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  #51  
Old February 6, 2013, 12:37 AM
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Bangladesh has her own Special Warfare Units who regularly train with their US, British and Chinese counterparts. I'm sure we could put together a team to extract the Bacchu Razakars of the world from their homelands in Pakistan and Saudi Arabia. Won't be surprised if they manage to find shelter in Turkey, but the Turks can be educated.
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  #52  
Old February 6, 2013, 12:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Electrequiem
Hanging them is revenge, not justice.


can't be any better comment to show the above emoticon.

Hanging them is revenge, nah ?? Hanging a man who killed 334 people and raped countless women is a revenge ?? Hanging a man whose 5 out of 6 war crimes (killing people) charges were proved beyond doubt is a revenge ??

So, what's justice in your book ? Give justice to those 334 people who got murdered, countless women who were raped, thousands of people who are relatives of those victims !!!

If a person can get death penalty for raping a Single girl then give justice to this butcher Kader Molla who did not only rape girls but killed hundreds of people !!! Bacchu rajakar who got death penalty is a child compare to this butcher. Still if you think that butcher should not get death penalty then i have no better word then feel ashamed of you.
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  #53  
Old February 6, 2013, 12:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Sohel
I believe that people taken prisoner must never be tortured or put to death under any circumstances. Therefore, I oppose the death penalty under all circumstances.
I'm happy about the current verdict on QM. As a civilized society, we must rise above our base instincts and be better than the ones we isolate and punish after they've been through due process of the law. Financial concerns are irrelevant.

Sadly, whether or not he remains in prison would depend on the party in power. Not that justifies killing a prisoner in fear of what might happen if Razakar lovers BNP-Jamaat returns to power because of AL's failures.
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  #54  
Old February 6, 2013, 01:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Naimul_Hd


can't be any better comment to show the above emoticon.

Hanging them is revenge, nah ?? Hanging a man who killed 334 people and raped countless women is a revenge ?? Hanging a man whose 5 out of 6 war crimes (killing people) charges were proved beyond doubt is a revenge ??

So, what's justice in your book ? Give justice to those 334 people who got murdered, countless women who were raped, thousands of people who are relatives of those victims !!!

If a person can get death penalty for raping a Single girl then give justice to this butcher Kader Molla who did not only rape girls but killed hundreds of people !!! Bacchu rajakar who got death penalty is a child compare to this butcher. Still if you think that butcher should not get death penalty then i have no better word then feel ashamed of you.
Keep your shame.

A legal system must not be based on pathos but on reason and ethics. No one is denying the tragedies of '71, but executing the razakars and the like will do nothing for them or their families. A murder does not bring justice for another murder - it only douses the fire for revenge. I never want to see any government with the power to kill one of their citizens. For the sake of both you and me.
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  #55  
Old February 6, 2013, 01:07 AM
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Like Sohel and EQ, I too oppose the death penalty under ALL circumstances. However, under certain conditions, I believe Geneva conventions should be ignored.
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  #56  
Old February 6, 2013, 07:43 AM
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Useful detail of Mullah's war crime/charge, and the reason of the verdict against him.

Quote:
Molla directly tied to 2 crimes, complicit in 3


Staff Correspondent, bdnews24.com

Published: 2013-02-05 15:39:07.0 Updated: 2013-02-05 20:58:24.0






One of the six charges of crimes against humanity by Jamaat-e-Islami leader Abdul Quader Molla during the Independence War could not be proved at all.


Prosecution has only been able to establish his direct involvement in two types of war crimes, and that he was a complicit with regard to the remaining three charges.

Molla, who is widely known as the "butcher of Mirpur" for his wartime brutality, received life imprisonment as the International Crimes Tribunal-2 delivered its second verdict, which apparently fell far short of what people had expected.

The prosecution has failed to substantiate the charges it brought against the infamous war criminal before the three-strong ICT-2 headed by Justice Obaidul Hassan, people observed after the verdict.

Jamaat’s Assistant Secretary General Molla was accused of murder, genocide, conspiracy, arson and plunder in six specific incidents as the trial, which began on May 28, culminated in the sentence on Tuesday.

Killings of Pallab, six others

‘Pallab’, a student of Mirpur Bangla College living in block B at Mirpur-11, was taken to confinement by a group of people opposing the freedom struggle in March of 1971. He had angered them for his effort to organise locals for the Liberation War.

