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  #1  
Old January 8, 2010, 03:30 PM
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Default Shakib hails 'real progress'

source
http://www.cricinfo.com/tri-bdesh201...ry/443157.html

***To a neutral, the one-sided contest in tonight's match may have been really boring. A tournament already devoid of any context and struggling for quality cricket seemed to have sunk to a new low tonight in many ways. However, it would be a myopic view of Bangladesh cricket, which has shown some definite signs of progress.

In ascending order, the hosts scored 296 against India yesterday, their highest score against a Test-playing country. They ended on 260 in the tri-series opener against Sri Lanka, and tonight, they were just one short of 250.

Interestingly enough, on all three occasions it felt that they could easily have scored 30 runs more. Impressively, and this perhaps has been the stand-out factor, they didn't play their usual brand of flashy cricket. Captain Shakib Al Hasan agreed, "That has been the biggest gain. Not playing any silly shots but by being sensible, we are still scoring these many runs - that has been the best part of this tournament for us. We are learning to play calmly and we are happy that we have been able to score more or near about 250 in three consecutive games."

He pointed out something interesting the other night though, after the loss to India. He said he chose to bat first not because he thought the dew wouldn't play a part later, but it was the fear of chasing 350 that India were capable of posting. They seem to be the words of a man lacking in confidence, but Shakib believes it's self awareness from a man who knows the limitations of the team and someone who is practical.

One journalist though, couldn't hold himself back. "Why do you say that? If you can score 297, can't you chase 320 or 350?" Shakib's polite response was, "All I'm saying is, we are still not quite confident of chasing those type of scores. Not yet."

One can understand where Shakib is coming from. It's a thought from someone who reckons he should learn to walk, before thinking about running. Some might argue that it limits oneself and that one must learn to dream big. Shakib said he wanted to master the basics and get the process right, so that the results follow. He seems to be a man wary of the past when Bangladesh would dazzle briefly, but eventually fall well short of achieving anything consistently.

"We have three 250 runs score consistently now, and I see it as real progress," he said. We have seen the old flashy Bangladesh implode spectacularly so often that we must give this new calmer approach some time to succeed.

Bangladesh might not have a captain who is tactically brilliant. They don't have potent seamers and possess a few batsmen who seem to prefer to live on the edge. But in Shakib, they seem to have a very sensible captain. He answers tricky and loaded questions with a disarming honesty, hasn't forgotten to smile, and has the confidence of his team-mates as well.

He certainly seems to have the backing of the selectors. Akram Khan, one of the national selectors, hailed him as a passionate cricketer who is out to do full justice to his talent and as someone who leads by example. Coach Jamie Siddons thinks Bangladesh would be really competitive in two years' time and Shakib concurs with the thought. It's up to their passionate, at times perhaps too emotional, fans to take a call on where they stand. Bangladesh cricket doesn't seem to be improving at the pace they, or the critics, want it to. But, it should have been obvious from the beginning that, it was never going to be a easy ride.
Sriram Veera is a staff writer at Cricinfo***
.................................................. .................................................. ...

my personal comment on this matter:

"He said he chose to bat first not because he thought the dew wouldn't play a part later, but it was the fear of chasing 350 that India were capable of posting."

well that is honestly 100% true! with players like that who strikes fear into any teams heart (espacialy shewag and yuvraj, when they gets going well there is simply no stoping them)


"All I'm saying is, we are still not quite confident of chasing those type of scores. Not yet."

well we maybe cursing at him and already ready to take the crown away from him but then again he speaks simply the truth and nothing but the truth and that is a FACT!!! Atleast some answers are pooping out for batting first :S

