning perforamce.



The following table have the list of these players and their Potential MOM Rate (PMOMR)

PlayerMOMTEST PlayedPotntial MOM Rate
Javed Omar (Bangladesh)1402.50%
Mohammad Ashraful (Bangladesh)3486.25%
Alok Kapali (Bangladesh)1175.88%
Mohammad Rafique (Bangladesh)1333.03%
Enamul Haque jnr (Bangladesh)1137.69%
Mashrafe Mortaza (Bangladesh)1352.86%
Shakib Al Hasan (Bangladesh)1128.33%


My conclusion:

None of our players have good PMOMR to be proud of

Only one player, Ashraful, has multiple MOM

Young players like Shakib and Enamul has better PMOMR than more senior and establsihed players like Mashrafee, Rafique and Ashraful

In TEST, its a myth rather than reality, i.e we don't have any true Match winner in our team yet. So there is no point to brag about who is our Match Winner and who is not in TEST team.
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Last edited by Fazal; June 24, 2009 at 01:14 AM..
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Old June 24, 2009, 12:44 AM
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Bangladesh has played 198 ODI out of which they won 44 games i.e. winning percentage of 22%. In these games, Bangladeshi players earned 49 MOMs i.e. 24% times.

Therefore if we look for match winners, we me be disappointed. However taking into consideration of our 22% team winning percentage, if we lower our bar and try to find out who are our match wining contributors in game in game out, that may be more relevant to us. Also that will give us another POV to analyze our young team that who may give us our next WIN (or close to win) by winning another MOM award. This thread I am using PMOM Rate as an indicator of player's rate/projection of their MOM and thereby give the team a chance for another win.