He was taken to Molla, who was also living in Mirpur at that time. With hands tied behind, he was dragged from Mirpur 12 to Shah Ali Majar (a shrine) and then dragged back the same way before being taken to Eidgah ground at Mirpur-12.

There they hanged Pallab from a tree and cut his fingers off. He had to endure the torture for two days before he was shot dead.

His body rotted outside under the open sky for two more days, and finally was dumped beside Kalapani Jheel with bodies of six unidentified people.

According to the verdict, the tribunal found his complicity to the crime, but the prosecution could not prove how Molla had masterminded the killing, thus failing to substantiate his direct involvement in the incident.

Murder of Poet Meherunnesa, mother, brother
In the morning of Mar 27, 1971, a team of Al-Badr members led by Molla stormed into the poet’s Mirpur residence at around 11am. He ordered and witnessed decapitation of Meherunnesa. Her two brothers – Rafiqul Hoque Bablu and Shariful Hoque Tuku – and their mother were killed in the same way.

Meherunnesa’s beheaded body was found hanging from the ceiling fan.

This time the prosecution failed to substantiate the killing, and the tribunal could not establish anything more than his ‘complicity’ to the crime.
Read full in dbnews24
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  #57  
Old February 6, 2013, 09:31 AM
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শাহবাগ কেন যাব ? আজ যেন শাহবাগ না যেতে হয়, সেজন্যই তো গেল বার এই আওয়ামী সরকারকে ভোট দিলাম, এই প্রত্যাশায় যে তারা যুদ্ধপরাধীর বিচার করবে আর দেশ ও জনগনের উন্নয়ন করবে । কিন্তু বিধি বাম !

তারছিরা তারেকের হাওয়া ভবনকে হার মানিয়ে দেয়া সীমাহীন দুর্নীতি, বিডিআর হত্যা, শেয়ারবাজার, হলমার্ক, কুইক রেন্টাল, ছাত্রলীগের কুকর্ম সহ অথর্ব আওয়ামী সরকার যখন সমস্যায় জর্জরিত, আর আবুলের ভারে নুয়ে পড়া পদ্মাব্রিজের ন্যয় বাকশালীয় গনতন্ত্রের ভিতর বাস করা এই নৈরাজ্যবাদে বিশ্বজিৎময় বাঙ্গালী যখন নিরাপত্তাহীনতায় বাকরুদ্ব, তখন নতুন বতলে পুরান মদ বেচতে আসছে এরা ! এরা জানে আবেগপ্রবন এই বাঙ্গালীকে কি বেচলে গিলবে !

এখন এরা বলবে, আমরাই একমাত্র দল যারা এই রাজাকারগুলোর বিচার করতে চাই। যাবজ্জীবনের এই মুলা এখন বেচবে। আরে এই মুলা খেয়েই তো তোদের ভোট দিলাম কু*র বাচ্চারা, আবার একি মূলা খাওয়াস কেন? বছর শেষে নির্বাচন, এখন এই ইস্যু নিয়ে বিচারের দাবিতে আবার জনগণকে ফুঁসলিয়ে কিছু নগ্ন ভোটের পায়তারা, নয়তো জনগণকে ব্যস্ত রেখে পালাবার পথ খোঁজা । মনে রাখিস,

♪ আমার মাথায় কাঠাল ভেঙ্গে খাওয়ার দিনতো শেষ,
নাম আমার জনগণ, আমিই বাংলাদেশ ♪
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  #58  
Old February 6, 2013, 10:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabz
শাহবাগ কেন যাব ? আজ যেন শাহবাগ না যেতে হয়, সেজন্যই তো গেল বার এই আওয়ামী সরকারকে ভোট দিলাম, এই প্রত্যাশায় যে তারা যুদ্ধপরাধীর বিচার করবে আর দেশ ও জনগনের উন্নয়ন করবে । কিন্তু বিধি বাম !

