Only a Twenty20 international league can help salvage all forms of cricket

[kalpurush]

Originally Posted by bharat
In case you missed there is a Champions league for that .BD is to have a team in that league next year .

Seeing this years response I dont think it will be successful ! The fans rather watch India vs BD rather than dhaka vs Mumbai !

IPL is a different beast , its been successful because of Indian city teams playing each other (and of course wine,women and movie starts).An Indian fan would not be interested in a match between Dhaka and Chittagong , in the same way a BD fan would not be interested in a game between Sailkot and Faislabad. Take out BD and international players out of IPL ..an avergae BD fan wouldnt care about IPL as well !

True. No point for another Champions League type league.

[yaseer]

Originally Posted by sharifk
it's not about a T20 competition of national teams....it's of professional franchises/clubs ... something like the champions league (e.g. dhaka vs. mumbai)....this way may be IPL can be International Premier League instead of Indian Premier League ..

There is already a champions league, right? why another one? What is new in that?

Why do you think Dhaka vs Mumbai match will be more interesting than BD vs IND? Who cares about a somerset vs Trinidad match? We have seen that champions league was not 10% successful as IPL. IPL is a totally different thing as Bharat pointed out.

Why BCCI will allow ICC to take the control of IPL as "International Premier League"? BCCI will never let it happen and there will be a ICC vs BCCI competition, always BCCI going to win because they have the money. So, no "International Premier League", only "Indian Premiere league".

I also want our younger players to play longer version and want to keep them away from T20 as much as possible in their development stage. I take loosing to Ireland 10 times in a T20 match over a Test win any day. T20 is a fun game, and our young cricketers only should be allowed to have fun after they develop as a cricketer. We already have a T20 league, and that is enough for the moment. We should concentrate to NCL and make them more competitive.

[wiseshah]

why converting players from test/odi to 20/20.

why cant we make a different team for 20/20? in that way, we dont have to convert our players style.
players like

najmul hossain Milon
najimuddin
alok kapali
ziaur rahman
najmus sadat
mithun ali
imrul kayes


already did well in this format. we can just add some national 20/20 players and make a competitive 20/20 team. in this way, our some national players will have break from extensive cricket and we can reduce some injury also.

playing all three format is too much asking for our players. it will ruin their all cricket sense. they cant adopt all 3 format. so selection is a crucial thing here

[BANFAN]

Forget it man, we have some scope of lifting up our domestic T20 tournaments. May be through more money and attracting better quality foreign players.

[BANFAN]

Originally Posted by wiseshah
why converting players from test/odi to 20/20.

why cant we make a different team for 20/20? .............

I wonder why can't we !!

[sharifk]

Originally Posted by yaseer
There is already a champions league, right? why another one? What is new in that?

okay, i said something like a champions league, but the answer isn't within the champions league....see the champions league implies that each major cricket nation has a domestic t2o league like the current ipl....where champions and/or runner ups from each domestic league plays in the champions league.....this is overkilling of this format...if at all feasible.....the answer lies within a single premier league of professional clubs from all test playing nations.....

Originally Posted by yaseer
Why do you think Dhaka vs Mumbai match will be more interesting than BD vs IND? Who cares about a somerset vs Trinidad match? We have seen that champions league was not 10% successful as IPL. IPL is a totally different thing as Bharat pointed out.

I am sure you know the difference between england vs spain and liverpool vs real madrid....but both of these types of competitions are proven successful....if a kolkata vs delhi game can have audience, so can a dhaka vs delhi....

Originally Posted by yaseer
Why BCCI will allow ICC to take the control of IPL as "International Premier League"? BCCI will never let it happen and there will be a ICC vs BCCI competition, always BCCI going to win because they have the money. So, no "International Premier League", only "Indian Premiere league".

it seems someone like many others has been brain washed......the answer lies within the question: will cricket be a global game or an indian sport?

Originally Posted by yaseer
I also want our younger players to play longer version and want to keep them away from T20 as much as possible in their development stage. I take loosing to Ireland 10 times in a T20 match over a Test win any day. T20 is a fun game, and our young cricketers only should be allowed to have fun after they develop as a cricketer. We already have a T20 league, and that is enough for the moment. We should concentrate to NCL and make them more competitive.

is it really just a fun game? if the professional cricketers were that naive, they wouldn't quit international career early to join just the fun...

i agree with you that our players need to develop their skills in the longer versions, but it's a concern at the moment as to what will be the future of the longer versions....so to survive in the international level, our players must learn how to play all formats...