Last edited by godzilla; January 8, 2010 at 03:41 PM..
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  #2  
Old January 8, 2010, 03:45 PM
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read it
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  #3  
Old January 8, 2010, 03:49 PM
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My fear is that this triangular tournament is a media sponsored televised contest. May be Shakib has to act in certain way so that we do not face humiliating defeat and the sponsors do not lose interest in the future.
However, it is true that we definitely showed some improvement in batting department; whether the improvement is good enough to beat (consistently) SL and India is a different question.
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  #4  
Old January 8, 2010, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by godzilla
"He said he chose to bat first not because he thought the dew wouldn't play a part later, but it was the fear of chasing 350 that India were capable of posting."
losing the game even before it started. What a shame. He could just bow down, kiss Dhoni on his boot and say, "my lord its all yours" and leave the field instead of wasting our time.
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  #5  
Old January 8, 2010, 04:16 PM
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I find this kind of mentality unacceptable from the captain or any players. On our day, we can beat anyone...be it India batting first.

Can't wait for Masri to return and take the leadership.
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  #6  
Old January 8, 2010, 04:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mahmood
I find this kind of mentality unacceptable from the captain or any players. On our day, we can beat anyone...be it India batting first.

Can't wait for Masri to return and take the leadership.
well, shakib is fearless and so are the rest of the boys.

i kind of disagree with you. in hindsight, yes shakib's decision was wrong, but the thinking behind it was, "india will score 350, and we can't chase 350". this is true.

but hey, progress is being made. remember 2004 India tour when we were all jumping because we crossed 200 in all three matches? see how far we've come?

before we can chase 350 against a G8 side, we first have to chase 275, then 300. and it think we are now capable of doing that. once we post 350 batting first, we can then have the confidence of chasing it down.

Siddons is working wonders with our boys, and I just hope we will be healthy for the next 13 months. we need Rasel and Mash (and Rubel too) to all be healthy for the next 13 months and thru the world cup.

i'm not worried about batting anymore, not on flat wickets anyways.
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  #7  
Old January 8, 2010, 04:30 PM
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If you can't even think of winning before the start of the play, please don't bother turning up.

I can't accept this type of mindset. I respect Dav Whatmore for his work on changing the mindset of Bangladeshi boys. Siddons is doing fine with the techniques, but he is not a motivator. I thought Chacha would solve the motivation problem, but I am really disappointed. Technique is at best 50% in any sports, the thirst to win constitutes the rest.
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Old January 8, 2010, 04:32 PM
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The short term goal is the 2011 WC. We must put up a good show at home and in order to do that we must get the basics right. Improvement will come in steps, not overnight and a real captain understands, acknowledges and doesn't hesitate to admit his team's weaknesses. Shakib did what he thought would help his team win - it might have been the wrong decision but he never "gave up before the game even started" like some of you are putting it.

You go Shakib!
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  #9  
Old January 8, 2010, 04:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AsifTheManRahman
Shakib did what he thought would help his team win - it might have been the wrong decision ...
Agreed, this happened when he won the toss. Now according to his words.. if India won the toss and opted to bat first, he would have lost the match immediately after toss.. just knowing that India would bat first and pile up runs. This mindset is not acceptable. He must change it if he wants to be successful. Period.
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Old January 8, 2010, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miraz
Agreed, this happened when he won the toss. Now according to his words.. if India won the toss and opted to bat first, he would have lost the match immediately after toss..
Oh please, give our cricketers some credit. You go out to toss the coin with a plan in mind and if the toss doesn't work out for you, surely you don't give up and start picnicking on the ground? Had India won the toss and batted, I'm sure our guys would have tried to do what it takes to win, but given that Shakib had a choice, he did what he thought was right.

Quote:
This mindset is not acceptable. He must change it if he wants to be successful. Period.
I don't think this mindset is as malicious as, say, playing for a respectable defeat or not surrounding a new batsman when the opponent is in trouble. The intention was to win and that's all that matters. Give him Mashrafe, Nazmul and an in-form Rasel and Razzak and he won't talk like this. Instead, the system has made sure that our bench is so depleted that we have to play with street cricketers and the kind of cricket that India has been playing, 350 isn't quite unexpected against our bowling. Previous captains, on the other hand, would say the same thing even when they had a strong bowling attack at their disposal.

