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  #1  
Old April 26, 2012, 11:08 AM
Koranist Koranist is offline
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Default Collapse of Sunni/Shia and rise of the Koranist

With the collapse of Ja'far Al Sadiq's empire in Iran and Ibn Hanbal's slow demise in Saudi Arabia, the tide is turning and the fictitous sects that emerged during the Abbasid Empire knows as the Sunni and Shia sects and others who follow man made revelations known as hadiths are slowly collapsing. Malik's Empire in Sudan is collapsing and Abu Hanifa's Empire in Pakistan is turning upside down. The so called Islamic states have proven to be ideologically obsolete and in the wrong side of history. The sects are on life support and the Koranist will take over. So who are the Koranist?

The Koranist believe only the Koran should speak for Islam.

WHAT IS DIFFERENCE BETWEEN ISLAM AND TODAY'S PRACTICES?


In comparing the teachings of Islam as derived from the Book of God to the practices taught and enforced by the popular Sunni and Shia faiths (1.2 Bn followers), we find that the list is quite extensive, with some of the highlights as follows:

In Islam, the requirement to be a Muslim is to simply accept and live according to the �Straight Path� (6:151-153), Vs. the Sunni or Shia 5-pillars which come from unauthorized books�

In Islam, abolishing Slavery is taught to be an act of righteousness (90:12-13), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings which encourages slavery under war�

In Islam, women are never forbidden from praying or fasting during Menstruation (2:222), nor is there a specific dress code (i.e. the Headscarf) imposed on them beyond modesty, Vs. the Sunni and Shia which teach the undermining of women and forcing them to cover their hair and avoid praying or fasting at certain times...

In Islam, a man or women may leave a Will, after settlement of debt (4:12), Vs. Sunnis who refuse to accept wills if there are any direct descendants...

In Islam, Monogamy is the basis for normal relationships, while polygamy is only allowed in cases involving marrying the mothers of orphans under the man�s guardianship (4:3), Vs. Sunnis where a man may be a polygamist simply if he can afford to, and Shia which allow sex for pleasure (Mut�a)...

In Islam, Divorce is enforceable only after a two-phase period, and it may be made nullified if the couple reconcile before the end of this period (65:1, 65:4), Vs. Sunni teachings that destroy families by allowing a divorce to occur on the spot with no waiting period and no nullification...

In Islam, Thieves do not have their hands cut-off, but are made to work until they return that which is stolen (12:76), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings which brutally amputate the hands causing disability...

In Islam, no one is allowed to be killed or Stoned for adultery (24:2), Vs. Sunni and Shia laws of stoning married adulterers to death...

In Islam, absolute Freedom of Faith is allowed (2:256, 10:99; 18:29; 88:21-22), Vs. Sunni and Shia requiring apostates to be killed and rejecting the practice of other faiths...

In Islam, people are acknowledged as being diverse and each is to be respected for his/her level of spiritual growth. A Submitter �Muslim� must work to attain the status of Faithful �Mumin� (49:14), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings that all followers of their religion must think, act, and even look the same (cult syndrome)...

In Islam, War can only be declared in cases of self-defence - no offensives (2:190), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings allowing raids and attacks on any people who are considered non-Muslim by their standards...

In Islam, Pilgrimage is a centre for gathering of nations and for all to witness the benefits of being together (22:27-2 , Vs. Sunni and Shia bringing in polytheistic rituals and superstition (touching of black stone, circling 7 times, etc..)...

In Islam, a Year is a luni-solar count made of 365-days (17:12, 9:36), with all the seasons fitting-in-place Vs. Sunnis teaching it to be a lunar one based on 354 days which creates confusion of seasons and time�

In Islam, males and females are not required to be Circumcised (32:7), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings requiring all males to be circumcised and females in some cases...

In Islam, music, statues, gold and silk are all Lawful(7:32-33, 16:116), Vs. Sunni beliefs forbidding silk & gold for men, and forbidding music & statues for all...

In Islam, rule of Government is under the constitution of the Qur'an through consultation and free-speech (5:48, 42:3 . Vs. Sunni teachings which allow the rise of dictators or monarchs, and Shia teachings which uphold self-appointed religious leaders based on genealogy.

