US Healthcare bill passed

[Banglatiger84]

Ok, so Obama succeeded where Clinton failed, but at what cost?

I personally dont get the anti-healthcare side;

They claim to be against big govt, but is that really the reason? Or are they mostly people benefiting from the insurance industry?

And if they arent, what could drive millions of people to be so spiteful of their fellow countrymen who cant afford insurance?
The video of tea party members mocking a man with Parkinson's was particularly disturbing and I cant help feeling that quite a few anti-healthcare bill people have similar views wrt those unfortunate enough to fall ill ( so you fell sick, and cant afford healthcare, too bad you have to die, thats your problem)

Look forward to hearing your views

[GoldenAsif]

Way to go Barack!

Awesome.

[cricket_pagol]

This bill is far from being perfect, but it is a good start to build a fair healthcare system in US. This is a huge achievement on obama's part.

[GoldenAsif]

Obama will be remembered alongside Roosevelt and his New Deal, and perhaps alongside Kennedy, who in the past (more than the present) used to be eulogized by the media as representing the hope of his generation. (Though now the media are far more realistic about Kennedy).

He will not be remembered as just another president like Ford or Carter, but as a truly great president who made a fundamental change to American society and the lives of millions.

[BD-Shardul]

I do not care about anything regarding health care, I am just happy to see GOP got defeated . I cannot stand war lover GOPs.

[imtiaz82]

CNN Poll result

What is your reaction to the newly passed health care reform bill?

For it
43%
138643

Against it
40%
129593

Not sure
17%
53864

[AsifTheManRahman]

Aww, America gets universal health care. Baby steps. How cute.

[cricket_pagol]

Originally Posted by imtiaz82
CNN Poll result

What is your reaction to the newly passed health care reform bill?

For it
43%
138643

Against it
40%
129593

Not sure
17%
53864

The above is just an internet poll, so don't read into it too much.

There is another CNN poll where they survey 1000 adults before the house vote on Sunday.
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...B_m#more-95895

Here are some interesting bits.

59 percent of those surveyed opposed the bill, and 39 percent favored it

However...

The CNN poll also suggests that public opposition to health care will not necessarily be a boon to Republicans in the 2010 midterm elections in Congress.

Roughly one in five of respondents who said they opposed the bill did so because it was not liberal enough, and those people are unlikely to vote Republican. Take them out of the picture and opposition to the bill because it is too liberal is 43 percent.

and...

"The Democrats have another advantage - most Americans also trust Barack Obama more than the GOP on health care," said Keating Holland, CNN's polling director. "That gives the president an opportunity - and seven months - to make the affirmative case for the health care bill."

[Fazal]

If you hide the information who proposed, who voted for and who voted against, this highly compromized bill will confused as a Republican Healthcare Bill.

Yes Republican voted "No" on record, but they got what they wished for. Shaap o Morlo, lathee o Banglo na.

When this bill go wrong while implementing, when people will realized nothing really significantly changes, I am afraid Republican will have the last laugh. And we will see the Dem backlash in next year's mid term election.

When Dem lost to VA Govroner's election, thats was a clear signal. And when they lost to retain highly democratic State Kennedy's open seat, that showed the trend, which direction the tain is moving, and I am afraid its too late to change the direction before mid term election.

[Blah]

Originally Posted by Fazal
If you hide the information who proposed, who voted for and who voted against, this highly compromized bill will confused as a Republican Healthcare Bill.

Are you referring to the house of representative vote last night?

If so, its public knowledge who voted what.

As to who proposed what in the actual bill. It is also public record. If they add anything new to the bill it will also be on public record. Here is the bill with all the changes made so far since last year (large page).

[Fazal]

Originally Posted by Blah
Are you referring to the house of representative vote last night?

If so, its public knowledge who voted what.

As to who proposed what in the actual bill. It is also public record. If they add anything new to the bill it will also be on public record. Here is the bill with all the changes made so far since last year (large page).

I know its public info. That's why I said if you hide that information (theoretically speaking), then it would be hard to tell who's bill it really is... as its so much compromised to the point that Democrats passed a Republican Bill.

[Sohel]

Tax the people? Use some of the money to SERVE the people with care, period. Work on prevention, efficiency and fiscal responsibility and in the process, fight GOP misguidance and cynicism designed to protect the privileged elite who profit from the status quo and the misery of others.

