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  #26  
Old March 7, 2014, 05:52 AM
imtiaz82 imtiaz82 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nadim
We lost the game because of our middle and lower order batsmans. Period!
We could have said that, if we won close matches against Pakistan, Afghanistan & lost only this game. But after watching all the matches closely, the biggest drawback of the team seems to be the captaincy.. In a match it is possible that one day batting won't click, or the bowlers will have an off day; but usually that is compensated by aggressive captaincy and innovative field placing.

In the the matches we lost in 2014, Mushfiq got rid of the pressure on the opposition batsmen by defensive field placing and bringing in the wrong bowler. He needs to finish games off and not hold back the best bowlers till the end. Even against Pakistan, people say we lost due to Afridi, but before he got to the crease Mushfiq let off the pressure by allowing a big partnership.

Finally, the worst part is, he did not learn a single thing over the 2 weeks, he repeated the exact same mistake in every match! This is unacceptable at an international level.
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  #27  
Old March 7, 2014, 06:07 AM
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Some people are not capable of learning, let alone innovation. They will make same mistakes over and over and over again. But that's why there are coaches? What do they do?
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  #28  
Old March 7, 2014, 08:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imtiaz82
We could have said that, if we won close matches against Pakistan, Afghanistan & lost only this game. But after watching all the matches closely, the biggest drawback of the team seems to be the captaincy.. In a match it is possible that one day batting won't click, or the bowlers will have an off day; but usually that is compensated by aggressive captaincy and innovative field placing.

In the the matches we lost in 2014, Mushfiq got rid of the pressure on the opposition batsmen by defensive field placing and bringing in the wrong bowler. He needs to finish games off and not hold back the best bowlers till the end. Even against Pakistan, people say we lost due to Afridi, but before he got to the crease Mushfiq let off the pressure by allowing a big partnership.

Finally, the worst part is, he did not learn a single thing over the 2 weeks, he repeated the exact same mistake in every match! This is unacceptable at an international level.
it is quite easy to blame it all on luck. I am sad that none of our sports reporter community could bring up these issues to mushy's attention when it was clear as broad daylight to our foreign commentators. The entire setup including Mushy lack the level of knowledge that even Russel Arnold seems to have. The whole tournament we couldn't figure out the right combination...bringing people in...throwing people out. The pain will continue in the ICC T-20. One look at the squad and we know Razzak and Reza will cost us more games.
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  #29  
Old March 7, 2014, 08:49 AM
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11. Never learning from mistakes. (This, IMHO, is his biggest shortcoming.)
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  #30  
Old March 7, 2014, 09:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rinathq
this guy has a good gameplan from the beginning... but the problem is, he doesnt adjust the plans when required. He goes with the same flow. when he plans the bowl the part timers during the middle he stick with it no matter how much the condition demands the main bowlers. When he plans to bowl spinners, no matter how much his spinners gets trashed he keeps bringing them back on...

The thing is, you can plan all you want and be all creative before the game, but if you dont have the ability to replan DURING the match.... you are not a good captain
And, opposition will adjust as the games goes on. Just thinking about these matches makes me sick!

I am now sure that he will not improve in the areas where he is deficient. He has not shown an ability to improve. At all.
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  #31  
Old March 7, 2014, 04:21 PM
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12. Overworking effective bowlers. Robiul and Shakib are the most recent examples.
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  #32  
Old March 7, 2014, 04:59 PM
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Does this information anyhow goes to player or team management, otherwise its useless to point out any of the faults.
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  #33  
Old March 7, 2014, 08:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mij
Does this information anyhow goes to player or team management, otherwise its useless to point out any of the faults.
Good question, does it?
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  #34  
Old March 8, 2014, 12:53 AM
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13. Overusing Robiul in Zimbabwe. The poor lad bowled 100 overs! Completely burnt him out
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  #35  
Old March 8, 2014, 03:34 AM
imtiaz82 imtiaz82 is offline
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Just watched a TV show today with Athar Ali as the special guest; he also pointed out the exact same things we have been mentioning in the forum in terms of Mushfiq's captaincy. It's obvious that coaches and team management also realizes this (after all that's their job); I think Mushy is just not capable to learn and implement the advises on the field.
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  #36  
Old March 8, 2014, 05:05 AM
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It is easy to be critical when you're losing, despite the fact that the same old shite may exist even when we squeeze out a win. Conversely, all is overlooked and forgiven when you win. So I'll have to take Ata's sudden epiphany with a grain of bit lobon.

