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  #1  
Old October 7, 2017, 04:15 PM
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Default Team Turmoil: my theory

Its been reported that the senior players have issues with Coach Hathu and I think the problem may extend to Nannu and possibly others as well. Notable points as follows:

Shakib sitting out is fishy, especially considering how competitive he is. Either he has beef with coach/management or the skipper. But there is no evidence of beef with Mushy, and secondly why would it emerge suddnely after a win vs Australia? Remember Shakib called out ex players after the loss to HK in 2014...perhaps Nannu still has an axe to grind???

Mushy and Shakib were reportedly in disagreement with the decision to bench Mominul. We know Hathu has issues with his technique but my theory is the coach views Momin as a threat to Imrul, Soumya, and Sabbirs positions in the XI. What else explains the continual fascination with these players across formats? Very odd that an unfit Mosaddek would be selected when he has such a serious ailment as to be out for 6 months. Then Momin was drafted as the backup when Nasir was referred to as the backup just 24 hrs earlier.

Now Mushy saying things like "Players dont listen to me, I cant motivate" and "i made a mistake by calling heads instead of tails"...all of a sudden he wants to be fired. Must be the most bizarre event in cricket history.

Just my theory...
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  #2  
Old October 7, 2017, 07:22 PM
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AF is back with a bang.

I genuinely hope there is some legitimate internal issue that's making this team perform in this humiliating fashion. I doubt Mushy's BS captaincy and leadership is solely responsible. Some of the older players are unreasonably entitled and Hathuru is evidently power-mad.

Definitely a crisis period.
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  #3  
Old October 7, 2017, 07:42 PM
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Quote:

Now Mushy saying things like "Players dont listen to me, I cant motivate" and "i made a mistake by calling heads instead of tails"...all of a sudden he wants to be fired.
Definitely a crisis period.
Getting fired is not the only way out you know. This is the worst way to get out of it. Only stupid can think that one directional way. He have learned nothing from Mashrafee, Tamim and Sakib. They have shown how you can "get out" in a more dignified way.

Wheather there is a team turmoil or not, (if this hypothesis is true) Musfiq will again tern out to be Stupid one.
Either way people try to twist it, there is no way to hide the fact...i.e. Mushfiq is a Marka mara Gordhob.
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  #4  
Old October 7, 2017, 07:46 PM
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Whatever gets Mushfiq out of captaincy, I will be happy with it. If this series humiliation is the price to pay, so be it. Things should be back to normal once this cry baby is put on a gag order.
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  #5  
Old October 7, 2017, 07:49 PM
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Can you provide any evidence when you said

Quote:
Mushy and Shakib were reportedly in disagreement with the decision to bench Mominul. We know Hathu has issues with his technique but my theory is the coach views Momin as a threat to Imrul, Soumya, and Sabbirs positions in the XI.
I think this whole star jalsha, serial needs to stop. This is a national team for FFS, not some gorilla chest beating contest. Captain,Management and players need to sort this out, or we will be a even bigger laughing stock in test cricket.
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Old October 7, 2017, 07:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eshen
Whatever gets Mushfiq out of captaincy, I will be happy with it. If this series humiliation is the price to pay, so be it. Things should be back to normal once this cry baby is put on a gag order.
Mushfiq has too much fake pride, to quit captaincy, even if you suffer the biggest innings defeat, he will find a way to blame it on the players. And Mr Hathurusinga and Nannu will be cheering him on like blind idiots.
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  #7  
Old October 7, 2017, 08:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eshen
Whatever gets Mushfiq out of captaincy, I will be happy with it. If this series humiliation is the price to pay, so be it. Things should be back to normal once this cry baby is put on a gag order.
Yeah I don't think this is going to be a long term problem. At least I hope not. But I am quite sure Mushy will be fired after this series...maybe as soon as within 24 hours.
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Old October 7, 2017, 08:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazal
He have learned nothing from Mashrafee, Tamim and Sakib. They have shown how you can "get out" in a more dignified way.
In Mushy's defense, he did step down voluntarily in 2013 after the ZIM series loss.