Koran is peace!
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  #2  
Old April 26, 2012, 01:29 PM
zsayeed zsayeed is offline
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Wonderful! The Qur'an is the Source. The Source that teaches Ahadiya Cannot create Disparity nor Parity - for that you need Two - which is a Contradiction.
Disparity can only come from Sources that are Disparate. Which in Bengali we call "দ্বন্দ" which comes the root দ্বি - two! It is impossible to have duality from Oneness of which Qur'an is the Source.
"When you are One - who is it that you can Love? Who is it that you can Hate?"

(Please upload the images to your own page, the images went missing - they are in your cache so you can't tell they are missing)

Tell me more.
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  #3  
Old April 26, 2012, 01:51 PM
09hotmail 09hotmail is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Koranist
With the collapse of Ja'far Al Sadiq's empire in Iran and Ibn Hanbal's slow demise in Saudi Arabia, the tide is turning and the fictitous sects that emerged during the Abbasid Empire knows as the Sunni and Shia sects and others who follow man made revelations known as hadiths are slowly collapsing. Malik's Empire in Sudan is collapsing and Abu Hanifa's Empire in Pakistan is turning upside down. The so called Islamic states have proven to be ideologically obsolete and in the wrong side of history. The sects are on life support and the Koranist will take over. So who are the Koranist?

The Koranist believe only the Koran should speak for Islam.

WHAT IS DIFFERENCE BETWEEN ISLAM AND TODAY'S PRACTICES?


In comparing the teachings of Islam as derived from the Book of God to the practices taught and enforced by the popular Sunni and Shia faiths (1.2 Bn followers), we find that the list is quite extensive, with some of the highlights as follows:

In Islam, the requirement to be a Muslim is to simply accept and live according to the �Straight Path� (6:151-153), Vs. the Sunni or Shia 5-pillars which come from unauthorized books�

In Islam, abolishing Slavery is taught to be an act of righteousness (90:12-13), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings which encourages slavery under war�

In Islam, women are never forbidden from praying or fasting during Menstruation (2:222), nor is there a specific dress code (i.e. the Headscarf) imposed on them beyond modesty, Vs. the Sunni and Shia which teach the undermining of women and forcing them to cover their hair and avoid praying or fasting at certain times...

In Islam, a man or women may leave a Will, after settlement of debt (4:12), Vs. Sunnis who refuse to accept wills if there are any direct descendants...

In Islam, Monogamy is the basis for normal relationships, while polygamy is only allowed in cases involving marrying the mothers of orphans under the man�s guardianship (4:3), Vs. Sunnis where a man may be a polygamist simply if he can afford to, and Shia which allow sex for pleasure (Mut�a)...

In Islam, Divorce is enforceable only after a two-phase period, and it may be made nullified if the couple reconcile before the end of this period (65:1, 65:4), Vs. Sunni teachings that destroy families by allowing a divorce to occur on the spot with no waiting period and no nullification...

In Islam, Thieves do not have their hands cut-off, but are made to work until they return that which is stolen (12:76), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings which brutally amputate the hands causing disability...

In Islam, no one is allowed to be killed or Stoned for adultery (24:2), Vs. Sunni and Shia laws of stoning married adulterers to death...

In Islam, absolute Freedom of Faith is allowed (2:256, 10:99; 18:29; 88:21-22), Vs. Sunni and Shia requiring apostates to be killed and rejecting the practice of other faiths...

In Islam, people are acknowledged as being diverse and each is to be respected for his/her level of spiritual growth. A Submitter �Muslim� must work to attain the status of Faithful �Mumin� (49:14), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings that all followers of their religion must think, act, and even look the same (cult syndrome)...

In Islam, War can only be declared in cases of self-defence - no offensives (2:190), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings allowing raids and attacks on any people who are considered non-Muslim by their standards...

In Islam, Pilgrimage is a centre for gathering of nations and for all to witness the benefits of being together (22:27-2 , Vs. Sunni and Shia bringing in polytheistic rituals and superstition (touching of black stone, circling 7 times, etc..)...

In Islam, a Year is a luni-solar count made of 365-days (17:12, 9:36), with all the seasons fitting-in-place Vs. Sunnis teaching it to be a lunar one based on 354 days which creates confusion of seasons and time�

In Islam, males and females are not required to be Circumcised (32:7), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings requiring all males to be circumcised and females in some cases...

In Islam, music, statues, gold and silk are all Lawful(7:32-33, 16:116), Vs. Sunni beliefs forbidding silk & gold for men, and forbidding music & statues for all...