[Raynman]

SharifK,

I kinda see your future vision (similar to the UEFA cup I guess) but that is still a while away. For your concept to succeed, IPL and the domestic T20 leagues that supply the Champions League teams need to be a international success beyond their own countries like The soccer leagues in Spain, England, Italy etc. Also the home and away matches around the globe is not as logistical as it is in Europe.

I think IPL and CL has the right momentum with the WC T20 every other year. I don't want ICC to spoil the T20 fun with unnecessary bi lateral intl series. But a qualification tournament for the WC would be most welcome.

[sharifk]

Originally Posted by bharat
In case you missed there is a Champions league for that .BD is to have a team in that league next year .

Seeing this years response I dont think it will be successful ! The fans rather watch India vs BD rather than dhaka vs Mumbai !

IPL is a different beast , its been successful because of Indian city teams playing each other (and of course wine,women and movie starts).An Indian fan would not be interested in a match between Dhaka and Chittagong , in the same way a BD fan would not be interested in a game between Sailkot and Faislabad. Take out BD and international players out of IPL ..an avergae BD fan wouldnt care about IPL as well !

first of all i don't think champions league is the answer because it is of the domestic champions of major cricketing nations.....you see cricket hasn't emerged yet as a major global sport....yet it already has created so many formats of the game that it is difficult for any team or nation to manage so many tournaments...on the other hand until the shorter version has been introduced, professional cricketers have been underpaid compared to major global sport professionals.....t20 has shown commercial prospects....however, as we all know the real cricket is the test cricket.....and if test dies so will die the beauty of cricket......how can we find a balance where the game of cricket is saved while allowing cricketers to make some additional income?

this is where we must support a system which doesn't insist international cricketers to retire early to join t20 tourneys......the system must allow each major cricketing nation and its players profit from a limited shorter version of the competition....while this version is not overkilled.....for this we must not support too many domestic t20 competitions of franchise teams.....and a champions league suggests of domestic t20 leagues.......we also must not support of a system that allows all the benefits of this short versions goes to a single nation so we need to support international premier league instead of indian premier league...and for this franchise teams need to be created under icc guidelines in each test playing country....and the ftp needs to be created such that a small window is allowed each year for such competition....the remaining time for the real cricket....

[sharifk]

Originally Posted by Raynman
SharifK,

Also the home and away matches around the globe is not as logistical as it is in Europe.

that's a good point to analyze and find answers for... i believe it's in the scheduling where the answer is......but frankly the world is much smaller now, my friend...

[Raynman]

Originally Posted by sharifk
that's a good point to analyze and find answers for... i believe it's in the scheduling where the answer is......but frankly the world is much smaller now, my friend...

The world is smaller, but you have to take the financial consdierations of flight, hotels etc. and see if it makes sense for one game that may not be able to draw the crowds. Imagine a Dhaka vs. Jamaica game and the Dhaka team spend 4 days on the road just to play a 3/4 hour match that for all we know could end up getting rained out.

[sharifk]

Originally Posted by Raynman
The world is smaller, but you have to take the financial consdierations of flight, hotels etc. and see if it makes sense for one game that may not be able to draw the crowds. Imagine a Dhaka vs. Jamaica game and the Dhaka team spend 4 days on the road just to play a 3/4 hour match that for all we know could end up getting rained out.

this money making format of the game and franchise teams no need to worry about money....also double headers, tripple headers aren't impossible in this format.....travel arrangement can be made such that a team goes on away games on the same route.......divisions can be arranged regionally....there can be so many answers.....

[bharat]

Originally Posted by sharifk
this money making format of the game and franchise teams no need to worry about money....also double headers, tripple headers aren't impossible in this format.....travel arrangement can be made such that a team goes on away games on the same route.......divisions can be arranged regionally....there can be so many answers.....

You are missing the financial aspects completely !!

Say this International Premier league is played in England (or for that matter BD) who would go to watch Dhaka Vs Sealkot ? The 2003 WC and the 20-20 world cup barely made money ! Franchises need to survive ..infact these are big Business houses bidding for international palyers what matters to them is money !!

