Georgia attacks Russian Province, Russia retaliating

[al Furqaan]

haven't really followed the news, and i have no clue of the history of this conflict. i support those who have justice and truth on their side.

[Tehsin]

Post #10 from Noc gives you a little insight into the history.

Originally Posted by al Furqaan
haven't really followed the news, and i have no clue of the history of this conflict. i support those who have justice and truth on their side.

[Orpheus]

Originally Posted by I_Knockout_U
knew it. Intentionally put Atlanta alongside Gori,Tskhinvali, poti, tbillsi.

knockout ck this out (got from digg.com)

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2341/...f3352d.jpg?v=0


and now probably a troll/maybe not

http://fumpr.com/images/ja9649gwx25j20sykl0q.png

(hint: look at the map for who of you don't get it from the first link)

[Banglatiger84]

Georgia is complaining that Russia is attacking its sovereignity by bombing them. They sure had no worries about Iraqs sovereignity when they sent 2 thousand troops for combat there, who have undoubtedly killed many Iraqis.

[billah]

Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
Georgia is complaining that Russia is attacking its sovereignity by bombing them. They sure had no worries about Iraqs sovereignity when they sent 2 thousand troops for combat there, who have undoubtedly killed many Iraqis.

I nominate this to be the "Post of the Day".

[Alien]

Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
Georgia is complaining that Russia is attacking its sovereignity by bombing them. They sure had no worries about Iraqs sovereignity when they sent 2 thousand troops for combat there, who have undoubtedly killed many Iraqis.

And how many did they kill in Iraq? Iraq's government didn't object to the presence of Georgian troops.

I am not supporting the US war, but you are comparing apples and oranges here.

[Puck]

Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
Georgia is complaining that Russia is attacking its sovereignity by bombing them. They sure had no worries about Iraqs sovereignity when they sent 2 thousand troops for combat there, who have undoubtedly killed many Iraqis.

what was different about iraq would be that georgia had been part of a coalition of the willing. in other words, they would have supported a group of nations that, for whatever ethical or unethical end, invaded a country to end the despotic regime of a tyrant, and these group of nations were in a consensus of opinion about how much of a threat iraq posed to the region. we all know that weapons of mass destruction were not found in iraq. in truth, the iraqi army had not even been reformed to the pre-first gulf war state. however, georgia did not invade iraq on its own.

brushing aside the politics, the only moral reason for russia to invade parts of georgia is to protect russians who had settled in that country and were routinely discriminated against. of course, politics always comes into this and ultimately, this is a little showdown between russia and america just like afganistan had been in the 80s. there is another cultural reason which might well have played its part. russians like to see strong leaders. they actually care a little less about free speech than the people of bangladesh. from tzarist times the nation had been so used to very strong central governments standing up to international regimes that each new president have to reassert their authority through some form of military or diplomatic might.

what if india decided to annex bangladesh? how would you feel if that happened? bangladesh sent peacekeeping forces to former yugoslavian republics. sikim was an independent kingdom that lost its sovereignty to india a few decades earlier. so lets say that india invades bangladesh and a serbian expresses the same sentiment as you did above?

invasion of iraq wasn't quite the morally acceptable action eventhough the by poduct has been the removal of saddam. similarly, invasion of georgia isn't morally acceptable unless there had been a genuine case of ethnic cleansing on the parts of the georgians. what was different about iraq was that, rightly or wrongly, there were a group of nations who went into the war. in the present instance, russia had gone alone.

[Banglatiger84]

Originally Posted by Puck
what was different about iraq would be that georgia had been part of a coalition of the willing. in other words, they would have supported a group of nations that, for whatever ethical or unethical end, invaded a country to end the despotic regime of a tyrant, and these group of nations were in a consensus of opinion about how much of a threat iraq posed to the region. we all know that weapons of mass destruction were not found in iraq. in truth, the iraqi army had not even been reformed to the pre-first gulf war state. however, georgia did not invade iraq on its own.

brushing aside the politics, the only moral reason for russia to invade parts of georgia is to protect russians who had settled in that country and were routinely discriminated against. of course, politics always comes into this and ultimately, this is a little showdown between russia and america just like afganistan had been in the 80s. there is another cultural reason which might well have played its part. russians like to see strong leaders. they actually care a little less about free speech than the people of bangladesh. from tzarist times the nation had been so used to very strong central governments standing up to international regimes that each new president have to reassert their authority through some form of military or diplomatic might.