In Islam, rule of Government is under the constitution of the Qur'an through consultation and free-speech (5:48, 42:3 . Vs. Sunni teachings which allow the rise of dictators or monarchs, and Shia teachings which uphold self-appointed religious leaders based on genealogy.

Koran is peace!
You cannot quote verse out of context. You have to know the whole context and understand it. Also,TRUE Hazrat MD. followers are Sunni, so all your talk about Koranist and downing Sunni is False.

Also this is insulting and anyone who mocks or claps at the Koran will go to hell after they die.This is truth and you cannot prove it false. So be careful what you write and this can be mis interpreted.
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  #4  
Old April 26, 2012, 01:53 PM
zsayeed zsayeed is offline
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When did he claim the falsehood of which you speak of hotmail?
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  #5  
Old April 26, 2012, 02:00 PM
09hotmail 09hotmail is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zsayeed
When did he claim the falsehood of which you speak of hotmail?
Sunni and Shia sects and others who follow man made revelations known as hadiths are slowly collapsing.

How do you know how to pray like sijda, ruku if you do not know hadis ????
Maybe he also thinks all prophet stories is false and example shab e miraj is false and man made ???
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  #6  
Old April 26, 2012, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 09hotmail
. ..............

How do you know how to pray like sijda, ruku if you do not know hadis ????
.............???
that's in Quran ... You can do it if you follow the Quran..
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Old April 26, 2012, 02:50 PM
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What is Koranist? I mean, who are Koranist? I have never heard of this label or title before. All muslims believe and practice Quran, no?
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Old April 26, 2012, 03:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BANFAN
that's in Quran ... You can do it if you follow the Quran..
please read quran before you give reference.
tell me the sura or line where it tells you HOW to pray inthe quran. There is no place in the quran where it tells when to ruku, when to sezda, where to put your hand to pray, all these.
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Old April 26, 2012, 03:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mufi_02
What is Koranist? I mean, who are Koranist? I have never heard of this label or title before. All muslims believe and practice Quran, no?
Ya you have a genuine question. This is another man made term..... I hate to use such terms... At the end none remains a Muslim .. All are Shia, Sunni, qadiani, koranist .. Etc etc. and then amongst them there are hanafi, agha khani etc etc. Our prophet was only Muslim and he only had one book to follow...Al Quran.

Although I agree whole heartedly, with the concept of following only Quran as the only book from the only creator. Since All other books are written by people, full of errors and can't be a book of guidance from the creator.
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Old April 26, 2012, 03:29 PM
zsayeed zsayeed is offline
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from the post and the word, it does not matter who the Koranists are... it is a movement I assume, but that does not matter either. It is the concept that matters. I like it.

What would you do if you knew who they are? This is THE ideal way to separate the concept from the followers. Otherwise you can attack the followers and not absorb the concept. It is the message that is important - not who, but what.
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Old April 26, 2012, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 09hotmail
please read quran before you give reference.
tell me the sura or line where it tells you HOW to pray inthe quran. There is no place in the quran where it tells when to ruku, when to sezda, where to put your hand to pray, all these.
I have read it enough to say that and not talking hear-says like you. And there are at least 2/3 archived threads in BC on this topic. .You will get almost every Ref in those threads. I don't like to enter into any sort of discussion about it here again.

You may also remain with what you believe... That's your matter, but don't say it's not there. How can you even imagine, the creator has missed out on prayer in His book?? He hasn't missed anything my friend. Re-read the Quran carefully, you will get it.
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  #12  
Old April 26, 2012, 03:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zsayeed
from the post and the word, it does not matter who the Koranists are... it is a movement I assume, but that does not matter either. It is the concept that matters. I like it.

What would you do if you knew who they are? This is THE ideal way to separate the concept from the followers. Otherwise you can attack the followers and not absorb the concept. It is the message that is important - not who, but what.
But my question is what is their message? How do they differ from traditional way of Shia/Sunni? I am very ignorant about this new term Koranist. I want to discuss but I just don't know their message.
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Old April 26, 2012, 04:05 PM
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I used to know Qur'an is spell like this and it should be Quranist ? When it changed to koranist?!
I don't know or never heard of koranist movement in my entire small life.This is second time I heard it in BC.As a lay person I would really love to know the history behind koranist movement when,where,how,who,why this movement or sect started.I am quite sure 90% Muslims in this world don't know or even follow this movement in 1400 years of Islamic history and it's a new concept by modern Muslims einsteins.
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Old April 26, 2012, 04:22 PM
zsayeed zsayeed is offline
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The spelling of Qur'an is your major point!??????
You might not have heard of the word in your entire life, but the message seems to be clear!
Qur'an is the foundation, the derivatives are what they are - derivatives. Unifying Source of Unified Message is the Qur'an - follow that doctrine - and call yourself whatever you want under the sun, or above it.

