Australia: Who Is To Blame For This Farce

[jeesh]

Originally Posted by BengaliPagol
It's John Inverarity's fault that Australia have spiralled into a huge decline. Selection has been horrendous such as picking Glenn Maxwell the so called "Big Show". He has been the "No Show" for quite some time now.

Constantly neglecting Khawaja has been another feature. He deserved to have a go in India when Hughes was performing poorly but Inverarity had other ideas. Australia do not know their best XI because of the bowling rotation process.

It has been very ugly for a while now.

Whats the reason behind not giving Nathan Lyon a go in shorter formats. They did the same thing with Stuart McGill. As if they have decided themselves Lyon wont have any luck in ODI's. Given up on the player.

But Lyon certainly adds a little bit more variety to the attack. And he's not a bad bowler as such, quite intelligent. Xavier Doherty their "Shorter Version" spinner is an average cricketer. If he bowled in Bangladesh he wouldnt even make it into the top 6 SLA's list.

[MohammedC]

Warner dropped after bar bust-up

http://www.espncricinfo.com/icc-cham...ry/641109.html

do we need a thread to discuss this

[BengaliPagol]

Originally Posted by jeesh
Whats the reason behind not giving Nathan Lyon a go in shorter formats. They did the same thing with Stuart McGill. As if they have decided themselves Lyon wont have any luck in ODI's. Given up on the player.

But Lyon certainly adds a little bit more variety to the attack. And he's not a bad bowler as such, quite intelligent. Xavier Doherty their "Shorter Version" spinner is an average cricketer. If he bowled in Bangladesh he wouldnt even make it into the top 6 SLA's list.

Lyon i dont think would be good in shorter formats. But they could try him out.

[Warrior868]

Originally Posted by jeesh

Who is to blame for this debacle? What has brought them down to this level, and how can they fight back to the top? Whats your opinion?

Sometimes you have a special generation, when its gone its gone. Same goes for alot of Football teams, look at Brazil for example. May take years before Aus returns to the top

[BengaliPagol]

This is the team which Australia should play

Australia's Best ODI XI
1. Shane Watson
2. Phillip Hughes
3. Michael Clarke
4. George Bailey
5. Adam Voges
6. C. Ferguson
7. Brad Haddin
8. James Faulkner
9. Mitchell Johnson
10. Mitchell Starc
11. Clint McKay

[jeesh]

Imo a spinner needs to be brought in. 5 pace bowlers=very one dimensional attack. And none of these bowlers create any fear or doubt in the batsmans mind.

Clint McKay for example is a very average bowler who is featuring prominently because of Australia's dearth in talent. Too bad Glen McGrath is coaching upcoming Indian prospects. He should be there working on guys like Starc instead.

[BengaliPagol]

Originally Posted by jeesh
Clint McKay for example is a very average bowler who is featuring prominently because of Australia's dearth in talent.

Are you serious bro? Clint McKay might not look like an exciting bowler to you but he has been a very consistent performer for Australia in ODIs for a very very long time. Probably Australia's MVP in ODIs in terms of bowling.

A great wicket taker and bowls good lines to dismiss batsmen mostly by getting them caught behind. I don't know how a bowling average of 21 in ODIs seems average to you...

And with the spinner situation Clarke and Voges are good enough to bowl some overs of spin. Don't think a specialist spinner is needed because Australia's strength lies in pace bowling.

Faulkner and Watson are natural wicket takers when they come in as 3rd change. Better to go in with these two than to go into the game with Doherty or Maxwell.

[BengaliPagol]

Well Australia A are playing Ireland atm and Steve Smith seems to be firing. Scored a hundred so congrats to him. Should be considered for the up coming Ashes. I think he would do well. Khawaja hasn't been doing well recently. Doolan has been hot and cold.

I'm anticipating on the Nathan Lyon vs. Fawad Ahmed showdown. I'm also interested in seeing how Ashton Agar goes.

[BengaliPagol]

The Ashes Team is looking like it's going to be something like...
1. Shane Watson
2. Dave Warner (might not play Ashes)
3. Chris Rogers
4. Michael Clarke
5. Steve Smith
6. Matthew Wade
7. James Faulkner
8. Peter Siddle
9. James Pattinson
10. Mitchell Starc
11. Nathan Lyon/Fawad Ahmed

Not looking like a good enough team to beat England tbh...

[jeesh]

Originally Posted by BengaliPagol
Are you serious bro? Clint McKay might not look like an exciting bowler to you but he has been a very consistent performer for Australia in ODIs for a very very long time. Probably Australia's MVP in ODIs in terms of bowling.

A great wicket taker and bowls good lines to dismiss batsmen mostly by getting them caught behind. I don't know how a bowling average of 21 in ODIs seems average to you...

And with the spinner situation Clarke and Voges are good enough to bowl some overs of spin. Don't think a specialist spinner is needed because Australia's strength lies in pace bowling.

Faulkner and Watson are natural wicket takers when they come in as 3rd change. Better to go in with these two than to go into the game with Doherty or Maxwell.