Unnecessary deaths and bankruptcy due to treatable illness ought not be acceptable to ANY hardworking American taxpayer regardless of party affiliation. America can, must and WILL do better InshAllah!

Now we need to show results, build on this and surprise the GOP come November.

(C/P FaBo SU)

[Fazal]

Sure... Nai Mamar cheye Kana Mama Bhalo. But I am afraid the compromized Mama we got is "Aundo Mama". Some see glass half full, some see half empty. I see "half empty". To me its a missed opportunity BIG time.

There is reason why far left like Kucinich voted against the bill in last Novemer (even though he voted for this bill this time to salvage whatever left to claim victory).

Yes its a win in a way, but in a way a missed opportuinity for DEM to do something really great for the future.

[Hatebreed]

Congrats America. Finally you will, at least in some shape or form, get to enjoy one of the great things about western civilisation.

[Tokai]

It was a good first step, but I still think the whole infrastructure is wrong. The very basic thing that is wrong is insurance based health care. The only way to make it better is to shut down the whole insurance industry and have government operate hospitals.

[bujhee kom]

Amra jara gorib immigrant achi, amader dookkher deen finally shesh holo tahole...ki khooshi je lagtesese...

[Banglatiger84]

Could some of our US-based members clarify what could be the cause of this extreme hate shown by the anti-health bill side?
I can understand people hatred's in many cases, but why should universal health coverage bring out such rabid, fiery emotions?


Hurled bricks, threats surround health overhaul
(AP)

25 March 2010,
Unrest over sweeping federal health care legislation has turned to vandalism and threats, with bricks hurled through Democrats’ windows, a propane line cut at the home of a congressman’s brother and menacing phone messages left for lawmakers who supported the bill.
The FBI is investigating the instances, which include shattered windows at four Democratic offices in New York, Arizona and Kansas. At least 10 members of Congress have reported some sort of threat as of Wednesday, and no arrests have been made.
The brick flung through the window of a county Democratic Party office in Rochester, New York, over the weekend had a note attached: “Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice,” roughly quoting 1964 Republican presidential nominee Barry Goldwater.
A New York congresswoman whose office window also was smashed with a brick accused the Republican leadership of failing to denounce attacks against lawmakers who supported the legislation. The vandalism was at Democratic Rep. Louise Slaughter’s district office in Niagara Falls early Friday, two days before the House passed the health care overhaul bill.
“It’s more disturbing to me that Republican leadership has not condemned these attacks and instead appears to be fanning the flames with coded rhetoric,” said Slaughter, a key supporter of the bill.
House Republican leader John Boehner of Ohio said in a statement that while many Americans are angry over the bill’s passage, “violence and threats are unacceptable.”
“That’s not the American way,” Boehner said. “We need to take that anger and channel it into positive change.”
The FBI and Capitol Police were briefing Democratic lawmakers on how to handle perceived security threats, said House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer. Those who feel they are at risk will be “getting attention from the proper authorities,” Hoyer said, declining to say whether any are receiving extra security. Normally only those in leadership positions have personal security guards.
At a news conference in Washington, Hoyer said people have yelled that Democratic lawmakers should be put on firing lines and posters have appeared with the faces of lawmakers in the cross hairs of a target.
While not directly criticizing Republicans, Hoyer said that “any show of appreciation for such actions encourages such action.”
Gun imagery was used in a posting on the Facebook page of Sarah Palin urging people to organize against 20 House Democrats who voted for the health care bill and whose districts went for the John McCain-Palin ticket two years ago. Palin’s post featured a U.S. map with circles and cross hairs over the 20 districts.
Some of the anger over the bill spilled over in a flood of obscenity and threat-filled phone and fax messages to the office of Rep. Bart Stupak. His office released some of the messages it has received since the health care bill passed, declining to add further comment.
“I hope you bleed ... (get) cancer and die,” one male caller told the congressman between curses.
A fax with the title “Defecating on Stupak” carried a picture of a gallows with “Bart (SS) Stupak” on it and a noose attached. It was captioned, “All Baby Killers come to unseemly ends Either by the hand of man or by the hand of God.”
The vandalism and threats surprised a researcher at a think tank that monitors extremist groups.
“I think it is astounding that we are seeing this wave of vigilantism,” said Mark Potok of the Alabama-based Southern Poverty Law Center.
In Virginia, someone cut a propane line leading to a grill at the Charlottesville home of U.S. Rep. Tom Perriello’s brother after the address was posted online by activists angry about the health care overhaul. Perriello also said a threatening letter was sent to his brother’s house. The FBI and local authorities were investigating.
Tea party activists had posted the brother’s address online thinking it was the congressman’s home. The post urged opponents to drop by and “express their thanks” for the Democrat’s vote in favor of the sweeping health care reform.
Nigel Coleman, chairman of the Danville Tea Party, said he re-posted the comment that originated on another conservative blog, including the address, Monday on his Facebook page. The posts were taken down after the mistake was discovered.
“We’ve never been associated with any violence or any vandalism,” he said. “We’re definitely sorry that we posted the incorrect address.”
Virginia Attorney General Ken Cuccinelli, who has filed a lawsuit challenging the health care overhaul and is a favorite of the Tea Party, said for activists to post an address of Perriello’s family shows that things are going too far.
“That is way over the line,” he said. “It’s not civil discourse, it’s an invitation to intimidation and it’s totally unacceptable.”
Potok compared the online posting of a public official’s address to tactics used by hate groups.
“This is what neo Nazi leaders in America do today,” Potok said. “They post personal information about their enemies and sit back and wait for somebody else to act.”
Lyndsay Stauble, executive director of the Sedgwick County Democratic Party in Wichita, Kan., said a brick was hurled through the party’s storefront plate glass window late Friday or early Saturday, landing in her office and gouging her wooden desk.
She said that written in marker on the brick were the slogans, “No to Obama” and “No Obomycare.”
“The tone is not surprising, but the aggressiveness is,” Stauble said Wednesday. “I’m not shocked that people are not reacting well to a large piece of legislation passed by a president that they don’t like.”
In Tucson, Arizona, someone either kicked in or shot out a glass door and a side window at the congressional office of Rep. Gabrielle Giffords early Monday, a few hours after the House health care vote. Giffords voted for the bill.
Giffords’ press secretary C.J. Karamargin in Tucson said the vandalism left the local congressional staff shaken and worried.

