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  #901  
Old June 19, 2012, 04:01 PM
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Zeeshan Zeeshan is offline
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Is Duminy's 7 ball 23 one of the highest SR above 20 albeit unofficial?
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  #902  
Old June 19, 2012, 05:40 PM
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Zeeshan Zeeshan is offline
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Tread softly, for here lies the immortals.

One wonders if a similar quote can be found as one enters the pantheon of the game where resides the sages of the game with ODI career runs above 10,000.

Quote:
Most runs
Player Span Mat Inns NO Runs HS Ave BF SR 100 50 0
SR Tendulkar (India) 1989-2012 463 452 41 18426 200* 44.83 21367 86.23 49 96 20
RT Ponting (Aus/ICC) 1995-2012 375 365 39 13704 164 42.03 17046 80.39 30 82 20
ST Jayasuriya (Asia/SL) 1989-2011 445 433 18 13430 189 32.36 14723 91.21 28 68 34
Inzamam-ul-Haq (Asia/Pak) 1991-2007 378 350 53 11739 137* 39.52 15812 74.24 10 83 20
JH Kallis (Afr/ICC/SA) 1996-2012 321 307 53 11498 139 45.26 15756 72.97 17 85 16
SC Ganguly (Asia/India) 1992-2007 311 300 23 11363 183 41.02 15416 73.70 22 72 16
R Dravid (Asia/ICC/India) 1996-2011 344 318 40 10889 153 39.16 15284 71.24 12 83 13
DPMD Jayawardene (Asia/SL) 1998-2012 378 355 35 10692 144 33.41 13686 78.12 15 67 26
KC Sangakkara (Asia/ICC/SL) 2000-2012 330 310 32 10636 138* 38.25 14080 75.53 13 72 10
BC Lara (ICC/WI) 1990-2007 299 289 32 10405 169 40.48 13086 79.51 19 63 16

Source
Jamie Siddons used to say that Bangladesh National Team does not have match winners. Whether it was an excuse or not, the point remains that the team's #1 individual with highest career runs is actually the lower of the tier.

Quote:
Most runs
Player Span Mat Inns NO Runs HS Ave BF SR 100 50 0
Shakib Al Hasan 2006-2012 126 121 19 3635 134* 35.63 4656 78.07 5 25 6
Mohammad Ashraful 2001-2011 169 163 13 3397 109 22.64 4843 70.14 3 20 12
Tamim Iqbal 2007-2012 113 113 1 3368 154 30.07 4254 79.17 3 23 12
Shahriar Nafees 2005-2011 75 75 5 2201 123* 31.44 3167 69.49 4 13 11
Habibul Bashar 1995-2007 111 105 5 2168 78 21.68 3586 60.45 0 14 18
Mushfiqur Rahim 2006-2012 108 99 18 2047 101 25.27 3074 66.59 1 10 9

Source
Shakib-al-Hasan, although may have enjoyed the #1 ODI all-rounder spot, will not even sniff near the top-tiered players. And who else is the squad besides the next, run-getter Tamim Iqbal, an inconsistent Ashraful and Mushfiqur with a meagre 2000+ runs.

While players like Sachin and Jayasuria have been playing for 20 years, for the Bangladeshi players to reach the top of the totem-pole, would realistically require that much time even if the players like Mushfiqur and Shakib were to play for 10 matches a year, scoring a 50 in each match with an aggregate of 1000 runs a year. These are of course just pulling numbers out of thin air, but it does help to put things into perspective.

Sachin, Ponting, Jaya, Kallis, Ganguly et al. have already reached the point where they have trained their muscle memory and reflexes to process a move automatically for the optimum shot. They have seen all the in's-and-out's of the game, and just like the adage goes in chess, "To the beginner's mind there are many options, but to the master, few." These are few, but the best possible moves.

Yes, experience matters a lot.

And even if experience does not speak volumes, it has to be the way these prodigies moved up the ranks. They have scored enough 50s and 100s, that just like yesterday's match where Amla (who by no means at the top of the tier), an 88 odd runs does not seem too unusual off the norm, while for a BD player, a 50 tends to be a gift.

It's no wonder, Sachin being at the top of the tier, holds also the record for second-highest ODI score of 200* runs. His teammate Sehwag also spoke of maturity that comes after 10 years of play the game.

Right now, Shakib and Tamim has 3000+ runs each. You cannot possibly expect a team with only 2 major players to form the inner core, while at the same time wishing that they will pile drive the opponent. That's just pure wishful thinking. Numbers don't lie, and according to numerical conspiracies, a neutral fan has every right to predict that a team consisting of players with 8000 or more runs will come up as the better one on any given day.

These are really common sense stat-interpretation. Yet, so often we emotional Bangladeshi fans wish that we will taste yet another miracle where the Tigers just cruise through a series earning every accolades imaginable. Such is and will not be the case.

And yes, naively by the time the team progresses to the level where almost five or six players are equipped with plenitude of runs, the rest of the world will also catch up. Sure, Bangladesh may have had a slow start being a relatively new team, but the fact of the matter is it will be another 10-12 years where our players reach the level of mastery to dominate series and bring home the World Cup.

