why its OK to mess up sometimes...

[al Furqaan]

Sounds like Ash, doesn't it? And that dismissal just 2 odd overs before the close of the session.

And once again a wicket has fallen just before the break. India won't like it, Australia will be more than happy.

Dravid and Yuvvy both got out the very last ball of the session.

All this is said to show one thing: give us some time. Its quite laughable after one bad showing against New Zealand - first match of the series in testing conditions - that members start with the doom and gloom. "its time to drop so and so..." etc.

We need patience. We constantly criticize our batsman for not having the necessary patience, but we forget to practice that ourselves. Has any team traversed a gap as wide as ours in shorter time? Answer the question please.

Ten years ago, I was introduced to the strangest sport humankind knows: cricket. Given that we had beaten Kenya in the ICC Trophy Finals and in so doing, qualified for our first ever World Cup, no conversation was complete without talking about cricket ad naseum. And so I came to enjoy the game.

But 10 years ago, in the summer of 1997, our team was vastly different. Merely taking the field was victory in and of itself, to speak nothing of defeats by triple digits or 10 wickets.

But in just 10 years, we have improved to the point where we expect ourselves to be in a position to win any game, against any team. Could progress be any more rapid? Is it conceivable that a team in some other sport could travel such a distance in class in so little time as a decade?

If fellows like Dravid and Tendulkar make mistakes such as these, given their years of dedication, hard work, and understanding, then what should our players do?

[Electrequiem]

Word, Al Furqan. As I watched Tendy's wicket fall, my thoughts were verbatim!

[al Furqaan]

Originally Posted by Electrequiem
Word, Al Furqan. As I watched Tendy's wicket fall, my thoughts were verbatim!

didn't actually watch the match. just my thoughts in general.

that having been said, mashrafee is playing quite toothlessly. he might need a drop before the test series starts. just for psychological reasons.

[Electrequiem]

Originally Posted by al Furqaan
didn't actually watch the match. just my thoughts in general.

that having been said, mashrafee is playing quite toothlessly. he might need a drop before the test series starts. just for psychological reasons.

Mash, with both the ball and the bat, has been very dissappointing. But I'd still hope to see him in the test series ... and speaking of pacers, what of Sajid? Is he bowling tomorrow?

[Nafis_BD]

Yes great point Asad bhaiya. But our problem is that we mess up but not sometimes, instead we mess up consistently and in their (or the other better teams') case they mess up only sometimes!!

[One World]

I understand the context you put up there but you need to understand that its Australia, India playing against with and its Bret Lee who is making all the trouble which giving a great cause to the other bowler (Clarke in this scenario) to pick up some wickets as well. Few days back when India was playing Pakistan on their soil they made Shoaib Akhtar look so ordinary and piled up heaps of runs against one of the best pace attack on paper. Tendulkar after a career as follows

Tests	142	229	24	11289	248*	55.06			37	47		42	93	0
ODIs	407	397	37	15962	186*	44.33	18669	85.50	41	87	1747	166	120	0

does anybody really cares if he makes a mistake in one test match while much capable younger fokes are also having trouble playing overseas and the top ranked test nation of the world. Surprisingly Ganguly is still not out when Indian middle order is ripped through. It happened to Srilanka few days back and I have no doubt either Pak, WI or NZ all would have struggled against this real professional team.

The analogy might be close but the pictures are slight different. Bangladesh was playing the weakest NZ team ever in this decade and we had a good start. Siddons while blaming Ash and Tamim has reasons that he as most of the fan base here agrees that Lara, Tendulkar, Pontings are not made in a day but on their day they cannot make mistakes. That was Ash's day and that differentiates him with all these averages and records from those in the price of a hapless defeat.

As Sohel_NR says "peace".

[al-Sagar]

beside occasional failure they have done lots of brillant things.

our players have done less brillant things and more stupid failures.

[al Furqaan]

Originally Posted by Nafis_BD
Yes great point Asad bhaiya. But our problem is that we mess up but not sometimes, instead we mess up consistently and in their (or the other better teams') case they mess up only sometimes!!

the other teams have far more experience. we're new here.

[al Furqaan]

thats very very true, one world.

but ash is not lara or ponting or tendulkar. at least not yet.

but they weren't themselves either at 23, well except for lara. tendy and ponting where both far lesser than they became around the age of 23. it seems that asides from lara who was an exceptional prodigy, batsman mature at 23-27 years of age.

[AsifTheManRahman]

What more can we ask of these guys than what they are currently delivering? They are barely out of their teens and are already carrying the burdens that come with the expectations of a hundred and fifty million people. At 18, people just about get their voting rights. 20 year olds are not even allowed to drink in many countries. 19 is not even the legal age for marriage in some places. All this is because people are not expected to be responsible enough at these ages to perform the deeds that law prohibits them from performing.

