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  #1  
Old January 24, 2011, 02:05 PM
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Default Even if Mash wasn't injured he still shouldn't have been picked for 15 man world cup Squad an this is why:

Here is Mashrafee's stats in ODIS for the last two years compared with his stats from his debut in ODI's:
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/eng...;type=allround

Mashrafee has a bowling average of 44.54 and has a highest score in batting of 22 in the last two years in ODIs. Shafiul has a bowling average of 31.56, Rubel has a bowling average of 36.72, Nazmul has a bowling average of 33.36, Shahadat has a bowling average of 43.42, Syed Rasel has a bowling average of 33.62. Same with ashraful, he has been 'out of form' for the last couple of years (although everyone already knows that)
What I am saying is that to not judge players on their past performance, but on their present performance.
I just don't understand why there is violence in bangladesh because of the exclusion of him from the 15 man squad.

My first thread! Didn't know how to create a new thread since last year but finally found the button.

May BD do well in the world cup
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  #2  
Old January 24, 2011, 02:10 PM
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  #3  
Old January 24, 2011, 02:11 PM
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Also mash is still recovering from injury so its good he wasn't included in 15 man squad. The people who are causing violence because he isn't going to play in the world cup are stupid. He is simply not fit.
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  #4  
Old January 24, 2011, 02:18 PM
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Crap!!

Look what his average is against the Indian and England from your link. That's all matters to me. Compare that with other bowlers, you will get your answer.

He was injured for most part of 2009 and 2010. Shakib also didn't give him much chance to bowl longer in his comeback games. 2/3 overs in the first spell and then in some matches didn't get the ball again.
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  #5  
Old January 24, 2011, 02:25 PM
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The reason behind this is because we have stopped playing the likes of kenys etc... Like in 2006, mash's 49 wickets came mainly from associate wickets.
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  #6  
Old January 24, 2011, 02:54 PM
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^^
That's the case for all the bowlers.
Shakib averages 36 and Razzak 40 against top 8 teams.
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  #7  
Old January 24, 2011, 03:27 PM
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Honestly whats the heck's gotten into the poeple round here?????

Let me paint you guys a picture. So, opening match against India. Bangladesh bat first and set a target for india. Even in the most optimistic scenario lets say Shafiul-Rubel bowl exceptionally well during the bowling pp and keep the RR to a reasonable figure. Maybe take a wicket a two. Hopefully the spinners will perform upto their standards as always and take wickets on a regular interval. The match is looking good for us, in fact it's looking very winnable at this stage. yaaaaaaaaaay ki moja ki moja! we're gonna beat Indian wooooooohoooo India need to make 18 runs in the last over with 1 wicket remaining. Enter Shakib's brilliant mind. Captaincy at it's best this is. He gets Shafiul or Rubel to bowl last over. Yousuf pathan hits 3 sixes in the first 3 balls. We lose match..sad worldcup!

My point being Mashrafe would've been our saviour in the death overs with his experience. And please dont take this as a Shafiul-Rubel bash, I am confident both will give their 112% when they play. but lets face it given their history, they will leak runs like crazy particularly during the latter part of the innings. I know they both won us matches against England and Newzealand respectivly but I think they're both still rookies dealing with death overs to be honest and nerves will get the better of them. I PRAY that I am WRONG!!!!
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  #8  
Old January 24, 2011, 03:46 PM
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I disagree! A fully fit Mashrafee is an automatic selection to our National Team. There is just simply no alternative to Mashrafee, period! I am a big Mashrafee fan but with his current injury situation I think the selectors made the right choice not include him. But again if he was fit to play there is no question in my mind that should have been included in our 15 man squad easily. Again that's my opinion.
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  #9  
Old January 24, 2011, 04:01 PM
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Dude ... Even a fully fit Mashrafe is a horrible death bowler!! It's his first spell that we will miss ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiger-ess
Honestly whats the heck's gotten into the poeple round here?????