তারছিরা তারেকের হাওয়া ভবনকে হার মানিয়ে দেয়া সীমাহীন দুর্নীতি, বিডিআর হত্যা, শেয়ারবাজার, হলমার্ক, কুইক রেন্টাল, ছাত্রলীগের কুকর্ম সহ অথর্ব আওয়ামী সরকার যখন সমস্যায় জর্জরিত, আর আবুলের ভারে নুয়ে পড়া পদ্মাব্রিজের ন্যয় বাকশালীয় গনতন্ত্রের ভিতর বাস করা এই নৈরাজ্যবাদে বিশ্বজিৎময় বাঙ্গালী যখন নিরাপত্তাহীনতায় বাকরুদ্ব, তখন নতুন বতলে পুরান মদ বেচতে আসছে এরা ! এরা জানে আবেগপ্রবন এই বাঙ্গালীকে কি বেচলে গিলবে !

এখন এরা বলবে, আমরাই একমাত্র দল যারা এই রাজাকারগুলোর বিচার করতে চাই। যাবজ্জীবনের এই মুলা এখন বেচবে। আরে এই মুলা খেয়েই তো তোদের ভোট দিলাম কু*র বাচ্চারা, আবার একি মূলা খাওয়াস কেন? বছর শেষে নির্বাচন, এখন এই ইস্যু নিয়ে বিচারের দাবিতে আবার জনগণকে ফুঁসলিয়ে কিছু নগ্ন ভোটের পায়তারা, নয়তো জনগণকে ব্যস্ত রেখে পালাবার পথ খোঁজা । মনে রাখিস,

♪ আমার মাথায় কাঠাল ভেঙ্গে খাওয়ার দিনতো শেষ,
নাম আমার জনগণ, আমিই বাংলাদেশ ♪
I don't agree with the underlined part... Hawa bhaban will forever symbolise corruption and I really cant see how someone can beat that level of corruption.
At-least the culprits of Halmark ended up in Jail. I cannot imagine something like that happening to Mamun (T.Zia's partner in corruption) if and when BNP was in the realm.

Quick rental was the only solution (short term) for the chronic power crisis inside the country. You can always complain about Govt backed businessman getting the contracts, but this form of corruption is practised even in the most developed countries. The fact is we have almost zero loadshedding now, something that was unimaginable a few years back. Even CPD approved rental power plants before our reserves started to fall, but thanks to Remittance we now have more reserves than ever in history.

Lets not talk about security, Biswajit is not the first and unfortunately he will definitely not be the last. Search Daily star archive for 2000/2001 when BNP came to power and check how many Leagues man was lost to the same kind of brutality. So lets not kid ourselves.

The rest I do agree with you.
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  #59  
Old February 6, 2013, 11:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zunaid
Like Sohel and EQ, I too oppose the death penalty under ALL circumstances. However, under certain conditions, I believe Geneva conventions should be ignored.
Isn't that the same slippery slope Washington took a tumble on after 911? Personally, I wouldn't have any confidence in any singular human to make a call like when human rights can be curtailed for the greater good, because everyone has bias and that will impact decisions made.