That is the problem with any thing to do with Religion - we have to take a concept back to our little mental factory and compare to what we know, what we have heard, tinker with it, put it up to against the light to see if we know of this from before, mold it, retrofit it, see if it fits into our square hole... oh okay how about the triangular one .... That is what Piaget called Learning - I don't.

The Absolute Truth has no comparison ... if that were possible then it won't be absolute, would it?

1. Harping on the spelling is inane
2. The argument of not having heard of the word is just an effort to retro-fit
3. The word is clear from the original post - Unified Message! No Dogma, No Divisions, No Opinions, No Tafsir, No Jurisprudence... just Unified Message!

Peace Out.
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Old April 26, 2012, 08:26 PM
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As a koranist Show me in the verse of Quran where Allah (swt) says Muslims to pray five times a day without explanation of mufassirin? As koranist only prefer to understand and follow their own opinions and don’t want to follow mufassirin scholars Mujtahids opinions. Remember Shia prays 3 times a day as they say it’s mentioned in the holy Quran. Don’t you think understanding from your own and rejecting Ahadith of prophet (sallahu alaihi wasallam) will only lead Muslims to destructions because few years’ later many koranist might claim that five times a day prayer isn’t compulsory?
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Old April 26, 2012, 08:31 PM
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Must read book on hadith rejecters/ modernists and their mu'tazila influence:
http://www.qsep.com/books/modernists.html
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Old April 26, 2012, 08:42 PM
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From now on I've to be careful behind whom or where I pray.
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Old April 27, 2012, 01:21 AM
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Many Muslims claim the Taliban are not following "true Islam". But for one reason or another its seems the Taliban and their likes continue acting and behaving this way. Muslims tell the world they are not true Islam. Yet why do they insist and continue to behave like this?

This is why


On the authority of `Abdullah ibn `Abbas that the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said, "If you find anybody committing the act of the People of Lot (i.e. sodomy), then kill the one doing it and the one with whom it is done."This hadith is recorded by Imam Ahmad, Imam Abu Dawud, and Imam At-Tirmidhi among others.


Narrated Abu Sa'id Al-Khudri: When the tribe of Bani Quraiza was ready to accept Sad's judgment, Allah's Apostle sent for Sad who was near to him. Sad came, riding a donkey and when he came near, Allah's Apostle said (to the Ansar), "Stand up for your leader." Then Sad came and sat beside Allah's Apostle who said to him. "These people are ready to accept your judgment." Sad said, "I give the judgment that their warriors should be killed and their children and women should be taken as prisoners." The Prophet then remarked, "O Sad! You have judged amongst them with (or similar to) the judgment of the King Allah." Bukhari

Narrated Aisha: No woman of Banu Qurayzah was killed except one. She was with me, talking and laughing on her back and belly (extremely), while the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) was killing her people with the swords. Suddenly a man called her name: Where is so-and-so? She said: I I asked: What is the matter with you? She said: I did a new act. She said: The man took her and beheaded her. She said: I will not forget that she was laughing extremely although she knew that she would be killed. Abu Dawood

:Narrated Atiyyah al-Qurazi: I was among the captives of Banu Qurayzah. They (the Companions) examined us, and those who had begun to grow hair (pubes) were killed, and those who had not were not killed. I was among those who had not grown hair. Abu Dawood

Narrated Ibn Umar: Bani An-Nadir and Bani Quraiza fought (against the Prophet violating their peace treaty), so the Prophet exiled Bani An-Nadir and allowed Bani Quraiza to remain at their places (in Medina) taking nothing from them till they fought against the Prophet again). He then killed their men and distributed their women, children and property among the Muslims, but some of them came to the Prophet and he granted them safety, and they embraced Islam. He exiled all the Jews from Medina. They were the Jews of Bani Qainuqa, the tribe of Abdullah bin Salam and the Jews of Bani Haritha and all the other Jews of Medina Bukhari