Let me paint you guys a picture. So, opening match against India. Bangladesh bat first and set a target for india. Even in the most optimistic scenario lets say Shafiul-Rubel bowl exceptionally well during the bowling pp and keep the RR to a reasonable figure. Maybe take a wicket a two. Hopefully the spinners will perform upto their standards as always and take wickets on a regular interval. The match is looking good for us, in fact it's looking very winnable at this stage. yaaaaaaaaaay ki moja ki moja! we're gonna beat Indian wooooooohoooo India need to make 18 runs in the last over with 1 wicket remaining. Enter Shakib's brilliant mind. Captaincy at it's best this is. He gets Shafiul or Rubel to bowl last over. Yousuf pathan hits 3 sixes in the first 3 balls. We lose match..sad worldcup!

My point being Mashrafe would've been our saviour in the death overs with his experience. And please dont take this as a Shafiul-Rubel bash, I am confident both will give their 112% when they play. but lets face it given their history, they will leak runs like crazy particularly during the latter part of the innings. I know they both won us matches against England and Newzealand respectivly but I think they're both still rookies dealing with death overs to be honest and nerves will get the better of them. I PRAY that I am WRONG!!!!

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  #10  
Old January 24, 2011, 04:10 PM
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Tiger-ess apu KKR er ghotonota bhule geso?
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  #11  
Old January 24, 2011, 04:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiger-ess
Honestly whats the heck's gotten into the poeple round here?????

Let me paint you guys a picture. So, opening match against India. Bangladesh bat first and set a target for india. Even in the most optimistic scenario lets say Shafiul-Rubel bowl exceptionally well during the bowling pp and keep the RR to a reasonable figure. Maybe take a wicket a two. Hopefully the spinners will perform upto their standards as always and take wickets on a regular interval. The match is looking good for us, in fact it's looking very winnable at this stage. yaaaaaaaaaay ki moja ki moja! we're gonna beat Indian wooooooohoooo India need to make 18 runs in the last over with 1 wicket remaining. Enter Shakib's brilliant mind. Captaincy at it's best this is. He gets Shafiul or Rubel to bowl last over. Yousuf pathan hits 3 sixes in the first 3 balls. We lose match..sad worldcup!
My point being Mashrafe would've been our saviour in the death overs with his experience. And please dont take this as a Shafiul-Rubel bash, I am confident both will give their 112% when they play. but lets face it given their history, they will leak runs like crazy particularly during the latter part of the innings. I know they both won us matches against England and Newzealand respectivly but I think they're both still rookies dealing with death overs to be honest and nerves will get the better of them. I PRAY that I am WRONG!!!!
Perfect example of fantasy. Even mash will not agree.

Dude, you have probably never watched BD death over bowling, and specialy Mash ..... If he is the captain, he will give the ball to shafiul. He clearly avoids last overs. I don't like to bring in examples......... Watch some old VDOs.

Well, i'm not sure about his exclusion if he was 100% fit. He is a good new ball bowler. Ideally, Shafiul and Rubel would take about an year to take the complete responsibility confidently. But there is no option at the moment for them, they have to rise up and take responsibility. They are both better quality bowler than even fit Mash, but they lack experience, and thats vital at that level.
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  #12  
Old January 24, 2011, 04:23 PM
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Only KKR!!! What about Taylor and Zimbabwe??? Because of Mash we lost the only series against Zimbabwe in the last 5 years!

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  #13  
Old January 24, 2011, 04:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bd fan
Here is Mashrafee's stats in ODIS for the last two years compared with his stats from his debut in ODI's:
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/eng...;type=allround

Mashrafee has a bowling average of 44.54 and has a highest score in batting of 22 in the last two years in ODIs. Shafiul has a bowling average of 31.56, Rubel has a bowling average of 36.72, Nazmul has a bowling average of 33.36, Shahadat has a bowling average of 43.42, Syed Rasel has a bowling average of 33.62. Same with ashraful, he has been 'out of form' for the last couple of years (although everyone already knows that)
What I am saying is that to not judge players on their past performance, but on their present performance.
I just don't understand why there is violence in bangladesh because of the exclusion of him from the 15 man squad.

My first thread! Didn't know how to create a new thread since last year but finally found the button.

