Shah M.S. Kibria died ...

[Sham]

I met SAMS Kibria a couple of times while he was Finance Minister. I can't say I was much of a fan of his as Finance Minister, but he seemed to me to be a decent person. Anyway, decent or not, no one deserves to die like this. The political scene in Bangladesh is becoming more intolerant by the day and this is a disturbing sign. The government has sat around for long enough, its about time they put a stop to this madness, for the country's sake and their own!

[reverse_swing]

Mr. Kibria was a brilliant student also in fact first class first in his undergrad. I agree with Al that he made a great mistake in 96 by joining BD politics. In fact he wanted to join BNP first but he did not get nomination and eventually joined AL. He was a regular columnist in Bhorerkagoj in early nineties. As a civil servant, he achieved almost everything but as a politician he was a total failure. He became minister after 96 election and became one of the most corrupted minister and created many scandals including his wife. But if you only consider his civil servant career then I must say that today we lost one of the brilliant civil servant officer in BD’s history with a bright service track record. May God bless his departed soul and let's pray to God to give his family the strength to endure the hardship they are going through now.

[al]

I am not a fan of SHAMS Kibria. But nobody deserves to be killed like this.
I have heard about him from my father who was his classmate and a collegue as a civil servant. I still wonder and failed to understand that, why a person of his caliber joined politics and compromised his values.
May Allah rest him in peace [ameen] and give strenght to his family.

[sujon]

Originally posted by al
I am not a fan of SHAMS Kibria. But nobody deserves to be killed like this.
I have heard about him from my father who was his classmate and a collegue as a civil servant. I still wonder and failed to understand that, why a person of his caliber joined politics and compromised his values.
May Allah rest him in peace [ameen] and give strenght to his family.

So who shd do politics in bangaldesh? All those dipjols' and pocha mollas' and so and so?

i really dont understand why ppl would say bad words abt a man who was just killed.

may allah gives him eternal peace.

[saadlu]

Innanillah He Wainnailahi Rajiun

This is very sad and worrisome.

[Kana-Baba]

He is now dead! This will certaintly bring some severe blood-shade in future. Oh GOD! save our country.

[Zobair]

Inalillah wa inna ilaihe rajoun! speechless! God save our country!

[Arnab]

This is getting ridiculous day by day. Looks like they want to wipe out the entire Awami league leadership with grenades.

Now who are "they"?

[Piranha]

This is very ridiculous. Whoever did this bombing is clearly behind most (if not all) of the previous bombings. All of them seem to share a common anti-opposition, anti-minority flavor to them.

I'd urge all of you to check out this article in the NYT: nyt

It is only a matter of time before we are officially labelled as another 'rogue state' (at best another 'islamist state) and sadly, the government doesnt seem to care that we are headed in that direction.

Inna lillahe wa inna ilayhi rajeown.

As echoed in other posts, I agree, no one deserves to die like this, regardless of their political past.

[cisco-guy]

Originally posted by Piranha
This is very ridiculous. Whoever did this bombing is clearly behind most (if not all) of the previous bombings. All of them seem to share a common anti-opposition, anti-minority flavor to them.

I'd urge all of you to check out this article in the NYT: nyt

It is only a matter of time before we are officially labelled as another 'rogue state' (at best another 'islamist state) and sadly, the government doesnt seem to care that we are headed in that direction.

Check out how our "Daily Inquilab" ridiculing this NYT article as a conspiracy against Bangladesh. Never ever they mentioned about the wrongdoing of the "so-caled' Islamists and Fundamentalists like "Bangla Bhai".

http://www.dailyinqilab.com/january27/index.htm

Need I say more who are behind these bomb balsts?