Here are the 198 games we played and the MOM for each.
YEAROpponentWinnerMOMMan of the Series
1986PakistanPakistanWasim Akram (Pakistan)
1986Sri LanksSri LankaAP Gurusinha (Sri Lanka)
1988IndiaIndiaNS Sidhu (India)
1988PakistanPakistanMoin-ul-Atiq (Pakistan)
1988Sri LanksSri LankaDSBP Kuruppu (Sri Lanka)
1990New ZealandNew ZealandAH Jones (New Zealand)
1990AustraliaAustraliaPL Taylor (Australia)
1990IndiaIndiaNS Sidhu (India)
1990Sri LanksSri LankaAthar Ali Khan (Bangladesh)
1995IndiaIndiaM Prabhakar (India)
1995Sri LanksSri LankaA Ranatunga (Sri Lanka)
1995PakistanPakistanWasim Akram (Pakistan)
1997PakistanPakistanSaeed Anwar (Pakistan)
1997Sri LanksSri LankaST Jayasuriya (Sri Lanka)
1997IndiaIndiaSC Ganguly (India)
1997KenyaKenyaKO Otieno (Kenya)
1997ZimbabweZimbabweGW Flower (Zimbabwe)
1997ZimbabweZimbabweBC Strang (Zimbabwe)
1997KenyaKenyaMA Suji (Kenya)
1998IndiaIndiaJ Srinath (India)
1998PakistanPakistanSaqlain Mushtaq (Pakistan)
1998IndiaIndiaA Jadeja (India)
1998KenyaBangladeshMohammad Rafique (Bangladesh)
1998KenyaKenyaSO Tikolo (Kenya)
1998IndiaIndiaA Kumble (India)
1999PakistanPakistanInzamam-ul-Haq (Pakistan)
1999KenyaKenyaSO Tikolo (Kenya)
1999ZimbabweZimbabweA Flower (Zimbabwe)
1999KenyaKenyaKO Otieno (Kenya)
1999ZimbabweZimbabweDR Campbell (Zimbabwe)
1999New ZealandNew ZealandGR Larsen (New Zealand)
1999West IndiesWest IndiesCA Walsh (West Indies)
1999ScotlandBangladeshMinhajul Abedin (Bangladesh)
1999AustraliaAustraliaTM Moody (Australia)
1999PakistanBangladeshKhaled Mahmud (Bangladesh)
1999West IndiesWest IndiesJC Adams (West Indies)
1999West IndiesWest IndiesBC Lara (West Indies)
2000Sri LanksSri LankaPA de Silva (Sri Lanka)
2000IndiaIndiaSC Ganguly (India)
2000PakistanPakistanImran Nazir (Pakistan)
2000EnglandEnglandAJ Stewart (England)
2001ZimbabweZimbabweBC Strang (Zimbabwe)
2001ZimbabweZimbabweADR Campbell (Zimbabwe)
2001ZimbabweZimbabweGW Flower (Zimbabwe)
2001ZimbabweZimbabweCB Wishart (Zimbabwe)
2001ZimbabweZimbabweDD Ebrahim (Zimbabwe)
2001ZimbabweZimbabweDD Ebrahim (Zimbabwe)
2002PakistanPakistanRashid Latif (Pakistan)
2002PakistanPakistanYousuf Youhana (Pakistan)
2002PakistanPakistanShahid Afridi (Pakistan)
2002Sri LanksSri LankaMS Atapattu (Sri Lanka)
2002Sri LanksSri LankaCRD Fernando (Sri Lanka)
2002Sri LanksSri LankaRP Arnold (Sri Lanka)Khaled Mashud (Bangladesh)
2002AustraliaAustraliaJN Gillespie (Australia)
2002New ZealandNew ZealandSE Bond (New Zealand)
2002South AfricaSouth AfricaHH Gibbs (South Africa)
2002South AfricaSouth AfricaHH Gibbs (South Africa)
2002South AfricaSouth AfricaSM Pollock (South Africa)
2002West Indiesn/rN/A
2002West IndiesWest IndiesRR Sarwan (West Indies)
2002West IndiesWest IndiesVC Drakes (West Indies)
2003CanadaCanadaA Codrington (Canada)
2003Sri LanksSri LankaWPUJC Vaas (Sri Lanka)
2003West Indiesn/rN/A
2003South AfricaSouth AfricaM Ntini (South Africa)
2003New ZealandNew ZealandCD McMillan (New Zealand)
2003KenyaKenyaMO Odumbe (Kenya)
2003IndiaIndiaYuvraj Singh (India)
2003South AfricaSouth AfricaMohammad Ashraful (Bangladesh)
2003IndiaIndiaG Gambhir (India)
2003South AfricaSouth AfricaSM Pollock (South Africa)
2003AustraliaAustraliaB Lee (Australia)
2003AustraliaAustraliaDR Martyn (Australia)
2003AustraliaAustraliaRT Ponting (Australia
2003PakistanPakistanYasir Hameed (Pakistan)
2003PakistanPakistanUmar Gul (Pakistan)
2003PakistanPakistanUmar Gul (Pakistan)
2003PakistanPakistanYousuf Youhana (Pakistan)
2003PakistanPakistanYasir Hameed (Pakistan)
2003EnglandEnglandA Flintoff (England)
2003EnglandEnglandA Flintoff (England)
2003EnglandEnglandA Flintoff (England)
2004ZimbabweabanN/A
2004ZimbabweabanN/A
2004ZimbabweBangladeshMohammad Ashraful (Bangladesh)
2004ZimbabweZimbabweHH Streak (Zimbabwe)
2004ZimbabweZimbabweKhaled Mahmud (Bangladesh)
2004West IndiesWest IndiesTL Best (West Indies)
2004West IndiesWest IndiesDR Smith (West Indies)
2004West IndiesWest IndiesDR Smith (West Indies)
2004Hong KongBangladeshJaved Omar (Bangladesh)
2004PakistanPakistanYasir Hameed (Pakistan)
2004IndiaIndiaSR Tendulkar (India)
2004Sri LanksSri LankaST Jayasuriya (Sri Lanka)
2004PakistanPakistanShoaib Malik (Pakistan)
2004South AfricaSouth AfricaCK Langeveldt (South Africa)
2004West IndiesWest IndiesCH Gayle (West Indies)
2004New ZealandNew ZealandCL Cairns (New Zealand)
2004New ZealandNew ZealandAftab Ahmed (Bangladesh)
2004New ZealandNew ZealandSB Styris (New Zealand)
2004IndiaIndiaM Kaif (India)
2004IndiaBangladeshMashrafe Mortaza (Bangladesh)
2004IndiaIndiaV Sehwag (India)
2005ZimbabweZimbabweDT Hondo (Zimbabwe)
2005ZimbabweZimbabweBG Rogers (Zimbabwe)
2005ZimbabweBangladeshManjural Islam Rana (Bangladesh)
