Who selects the final eleven?

[Stumped]

Originally Posted by TheWatcher
The selection of the playing eleven was always heavly influenced by the selectors. It was very apparent during the England series, and also during the last series against Sri Lanka. But this time, no selector is traveling with the team, so it is not clear how much is their affect now on the team selection.

Anyway, one thing is clear- DW's spine is not that strong as most of us fan used to think it was.

Watch what u say there buddy... how dare u say that about dav! He fights tooth and bone for things to get done in BD. He does alot more than some other coaches so don't assume from lookin on the outside u know whats what. I don't know how u came to that conclusion but i would take it back if i were u. He cares and listens to everyone in that team and his back bone is prob stronger than yours. Id like to see u put in his position and see how u do...

[TheWatcher]

Originally Posted by Stumped
Watch what u say there buddy......

Stumped, truth hurts, does not it?

Most of the leading cricket coaches (for example Bennett King or Bob Woolmer) has the final say in their playing eleven selection, the job of the selectors stop with selecting the 15/14 members squad. The coach is the one who makes the strategy for his team, so the team selection has to be according to his will. But, as you can see, most of the fans here (the true fanatics who follows our cricket team very closely) are not convinced that it is the case with your father. One very apparent example is that the chief selector had prevented Aftab Ahmed from playing during the Test series against Sri Lanka. Even though Aftab was selected in the Test squad, the selector decided to punish him this way for not playing up to his potential in the previous ODI series. I am not going to argue whether it was a wrong or right decision, but it should have been decided by DW, not by Faruque Ahmed.

There are good reason a poor country like ours pay your father $150 K some money every year. If he does not carry out his responsibilities properly, it hurts us all as a nation. So, I have my full rights to express my disappointment at him regardless of how hurtful it is for you.

Anyway, I have no problem taking my words back if you can, instead of throwing emotional giberish, provide us some hard facts that your father is the supreme authority in the playing eleven selection.

[Orpheus]

you can argue wihtout being an a** you know....what's up with "your father" instead of coach whatmore. I would take that personally .....

and stop talking about the man's salary, it's not much really. Also he has been by far the best coach bd had though sometimes i didn't like him either (for example when he wanted a get out clause to grab India's job)

By the way I also thought ms. stumped overreacted a bit... It's a fanatics' blog... you shouldn't be reading if you can't shrug it off.

[TheWatcher]

Orpheus, I don't think Stumped needs you to act as her protective boyfriend, she sounds smart enough to hold on her own in a debate. But if you want debate on her behalf, I have no problem.

The argument is not about how good a coach Whatmore is, it is about whether he is bold enough not to let others meddling with his team selection (the playing eleven).

[Orpheus]

You need to show a bit more respect to me.. I am not your buddy nor I am your father. Maybe then I will argue with you over nothing...

[TheWatcher]

Orpheus, I don't consider you for anything (buddy, foe, whatever), so there is no question of respecting or disrespecting. Also, argueing over nothing is not my style.

I guess that means you have nothing to say about the issue here.

[karimjay.]

You guys are arguing about nothing right now btw. Well in my opinion its Dav Whatmore who selects the XI. Bashar gets a say but it doesnt really mean much because hes too soft so its down to Dav in essence. Stumped..why dont you ask your father about this sometime..?

[Fazal]

So all along the coach's daughter and her boyfriend was monitoring this thread .... I should be nuch more careful next time.... I better be watch out what I say.... bohud Bhoy Paiseee......

[Tigers_eye]

ki dhukkhey ei thread khulsilam??

[Fazal]

Now can the selectors (who were responsible for the 3rd ODI team) please stand up ?

[BangladeshFan]

i dont know where do u guys find that the coach has the final say. It is the captain and captain only who makes decision about the final 11. the coach can atbest suggest. So it is not the question whether DW spine is strong or not it is Bashar whose spine should be strong enough. Anyway after seeing JO selected in this match, I am sure it is DW who is choosing him. its amazing that he was the same coach of 96 Srilankans with dare devil openers kalu and jaya. but in that case i guess it was capain ranatunga's decision(which it should be).

[Fazal]

Originally Posted by BangladeshFan
i dont know where do u guys find that the coach has the final say. It is the captain and captain only who makes decision about the final 11.

Originally Posted by BangladeshFan
Anyway after seeing JO selected in this match, I am sure it is DW who is choosing him. its amazing that he was the same coach of 96 Srilankans with dare devil openers kalu and jaya.

Please .... please ..... don't confuse me any more !!!!!

[BangladeshFan]

well, all i wanted to say is captain always take precedence over coach. Bd may be the only exception in this case.

[Stumped]

Originally Posted by BangladeshFan
well, all i wanted to say is captain always take precedence over coach. Bd may be the only exception in this case.

OK im sorry if everyone feels i have over reacted. Dad does not have the final say neva has in any team, he only puts in his word. He is not a selector. He was briefly in sri lanka for a very short time. He did not like it as he felt it got in the way of his relationship with the players. What i was over reacting about was the back bone my father aparently does not have. Seriously I "over react" and defend my dad cos i know how much sleep dad does not get sometimes thinkin of different ways to help the guys. I know how many hours he spends getting footage together before every series, how much time he spends in the office as well as training with the guys and one on one. Really u guys can believe what u want at the end of the day but i only see my dad a month of a year and phone calls are all i have. If he did not care he would be with his family a hell of a lot more than what he does. I came to BD for a week to spend with dad last dec and still he had to work. and that was after not seeing him for many months. So if u think u can find a better coach that will work just as hard go ahead and make ur suggestions.. and no way should u bring how much he gets paid into all this... it is no lie that he gets paid alot less than other coaches.. and y?!?!?! Because he wants to help a team become the best team. A team that has been struggling for years...