[al Furqaan]

what bangladesh needs is not a corrupt khaled nor a sell-out hasina...BD needs a truely patriotic benevolent dictator.

i "tyrant" with no curruption legal, moral, or otherwise, with only the views to make the country better, and better the lives of its citizens.

frankly khaleda's main concern is trying to defeat hasina and the AL...hasina's goal is how to make bangladesh a satellite state of india.

if the bengalis dont find new leaders...this s**t will continue.

unfortunately, finding a good dictator is as likely as hasina and khaleda becoming best friends.

my 2 cents as an ABCD

[nasifkhan]

Originally posted by al Furqaan
what bangladesh needs is not a corrupt khaled nor a sell-out hasina...BD needs a truely patriotic benevolent dictator.

i "tyrant" with no curruption legal, moral, or otherwise, with only the views to make the country better, and better the lives of its citizens.

frankly khaleda's main concern is trying to defeat hasina and the AL...hasina's goal is how to make bangladesh a satellite state of india.

if the bengalis dont find new leaders...this s**t will continue.

unfortunately, finding a good dictator is as likely as hasina and khaleda becoming best friends.

my 2 cents as an ABCD

Right you are........

[DJ Sahastra]

"hasina's goal is how to make bangladesh a satellite state of india."

Wow!!!

Is there a reason why Hasina would want to do that?

[Pundit]

Is there a reason why Hasina would want to do that?

To become the next PM of India, I suppose

[Sham]

Firstly, I don't know why joining politics must be a bad thing in itself? You can say that for Kibria, the decision turned out to be fatal. True. But that doesn't mean good people shouldn't join politics. More good people ought to in order to get our country out of this course that it is currently heading in. Because we have always left politics upto the scums, we are in the position we are in. Yes, you might die in a grenade attack, get tortured in police remand etc, but thats the price you might have to pay if you really want to do something for Bangladesh. Its no good sitting in the sidelines and blaming the politicians.

Secondly, the idea of a benevolent dictator always makes me laugh. How many dictators have been benevolent? Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Someone may start off with all the good intentions, but unless there are checks and balances on his power, how do you ensure that he will remain benevolent? Some also say, bring back the army, they can run the country better! Another laughable suggestion. Haven't we had our fill of the army? Have we not learnt anything from Pakistan? Our democracy is less than perfect to put it mildly, but only by persisting with it can we ever get anywhere. If at one point, and I think that point will come, there is a mass uprising against our major political parties, wouldn't you guys rather have a democratic system where we can get rid of them both. People when they find another viable option will then be able to elect them to power. However, what if our "benevolent" dictator went wrong, how would we get rid of him then? Another bloody struggle like the one to get rid of Ershad? I hope not!

Edited on, January 28, 2005, 7:25 AM GMT, by Sham.

[Spitfire_x86]

Originally posted by al Furqaan
hasina's goal is how to make bangladesh a satellite state of india.

You actually beleive in this?

This is one of the most ridiculous fake popular belief

[shujan]

This is a sad day for Bangladesh.

[howzatt!]

i couldn't really believe it when i saw channel I news. feel sorry for Kibria. he was a good guy. he served our nation well (not considering his political life). when i read his biography in prothom alo, i realized even more how big an asset he was to our nation. these bombings need to stop in our country. this govt. has taken some tough measures against corruption and domestic terrorism in BD and have won huge support from BD citizens including mine, but now its time for them to show how neutral they are in bringing terrorists to justice. whoever a politican is (be it some one from AL, BNP, jamaat,..) no one deserves to die like this. man i fear some serious turmoil in BD real soon.

[fab]

This is truly sad; what a horrible way to die. We know him and more specifically his family - son and daughter-in-law (of the stock market scandal), but they do not seem like corrupt people. They don't live lavishly or extravagantly. Anyhow, I hope they have the strength to overcome this tragedy, although I doubt they can.. It's so terrible..

PS: What is it with Sylhet and terrorism? First the British ambassador and now this. Is it also a goldmine of terrorists?

[Zobair]

ouch! Lets not go down that road right now.
What happened was outrageous...but there is an air of inevitability around these incidents these days...things have gone from bad to worse...can people come up with realistic solutions?

Originally posted by fab
PS: What is it with Sylhet and terrorism? First the British ambassador and now this. Is it also a goldmine of terrorists?

[Piranha]

BD needs a truely patriotic benevolent dictator.

This benevolent dictator theory really, really annoys me. I have found this theory to be very prevalent among Bangladeshis, even among those who are otherwise intelligent and well-educated.