Even if the international community got together and reached unanimous or near-unanimous agreement and then ratified a document that states, for example, that in extreme cases (ie. when authorities know for a fact that a person is a terrorist) torture to gain information to save lives is legal, while the document itself is unbiased, its implementation is inevitably down to singular organizations. Since I subscribe to the maxim that its better to let 1000 guilty persons go free than to punish even a single innocent person, I cannot reconcile with such a view.
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  #60  
Old February 6, 2013, 03:25 PM
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You guys know that political prisoners live a charmed life in BD prisons, right? Its not like general population at all. They usually live in separate quarters with a lawn in front for walking. They get newspapers, TVs, cell phones ( smuggled ), food from outside from family, own toilet etc etc.Its not a five star hotel, but not being confined in a 10 ft by 10 ft either. Better to hang 'em, besides they almost always walk free with change in govt, only to be greeted by their own people with garlands after the mighty 'struggle'.
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  #61  
Old February 6, 2013, 04:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beamer
You guys know that political prisoners live a charmed life in BD prisons, right? Its not like general population at all. They usually live in separate quarters with a lawn in front for walking. They get newspapers, TVs, cell phones ( smuggled ), food from outside from family, own toilet etc etc.Its not a five star hotel, but not being confined in a 10 ft by 10 ft either. Better to hang 'em, besides they almost always walk free with change in govt, only to be greeted by their own people with garlands after the mighty 'struggle'.
MK Alamgir's description of life in Kashimpur Jail between Feb. 2007-Oct. 2008 would certainly fit what you have said, Beamer bhai.
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  #62  
Old February 6, 2013, 04:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beamer
You guys know that political prisoners live a charmed life in BD prisons, right? Its not like general population at all. They usually live in separate quarters with a lawn in front for walking. They get newspapers, TVs, cell phones ( smuggled ), food from outside from family, own toilet etc etc.Its not a five star hotel, but not being confined in a 10 ft by 10 ft either. Better to hang 'em, besides they almost always walk free with change in govt, only to be greeted by their own people with garlands after the mighty 'struggle'.
Sounds like federal prisons in USA. You know the white collar criminals who get jail time like Ivan Boesky.
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  #63  
Old February 6, 2013, 07:07 PM
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The punishment based on Bangladeshi Law seems insufficient. Nobody in BD gets imprisonment more than Life Sentence which is 15 years or so in total. This is unacceptable as we generally find people getting prison sentences for 80 years or even 100+ years for multiple crimes in the west. Unfortunately, those laws in BD are obsolete and need serious reformation. I rather like the idea of imprisonment than hanging till death, as life as a prisoner can never be enjoyable no matter how poshly lived. The only thing that can quench the thirst of mango people gathered in Shahbag is a ruling from the Supreme Court that no authoritative person like the President will be allowed to alter his sentences in future to announce sympathetic forgiveness like they do in different national days as part of the celebration. To quell those who are depressed by the thing that he might lead a very pleasant life inside the jail, the same authority can add to their verdict that he won't be allowed to receive division. Considering the specificity of the crime done and current national sentiment such decisions would be more legitimate and should be undertaken instantly.
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Old February 6, 2013, 07:18 PM
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so when is sentence hearing that will lay out the terms of interment - I think it is done already.
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  #65  
Old February 6, 2013, 07:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zsayeed
so when is sentence hearing that will lay out the terms of interment - I think it is done already.
There is no separate sentencing phase as in the US. As there is no jury, the judge also decides the sentencing as part of the deliberation. In the US, while the jury decides the verdict, sentencing is left to the judge.
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  #66  
Old February 6, 2013, 09:19 PM
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Thousands join Shahbagh sit-in

Demand capital punishment for Quader Mollah; protests spread across country



Quote:
Forty-two years after the Liberation War, sentiments of liberation were rekindled as thousands yesterday refused to leave the street and go home until their demand for capital punishment for war criminals were met.



The spontaneous agitation began on Tuesday afternoon shortly after a tribunal gave life sentence to Jamaat leader Abdul Quader Mollah, and continued throughout the night. The occupation of Shahbagh intersection, initiated by bloggers and activist network went on all day yesterday, with the number of people escalating as the day wore on.


The spirit of the protest spread to other parts of the country, with sit-ins and demonstrations taking place in Chittagong, Sylhet, Rajshahi, Rangpur, Sunamganj, Barisal, Rajbari, Noakhali and Narsingdi.
Details
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  #67  
Old February 6, 2013, 09:21 PM
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picture courtesy: bdnews24.com
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  #68  
Old February 6, 2013, 09:24 PM
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Shahbagh to see grand rally Friday

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Amidst a nationwide general strike by the Jamaat-e-Islami, demonstrators demanding death sentence for party’s Assistant Secretary General Abdul Quader Molla have announced to stage a grand rally at the city’s Shahbagh intersection Friday.

The announcement came from a rally which entered its the second day Wednesday.

Mahmudur Haque Munshi, a member of the Blogger and Online Activists Network and one of the organisers of the protests, urged everyone to join the grand rally.

“A rally will begin 8am Thursday at Shahbagh and the grand rally will be held on Friday,” he told bdnews24.com.

He said they would continue their protests until the verdict was reviewed and Molla was awarded the capital punishment.

An announcement from the main stage of the programme said the agitators would stay overnight at the intersection like the previous night.

The agitators have been demonstrating at the Shahbagh intersection since Tuesday evening, after the war crimes tribunal ordered life imprisonment for Molla for 'crimes against humanity' during the 1971 Liberation War.

Thousands of people burst into the streets to protest the verdict of Molla because they felt the punishment was too light. Hours after the verdict was read out at the tribunal, people from all walks of life assembled at the spot.