The truth is, it will take us a while to match this Indian team's batting strength even on a semi-regular basis and if one can acknowledge that they will have to have a slightly off day for us to beat them (and of course we'll have to be at our best too - taking nothing away from our players), then I don't see why taking an alternate path to try to get there would imply a defeatist attitude.

He made the wrong decision, I'm sure he will learn from it, because he seems to be a smart player in general. Give him some time.
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Old January 8, 2010, 05:11 PM
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^^^

he threw His Bowlers under the Bus, had we bowled 1st the spinners would have had much more bite from the pitch + 51/3

India score 290-310
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Old January 8, 2010, 05:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cricman
^^^

he threw His Bowlers under the Bus, had we bowled 1st the spinners would have had much more bite from the pitch + 51/3

India score 290-310
I didn't say it wasn't a stupid decision. But the intention wasn't to lose or give up before the game had started, as many people are accusing him of. He genuinely thought we had a better chance of winning if we batted first, which was stupid but with the best of intentions.
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Old January 8, 2010, 05:34 PM
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ATMR, I am sure they would have tried if India batted first, but trying something without believing is very difficult to achieve.And that's my point. The public announcement of our captain doesn't bode well for our young team.
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  #14  
Old January 8, 2010, 05:46 PM
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Agree with Miraz. He didn't need to spell it out that he feared India's batting line up will pile up runs against our bowlers... That clearly shows that he didn't have confidence in the bowling line up. There lies the true leadership experience where you help the team dream big and believe inthemselves even if the odds are against you. Maybe its because its still a 20 year old leading a national team.I support Saqib for what he has done and does but he went with his emotions than science that day.. The dew was going to make it easy for the batsman and impossible for the bowlers..he just didn't want to believe in it and rather went with his gut to avoid humilations. Maybe he was thinking India will score 400 runs or something..

Also, he said today that Mashrafee's presence, as good of a player he was, wouldnt have changed the results for the team.. Say what??? Does he not know how many REAL wins we had with Mashrafee's bowling, batting and guidance? I didnt like his comment about the number one pacer of the country and the team captain. Certainly, it doesn't help Mashrafee to feel how important he is to his team. Perhaps, Sakib got that signal from Jamie who also said that Mashrafee is not that good of a player and doesn't know variations too well. Had it been that case, he wouldn't have been paid 200% more than Siddon's anual salary to play for Kolkata Knight Riders..
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Old January 8, 2010, 05:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dhakablues

Also, he said today that Mashrafee's presence, as good of a player he was, wouldnt have changed the results for the team.. Say what??? Does he not know how many REAL wins we had with Mashrafee's bowling, batting and guidance? I didnt like his comment about the number one pacer of the country and the team captain. Certainly, it doesn't help Mashrafee to feel how important he is to his team. Perhaps, Sakib got that signal from Jamie who also said that Mashrafee is not that good of a player and doesn't know variations too well. Had it been that case, he wouldn't have been paid 200% more than Siddon's anual salary to play for Kolkata Knight Riders..
He did not say that ... Link it

nevermind i found it

Quote:
“He (Mashrafe) is a very good leader but I don't think his presence would have made any difference in this kind of surface,” Shakib observed.
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Old January 8, 2010, 05:52 PM
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A question to forum members -> If BD had won (and i believe they fumbled on victory which was in their lap) and Shakib had made the same exact comment regarding why he chose to bat first, how many of you would not be praising the 'brilliant strategy'? Let the honest answers start with Miraz himself.
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Old January 8, 2010, 05:52 PM
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Quote from Sakib:"Mooo".

Look, its great that we have been consistently good in batting. scoring 250 3 times in a row is a great achievement. No denying it, and as captain he can be proud of that.