The awful truth is that most of our BCB matobbors, including most former players, are made of the same stuff and don't think Mushfiq is doing anything wrong by adhering to the script regardless of match situation. Some may have an occasional issue about how he uses his bowlers every now and then, but his passive and often suicidal field setting is at par with their "prevent the boundary and allow easy singles" philosophy. They don't get how rhythm mitigates pressure and eventually establishes the platform for timely acceleration with wickets in hand. In other words, they're clueless idiots. Like him, they too believe that wickets primarily fall only due to unforced batting error, and a lethal delivery is an anomalous bonus. KM Pilot is the only guy I know of who's critical of Mushfiq's abilities on the field. He's repeatedly referred to as "captain fantastic" not only because of his legitimate prowess with the bat, but also because he's easier to control. Their major issue with Shakib has always been his critical attitude, and the fact he rightfully questions and speaks the hard truth about their qualification to influence the game at this level.
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Last edited by Sohel; March 8, 2014 at 05:46 AM..
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  #37  
Old March 8, 2014, 10:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imtiaz82
Just watched a TV show today with Athar Ali as the special guest; he also pointed out the exact same things we have been mentioning in the forum in terms of Mushfiq's captaincy. It's obvious that coaches and team management also realizes this (after all that's their job); I think Mushy is just not capable to learn and implement the advises on the field.
I think Atahar is saying all that because he heard Gavaskar and co say it. None of our former players would have done anything differently if they were captain
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  #38  
Old March 8, 2014, 11:37 AM
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You learn and apply.
At least, give credit to Athar when he is speaking on the open media about poor captaincy. The selectors and BCB are failing to see the issue.
Athar took the point and brought it out in the air!
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  #39  
Old March 8, 2014, 12:42 PM
imtiaz82 imtiaz82 is offline
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So how many of you actually think that Mushy is going to learn from the Asia cup? I have a feeling that captaincy and aggressiveness is a natural thing, it would be hard to get someone trained for it.. Maybe he will try to rotate the bowlers a little bit more after all the criticism, but when the crunch time comes he is again going to be defensive and let the opposition run away with the game..
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  #40  
Old March 8, 2014, 01:37 PM
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sohel bhai you got me convinced. mushy is not good enough captain. i agree, we woulndt have lost all those close matches with better captaincy....

i am actually beginning to like the idea of bringing shak back as capt.... we got better sets of players now.... you my friend are what i call a visionary....when it comes to cricket..
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  #41  
Old March 21, 2014, 12:57 AM
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Even though the batsman failed miserably I think the Hongkong game was close enough to be won by BD and i would blame Mushy and his tactics for this loss also

Mushy needs to get the basic objectives right:
i) The new ball is only effective for a short period of time. After it loses its shine or the batsman get set whatever little movement we get will not be effective anymore.
Action to be taken as Captain: Get close in catches in terms of slip fielders and gully so that we can try and get the early breakthroughs. It is the same if we are searching for a wicket in the middle of the game... get men in catching positions!

ii) When you attack you got to be prepared to concede some boundaries for the wicket you are searching for
Action to be taken as Captain: don't freakin take away the slips and gully after one boundary

iii) Pressure of runs brings wickets
Action to be taken as Captain: for gods sake keep fielders in the ring and save the singles even at the expense of few boundaries. It was criminal to let Hongkong milk singles so easily.. we should have invited them to go for it in order to pickup wickets

iv) Whatever your bowling plan is prior to the game can be changed according to match situation
Action to be taken as Captain: If a bowler is getting hammered for boundaries and not bowling decent line and length don't bring him back during CRUCIAL situations (farhad reza or Razzak vs Pakistan)

v) Do not follow theory blindly
Action to be taken as Captain: Off Spinners CAN bowl to righ handers and SLA's can bowl to left handers... so get your best bowlers in operation when you are searching for a wicket.
Dew affects spinners but it doesn't mean you have to resort to super part timers bowling seam up deliveries. If your spinners are more economical despite the dew please persist with them instead of using crap seam options.
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  #42  
Old March 21, 2014, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jadukor
Even though the batsman failed miserably I think the Hongkong game was close enough to be won by BD and i would blame Mushy and his tactics for this loss also

Mushy needs to get the basic objectives right:
i) The new ball is only effective for a short period of time. After it loses its shine or the batsman get set whatever little movement we get will not be effective anymore.
Action to be taken as Captain: Get close in catches in terms of slip fielders and gully so that we can try and get the early breakthroughs. It is the same if we are searching for a wicket in the middle of the game... get men in catching positions!