I'm not trying to pick on any of the posters, but this idea if too prevalent for me to just stay silent.

To say that we need a benvolent dictator is like saying: "I just need to win the lottery, and I can retire happily". It is purely wishful a very lazy way of thinking.

Whenever I come across this theory I am reminded of this: "If men were angels, no government would be necessary." by James Madison in the Federalist papers.

The fact remains that human beings are not angels and neither are those that lead them. The only realistic way of overcoming the problem of poor governance is to build better institutions of governance.

Dont get me wrong, building institutions is no easy task, but at least, if we try to do that (rather than hoping idly for some great leader to miraculously appear), we will be on the right track. And an honest pusuit of democracy would be one way to building better institutions.

Here is a great primer for anyone who is interested in this topic.

[nasifkhan]

Originally posted by Spitfire_x86

You actually beleive in this?

This is one of the most ridiculous fake popular belief

i believe it .......

this is not at all fake.......

[Shubho]

This is truly another sad episode in our already sad history. I cannot understand why there are elements in our country that are going down this vile route; the route of fundamentalism. Let's not kid ourselves. We may not know which individuals have perpetrated these bombings since the whole Udichi thing several years back, but we certainly know what type of people they are, and what their motives are.

I look at Bangladeshi society today, and see a subtle but growing radicalization among common folk that completely defies the values upon which our country was built.

A few points I wanted to make with regards to what other people have said in this thread:

What is this rubbish about politicians trying to sell out Bangladesh to India? Who in their right mind would want to do that? And what benefit can the Awami League possibly derive from selling out to India? This mindless rhetoric from people who call themselves 'educated' is absolutely mind-boggling.

Next point; how on earth can somebody who's spent a lot of his/her life in the West, and probably gone to university too, talk about benevolent dictatorship? The proverb has been used before: "absolute power corrupts absolutely". Besides, name one decent benevolent dictator. Gaddafi? Ayatollah Khomeini? Hafis Assad? Hitler? Tito? Mussolini? Zia? Musharraf? Ayub Khan? Ershad? Who, pray tell would pass as benevolent dictator?

Then there is this whole thing about SAMS Kibria being a corrupt politician. Fine. Let's agree that he was corrupt like ALL other politicians in Bangladesh. So what? Do we allow people to roam around and throw grenades at political gatherings in order remove corrupt leaders? Isn't the Anti-corruption bureau meant to be doing that? Isn't the police responsible for that? Are we not meant to be a democracy?

Finally, a couple of points I want to make about the increasing radicalization of Bangladeshi society. Please do not stick your heads in the sand like ostriches; the problem exists, I assure you.

It starts with little things. Consider the annoying insistence of some of our compatriots on saying 'Allahhafez' instead of 'Khodahafez'. Suddenly half the country is screaming that you are a sinner, a non-believer, an idol-worshipper for saying the latter.

Okay, so far things are still relatively harmless, but as I said things always start small and spin out of control later. Next thing you know, some half-assed mullah is screaming for the head of Taslima Nasreen, who herself can't string together five sentences that have even a semblance of literary value. Regardless, why shout down her democratic right to free speech?

Then things start to escalate further. Suddenly, Ahmadiyyas can no longer be regarded as Muslims, just because the Sunni majority says so. What sort of rubbish is that? I don't recall a single passage of the Quran that says only Sunni Islam is the correct path. But then, why would a semi-literate mullah listen to me anyway?

But hey, the story doesn't end there. Suddenly, any Kolimuddin Solimuddin with a little bit of money decides that the best way to contribute to the nation is by funding a madrasah (read Taliban training camp, and don't you deny it) or a new mosque next to 15 others within the same city block. Thence we get Dolby Surround Sound Azaan five times a day. Just in case you didn't hear it the first time, it's sung at you from 15 different directions, in 15 different pitches, at 15 different volumes. My point isn't that Azaan should be done away with. My point is whether we need 15 mosques within the same 100 square meters. Should a half-way enlightened society not be spending on schools and hospitals as well? But no, that would make us kafirs, wouldn't it?