But India WILL score 350+ if they batted first? Really?!! I'd want to beat him up if I was a bowler like Razzak. Here was the perfect opportunity for the bowlers to shine and possibly restrict them to under 300, and Sakib just throws it away. If you can't grip the ball, and our strength is spin, how can you win bowling 2nd? And who knows if we end up with the same pace attack in the WC due to injury? Maybe Nazmul will will ahead of rubel, but that's it. Is Sakib gonna say we quit everytime we have to bat 2nd and the opponent scores 300+? He never looks after his bowlers and publicly says his pacers are bad. That's terrible!!
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Old January 8, 2010, 05:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ Sahastra
A question to forum members -> If BD had won (and i believe they fumbled on victory which was in their lap) and Shakib had made the same exact comment regarding why he chose to bat first, how many of you would not be praising the 'brilliant strategy'? Be honest.

We could have won had it not been for his biggest crime of the match..ultra-defensive field setting. At 51/3 and needing 6.3 rpo, they would have been under real pressure had they been forced to go over the top. Dhoni and co. looked very worried. (kudos to them for getting out of it.) But yes, I blame Sakib for that.

I for one, think they have the capability to chase 320-330.. and how does he know we wouldn't have got India all out under 270? You've gotta give your players the best chance, and he didn't.
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Old January 8, 2010, 06:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ Sahastra
A question to forum members -> If BD had won (and i believe they fumbled on victory which was in their lap) and Shakib had made the same exact comment regarding why he chose to bat first, how many of you would not be praising the 'brilliant strategy'? Let the honest answers start with Miraz himself.
He failed in his strategy which was not well though out. You must leave it like this. I don't think any leader gets applauded for failed strategies, doesn't matter how good it was.

Strategy may fail one day and succeed the other day. What irritated me is his public admission that he feared Indian batting line up and it was not possible for them to chase down whatever score India would have made.
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Old January 8, 2010, 06:19 PM
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Only progress I see is Shakib went from saying "We can win on a good day" to "We can score 250 on a flat track". Oh wait, I think the correct term is "regress".
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Old January 8, 2010, 06:51 PM
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Why are we so happy about putting up 250+ in 3 straight innings? Sure, the batting against India was pretty good, but I don't feel the same way about the other 2 matches against SL. 249 and 260 on this batting paradise is the same as scoring 190 on a normal pitch. Nothing to get excited about. While other teams are now crossing 300 regularly, we are going crazy for 250...
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Old January 8, 2010, 06:58 PM
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[QUOTE=Miraz;1036575]ATMR, I am sure they would have tried if India batted first, but trying something without believing is very difficult to achieve.And that's my point. The public announcement of our captain doesn't bode well for our young team.[/Q

Agrred, some of u r saying, wrong decision, will learn, but it is just common sense, use your condition best and go for win as we have good batting line up and India has weak bowling line up than Srilanka.do bat which is sensible. that is simple, why do you give people to talk about u, if u would bat later and lose we wouldnt talk about this.

anyway good luck for the next match with toss win and field
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Old January 8, 2010, 07:05 PM
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To be honest, these comments are being stated at the wrong time. Rather than being concerned after such a pathetic hammering in your own ground, we're hailing 'real progress'. The pitches were made for batting - scores of 249 and 260 were were pretty much under par on this pitch. 296 was probably par.

The batting order is a major cause for concern - guys like Imrul and Rakibul have so much to learn. I won't say anything about Imrul since he's been scoring fine, but Rakibul needs to go, with Aftab or Nafees as his replacement.
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Old January 8, 2010, 07:09 PM
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At present Bangladesh is much more capable of setting 300+ targets against good oppositions than chasing those sorts of scores down. Clearly the team thinktank decided that India would - relatively speaking - have a more difficult time chasing down a large score. He was simply articulating that. I wouldn't beat down too harshly on him or his personal attitude. No one who remembers how Shakib chased down SL's score last year and the manner is which he did to get us into the finals should doubt his "never-say-die" attitude.
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Old January 8, 2010, 07:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zobair
No one who remembers how Shakib chased down SL's score last year and the manner is which he did to get us into the finals should doubt his "never-say-die" attitude.
Which just goes to show how pathetic the fans are. One game, one comment and we start questioning the guy's attitude and his commitment. Shameful and very offensive.
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