Australia's MVP in bowling because there is nobody else. He's an ok by the book bowler. Nothing special. Compare him with South Africa or Englands bowlers? Imo nowhere near. More of an unforced error wicket bowler rather than someone who will pick wickets with genuine application of skill.

Hard to imagine Australia which is so good in producing quality fast bowlers is unable to bring in someone who can put fear in batsmen like Steyn or Anderson does.

Perhaps my expectation is not realistic because i used to be a fan of Australia in the days of McGrath, Lee, Gillespie, Fleming, Bichel etc. But with the resources they possess its unbelievable where they stand now. Perhaps a reason why they are slipping into mid table.

[Gowza]

Originally Posted by BengaliPagol
The Ashes Team is looking like it's going to be something like...
1. Shane Watson
2. Dave Warner (might not play Ashes)
3. Chris Rogers
4. Michael Clarke
5. Steve Smith
6. Matthew Wade
7. James Faulkner
8. Peter Siddle
9. James Pattinson
10. Mitchell Starc
11. Nathan Lyon/Fawad Ahmed

Not looking like a good enough team to beat England tbh...

What are your thoughts on Dave Hussey for the ashes? Personally I reckon he should have been given the nod, his experience in those conditions would have made the team stronger imo.

[BengaliPagol]

Originally Posted by jeesh
Australia's MVP in bowling because there is nobody else. He's an ok by the book bowler. Nothing special. Compare him with South Africa or Englands bowlers? Imo nowhere near. More of an unforced error wicket bowler rather than someone who will pick wickets with genuine application of skill.

I dont think it's possible for a bowler to average 21 in ODIs when he is "more of an unforced error wicket bowler". And there are other bowlers like Mitch Johnson, Pattinson, Cummins, Starc, Siddle, Ryan Harris, Jackson Bird, Faulkner, Hilfenhaus who are all good bowlers and would walk into any other team in world cricket (except SA). So frankly there are "some bodies".

BTW in ODIs Clint McKay averages better than Dale Steyn and Jimmy Anderson. McKay is a specialist ODI bowler.

[sum_1]

I'd prefer Brad Haddin over Wade for the ashes, for the reason that chances are Wade will be facing Swann a lot more when he comes on to bat. This is where Haddin will have an advantage of being a right hander, and frankly Wade doesn't look too convincing while playing spin.

[BengaliPagol]

Originally Posted by Gowza
What are your thoughts on Dave Hussey for the ashes? Personally I reckon he should have been given the nod, his experience in those conditions would have made the team stronger imo.

Dave Hussey would always have been one of the first picked in my books. But sadly i dont think selectors consider him for tests at all. If the team get rid off Faulkner then the batting gets strengthened immensely imo. Australia should look to strengthening the batting as much as possible because that is where our problem will lie imo. Bowling will be fine.

But i do accredit the selectors for picking Chris Rogers. He finally gets what he deserves. He has been consistent in domestics for many many years now. He has played in England and Australia and still maintains a fantastic average. Same goes to Dave Hussey. Dave Hussey is a much better test cricketer then he is a limited overs cricketer.

1. Shane Watson
2. Dave Warner
3. Chris Rogers
4. Michael Clarke
5. Dave Hussey
6. Steve Smith
7. Matthew Wade
8. Peter Siddle
9. James Pattinson
10. Mitchell Starc
11. Nathan Lyon/Fawad Ahmed

[Gowza]

Originally Posted by BengaliPagol
Dave Hussey would always have been one of the first picked in my books. But sadly i dont think selectors consider him for tests at all. If the team get rid off Faulkner then the batting gets strengthened immensely imo. Australia should look to strengthening the batting as much as possible because that is where our problem will lie imo. Bowling will be fine.

But i do accredit the selectors for picking Chris Rogers. He finally gets what he deserves. He has been consistent in domestics for many many years now. He has played in England and Australia and still maintains a fantastic average. Same goes to Dave Hussey. Dave Hussey is a much better test cricketer then he is a limited overs cricketer.

1. Shane Watson
2. Dave Warner
3. Chris Rogers
4. Michael Clarke
5. Dave Hussey
6. Steve Smith
7. Matthew Wade
8. Peter Siddle
9. James Pattinson
10. Mitchell Starc
11. Nathan Lyon/Fawad Ahmed

Faulkner should only be picked as a bowler, let his batting be a bonus imo.

[BD_TigerZ]

My XI would have been..

1. Shane Watson
2. Mark Cosgrove
3. Chris Rogers
4. Michael Clarke
5. Callum Ferguson/Adam Voges
6. Tim Paine
7. Steve Smith/Faulkner/Henriques
8. Peter Siddle
9. James Pattinson
10. Mitchell Starc
11. Fawad Ahmed

[Gowza]

Originally Posted by BengaliPagol
Dave Hussey would always have been one of the first picked in my books. But sadly i dont think selectors consider him for tests at all. If the team get rid off Faulkner then the batting gets strengthened immensely imo. Australia should look to strengthening the batting as much as possible because that is where our problem will lie imo. Bowling will be fine.