2005ZimbabweBangladeshManjural Islam Rana (Bangladesh
2005ZimbabweBangladeshMohammad Rafique (Bangladesh)
2005EnglandEnglandME Trescothick (England)
2005AustraliaBangladeshMohammad Ashraful (Bangladesh)
2005EnglandEnglandPD Collingwood (England)
2005AustraliaAustraliaA Symonds (Australia)
2005EnglandEnglandAJ Strauss (England)
2005AustraliaAustraliaShahriar Nafees (Bangladesh)
2005Sri LanksSri LankaDPMD Jayawardene (Sri Lanka)
2005Sri LanksSri LankaWU Tharanga (Sri Lanka)
2005Sri LanksSri LankaCRD Fernando (Sri Lanka)
2006Sri LanksSri LankaPDRL Perera (Sri Lanka)
2006Sri LanksBangladeshAftab Ahmed (Bangladesh)
2006Sri LanksSri LankaKC Sangakkara (Sri Lanka)
2006KenyaBangladeshShahriar Nafees (Bangladesh)
2006KenyaBangladeshSyed Rasel (Bangladesh)
2006KenyaBangladeshMohammad Rafique (Bangladesh)
2006KenyaBangladeshRajin Saleh (Bangladesh)Shahriar Nafees (Bangladesh)
2006AustraliaAustraliaAC Gilchrist (Australia)
2006AustraliaAustraliaA Symonds (Australia)
2006AustraliaAustraliaMJ Cosgrove (Australia)
2006ZimbabweZimbabweS Matsikenyeri (Zimbabwe)
2006ZimbabweBangladeshFarhad Reza (Bangladesh)
2006ZimbabweZimbabweBRM Taylor (Zimbabwe)
2006ZimbabweZimbabweP Utseya (Zimbabwe)
2006ZimbabweBangladeshShahriar Nafees (Bangladesh)
2006KenyaBangladeshShakib Al Hasan (Bangladesh)
2006KenyaBangladeshMashrafe Mortaza (Bangladesh)
2006KenyaBangladeshMashrafe Mortaza (Bangladesh)Mashrafe Mortaza (Bangladesh)
2006Sri LanksSri LankaWU Tharanga (Sri Lanka)
2006West IndiesWest IndiesCH Gayle (West Indies)
2006ZimbabweBangladeshShahriar Nafees (Bangladesh)
2006ZimbabweBangladeshShahriar Nafees (Bangladesh)
2006ZimbabweBangladeshSC Williams (Zimbabwe)
2006ZimbabweBangladeshAbdur Razzak (Bangladesh)
2006ZimbabweBangladeshAftab Ahmed (Bangladesh)
2006ZimbabweBangladeshGB Brent (Zimbabwe)Shahriar Nafees (Bangladesh)
2006ScotlandBangladeshShakib Al Hasan (Bangladesh)
2006ScotlandBangladeshMashrafe Mortaza (Bangladesh)Aftab Ahmed (Bangladesh)
2007ZimbabweBangladeshShakib Al Hasan (Bangladesh)
2007ZimbabweZimbabweGB Brent (Zimbabwe)
2007ZimbabweBangladeshShahriar Nafees (Bangladesh)
2007ZimbabweBangladeshAftab Ahmed (Bangladesh)Mashrafe Mortaza (Bangladesh)
2007BermudaBangladeshShahriar Nafees (Bangladesh)
2007CanadaBangladeshShakib Al Hasan (Bangladesh)
2007IndiaBangladeshMashrafe Mortaza (Bangladesh)
2007Sri LanksSri LankaST Jayasuriya (Sri Lanka)
2007BermudaBangladeshMohammad Ashraful (Bangladesh)
2007AustraliaAustraliaGD McGrath (Australia)
2007New ZealandNew ZealandSE Bond (New Zealand)
2007South AfricaBangladeshMohammad Ashraful (Bangladesh)
2007EnglandEnglandSI Mahmood (England)
2007IrelandIrelandWTS Porterfield (Ireland)
2007West IndiesWest IndiesRR Sarwan (West Indies)
2007IndiaIndiaMS Dhoni (India)
2007IndiaIndiaG Gambhir (India)
2007IndiaabanN/A
2007Sri LanksSri LankaCRD Fernando (Sri Lanka)
2007Sri LanksSri LankaST Jayasuriya (Sri Lanka)
2007Sri LanksSri LankaJ Mubarak (Sri Lanka)
2007New ZealandNew ZealandJM How (New Zealand)
2007New ZealandNew ZealandPG Fulton (New Zealand)
2008New ZealandNew ZealandDL Vettori (New Zealand)
2008South AfricaSouth AfricaGC Smith (South Africa)
2008South AfricaSouth AfricaA Nel (South Africa)
2008South AfricaSouth AfricaJA Morkel (South Africa)
2008IrelandBangladeshMashrafe Mortaza (Bangladesh)
2008IrelandBangladeshFarhad Reza (Bangladesh)
2008IrelandBangladeshTamim Iqbal (Bangladesh)Shahriar Nafees (Bangladesh)
2008PakistanPakistanMohammad Yousuf (Pakistan)
2008PakistanPakistanSalman Butt (Pakistan)
2008PakistanPakistanSalman Butt (Pakistan)
2008PakistanPakistanShakib Al Hasan (Bangladesh)
2008PakistanPakistanMohammad Asif (Pakistan)
2008PakistanPakistanSalman Butt (Pakistan)
2008IndiaIndiaG Gambhir (India)
2008UAEBangladeshMohammad Ashraful (Bangladesh)
2008Sri LanksSri LankaKC Sangakkara (Sri Lanka)
2008IndiaIndiaSK Raina (India)
2008Sri LanksSri LankaST Jayasuriya (Sri Lanka)
2008PakistanPakistanAbdur Rauf (Pakistan
2008AustraliaAustraliaMEK Hussey (Australia)
2008AustraliaAustraliaSE Marsh (Australia)
2008AustraliaAustraliaTamim Iqbal (Bangladesh)
2008New ZealandBangladeshJunaid Siddique (Bangladesh)
2008New ZealandNew ZealandJDP Oram (New Zealand)
2008New ZealandNew ZealandLRPL Taylor (New Zealand)
2008South AfricaSouth AfricaDW Steyn (South Africa)
2008South AfricaSouth AfricaHM Amla (South Africa)
2008South AfricaabanN/A
2009ZimbabweZimbabweE Chigumbura (Zimbabwe)
2009Sri LanksBangladeshShakib Al Hasan (Bangladesh)
2009Sri LanksSri LankaKC Sangakkara (Sri Lanka)Shakib Al Hasan (Bangladesh)
2009ZimbabweZimbabweRW Price (Zimbabwe)
2009ZimbabweBangladeshRaqibul Hasan (Bangladesh)
2009ZimbabweBangladeshMashrafe Mortaza (Bangladesh)Shakib Al Hasan (Bangladesh)