EDIT: I must say the list of the highest ODI run-getters consists of retired players mostly. So I may have conflated the akaash-patal description.
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The guy you hit? If he got a look at the plates, it won't even take that long. There's no play here. There's no angle, there's no champagne room. I'm not a miracle worker, I'm a janitor. The math on this is simple; the smaller the mess, the easier it is for me to clean up.
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  #903  
Old June 19, 2012, 08:05 PM
Kohli_Sox Kohli_Sox is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeeshan
Sure, Bangladesh may have had a slow start being a relatively new team, but the fact of the matter is it will be another 10-12 years where our players reach the level of mastery to dominate series and bring home the World Cup.
Yes only if they stick with this set of players. But given the trend when even a little bit of bad form hits, the outcries of dropping someone gets to the point of such extravaganza that it's hard to imagine that we can say confidently we'll see this same set of players after 10-12 years. We can't look for solutions to resurrect the current situation only but rather where we'll stand after many such years. Long term plans can only be beneficial.
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  #904  
Old June 19, 2012, 08:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeeshan
While players like Sachin and Jayasuria have been playing for 20 years, for the Bangladeshi players to reach the top of the totem-pole, would realistically require that much time even if the players like Mushfiqur and Shakib were to play for 10 matches a year, scoring a 50 in each match with an aggregate of 1000 runs a year. These are of course just pulling numbers out of thin air, but it does help to put things into perspective.
As (effectively) a Tier 2 side, it is difficult to draw comparisons between our performance and those of Tier 1 sides. Our dearth of test matches and T20s aside, we don't even get as many ODIs as G8 teams do. Therefore, none of our players, even Ash who debuted at 16 and will probably play well into his 30s, will get to play 350+ ODIs like Tendulkar et al. (And I say this factoring in the increasing success of the BD ODI side and the ability of the cricket board to afford more matches.) Thus, we will always be lagging behind in total run aggregate. I, however, do believe that Shakib, Tamim and Mushy have the ability to cross 8000 ODI runs before they respectively retire, given their respective ages and ability to score consistently (I say that about Mushy from late last year on-wards)

In terms of experience being of importance, I think it's necessary to take into consideration the experience of playing at a particular ground as well. While Tendulkar or Ponting or Jayasuriya might have the most experience overall, they do not have the most experience of playing in Mirpur (for instance) - Shakib does. That is also indicated by his run aggregate on that ground. His relative experience at that ground can often outweigh the total experience of other players. The same can be said for Jayawardane in a couple of grounds in Sri Lanka and Jayasuriya in Sharjah.
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  #905  
Old June 19, 2012, 08:17 PM
TigerEz TigerEz is offline
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should i open the next thread or someone else got it?
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  #906  
Old June 19, 2012, 11:22 PM
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Zeeshan Zeeshan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerEz
should i open the next thread or someone else got it?
Wait a bit and go for it. What are you waiting for? Did Jafar deter you? :p

I already got today's match covered.
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The guy you hit? If he got a look at the plates, it won't even take that long. There's no play here. There's no angle, there's no champagne room. I'm not a miracle worker, I'm a janitor. The math on this is simple; the smaller the mess, the easier it is for me to clean up.
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  #907  
Old June 20, 2012, 12:02 AM
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If nobody opens BD vs Zim by 2pm tommorrow then i guess i'll have to do it
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  #908  
Old June 20, 2012, 12:28 AM
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BANFAN BANFAN is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Navo
As (effectively) a Tier 2 side, it is difficult to draw comparisons between our performance and those of Tier 1 .....
what's that Tier 1/2? Has it been officially declared?? . I don't want to see tier system and i think we shouldn't use it until it's officially declared...I don't thnk it will ever be..
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  #909  
Old June 20, 2012, 01:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BANFAN
what's that Tier 1/2? Has it been officially declared?? . I don't want to see tier system and i think we shouldn't use it until it's officially declared...I don't thnk it will ever be..
It's not been officially declared but the reason why I use the term is because it de facto exists already. Just look at the teams we regularly play: Zimbabwe, NZ and West Indies. Would they not be, along with Ireland, Afghanistan and Namibia, the teams that form the 2nd tier anyway? In addition, look at the number of matches we play. Is it anywhere comparable to the top teams?

Two tiers exist already and by not acknowledging it formally, the ICC can continue with the charade that we are 'full' members.
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  #910  
Old June 20, 2012, 01:19 AM
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Ya I know it exists, but we still have an opportunity to play the top teams if we perform. Like NZ, WI ... but if we accept it like this, I'm sure it will be made official and that makes life difficult for us. I don't say that if you use it once it will begone official, but if a large fan base of Bangladesh like BC gets used to such terms...it will only encourage people...to make it official...we can use other terms like top 4 ranked etc... I feel very uncomfortable with such confident use of tier....words

It's very logical that top 4/5 teams play within them more often and the other teams within them.. With occasional matches between each other...even if we don't look at it with the prism of tier..
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