As rightly pointed above by one of the posters each country needs to proove that they have a comercially viable setup in their own country before we can make it global .

IPL (which I despise) ..is only surviving (and surviving well) because of India's huge population and market.Adding "outside" teams will dilute the packed money making schedule .A game between Sealkot and Dhaka would mean less gate money and less TRP ratings in India.

For the Soccer club model to succeed the individual franchise's should be commercially viable in their respective countries before they go Internatioanal

[yaseer]

Originally Posted by sharifk
okay, i said something like a champions league, but the answer isn't within the champions league....see the champions league implies that each major cricket nation has a domestic t2o league like the current ipl....where champions and/or runner ups from each domestic league plays in the champions league.....this is overkilling of this format...if at all feasible.....the answer lies within a single premier league of professional clubs from all test playing nations.....

mate, are you talking about that there will be no domestic T20 competition and all domestic teams will compete in "International Premiere League"? We have 12 clubs playing in DPL and 6 FC teams in NCL? All 12 or 6 clubs/teams then participate? If not then how you select which team going to participate? Also the number of teams in domestics is not the same for each country. If all teams not going to play from each country, then there must be a domestic tournament to select. If you are saying all will particiapte then number of matches of your version of IPL can reach 100/200.

Originally Posted by sharifk
I am sure you know the difference between england vs spain and liverpool vs real madrid....but both of these types of competitions are proven successful....if a kolkata vs delhi game can have audience, so can a dhaka vs delhi....

Aren't you comparing apple with oranges?
Let first make a team like Liverpool or Real Madrid in cricket who has fan base world-wide then go to that format.
Also champions league foot-ball in Europe and same type of tournament in Cricket world-wide is totally different. Already some of the members have mentioned about the travel issues and commercial viability.

Originally Posted by sharifk
it seems someone like many others has been brain washed......the answer lies within the question: will cricket be a global game or an indian sport?

If BCCI decides, though there is a "International Premiere League", they still want to have a domestic championship that is "Indian Premiere League". Can ICC stop that? Can ICC say to us that you cannot have a DPL?

Originally Posted by sharifk
is it really just a fun game? if the professional cricketers were that naive, they wouldn't quit international career early to join just the fun...

i agree with you that our players need to develop their skills in the longer versions, but it's a concern at the moment as to what will be the future of the longer versions....so to survive in the international level, our players must learn how to play all formats...

Yes, money is there in T20 thats why its drawing attention of the international players. But the format itself is still for the fun of spectators. Still a good performance in Test/ODI is remembered or ranked more than a T20 performance.

[M.H.Rubel]

Money is everything and everything will turn round money.So i think shortly T20 will be the prime form of popular cricket.And club or Franchise cup cricket will be the prime place where all money will round.I think shortly like football clubs will dominate in cricket in paralles to nation versus nation cricket.We like it or not T20 will the dominate the future cricket but i do believe tests will survive as it is the purest form of cricket.

Posted via BC Mobile Edition

[bangla-red]

We need an official T20 league, NCLT20 perhaps?

[sharifk]

Originally Posted by yaseer
mate, are you talking about that there will be no domestic T20 competition and all domestic teams will compete in "International Premiere League"? We have 12 clubs playing in DPL and 6 FC teams in NCL? All 12 or 6 clubs/teams then participate? If not then how you select which team going to participate? Also the number of teams in domestics is not the same for each country. If all teams not going to play from each country, then there must be a domestic tournament to select. If you are saying all will particiapte then number of matches of your version of IPL can reach 100/200.

perhaps you need to read my first post again....the total # of teams shouldn't exceed 10 to 12 because only one to max 2 teams from each test playing nation should be licensed to participate....each franchise team needs to be formed under the guidelines of icc...these franchise team may or may not participate in a domestic league....

Originally Posted by yaseer
If BCCI decides, though there is a "International Premiere League", they still want to have a domestic championship that is "Indian Premiere League". Can ICC stop that? Can ICC say to us that you cannot have a DPL?

why would bcci decide about an international premier league?...it needs to be up to the icc......i see the reason for your confusion though...it's my mistake when i spoke against the domestic t20 league....i should have been clearer on this....i guess icc can't and shouldn't stop a member from organizing a domestic league like the current ipl or dpl...however, an international premier league should be the top ranked t20 league so that any domestic league can become secondary to players....for this ftp needs to allow a window for the international premier league and the domestic league doesn't get players who are on international duty....