But i do accredit the selectors for picking Chris Rogers. He finally gets what he deserves. He has been consistent in domestics for many many years now. He has played in England and Australia and still maintains a fantastic average. Same goes to Dave Hussey. Dave Hussey is a much better test cricketer then he is a limited overs cricketer.

1. Shane Watson
2. Dave Warner
3. Chris Rogers
4. Michael Clarke
5. Dave Hussey
6. Steve Smith
7. Matthew Wade
8. Peter Siddle
9. James Pattinson
10. Mitchell Starc
11. Nathan Lyon/Fawad Ahmed

also, keep starc away from the test team. we have much better FC bowlers than him currently, he's a gun shorter format bowler but nothing special in the longer format and certainly not up to standard of other aussie pacers atm. actually would easily pick faulkner over starc in tests if it was my choice, plenty of others also.

[BengaliPagol]

Originally Posted by Gowza
also, keep starc away from the test team. we have much better FC bowlers than him currently, he's a gun shorter format bowler but nothing special in the longer format and certainly not up to standard of other aussie pacers atm. actually would easily pick faulkner over starc in tests if it was my choice, plenty of others also.

Fair enough. Would definitely have tried out Jackson Bird. He is a gun bowler who has been tearing up the domestic team. He also bowled very well in the limited opportunity he got in international cricket.

Ryan Harris would probably be the more obvious pick. A wicket taking bowler which we need since we are coming up against the likes of Cook and Trott.

[jeesh]

Originally Posted by BengaliPagol
I dont think it's possible for a bowler to average 21 in ODIs when he is "more of an unforced error wicket bowler". And there are other bowlers like Mitch Johnson, Pattinson, Cummins, Starc, Siddle, Ryan Harris, Jackson Bird, Faulkner, Hilfenhaus who are all good bowlers and would walk into any other team in world cricket (except SA). So frankly there are "some bodies".

BTW in ODIs Clint McKay averages better than Dale Steyn and Jimmy Anderson. McKay is a specialist ODI bowler.

Dont always look at the average. Ajit Agarkar averages 27. And that by playing 191 matches and picking 288 wickets mostly in the flat tracks of India. You consider him a world class bowler?

You are defending 180 runs in a 50 over match who do you prefer to have in your team McKay? Anderson? Finn? Steyn? Malinga? Philander? Morkel? Ishant Sharma poses more threat than Clint McKay. McKay is no more than a Stuart Clark who simply relies on bowling line and length and waits for the batsman to make a mistake. For pacer number 3 thats ok, but as your strike bowler no. Especially when you are Australia. Like i said perhaps thats where the issue lies.

Starc, Pattinson, Johnson, Cummins are all very good, but confidence is not there. Honestly i d prefer Bangladesh facing Australia than India now atm. Its hard to imagine, but India's Zaheer Khan, Ishant, Kumar, Yadav will probably cause more problems than the current Aussie lineup.

Dont get me wrong, i am being very objective, Australia's probably my number 3 team, at one it was even number 1 (In the days of Steve Waugh). Pains to see where they stand today. And i see another Ashes battering coming up. Lot of work to do, but is Cricket Australia up for it.

[jeesh]

Another point i forgot to mention. Australian quicks were much more driven and potent under McDermott. Not sure i see the same under Ali De Winter. Maybe they should bring McDermott back or even Troy Cooley.

[MohammedShamim]

Pretty much a selection issue, I think Shaun Marsh and Steve Smith deserved to be in the national team and backed up well. I don't understand the reason behind Australia not including players like David Hussey or even Brad Hodge to install some experience. My ODI Team:

1) Shane Watson
2) David Warner
3) Shaun Marsh
4) Brad Hodge/Wade
5) Micheal Clarke
6) George Bailey
7) David Hussey
8) James Faulkner
9) Mitchel Johnson
10) Clint Mckay
11) Xavier Doherty

[Gowza]

Originally Posted by King13
Pretty much a selection issue, I think Shaun Marsh and Steve Smith deserved to be in the national team and backed up well. I don't understand the reason behind Australia not including players like David Hussey or even Brad Hodge to install some experience. My ODI Team:

1) Shane Watson
2) David Warner
3) Shaun Marsh
4) Brad Hodge/Wade
5) Micheal Clarke
6) George Bailey
7) David Hussey
8) James Faulkner
9) Mitchel Johnson
10) Clint Mckay
11) Xavier Doherty

hodge is retired from that level. doherty isn't very good so i get him out. agree that shaun marsh and steven smith should be given more chances in all formats.

[Gowza]

cosgrove and mcdonald should be in consideration more often to.

[jeesh]

Mitchell Johnson really tried last evening. Bowled his heart out. But had no support from other Aussie bowlers.

[BengaliPagol]

Jeesh bhai there is a difference between having an average of 21 and having an average of 27. Main point is McKay has been getting the job done for Australia. He might not be as threatening as the likes of Dale Steyn but you don't have to be a Steyn or a Malinga to either have a good bowling average or to bag wickets. Just ask Glenn McGrath.