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  #1  
Old January 15, 2014, 03:03 AM
jashan83 jashan83 is offline
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Default ICC mull two-tier Test cricket

World cricket's custodians are to consider a revolutionary proposal to bring relegation and promotion to Test matches as a partial sop to the imminent death of the World Test Championship (WTC).

The ICC executive board is expected to consider the proposal at the next round of meetings later this month, the same gathering expected to end any hopes for the WTC due to the reluctance of broadcasters and the lack of certainty around the format of an event that was postponed from its original 2013 launch date and re-launched for 2017 last October.

ESPNcricinfo understands that the board will instead entertain the promotion/relegation plan, which will open up the possibility of nations like Ireland and Afghanistan earning their way into Test matches while at the same time placing the likes of Zimbabwe and Bangladesh on the precipice. It will be introduced on the "no disadvantage" condition that none of the current ICC Full Member nations would lose that status and its financial advantages.

Instead, the Associate nations will have the chance to press for spots at the Test match table on the basis of performance against the lower-ranked Full Members. This would provide a strong incentive for nations currently playing Test matches to improve themselves while also offering opportunities for Associates to compete at the highest level of the game.

Precise details of how promotion and relegation from Test cricket would work in practice are yet to be revealed, but the concept of play-offs for Test status every four years is believed to be one of the options under consideration. The idea of dividing Test cricket up into two tiers has been debated for some time, with various noted voices on the game expressing opinions on its merits.

In 2013, the former England captain Michael Vaughan suggested that the incentives provided by promotion and relegation would also add context and value to Test cricket, perhaps to the point of dissuading some players from fringe nations prioritising the IPL over representing their country at that time of year.

"Just imagine if New Zealand have to come to England and win one out of three Tests to stay in the first division or win promotion," Vaughan wrote in the Telegraph. "If there is a proper financial incentive to playing in the first division, like there is in football's Premier League, then players would be less likely to choose the IPL instead."

In addition to promotion and relegation, the ICC is expected to consider a further enrichment of the financial rewards on offer to the teams earning the top spot on the governing body's international rankings system, for which the Test Championship Mace is currently awarded on an annual basis. The rankings have continued to function despite an increasing number of diversions from the Future Tours Programme, as nations make bilateral agreements that flout the authority of the officially agreed schedule.

India recently reduced their tour of South Africa to the minimum two Test matches while adding two unscheduled home fixtures against West Indies, while this week it was confirmed that Pakistan's series against Australia in October will be downsized from the earlier agreed three Tests to two.

The ICC have previously flagged that promotion and relegation will become part of the landscape for ODIs, coming into effect following the 2019 World Cup.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci-icc/c...ry/709973.html
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  #2  
Old January 15, 2014, 03:36 AM
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What does 'no disadvantage' mean? That we will start off with Test status but have to fight to keep it? Lol, just when we were actually starting to compete. I think its a great idea if it means IRE and AFG get to play Tests but terrible if there is even a chance we could lose status and the few chances to play the top 4 teams. Lets see how the BCB handles this. My guess is teams like WI, NZ, SL, PAK will not stand for an official second tier status. Unfortunately I can see that IND, AUS, and ENG will have the only 3 votes that count. A drawn series vs SL should go some ways to pressing our case. ZIM may have won a fluke Test against PAK, but if we can draw 5 Tests out of 6 over the course of a year we can make a case for ourselves.

I hope 2 tiers of 6 is one possible proposal.
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  #3  
Old January 15, 2014, 04:06 AM
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Tier 1-SA
2-ENG,AUS,IND
3-PAK,SL,WI,NZ
4-BD,ZIM
5-IRE,AFG

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  #4  
Old January 15, 2014, 04:15 AM
jashan83 jashan83 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by al Furqaan
What does 'no disadvantage' mean? That we will start off with Test status but have to fight to keep it? Lol, just when we were actually starting to compete. I think its a great idea if it means IRE and AFG get to play Tests but terrible if there is even a chance we could lose status and the few chances to play the top 4 teams. Lets see how the BCB handles this. My guess is teams like WI, NZ, SL, PAK will not stand for an official second tier status. Unfortunately I can see that IND, AUS, and ENG will have the only 3 votes that count. A drawn series vs SL should go some ways to pressing our case. ZIM may have won a fluke Test against PAK, but if we can draw 5 Tests out of 6 over the course of a year we can make a case for ourselves.

I hope 2 tiers of 6 is one possible proposal.
By no disadvantage I guess they mean that teams in Div 2 if want to play tests with Div 1 can go ahead. So if Zim convinces Aus to tour them then it is allowed. Also the voting structure and the massive ICC funding to Full Members will not change.