ii) When you attack you got to be prepared to concede some boundaries for the wicket you are searching for
Action to be taken as Captain: don't freakin take away the slips and gully after one boundary

iii) Pressure of runs brings wickets
Action to be taken as Captain: for gods sake keep fielders in the ring and save the singles even at the expense of few boundaries. It was criminal to let Hongkong milk singles so easily.. we should have invited them to go for it in order to pickup wickets

iv) Whatever your bowling plan is prior to the game can be changed according to match situation
Action to be taken as Captain: If a bowler is getting hammered for boundaries and not bowling decent line and length don't bring him back during CRUCIAL situations (farhad reza or Razzak vs Pakistan)

v) Do not follow theory blindly
Action to be taken as Captain: Off Spinners CAN bowl to righ handers and SLA's can bowl to left handers... so get your best bowlers in operation when you are searching for a wicket.
Dew affects spinners but it doesn't mean you have to resort to super part timers bowling seam up deliveries. If your spinners are more economical despite the dew please persist with them instead of using crap seam options.
Mushy's captaincy is questionable and maybe it is time to look into Shakib as a viable replacement. But sometimes the criticisms seem very out of place.

Your point 1,2,3 are exact same things - having close in fielders. So adding more bullet points is just inflating the grievances. In the last over we had close fielders. If number 9 and 10 HK batsmen can play uppishly or even hit 6 off Razzak then we can imagine what other better batsmen will do.

Beside Shakib, we just don't have any other bowlers who can contain runs and create that pressure to take wickets. Razzak had the ability but now that's a distant memory.

After 2 bad overs, he took Razzak off. But then he bowled a good 3rd over and Mushy had no choice but to let him bowl the last over.

Regarding following the script, he let Nasir bowl in Nepal match. He gave 1 run in the first over. So he gave another over. If he didn't then he would have been questioned as to why after such a great over Nasir was not bowled more. But then Nasir got hammered. In the HK match, he then let Shabbir bowled a crucial 19th over and he did well.

You have to understand that in T20 captains gamble. Some times it works (having AlAmin back early for his second spell against Nepal and he got 2 wickets) and sometimes it doesn't (Reza/Razzak).

As I said early, some of Mushy's decisions are mind baffling. But we are looking for a scapegoat and he is an easy target. Give specific examples instead of general comments (have close in fielders) then we can better identify exact mistakes.

My biggest criticism for him is his inability to pick correct 11. Yes, Faruk messed up the 15 but its Mushy/SJ who decides 11. Razzak/Reza playing while Momin/Gazi warming bench is strange.
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  #43  
Old March 21, 2014, 11:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mufi_02
As I said early, some of Mushy's decisions are mind baffling. But we are looking for a scapegoat and he is an easy target.
Because he, himself make it easy for fans to make himself an easy target. Besides on-field cricket related gaffles and team selection, his is performing poorly what used to be his strength at the first place.

How often you see a national team captain of any team cry on the field? Team ususally pick the characteristics of the captain in the team. Now we have see the whole team cry all together after a game.
How often do you see a good captain pick a newbie in the team as scape goat (in media brieding) to divert heat from him?
How often you have seen a good captain try to justify their team selection with more confusing explaination
How often have you seen a good captain, after failing in the field (the easiest possible stump) bark at a young (and pretty good fielder) player's fault and abuse his power as the captain?
How often you see a good captain shamelessly favaout a group of under performers a while thow some young but performing players under the bus?

The list can go on and on....

Yes now a days Rahim is the easy scape goat for the fans. But if anybody need to be blamed, it's himself who should be blamed, he made himslef easier by his own actions. He is showing no leadership characterisitcs at all.
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  #44  
Old March 21, 2014, 12:19 PM
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How often you see a national team captain of any team cry on the field? Team ususally pick the characteristics of the captain in the team. Now we have see the whole team cry all together after a game.
--Just today, I saw William Porterfield totally dejected and almost crying. (Asia cup was an exception, where ice cool players like Shakib and the whole nation cried)

How often do you see a good captain pick a newbie in the team as scape goat (in media brieding) to divert heat from him?
--he said in recent press briefing, "maybe its my fault I am falling short of leading"

How often you have seen a good captain try to justify their team selection with more confusing explaination
-- Michael Clarke with selecting Shaun Marsh for the SA series.

How often have you seen a good captain, after failing in the field (the easiest possible stump) bark at a young (and pretty good fielder) player's fault and abuse his power as the captain?
-- Michael Clarke once again abusing and getting rid of Simon Katich and then slowly fading Hussey out

How often you see a good captain shamelessly favaout a group of under performers a while thow some young but performing players under the bus?
-- Dhoni persisting with Rohit Sharma, Raina. And of course Jadeja. While consistently not giving chance to Rahane, Badrinath.