Here are the Bangladeshi players you won MOM and calculated PMOM Rate
PlayerMOMODI PlayedPotntial MOM
Shahriar Nafees60711.67%
Shakib Al Hasan6269.68%
Manjural Islam Rana2528.00%
Mashrafe Mortaza10376.80%
Farhad Reza3226.25%
Junaid Siddique 1715.88%
Athar Ali Khan1915.26%
Aftab Ahmed8045.00%
Raqibul Hasan2314.35%
Mohammad Ashraful13964.32%
Minhajul Abedin2414.17%
Tamim Iqbal5323.77%
Khaled Mahmud7722.60%
Syed Rasel3912.56%
Mohammad Rafique12532.40%
Rajin Saleh4312.33%
Javed Omar5911.69%
Adbur Razzak8111.23%


Atlast the ODI data is compiled together and PMOM Rate calculated. For those who care take a look, it may open some eye ( as it did to me)...

http://www.banglacricket.com/alochon...59&postcount=3

I am reposting my observation here anyway....


Facts from the data (ODI):

1) Shahriar Nafees and Mashrafe got maximum of 7 MOMs followed by Ashraful and Shakib who got 6 MOMs.

2) The top 5 PMOM Rate Holders are 1) SN ( 11.7%), 2) Shakib (9.7%), 3) Rana (8%), 4) Mashrafe (6.8%), Farhad (6.2%)

However Rana and Farhad didn't played enough games to have a stabilized PMOM.


My comments (about our ODI players) :

Personally it really opens my mind about the few thinks:

1) We can trust our young players in future to win us some games for us in future, more that what we used to get in the past.