[Equinox]

Originally Posted by AsifTheManRahman
Aww, America gets universal health care. Baby steps. How cute.

Exactly. I don't see what there is to celebrate here. Why did it take so long? Why is the country still not united over this?

[Tigers_eye]

Originally Posted by Equinox

Exactly. I don't see what there is to celebrate here. Why did it take so long? Why is the country still not united over this?

Special interest groups and insurance industry, who channels money to all senete/congress races to both parties were the reason. Still the heath care needs more reforms.

[Zunaid]

Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
Could some of our US-based members clarify what could be the cause of this extreme hate shown by the anti-health bill side?
I can understand people hatred's in many cases, but why should universal health coverage bring out such rabid, fiery emotions?
.... snipped ...

Here is a view -

Why the Hate? Extreme Reactions to Obama’s Healthcare Proposal

http://www.thedefendersonline.com/20...care-proposal/

[imtiaz82]

I am not too surprised at the reaction... First of all, hardly anyone understands the "Healthcare Bill"--- the main benefits, implementation time period, the COST. Forget the general public, even analysts from Republican or Democratic party can speak to the details of the plan. This ambiguity was used by lot of the groups to spin negative propaganda. Secondly, the TIMING of the bill. This issue about "universal healthcare" has been there for few decades now, but a plan to fix it by pouring in billions of tax payer money when the country is in the worst recession in living memory was not prudent. Unemployment rate is around 10%, jobs are being cut and the budget deficit has grown exponentially. At this moment, the focus should be to fix the economy and create jobs. So many who agrees with the principal of "universal healthcare" still voted against it, since they feel that government subsidy and involvement will just inflate the already ballooning deficit.Finally, US business and social system has always emphasized on the growth of the private sector and minimum involvement of government (unlike some European countries and Canada). So many doubt in the efficiency of governemnt run medicare and healthcare plan. United States Postal service, Social security system and other government run programs hasn't been too successful.