Shakib and Tamim were fired by the board after the 2011 WC debacle (shortly therefter to be technically correct).

Mash was basically fired from the T20 side this year - whether that was the right cricketing decision or not - it was a tasteless way to go. Now is that the idea of Hathu, Nannu, or someone else we won't know. It doesn't seem like Papon is the culprit though.
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  #9  
Old October 7, 2017, 08:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DinRaat.
Can you provide any evidence when you said



I think this whole star jalsha, serial needs to stop. This is a national team for FFS, not some gorilla chest beating contest. Captain,Management and players need to sort this out, or we will be a even bigger laughing stock in test cricket.
BDcrictime.com reported Shakib/Mushy saying they were disappointed that Momin was left out of the Aussie squad and/or that they were pleased when he was included. There was another report that the senior players, Mashrafee included, met with Papon and had Momin included the next day.

Mohammad Isam has hinted that there is discord between Hathu and senior players in articles here and there.

As far as Hathu's agenda against Mominul, thats just my gut feeling. I don't have any evidence for it so its not a "fact"...at least not yet anyways. Its part of my working theory though. I have a feeling he may have a similar beef with Mosaddek just based on some off the cuff remarks he reportedly made.
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  #10  
Old October 7, 2017, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by al Furqaan
BDcrictime.com reported Shakib/Mushy saying they were disappointed that Momin was left out of the Aussie squad and/or that they were pleased when he was included. There was another report that the senior players, Mashrafee included, met with Papon and had Momin included the next day.

Mohammad Isam has hinted that there is discord between Hathu and senior players in articles here and there.

As far as Hathu's agenda against Mominul, thats just my gut feeling. I don't have any evidence for it so its not a "fact"...at least not yet anyways. Its part of my working theory though. I have a feeling he may have a similar beef with Mosaddek just based on some off the cuff remarks he reportedly made.
Well what else could they have said? " We are glad Momin is out of the team"?

A lot of sports journalists ask leading questions like "how do you feel about Momin being left out" or "are you glad to see Momin back?" and there's only one way to answer these questions. It doesn't mean they have issues with the coach or whatever.

As far as Moss is concerned, he has a serious eye infection. And that's the only reason he hasn't been with the team.
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  #11  
Old October 7, 2017, 09:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by al Furqaan
In Mushy's defense, he did step down voluntarily in 2013 after the ZIM series loss.
.
It doesn't count. He cried and said he is retiring and then when calmed down, he reverted back. Where-as officially Sakib and Mashrafee retired (regardless in the background if there were fired or not) they stick with the retirement and chose a more honorable exit in public.

On the contrary, Mushiq is following the old captains....trying to shameless stick as captain as long as he can.
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Old October 7, 2017, 10:06 PM
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Was a big fan of the head coach, but wondering whether times up.

This is the first time i ve seen (Since he took over), that the players are turning up just because they have to, and look on their faces suggest its a bad holiday which they want to end asap. In NZ they at least fought, nothing here.

How we fare in the ODI's will provide us a good idea of where we stand.
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  #13  
Old October 8, 2017, 12:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazal
It doesn't count. He cried and said he is retiring and then when calmed down, he reverted back. Where-as officially Sakib and Mashrafee retired (regardless in the background if there were fired or not) they stick with the retirement and chose a more honorable exit in public.

On the contrary, Mushiq is following the old captains....trying to shameless stick as captain as long as he can.
Shak didn't retire. Mash retired from T20, but the scoop is he was forced to. Shak was fired, just like how Mushy likely will be fired and how he was fired from the ODI team in 2014 right before the world cup.

Those are the negative aspects of Mushy. His rolling on others when things go bad, not giving up the WK gloves years ago, and now the captaincy. Although I thought his captaincy had improved quite a bit the last few years.
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Old October 8, 2017, 12:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeesh
Was a big fan of the head coach, but wondering whether times up.

This is the first time i ve seen (Since he took over), that the players are turning up just because they have to, and look on their faces suggest its a bad holiday which they want to end asap. In NZ they at least fought, nothing here.