And we expect these boys to go out there against seasoned 30 year olds who have years of top class domestic and international cricket behind them and beat the crap out of them. While a 22 year old is a mere debutant in most teams - heck even underage for some (e.g. Australia) - at 22, a Bangladeshi player has to carry the label of one of the most experienced and skilled batsmen in the country.

We need older players. Unfortunately, our best players are the relatively younger ones. We need this bunch to hang around for a few years. We need to invest a fair amount of faith in them. The culture of picking players from a core group of 20 or 30 has begun to evolve, and the key over the next few years will be to stick to these players instead of making too many changes.

[al Furqaan]

well said, Asif, well said.

[Gowza]

well everyone develops at their own pace, i think the most worrying thing about ashraful is that he's played at the international level for over 5 years and is still very inconsistent, compared to other top talents like the ones mentioned (lara, tendulkar, ponting) i think they were more consistent at 23 than ashraful is at 23. he still has a lot of time though, but the wait is frustrating.

just went through some numbers using player oracle on cricketarchive.com and these are ponting and tendulkars stats around the age of 23

ponting at not quite 23 years old (born dec 19 1974):
tests: on 21st august 1997 ave: 38.06, played 9 matches
ODIs: on 17 dec 1997 ave: 32.63, 29 matches played

tendulkar at 23 and a few months (born april 24 1973):
tests: on 4th july 1996 ave: 54.92, 41 matches played
ODIs: on 23rd sept 1996 ave: 39.54, 127 matches played

ashraful at close to 23 and 6 months (born july 7 1984):
tests: on 27th dec 2007 ave: 25.72, 38 matches
ODIs: on 27th dec 2007 ave: 22.33, 105 matches

ashraful doesn't match up, however something to consider is that ponting and tendulkar went into much better teams than ashraful. india and australia at the time tendulkar and ponting entered their respective teams were stronger than bangladesh so this could be partially why ashraful hasn't developed as quickly as other top players. also keep in mind ponting at 23 would have played a lot less matches than ashraful which makes them tougher to compare than say tendulkar who had played a similar amount of matches as ashraful at the same age.

[tonoy]

Is it me or are we just going a bit over the top with comparing Ash to that likes of Ponting, Tendulkar and Lara. Ash is a good player, but I just dont see him up to the stature of these guys as Gowza have rightfully pointed out.

[AsifTheManRahman]

Gowza, you're right about Ashraful having inferior stats because of having walked into a weak side. Had he been born ten years later, he would have been as good as Ponting and Tendulkar at 23.

Tonoy - I don't think it's an unfair comparison. The kinds of shots that Ashraful pulls off indicate that he is talented enough for one to claim that at a raw state, he is as good as some of the world's best. It is the application that is lacking.

[Sohel]

It is not a crime to make mistakes, but it IS a crime once you can't seem to learn from them. That said, leaning is a process and patience still a virtue ...

[tonoy]

Originally Posted by AsifTheManRahman
It is the application that is lacking.

There you go. Theres the sad piece of the puzzle. This is the part where I dont feel much optimistic at all.

[zainab]

Originally Posted by AsifTheManRahman
What more can we ask of these guys than what they are currently delivering? They are barely out of their teens and are already carrying the burdens that come with the expectations of a hundred and fifty million people. At 18, people just about get their voting rights. 20 year olds are not even allowed to drink in many countries. 19 is not even the legal age for marriage in some places. All this is because people are not expected to be responsible enough at these ages to perform the deeds that law prohibits them from performing.

And we expect these boys to go out there against seasoned 30 year olds who have years of top class domestic and international cricket behind them and beat the crap out of them. While a 22 year old is a mere debutant in most teams - heck even underage for some (e.g. Australia) - at 22, a Bangladeshi player has to carry the label of one of the most experienced and skilled batsmen in the country.

We need older players. Unfortunately, our best players are the relatively younger ones. We need this bunch to hang around for a few years. We need to invest a fair amount of faith in them. The culture of picking players from a core group of 20 or 30 has begun to evolve, and the key over the next few years will be to stick to these players instead of making too many changes.

So true! These lads are un der great pressure to perform at the national level, without playing a lot of domestic cricket and more often they fail, e.g. Ashraful. He was thrown into the National side too young, also playing in a losing side all the time, has a psychological effect on the person, always seem like an uphill task.
I hope that Jamie takes about 21 core players and groom them within the next couple of years. There should not be constant changes.

[lamisa]

majhe majhe korle thik ase kintu bar bar korar jonno oder konoi xcuse nai.

[damalChele]

Only fools keep on making the same mistake. Only wise men learn from his and/or other's mistake.