"Awf ibn Malik reported that the Prophet (Peace be upon him) said, 'The Jews split into 71 sects: one will enter Paradise and 70 will enter Hell. The Christians split into 72 sects: 71 will enter Hell and one will enter Paradise. By Him in Whose hand is my soul, my Ummah will split into 73 sects: one will enter Paradise and 72 will enter Hell.' Someone asked, 'O Messenger ofAllah (Peace be upon him), who will they be?' He replied, 'The main body of the Muslims (al-Jama'ah).' Awf ibn Malik is the only one who reported this Hadith, and its isnad is acceptable." And in another version of this Hadith the Prophet (Peace be upon him) goes onto say that the saved sect, "...Are those who follow my and my Sahaba's path" (Tirmidhi, vol. 2, pg. 89)


Some Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to ‘Ali and he burnt them. The news of this event, reached Ibn ‘Abbas who said, “If I had been in his place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah’s Apostle forbade it, saying, ‘Do not punish anybody with Allah’s punishment (fire).’ I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah’s Apostle, ‘Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him. Bukhari

Allah's Apostle sent us in a mission (i.e. am army-unit) and said, "If you find so-and-so and so-and-so, burn both of them with fire." When we intended to depart, Allah's Apostle said, "I have ordered you to burn so-and-so and so-and-so, and it is none but Allah Who punishes with fire, so, if you find them, kill them." Bukhari

Allah's Apostle said, "I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah.' And if they say so, pray like our prayers, face our Qibla and slaughter as we slaughter, then their blood and property will be sacred to us and we will not interfere with them except legally and their reckoning will be with Allah." Narrated Maimun ibn Siyah that he asked Anas bin Malik, "O Abu Hamza! What makes the life and property of a person sacred?" He replied, "Whoever says, 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah', faces our Qibla during the prayers, prays like us and eats our slaughtered animal, then he is a Muslim, and has got the same rights and obligations as other Muslims have." Bukhari

Abu Musa said, “I came to the Prophet along with two men (from the tribe) of Ash’ariyin, one on my right and the other on my left, while Allah’s Apostle was brushing his teeth (with a Siwak ), and both men asked him for some employment. The Prophet said, ‘O Abu Musa (O ‘Abdullah bin Qais!).’ I said, ‘By Him Who sent you with the Truth, these two men did not tell me what was in their hearts and I did not feel (realize) that they were seeking employment.’ As if I were looking now at his Siwak being drawn to a corner under his lips, and he said, ‘We never (or, we do not) appoint for our affairs anyone who seeks to be employed. But O Abu Musa! (or ‘Abdullah bin Qais!) Go to Yemen.’” The Prophet then sent Mu’adh bin Jabal after him and when Mu’adh reached him, he spread out a cushion for him and requested him to get down (and sit on the cushion). Behold: There was a fettered man beside Abu Muisa. Mu’adh asked, “Who is this (man)?” Abu Muisa said, “He was a Jew and became a Muslim and then reverted back to Judaism.” Then Abu Muisa requested Mu’adh to sit down but Mu’adh said, “I will not sit down till he has been killed. This is the judgment of Allah and His Apostle (for such cases) and repeated it thrice. Then Abu Musa ordered that the man be killed, and he was killed. Abu Musa added, “Then we discussed the night prayers and one of us said, ‘I pray and sleep, and I hope that Allah will reward me for my sleep as well as for my prayers.’” Bukhari

Some people from the tribe of ‘Ukl came to the Prophet and embraced Islam. The climate of Medina did not suit them, so the Prophet ordered them to go to the (herd of milch) camels of charity and to drink, their milk and urine (as a medicine). They did so, and after they had recovered from their ailment (became healthy) they turned renegades (reverted from Islam) and killed the shepherd of the camels and took the camels away. The Prophet sent (some people) in their pursuit and so they were (caught and) brought, and the Prophets ordered that their hands and legs should be cut off and that their eyes should be branded with heated pieces of iron, and that their cut hands and legs should not be cauterized, till they die.