Sajeda Chowdhury, the Deputy Leader in Parliament, also rushed to the demonstration site.

The protestors have been singing, reciting poems, raising slogans, screening films and making speeches.

They wondered why the Jamaat Assistant Secretary General was given life term instead of a death sentence as “it was proven that Molla had murdered hundreds”.

They promised not to budge until their demand for hanging Molla for the crimes in 1971 was met.

Leaders from several political parties and a group of Dhaka University teachers have also joined the demonstrations.

The freedom fighters have also expressed solidarity with the protests.

Although the spirited protesters had besieged only Shahbagh intersection in the morning, their sit-in programme spread up to the Fine Arts faculty of Dhaka University in the south, Ruposhi Bangla Hotel in the north, Aziz Super Market in the west and Childrens Park in the east by the evening.

Earlier, the demonstrators put on black clothes in front of the Raju Sculpture in protest.

Students of the Faculty of Fine Arts drew images on the streets stretching from Shahbagh to Raju Sculpture demanding capital punishment to Razakars.

People from other surrounding districts of Dhaka have also gathered there.

Prof Rafiqul Hasan, a teacher of the Bangabandhu Agriculture University, rushed to the site from Gazipur as he heard about the demonstration.

He expressed discontent over the verdict. “The verdict has upset the youth,” he said.

He demanded capital punishment to the other war crimes accused as well.

Soumit Shuvra, a Chittagong University student, did not think a second time before coming to Dhaka from Chittagong, nor did Aminul Islam, a businessman from Narayanganj.
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  #69  
Old February 6, 2013, 10:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by One World
The punishment based on Bangladeshi Law seems insufficient. Nobody in BD gets imprisonment more than Life Sentence which is 15 years or so in total. This is unacceptable as we generally find people getting prison sentences for 80 years or even 100+ years for multiple crimes in the west. Unfortunately, those laws in BD are obsolete and need serious reformation. I rather like the idea of imprisonment than hanging till death, as life as a prisoner can never be enjoyable no matter how poshly lived. The only thing that can quench the thirst of mango people gathered in Shahbag is a ruling from the Supreme Court that no authoritative person like the President will be allowed to alter his sentences in future to announce sympathetic forgiveness like they do in different national days as part of the celebration. To quell those who are depressed by the thing that he might lead a very pleasant life inside the jail, the same authority can add to their verdict that he won't be allowed to receive division. Considering the specificity of the crime done and current national sentiment such decisions would be more legitimate and should be undertaken instantly.
Well Mollah has several sentences running concurrently which should technically cover the duration of his life...but how do we know that he won't get presidential clemency ?
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Old February 6, 2013, 11:58 PM
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Granted the Molla Razakar verdict doesn't seem to make sense when compared to that of Bachchu Razakar's, but seeing such a self-righteous lynch mob is deeply disturbing. At least people are showing how serious they are about the process and that's a great thing.
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Old February 7, 2013, 09:35 AM
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Just came back from প্রজন্ম চত্বর (Shahbhag).. Its getting stronger day by day.. More people are getting involved everyday..Another important news is that our national Cricket team just sent their support for this protest and they will be present in Shahbhag at Saturday..

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Old February 7, 2013, 09:45 AM
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I hope Molla is just a starting point and then it addresses our national frustration with politics. Then truly Shahbagh can become our Tahrir Square.
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Old February 7, 2013, 10:24 AM
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^ it will if this protest gets more organised.. Soon it will become a movement... But yeah.. This molla incident was a wake up call.. After a long time this type (i.e. Non political) of protest is happening in our country..

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Last edited by ahnaf; February 7, 2013 at 11:14 AM..
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  #74  
Old February 7, 2013, 10:27 AM
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^^^ I see the words Bangla Boshonto (Bangla Spring) surfacing on the internet

[in the comment section of this PA article: http://www.prothom-alo.com/detail/da...07/news/327555.
Gist of the article: AL joint GS Hanif was forced to get off the stage and leave Shahbag without making a speech]
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Old February 7, 2013, 10:44 AM
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I like the way the people of all age especially young well aware people, should be very careful not to let politicians take away the leading or put a any colour on them. No way should be a Tahrir Square, it was full of a tragedy with lot of loss and blood, then ended up being betrayed, and loss of blood, struggle still goes on.
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