So does the story end there? Of course not! While we're at it, why not get rid of Indian agents too (read, Awami Leaguers)? After all, the Indians are the ultimate sinners since they have a multiplicity of deities. So, let's build a huge funeral pyre for Ivy Rahman and Kibria, and if we can, let's throw Sheikh Hasina into it too.

That's not enough? No problem! We'll make sure that we hound every journalist with liberal, non-Islamic agendas out of town, out of country and if possible, out of this world too.

What? Still not enough? Let's make certain that known mass murderers, but Islamic zealots are in government, and in important positions too, thank you very much. Surely that will sate our appetite!

Anyway, I think you guys get my drift. At some point, enough just has to be enough. We have to come out of the caves and reclaim the tolerant society that we once were. I can only hope that there are still enough people in Bangladesh with enough guts to stand up to this new breed of Islamo-nazis, because this madness refuses to leave on it's own. All this time we've seen the symptoms. Initially, we ignored the trouble. Then we applied some over-the-counter medicine, but without effect. Then we used anti-biotics. Still nothing. I guess it's time for chemotherapy.

Edited on, January 29, 2005, 3:19 AM GMT, by Shubho.

[Zunaid]

Well said Shubho.

I hate one-liners - but there you go.

[al Furqaan]

Originally posted by Piranha

This benevolent dictator theory really, really annoys me. I have found this theory to be very prevalent among Bangladeshis, even among those who are otherwise intelligent and well-educated.

I'm not trying to pick on any of the posters, but this idea if too prevalent for me to just stay silent.

To say that we need a benvolent dictator is like saying: "I just need to win the lottery, and I can retire happily". It is purely wishful a very lazy way of thinking.

Whenever I come across this theory I am reminded of this: "If men were angels, no government would be necessary." by James Madison in the Federalist papers.

The fact remains that human beings are not angels and neither are those that lead them. The only realistic way of overcoming the problem of poor governance is to build better institutions of governance.

Dont get me wrong, building institutions is no easy task, but at least, if we try to do that (rather than hoping idly for some great leader to miraculously appear), we will be on the right track. And an honest pusuit of democracy would be one way to building better institutions.

Here is a great primer for anyone who is interested in this topic.

Basically, you have "civilized nations" (USA, Western Europe, Japan, Australia) and the rest. Democracy is something which that West has succeeded by, however 3rd world nations erroniously believed that by doing so they would get out of the muck and mire that they are in. Indeed, democracy may or may not help third world nations "succeed." Ever notice how riots, and wild behaviors flourish in third world countries??? When was the last riot in America???

Just because some white people do things some way, doesnt neccessarily mean that black, brown, yellow, HAS to do the same. It is my sincere belief that Bangladeshis are not at this time, by and large, ready for democracy. They may evolve so that they can practice democracy successfully, or they may not. Bottom line is that, Bengalis are not capable of democratic governance. The populace is too ignorant, too emtional, and too corrupt. Democracy is rule by people, for people, and of the people.

I am not saying that i have the solution, but the enlightened despot way might not be such a bad idea. Indeed, my mothers uncle, who used to work for the UN High Commission of Refugees, said last march that Bangladesh is well on its way to becoming the next Somalia i.e. a failed state.

Conflict always involves 2 parties in this case BNP and AL. BNP is corrupt and AL are sell outs. For those who think it is false, why does the market suddenly open up to Indian goods when AL comes to power? For some reason, hasina feels an oath of allegiance to India prolly since they helped her father get independence. If only that act was altruistic.

To further prove Bengalis' inherent "inferiority" when it comes to democracy and the AL pathetic patriotism. Look at this 3 day hartal. Who called it? What good does it do for the party, and more importantly the nation, which looses untold millions in GDP? Wait, the hartal brings Kibria back to life, so it is sensible after all.

Im pretty sure that the BNP also calls hartals when not in power. Did democrats call a hartal because bush won? What about when JFK was shot? No, they are more judicous about such things. They place nation above party, and party above self. Bangladeshis tend to do the oppossite.

Edited on, January 29, 2005, 5:56 AM GMT, by al Furqaan.