Imam Shafi, may Allah have mercy upon him, said the Imam [supreme leader of the Muslims] is given the choice of killing the prisoners, showing them mercy, ransoming them or keeping them in bondage. This issue has been confirmed and has been proven in our book 'Al Ahkam.' (Tafsir of the Qur'an by Ibn Kathir [1])

According to the Qur'an a woman who has been captured by force falls in the category of a slave girl (kaniz). And because the Qur'an confines the use of force to the fighting (qital) in the way of God, thus according to the Qur'an a slave girl is that woman who falls in the hands of Muslims as a prisoner during the course of war waged in the way of God. (Maulana Maududi, Rasa'il wa Masa'il 3rd edition, Vol. III, p.102).


Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas: Ikrimah reported on the authority of Ibn Abbas, saying: I think the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) said: When one of you prays without a sutrah, a dog, an ***, a pig, a Jew, a Magian, and a woman cut off his prayer, but it will suffice if they pass in front of him at a distance of over a stone's throw. ( Bukhari )

'Umar b. Muhammad b. Zaid reported that he heard his father narrating from Ibn 'Umar that Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) had said. If bad luck is a fact, then it is in the horse, the woman and the house. (Bukhari)





This is why they behave like this. Let no one make you believe they are not following Sunni tey are following hadiths to the teeth. Thats why no Muslim scholars can tell them "what you are doing is against Islam!". Thats why even though there are tons of Sheikhs in Pakistan and tons of Sufi sheikhs nobody can stop them. because they all follow the same Islam.

These hadith are against everything the Quran stands for and present an image of the prophet of a ruler, a warrior, a conquerer and an executioner. This, even though the Quran says:


16:82 But if they turn away from you, your only duty is a clear delivery of the Message .

6:107 Yet if God had so willed, they would not have ascribed Divinity to aught besides Him; hence, We have not made you their keeper, nor are you a guardian over them.

4:79-80 Say:'Whatever good betides you is from God and whatever evil betides you is from your own self and that We have sent you to mankind only as a messenger and all sufficing is God as witness. Whoso obeys the Messenger, he indeed obeys God. And for those who turn away, We have not sent you as a keeper."

17:53-54 And tell my servants that they should speak in a most kindly manner. Verily, Satan is always ready to stir up discord between men; for verily; Satan is mans foe .... Hence, We have not sent you with power to determine their Faith.


88:21 22; And so,exhort them your task is only to exhort; you cannot compel them to believe.

42:6 48 And whoso takes for patrons others besides God, over them does God keep a watch. Mark, you are not a keeper over them. But if they turn aside from you (do not get disheartened), for We have not sent you to be a keeper over them; your task is but to preach

Two radically different Islam's with radically different prophets!


As for such who do not fight you on account of faith, or drive you forth from your homelands, God does not forbid you to show them kindness and to deal with them with equity, for God loves those who act equitably. God only forbids you to turn in friendship towards such as fight against you because of faith and drive you forth from your homelands or aid in driving you forth. As for those from among you who turn towards them for alliance, it is they who are wrongdoers. 60:8-9

Permission (to fight) is given to those against whom war is being wrongfully waged, and verily, God has indeed the power to aid them. Those who have been driven from their homelands in defiance of right for no other reason than their saying, �Our Lord is God.� 22:39-40


Quran is peace!
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  #19  
Old April 27, 2012, 03:46 AM
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Antora Antora is offline
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wow!.... Very interesting !
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  #20  
Old April 27, 2012, 03:55 AM
Boomerang Boomerang is offline
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Confusing! may ALLAH (swt) guide us to the right path.

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  #21  
Old April 27, 2012, 04:54 AM
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BANFAN BANFAN is offline
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Quote:
"Shall I seek other than God as a source of law, when He has revealed to you this book fully detailed?" 6:114

"We did not leave anything out of this book" 6:38

"We have revealed to you this book to provide explanations for everything" 16:89

"We have cited in the Quran every kind of example, but the human being is the most argumentative creature" 18:54
First of all you can have a look at the above verses from Quran and see if you can agree to it or not. There are many more verses in Quran meaning like above. If you read the Quran with some authentic English translation to understand it you will be shocked with the opinions you have on Hadith vis a vis Quran.

Why not Bangla? Because almost all Bangla translators have used the Urdu translation as the basis/base, so they distorted it even further. Like the first verse of Quran: Bismillahir Rahmanir Rahim: in the name of Allah; the most Merciful and The Most Benevolent. But if you see the Bangla Quran or Urdu, they have added an additional word: Shuru Korchi. Which is not there in the original verse. There by limiting Bismillah...... Or the Name of Allah, only to begin ... While the verse Bismillah ....... isn't meant only to Begin. This was a simple example... There are many more and in many cases, they have kept the original Urdu word, because they didn't know an appropriate Bangla word...