How we fare in the ODI's will provide us a good idea of where we stand.
I've also heard rumors the coach himself wanted to quit. Maybe I'm just imagining things.

Hathu did his job from 2015 to getting us to being a competitive side. its probably time for a fresh set of ideas for all involved.
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Old October 8, 2017, 01:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by al Furqaan
I've also heard rumors the coach himself wanted to quit. Maybe I'm just imagining things.

Hathu did his job from 2015 to getting us to being a competitive side. its probably time for a fresh set of ideas for all involved.
You hear alot of rumors.

Any news of Sabbir scoring a hundred. I'll have to wait till my deathbed, before I see this guy score a ton.
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  #16  
Old October 8, 2017, 02:01 AM
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I also feel time for new ideas.

Once you start having differences with key members of dressing room, becomes very difficult to reverse the situation.

Chances of change are slim though, we wont make changes before 2019, Papon will naturally play it safe. But 2019 is a long way to go.

Also feel the next coach we should sign should be a high profile big budget coach. Not a gamble, not an emerging coach. But simply someone with experience to get the job done. SAfricans seem re-energized under Otis Gibson. Difference a good coach can make.

We need to spend big, target someone very capable. In the bracket of an Andy Flower, Trevor Bayliss, Tom Moody. Hard to convince those guys to join BD, but thats the level of coaching, thinking we require.
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  #17  
Old October 8, 2017, 05:17 AM
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There is nothing fishy, no beef.
We just sucked.
Our bowling got exposed on good batting track.
Batsmen with out Tamim and Sakib could not handle the pressure and were outplayed by a skilled bowlikg unit.
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  #18  
Old October 8, 2017, 08:18 AM
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In the history of this game, the team always took the captain's persona. Captain is the one who is leading these men on the field. Making all the decisions (be it consulted or not).

See our captains. A putuputu captain's team will become putuputu team

The ODI transformation came after the captaincy was taken away from Mushfique. Before that we lost all the close games, what 14 in a row?
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  #19  
Old October 8, 2017, 08:41 AM
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I don't think there is anything fishy too. Mushfiqur is simply a inept captain. A team fights for their leaders but in order for that to happen the leader has to galvinize the team and raise their morale.

Mortaza does that, the team is willing to run walls and die for him, they won't for Mushfiqur and it shows.

Also I think Hathru's voice is no longer reaching the locker room the team isn't just phasing mushfiqur out and at that point a change at the top is needed.

But HERE is the major dilemna do you compromise ODI for Tests?

Because under Hathru the ODI team has grown leaps and bounds from before and looks to be in unision and functionality heading into the next 12-18 months before 2019 WC.

If you make the coaching change now you will have a new coach with new philosophy, you might be able to revamp the test side but at the same time cripple and stagnate the ODI team's chances at performing in 2019.

So something about stuck in a rock and a hard place, at this point there is no point in firing Hathru, the best thing would be to hire a assistant coach who can be groomed into taking his role once Hathru serves his role which is to help BD win 2019 world cup. Once he has done that then start fresh on both ODI and Test WITH a brand new coach and philosophy.
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  #20  
Old October 8, 2017, 10:22 AM
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shakib did not play this series due to bcb politics. So don't believe the bs he gave about needing rest. It's rubbish. There is so much more going behind the scenes. It's sad that politics will basically destroy bd cricket and not wont allow for progress to happen. Not only that but bd cricket players are just selfish. It's themselves first then the team.

We see our senior players who simply aren't T20 players still playing that format for their country. It is all ego. They feel entitled to play every format. They feel like they run things. Which they do tho. Not only that but someone like Mushy was basically forced to take off his gloves. Why? Because he knows if he is lone keeper then his spot in the team is too valuable. They just think about themselves.

Not only that but why do you think players like Nasir and Al-Amin got the axe? They did stuff behind the scenes that pissed off the higher-ups.