[Blah]

Originally Posted by imtiaz82
I am not too surprised at the reaction... First of all, hardly anyone understands the "Healthcare Bill"--- the main benefits, implementation time period, the COST. Forget the general public, even analysts from Republican or Democratic party can speak to the details of the plan. This ambiguity was used by lot of the groups to spin negative propaganda. Secondly, the TIMING of the bill. This issue about "universal healthcare" has been there for few decades now, but a plan to fix it by pouring in billions of tax payer money when the country is in the worst recession in living memory was not prudent. Unemployment rate is around 10%, jobs are being cut and the budget deficit has grown exponentially. At this moment, the focus should be to fix the economy and create jobs. So many who agrees with the principal of "universal healthcare" still voted against it, since they feel that government subsidy and involvement will just inflate the already ballooning deficit.Finally, US business and social system has always emphasized on the growth of the private sector and minimum involvement of government (unlike some European countries and Canada). So many doubt in the efficiency of governemnt run medicare and healthcare plan. United States Postal service, Social security system and other government run programs hasn't been too successful.

Stop reading Fox News and Wall Street Journal and you might understand the benefit of Health Care bill. Somethings to think about:

- USA is the only developed nation without a universal health care. (before the bill was passed). Still remains the only developed country where the government doesn't provide a health care option (medicaid is only available for limited age group).

- As far as efficiency is concerned, while Medicaid is not 100% efficient but its cost overhead is more efficient than any large private option available.

- Health bill cost ~1 trillion over 10 years (~100 billion a year). Iraq & Afghan war cost ~1 trillion over 8 year. The idea that ~1 trillion dollars were spent to kill more than 1 million people in another country in more acceptable than spending ~1 trillion dollars over the next 10 years to save people in your own country, is simply quite mind boggling.

- Health care bill is paid for. Meaning government is NOT adding a single dime to deficit. People who makes more than ~200,000 will be taxed (a small minority) more to pay for the cost of the bill. This same group of people received massive tax cuts during bush administration which contributed in higher deficit. Initially the government will spend some money from its pocket, but it will be covered by the taxes in later years. So cost is zero. Let me repeat, cost is ZERO. Adds nothing to the deficit.

- I am surprised when people talk about reducing the deficit at the same time criticize the health care bill. You can't reduce the deficit without fixing the current insurance system. The way current system works (prior to the HCB), people without health insurance has no option but to wait till they are in their deathbed to get healthcare. By law hospitals will have to take patients when they are at the fag end of their health issues. Since they can't afford a health care, or even if they can afford a health care the insurance company can refuse to provide insurance to them for absolutely no reason at all; the government ends up paying the bill. And where does government get that money? From the tax payers. Preventative health care cost less than health care when you are dying. Government don't get enough money from tax to help pay bill of people in their death bed, it needs to borrow money to pay that bill, thus increasing its deficit. Current health care bill prevent that and will actually help cut deficit in the long term.

It is true that eventually health care cost will catch up to the money raised from tax (projection is 10-12 years), but it also makes the assumption that US economy will stay the same in the next 10-12 years.

So why does the right political spectrum and the Libertarians (as if there is a difference in USA) have foams in their mouth when they talk about healthcare bill?

Simply put, insurance industry is one of the most profitable (at the cost of people's health and wealth) and powerful industry in the United States. It is worth $2 trillion dollars, or 1/6th of US economy. They are also a powerful force in politics exceeding almost all forms of donations made by any private organizations to political parties (in both sides). As we have seen in the recent past, candidates who raise the most money wins the election. By passing the healthcare bill you will be pissing off your biggest donors.

The only people who loses from this bill are the private insurance company. They will still make money, as the bill makes it mandatory for everyone to get insurance from private companies, but no where close to what it would have been if things where the same.

The health care bill has been discussed and argued and analyzed to its very end. If anyone is "confused" by the bill its not because the bill is confusing, but because they didn't care enough to investigate on their own but resorts to sound bites from cable news and partisan sources.

If you need any source for the information I provided let me know I will be glad to get them for you. While I might have some of my numbers wrong (I am writing from memory), the gist of the healthcare saga is pretty much it.

[Orpheus]

Originally Posted by Blah


It is true that eventually health care cost will catch up to the money raised from tax (projection is 10-12 years), but it also makes the assumption that US economy will stay the same in the next 10-12 years.

yes it will get worse. Negative growth is coming

[Orpheus]

Blah will finally get his health insurance from the government. He has so happy....

[Blah]

Originally Posted by Orpheus
Blah will finally get his health insurance from the government. He has so happy....

Actually I belong to the tax bracket who got their tax raised. Not complaining.

Also, the government is NOT providing health insurance. Public option has been removed from the bill that was passed. Its still all private insurance company, just with better regulation.