May BD do well in the world cup
In the ODI, RR is as (in fact, more) important as the average. What are the RR of these bowlers? Both career averages and last couple of years' averages...
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  #14  
Old January 24, 2011, 04:45 PM
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Haha this is sooo Bull ,
First of all To everyone who thinks Mash is a crap bowler in death overs, please go watch the highlights of "Bangladesh vs England" second ODI, and loot at the last 10 over bowling...... Than u will shut up for good.
The idea that Shafiul and Rubel are better bowler than Mash is a stupid thread to start with.......
Plus when Mash bowls, he doesn't need to bowl in death overs because he does his job in his first spell.
Look at Shakib, Razzaq,,,,, they both suck at death overs as well, but it covers up for their tight bowling earlier.

Stats doesn't necessarily represent players, if that was the case, ash would have been out right now

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  #15  
Old January 24, 2011, 05:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rinathq
Haha this is sooo Bull ,
First of all To everyone who thinks Mash is a crap bowler in death overs, please go watch the highlights of "Bangladesh vs England" second ODI, and loot at the last 10 over bowling...... Than u will shut up for good.
Which year / which series? Did we win that? Was it first innings or 2nd innings? Opponents only needs to hit him for as much runs necessary to win. There is probably no example that Mash has defended the target in last over.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rinathq
The idea that Shafiul and Rubel are better bowler than Mash is a stupid thread to start with.......
Plus when Mash bowls, he doesn't need to bowl in death overs because he does his job in his first spell.
Look at Shakib, Razzaq,,,,, they both suck at death overs as well, but it covers up for their tight bowling earlier.
Shafiul and rubel are definitely better quality bowlers, give them some time to gather experience, u will see. And that high lighted par is really "Bull' haha.

Shakib and Razzaq basically shouldnt be bowling at the death, if we had pacers to do that. yet they have taken the responsibility and done much better. specially after Zim and then KKR, Mash hardly has ever bowled last overds. His escaping attitude at those situations were visible

Quote:
Originally Posted by rinathq
Stats doesn't necessarily represent players, if that was the case, ash would have been out right now

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Depends on whom you are comparing with Ash and which performance you are talking about. By the way, how does Ash get into this discussion? And which stat of mash you are trying to justify by bringing in Ash here?

My friend team is above individuals. who ever it is, Mash or Ash. Ash isn't injured, Mash is.
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  #16  
Old January 24, 2011, 05:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shehwar
Only KKR!!! What about Taylor and Zimbabwe??? Because of Mash we lost the only series against Zimbabwe in the last 5 years!

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Same can be said about other bowlers too.
Rubel just a few days before conceded over 80 runs just from 8 overs against CCS in the Premier League.

Shaiful conceded over 95 runs twice last year. Against England and Pakistan. In the same game against England, Mash conceded only 31 took 3 wickets.

I know Mash sucked in death bowling quite a few times but still theres no comparison between him and other bowlers. He also bowled well in some game too.
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  #17  
Old January 24, 2011, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BANFAN
Which year / which series? Did we win that? Was it first innings or 2nd innings? Opponents only needs to hit him for as much runs necessary to win. There is probably no example that Mash has defended the target in last over.
He is talking about the game against England that we won. July last year.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/england-...iew=commentary
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  #18  
Old January 24, 2011, 05:32 PM
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I don't know if anyone noticed this but in the last two years, there have been two bipolar versions of Mashrafe. One which has been extremely raw and just terrible (not even U-19 esque) and one which has been arguably the worlds best new ball bowler (ODI) He shows these two sides in most series usually starting off bad and progressing beautifully. This happened in both the ENG and NZ series. Mashrafe was just blowing everybody away earlier last year against Sri Lanka and India. Mashrafe is not gone. Trust me. The latter version of Mashrafe is here and if he still gets a go, he is still our best fast bowler, no doubt.
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  #19  
Old January 24, 2011, 06:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Murad
He is talking about the game against England that we won. July last year.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/england-...iew=commentary
Thanks a lot.

@ rinathq 5oth over:
Quote:
Shafiul to bowl the final over, Trott on strike. England need 10 runs, Bangladesh need just one wicket for a historic victory. Man at deep midwicket, deep square leg, long on
Although Mash played well, but if Mash was bowling this over, he wouldnt have defended 10 runs, guaranteed. That was his weakness despite being a good new ball nowler and generally eonomical. if he was regularly bowling these last overs, his economy could be destroyed quiet a bit, Yet A fit Mash could be a good combination with Shafiul & Rubel.