Absolute crap mentality and disgusting politics with clashing of egos and power struggles. It will destroy our development of cricket in our country. Yeah sure we will have glimpses here and there of success but we won't progress.

Most players get their name on the map simply cos they have connections with BCB officials. It is all a game. Nothing else. It is not about cricket anymore its more like a networking event in order to gain as much as you can.

Cos once all these egotistical senior players retire we will have a XI that are basically little baby kids. And those baby kids will turn into those same egotistical power hungry seniors that we have today. And the cycle will continue forever.

Not only that but why do you think all our youngsters are crap? They have all this ridiculous wealth that it is not essentially about cricket anymore. They think they all "made it". So it doesn't matter for them anymore. That is why you don't see the grit and determination from the youngsters that you would like.

Can't blame them though. Most of them lived in poor conditions as youngsters and suddenly 21 and they are swimming in money and are idols of bangladesh with girls chasing them.

Pretty irrelevant but 90% of the Bangladesh cricket team are chain smokers. But that to me is a reflection of the disorder and mess that exists within the team.

Bangladesh Cricket is actually a disaster. We are riding on talent alone in terms of the achievements we have accomplished. Don't expect too much from them anymore.
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  #21  
Old October 8, 2017, 11:58 AM
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I think the problem is more simple.

The techniques and the mental capacity of the youngsters have not improved at the rate that should have been. Bangladesh played well in the last few test matches because the seniors performed. Younger guys remain highly inconsistent. This is a very worrying trend.
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Old October 8, 2017, 12:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mafizraju
I think the problem is more simple.

The techniques and the mental capacity of the youngsters have not improved at the rate that should have been. Bangladesh played well in the last few test matches because the seniors performed. Younger guys remain highly inconsistent. This is a very worrying trend.

Hmm... at least this series doesn't match with your reasoning. Young players are supposed to be inconsistent and seniors more consistent. Its a realistic expectation, not the problem itself. The problem occurs when senior players becomes inconsistent. And I believe that's what happened here. lets go player by player:

Senior Players:

1. Sakib : Didn't played. So no comment there.
2. Tamim: We missed his performance in 1st TEST. Senior was not performing=1
3. Rahim: He played very poorly (as a batsman) based on his own standard.Senior was not performing=2
4. Riyad: He played more or less poorly. Senior was not performing=3
5. Imrul: His performance was nothing to be proud of as a senior player. Senior was not performing=4.
....
....


We sucked big time because none of our seniors performed. We invested soo many years on them, by this time they should be experienced and consistent on their performance because consistency comes with experience and practice (under high quality coach). And in this series the whole group of senior players are 'kupokath' ... none of them give a fight or took the leadership of leading the young.


So in my humble opinion, inconsistency of new players are not the problem, inconsistency of senior players are the root cause of the problem.
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  #23  
Old October 8, 2017, 12:21 PM
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The problem is Mushfiqur. No other theories needed.

Remove the cancer and you will get a great Bangladesh team again.
Now, even if you win, yes, consider this, even if you win the ODI series vs SA, this loser like fellow will still hover around the team and continue to affect the dressing room negatively with his inferiority complex messages.

You want him out of there, asap.

That is my theory. Except, it is a reality. Might have been a theory when I first spouted it like 3 or 4 years ago.
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Old October 8, 2017, 03:47 PM
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Look at the two Tests from nine years ago when we toured SA and comapre against the recent tests.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/1...a-test-series/

www.espncricinfo.com/series/13832/scorecard/350346/South-Africa-vs-Bangladesh-2nd-Test-bangladesh-in-south-africa-test-series/


TEST 1
SA - 441ao vs 496/3
BD - 153+159 vs 320+90
Shakib took 5 wickets

TEST2
SA - 429ao vs 573/4
BD - 250+131 vs 147+172
Shakib took 6 wickets
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Old October 8, 2017, 03:50 PM
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When you have gangrene in your leg, you have to make a tough choice i.e. to cut the leg to save the rest of the body. But if you take too long then the gangrene spread out.... at that point the only option left will be pain killer and waiting for the death.
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