what if india decided to annex bangladesh? how would you feel if that happened? bangladesh sent peacekeeping forces to former yugoslavian republics. sikim was an independent kingdom that lost its sovereignty to india a few decades earlier. so lets say that india invades bangladesh and a serbian expresses the same sentiment as you did above?

invasion of iraq wasn't quite the morally acceptable action eventhough the by poduct has been the removal of saddam. similarly, invasion of georgia isn't morally acceptable unless there had been a genuine case of ethnic cleansing on the parts of the georgians. what was different about iraq was that, rightly or wrongly, there were a group of nations who went into the war. in the present instance, russia had gone alone.

1) If Bangladesh goes and bombs Sikkim or any other Indian state, I wouldnt be surprised to see the Indians bombing us back.

2) The Russians only attacked Tsibilsi after the Georgians attacked Ossetia.....


As mentioned earlier, what happened was that the georgian president thought he could draw NATO to fight his war, he is known as a firebrand and even Europe/US tried to restrain him, but he thought he could take on Russia and win.....

Note the parts in bold in the article below..



http://www.thenational.ae/article/20080811...=globalbriefing


In The Observer, Thomas de Waal described Georgia's president by saying: "Saakashvili is a famously volatile risk-taker, veering between warmonger and peacemaker, democrat and autocrat. On several occasions international officials have pulled him back from the brink. On a visit to Washington in 2004, he received a tongue-lashing from then Secretary of State Colin Powell who told him to act with restraint. Two months ago, he could have triggered a war with his other breakaway province of Abkhazia by calling for the expulsion of Russian peacekeepers from there, but European diplomats persuaded him to step back. This time he has yielded to provocation and stepped over the precipice.

"The provocation is real, but the Georgian President is rash to believe this is a war he can win or that the West wants it. Both George Bush and John McCain have visited Georgia, made glowing speeches praising Saakashvili and were rewarded with the Order of St George. But Bush, at least in public, is now bound to be cautious, calling for a ceasefire.

The reaction in much of Europe will be much less forgiving. Even before this crisis, a number of governments, notably France and Germany, were reporting 'Georgia fatigue'. Though they broadly wished the Saakashvili government well, they did not buy the line that he was a model democrat - the sight last November of his riot police tear-gassing protesters in Tbilisi and smashing up an opposition TV station dispelled that illusion. And they have a long agenda of issues with Russia, which they regard as more important than the post-Soviet quarrel between Moscow and Tbilisi. Paris and Berlin will now say they were right to urge caution on Georgia's Nato ambitions at the Bucharest Nato summit."

[Puck]

Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
1) If Bangladesh goes and bombs Sikkim or any other Indian state, I wouldnt be surprised to see the Indians bombing us back.

2) The Russians only attacked Tsibilsi after the Georgians attacked Ossetia.....


As mentioned earlier, what happened was that the georgian president thought he could draw NATO to fight his war, he is known as a firebrand and even Europe/US tried to restrain him, but he thought he could take on Russia and win.....

ere right to urge caution on Georgia's Nato ambitions at the Bucharest Nato summit."[/I]

bangladesh in their right mind would not bomb sikim since it is part of indian territory now and has been for a number of years.

ossetia is part of georgia. there had been rebel groups in that region since cossack times many centuries earlier who had fought against the imperial tzarist army. in the late 1940s as part of stalin's plan to russianise many parts of the smaller nations taken over by late tzarist regime, he instigated ethnic russians to settle in these parts of the country. georgia, lithuania as well as the lands previously controlled by chechnyans, uzbeks and kazaks. there was even a jewsish colony set up just outside serbia that dreamed of uniting all russian jews. when the russians started to settle in ossetia they certainly enjoyed more freedom compared to the ethnic population. there had been limited latent dissatisfaction between the russians, the original ossetians and the tribes from georgia who had lived in that region for centuries longer. after the disintegration of the soviet union there was a georgian civil war. this polarised the nation to such an extent that many rebel groups comprising of ethhnic tribal followings wanted their own autonomous regions. one such group happens to be the russians in ossetia who had been armed by russia for a number of years. the georgian government could legitimately argue that they have been maintaining the territorial integrity of their nation. many syleti's want an independent sylet. many tribes from parborto chottogram would prefer some form of autonomy. if and when armed struggle were to follow, would bangladesh give up the right to those parts without batting an eyelid?

online newspapers, just like their print counterparts are written by journalists, and for that matter freelance journalists. you should not rely too much on such mediums and believe what is reported exclusively. a little knowledge of the history and culture of the country, perhaps making acquaintance with some locals always allows you a much more grass root interpretation of any conflict that a newshog would not have access to.