2) Rana's 8% PMOM (3rd in the list) , just make me realize that what a talent we lost, nothing spectacular.. no hype, but result oriented performance like a blue color worker.

3) Marshrafee is still our most trust worthy experienced player we have.

4) Shakib will lead us to the next level. I am hoping that his PMOMR will increase over next few years as most of his MOMRsare recent.

5) We need SN as soon as possible in the team. Some of his MOM (not all) came from weaker teams. But then, those are teams we play more. So why not bring him back to make sure we win against them day in day out. That will make our team's job much easier.

6) We need to bring back Farhad into the ODI equation as soon as possible. He may not be a solution for TEST or T20, but looks like he is still an untapped potential for our ODI team. In his limited exposure his PMOMR of 8% ( 4th in all time list) proves. At least he will bring some competition.

7) As we already spent some time in Junaid, maybe we should stick with him a little longer. But only when he is inform with the bat. No point to spoil his career. Long term, I would like to see further where he can take us.

8) Raqibul will stabilize our lineup and in low scoring bowling friendly games, he may win some MOMs as well as games for us.

9) Aftab (5%) has slightly higher PMOMR than Ashraful (4.3%). Aftab may bring some experience, flair and some quick runs like Ash. So I say we need to bring back Aftab also and let him compete with Ash for a slot in the final 11.

10) By this time Tamim should have a much better PMOMR what he have now. He need to go to the next level . These 30s and 40s is not going give him any MOMs. As an opener, he is in a unique position. He needs to take it to 80s and 100s.

11) Pilot was the best WC that we ever had. Pilot had one "Man of the series" award. We need more production from our current WC groups. And the way to do it is more competition. There comes brining back Dhiman if we donlt have any talent who is ready to challenge Rahim.

12) More or less I feel much better about our future with our newer corps of players, specially the middle order. However in Bowling, Opener, and WC we have to see which young players step in to replace Mashrafe, SN, and Pilot. Because up to now, we still don’t have adequate replacement of those three.

[Updated June 29, 2009]
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Last edited by Fazal; June 28, 2009 at 11:54 PM..
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  #4  
Old June 24, 2009, 12:53 AM
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Fazalda....stop hogging your own thread.
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Old June 24, 2009, 12:58 AM
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According to this, Tendulkar is #1 matchwinner.

Shakib's result: 6 times in all three format of the game.
Nafees' result: 7 times "
Ash's result: 10 times "

Last edited by Zeeshan; June 24, 2009 at 01:38 AM..
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Old June 24, 2009, 01:23 AM
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Wtf is a match-winner?

Can we not stick with the term 'team player'?
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Old June 24, 2009, 01:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gopal Bhar
According to this, Tendulkar is #1 matchwinner.

Shakib's result: 6 times in all three format of the game.
Nafees' result: 7 times "
Ash's result : 7 times "

you linked ashraful to nafees' page.
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Old June 24, 2009, 01:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gowza
you linked ashraful to nafees' page.
thanks. someone is alert! wish only 1/2 the bc were as astute as you...
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Old June 24, 2009, 01:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gopal Bhar
According to this, Tendulkar is #1 matchwinner.

Shakib's result: 6 times in all three format of the game.
Nafees' result: 7 times "
Ash's result : 7 times "
Gopal Da... edhar ka stat udhar ar koto din cholbey?

Ash got 6 not 7, Your link is wrong. It takes to Nafees's link
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Old June 24, 2009, 01:36 AM
Gowza Gowza is offline
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you can also check series awards, shakib has 2, ashraful has 1 and nafees has has 3.
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Old June 24, 2009, 01:37 AM
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Ash got 10 MoM Awards not 7.