[sharifk]

Originally Posted by bharat
You are missing the financial aspects completely !!

Say this International Premier league is played in England (or for that matter BD) who would go to watch Dhaka Vs Sealkot ? The 2003 WC and the 20-20 world cup barely made money ! Franchises need to survive ..infact these are big Business houses bidding for international palyers what matters to them is money !!

As rightly pointed above by one of the posters each country needs to proove that they have a comercially viable setup in their own country before we can make it global .

am i really?

why would a dhaka vs sealkot game be played in england in a home n away scenario? btw do u know the bengali base in england? so any game playing in london involving a bengali team, u no need to worry about spectators...

questioning the financial viability or being concerned of insufficient spectators in a game involving a major team from bangladesh is of pure ignorance....i suggest you do some study about the bengali population base, bangladeshi fans, youths and their spending habits, etc....don't get offended if i say this that bengali youngsters had started rocking long before indians even started learning about rock n roll...so u need to learn how bengali young generation (especially of urbane) spend their time and money in cafes, restaurants and fun activities.....even an under 19 wc can have a stadium full of audience in bangladesh....

Originally Posted by bharat
IPL (which I despise) ..is only surviving (and surviving well) because of India's huge population and market.Adding "outside" teams will dilute the packed money making schedule .A game between Sealkot and Dhaka would mean less gate money and less TRP ratings in India.

do u think a game between nz or paki vs bangladesh cares about the trp ratings in india? so wut if the trp ratings in india is less, should this type of game not be played? it only matters if you get enough spectators and tv audience from the involved cities/countries......and btw bangladesh also has a huge population of more than 160 millions.....so u can't just speak of indias huge population....

Originally Posted by bharat
For the Soccer club model to succeed the individual franchise's should be commercially viable in their respective countries before they go Internatioanal

each of all current test playing nations is capable of at least one financially viable franchise team...

[Neel Here]

Originally Posted by sharifk
it's not about a T20 competition of national teams....it's of professional franchises/clubs ... something like the champions league (e.g. dhaka vs. mumbai)....this way may be IPL can be International Premier League instead of Indian Premier League ..

there is already something called the champions league 20-20, which is the same thing you propose.

bengali youngsters had started rocking long before indians even started learning about rock n roll

just asking this because I'm interested in music. when was that. which band ?

[sharifk]

Originally Posted by Neel Here
there is already something called the champions league 20-20, which is the same thing you propose.

i have already answered this in reply to other posts that champions league is a competition of countries whereas the proposed international premier league is of franchise teams (of cities) from test playing nations...

Originally Posted by Neel Here
just asking this because I'm interested in music. when was that. which band ?

btw this was in response to bharat's arrogance that all financial viability is only in india because of girls, wine, etc.....to answer ur question, there r many...if u haven't listened warfaze, rockstrata, artcell u may start with those...

[Neel Here]

Originally Posted by sharifk
i have already answered this in reply to other posts that champions league is a competition of countries whereas the proposed international premier league is of franchise teams (of cities) from test playing nations...

champions league 20-20 is a tournament among the T-20 teams of various countries. you are confusing with champions trophy.

btw this was in response to bharat's arrogance that all financial viability is only in india because of girls, wine, etc

wine ? girls ? financial viability ? should those 3 even be in the same sentence ?

thing is, bangladesh alone does not have the financial viability to support a large number of franchisees YET. but I think it will be there in a couple of decades.

.....to answer ur question, there r many...if u haven't listened warfaze, rockstrata, artcell u may start with those...

I do know of the bangladeshi rock scene. but your statement is a little wrong. the earliest band in this region was 'mohiner ghoraguli' from the mid 70's. this was a kolkata band, which, as you know is in india. many bangladeshi rock bands as well as indian rock bands derive inspiration from them.
the recent hit hindi movie song bheegi bheegi, sung by bangladeshi singer james was based on one of their songs (prithibita naki choto hote hote)
rock bands anyway have little to do with cricket, but I'll love to discuss this with you in forget cricket.

edit : I do enjoy bands from both sides of the border and there are some very good ones on both sides. you could have made your point without dissing indian bands, of which you are clearly not aware of.