On the tiers I prefer Tier 1 of 8 teams and Tier 2 of 4 to 6 teams. Initially BD might go in Div 2 as per present ranking but they have every chance to make it to Div 1 in few years. In Div 1 it will get good chances to play the Top teams. If the Tiers are made 6 each them it makes it very difficult for BD to reach Div 1.
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  #5  
Old January 15, 2014, 04:22 AM
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This would be good. Basically they are planning to make 2 groups.. 5 teams each.

1st tier should be
South Africa
India
Australia
England
Pakistan

Tier 2
Sri Lanka
New Zealand
West Indies
Bangladesh
Zimbabwe

This will be very good for our cricket and will mean more frequent faceoffs between the other 4 teams. For next 5 years... sounds like a plan. But if they decide to include Afghanistan and Ireland and than bump up no.6 to Tier 1, than not so good as we will probably be left to face New Zealand, West Indies Zimbabwe, Ireland and Afghanistan for the majority.

I think every year, the winner of the intercontinental cup should be allowed to play tier 2. It doesnt make sense to allow 2 new test nations at once but allowing 1 team makes sense. Also the worst performer of Tier 2 should be relegated to play the intercontinental or Tier 3.
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  #6  
Old January 15, 2014, 04:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by al Furqaan
ZIM may have won a fluke Test against PAK, but if we can draw 5 Tests out of 6 over the course of a year we can make a case for ourselves.
It was no fluke. Zimbabwe had a first innings lead in both Tests and won one of the ODIs as well.
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  #7  
Old January 15, 2014, 05:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by al Furqaan
What does 'no disadvantage' mean? That we will start off with Test status but have to fight to keep it? Lol, just when we were actually starting to compete. I think its a great idea if it means IRE and AFG get to play Tests but terrible if there is even a chance we could lose status and the few chances to play the top 4 teams. Lets see how the BCB handles this. My guess is teams like WI, NZ, SL, PAK will not stand for an official second tier status. Unfortunately I can see that IND, AUS, and ENG will have the only 3 votes that count. A drawn series vs SL should go some ways to pressing our case. ZIM may have won a fluke Test against PAK, but if we can draw 5 Tests out of 6 over the course of a year we can make a case for ourselves.

I hope 2 tiers of 6 is one possible proposal.
a test win can not be a fluke
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  #8  
Old January 15, 2014, 05:13 AM
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al Furqaan al Furqaan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by battye
It was no fluke. Zimbabwe had a first innings lead in both Tests and won one of the ODIs as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Night_wolf
a test win can not be a fluke
What I meant was that it is unlikely to occur again until it does occur again. ZIM may not even play another match ever, at the rate they're going. Plus it was PAK a team that can lose to anybody on the rigt day either by incompetence or even possibly by design.
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  #9  
Old January 15, 2014, 07:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by al Furqaan
What I meant was that it is unlikely to occur again until it does occur again. ZIM may not even play another match ever, at the rate they're going. Plus it was PAK a team that can lose to anybody on the rigt day either by incompetence or even possibly by design.
i agree pak team can lose to anybody anyday, they are unpredictable but to win a test a single bad day wont do, so zim deserved that win because they played well and took 20 wickets, something we will only take playing cricket 07
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  #10  
Old January 15, 2014, 07:45 AM
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what ICC is taking is a Big Risk with this tier system IMHO

as long as India remains in 1st Tier this could work, but what happens if india drops down?, then India cant tour Aus SA ENG, and vice versa..how would then AUS SA and ENG get share of the money that india make?
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  #11  
Old January 15, 2014, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Night_wolf
what ICC is taking is a Big Risk with this tier system IMHO

as long as India remains in 1st Tier this could work, but what happens if india drops down?, then India cant tour Aus SA ENG, and vice versa..how would then AUS SA and ENG get share of the money that india make?
yes.u got a important point ICC 60% Rev come frm india.

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  #12  
Old January 15, 2014, 09:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Night_wolf
what ICC is taking is a Big Risk with this tier system IMHO

as long as India remains in 1st Tier this could work, but what happens if india drops down?, then India cant tour Aus SA ENG, and vice versa..how would then AUS SA and ENG get share of the money that india make?
This will be a big concern with this plan. Also we've often seen boards like the SLC and WICB get in a financial muddle and depend on tours from India to put them back in the black. As things stand both these teams will end up in Tier 2 and I can't see why they'd agree to such a plan. One way to circumvent this is to have enough space in the schedule so that teams can have short tours with each other which have no bearing on the rankings - in essence they'd just be exhibition matches. And also the seasons must not be long, ideally 2 years or less, so that teams don't have to wait 4-5 years to be promoted to the elite tier.
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  #13  
Old January 15, 2014, 09:20 AM
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Though an unpopular statement with 'Purists', Test cricket is not worth saving. It can be kept around for its nostalgia feel but its time for ICC to back away from it and leave it to the individual boards.