[Banglatiger84]

At the end of the day I find it difficult to sympathize with a president who is more hawkish than American neocons, themselves and who started the war by attacking Russians in South Ossetia.

[Banglatiger84]

Originally Posted by Puck
however, georgia did not invade iraq on its own.

But they happily sent combat troops there hoping to get NATO/EU membership. They were nothing less than mercenaries.

[Anher]

Originally Posted by Orpheus
knockout ck this out (got from digg.com)

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2341/...f3352d.jpg?v=0


and now probably a troll/maybe not

http://fumpr.com/images/ja9649gwx25j20sykl0q.png

(hint: look at the map for who of you don't get it from the first link)

Orphy for Jora Tali minister.

[Alien]

One can easily vent at Georgia for being American puppet but lets look at facts. Iraq war was supported directly and indirectly by many muslim countries whom we seldom blame. Countries like Pakistan which allow US to fly into Afghanistan to bomb Talibans, Saudi allowing US base in its country.

When 9-11 happens, government of BD eagerly offers the country as potential base to bomb Bin Laden but doesn't condemn when million people are already dead in War on Terror.

Why should Georgia feel for our fellow Muslim countries when we failed ourselves? There is a reason why they suck up to the Americans and that is to escape Moscow's Soviet style grip on neighbouring countries.

[Anher]

So the war ended at last?
Peace.

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/eu...war/index.html

[Banglatiger84]

[Rabz]

Good one Banglatiger.
Picture tells a thousand story.

[Nocturnal]

massive one - bt84

[Banglatiger84]

Sorry, forgot to mention source, copy pasted from another forum

[Kabir]

Lol...that was a neat piece of work. Just tells you what exactly happened.

PS - Ajke Mijan bhai amare haat e niya bechar dhanday thakbe. But ami sheita hoite deyar pokhkho pati noi.

[Tigers_eye]

Originally Posted by Kabir
Lol...that was a neat piece of work. Just tells you what exactly happened.

PS - Ajke Mijan bhai amare haat e niya bechar dhanday thakbe. But ami sheita hoite deyar pokhkho pati noi.

Chilla, kaitta, lobon lagaiya, chulai dom diya, Yum Yum!!

[Nocturnal]

Originally Posted by Kabir
Lol...that was a neat piece of work. Just tells you what exactly happened.

PS - Ajke Mijan bhai amare haat e niya bechar dhanday thakbe. But ami sheita hoite deyar pokhkho pati noi.

7999- one more to go তাড়াতাড়ি করেন ভাইজান!!

[Rabz]

Kabir bhai,
taratari.

Bhuna khichuri khamu.

[tranquill]

Here the news: http://samsonblinded.org/news/govern...te-russia-2647  Israelis supply weapons to Georgia!

[ammark]

Its been almost 2 months since the conflict, but I just came across one of my FAVOURITE BBC documentary series on youtube. I watched this in Dhaka and then Toronto around August/September 2005. I'd like to share that here with you.

Its uncanny that upon watching this particular episode, and by reflecting on this years events there are so many predictable things that have happened. Just shows how blind the outside world is to issues and events till the powder keg explodes.

Part 1 of 4:

Part 2 of 4:

Part 3 of 4:

Part 4 of 4

This episode is from a part of the series Holidays in the Danger Zone: Places that dont exist. There are also other series that the presenter Simon Reeve has presented, of which I particularly liked "Meet the Stans" done in 2004. I'm however looking for a one part documentary he did called "House of Saud" in 2004, in which he goes through Saudi Arabia and interacts with the Saudia Royal Family and parts of Saudi Society up close.

More info can be found here: http://www.shootandscribble.com/sr/1.html

[ammark]

Today's news from BBC http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7651097.stm