[Sorry]

Originally Posted by Stumped
OK im sorry if everyone feels i have over reacted. Dad does not have the final say neva has in any team, he only puts in his word. He is not a selector. He was briefly in sri lanka for a very short time. He did not like it as he felt it got in the way of his relationship with the players. What i was over reacting about was the back bone my father aparently does not have. Seriously I "over react" and defend my dad cos i know how much sleep dad does not get sometimes thinkin of different ways to help the guys. I know how many hours he spends getting footage together before every series, how much time he spends in the office as well as training with the guys and one on one. Really u guys can believe what u want at the end of the day but i only see my dad a month of a year and phone calls are all i have. If he did not care he would be with his family a hell of a lot more than what he does. I came to BD for a week to spend with dad last dec and still he had to work. and that was after not seeing him for many months. So if u think u can find a better coach that will work just as hard go ahead and make ur suggestions.. and no way should u bring how much he gets paid into all this... it is no lie that he gets paid alot less than other coaches.. and y?!?!?! Because he wants to help a team become the best team. A team that has been struggling for years...

i always thought dav is the best coach we had so far....
but may i sense that you really don't like our team but defending your dad?
and, btw, a professional is not supposed to spend his time out of his work while his daughter is on holiday; besides, undisputedly, you should be proud of your dad for his dedication for the work.

[Stumped]

I will admit... sri lanka is always my number one team but i grew up with many of them and sri lanka is my home, but i do like the BD team. I have gotten to know a couple of them over the years and they are decent well mannerd guys. I am proud of my dad. I was not complaining that he went to work while i was there just stating it so that peop know how hard he works(it was just before x-mas). He really is an amazing man, not just cos he is my dad, but he gives a thousand percent no matter how small or large a task may be.

[Fazal]

খাইশে.... মনে হয় এতো আসলেই কোচের মাইয়া

[akabir77]

listen stumped. Its very bad time to stick around in BC. I am sure when we do well you will see the same guys r full of pride with dav and the management. I am sure you know that by now.
On another note I can't understand why he didn't send any 12 man to come down the bowler and tell/suggest him where to bowl.
Yes you might say the bowler is experience etc but Dav have been in this situation then the whole bd team so he know exactly what to do. And that where i am disappointed that he didn't do most pro coaches would have done in the same position.

[Stumped]

I did not watch the match. Most probably when drinks were taken out messages were relayed then or if someone needed something or if someone is on the boundary and someone goes to talk to them. And not everything is on camera. I have no idea if dad did send msg or not but sometimes it does not help... they have to be willing to listen too! Im sure the team and bowlers knew what they were doing wrong. They are all feeling crap after yesterday and maybe so they should from what everyone is saying who watched the game. At the end of the day they have to be able to think for themselves. They have alot of prep for a tour let alone a game. They have team meetings to discuss the days game stratagy have analized all players more so on key players. They have been provided with alot of info... Yes peop are all full of praise for dad when they do well but i dun really pay much attention to all the hype its been up and down in each country for years with the fans... all i am tryin to do is show both sides of the field. If dad did something wrong id admit it, but learning from dad get all the facts first before judging or attacking...

[Spitfire_x86]

Originally Posted by akabir77
On another note I can't understand why he didn't send any 12 man to come down the bowler and tell/suggest him where to bowl.
Yes you might say the bowler is experience etc but Dav have been in this situation then the whole bd team so he know exactly what to do. And that where i am disappointed that he didn't do most pro coaches would have done in the same position.

No advice in the world will help us if we keep giving 4 full tosses in the last over.

[akabir77]

I guess we would never know what happen before that ball until dav writes about it in TC. but looking from the video footage it didn't seem that any instruction came. whether it would have worked or not that's different.
But one thing I want mention I am not judging or attacking anyone. I am just saying that might have given some hope to masri... as could say well every one told me to do this and it didn't work. instead he is hiding in his sweater now...

[Tigers_eye]

I had asked Saber Bhai about this process. I am quoting him.

"With regard to who selects the final XI on the day of the match, this is
usually for the Coach and Captain to decide but the Manager may also
be consulted. The Selectors choose / select the squad only."

Now we know which side H Bashar, Hira and the Coach is on in regards on JO and Kapali. Unless things have changed after he left. The new selectors seem to have more influence on the final eleven.

(Miraz, Mahmood, Sydney, Dak_Pion was right all along)

[Sovik]

so we are still blaming dave for mash bowling 4 full tosses.

Bad luck for JO cause his friend will not be in kenya to give him another chance

[Tigers_eye]

Originally Posted by sovik
so we are still blaming dave for mash bowling 4 full tosses.

I don't think so. The only one to be blamed is Mash himself. No one in sane mind would ask a bowler to bowl one fulltoss in the dying moments let alone four.

[Fazal]

Originally Posted by Cats_eye
I had asked Saber Bhai about this process. I am quoting him.

"With regard to who selects the final XI on the day of the match, this is
usually for the Coach and Captain to decide but the Manager may also
be consulted. The Selectors choose / select the squad only."

Now we know which side H Bashar, Hira and the Coach is on in regards on JO and Kapali. Unless things have changed after he left. The new selectors seem to have more influence on the final eleven.

(Miraz, Mahmood, Sydney, Dak_Pion was right all along)

Hmmm... based on different rumors in newspapers (past and present) I suspect things may have changed a lit bit. For exmaple I have hard time to believe that the manager has more to say (selecting the final 11) than selectors? Before Hira (who was just recently being appointed), we used to have a non-cricket back ground Manager. Also my guess is for-good-or-for-bad the current set of selectors are more involved in team selection than before.

These are all speculation in my part. And its happening becuase, BCB never came out in public and addressed this in a official manner and continue to allow this issue a breeding ground for rumors.