1. There is no point in trying to expand to IRE, AFG etc. until Test Cricket is a viable investment where it can support itself withough being funded through the profits of ODIs and T20s

2. For those that point to 'Test Cricket is alive and well based on last year', the truth is that Test Cricket is alive and well in AUS, ENG and to a degree in SA and IND (when these two teams do well). Lack of respect for BD and ZIM despite their recent results are proof of that. Nobody other than the die hard fans of that country care for TESTs involving SL, NZ, PAK, WI, BD and ZIM. The fact that broadcasters can't find comfort in a return on investment on a TEST CHAMPIONSHIP says it all

3. Remove the permanent membership contingency with Test Status and expand the voting block in ICC. You can give special membership to the existing 10 where their votes carry heavier weight.

I say do away with the FTP and only have fixed limited overs tournaments (including qualifications as necessary), maybe throw in a bi-annual ODI league and leave the rest fo the boards. AUS/ENG can schedule their Ashes as long as it is not to the detriment of the fixed tournaments. Other boards can schedule Tests if they so choose with each other but it will have no context in the larger scheme of things.

T20 should be allowed to shine and become the flag-bearer for cricket as that is where the future lies for expansion, Olympics fixture etc.
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  #14  
Old January 15, 2014, 04:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Night_wolf
what ICC is taking is a Big Risk with this tier system IMHO

as long as India remains in 1st Tier this could work, but what happens if india drops down?, then India cant tour Aus SA ENG, and vice versa..how would then AUS SA and ENG get share of the money that india make?
I highly doubt India will ever fall out of the top tier, although they were always a 5th or worse ranked team up till the 2000s. The main issue is will the likes of WI, NZ, PAK, SL go along with being placed in a 2nd tier. I hope not.

This solution won't make Tests better. It will only benefit the top 4 even more. They should just leave it as is. There are only 9 viable Test teams and adding IRE and eventually AFG will make it 11. A de facto tier system already exists.
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Old January 15, 2014, 08:26 PM
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I think 1st tier will be about 8 teams.
South Africa
India
Australia
England
Pakistan
Srilanka
West Indies
New Zealand

And 2nd tier will be:
Bangladesh
Zimbabwe
Ireland
Afghanistan
Scotland (Maybe)
Kenya (maybe)

The top team of 2nd tier may replace the bottom team of 1st tier every 2 years or so. Poor West Indies and NZ will be under threat if this happens.
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Old January 16, 2014, 01:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by al Furqaan
I highly doubt India will ever fall out of the top tier, although they were always a 5th or worse ranked team up till the 2000s. The main issue is will the likes of WI, NZ, PAK, SL go along with being placed in a 2nd tier. I hope not.

This solution won't make Tests better. It will only benefit the top 4 even more. They should just leave it as is. There are only 9 viable Test teams and adding IRE and eventually AFG will make it 11. A de facto tier system already exists.
If India falls out of the Tier 1 then it will be a disaster for sure. But given the current world cricket situation they may take this risk with confidence.

On the other hand will the Tier system make any difference to us? I am not sure. Currenlty we are not getting enough matches, we have been playing the unofficial Tier 2 teams for the last 3 years or so. We haven't played with SA, AUS or India for quite long time, so I am not too much botherd about this. but will the Tier system bring more matches for us? I don't think so unless our board will bring some extra series for us, well that can happen with the existing system too.

I don't like the tier based theory and I am certian that NZ, WI, ZIm, Pak will not like it either. The so called posh teams like to distinguish themselves in many ways and this Tier theory is another way to do so. I have enough doubt that the 'posh' teams will be able to implement it.

Is ICC doing it? I don't think so. If the ICC really wanted to get more teams playing the Test cricket then they would have allowed teams like AFG/IRE tour the top teams more often. They didn't do it cause there is no money there.

This Tier theory is a conspiracy of the elite teams. Nothing else.
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  #17  
Old January 16, 2014, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cricketboy
I think 1st tier will be about 8 teams.
South Africa
India
Australia
England
Pakistan
Srilanka
West Indies
New Zealand

And 2nd tier will be:
Bangladesh
Zimbabwe
Ireland
Afghanistan
Scotland (Maybe)
Kenya (maybe)

The top team of 2nd tier may replace the bottom team of 1st tier every 2 years or so. Poor West Indies and NZ will be under threat if this happens.
I don't think 8/8 teams tier will work. Only Bangladesh has proper first class structure and general infrastructure. Zim is in strike again, Ireland has only 1 or 2 grounds at most, and AFG and rest has no infrastructure to sustain long term cricket.
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  #18  
Old January 16, 2014, 10:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cricketboy
I think 1st tier will be about 8 teams.
South Africa
India
Australia
England
Pakistan
Srilanka
West Indies
New Zealand

And 2nd tier will be:
Bangladesh
Zimbabwe
Ireland
Afghanistan
Scotland (Maybe)
Kenya (maybe)

The top team of 2nd tier may replace the bottom team of 1st tier every 2 years or so. Poor West Indies and NZ will be under threat if this happens.