But you can use a Bangla and English side by side. When ever you see a dispute in any meaning, go to the root of that word in Arabic, you will get the meaning.

It's not important what Shia says or what Sunnis say, it's important what Quran says. And definitely both these groups have got something right and something's wrong... That's the reason for their difference. No one group can survive by getting everything wrong in light with Quran.

Allah has made the Quran easy to understand, not the other way round as we are told to believe by the Ahadith. None can make things easier than Allah. Bro.. Give it a try yourself, and with sincerity to find the truth...inshallah you will get it. You don't need to blindly follow the hearsays when you have a clear book in front of you.

I'm not trying to prove you wrong or prove me right; It's just a suggestion, taking or not taking is your matter. After all, reading Quran, understanding and following can't be worse than following hear-says. And you can read Quran without Odu, you can mark verses that seems relevant to your queries and everything that you would do while reading a book of law. Later you can revisit the marked verses.... That helps, since everything about any topic hasn't been said in one verse...it's all over the book...sent down over 22 years. And please don't form any opinion on any topic, until you finish reading it all. Read with an open heart; Allah will guide you to the truth.

Religion is a conscious decision of every adult. You have the freedom to believe or reject anything. But following fore fathers or scholars blindly isn't the way. We all are guilty of doing this mistake upto certain point of our life. May Allah pardon us.



Quote:
Originally Posted by BD_2015
As a koranist Show me in the verse of Quran where Allah (swt) says Muslims to pray five times a day without explanation of mufassirin? As koranist only prefer to understand and follow their own opinions and don’t want to follow mufassirin scholars Mujtahids opinions. Remember Shia prays 3 times a day as they say it’s mentioned in the holy Quran. Don’t you think understanding from your own and rejecting Ahadith of prophet (sallahu alaihi wasallam) will only lead Muslims to destructions because few years’ later many koranist might claim that five times a day prayer isn’t compulsory?
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  #22  
Old April 27, 2012, 05:41 AM
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Naimul_Hd Naimul_Hd is offline
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When it comes to religion, and comparing with other fellow members' knowledge, i can say i am a novice. So, pardon me if i say anything wrong.

As far as shia muslim and sunni is concern, both of them abide by Quran, no doubt. There are few more things that Shia muslims do which violates the principle of Quran. For example,

Shia Muslims believe that the Imam (11 Imams) is sinless by nature, and that his authority is infallible as it comes directly from God. Therefore, Shia Muslims often venerate the Imams as saints and perform pilgrimages to their tombs and shrines in the hopes of divine intercession which is clearly 'Shirk'. They see 'Imam' as a medium to reach to Allah. But Allah clearly said to pray to him, Not to anyone else. And thinking 'Imam' as sinless, infallible is nothing but comparing them with 'Allah' as only and only Allah can have such attributes.

In addition, Shia Muslims do not recognize 4 khalifas of Islam. Rather they see Abu Bakr (Radi Allahu Anhu) the first Khalifa, as their enemy who was elected by the people of that time over Ali (PBUH) son in law of Prophet Mohammed (PBUH). Shia muslims believe that Abu Bakr killed Ali (i heard, not sure though, sorry if i am wrong). For this reason, Shia muslims even curse him (Abu Bakr) in their prayer.

Having said that, i want to share the following video of Dr. Zakir Naik ( though i don't like his speeches that much, but in this speech, he explains it quite well)




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  #23  
Old April 27, 2012, 09:31 AM
Zunaid Zunaid is offline
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The thread was moved by mistake. Please resume you discussions being mindful of forum rules - do not make negative comments about other beliefs

- Admin
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  #24  
Old April 27, 2012, 09:32 AM
zsayeed zsayeed is offline
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Cheers for the Rule of Law! Thanks Z Bhai, Good Night now!
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  #25  
Old April 27, 2012, 09:35 AM
09hotmail 09hotmail is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zunaid
The thread was moved by mistake. Please resume you discussions being mindful of forum rules - do not make negative comments about other beliefs

- Admin
Thanks we can dicuss good discussions.
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