Career averages
SpanMatRunsHSBat Av100WktsBBIBowl Av5CtSt
overall2001-20091985075158*23.067333/2650.360490Profile
Match awards
player of the match2611414006300Test v Sri LankaColombo (SSC)6 Sep 2001Test # 1561
player of the match52-5203600ODI v South AfricaDhaka14 Apr 2003ODI # 2003
player of the match51*-51--00ODI v ZimbabweHarare10 Mar 2004ODI # 2110
player of the match158*316112900Test v IndiaChittagong (MAA)17 Dec 2004Test # 1727
player of the match100-100--00ODI v AustraliaCardiff18 Jun 2005ODI # 2250
player of the match136113703320Test v Sri LankaChittagong (CDS)28 Feb 2006Test # 1784
player of the match29*-29--00ODI v BermudaPort of Spain25 Mar 2007ODI # 2554
player of the match87-87--00ODI v South AfricaProvidence7 Apr 2007ODI # 2564
player of the match61-6115500T20I v West IndiesJohannesburg13 Sep 2007T20I # 24
player of the match109-109--00ODI v United Arab EmiratesLahore24 Jun 2008ODI # 2


Cricinfo Link
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Old June 24, 2009, 01:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazal
Gopal Da... edhar ka stat udhar ar koto din cholbey?

Ash got 6 not 7, Your link is wrong. It takes to Nafees's link
uff....same thing....tomtato...tomato
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  #13  
Old June 24, 2009, 01:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gowza
you can also check series awards, shakib has 2, ashraful has 1 and nafees has has 3.
Khaled Mashud and Mashrafe as Well
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12.6 Syed Rasel to Sangakkara, OUT: What a delivery, completely fooled Sangakkara, first five delivery were the outswingers and now, this one comes in sharply, Sangakkara tries to left it and ball hits the off stump, top class bowling!
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Old June 24, 2009, 01:39 AM
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So what's the verdict, before ami ghumaite jai....according to Fazalda's criteria Ash is the "matchwinner"?
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Old June 24, 2009, 01:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kabir
Wtf is a match-winner?

Can we not stick with the term 'team player'?
I understand your frustration Bhaigna.

But this debate is going on in the "Thanks Ashraful for your service as Bangladesh Captain" where people were claiming that we have only one match winner in the team. I didn;t want to dilute that thread as its a thread created by Ash fans to give him his final honor.

However I couldn't resist to point out we really don;t have any. And if we really have one, his name may no longer be Ashraful.
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Old June 24, 2009, 01:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazal
I understand your frustration Bhaigna.

But this debate is going on in the "Thanks Ashraful for your service as Bangladesh Captain" where people were claiming that we have only one match winner in the team. I didn;t want to dilute that thread as its a thread created by Ash fans to give him his final honor.

However I couldn't resist to point out we really don;t have any. And if we really have one, his name may no longer be Ashraful.
So You Wasted, 15 Minutes of yours and Our Time Due to your Hatred of Ash?

In the End Fazal, Ash will Always Win, Remember that
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12.6 Syed Rasel to Sangakkara, OUT: What a delivery, completely fooled Sangakkara, first five delivery were the outswingers and now, this one comes in sharply, Sangakkara tries to left it and ball hits the off stump, top class bowling!
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Old June 24, 2009, 01:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cricman
So You Wasted, 15 Minutes of yours and Our Time Due to your Hatred of Ash?

In the End Fazal, Ash will Always Win, Remember that
lmfao....hahaha....wow! no seriously, he sets up a criteria, like the boundary conditions of a function, then sculpts on it....and collapses the whole deal by puling that his initial arguments were moot. wow!

bangali janeo khaijuira alap korte...
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  #18  
Old June 24, 2009, 01:46 AM
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Woo, looks like SN is our 'match winner'.
: floor::f loor:

Biggest joke in recent times!!

Peraonally, I don't believe in matchwinners. It's impossible to 'win' a match alone.For example, without Bashars slowpoke 47, Ash's exploding 100 would be useless. Without Ash's run a ball 26, Shakib's sensational 92 would be in vain.

Dev whatmore targetted players and asked for personal improvement only as a way to improve the team.This is not the way to be a formidable team. This is the way towards a merely respectable team,which I admit we're still a way apart from .

In a settled team, A match winner is someone who can finish the game or go an extra mile, like Albie Morkel or Pietersen or Yuvraj. But to do that, they must be given a platform. We currently don't have a line up that can provide the launchpad for a potential matchwinner. Once that part is done, I'll look for matchwinner.

Remember, even the Mighty Gayle can't win a measly 20 over battle by himself.
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  #19  
Old June 24, 2009, 01:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cricman
So You Wasted, 15 Minutes of yours and Our Time Due to your Hatred of Ash?

In the End Fazal, Ash will Always Win, Remember that
I didn't waste your time. It's you who is responsible for your own wasted time. And please don't try to judge my own time and how I use it and whether I consider it wasted or not.