[sharifk]

Originally Posted by Neel Here
champions league 20-20 is a tournament among the T-20 teams of various countries. you are confusing with champions trophy.

dude, if u had read my earlier posts, u would have been clearer on my explanations on champions league vs the proposed international premier league.....the champions league includes the champions/runner ups from selected countries to compete in groups like wc tourneys....which implies there would be qualifiers from domestic competitions...the suggested international premier league is suggested to include franchisees formed under the icc guidelines....these franchise teams will be formed solely for the international premier league and not to compete in domestic league like the current ipl or dpl or pcl for that matter....and the premier league will make all domestic t20 league inferior to it....

Originally Posted by Neel Here
thing is, bangladesh alone does not have the financial viability to support a large number of franchisees YET. but I think it will be there in a couple of decades.

i don't think u can prove ur point with any logic on bangladesh's capability....i think bangladesh is capable at will only if the bcb visions it.....but i won't go into that debate because i am not suggesting a bangladeshi or another domestic t20 league....i am talking about an international premier league...

Originally Posted by Neel Here
I do know of the bangladeshi rock scene. but your statement is a little wrong. the earliest band in this region was 'mohiner ghoraguli' from the mid 70's. this was a kolkata band, which, as you know is in india. many bangladeshi rock bands as well as indian rock bands derive inspiration from them.
the recent hit hindi movie song bheegi bheegi, sung by bangladeshi singer james was based on one of their songs (prithibita naki choto hote hote)
rock bands anyway have little to do with cricket, but I'll love to discuss this with you in forget cricket.

if u know bangladeshi rock scene, then wouldn't try to distort history by stating 'mohiner ghoraguli' as the earliest band in the region....we all can do some research and be sure, but i am judging based on your statement since u have mentioned that band is of mid 70s....since bangladesh obtained independence only in 1971 i won't go before that, but 'Uccharon' was the earliest band that was formed early 70s immediately after the independence....and azam khan, uccharon's lead singer, who was also a freedom fighter, had been rocking all along....if mohiner ghoraguli was a mid 70's band and of rock, i would say feedback, miles, lucky akondh, feroz shai, fakir alomgir, ferdous wahid all were rocking before mohiner ghoraguli...i agree though that this would be better discussed in forget cricket....

Originally Posted by Neel Here
edit : I do enjoy bands from both sides of the border and there are some very good ones on both sides. you could have made your point without dissing indian bands, of which you are clearly not aware of.

i do also enjoy suman chatterjee (forget my spelling), anjan datta, ajay chakraborti...so no issue there, but i am not sure why u got so offended when i mentioned of bengalis not just of bangladeshis who are of rock culture (i am sure u know of that type)....the point was that the new generation is ready to spend time and money to have fun in the evening to enjoy a good professional t20 game....

[Neel Here]

i don't think u can prove ur point with any logic on bangladesh's capability....i think bangladesh is capable at will only if the bcb visions it.....but i won't go into that debate because i am not suggesting a bangladeshi or another domestic t20 league....i am talking about an international premier league...

sharif bhai, no need to get defensive about it. I too am enthusiastic about the commercial strength of bangladesh cricket but that's for the future, it's not there yet. no use pretending otherwise.
read this thread please. http://www.banglacricket.com/alochon...&highlight=bcb
it's easy to see that from the % contribution of the cricket boards to world cricket in terms of money.
at the moment BCB comes even below PCB and CSL I think.

when i mentioned of bengalis not just of bangladeshis who are of rock culture

if some of those bengalis are indians then you can't say indians didn't know of rock. I didn't get offended, just corrected you. they are indians first and then bengalis aren't they ? would you for example say you are dhakaiya (or sylheti or input place of origin) first and not bangladeshi ?
in fact there were indian rock bands in other languages too at the same time as per my friends but I don't know the details.

[sharifk]

i am bringing it up one more time since tri-series may allow many to read this....

and btw brother Neel Here, one of the biggest reasons for less contribution is due to lack of quality tournaments here....the other being that bcb's lack of vision as far as commercialization is concerned......u see if u remember correctly we had an under 19 wc that had every single match with stadium full of spectators, which tells that market is there.....and we have a huge population base...