That will be bad. I think most likeley will be 6 team each. That will be much better case for us than 8 team each.

As long as we get more games I am ok, if we are good enough, eventually nobody will be able to stop us mocing to the top tier, it will be a matter of time. moving to tier one will motivate us to play harder. I hope they again don't change the goal post.
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Old January 17, 2014, 02:52 PM
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there is relegation exception for IND,AUS, ENG. These 3 teams will never be relegated.http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci-icc/c...ry/710723.html
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Old January 17, 2014, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CricketPagolChele
there is relegation exception for IND,AUS, ENG. These 3 teams will never be relegated.http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci-icc/c...ry/710723.html
Now the real ugly picture behind the two tier is showing up.

They should kick out this three nations out of ICC and let them have their own association and lt them play as many times as they want against each outer.

From the fans point of view, we don't love cricket for money. Also I think too much money flowing from Indian T20 league is destroying the game. Without these three evil power, eventually it will be better for world cricket.

I say for the rest of the nations... take control of ICC....kick these three conspirator out...promote couple of more countries....strict ban on particiaption on any tournament organized by these three nations ....cricket will be just fine without them.
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Old January 17, 2014, 06:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazal
Now the real ugly picture behind the two tier is showing up.

They should kick out this three nations out of ICC and let them have their own association and lt them play as many times as they want against each outer.

From the fans point of view, we don't love cricket for money. Also I think too much money flowing from Indian T20 league is destroying the game. Without these three evil power, eventually it will be better for world cricket.

I say for the rest of the nations... take control of ICC....kick these three conspirator out...promote couple of more countries....strict ban on particiaption on any tournament organized by these three nations ....cricket will be just fine without them.
Bhai ICC= BCCI+ECB+CA. All others are supporting members.
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Old January 17, 2014, 06:16 PM
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Cricket will be done for good. I can't believe this is actually happening. How much more power do they need? They already control everything as it is. Huge middle finger to the "Gentleman's Game". Gentleman my a**
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Old January 17, 2014, 08:24 PM
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Whats done is done and what will happen will happen. No point bitching although for the record I will say what is transpiring is a shame and a travesty of common sense and decency.

That being said, how do we - BCB in particular - move forward? We won't know till the full details are revealed and endorced. But for the purposes of discussion it seems the absolute worst case scenario is now going to be reality.

Firstly the Slaving Seven should strengthen ties between themselves as we're all in the same boat. We are now rank beggers each and everybone and beggers cannot afford to have principles. Now is the time to beg BCCI/CA/ECB for any firm fixtures we can get.

If we cannot, I do fear countries like SL and ZIM may collapse completely. Here is my take on a scenario were the Slaving Seven are totally cut off from the Tyranical Trio:

SA will survive quite well as long as they are top ranked and considered worthy opponents. Being a minority sport, cricket will struggle if they drop down the rankings.

PAK have a fairly strong fanbase but the lack of home fixtures will squeeze them. Still, with enough LOIs they may just eke out a survival. PAK does have the potential to displace SA at winners square, but they will need to find much more talent in both the bowling and batting departments to do so.

SL relies on BBCI handouts to get by. If they lose that, they will sink since cricket isnnot that popular relative to the rest of the SC.

WI can actually be viable due to the success of the CPL. That can fund them quite well.

NZ are another tiny market team like SL. If they survive it will be because they have a devoloped economy.

BD are in trouble. If we fix the BPL, we will also be able to fund ourselves well. We have a cricket crazy public and if local broadcasters step up, we can at least survive. BPL broadcast quality was great. We will be much poorer than we are now, but perhaps we be 'comfy' instead of 'ballin'.

ZIM are already dead. The new situation just means they can't be resurrected.

IRE could possibly be viable as a test nation but as of now AFG will likely not be no matter how good theirnteam may become.
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Old January 17, 2014, 08:51 PM
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India Aus and Eng should form their own ICC and play with each other all year long..how low can you get..gali astese
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Old January 17, 2014, 08:57 PM
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one guy in cricinfo mentioned that are Man U, Real Madrid, Barcelona etc have exception from relegation?, if you are good enough you know you wont be relegated, you only think abut exception when deep down you know you suck
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