It needs guts & skills of controlling the ball, to bowl the last over and defending the target. That's a natural ability, and Shafiul is distinctly ahead of Mash in that. on the other hand It's a matter of skill and experience to be able to ball the bew ball. That comes with time if a player has skills of controlling the ball. Which Shahadat didnt have, but Shafiul and Rubel has. That's why these two have the potential to be better bowlers than Mash. But as I said, A fit Mash is still desireable in the team, until Shafiul/Rubel gets that new ball bowling right with some experience. It's relatively easy.
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Last edited by BANFAN; January 24, 2011 at 06:13 PM..
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  #20  
Old January 24, 2011, 06:20 PM
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^^ IMO, BANFAN said it very well
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  #21  
Old January 24, 2011, 07:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BANFAN
Thanks a lot.

@ rinathq 5oth over:


Although Mash played well, but if Mash was bowling this over, he wouldnt have defended 10 runs, guaranteed. That was his weakness despite being a good new ball nowler and generally eonomical. if he was regularly bowling these last overs, his economy could be destroyed quiet a bit, Yet A fit Mash could be a good combination with Shafiul & Rubel.

It needs guts & skills of controlling the ball, to bowl the last over and defending the target. That's a natural ability, and Shafiul is distinctly ahead of Mash in that. on the other hand It's a matter of skill and experience to be able to ball the bew ball. That comes with time if a player has skills of controlling the ball. Which Shahadat didnt have, but Shafiul and Rubel has. That's why these two have the potential to be better bowlers than Mash. But as I said, A fit Mash is still desireable in the team, until Shafiul/Rubel gets that new ball bowling right with some experience. It's relatively easy.
Are u actually saying Shafiul has more guts than Mashrafee Bin Mortaza? and SHafiul has more skills than Mashrafee?
WOW
there is so much wrong with that comment i wont even bother. Clearly guts and skills have a different meaning to you.

"have the potential" yea well guess what? if i start playing from today hardcore in my league, i "have the potential" to be in Canada's national team in 2 years! which is not same as "i am the national bowler of Canada"
Shafiul is one of my fav bowlers..... u can check in my player list. However, he is not nearly close to where Mashrafee is. Face the reality. Mash have beaten worlds top batsmen where Shafi is improving! Until than, Mash continues to be the best pacer Bangladesh have ever produced and will stay like one for next 2-3 years unless, Shafi improves on a bullet speed.

Mash has the talent...... suggesting Shafiul and Rubel has more talent is foolish.

And guess what? Rubel and Shafiul are soo effective, they cannot defend a target on 295 in home ground. I dont remember Mash being in a position like that........ unless u can find one
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  #22  
Old January 24, 2011, 07:54 PM
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Mash is the worst death bowler I've ever seen. But I'm missing his death slog batting particularly.

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  #23  
Old January 24, 2011, 07:59 PM
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As far as death bowling goes ... there is no doubt Shafiul is far better than Mash ... Mash consistently has brain freeze when bowling at the death specially while defending a target. It has been proven time and again ... Hence he is usually not given that job anymore ... But yeah his first spell is pure quality when at his peak ...
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  #24  
Old January 24, 2011, 08:01 PM
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Welcome Mr "bd fan" as you posted your first thread.

But !!!!!!!!!....How come you think fit Mashrafi out of team!!!...either you dont know Mashrafi or you dont know Bangladesh Team.
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  #25  
Old January 24, 2011, 08:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Murad
Same can be said about other bowlers too.
Rubel just a few days before conceded over 80 runs just from 8 overs against CCS in the Premier League.

Shaiful conceded over 95 runs twice last year. Against England and Pakistan. In the same game against England, Mash conceded only 31 took 3 wickets.

I know Mash sucked in death bowling quite a few times but still theres no comparison between him and other bowlers. He also bowled well in some game too.
You know when Afridi has a go, he can make world's best bowler the worst. So That doesn't mean Shafiul is a poor bowler. He is improving day by day. Still Mash is our first choice bowler if fully fit and get match practice. We all know his poor bowling against Zim in first 2 matches. So not picking a struggling Mash is a good move.

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