I understand that you are pissed off with what is happening with Ash.

If you want to vent off your frustration, please go somewhere else and pick some one esle to fight. Lets not go again in a discussion who kiss Ash's as$ and who hates Ash.

I care less if Ash is personally successful or not, I care more if team wins or lose. may be there is our difference.

We all support our team. I think Ash is damaging the team's goal and you think he is helping, and lets keep it that way and agree to disagree.

And if you think this thread is wasting your time, please feel free to ignore this thread.

Thanks
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Last edited by Fazal; June 24, 2009 at 02:03 AM..
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  #20  
Old June 24, 2009, 01:51 AM
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We have to put BD team and it's players in true perspective. We have to consider our level of cricket and the players are compared within our national boundary only. Whomever has significant & maximum contribution in changing the course of a match is a match winner.

Though we didn't win many tests, but at some point even draw or putting up a fighting score was considered to be victories for us. Hope we don't forget where we started. A good century in a match or a 5 wkt haul in a test displays match winning performance for our team. Had there performance been supported by some moderate performances by a couple others could have given us a win. That's what other reputed international math winners enjoy from their side.

Trying to prove; We don't have a Match winner is like; "Nijer Naak Kete Porer Jatra Bhongo". Highly Pre conceived ..... .
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Last edited by BANFAN; June 24, 2009 at 02:06 AM..
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  #21  
Old June 24, 2009, 01:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cricman
So You Wasted, 15 Minutes of yours and Our Time Due to your Hatred of Ash?

In the End Fazal, Ash will Always Win, Remember that
Revenge of the Ash fans.

Starring cricman and Fazal as protagonist and asntagonist.

Hold your breath......
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  #22  
Old June 24, 2009, 01:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BANFAN
Trying to prove; We don't have a Match winner is like; "Nijer Naak Kete Porer Jatra Bhongo". Highly Pre conceived ..... .
I like the phrase. Explanation please. How it originated? shardul vai koi...
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  #23  
Old June 24, 2009, 02:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Siraji
Woo, looks like SN is our 'match winner'.
: floor::f loor:

Biggest joke in recent times!!

Peraonally, I don't believe in matchwinners. It's impossible to 'win' a match alone.For example, without Bashars slowpoke 47, Ash's exploding 100 would be useless. Without Ash's run a ball 26, Shakib's sensational 92 would be in vain.

Dev whatmore targetted players and asked for personal improvement only as a way to improve the team.This is not the way to be a formidable team. This is the way towards a merely respectable team,which I admit we're still a way apart from .

In a settled team, A match winner is someone who can finish the game or go an extra mile, like Albie Morkel or Pietersen or Yuvraj. But to do that, they must be given a platform. We currently don't have a line up that can provide the launchpad for a potential matchwinner. Once that part is done, I'll look for matchwinner.

Remember, even the Mighty Gayle can't win a measly 20 over battle by himself.
Well Siraji, if you don;t believe in 'match winner' concept, I agree with you. You cannot ignore supporting players' role as this game is not played by 1 player but 11 players.

Therefore the logic that player X or Y ( regardless of his performance) cannot be droped by claiming he is a match winner, and without him we cannot win any more, should not make any sense to you also.

But then again you explained who is a match winner in your POV. See there lies the problem, your definition is too vague and subjest to interpretation and will be different based on individual and cannot be backed up with facts. And there we get statements from fans that "he is our true match winner and he is not". It cannot be backup by stat, and there lies the problem.
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Last edited by Fazal; June 24, 2009 at 02:07 AM..
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  #24  
Old June 24, 2009, 02:04 AM
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Fazal Using Your Criteria of (PMOMR)

Murali, Andy Flower, Kapil Dev are Either Equal or Worth Less than Ash

Lara < Shahriar Nafees

Numbers can be skewed to favor anyones argument
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12.6 Syed Rasel to Sangakkara, OUT: What a delivery, completely fooled Sangakkara, first five delivery were the outswingers and now, this one comes in sharply, Sangakkara tries to left it and ball hits the off stump, top class bowling!
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  #25  
Old June 24, 2009, 02:09 AM
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At a glance, this shows that Aussies got more matchwinners ... 2nd would prolly be india...third pakistan....i am too lazy...will someone kindly tally them up plz?
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