I can come up with many more excuses from Ganguly,Hafeez, Cook captaincies.
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  #45  
Old March 21, 2014, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mufi_02
I can come up with many more excuses from Ganguly,Hafeez, Cook captaincies.
They all made (themsleves) an easy target (by fans) to attack by their action even though Ganguly was pretty decent captain. In top of it, unlike those three Rahim is not a good captain on the field.

Hafeez also have the same problem like Rahim. He make mistakes on the field (run outs) and then he yells to his partner as if its his fault. And see where PAK team is going. They wins by individual performance, not as a team.


So it's no surprise why fans are blaming Rahim now a days.
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  #46  
Old March 21, 2014, 12:31 PM
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he is good batsmen and one of the best of ours no doubt... occasional brian fart understandable as long as it does not happen too often..but he seems to be talking like the politicians and CEOs only finding explanations of excuses. Sometimes he talks like normally without the sugar coating but then he gets into trouble too. But he himself admitted once they are slow learners hope he himself include that too. He needs a good training also in tactics, strategy management and those should not come from our incompetent selectors or BCB officials. Coach should give that but it seems it's not working. If one process does not work, you all know what needs to be done with that process. But in BD will it really work?
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  #47  
Old March 21, 2014, 12:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazal
They all made easy target (by fans) to attack by their action even though Ganguly was pretty decent captain. In top of it, unlike those three Rahim is not a good captain on the field.

So it's no surprise why fans are blaming Rahim now a days.
true that all fans are now aware of can see themselves what he is doing in field as captain using several resources, media, news etc. But even anybody else comes in his place, the core issue is not fixed, so it will just have a temp solution.
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  #48  
Old March 21, 2014, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazal
They all made (themsleves) an easy target (by fans) to attack by their action even though Ganguly was pretty decent captain. In top of it, unlike those three Rahim is not a good captain on the field.

Hafeez also have the same problem like Rahim. He make mistakes on the field (run outs) and then he yells to his partner as if its his fault. And see where PAK team is going. They wins by individual performance, not as a team.


So it's no surprise why fans are blaming Rahim now a days.
You asked many questions with "how often" and I gave very specific answers to them. Books can be written about Hafeez, Shoaib Malik, Younis Khan's (excluding Misbah) captaincy blunders. Only through sheer raw talent and some marquee players is how Pak remains competitive. Unfortunately we lack that.

We are all frustrated about Mushy's captaincy. I think Shakib should take over T20 captaincy. It's time we start rotating.

That being said, most of Mushy's criticisms are just general ideas and lacking specificity. We need to blame someone and so we go to him. 1-2 start blaming, then few joins in, then some chimes in with big words, and voila!! Mushy is the culprit. We will be hell-bent to prove our analysis right rather than eat that humble pie when we are wrong.

I don't care if my whole observation about Mushy is wrong. I don't mind being wrong a thousand times. I was wrong about Anamul and so many other instances. If you can discuss specific instances, the overs, the powerplays, the players then I will change my views. Team jitlei hoise, nijer right/wrong analysis er kheta puri.
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  #49  
Old March 21, 2014, 01:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mufi_02
You asked many questions with "how often" and I gave very specific answers to them. Books can be written about Hafeez, Shoaib Malik, Younis Khan's (excluding Misbah) captaincy blunders. Only through sheer raw talent and some marquee players is how Pak remains competitive. Unfortunately we lack that.
Thanks for answering my question. And your annser doesn't conrtradicts my mian point. If you read my comments, the main point is: sometimes a person, by his own act, makes him vulnerable to public and therefore is mainly responsible for the blame he gets.

In Rahim's case, that is the case. Yes he is the favorite scape goat, but his own action is not helping him but responsible for making hard situation even harder. And its no wonder, regadless how he hard he is trying to divert heat from him by throwing his new players under the bus, eventually his action indirectly creating more presuree on him.

Fans are not necessarily stupid and will believe all the noinsense he says in the media and believe all the contradictory statements he says to save is sorry rear.

He didn;t give a break to his young players, Why anyone would expect that some fans will give him a break?
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  #50  
Old March 21, 2014, 01:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazal
Thanks for answering my question. And your annser doesn't conrtradicts my mian point. If you read my comments, the main point is: sometimes a person, by his own act, makes him vulnerable to public and therefore is mainly responsible for the blame he gets.

In Rahim's case, that is the case. Yes he is the favorite scape goat, but his own action is not helping him but responsible for making hard situation even harder.
Yeah I get your point. But my view is that it's not Mushy's captaincy but rather than whole management/selection/indiv. players who are bigger culprits. Mushy is lacking in those areas as well and have many areas to improve.

With players like Reza/Razzak we can't win. We only have one great bowler in Shakib and that's not enough. Others have to step in if we want to beat anyone in Super 10.
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